You old timers sound exactly like the old timers down at the cafe who sit around read newspapers and chat about politics.
They say stuff like: 'kid's these days have it too easy.' 'if they live back in our time most of them would've never made it' and they talk about how wonderful things were back in their day.
You old timers sound exactly like the old timers down at the cafe who sit around read newspapers and chat about politics. They say stuff like: 'kid's these days have it too easy.' 'if they live back in our time most of them would've never made it' and they talk about how wonderful things were back in their day. They forget about polio, facism and Jim Crow. It's nostalgia pure and simple.
Jim Crow? Jim Beam
I think the old timers are right though. If someone like you went back and played EQ back in the day, you would realize it.
Most people here are probably new to the genre, so they don't really understand all of the complaints directed toward newer MMORPGs. They don't realize that the genre used to be challenging, the PvP used to be fun, and MMORPGs used to be real MMORPGs, with worlds and not cheap lobbies and instances all over the place.
MMORPGs these days are easy, too easy.. I'm hesitant to call something like WoW a game, with all of the hand outs. I mean, all of the free hand outs, it's not very interactive to show up to a zone and get the best loot in the game without having to put forth any effort.
And that polio thing.. older MMORPGs were true MMORPGs. The newer ones really aren't MMORPGs. There is no world, no community, there is nothing massive about instancing everything.
Back when I played MMORPGs, I knew everyone on the server. Now you are lucky to know 1 or 2 people by the time you hit 80. Instances with random players, and games where you can solo to 80... You could level to 80 in WoW without anyone else, it's a single player game.
You old timers sound exactly like the old timers down at the cafe who sit around read newspapers and chat about politics. They say stuff like: 'kid's these days have it too easy.' 'if they live back in our time most of them would've never made it' and they talk about how wonderful things were back in their day. They forget about polio, facism and Jim Crow. It's nostalgia pure and simple.
Jim Crow? Jim Beam
I think the old timers are right though. If someone like you went back and played EQ back in the day, you would realize it.
Most people here are probably new to the genre, so they don't really understand all of the complaints directed toward newer MMORPGs. They don't realize that the genre used to be challenging, the PvP used to be fun, and MMORPGs used to be real MMORPGs, with worlds and not cheap lobbies and instances all over the place.
MMORPGs these days are easy, too easy.. I'm hesitant to call something like WoW a game, with all of the hand outs. I mean, all of the free hand outs, it's not very interactive to show up to a zone and get the best loot in the game without having to put forth any effort.
And that polio thing.. older MMORPGs were true MMORPGs. The newer ones really aren't MMORPGs. There is no world, no community, there is nothing massive about instancing everything.
Back when I played MMORPGs, I knew everyone on the server. Now you are lucky to know 1 or 2 people by the time you hit 80. Instances with random players, and games where you can solo to 80... You could level to 80 in WoW without anyone else, it's a single player game.
Gin, you are my favorite person right now. the last phrase sums up the new MMOGs that are comming out, in fact dare i call them OSPG (online single player games)
though you probably didnt know EVERYONE, but you knew the MAIN MAJORITY which was roughly 75% :P sry...
i still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS
You old timers sound exactly like the old timers down at the cafe who sit around read newspapers and chat about politics. They say stuff like: 'kid's these days have it too easy.' 'if they live back in our time most of them would've never made it' and they talk about how wonderful things were back in their day. They forget about polio, facism and Jim Crow. It's nostalgia pure and simple.
Jim Crow? Jim Beam
I think the old timers are right though. If someone like you went back and played EQ back in the day, you would realize it.
Most people here are probably new to the genre, so they don't really understand all of the complaints directed toward newer MMORPGs. They don't realize that the genre used to be challenging, the PvP used to be fun, and MMORPGs used to be real MMORPGs, with worlds and not cheap lobbies and instances all over the place.
MMORPGs these days are easy, too easy.. I'm hesitant to call something like WoW a game, with all of the hand outs. I mean, all of the free hand outs, it's not very interactive to show up to a zone and get the best loot in the game without having to put forth any effort.
And that polio thing.. older MMORPGs were true MMORPGs. The newer ones really aren't MMORPGs. There is no world, no community, there is nothing massive about instancing everything.
Back when I played MMORPGs, I knew everyone on the server. Now you are lucky to know 1 or 2 people by the time you hit 80. Instances with random players, and games where you can solo to 80... You could level to 80 in WoW without anyone else, it's a single player game.
