Ain't you guys tired of trolling Darkfall yet? Go troll a game that deserve trolling instead, like Eve. Atleast you know how that game plays and looks, more than you can say about Darkfall.
Ain't you guys tired of trolling Darkfall yet? Go troll a game that deserve trolling instead, like Eve. Atleast you know how that game plays and looks, more than you can say about Darkfall.
Why on earth, or the universe, does Eve deserve trollilng? It's a good, honest, serious game.
Defensive much? Only show that you are afraid that Darkfall will succeed.
I don't play WAR but he does have a point. Until DF releases sometime in the future there really isn't any point to consider it better than an already released game. ( I guess DnL would work ) The beta leaks have shown its far from complete, and the testers themselves are already saying push back the release date.
Regardless of how you feel about Darkfall itself, a little perspective is in order regarding the role of a producer. Tasos, apparently, is a producer of Darkfall (I say apparently because I don't know the guy and there's been no elaboration on his actual day-to-day duties at Aventurine that I know of).
I'm not sure how many of you here have entertainment industry experience, but a producer is a jack-of-all-trades title for a bullshitter. Producers are the salesmen/politicians/babykissers who drive the production of the game/movie/franchise by networking (socially), keeping track of budgets, making sure the skill people (programmers, actors, whatever) are in the right place at the right time doing the work, and many other non-technical but essential chores.
Producers are managers, they are not content or feature generators. They are certainly not 'developers' as the term is understood in the software industry.
They are salemen, plain and simple, and therefore you cannot ever believe anything that comes out of their mouths, as it is their job to bullshit you (and their investors) and get you to buy their product.
The timeline and the quotes in the original post are kind of comical if you're tracking how often Aventurine has been working on the game, but as far as Tasos is concerned, the quotes merely serve to illustrate that he is doing his job as a producer, which is to engage the fanbase/general public and keep them excited about the product, even though it may be years away from release. A producer's job is not to be honest with you. It is to present his product in the best possible light. If the truth happens to match up with what he says, that's a happy coincidence.
I don't know if Tasos does any coding on Darkfall, I doubt it, and the actual coders probably wish he would stfu and stop giving the fans ammunition with his sometimes contradictory statements. That said, he can't shut up, because it is his job to whip you all into a frenzy and thereby drive the game's hype meter up, and he is doing a damn fine job of it, and has been for years, lol.
Love the game or hate it, Tasos is doing what every competent producer does. All of you should think twice before you believe anything that comes out of a game developer's mouth (especially if that developer has 'producer' somewhere in their title). Their entire purpose is to get you to buy their product, and therefore they will say anything, and will sound extremely earnest and convincing when they say the exact opposite a week later.
Originally posted by veritas_X Regardless of how you feel about Darkfall itself, a little perspective is in order regarding the role of a producer. Tasos, apparently, is a producer of Darkfall (I say apparently because I don't know the guy and there's been no elaboration on his actual day-to-day duties at Aventurine that I know of). I'm not sure how many of you here have entertainment industry experience, but a producer is a jack-of-all-trades title for a bullshitter. Producers are the salesmen/politicians/babykissers who drive the production of the game/movie/franchise by networking (socially), keeping track of budgets, making sure the skill people (programmers, actors, whatever) are in the right place at the right time doing the work, and many other non-technical but essential chores. Producers are managers, they are not content or feature generators. They are certainly not 'developers' as the term is understood in the software industry. They are salemen, plain and simple, and therefore you cannot ever believe anything that comes out of their mouths, as it is their job to bullshit you (and their investors) and get you to buy their product. The timeline and the quotes in the original post are kind of comical if you're tracking how often Aventurine has been working on the game, but as far as Tasos is concerned, the quotes merely serve to illustrate that he is doing his job as a producer, which is to engage the fanbase/general public and keep them excited about the product, even though it may be years away from release. A producer's job is not to be honest with you. It is to present his product in the best possible light. If the truth happens to match up with what he says, that's a happy coincidence. I don't know if Tasos does any coding on Darkfall, I doubt it, and the actual coders probably wish he would stfu and stop giving the fans ammunition with his sometimes contradictory statements. That said, he can't shut up, because it is his job to whip you all into a frenzy and thereby drive the game's hype meter up, and he is doing a damn fine job of it, and has been for years, lol. Love the game or hate it, Tasos is doing what every competent producer does. All of you should think twice before you believe anything that comes out of a game developer's mouth (especially if that developer has 'producer' somewhere in their title). Their entire purpose is to get you to buy their product, and therefore they will say anything, and will sound extremely earnest and convincing when they say the exact opposite a week later.
