I would say that Tolkein is not the "Father of Fantasy" as there are countless folk tales,mythology, books ect that preceded his writings. High fantasy has a very large scope and carries a huge amount of modern literature, movies, games ect under it's wing, some of which does not bear any connection Tolkien. However the most widely accepted form of high fantasy used in mmorpgs and the general publics perception of what elements constitute the fantasy genre do borrow more heavily from Tolkien than any other single source.
Now this I can accept. While it is said
This has caused Tolkien to be popularly identified as the "father" of modern fantasy literature[6]—or more precisely, high fantasy
It is debatable. I like how you phrased that.
However the most widely accepted form of high fantasy used in mmorpgs and the general publics perception of what elements constitute the fantasy genre do borrow more heavily from Tolkien than any other single source.
I believe this is middle ground we can all agree apon. So I am out you guys have a good night.
Age of Conan MMO in fact took more inspiration and elements dirived from the origional books, and little or no inspiration off of tolkein, so deffinently not "All" fantasy mmo take directly from Tolkeins work. BTW the conan lore and books where around before the hobbit ever existed.
Actually, the Hobbit was written first, just wasn't published til 1937.
Regardless I dont think anyone here is saying ALL. Just most high-fantasy.
Thats a good point, but unfortunantly most will not accept this. Just like in many other things, for example: Russia, and a couple other nations where already finished with the prototype technology for space flight. Yet the americans where the first to successfully launch, hence even if americans finished developing the technology just a little bit later, they are still said to be the Father Nation of space flight. Even though in reality If i recall, americans finished development of test shuttles before russia, the point is, even if we did not finish first, the first out the door and that gets seen more is usually the winner. Unfortunantly this exact thing which most would say "Well Conan was out the door, wouldnt it win"? Well, like i just said, "Whoever gets seen more" is the biggest factor", when dealing with this calibur of great work. And unfortunantly conan did not have the reader base, or the ease of mass media to help it get known.
Well that's exactly it. I mean Tolkein was what caught on like wild-fire. Personally I love the gritty lore of Conan. Tolkein was a great writer but a little soft sometimes.
True, But no doubt both have givin a much thicker variety of fantasy, while many MMO's are are little "soft" like wow, and hmm, maybe even everquest2? Others go more in the conan direction with a hinted flavour of tolkeins work, such as creatures, and sorcery. Aka, Darkfall. See while many disliked "Age of conan" it seems darkfall got the best of "sandbox" while adding a blend of grittyness from the conan, and as well, elves, and magic from tolkein, I cant say i am disapointed with the way history has turned out
I would say that Tolkein is not the "Father of Fantasy" as there are countless folk tales,mythology, books ect that preceded his writings. High fantasy has a very large scope and carries a huge amount of modern literature, movies, games ect under it's wing, some of which does not bear any connection Tolkien. However the most widely accepted form of high fantasy used in mmorpgs and the general publics perception of what elements constitute the fantasy genre do borrow more heavily from Tolkien than any other single source.
Now this I can accept. While it is said
This has caused Tolkien to be popularly identified as the "father" of modern fantasy literature[6]—or more precisely, high fantasy
It is debatable. I like how you phrased that.
However the most widely accepted form of high fantasy used in mmorpgs and the general publics perception of what elements constitute the fantasy genre do borrow more heavily from Tolkien than any other single source.
I believe this is middle ground we can all agree apon. So I am out you guys have a good night.
Age of Conan MMO in fact took more inspiration and elements dirived from the origional books, and little or no inspiration off of tolkein, so deffinently not "All" fantasy mmo take directly from Tolkeins work. BTW the conan lore and books where around before the hobbit ever existed. So while the public will relate most "fantasy" to "Tolkein" because of the popularity it got, that does not accurately represent the absolute source of most inspiration. As far as little half elves, elves, and sorcery in general, alot of it is taken from tolkein.
No not all Fantasy is derived from Tolkien that was never said. I guess your wondering why I added AoC then huh lol, merely for the fact that it has a Necromancer class which wasn't used in any way for Conan until 1972. Tolkiens Influence can be seen in many ways in the genre. No he is not the be all end all of the genre because it is continualy changing and evolving but he did have a very large influence on it and still does today.