Gin, you are my favorite person right now. the last phrase sums up the new MMOGs that are comming out, in fact dare i call them OSPG (online single player games)
though you probably didnt know EVERYONE, but you knew the MAIN MAJORITY which was roughly 75% :P sry...
i still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS
"I still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS"
What game ever had that?
Sometimes i think people are remembering stuff that never existed.. That game you remember hasn't been made yet, we are still waiting for it.
Nothing excites jaded Grandmasters more than a theoretical novelty
Gin, you are my favorite person right now. the last phrase sums up the new MMOGs that are comming out, in fact dare i call them OSPG (online single player games)
though you probably didnt know EVERYONE, but you knew the MAIN MAJORITY which was roughly 75% :P sry...
i still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS
"I still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS"
What game ever had that?
Sometimes i think people are remembering stuff that never existed.. That game you remember hasn't been made yet, we are still waiting for it.
ahm UO, EQ1 (at least at the beginig) and SWG (pre-cu) ranger camps anyone?
Haha Gink, so you stop pretending to be a skilled player as no one buys the bullshit.
Now you pretend to talk on behalf of "old timers" as if ... and oh you are only 23 and you are still drinking milk when I got my PhD. You are old timer in your dreams?
The new generation displaces the old, that is progression. Trying to look back as if the past is better is just illusion. Trying to preach to us when you are only 23, is just bullshit. I am possibly older than your parents.
Gin, you are my favorite person right now. the last phrase sums up the new MMOGs that are comming out, in fact dare i call them OSPG (online single player games)
though you probably didnt know EVERYONE, but you knew the MAIN MAJORITY which was roughly 75% :P sry...
i still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS
"I still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS"
What game ever had that?
Sometimes i think people are remembering stuff that never existed.. That game you remember hasn't been made yet, we are still waiting for it.
ahm UO, EQ1 (at least at the beginig) and SWG (pre-cu) ranger camps anyone?
Ooh ya, EQ1, Run halfway across the world with a Warrior just to get ganked and have to do it again to get your corpse. That was an adventure... After you had made the trip once, it isn't an adventure the second time. Doing it over and over and over again doesn't make it an adventure either.
UO was even less of an adventure then EQ after you had made the a trip a few times. Never played SWG, so maybe that is the holy grail of adventure games, creating such a dynamic world that each trip out was an adventure...
I doubt that highly. Risky environments do not make it an Adventure. If that was true every Warcraft Raid would be an "adventure" and i'm sure you won't want to admit that.
Hmm, Actually Hellgate London, first time to a new station was an adventure on Hardcore Mode. Creatures were random, encounters were random, you never knew if you might get a deadly mix of creatures that would lead to your death. Now that game on hardcore mode made getting from point A to point B an adventure every time.
Edit to add: Basically what i'm saying is nothing feels quite like that first time, in any game unless its dynamic somehow. If the same buildings are there with the same mobs, with the same tricks to get by, its not an adventure once you've done it.
I'll add Shadowbane to games that made point A to point B an adventure. I remember logging out one night where i thought it was safe, logging in the next day and the town was hostile. That game could make point A to point B very dynamic at times.
Nothing excites jaded Grandmasters more than a theoretical novelty
Haha Gink, so you stop pretending to be a skilled player as no one buys the bullshit. Now you pretend to talk on behalf of "old timers" as if ... and oh you are only 23 and you are still drinking milk when I got my PhD. You are old timer in your dreams? The new generation displaces the old, that is progression. Trying to look back as if the past is better is just illusion. Trying to preach to us when you are only 23, is just bullshit. I am possibly older than your parents.
That is so true and its simply the reality of life. The new will always replace the old. When anyone looks back on the past, there's always a tendency to focus on the good instead of the bad. I agree that EQ was an excellent game for its time but to simply consider it as the best ever is stretching it a bit.
I recall, 3 months - day in day out - spent in Velks leveling simply because I couldn't find anywhere else to go to go from 40-45 at the time (Rng main lol what can ya do eh). 3 days camping Stormfeather for the Eyepatch. 2+ years for my epics. Definitely not all that much fun. What made EQ memorable, for me anyway, was the people I met.
The truth is, Ginkeq, if you want a game like EQ, well, you can always go back to EQ. I know I can since my toons are still there and were not deleted. But, I don't because simply put, you can never resurrect the past. Yes, the games these days do seem overly simple but hey, to me that's a good thing if I can 'finish' it within a few months then I can at least, in a way, save some money by moving on to another game and trying something else.
As someone once said "The past is a foreign country; they do things differently there."
And on a side note, Seriously ? 23 ? I mean Seriously ? Lol, come talk to me again in another 20 years or so after life has knocked you around a bit and then we'll talk about you being an old timer.