While I respect what you have to say and add to the topic here, I couldn't disagree more.
Telling fans the game is "ready for launch" when it is still garbage = Not Good.
Telling fans that a beta is coming 'soon' back in 2003 and having fans anticipating such an event = Not Good.
Telling fans that they will all get to play BEFORE they will ever have to pre-pay one cent, when this is obviously NOT the case = Not good.
Telling the public total bullshit gives false hopes. And giving lots of lots of total BS and false hopes disintegrates the trust that most of your potential fan base might have which in turns eliminates potential profits and also creates a lot of confusion and skepticism as is clearly the current case with this game.
Maybe it's just me, but I'd much prefer an honest salesman then one that I can clearly see is full of total BS. If I catch a sales person feeding me obvious crap, I either play with him and try and make him look like an ass, or/and I DO NOT buy anything from him. I don't support the BS when it comes to sales people.
I don't hardly think that I am alone here. I think most consumers, when they smell obvious BS from a salesman turn their backs and buy from someone they trust more, even if it means listening to a trusted friend or family member and ordering it online or somewhere else.
Originally posted by TheHavok People take games WAY too seriously. Ah well, this seems to happen whenever a very hyped up game is about to release.
I getcha. But let's pretend for a moment that it isn't a game shall we?
Let's pretend that instead of a game, it's a brand new "Kraftsman" Super-Flex wrench that you go to the retail store to buy to go home and fix your car.
On that package at the store, the package advertises the wrench as "guaranteed never to break, and made with 100% stainless steel, guaranteed forever" and so on. The price seems high, but $50 is still much more affordable then the mechanic repairing your car, so you make the purchase with high expectations based on all of the implied quality and marksmanship and all on the package.
You get home, $50 + tax less in your wallet, and find that the wrench first of all won't even fit the standard sized bolt you need it to. Afterall, the package said it fits that size standard bolts that you bought it for.
After going back to the store, and spending much of your free time having to get a store manager and an override of the register and a big hassle, you finally make it back home with the "replacement model" that is up to date and should work.
It fits the bolt now, but as you put all your strength into the wrench to bust the bolt free inside your engine, the wrench itself breaks instead and you bust your knuckles on your engine block as pain shoots through your arm and blood squirts everywhere.
Obviously the false advertisements on the package of "break resistant" was bogus, amd now you have just a broken wrench (and forearm) and are out fifty bucks.
This probably just pisses most consumers off totally and they will go back and demand a full refund immediately and might even want to take further action!
So, you say that people take video games all too seriously.
If you ask me, I don't think we take them seriously enough. We hold most other products and companies at MUCH higher standards then we do the video game industry. We'll damn sure take that wrench back, but if we spend $50 on a game that turns out to be a pile of crap with tons of false advertising, most of us just put it aside and hope we make a better choice next time, almost like each game is a "wild gamble".
Most of us take back a pair of jeans if they don't fit right or tear in the inseam when we get them home. Most of us take back a coffee pot that don't work when we get it home, or takes too long, or makes too much noise or smoke. Most of us will take radio back to the shop if it has static in the background. On and On.. but video games, for some reason these game companies are not held to the same standards.
We not only allow them to BS us with broken or empty promises and sell us a broken game, but we even promote it and tell them in polls like the polls on these very DF forums that "no matter what, I'll buy your game anyhow, even if it is a pile of crap!" Look at one of the threads where almost 25% of the people basically say they'll buy it no matter what!
Call me "Serious Sam" if you like.
Or maybe just call me an honest consumer who has had the shades pulled over my eyes one too many times.
I've been down this block a time or two before, and this time I've decided to actually look where I am stepping before trusting that red-haired sales kid that the "ice will hold me up, just go ahead and step on it". ;-)
After all, I have seen loooong posts like these from you time after time now. This is not countering your numerous small contributions to other people threads in general regarding how evil Aventurine and their dark master Tasos is.
It seems like Darkfall gives you alot to do. I am just guessing: perhaps a way for you to let out built up anger?
Its fine, let it out. The community is here for you and Aventurine and Tasos has the stamina to bear with you having to let everything, that I assume has gone wrong for you, out on them.
Kisses and hugs from me, hope you feel better soon.
If you want to hire Machete to kill the bad guys, you better make damn sure the bad guy isnt you!
