A challeng for those that say it is "Just a game, get over it"

DarthRaiden

If the current crap shutdown no one will miss it, thats the difference to PRE CU, we here miss it badly.

$OE should change and nerf their pos of a game  to hell cause its just a game lol

jinxit

I am a vet and have returned to the game more than a few times to see if the old magic is still there, a few people i knew pre nge have returned but only because it fills a gap in there station access pass. They are still annoyed at what happened and still belief that the old system was the best system.

They stay away from the soe forums not because of vet bashing but because when the nge hit these same vets cried out to the community and devs to please explain why this all happened and why we had no choice in the implementation of the NGE. Every post that was put up on the lithium forums that gave a negative view on the nge was deleted instantly, the forum was shutdown after a while because the lithium admins couldnt keep up with deleting the posts and eventually it was rebuilt. They even disabled the chat client that was integrated into the swg launchpad and going so far  as to ending employment with the best community manager SWG has ever seen, Tiggs

The question that should be asked is, if all your friends within a game and yourself where treated like this by the games community relations and management would you put up with it and give up your right to free speech and expression?

I used to love the game but being gagged and told what to like wasnt my idea of fun.

shukes33

he more i read if this the more i really feel i am missing out. True i have only been playing a few weeks now but i do enjoy th game, it just makes me wander what i have missed though. I played eq for 7 years and had to just give in towards the end as the game just moved on so much that lower level raid targets could be done with a group and all that was ever added was high level raid stuff. though i loved the game so much as introduced me to a whole new type of game.

I for one wish they would release a classic server just so i could taste what swg was and then i could make my own opinion at least. What i will say to the op is that after playing eq at the start and then 6 motnhs into the game i deleted my char in a temper only to feel sick after. i know how i felt after 6 months of hard work, i can't imagine 2 years. But in the end i had to accept that i had to start again, but at least i could start again in the same game. True vets ( not just the name calling, present player haters ) just dont have that choice, and i do feel for them.

sadnebula

I can see your point and respect it about deleting chars,  but it's a mute point. Even if someone were dumb enough to do it, what would it prove? notta. You have to know what was , what you had, before you can see the loss,  and there is no way the newer players can  do that as they never got to play the old swg. If you didn't play it how can you miss it?  If you don't miss it then wtf are all these x players ranting about.

Got to admit, this is the best board for reading at work . we might not be in game pvp but we got it going on here.

MickeyMann

 I agree with the OP ,  The number of non players are 5 to 1 to the current player base. Now most of them are not vocal but they have the same reasons for not playing the NGE as the vocal ones do.  Hiding behind the Forum Mods on the SWG forums and sticking their tongues out  at us here only validate the fact that the NGE is only for children and those who act as such.

Suvroc

Originally posted by sadnebula


I can see your point and respect it about deleting chars,  but it's a mute point. Even if someone were dumb enough to do it, what would it prove? notta. You have to know what was , what you had, before you can see the loss,  and there is no way the newer players can  do that as they never got to play the old swg. If you didn't play it how can you miss it?  If you don't miss it then wtf are all these x players ranting about.
Got to admit, this is the best board for reading at work . we might not be in game pvp but we got it going on here.

I respectfully disagree.

I think it shows that there is a certain amount of "work" involved in an MMO and that work translates into value.

For example, gold and credit sellers are certainly making a profit on the value of ingame items. Even SOE's new RMT's shows that there is a real world value to ingame items.

shukes33

Originally posted by MickeyMann


 I agree with the OP ,  The number of non players are 5 to 1 to the current player base. Now most of them are not vocal but they have the same reasons for not playing the NGE as the vocal ones do.  Hiding behind the Forum Mods on the SWG forums and sticking their tongues out  at us here only validate the fact that the NGE is only for children and those who act as such.

But dont you see that this is the same reason what gathers hate for the so called "vets"? i use so called as i dont believe you to be a true representative of vets. I am a 34 year old with an 11 year old son, and while some may scoff and call me a child because i play computer games, i can assure you friend i am in no ways a child. No NGE is not just for children, it's just not for you. My 11 year old has started playing swg and needs me to help him along with certain aspects. he is also probable more of a vet in games like eq/eq2 wow, lotro and Vg than most so called vets here.

saay

 