He is credited the same way Bella Lugosi is as the Fore Father of Monsters in Horror films. They merely had a larger impacts on the genre than others. Same way UO is credited for bringing popularity to the MMORPG genre of gaming.
but those most certainly shows the game is a bit long in the tooth graphics wise. If you are impressed by those graphics, you have not played any MMO in the last 5 years at all.
I played plenty of games, aside from Age of Conan there is no other game on the market that has this kind of detail not even Warhammer which I am playing right now. The graphics for darkfall look very crisp, which I can't say for vast majority of the games out there, most screenshots and previous videos that we have seen don't do this game any justice.
Texture and shader quality aren't everything. I mean, look at WoW. Part of the reason that game looked "good" was because of the smooth animation. This game may have some decent visuals, but from these two video footage snippets - the animation in this game looks absolutely atrotious. Graphics aren't everything for me... but I just can't handle a game that has minimal effort in the animation department. For me, poor animation is the absolute worst thing you can have in the graphics department.
That aside, this game is going to be a User Interface/HUD nightmare. From the looks of things, the developers thought of everything except how players will actually play the game. The inventory box was okay enough I guess, but he had windows all over the place for everything. I'm all for customization, but you have to have some sort of uniformity. It's a presentation thing.
Maybe this will all change after Beta... but I've said it before and I'll say it again - they're looking at a 2008 release... I don't see it happening. Maybe March-June 2009, at the earliest.
you mean like how corpses slid and the bodies seemed to twitch from side to side when leaning? Those are small tweaks at the most, and btw i would not go by the "Gameplay trailor" on making any assumptions, we have already seen it looks much better in the new presentation, as far as small animations and fluidity of bodys, ect, those will be fixed up in Open beta, before launch, or shortly after launch, but those will deffinently change. I personally loved the way wow looked too, besides the fact that it had crap technology driving its textures, the art direction was simply amazing. And that made people not really care how dated the "textures where" I can see the same thing in darkfall, the art direction may not be for everybody, but it is deffinetly there, and some of it looks very nice.
I would say that Tolkein is not the "Father of Fantasy" as there are countless folk tales,mythology, books ect that preceded his writings. High fantasy has a very large scope and carries a huge amount of modern literature, movies, games ect under it's wing, some of which does not bear any connection Tolkien. However the most widely accepted form of high fantasy used in mmorpgs and the general publics perception of what elements constitute the fantasy genre do borrow more heavily from Tolkien than any other single source.
Now this I can accept. While it is said
This has caused Tolkien to be popularly identified as the "father" of modern fantasy literature[6]—or more precisely, high fantasy
It is debatable. I like how you phrased that.
However the most widely accepted form of high fantasy used in mmorpgs and the general publics perception of what elements constitute the fantasy genre do borrow more heavily from Tolkien than any other single source.
I believe this is middle ground we can all agree apon. So I am out you guys have a good night.
Age of Conan MMO in fact took more inspiration and elements dirived from the origional books, and little or no inspiration off of tolkein, so deffinently not "All" fantasy mmo take directly from Tolkeins work. BTW the conan lore and books where around before the hobbit ever existed.
Actually, the Hobbit was written first, just wasn't published til 1937.
Regardless I dont think anyone here is saying ALL. Just most high-fantasy.
Thats a good point, but unfortunantly most will not accept this. Just like in many other things, for example: Russia, and a couple other nations where already finished with the prototype technology for space flight. Yet the americans where the first to successfully launch, hence even if americans finished developing the technology just a little bit later, they are still said to be the Father Nation of space flight. Even though in reality If i recall, americans finished development of test shuttles before russia, the point is, even if we did not finish first, the first out the door and that gets seen more is usually the winner. Unfortunantly this exact thing which most would say "Well Conan was out the door, wouldnt it win"? Well, like i just said, "Whoever gets seen more" is the biggest factor", when dealing with this calibur of great work. And unfortunantly conan did not have the reader base, or the ease of mass media to help it get known.