Originally posted by dummenumse You, my dear zaxx... You should be loving Darkfall. After all, I have seen loooong posts like these from you time after time now. This is not countering your numerous small contributions to other people threads in general regarding how evil Aventurine and their dark master Tasos is. It seems like Darkfall gives you alot to do. I am just guessing: perhaps a way for you to let out built up anger? Its fine, let it out. The community is here for you and Aventurine and Tasos has the stamina to bear with you having to let everything, that I assume has gone wrong for you, out on them. Kisses and hugs from me, hope you feel better soon.
Tell ya what.. you come and give me those umm hugs and kisses in person.
Simply download a real game that already exists. There is a trial period in Asherons Call. Log into the Darktide server. Name your avatar in AC something like "Darkfall RulzAC". Myself and many others there will be sure and give you plenty of lovin. {evil grin}
After all, I have seen loooong posts like these from you time after time now. This is not countering your numerous small contributions to other people threads in general regarding how evil Aventurine and their dark master Tasos is.
It seems like Darkfall gives you alot to do. I am just guessing: perhaps a way for you to let out built up anger?
Its fine, let it out. The community is here for you and Aventurine and Tasos has the stamina to bear with you having to let everything, that I assume has gone wrong for you, out on them.
Kisses and hugs from me, hope you feel better soon.
Tell ya what.. you come and give me those umm hugs and kisses in person.
Simply download a real game that already exists. There is a trial period in Asherons Call. Log into the Darktide server. Name your avatar in AC something like "Darkfall RulzAC". Myself and many others there will be sure and give you plenty of lovin. {evil grin}
Heh.
- Zaxx
Lol zaxx, you go through alot of shifts. First you trolled DF, then you admitted that you where wrong about certain things and that you where now interested and following it closely, and then you transfored into a uber-skeptic Whats next ol' zaxx.
Edit: I agree mainly with your thread OP, and that list was hellla funny, especially the newer ones. Well Cheers to DF failing or moderately succeeding. If it moderatlely succeeds, people will be able to find me ingame.
After all, I have seen loooong posts like these from you time after time now. This is not countering your numerous small contributions to other people threads in general regarding how evil Aventurine and their dark master Tasos is.
It seems like Darkfall gives you alot to do. I am just guessing: perhaps a way for you to let out built up anger?
Its fine, let it out. The community is here for you and Aventurine and Tasos has the stamina to bear with you having to let everything, that I assume has gone wrong for you, out on them.
Kisses and hugs from me, hope you feel better soon.
Tell ya what.. you come and give me those umm hugs and kisses in person.
Simply download a real game that already exists. There is a trial period in Asherons Call. Log into the Darktide server. Name your avatar in AC something like "Darkfall RulzAC". Myself and many others there will be sure and give you plenty of lovin. {evil grin}
Heh.
- Zaxx
Uh, sounds like I am really in trouble now.
Giggle
If you want to hire Machete to kill the bad guys, you better make damn sure the bad guy isnt you!
People take games WAY too seriously. Ah well, this seems to happen whenever a very hyped up game is about to release.
I getcha. But let's pretend for a moment that it isn't a game shall we?
Let's pretend ......
This is actually a very good point and unfortunately one that should be considered before we so blindly give our support to a company that makes video games.
""But Coyote, you could learn! You only prefer keyboard and mouse because that's all you've ever known!" You might say right before you hug a rainforest and walk in sandals to your drum circle where you're trying to raise group consciousness of ladybugs or whatever it is you dirty goddamn hippies do when you're not busy smoking pot and smelling bad." Coyote's Howling: Death of the Computer
People take games WAY too seriously. Ah well, this seems to happen whenever a very hyped up game is about to release.
I getcha. But let's pretend for a moment that it isn't a game shall we?
Let's pretend ......
This is actually a very good point and unfortunately one that should be considered before we so blindly give our support to a company that makes video games.
Exactly, you can love a game for what it is. But you cannot be so kind to the business side making all these promies, otherwise if they see people don't care, they wont bother making good on those promises. In life sadly, people like to take as many shortcuts as possible, the only way to prevent this is to show them that although it may be "only a game" It is a game that people will invest time in, and people take something like that very seriously, and so should those developing the game. So far, aventurine has made very loose statements.
If nobody spoke up about these things, trust me, the industry itself would belitter the gamers and take the easy way out every single time. Business practice is serious business, and it shouldnt be treated any differently for being a business that makes game, I treat aventurine exactly the same as I would anybody else trying to sell me any other kind of product.