Gin, you are my favorite person right now. the last phrase sums up the new MMOGs that are comming out, in fact dare i call them OSPG (online single player games)
though you probably didnt know EVERYONE, but you knew the MAIN MAJORITY which was roughly 75% :P sry...
i still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS
"I still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS"
What game ever had that?
Sometimes i think people are remembering stuff that never existed.. That game you remember hasn't been made yet, we are still waiting for it.
ahm UO, EQ1 (at least at the beginig) and SWG (pre-cu) ranger camps anyone?
Ooh ya, EQ1, Run halfway across the world with a Warrior just to get ganked and have to do it again to get your corpse. That was an adventure... After you had made the trip once, it isn't an adventure the second time. Doing it over and over and over again doesn't make it an adventure either.
UO was even less of an adventure then EQ after you had made the a trip a few times. Never played SWG, so maybe that is the holy grail of adventure games, creating such a dynamic world that each trip out was an adventure...
I doubt that highly. Risky environments do not make it an Adventure. If that was true every Warcraft Raid would be an "adventure" and i'm sure you won't want to admit that.
Hmm, Actually Hellgate London, first time to a new station was an adventure on Hardcore Mode. Creatures were random, encounters were random, you never knew if you might get a deadly mix of creatures that would lead to your death. Now that game on hardcore mode made getting from point A to point B an adventure every time.
Edit to add: Basically what i'm saying is nothing feels quite like that first time, in any game unless its dynamic somehow. If the same buildings are there with the same mobs, with the same tricks to get by, its not an adventure once you've done it.
I'll add Shadowbane to games that made point A to point B an adventure. I remember logging out one night where i thought it was safe, logging in the next day and the town was hostile. That game could make point A to point B very dynamic at times.
Minor comments, not direct against you, just offspring remarks.
SWG at start was good because in that game every role has a role. Even pure merchants have a role. That means some kind of game variety that is unknown to us then, fresh new experience. You can drop you house any where on a huge map, shops inside with vendoring machines, factories inside your house, you can buy and sell thru vendor machines. People travel to visit great factories, merchant buy good batches of output from producers and avoid bad batches. Its a dynamic society, with every piece unique. The same gun you make today =/= the same gun you make tomorrow, even if its called the same.
Novelty is always fun, unless it is so crappy. As we grow up, novelty is harder and harder to find. My sister's toddler find my wardrobe fun, he hides inside it everyday. I don't.
Luckily the toddler grows up and let the old novelties go. Same for gamers. Some cannot let the past go, its ok for them to hang onto it. Its fast becoming a nuisance for them to come preaching to us, as if some old game is gospel and the only true god of games that only the wise man learns to appreciate and play.
You old timers sound exactly like the old timers down at the cafe who sit around read newspapers and chat about politics. They say stuff like: 'kid's these days have it too easy.' 'if they live back in our time most of them would've never made it' and they talk about how wonderful things were back in their day. They forget about polio, facism and Jim Crow. It's nostalgia pure and simple.
Jim Crow? Jim Beam
I think the old timers are right though. If someone like you went back and played EQ back in the day, you would realize it.
Most people here are probably new to the genre, so they don't really understand all of the complaints directed toward newer MMORPGs. They don't realize that the genre used to be challenging, the PvP used to be fun, and MMORPGs used to be real MMORPGs, with worlds and not cheap lobbies and instances all over the place.
MMORPGs these days are easy, too easy.. I'm hesitant to call something like WoW a game, with all of the hand outs. I mean, all of the free hand outs, it's not very interactive to show up to a zone and get the best loot in the game without having to put forth any effort.
And that polio thing.. older MMORPGs were true MMORPGs. The newer ones really aren't MMORPGs. There is no world, no community, there is nothing massive about instancing everything.
Back when I played MMORPGs, I knew everyone on the server. Now you are lucky to know 1 or 2 people by the time you hit 80. Instances with random players, and games where you can solo to 80... You could level to 80 in WoW without anyone else, it's a single player game.
Gin, you are my favorite person right now. the last phrase sums up the new MMOGs that are comming out, in fact dare i call them OSPG (online single player games)
though you probably didnt know EVERYONE, but you knew the MAIN MAJORITY which was roughly 75% :P sry...
i still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS
non!i ll give them their due!wow and the newer genre mostly are multiplayer online game .that being said they are not massive multiplayer
massive multiplayer got twisted ,yes online there are massive amount of player ,but you cant interact with them in a battle
only like a chat room can you interact.in my book wow and countless other that instanced everything cannot
call their game massive multiplayer online game,since they are just multiplayer online game
Originally posted by drbaltazar yes online there are massive amount of player ,but you cant interact with them in a battle only like a chat room can you interact.in my book wow and countless other that instanced everything cannot call their game massive multiplayer online game,since they are just multiplayer online game where are the massive multiplayer ?eve is one!