Well that's exactly it. I mean Tolkein was what caught on like wild-fire. Personally I love the gritty lore of Conan. Tolkein was a great writer but a little soft sometimes.
True, But no doubt both have givin a much thicker variety of fantasy, while many MMO's are are little "soft" like wow, and hmm, maybe even everquest2? Others go more in the conan direction with a hinted flavour of tolkeins work, such as creatures, and sorcery. Aka, Darkfall. See while many disliked "Age of conan" it seems darkfall got the best of "sandbox" while adding a blend of grittyness from the conan, and as well, elves, and magic from tolkein, I cant say i am disapointed with the way history has turned out
Yeah I won't deny Howards impact on the genre either. The only one that did rival Howards influence was Tolkien.
Edited to add: That was actually an enjoyable debate guys so thanks for that. Now I am truely off this thread lol.
Originally posted by Z3R01 Originally posted by GrayGhost79 I found it on the official website. Sorry I rarely if ever visit a forum of a game im not interested in. That wasn't meant as a slight. The site was http://www.play-earthrise.com/ Making money while offline isn't something a lot of Hardcore players want in a game. Thats to close to bots and for me atleast it leave's a bitter taste of laziness in my mouth. As far as linear I got that from this "The main storyline and all associated quests will be completely solo-friendly and allow each player to explore the island of Enterra at their leisure without requiring additional help but there will be additional challenges where a player may need friendly support. Also, many of the player-versus-player (PvP) mechanics will be party and guild oriented for those who seek to become involved in the grand struggle for domination over controllable zones and their resources." The fact that it won't be FFA PvP made it feel a bit more linear to me. Yes. PvP will be an important part of the game. Players will have the opportunity to kill other players but not without consequences. Another PvP aspect in Earthrise will be guild rivalries. Guilds will be able to declare war on each other and fight for power and resources. Such wars will be prohibited in the security zones, but will not be punished in the other territories. There must be a good reason for PvP players to risk everything to make a kill. What will making a PvP kill grant you?This part made me go meh... Because it's more UO than DarkFall like as far as the skills go. I am actually looking forward to the skill degradation over time if you don't use them, and there are last was said I think 500 skills and 700 spells in DarkFall. Earthrise has 100 from what they say on there site. There are no character levels in Earthrise. Instead, advancement is purely skill based. Each skill can be improved to its maximum potential and players will reach a peak in their development when they have no more skills to improve on. Future expansions will bring new and expanded skills to allow further character development I am not tryin to bash the game in any way it's just not my cup of tea. My reply was only because of the statement you made that Earthsea had everything DarkFall had and then some. It far from has everything DarkFall has and even some of the things it has that are similar aren't done as well as DarkFall in my opinion. And yeah I feel there's room for both because from what I have read it will be more casual player friendly than DarkFall, it is also Sci Fi insread of Fantasy so neither will really compete. I don't go around and shoot my mouth off without atleast a basic knowledge of what I am talking about lol. Earthrise may be nothing like what I think it will since I am merely basing my opinion on information I have at the moment. Again this merely my opinion and nothing more. And to the person that said you will be able run it on a low in 2006 machine, these are the minimum system requirements for Earthrise. Minimum Requirements: 2 GHz CPU, 1024 MB RAM and 256 MB VRAM video card supporting shader model v3.0
So having safe zones in the game makes a game more linear to you? Basically Earthrise is a ground based Eve online do you think Eve is linear? It has pve missions that you can solo also and if you kill people in high sec you get owned by guards too. I wouldn't go by the list of skills on the site to be honest, the game isn't even in alpha so we have no freaking clue how many skills Earthrise will have. I'm personally looking forward to both games but saying Earthrise seems more casual friendly is crazy imo. Both games have FFA areas in the game, both games will have quests you can solo. to be honest I believe the Earthrise Devs are learning from what Eve did, the only reason Eve has 250k subs instead of 25k is due to high sec space. If darkfall has no "high sec" area in the game it won't have many subs to be honest. If your going to say Earthrise is more casual friendly due to a high sec secure area you must not have played Eve, even in high sec you can get owned very quickly if you mess with the wrong person. No area will be truely safe in ER so I consider both games very hardcore. High sec areas give people the illusion of safety and sometimes that illusion is all you need. Anyway I have a bad feeling Darkfall is going to have a huge problem with people camping zones just outside a town, something that happened in UO and basically destroyed that game.