When people like us cite our skepticism, it is not beacuse we want to dislike the company, we want them to do better, and it keeps developers from being lazy. Although it may not make any difference on a smart personal scale, but when tons of communties outspeak and their is alot of vocal communities on the subject, the mmo industry as a whole can take notice to what we want realized.
People take games WAY too seriously. Ah well, this seems to happen whenever a very hyped up game is about to release.
I getcha. But let's pretend for a moment that it isn't a game shall we?
Let's pretend ......
This is actually a very good point and unfortunately one that should be considered before we so blindly give our support to a company that makes video games.
Reasons to support them are plenty in my opinion; even with the above points taken into consideration.
And the beta leakers really speak good about the game. I do not care if they postpone it a month or two. It is nice to see someone trying to develop a product that appeals to what I (and many others) like.
Perhaps they fail. But I surely hope they do not. And seeing how complete the game is I find it highly unlikely that they will not release it.
If you want to hire Machete to kill the bad guys, you better make damn sure the bad guy isnt you!
People take games WAY too seriously. Ah well, this seems to happen whenever a very hyped up game is about to release.
I getcha. But let's pretend for a moment that it isn't a game shall we?
Let's pretend ......
This is actually a very good point and unfortunately one that should be considered before we so blindly give our support to a company that makes video games.
Reasons to support them are plenty in my opinion; even with the above points taken into consideration.
And the beta leakers really speak good about the game. I do not care if they postpone it a month or two. It is nice to see someone trying to develop a product that appeals to what I (and many others) like.
Perhaps they fail. But I surely hope they do not. And seeing how complete the game is I find it highly unlikely that they will not release it.
Hey alot of us my be skeptics and not like the way aventurine has said one thing and done another. But hardly anyone actually "Wants a mmo to fail". Most likely if you are on the forums, you are fond of mmo's in general for whatever reason. I am highly skeptical of darkfalls impending D-day on whether it does well, or flops. But I would also love to see it do well, because I have been straggling for several years now looking for a good MMO. Yes I even resorted to WoW for a couple year, but I dont think that counts because even though I enjoyed it, WoW has VERY little impact on a lasting impressing to why I love MMO's. I do however see the possibility of a lasting impression with darkfall. The only other MMO's to truly remember for me where SWG, and Planetside, and maybe runescape.
Yes I played RS in middle school back in like 2000 Great times too, I wouldn't dare go back, as I've outgrown it much in the same way I outgrew pokemon after leaving elementary school. But good times no less.
I wouldnt say its the most widely accused MMO of Vaporware in history.... I think Star Trek Online still holds that title. Going on 10+ years in development and 3 different developers.
I do think that most consumers don't hold game companies to the same standards that we hold most any other business.
If we go to a fast food place and spend $5 on a meal, tell them we don't want pickles and then find pickles on that burger, a lot of us will take that burger back and make them get it right! But if we spend TEN TIMES that amount on a game, and it isn't the quality they advertised or hyped it to be, we just throw in in a box or whatever and shrug our shoulders.
I can't speak for other countries, but here in the USA, if we purchase a video game and then don't like it, one of the reasons we can't take it back to the store and demand a refund is because almost every retail establishment has a "No refunds" policy on video games due to the high risk of consumers simply installing the game or copying it to a blank DVD then wanting to take it back. They will usually only trade a game out for the same exact game title only if somehow fails or is a bad disc or whatever.
But that should make us even MORE CAUTIOUS it would seem. I would think that we'd definitely want to double or triple check reviews and respected review magazines/websites before laying down our hard earned money.
$50 may not break the bank for a single game, win or lose. But multiplied by many game developers putting out less then desirable game content, and the money can certainly add up quickly if we as consumers don't do our homework before putting up the $$$.
Originally posted by Hodo I wouldnt say its the most widely accused MMO of Vaporware in history.... I think Star Trek Online still holds that title. Going on 10+ years in development and 3 different developers.
LOL. What??? Star Trek Online you say?
I think many, many times the people that have ever even heard of Star Trek Online know about Darkfall Online.
But yes, STO if it has been in development for 10+ years certainly fits the definition I gave for "vaporware" in my OP.
With all respest to the number of letters written.... this is just another "i dont know the facts about the game so i will just produce the facts" thread... it is really interesting to watch how much energy ppl can invest in speculation and guessing what this game is or it isn¨t...... get a life, wait for 3 more weeks, and if the game comes out... then you are entitled to be negative or positive about the game (and only if you have played the game)...