Yes, Eve is a special game, but not in the way you suggest:
In Eve, you cannot interact with players in battle outside the system you are in. Guess why that is - every system is an instance! If you and another player never are in the same system at the same time, you can only interact through chat. You can agree to meet, but you can do that in other games as well. When you misguidedly play PvE in Eve (missions), you'll even have to go into your own private instance. At least in many other games, most missions (quests) can be completed outside private instances.
Even in a PvE game like LotRO I've seen an awful lot of players in the same public instance at the same time, like they can be in an Eve Online system. However, they weren't there to fight each other, but they were enjoying a concert. But it's a completely different game, so it makes sense people do different things...
Instancing is evil, only there for devs to make easy content and bring down server load its like beeing confined in a box
i wouldnt go so far,since someone pointed out to me that eve IS IN FACT a form of instancing,but men do you see the difference.ton of player can interact in battle
Originally posted by Selo Instancing is evil, only there for devs to make easy content and bring down server load its like being confined in a box
Private instancing could also be a useful tool for storytelling, for PvE games that do that kind of thing (of the games I played, Guildwars and LotRO come to mind).
This simply means there is alienation of the founding fathers. This creates a huge niche in the market- meaning, even for the capitalist-driven industry that it has become, there's money to be made by doing things 'the old way'. The other thing to consider is that history repeats itself. What is the fad today won't be tomorrow, and the hairdo's from the 60s will make their comeback- it never fails to deliver.
The beautiful thing about the MMO industry is that it's built using the same infrastructures that are used to consume. Making MMOs will always have their share of potential good products rather than your insta-grats that plague the market, because one needs to be 'hardcore' themselves in order to even reach a creation point. Purebreds are kept around for a reason, in every industry.
Maybe it's just time to head back to MUDs and wait for the corporate capitalist storm to pass. D&D is still alive and kicking. So much could be learnt from their example.
That is exactly right, and we're not saying NO to save WoW, because it is already a lost cause. We are saying NO to dissuade the next group of greedy suits who decide to emulate Blizzard and Cryptic, etc. We can prevent some of the future games from spewing this crap, but the sooner we start saying no, the better the results will be. So - Stand up, pull up your pants, and walk away. - MMO_Doubter
Hardly. This simply means there is alienation of the founding fathers. This creates a huge niche in the market- meaning, even for the capitalist-driven industry that it has become, there's money to be made by doing things 'the old way'. The other thing to consider is that history repeats itself. What is the fad today won't be tomorrow, and the hairdo's from the 60s will make their comeback- it never fails to deliver. The beautiful thing about the MMO industry is that it's built using the same infrastructures that are used to consume. Making MMOs will always have their share of potential good products rather than your insta-grats that plague the market, because one needs to be 'hardcore' themselves in order to even reach a creation point. Purebreds are kept around for a reason, in every industry. Maybe it's just time to head back to MUDs and wait for the corporate capitalist storm to pass. D&D is still alive and kicking. So much could be learnt from their example.
Name a few good MUDs. I haven't played any since Vampire: The Masquerade MUDs and MUSHs were popular like ten or fifteen years ago.
old school MMORPG gamers i started my MMO days with ultima online, pre-trammel
Hi,
Sorry if I offend you but I have a hard time to believe that you played UO when you were 12 year old , your profile says 24 y/o and Pre Trammel was 1998/1999 ( if I trust wikipedia since I never played UO ).
Good are the chances that I am wrong and I hope I am but I find amusing to read so many thread about so called Old School gamer Pre Trammel and when you check their profile some of them were not even 5 y/o at the time.
old school MMORPG gamers i started my MMO days with ultima online, pre-trammel
Hi,
Sorry if I offend you but I have a hard time to believe that you played UO when you were 12 year old , your profile says 24 y/o and Pre Trammel was 1998/1999 ( if I trust wikipedia since I never played UO ).
Good are the chances that I am wrong and I hope I am but I find amusing to read so many thread about so called Old School gamer Pre Trammel and when you check their profile some of them were not even 5 y/o at the time.
old school MMORPG gamers i started my MMO days with ultima online, pre-trammel
Hi,
Sorry if I offend you but I have a hard time to believe that you played UO when you were 12 year old , your profile says 24 y/o and Pre Trammel was 1998/1999 ( if I trust wikipedia since I never played UO ).