Darkfall will have "high sec" areas, but they will not be artificially imposed by the devs. It will be players themselves that create relatively safe areas. Thats the way it should be.
...Anyway I have a bad feeling Darkfall is going to have a huge problem with people camping zones just outside a town, something that happened in UO and basically destroyed that game.
There's 100's of city sites... dilution should take care of this
I dislike it when people say "graphics are so great" when they clearly are not (fanboy). At least I am honest about it. The animations are not on par with other games and the polygon count seem generally low.
I hope DF will be entertaining but I'm keeping a realistic view
I dislike it when people say "graphics are so great" when they clearly are not (fanboy). At least I am honest about it. The animations are not on par with other games and the polygon count seem generally low.
I hope DF will be entertaining but I'm keeping a realistic view
I dislike when people say the graphics are clearly not good.....when clearly they are at a bare minimum on par with todays most recent MMO releases minus AoC. At least im honest about it.
The animations need work but may be necessary to accomplish the massive gameplay ideas.
Animations arent amazing.....graphics are certainly good, if not great.
People seem to forget there is a difference between Graphics, Animations, and Art Style. The later two are more debatable than the first, and are more geared towards personal opinion.
I dislike it when people say "graphics are so great" when they clearly are not (fanboy). At least I am honest about it. The animations are not on par with other games and the polygon count seem generally low.
I hope DF will be entertaining but I'm keeping a realistic view
I'm not a "fanboy" and I think the graphics look great.
...Anyway I have a bad feeling Darkfall is going to have a huge problem with people camping zones just outside a town, something that happened in UO and basically destroyed that game.
There's 100's of city sites... dilution should take care of this
Camping same race will get you alignment hits Dunno how many will welcome this and i don't see how Mirdain should camping Orks outside Flaming Skull and other Ork citys for example LOL
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE-------------------------------------------------- $OE - eternal enemy of online gaming -We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)
Comments
Now this I can accept. While it is said
This has caused Tolkien to be popularly identified as the "father" of modern fantasy literature[6]—or more precisely, high fantasy
It is debatable. I like how you phrased that.
However the most widely accepted form of high fantasy used in mmorpgs and the general publics perception of what elements constitute the fantasy genre do borrow more heavily from Tolkien than any other single source.
I believe this is middle ground we can all agree apon. So I am out you guys have a good night.
Age of Conan MMO in fact took more inspiration and elements dirived from the origional books, and little or no inspiration off of tolkein, so deffinently not "All" fantasy mmo take directly from Tolkeins work. BTW the conan lore and books where around before the hobbit ever existed.
Actually, the Hobbit was written first, just wasn't published til 1937.
Regardless I dont think anyone here is saying ALL. Just most high-fantasy.
Thats a good point, but unfortunantly most will not accept this. Just like in many other things, for example: Russia, and a couple other nations where already finished with the prototype technology for space flight. Yet the americans where the first to successfully launch, hence even if americans finished developing the technology just a little bit later, they are still said to be the Father Nation of space flight. Even though in reality If i recall, americans finished development of test shuttles before russia, the point is, even if we did not finish first, the first out the door and that gets seen more is usually the winner. Unfortunantly this exact thing which most would say "Well Conan was out the door, wouldnt it win"? Well, like i just said, "Whoever gets seen more" is the biggest factor", when dealing with this calibur of great work. And unfortunantly conan did not have the reader base, or the ease of mass media to help it get known.
Well that's exactly it. I mean Tolkein was what caught on like wild-fire. Personally I love the gritty lore of Conan. Tolkein was a great writer but a little soft sometimes.
True, But no doubt both have givin a much thicker variety of fantasy, while many MMO's are are little "soft" like wow, and hmm, maybe even everquest2? Others go more in the conan direction with a hinted flavour of tolkeins work, such as creatures, and sorcery. Aka, Darkfall. See while many disliked "Age of conan" it seems darkfall got the best of "sandbox" while adding a blend of grittyness from the conan, and as well, elves, and magic from tolkein, I cant say i am disapointed with the way history has turned out
Now this I can accept. While it is said
This has caused Tolkien to be popularly identified as the "father" of modern fantasy literature[6]—or more precisely, high fantasy
It is debatable. I like how you phrased that.