I wouldnt say its the most widely accused MMO of Vaporware in history.... I think Star Trek Online still holds that title. Going on 10+ years in development and 3 different developers.
Its not a widely accused of vaporware, it "IS" vaporware. Go look up the definition for vaporware, it fits the definition almost too perfectly. www.wikipedia.org their you go.
Originally posted by morgoth123 With all respest to the number of letters written.... this is just another "i dont know the facts about the game so i will just produce the facts" thread... it is really interesting to watch how much energy ppl can invest in speculation and guessing what this game is or it isn¨t...... get a life, wait for 3 more weeks, and if the game comes out... then you are entitled to be negative or positive about the game (and only if you have played the game)...
My OP was just speculation and facts that I made up huh?
Just out of curiosity, I think it is safe to assume that YOU will NOT be one of the lucky few who gets to "try before you buy" for Darkfall. So, will you pre-pay for that opportunity to start playing that game on launch day if that becomes available to you?
Just a question for you since you seem so quick to dismiss such information as in my OP as "speculation and guessing" and nothing more then that.
I do think that most consumers don't hold game companies to the same standards that we hold most any other business. If we go to a fast food place and spend $5 on a meal, tell them we don't want pickles and then find pickles on that burger, a lot of us will take that burger back and make them get it right! But if we spend TEN TIMES that amount on a game, and it isn't the quality they advertised or hyped it to be, we just throw in in a box or whatever and shrug our shoulders. I can't speak for other countries, but here in the USA, if we purchase a video game and then don't like it, one of the reasons we can't take it back to the store and demand a refund is because almost every retail establishment has a "No refunds" policy on video games due to the high risk of consumers simply installing the game or copying it to a blank DVD then wanting to take it back. They will usually only trade a game out for the same exact game title only if somehow fails or is a bad disc or whatever. But that should make us even MORE CAUTIOUS it would seem. I would think that we'd definitely want to double or triple check reviews and respected review magazines/websites before laying down our hard earned money. $50 may not break the bank for a single game, win or lose. But multiplied by many game developers putting out less then desirable game content, and the money can certainly add up quickly if we as consumers don't do our homework before putting up the $$$.
- Zaxx
Trust me if they had convenient way on par with fastfood of returning a purchase, people would be demanding refunds on some titles in the thousands. Unfortunately, different terms and standards apply to online games than a cheeseburger, and since most outlets dont allow refunds, this becomes a big waste of cash for those who actually care what they are putting money down on. Not to mention it's not very easy at all to go to an employee who works for the game company and ask "Can I speak with your manager?"
Comments
Yeah I did...I was really bored at work, I suck I know.
Ain't you guys tired of trolling Darkfall yet? Go troll a game that deserve trolling instead, like Eve. Atleast you know how that game plays and looks, more than you can say about Darkfall.
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Grammar nazi's. This one is for you.
Why on earth, or the universe, does Eve deserve trollilng? It's a good, honest, serious game.
I stopped reading after the 2nd sentence. Maybe I shouldnt as it only could get better.
I don't play WAR but he does have a point. Until DF releases sometime in the future there really isn't any point to consider it better than an already released game. ( I guess DnL would work ) The beta leaks have shown its far from complete, and the testers themselves are already saying push back the release date.
Regardless of how you feel about Darkfall itself, a little perspective is in order regarding the role of a producer. Tasos, apparently, is a producer of Darkfall (I say apparently because I don't know the guy and there's been no elaboration on his actual day-to-day duties at Aventurine that I know of).
I'm not sure how many of you here have entertainment industry experience, but a producer is a jack-of-all-trades title for a bullshitter. Producers are the salesmen/politicians/babykissers who drive the production of the game/movie/franchise by networking (socially), keeping track of budgets, making sure the skill people (programmers, actors, whatever) are in the right place at the right time doing the work, and many other non-technical but essential chores.
Producers are managers, they are not content or feature generators. They are certainly not 'developers' as the term is understood in the software industry.
They are salemen, plain and simple, and therefore you cannot ever believe anything that comes out of their mouths, as it is their job to bullshit you (and their investors) and get you to buy their product.
The timeline and the quotes in the original post are kind of comical if you're tracking how often Aventurine has been working on the game, but as far as Tasos is concerned, the quotes merely serve to illustrate that he is doing his job as a producer, which is to engage the fanbase/general public and keep them excited about the product, even though it may be years away from release. A producer's job is not to be honest with you. It is to present his product in the best possible light. If the truth happens to match up with what he says, that's a happy coincidence.