Originally posted by GrandAm


I am not a pre-cu vet.  I just have empathy for them and anyone else that  has invested a mass amount of time in anything to have it involuntary stripped away.
I challenge all current players that say "Hey it's only a game, you lost it, get over it and move on" to try and see if they can do it themselves before they bash and judge people that have had it done to them.
If it is just a game and you can take it or leave it as you tell others to,  I want you to go to your primary playing account and delete the main character(s).  All of the time invested gone.  All of the rewards and items gone.  All the credits gone.  All the level 90's gone.
Why do this.  Simple, I have seen people bash, put down and otherwise belittle the vets here.  The same vets who basically funded the game when it it was released too soon and paid to have it  get to they point where you now have the game you play.
If the game you have now is just a game and you wouldn't care if it was lost, if all you have put in to it wasn't important to remember years later what is lost, then delete your work now.  Start new characters.  This would prove you actually mean what you say for yourself, not just others.  Delete your Jedies, your Bounty Hunters, your etc.  Throw away your Musty goodies, glowies, credits and so on.  If the game is that good as a "game" you should have no problem starting over.
If you don't have the courage to voluntarily give up what was involuntarily taken from these people, you don't have the scrote to tell anyone here anything.  You aren't telling these people they are whining, you are just showing them that you are the whiners with no courage.
Show the vets you mean what you say, it is just a game, delete your characters and start new.  Give up your work and rewards to PROVE what you say is true current players.
Obraik,  I thought you were a cool dude.  You supported your current game and I never once read you bashing the vets.  Then you are on the official forums bad mouthing them and telling all the current players to come make trouble on the VET forum.  You lost my respect man.  You should be the first to delete your medic general and armorsmith and start new.  Then maybe you will earn my respect back.  To be fair to you, many vets have unjustly attacked you and you were always polite.  You always seemed empathetic and positive.   This is where you earned my respect.  To see you do the same thing as the attacking vets, but not even have the courage to do it here, just makes you as bad as the vets that attacked you.  You should at least apologize to the community here as the community leader I thought you were.
Come,on current players I dare you.

This has probably been said before but i cant be bothered to read all the replies:

 

Firstly, it was over 2 years ago, secondly at the NGE you didnt loose your level, items etc - what you are suggesting is completely different.

On a side note: Obraik was not attempting to "cause trouble" he was asking if a few people from the SWG forums would use these forums a bit more in order to balance out the numbers a bit here and help to give a more balanced view (from people who play the game).

jinxit

You know what this thread is missing, a link to the relative source material and an audience with Obraik

Kyleran

OK, OP, you're on.

My first MMO was Lineage 1. I chose to play a mage and rolled an appropriate character.  I was lured by the promise that at level 40 I could get a spell that would summon 4 bugbear pets that would make me a formidable fighter indeed.

Well, leveling to 40 proved to be no problem, but saving up 1 million adena to buy the scroll proved to be far more difficult. I ground for hours and hours saving up my cash, and finally after about 3 months I achieve my goal. I got a decent deal on the spell (950K) and in no time I was out tearing up dungeon instances (good bye loyal dobermans) and having a blast.

Two weeks after I achieved glory, NCSoft decided that Wizards with 4 bugbears were overpowered, especially if they had invested points in skills that also made them strong casters.  They wanted more balance, so they said if you had a charisma skill of 17 or 18, you could have 4 bugbear pets. (but this would have made your spells very weak).  In my case, I had a 12 charisma, which meant I could get 2 bugbears.  In the end, the perfect balance point was 3 pets, however NC did not allow you to respec your character.

I was crushed.  No way was I re-rolling (my mage had lots of other great spells, including a very lucky  invisibility drop,) and I was extremely angry at having my character destroyed.  Not to mention the fact that with the new limitations everyone fled from the class and within a month the spell books could be purchased for a measly 35K.  I viewed that as a 900K loss, which was a small fortune for a player of my experience. Heck, I couldn't even go back and use my dobermans since I gave them away to friends once I got my bugbears.

It ruined the game for me, and in no time at all, within 3 months I was playing DAOC and never looked back.  (well, except for that short 2 month return on another server, but that doesn't count) Was I pissed at NCSoft? Damn right, I had some really good friends in L1 and I left with a bad taste in my mouth.

But I eventually got over it.  I even went out and gave Lineage 2 a 6 month trial, and while I was disappointed that I didn't have right stuff to reach the end game, I wasn't so bitter that I started to haunt forums about how NCsoft destroyed my game play.

To this day I consider NCSoft an inferior developer that makes Korean grind games (yes, I know they have other ones) so I look at games like AION with great suspicion and mistrust.  But I'll still probably give it a try.

So yes, it is possible to get over it even when your entire class has been turned upside down.

 

thamighty213

Star Wars 7 server shutdown "Revenge of  the Vets"

 

I cant wait for that day just watching and laughing as the forums fill with posts of all the NGE fanboi's cry there little 11 year old hearts out.