However the most widely accepted form of high fantasy used in mmorpgs and the general publics perception of what elements constitute the fantasy genre do borrow more heavily from Tolkien than any other single source.
I believe this is middle ground we can all agree apon. So I am out you guys have a good night.
Age of Conan MMO in fact took more inspiration and elements dirived from the origional books, and little or no inspiration off of tolkein, so deffinently not "All" fantasy mmo take directly from Tolkeins work. BTW the conan lore and books where around before the hobbit ever existed. So while the public will relate most "fantasy" to "Tolkein" because of the popularity it got, that does not accurately represent the absolute source of most inspiration. As far as little half elves, elves, and sorcery in general, alot of it is taken from tolkein.
No not all Fantasy is derived from Tolkien that was never said. I guess your wondering why I added AoC then huh lol, merely for the fact that it has a Necromancer class which wasn't used in any way for Conan until 1972. Tolkiens Influence can be seen in many ways in the genre. No he is not the be all end all of the genre because it is continualy changing and evolving but he did have a very large influence on it and still does today.
He is credited the same way Bella Lugosi is as the Fore Father of Monsters in Horror films. They merely had a larger impacts on the genre than others. Same way UO is credited for bringing popularity to the MMORPG genre of gaming.
Texture and shader quality aren't everything. I mean, look at WoW. Part of the reason that game looked "good" was because of the smooth animation. This game may have some decent visuals, but from these two video footage snippets - the animation in this game looks absolutely atrotious. Graphics aren't everything for me... but I just can't handle a game that has minimal effort in the animation department. For me, poor animation is the absolute worst thing you can have in the graphics department.
That aside, this game is going to be a User Interface/HUD nightmare. From the looks of things, the developers thought of everything except how players will actually play the game. The inventory box was okay enough I guess, but he had windows all over the place for everything. I'm all for customization, but you have to have some sort of uniformity. It's a presentation thing.
Maybe this will all change after Beta... but I've said it before and I'll say it again - they're looking at a 2008 release... I don't see it happening. Maybe March-June 2009, at the earliest.
you mean like how corpses slid and the bodies seemed to twitch from side to side when leaning? Those are small tweaks at the most, and btw i would not go by the "Gameplay trailor" on making any assumptions, we have already seen it looks much better in the new presentation, as far as small animations and fluidity of bodys, ect, those will be fixed up in Open beta, before launch, or shortly after launch, but those will deffinently change. I personally loved the way wow looked too, besides the fact that it had crap technology driving its textures, the art direction was simply amazing. And that made people not really care how dated the "textures where" I can see the same thing in darkfall, the art direction may not be for everybody, but it is deffinetly there, and some of it looks very nice.
Now this I can accept. While it is said
This has caused Tolkien to be popularly identified as the "father" of modern fantasy literature[6]—or more precisely, high fantasy
It is debatable. I like how you phrased that.
However the most widely accepted form of high fantasy used in mmorpgs and the general publics perception of what elements constitute the fantasy genre do borrow more heavily from Tolkien than any other single source.
I believe this is middle ground we can all agree apon. So I am out you guys have a good night.
Age of Conan MMO in fact took more inspiration and elements dirived from the origional books, and little or no inspiration off of tolkein, so deffinently not "All" fantasy mmo take directly from Tolkeins work. BTW the conan lore and books where around before the hobbit ever existed.
Actually, the Hobbit was written first, just wasn't published til 1937.
Regardless I dont think anyone here is saying ALL. Just most high-fantasy.