I don't know if Tasos does any coding on Darkfall, I doubt it, and the actual coders probably wish he would stfu and stop giving the fans ammunition with his sometimes contradictory statements. That said, he can't shut up, because it is his job to whip you all into a frenzy and thereby drive the game's hype meter up, and he is doing a damn fine job of it, and has been for years, lol.
Love the game or hate it, Tasos is doing what every competent producer does. All of you should think twice before you believe anything that comes out of a game developer's mouth (especially if that developer has 'producer' somewhere in their title). Their entire purpose is to get you to buy their product, and therefore they will say anything, and will sound extremely earnest and convincing when they say the exact opposite a week later.
While I respect what you have to say and add to the topic here, I couldn't disagree more.
Telling fans the game is "ready for launch" when it is still garbage = Not Good.
Telling fans that a beta is coming 'soon' back in 2003 and having fans anticipating such an event = Not Good.
Telling fans that they will all get to play BEFORE they will ever have to pre-pay one cent, when this is obviously NOT the case = Not good.
Telling the public total bullshit gives false hopes. And giving lots of lots of total BS and false hopes disintegrates the trust that most of your potential fan base might have which in turns eliminates potential profits and also creates a lot of confusion and skepticism as is clearly the current case with this game.
Maybe it's just me, but I'd much prefer an honest salesman then one that I can clearly see is full of total BS. If I catch a sales person feeding me obvious crap, I either play with him and try and make him look like an ass, or/and I DO NOT buy anything from him. I don't support the BS when it comes to sales people.
I don't hardly think that I am alone here. I think most consumers, when they smell obvious BS from a salesman turn their backs and buy from someone they trust more, even if it means listening to a trusted friend or family member and ordering it online or somewhere else.
- Zaxx
People take games WAY too seriously. Ah well, this seems to happen whenever a very hyped up game is about to release.
I getcha. But let's pretend for a moment that it isn't a game shall we?
Let's pretend that instead of a game, it's a brand new "Kraftsman" Super-Flex wrench that you go to the retail store to buy to go home and fix your car.
On that package at the store, the package advertises the wrench as "guaranteed never to break, and made with 100% stainless steel, guaranteed forever" and so on. The price seems high, but $50 is still much more affordable then the mechanic repairing your car, so you make the purchase with high expectations based on all of the implied quality and marksmanship and all on the package.
You get home, $50 + tax less in your wallet, and find that the wrench first of all won't even fit the standard sized bolt you need it to. Afterall, the package said it fits that size standard bolts that you bought it for.
After going back to the store, and spending much of your free time having to get a store manager and an override of the register and a big hassle, you finally make it back home with the "replacement model" that is up to date and should work.
It fits the bolt now, but as you put all your strength into the wrench to bust the bolt free inside your engine, the wrench itself breaks instead and you bust your knuckles on your engine block as pain shoots through your arm and blood squirts everywhere.
Obviously the false advertisements on the package of "break resistant" was bogus, amd now you have just a broken wrench (and forearm) and are out fifty bucks.
This probably just pisses most consumers off totally and they will go back and demand a full refund immediately and might even want to take further action!
So, you say that people take video games all too seriously.
If you ask me, I don't think we take them seriously enough. We hold most other products and companies at MUCH higher standards then we do the video game industry. We'll damn sure take that wrench back, but if we spend $50 on a game that turns out to be a pile of crap with tons of false advertising, most of us just put it aside and hope we make a better choice next time, almost like each game is a "wild gamble".
Most of us take back a pair of jeans if they don't fit right or tear in the inseam when we get them home. Most of us take back a coffee pot that don't work when we get it home, or takes too long, or makes too much noise or smoke. Most of us will take radio back to the shop if it has static in the background. On and On.. but video games, for some reason these game companies are not held to the same standards.
We not only allow them to BS us with broken or empty promises and sell us a broken game, but we even promote it and tell them in polls like the polls on these very DF forums that "no matter what, I'll buy your game anyhow, even if it is a pile of crap!" Look at one of the threads where almost 25% of the people basically say they'll buy it no matter what!
Call me "Serious Sam" if you like.
Or maybe just call me an honest consumer who has had the shades pulled over my eyes one too many times.
I've been down this block a time or two before, and this time I've decided to actually look where I am stepping before trusting that red-haired sales kid that the "ice will hold me up, just go ahead and step on it". ;-)
...Just something to think about, huh?
- Zaxx
I getcha. But let's pretend for a moment that it isn't a game shall we?