And oh what a glorious day it will be.

 

Jeebus im full of hate today.

Burntvet

Originally posted by thamighty213


Star Wars 7 server shutdown "Revenge of  the Vets"
 
I cant wait for that day just watching and laughing as the forums fill with posts of all the NGE fanboi's cry there little 11 year old hearts out.
And oh what a glorious day it will be.
 
Jeebus im full of hate today.

I'll bring the E-beer.

thamighty213

Originally posted by Suvroc


 
Originally posted by sadnebula


I can see your point and respect it about deleting chars,  but it's a mute point. Even if someone were dumb enough to do it, what would it prove? notta. You have to know what was , what you had, before you can see the loss,  and there is no way the newer players can  do that as they never got to play the old swg. If you didn't play it how can you miss it?  If you don't miss it then wtf are all these x players ranting about.
Got to admit, this is the best board for reading at work . we might not be in game pvp but we got it going on here.

 

I respectfully disagree.

I think it shows that there is a certain amount of "work" involved in an MMO and that work translates into value.

For example, gold and credit sellers are certainly making a profit on the value of ingame items. Even SOE's new RMT's shows that there is a real world value to ingame items.

but its enjoyable work i personally had 1 main account and 2 jedi grind accounts those 2 jedi account equated to £1800+ in my pocket hell i would have probably done another couple if the village hadnt came in

DarthRaiden

Originally posted by thamighty213

Originally posted by Suvroc


 
Originally posted by sadnebula


I can see your point and respect it about deleting chars,  but it's a mute point. Even if someone were dumb enough to do it, what would it prove? notta. You have to know what was , what you had, before you can see the loss,  and there is no way the newer players can  do that as they never got to play the old swg. If you didn't play it how can you miss it?  If you don't miss it then wtf are all these x players ranting about.
Got to admit, this is the best board for reading at work . we might not be in game pvp but we got it going on here.

 

I respectfully disagree.

I think it shows that there is a certain amount of "work" involved in an MMO and that work translates into value.

For example, gold and credit sellers are certainly making a profit on the value of ingame items. Even SOE's new RMT's shows that there is a real world value to ingame items.

but its enjoyable work i personally had 1 main account and 2 jedi grind accounts those 2 jedi account equated to £1800+ in my pocket hell i would have probably done another couple if the village hadnt came in

Often use this as an argument for the game status.

In the rough real world economy 

2 PRE CU Jedi equals £1800+

2 current Jedi  equals  0

There you have  the value of current  SWG.

 

GrandAm

Again, this isn't a post about SOE is bad so move on.  It was first a post about current players being asked to come here and counter the vets in the hopes that it would get the voice of the current player out to give a positive view of the current game to potential new gamers.

The end result was several threads locked or deleted because some (not all) current players came to the vet forum and started calling names.  Not just get over it, but also calling the vets that care and wish to to discuss what happened to them, mental for caring two years later, and to get a life.

I have seen vets just blatently call current players "idiots" for still playing and I think that is equally as wrong to name call them.  If a current player enjoys himself in SWG, he/she doesn't need a troll belittling them.  Likewise if a vet wants to talk about what happened two years ago, he doesn't need a current player belittling him.

I as a member of the MMORPG.com community was frustrated with seeing threads locked or deleted.  Because others were specificlly called here to counter vets and instead flamed them (againnot all current players did).  I proposed that they try to gain some empathy for why the vets hold their torch by deleting their characters and starting new.  Maybe then the current players that putdown the vets would think twice before ridiculing them.

As far a Obraik is concerned.  I liked the guy.  I had a lot of respect for him. He believes in the current game and when he was attacked by vets (which I condemn) he always responded politely with out belittling them.  I saw him as a community leader, and it would be hard for any person here to say he doesn't.  He may be for the current game, and vets may not like that, but he still acts as a leader.  He even has his own stickies.

When as a leader he called people here to counter the vets and a high number of them started making fun of and flaming vets, he did nothing as a community leader.  I am sure he read the threads getting locked and said nothing.  If a person takes on the roll as a community leader he/she takes on the fiduciary resposibility to make sure that all people are treated fairly.  Even if people are opposed to your ideas.  Because they are also members of the community.  If he came here and said "please stop flaming vets, stick to the good qualities of the current game," he would continue to have my respect instead of losing it.