Good are the chances that I am wrong and I hope I am but I find amusing to read so many thread about so called Old School gamer Pre Trammel and when you check their profile some of them were not even 5 y/o at the time.
LOL full of crap or a spoiled brat.
i don't see how being 12 and playing an MMO automatically attributes to being a spoiled brat. I was 12 when I first started EQ when Kunark was the only expansion. There were a few other kids I knew who played EQ at the same age as I did.
Old gamer here and we cant win with these new gamers. We will die out but we have hope in the new gamers outcast that under stand that we had the golderage of gaming and try to up date it. With freeshards of our games and out and coming soon games like MO DF. I may be done with gaming in next few years If our Few Hopes fail to grow.
Comments
You old timers sound exactly like the old timers down at the cafe who sit around read newspapers and chat about politics.
They say stuff like: 'kid's these days have it too easy.' 'if they live back in our time most of them would've never made it' and they talk about how wonderful things were back in their day.
They forget about polio, facism and Jim Crow.
It's nostalgia pure and simple.
Well shave my back and call me an elf! -- Oghren
Jim Crow? Jim Beam
I think the old timers are right though. If someone like you went back and played EQ back in the day, you would realize it.
Most people here are probably new to the genre, so they don't really understand all of the complaints directed toward newer MMORPGs. They don't realize that the genre used to be challenging, the PvP used to be fun, and MMORPGs used to be real MMORPGs, with worlds and not cheap lobbies and instances all over the place.
MMORPGs these days are easy, too easy.. I'm hesitant to call something like WoW a game, with all of the hand outs. I mean, all of the free hand outs, it's not very interactive to show up to a zone and get the best loot in the game without having to put forth any effort.
And that polio thing.. older MMORPGs were true MMORPGs. The newer ones really aren't MMORPGs. There is no world, no community, there is nothing massive about instancing everything.
Back when I played MMORPGs, I knew everyone on the server. Now you are lucky to know 1 or 2 people by the time you hit 80. Instances with random players, and games where you can solo to 80... You could level to 80 in WoW without anyone else, it's a single player game.
Jim Crow? Jim Beam
I think the old timers are right though. If someone like you went back and played EQ back in the day, you would realize it.
Most people here are probably new to the genre, so they don't really understand all of the complaints directed toward newer MMORPGs. They don't realize that the genre used to be challenging, the PvP used to be fun, and MMORPGs used to be real MMORPGs, with worlds and not cheap lobbies and instances all over the place.
MMORPGs these days are easy, too easy.. I'm hesitant to call something like WoW a game, with all of the hand outs. I mean, all of the free hand outs, it's not very interactive to show up to a zone and get the best loot in the game without having to put forth any effort.
And that polio thing.. older MMORPGs were true MMORPGs. The newer ones really aren't MMORPGs. There is no world, no community, there is nothing massive about instancing everything.
Back when I played MMORPGs, I knew everyone on the server. Now you are lucky to know 1 or 2 people by the time you hit 80. Instances with random players, and games where you can solo to 80... You could level to 80 in WoW without anyone else, it's a single player game.
Gin, you are my favorite person right now. the last phrase sums up the new MMOGs that are comming out, in fact dare i call them OSPG (online single player games)
though you probably didnt know EVERYONE, but you knew the MAIN MAJORITY which was roughly 75% :P sry...
i still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS
Jim Crow? Jim Beam
I think the old timers are right though. If someone like you went back and played EQ back in the day, you would realize it.
Most people here are probably new to the genre, so they don't really understand all of the complaints directed toward newer MMORPGs. They don't realize that the genre used to be challenging, the PvP used to be fun, and MMORPGs used to be real MMORPGs, with worlds and not cheap lobbies and instances all over the place.
MMORPGs these days are easy, too easy.. I'm hesitant to call something like WoW a game, with all of the hand outs. I mean, all of the free hand outs, it's not very interactive to show up to a zone and get the best loot in the game without having to put forth any effort.
And that polio thing.. older MMORPGs were true MMORPGs. The newer ones really aren't MMORPGs. There is no world, no community, there is nothing massive about instancing everything.
Back when I played MMORPGs, I knew everyone on the server. Now you are lucky to know 1 or 2 people by the time you hit 80. Instances with random players, and games where you can solo to 80... You could level to 80 in WoW without anyone else, it's a single player game.