...- Zaxx
Let's pretend it is a consumer product that costs $50....
This post by the way - is in support of Zaxx and what he says - only I said it shorter
Once money changes hands - a whole new set of rules apply.
If you want to go the "it's just a game! don't take it so seriously!" route - then make it Free to Play.
Nothing says irony like spelling ideot wrong.
You, my dear zaxx...
You should be loving Darkfall.
After all, I have seen loooong posts like these from you time after time now. This is not countering your numerous small contributions to other people threads in general regarding how evil Aventurine and their dark master Tasos is.
It seems like Darkfall gives you alot to do. I am just guessing: perhaps a way for you to let out built up anger?
Its fine, let it out. The community is here for you and Aventurine and Tasos has the stamina to bear with you having to let everything, that I assume has gone wrong for you, out on them.
Kisses and hugs from me, hope you feel better soon.
If you want to hire Machete to kill the bad guys, you better make damn sure the bad guy isnt you!
Tell ya what.. you come and give me those umm hugs and kisses in person.
Simply download a real game that already exists. There is a trial period in Asherons Call. Log into the Darktide server. Name your avatar in AC something like "Darkfall RulzAC". Myself and many others there will be sure and give you plenty of lovin. {evil grin}
Heh.
- Zaxx
Tell ya what.. you come and give me those umm hugs and kisses in person.
Simply download a real game that already exists. There is a trial period in Asherons Call. Log into the Darktide server. Name your avatar in AC something like "Darkfall RulzAC". Myself and many others there will be sure and give you plenty of lovin. {evil grin}
Heh.
- Zaxx
Lol zaxx, you go through alot of shifts. First you trolled DF, then you admitted that you where wrong about certain things and that you where now interested and following it closely, and then you transfored into a uber-skeptic
Whats next ol' zaxx.
Edit: I agree mainly with your thread OP, and that list was hellla funny, especially the newer ones. Well Cheers to DF failing or moderately succeeding. If it moderatlely succeeds, people will be able to find me ingame.
Tell ya what.. you come and give me those umm hugs and kisses in person.
Simply download a real game that already exists. There is a trial period in Asherons Call. Log into the Darktide server. Name your avatar in AC something like "Darkfall RulzAC". Myself and many others there will be sure and give you plenty of lovin. {evil grin}
Heh.
- Zaxx
Uh, sounds like I am really in trouble now.
Giggle
If you want to hire Machete to kill the bad guys, you better make damn sure the bad guy isnt you!
I getcha. But let's pretend for a moment that it isn't a game shall we?
Let's pretend ......
This is actually a very good point and unfortunately one that should be considered before we so blindly give our support to a company that makes video games.
""But Coyote, you could learn! You only prefer keyboard and mouse because that's all you've ever known!" You might say right before you hug a rainforest and walk in sandals to your drum circle where you're trying to raise group consciousness of ladybugs or whatever it is you dirty goddamn hippies do when you're not busy smoking pot and smelling bad."
Coyote's Howling: Death of the Computer
I getcha. But let's pretend for a moment that it isn't a game shall we?
Let's pretend ......
This is actually a very good point and unfortunately one that should be considered before we so blindly give our support to a company that makes video games.
Exactly, you can love a game for what it is. But you cannot be so kind to the business side making all these promies, otherwise if they see people don't care, they wont bother making good on those promises. In life sadly, people like to take as many shortcuts as possible, the only way to prevent this is to show them that although it may be "only a game" It is a game that people will invest time in, and people take something like that very seriously, and so should those developing the game. So far, aventurine has made very loose statements.
If nobody spoke up about these things, trust me, the industry itself would belitter the gamers and take the easy way out every single time. Business practice is serious business, and it shouldnt be treated any differently for being a business that makes game, I treat aventurine exactly the same as I would anybody else trying to sell me any other kind of product.
When people like us cite our skepticism, it is not beacuse we want to dislike the company, we want them to do better, and it keeps developers from being lazy. Although it may not make any difference on a smart personal scale, but when tons of communties outspeak and their is alot of vocal communities on the subject, the mmo industry as a whole can take notice to what we want realized.
I getcha. But let's pretend for a moment that it isn't a game shall we?
Let's pretend ......
This is actually a very good point and unfortunately one that should be considered before we so blindly give our support to a company that makes video games.
Reasons to support them are plenty in my opinion; even with the above points taken into consideration.
And the beta leakers really speak good about the game. I do not care if they postpone it a month or two. It is nice to see someone trying to develop a product that appeals to what I (and many others) like.