 

docminus

Originally posted by GrandAm


Again, this isn't a post about SOE is bad so move on.  It was first a post about current players being asked to come here and counter the vets in the hopes that it would get the voice of the current player out to give a positive view of the current game to potential new gamers.
The end result was several threads locked or deleted because some (not all) current players came to the vet forum and started calling names.  Not just get over it, but also calling the vets that care and wish to to discuss what happened to them, mental for caring two years later, and to get a life.
I have seen vets just blatently call current players "idiots" for still playing and I think that is equally as wrong to name call them.  If a current player enjoys himself in SWG, he/she doesn't need a troll belittling them.  Likewise if a vet wants to talk about what happened two years ago, he doesn't need a current player belittling him.
I as a member of the MMORPG.com community was frustrated with seeing threads locked or deleted.  Because others were specificlly called here to counter vets and instead flamed them (againnot all current players did).  I proposed that they try to gain some empathy for why the vets hold their torch by deleting their characters and starting new.  Maybe then the current players that putdown the vets would think twice before ridiculing them.
As far a Obraik is concerned.  I liked the guy.  I had a lot of respect for him. He believes in the current game and when he was attacked by vets (which I condemn) he always responded politely with out belittling them.  I saw him as a community leader, and it would be hard for any person here to say he doesn't.  He may be for the current game, and vets may not like that, but he still acts as a leader.  He even has his own stickies.
When as a leader he called people here to counter the vets and a high number of them started making fun of and flaming vets, he did nothing as a community leader.  I am sure he read the threads getting locked and said nothing.  If a person takes on the roll as a community leader he/she takes on the fiduciary resposibility to make sure that all people are treated fairly.  Even if people are opposed to your ideas.  Because they are also members of the community.  If he came here and said "please stop flaming vets, stick to the good qualities of the current game," he would continue to have my respect instead of losing it.
 

That's why I stopped reading the SWG section completely. Usually just flaming ongoing unfortunately. Too bad.

Only saw this thread now in the start page., otherwise I wouldn't have ended up here.

rekkor

I'm sorry if this analogy was made already as I didn't read all 42 posts but, imagine the vets as a union on strike because they were treated unfairly and the current supporters of the game would be the scabs. The people who come in and destroy everything the union was working for by keeping the company in business and delaying or negating any hope the union has of getting what they feel they deserve. 

MMO's are more about community than game play for most, so if you have a strong community or group to play with, game play will always take a back seat. The problem here is that SOE alienated their current community at the time ( the vets) for a larger mythical group of players they thought was there, and have admitted as much themselves. Be that as it may, the current game will remain the way it is and will only be improved upon, that is until they decide that the NGE isn't starwarsy enough and decide to completely change the fundamental aspect of the game again.  Which I would love to see them do,and have all the current players lose everything they've accomplished over the past few years, then gain a true sense of empathy for what the vets are talking about.

To the OP, voluntarily giving something up will not give you nearly the same feeling as having it stolen, but I appreciated what your post tried to do for us.  Good to see the fight isn't over. heh.

musicmann

I think the OP has the right tune when thinking on how vets feel about the NGE and SOE, but it is much easier to make a comparison than a very long winded post.

A NGE player could delete every item and their toon and still not know what or how the vets felt or still feels. A voluntary action is not what happened. All the grief put on the vet players was done so by SOE and no amount of self infliction could even come close .

shukes33

I have to admit the hostility this game seems to generate does border on obsessive. I cn see why a lot of people are posting these "it's just  gme" threads. it's because when you read posts like compring games with Union strikes and the like, you have to see where they are coming from, and this is evidence of a  deep dark breakdown in our social society. We have people freely admitting that they negate the gameplay to an extent because of the social activity in the game, but when you read coments like those you have to ask yourselves why does the gameply suddenly count now?

Why can't this great community ll get together in  social chat room?

The more i read about this vets argument the more i feel i missed something big with the old swg but also i wander if i would have enjoyed this said community when all i hear from them now is open hostility towards present players!

BadgerSmaker

Originally posted by GrandAm


When as a leader he called people here to counter the vets and a high number of them started making fun of and flaming vets, he did nothing as a community leader.  I am sure he read the threads getting locked and said nothing.  If a person takes on the roll as a community leader he/she takes on the fiduciary resposibility to make sure that all people are treated fairly.  Even if people are opposed to your ideas.  Because they are also members of the community.  If he came here and said "please stop flaming vets, stick to the good qualities of the current game," he would continue to have my respect instead of losing it. 

I hope all those trolls had their threads deleted and got banned?



I can certainly understand people still being angry at the way the CU and NGE were handled, having gone through it all myself I still see those times as the worst management of an online game, ever.