Gin, you are my favorite person right now. the last phrase sums up the new MMOGs that are comming out, in fact dare i call them OSPG (online single player games)
though you probably didnt know EVERYONE, but you knew the MAIN MAJORITY which was roughly 75% :P sry...
i still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS
"I still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS"
What game ever had that?
Sometimes i think people are remembering stuff that never existed.. That game you remember hasn't been made yet, we are still waiting for it.
Nothing excites jaded Grandmasters more than a theoretical novelty
This is just going to be a infinite loop of crying, ten years from now the current MMO players will be posting about how hard they had it.
Lolvet - "MAH VIDYA GAM WUZ HARDR"
Lolnoob - "UR GAMEZ WERE BORIN".
Bragging over playing hard games, it impresses the ladies I guess.
Gin, you are my favorite person right now. the last phrase sums up the new MMOGs that are comming out, in fact dare i call them OSPG (online single player games)
though you probably didnt know EVERYONE, but you knew the MAIN MAJORITY which was roughly 75% :P sry...
i still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS
"I still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS"
What game ever had that?
Sometimes i think people are remembering stuff that never existed.. That game you remember hasn't been made yet, we are still waiting for it.
ahm UO, EQ1 (at least at the beginig) and SWG (pre-cu) ranger camps anyone?
Haha Gink, so you stop pretending to be a skilled player as no one buys the bullshit.
Now you pretend to talk on behalf of "old timers" as if ... and oh you are only 23 and you are still drinking milk when I got my PhD. You are old timer in your dreams?
The new generation displaces the old, that is progression. Trying to look back as if the past is better is just illusion. Trying to preach to us when you are only 23, is just bullshit. I am possibly older than your parents.
Gin, you are my favorite person right now. the last phrase sums up the new MMOGs that are comming out, in fact dare i call them OSPG (online single player games)
though you probably didnt know EVERYONE, but you knew the MAIN MAJORITY which was roughly 75% :P sry...
i still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS
"I still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS"
What game ever had that?
Sometimes i think people are remembering stuff that never existed.. That game you remember hasn't been made yet, we are still waiting for it.
ahm UO, EQ1 (at least at the beginig) and SWG (pre-cu) ranger camps anyone?
Ooh ya, EQ1, Run halfway across the world with a Warrior just to get ganked and have to do it again to get your corpse. That was an adventure... After you had made the trip once, it isn't an adventure the second time. Doing it over and over and over again doesn't make it an adventure either.
UO was even less of an adventure then EQ after you had made the a trip a few times. Never played SWG, so maybe that is the holy grail of adventure games, creating such a dynamic world that each trip out was an adventure...
I doubt that highly. Risky environments do not make it an Adventure. If that was true every Warcraft Raid would be an "adventure" and i'm sure you won't want to admit that.
Hmm, Actually Hellgate London, first time to a new station was an adventure on Hardcore Mode. Creatures were random, encounters were random, you never knew if you might get a deadly mix of creatures that would lead to your death. Now that game on hardcore mode made getting from point A to point B an adventure every time.
Edit to add: Basically what i'm saying is nothing feels quite like that first time, in any game unless its dynamic somehow. If the same buildings are there with the same mobs, with the same tricks to get by, its not an adventure once you've done it.
I'll add Shadowbane to games that made point A to point B an adventure. I remember logging out one night where i thought it was safe, logging in the next day and the town was hostile. That game could make point A to point B very dynamic at times.
Nothing excites jaded Grandmasters more than a theoretical novelty
That is so true and its simply the reality of life. The new will always replace the old. When anyone looks back on the past, there's always a tendency to focus on the good instead of the bad. I agree that EQ was an excellent game for its time but to simply consider it as the best ever is stretching it a bit.
I recall, 3 months - day in day out - spent in Velks leveling simply because I couldn't find anywhere else to go to go from 40-45 at the time (Rng main lol what can ya do eh). 3 days camping Stormfeather for the Eyepatch. 2+ years for my epics. Definitely not all that much fun. What made EQ memorable, for me anyway, was the people I met.
The truth is, Ginkeq, if you want a game like EQ, well, you can always go back to EQ. I know I can since my toons are still there and were not deleted. But, I don't because simply put, you can never resurrect the past. Yes, the games these days do seem overly simple but hey, to me that's a good thing if I can 'finish' it within a few months then I can at least, in a way, save some money by moving on to another game and trying something else.
As someone once said "The past is a foreign country; they do things differently there."
And on a side note, Seriously ? 23 ? I mean Seriously ? Lol, come talk to me again in another 20 years or so after life has knocked you around a bit and then we'll talk about you being an old timer.