Perhaps they fail. But I surely hope they do not. And seeing how complete the game is I find it highly unlikely that they will not release it.
If you want to hire Machete to kill the bad guys, you better make damn sure the bad guy isnt you!
I getcha. But let's pretend for a moment that it isn't a game shall we?
Let's pretend ......
This is actually a very good point and unfortunately one that should be considered before we so blindly give our support to a company that makes video games.
Reasons to support them are plenty in my opinion; even with the above points taken into consideration.
And the beta leakers really speak good about the game. I do not care if they postpone it a month or two. It is nice to see someone trying to develop a product that appeals to what I (and many others) like.
Perhaps they fail. But I surely hope they do not. And seeing how complete the game is I find it highly unlikely that they will not release it.
Hey alot of us my be skeptics and not like the way aventurine has said one thing and done another. But hardly anyone actually "Wants a mmo to fail". Most likely if you are on the forums, you are fond of mmo's in general for whatever reason. I am highly skeptical of darkfalls impending D-day on whether it does well, or flops. But I would also love to see it do well, because I have been straggling for several years now looking for a good MMO. Yes I even resorted to WoW for a couple year, but I dont think that counts because even though I enjoyed it, WoW has VERY little impact on a lasting impressing to why I love MMO's. I do however see the possibility of a lasting impression with darkfall. The only other MMO's to truly remember for me where SWG, and Planetside, and maybe runescape.
Yes I played RS in middle school back in like 2000
Great times too, I wouldn't dare go back, as I've outgrown it much in the same way I outgrew pokemon after leaving elementary school. But good times no less.
I wouldnt say its the most widely accused MMO of Vaporware in history.... I think Star Trek Online still holds that title. Going on 10+ years in development and 3 different developers.
So much crap, so little quality.
I do think that most consumers don't hold game companies to the same standards that we hold most any other business.
If we go to a fast food place and spend $5 on a meal, tell them we don't want pickles and then find pickles on that burger, a lot of us will take that burger back and make them get it right! But if we spend TEN TIMES that amount on a game, and it isn't the quality they advertised or hyped it to be, we just throw in in a box or whatever and shrug our shoulders.
I can't speak for other countries, but here in the USA, if we purchase a video game and then don't like it, one of the reasons we can't take it back to the store and demand a refund is because almost every retail establishment has a "No refunds" policy on video games due to the high risk of consumers simply installing the game or copying it to a blank DVD then wanting to take it back. They will usually only trade a game out for the same exact game title only if somehow fails or is a bad disc or whatever.
But that should make us even MORE CAUTIOUS it would seem. I would think that we'd definitely want to double or triple check reviews and respected review magazines/websites before laying down our hard earned money.
$50 may not break the bank for a single game, win or lose. But multiplied by many game developers putting out less then desirable game content, and the money can certainly add up quickly if we as consumers don't do our homework before putting up the $$$.
- Zaxx
LOL. What??? Star Trek Online you say?
I think many, many times the people that have ever even heard of Star Trek Online know about Darkfall Online.
But yes, STO if it has been in development for 10+ years certainly fits the definition I gave for "vaporware" in my OP.
- Zaxx
With all respest to the number of letters written.... this is just another "i dont know the facts about the game so i will just produce the facts" thread... it is really interesting to watch how much energy ppl can invest in speculation and guessing what this game is or it isn¨t...... get a life, wait for 3 more weeks, and if the game comes out... then you are entitled to be negative or positive about the game (and only if you have played the game)...
Its not a widely accused of vaporware, it "IS" vaporware. Go look up the definition for vaporware, it fits the definition almost too perfectly. www.wikipedia.org their you go.
My OP was just speculation and facts that I made up huh?
Just out of curiosity, I think it is safe to assume that YOU will NOT be one of the lucky few who gets to "try before you buy" for Darkfall. So, will you pre-pay for that opportunity to start playing that game on launch day if that becomes available to you?
Just a question for you since you seem so quick to dismiss such information as in my OP as "speculation and guessing" and nothing more then that.
- Zaxx
Trust me if they had convenient way on par with fastfood of returning a purchase, people would be demanding refunds on some titles in the thousands. Unfortunately, different terms and standards apply to online games than a cheeseburger, and since most outlets dont allow refunds, this becomes a big waste of cash for those who actually care what they are putting money down on. Not to mention it's not very easy at all to go to an employee who works for the game company and ask "Can I speak with your manager?"