Thankfully, mistakes like that seem to be behind us now but I do think that people on both sides of the fence, the disgruntled veterens and the happy subscribers, do need to be more excellent to each other.

Linna

 

Originally posted by shukes33


I have to admit the hostility this game seems to generate does border on obsessive. I cn see why a lot of people are posting these "it's just  gme" threads. it's because when you read posts like compring games with Union strikes and the like, you have to see where they are coming from, and this is evidence of a  deep dark breakdown in our social society. We have people freely admitting that they negate the gameplay to an extent because of the social activity in the game, but when you read coments like those you have to ask yourselves why does the gameply suddenly count now?
Why can't this great community ll get together in  social chat room?
The more i read about this vets argument the more i feel i missed something big with the old swg but also i wander if i would have enjoyed this said community when all i hear from them now is open hostility towards present players!

The hostility is a direct result of what happened during and after the CU/ NGE. We were belittled, ridiculed, told to leave if we didn't like it. POLITE posts asking SOE to rethink the changes were flamed (in often VERY vile terms, with nasty personal attacks), deleted, and the posters often banned from the forums. This while the flames and posts glorifying the changes remained.

 

The community was argumentative and bickering before, but mostly they were deeply involved, and playing the game. The CU/NGE and the way SOE dealt with the forums at that time, however, made for a deep rift between those who remained and those who left. In my experience, the attacks on the vets never stopped, and carried over to other forums, like this one. And some people retalliate in kind by going to current gameplay forums.

Don't think too badly of the community. Those who left ARE by far the majority, and you won't see most of them posting here. They have not forgotten, though. Mention SWG in any game, and you get people cursing the name of SOE and all its works. The names of our servers are still a thing that binds us, and we tend to form cliques even in other games. You did miss out on something great.

Linna

shukes33

You know what as soon as i posted that i read back and realised i was getting quite angry myself. And to be honest i realise that i have no right to be. I do think about all the things i hear how swg and i do think it must have been a great game. Total control over my char would be amazing. Dont get me wrong though i am really loving playing the game at the moment. But i wish i could just go back and try the old one, or if they did release a classic server i would jump in head first.

From this moment i may post opinions but as to the argument between the 2 factions. I will stay away as i feel i have no idea how they must be feeling.

musicmann

Originally posted by shukes33


You know what as soon as i posted that i read back and realised i was getting quite angry myself. And to be honest i realise that i have no right to be. I do think about all the things i hear how swg and i do think it must have been a great game. Total control over my char would be amazing. Dont get me wrong though i am really loving playing the game at the moment. But i wish i could just go back and try the old one, or if they did release a classic server i would jump in head first.
From this moment i may post opinions but as to the argument between the 2 factions. I will stay away as i feel i have no idea how they must be feeling.

I think you have this all wrong. It's not about the vets against the current players. It's about the vet's against SOE and their shaddy buisness practices. I couldn't give a rat's ass about the people who still play SWG. I do wish though they could just play one day on a classic server to see how the game truly was back then. I would imagine if they ever had that chance, they would finally see how shallow and ridiculous the NGE really is.

smg77

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker


 


I can certainly understand people still being angry at the way the CU and NGE were handled, having gone through it all myself I still see those times as the worst management of an online game, ever.
Thankfully, mistakes like that seem to be behind us now but I do think that people on both sides of the fence, the disgruntled veterens and the happy subscribers, do need to be more excellent to each other.

If the NGE is still on the live servers then the mistakes certainly aren't behind us. Having "Galactic Senators" come here in a desperate attempt to get people to resubscribe won't change that.

DarthRaiden

 

Originally posted by smg77


 
Originally posted by BadgerSmaker


 


I can certainly understand people still being angry at the way the CU and NGE were handled, having gone through it all myself I still see those times as the worst management of an online game, ever.
Thankfully, mistakes like that seem to be behind us now but I do think that people on both sides of the fence, the disgruntled veterens and the happy subscribers, do need to be more excellent to each other.

 

If the NGE is still on the live servers then the mistakes certainly aren't behind us. Having "Galactic Senators" come here in a desperate attempt to get people to resubscribe won't change that.

 

the problem is this, both partys agree except for very few fanbois that PRE CU  was a better game.

Difference is i stick to that and don't allow me to flaw my SWG experience by practicing mediocre and inferior things, on the other hand  i can't  practicing what i say good game experience cause  $OE deny to offer classic server.

The NGE lovers however have a place, the NGE on the live servers. Thats a big injustice. Do not blame them for tho i don't understand why they play crap although many of them state PRE CU was better but the target of my anger is and will be $OE. The greedy company who destroyed my MMO home.