Gin, you are my favorite person right now. the last phrase sums up the new MMOGs that are comming out, in fact dare i call them OSPG (online single player games)
though you probably didnt know EVERYONE, but you knew the MAIN MAJORITY which was roughly 75% :P sry...
i still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS
"I still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS"
What game ever had that?
Sometimes i think people are remembering stuff that never existed.. That game you remember hasn't been made yet, we are still waiting for it.
ahm UO, EQ1 (at least at the beginig) and SWG (pre-cu) ranger camps anyone?
Ooh ya, EQ1, Run halfway across the world with a Warrior just to get ganked and have to do it again to get your corpse. That was an adventure... After you had made the trip once, it isn't an adventure the second time. Doing it over and over and over again doesn't make it an adventure either.
UO was even less of an adventure then EQ after you had made the a trip a few times. Never played SWG, so maybe that is the holy grail of adventure games, creating such a dynamic world that each trip out was an adventure...
I doubt that highly. Risky environments do not make it an Adventure. If that was true every Warcraft Raid would be an "adventure" and i'm sure you won't want to admit that.
Hmm, Actually Hellgate London, first time to a new station was an adventure on Hardcore Mode. Creatures were random, encounters were random, you never knew if you might get a deadly mix of creatures that would lead to your death. Now that game on hardcore mode made getting from point A to point B an adventure every time.
Edit to add: Basically what i'm saying is nothing feels quite like that first time, in any game unless its dynamic somehow. If the same buildings are there with the same mobs, with the same tricks to get by, its not an adventure once you've done it.
I'll add Shadowbane to games that made point A to point B an adventure. I remember logging out one night where i thought it was safe, logging in the next day and the town was hostile. That game could make point A to point B very dynamic at times.
Minor comments, not direct against you, just offspring remarks.
SWG at start was good because in that game every role has a role. Even pure merchants have a role. That means some kind of game variety that is unknown to us then, fresh new experience. You can drop you house any where on a huge map, shops inside with vendoring machines, factories inside your house, you can buy and sell thru vendor machines. People travel to visit great factories, merchant buy good batches of output from producers and avoid bad batches. Its a dynamic society, with every piece unique. The same gun you make today =/= the same gun you make tomorrow, even if its called the same.
Novelty is always fun, unless it is so crappy. As we grow up, novelty is harder and harder to find. My sister's toddler find my wardrobe fun, he hides inside it everyday. I don't.
Luckily the toddler grows up and let the old novelties go. Same for gamers. Some cannot let the past go, its ok for them to hang onto it. Its fast becoming a nuisance for them to come preaching to us, as if some old game is gospel and the only true god of games that only the wise man learns to appreciate and play.
Ever think that maybe old school MMO players dying off might be a good thing?
"World of Warcraft is the perfect implementation of this genre." - Hilmar Petursson. CEO of CCP.
Jim Crow? Jim Beam
I think the old timers are right though. If someone like you went back and played EQ back in the day, you would realize it.
Most people here are probably new to the genre, so they don't really understand all of the complaints directed toward newer MMORPGs. They don't realize that the genre used to be challenging, the PvP used to be fun, and MMORPGs used to be real MMORPGs, with worlds and not cheap lobbies and instances all over the place.
MMORPGs these days are easy, too easy.. I'm hesitant to call something like WoW a game, with all of the hand outs. I mean, all of the free hand outs, it's not very interactive to show up to a zone and get the best loot in the game without having to put forth any effort.
And that polio thing.. older MMORPGs were true MMORPGs. The newer ones really aren't MMORPGs. There is no world, no community, there is nothing massive about instancing everything.
Back when I played MMORPGs, I knew everyone on the server. Now you are lucky to know 1 or 2 people by the time you hit 80. Instances with random players, and games where you can solo to 80... You could level to 80 in WoW without anyone else, it's a single player game.
Gin, you are my favorite person right now. the last phrase sums up the new MMOGs that are comming out, in fact dare i call them OSPG (online single player games)
though you probably didnt know EVERYONE, but you knew the MAIN MAJORITY which was roughly 75% :P sry...
i still want games that to get from point A to point B you had to prepare it like an adventure, not some click to summon instant travel BS
non!i ll give them their due!wow and the newer genre mostly are multiplayer online game .that being said they are not massive multiplayer
massive multiplayer got twisted ,yes online there are massive amount of player ,but you cant interact with them in a battle
only like a chat room can you interact.in my book wow and countless other that instanced everything cannot
call their game massive multiplayer online game,since they are just multiplayer online game
where are the massive multiplayer ?eve is one!