Thats a good point, but unfortunantly most will not accept this. Just like in many other things, for example: Russia, and a couple other nations where already finished with the prototype technology for space flight. Yet the americans where the first to successfully launch, hence even if americans finished developing the technology just a little bit later, they are still said to be the Father Nation of space flight. Even though in reality If i recall, americans finished development of test shuttles before russia, the point is, even if we did not finish first, the first out the door and that gets seen more is usually the winner. Unfortunantly this exact thing which most would say "Well Conan was out the door, wouldnt it win"? Well, like i just said, "Whoever gets seen more" is the biggest factor", when dealing with this calibur of great work. And unfortunantly conan did not have the reader base, or the ease of mass media to help it get known.
Well that's exactly it. I mean Tolkein was what caught on like wild-fire. Personally I love the gritty lore of Conan. Tolkein was a great writer but a little soft sometimes.
True, But no doubt both have givin a much thicker variety of fantasy, while many MMO's are are little "soft" like wow, and hmm, maybe even everquest2? Others go more in the conan direction with a hinted flavour of tolkeins work, such as creatures, and sorcery. Aka, Darkfall. See while many disliked "Age of conan" it seems darkfall got the best of "sandbox" while adding a blend of grittyness from the conan, and as well, elves, and magic from tolkein, I cant say i am disapointed with the way history has turned out
Yeah I won't deny Howards impact on the genre either. The only one that did rival Howards influence was Tolkien.
Edited to add: That was actually an enjoyable debate guys so thanks for that. Now I am truely off this thread lol.
So having safe zones in the game makes a game more linear to you? Basically Earthrise is a ground based Eve online do you think Eve is linear? It has pve missions that you can solo also and if you kill people in high sec you get owned by guards too.
I wouldn't go by the list of skills on the site to be honest, the game isn't even in alpha so we have no freaking clue how many skills Earthrise will have.
I'm personally looking forward to both games but saying Earthrise seems more casual friendly is crazy imo. Both games have FFA areas in the game, both games will have quests you can solo. to be honest I believe the Earthrise Devs are learning from what Eve did, the only reason Eve has 250k subs instead of 25k is due to high sec space. If darkfall has no "high sec" area in the game it won't have many subs to be honest.
If your going to say Earthrise is more casual friendly due to a high sec secure area you must not have played Eve, even in high sec you can get owned very quickly if you mess with the wrong person. No area will be truely safe in ER so I consider both games very hardcore. High sec areas give people the illusion of safety and sometimes that illusion is all you need.
Anyway I have a bad feeling Darkfall is going to have a huge problem with people camping zones just outside a town, something that happened in UO and basically destroyed that game.
Darkfall will have "high sec" areas, but they will not be artificially imposed by the devs. It will be players themselves that create relatively safe areas. Thats the way it should be.
Khael[SUN]
SUN - peekayin since pong
Webdeveloper on:
http://www.guildofsun.com
http://www.bloodmonarchy.com
There's 100's of city sites... dilution should take care of this
I dislike it when people say "graphics are so great" when they clearly are not (fanboy). At least I am honest about it. The animations are not on par with other games and the polygon count seem generally low.
I hope DF will be entertaining but I'm keeping a realistic view
URL="http://www.darkfallonline.com/"]IMG]http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l1/rwp80/Darkfall Ad Banners/DFadsigbanner5.jpg[/IMG][/url]
I dislike when people say the graphics are clearly not good.....when clearly they are at a bare minimum on par with todays most recent MMO releases minus AoC. At least im honest about it.
The animations need work but may be necessary to accomplish the massive gameplay ideas.
Animations arent amazing.....graphics are certainly good, if not great.
People seem to forget there is a difference between Graphics, Animations, and Art Style. The later two are more debatable than the first, and are more geared towards personal opinion.
---sig---
Click this for lulz: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/173737/page/6
I'm not a "fanboy" and I think the graphics look great.
EDIT: What originalegg said.
There's 100's of city sites... dilution should take care of this
Camping same race will get you alignment hits Dunno how many will welcome this and i don't see how Mirdain should camping Orks outside Flaming Skull and other Ork citys for example LOL
-----MY-TERMS-OF-USE--------------------------------------------------
$OE - eternal enemy of online gaming
-We finally WON !!!! 2011 $OE accepted that they have been fired 2005 by the playerbase and closed down ridiculous NGE !!
"There was suppression of speech and all kinds of things between disturbing and fascistic." Raph Koster (parted $OE)