Yes, Eve is a special game, but not in the way you suggest:
In Eve, you cannot interact with players in battle outside the system you are in. Guess why that is - every system is an instance! If you and another player never are in the same system at the same time, you can only interact through chat. You can agree to meet, but you can do that in other games as well. When you misguidedly play PvE in Eve (missions), you'll even have to go into your own private instance. At least in many other games, most missions (quests) can be completed outside private instances.
Even in a PvE game like LotRO I've seen an awful lot of players in the same public instance at the same time, like they can be in an Eve Online system. However, they weren't there to fight each other, but they were enjoying a concert. But it's a completely different game, so it makes sense people do different things...
Instancing is evil, only there for devs to make easy content and bring down server load
its like beeing confined in a box
i wouldnt go so far,since someone pointed out to me that eve IS IN FACT a form of instancing,but men do you see the difference.ton of player can interact in battle
Private instancing could also be a useful tool for storytelling, for PvE games that do that kind of thing (of the games I played, Guildwars and LotRO come to mind).
Agree with OP, but lets go steady on the value weighted terms, there is nothing in MMO's truely evil.
.....hmmm OK F2P, apart from that nothing in MMO's is evil.
Hardly.
This simply means there is alienation of the founding fathers. This creates a huge niche in the market- meaning, even for the capitalist-driven industry that it has become, there's money to be made by doing things 'the old way'. The other thing to consider is that history repeats itself. What is the fad today won't be tomorrow, and the hairdo's from the 60s will make their comeback- it never fails to deliver.
The beautiful thing about the MMO industry is that it's built using the same infrastructures that are used to consume. Making MMOs will always have their share of potential good products rather than your insta-grats that plague the market, because one needs to be 'hardcore' themselves in order to even reach a creation point. Purebreds are kept around for a reason, in every industry.
Maybe it's just time to head back to MUDs and wait for the corporate capitalist storm to pass. D&D is still alive and kicking. So much could be learnt from their example.
That is exactly right, and we're not saying NO to save WoW, because it is already a lost cause. We are saying NO to dissuade the next group of greedy suits who decide to emulate Blizzard and Cryptic, etc.
We can prevent some of the future games from spewing this crap, but the sooner we start saying no, the better the results will be.
So - Stand up, pull up your pants, and walk away.
- MMO_Doubter
Name a few good MUDs. I haven't played any since Vampire: The Masquerade MUDs and MUSHs were popular like ten or fifteen years ago.
Hi,
Sorry if I offend you but I have a hard time to believe that you played UO when you were 12 year old , your profile says 24 y/o and Pre Trammel was 1998/1999 ( if I trust wikipedia since I never played UO ).
Good are the chances that I am wrong and I hope I am but I find amusing to read so many thread about so called Old School gamer Pre Trammel and when you check their profile some of them were not even 5 y/o at the time.
Hi,
Sorry if I offend you but I have a hard time to believe that you played UO when you were 12 year old , your profile says 24 y/o and Pre Trammel was 1998/1999 ( if I trust wikipedia since I never played UO ).
Good are the chances that I am wrong and I hope I am but I find amusing to read so many thread about so called Old School gamer Pre Trammel and when you check their profile some of them were not even 5 y/o at the time.
LOL full of crap or a spoiled brat.
Hi,
Sorry if I offend you but I have a hard time to believe that you played UO when you were 12 year old , your profile says 24 y/o and Pre Trammel was 1998/1999 ( if I trust wikipedia since I never played UO ).
Good are the chances that I am wrong and I hope I am but I find amusing to read so many thread about so called Old School gamer Pre Trammel and when you check their profile some of them were not even 5 y/o at the time.
LOL full of crap or a spoiled brat.
i don't see how being 12 and playing an MMO automatically attributes to being a spoiled brat. I was 12 when I first started EQ when Kunark was the only expansion. There were a few other kids I knew who played EQ at the same age as I did.
Old gamer here and we cant win with these new gamers. We will die out but we have hope in the new gamers outcast that under stand that we had the golderage of gaming and try to up date it. With freeshards of our games and out and coming soon games like MO DF. I may be done with gaming in next few years If our Few Hopes fail to grow.
Old school gamers should likely get out and enjoy real life imo. Your time is done....lol
I've been playing videogames for about 5-6 years. If ever go above 10+ years I'll quit in a heartbeat. Theres more to life then a PC peeps...
"I play Tera for the gameplay"
Gaming isn't for everyone. I'll probably keep on going until I die. I can't remember a time in my life when I wasn't a gamer to be honest.