Any reason that the paying customer thinks is reason enough for them to quit. Have you not bought something because you did not like the color of it? If you said yes, then that was a lame reason not to buy something. If you go to a fast food place and constantly have to tell the cook, no cheese on my hamburger and he keeps putting cheese on will you stop going there? If you said yes, then that is a lame reason to quit the place.
In other words, "give these companies their out. Let them get away with ripping you off and just keep quiet and polite about it. Then the next company down the street can do the exact same thing to you, and so on and so on and so on. Let them get away with releasing unfinished and poorly designed games."(and yes mmos do get released unfinished too, An unfinished mmo is totally different from an evolving one, but these dishonest companies have twisted the way finished mmos evolve into "release with 1/4 of the content a mmo should release with, grab cash, work on finishing it later, but make sure to keep saying "no mmo is ever finished") "Sure have your say, but do it in a way that looks like you'll still be paying for the game so you can contribute to a facade used to suck in more people."
Screw that. Hammer them. Bury them. They don't deserve to be able to "fix it" later. They shouldn't be able to last that long. If a game has been marketed as a finished mmo and has sold a few hundred thousand copies at/near release based on that marketing, but is limping along just weeks later, then obviously more than enough people agree that the game was sub-par, and regardless of their being a few hangers on, that game developer needs to be taught a lesson. A lesson other mmo developers should be able to learn from. The I quit threads are usually the ones these companies can REALLY learn from, because those threads are cutting to the core of why those people are leaving. As opposed to dancing around and pretending everything is going to be rosy. Yes it's often emotional, because people should be emotional when they've been ripped off and their hard earned money and valuable leisure time has been wasted.
The only example games that manage to survive after being released in a sub-par state offer is an example to companies like Cryptic that they can make money even if they push incomplete crap out the door, which is exactly the lesson Cryptic took to heart. They knew exactly what they were doing and how they were scamming people. That's the true legacy of games like EvE and a couple of others that managed to hang on. It's not this rosy picture of games that managed to hang in there and eventually thrive. It's been them showing these unscrupulous developers that money can still be made rushing development and releasing crap, but selling a few hundred thousand copies. Just look at what we've been getting out of them the last few years..... rushed out the door crap that's survived because they managed to sell enough copies initially and a few hangers on provide more gravy.
If a company out there falls short of development funds and/or wants us to pay for finishing their game (which is exactly what Cryptic is trying to pull), then they should offer shares to the gamers willing to do that. Then those "investors" can someday get a return on their investment too, just like the EA's and Ataris. Otherwise these companies should get hammered down for trying to scam people, and hammered hard.
So people spread your anger when you quit. Spread it far and wide. Don't stop at the game in question's site either. Spread your anger to every forum, blog, tweet, facebook post, etc etc you can. That's what these dishonest developers are doing when they're promoting the crap, so fair is fair.
Any reason that the paying customer thinks is reason enough for them to quit. Have you not bought something because you did not like the color of it? If you said yes, then that was a lame reason not to buy something. If you go to a fast food place and constantly have to tell the cook, no cheese on my hamburger and he keeps putting cheese on will you stop going there? If you said yes, then that is a lame reason to quit the place.
WOW i want you for a customer. I would rob you blind then when you had no money left i would toss you and your foolish attitude out the door.
Any reason that the paying customer thinks is reason enough for them to quit. Have you not bought something because you did not like the color of it? If you said yes, then that was a lame reason not to buy something. If you go to a fast food place and constantly have to tell the cook, no cheese on my hamburger and he keeps putting cheese on will you stop going there? If you said yes, then that is a lame reason to quit the place.
WOW i want you for a customer. I would rob you blind then when you had no money left i would toss you and your foolish attitude out the door.
That's the way Cryptic is operating with their C-Store.
Any reason that the paying customer thinks is reason enough for them to quit. Have you not bought something because you did not like the color of it? If you said yes, then that was a lame reason not to buy something. If you go to a fast food place and constantly have to tell the cook, no cheese on my hamburger and he keeps putting cheese on will you stop going there? If you said yes, then that is a lame reason to quit the place.
WOW i want you for a customer. I would rob you blind then when you had no money left i would toss you and your foolish attitude out the door.
That's the way Cryptic is operating with their C-Store.
I was just look at those City of Heroes booster packs. A single costume and some gameplay effecting powers for $10? The Aion store is even worse. Cryptic makes NCsoft look extremely greedy by comparison.
Any reason that the paying customer thinks is reason enough for them to quit. Have you not bought something because you did not like the color of it? If you said yes, then that was a lame reason not to buy something. If you go to a fast food place and constantly have to tell the cook, no cheese on my hamburger and he keeps putting cheese on will you stop going there? If you said yes, then that is a lame reason to quit the place.
WOW i want you for a customer. I would rob you blind then when you had no money left i would toss you and your foolish attitude out the door.
That's the way Cryptic is operating with their C-Store.
I was just look at those City of Heroes booster packs. A single costume and some gameplay effecting powers for $10? The Aion store is even worse. Cryptic makes NCsoft look extremely greedy by comparison.
Aww come on, there is a big difference.
NCSoft weren't trying to force booster packs down customers throats before the game was finished. The City of Heroes game was several years in to production and had several issues of content before there was even a store. Cryptic look both greedy and needy in comparison with NCSoft and City of Heroes.
I don't know about Aion having never played it.
However, the Aion store options are: character customization, gender change (!), character name change and legion name change. Comparing those options with the STO store you become more aware that the STO store is "content for sale".
Any reason that the paying customer thinks is reason enough for them to quit. Have you not bought something because you did not like the color of it? If you said yes, then that was a lame reason not to buy something. If you go to a fast food place and constantly have to tell the cook, no cheese on my hamburger and he keeps putting cheese on will you stop going there? If you said yes, then that is a lame reason to quit the place.
WOW i want you for a customer. I would rob you blind then when you had no money left i would toss you and your foolish attitude out the door.
That's the way Cryptic is operating with their C-Store.
I was just look at those City of Heroes booster packs. A single costume and some gameplay effecting powers for $10? The Aion store is even worse. Cryptic makes NCsoft look extremely greedy by comparison.
City of Heroes releases about two booster packs a year. They include multiple costume sets, emotes, and special powers that are absolutely not necessary to play the game. That means you get all that content for about $20 extra a year.
So far, the C-Store for Star Trek Online comes to about $25 dollars (at three months after release) with over half (!!) of the upcoming updates being C-Store items. If Cryptic continues to fill the C-Store at the same rate then in the end a dedicated player will be spending $100 extra per year in the C-Store.
The first booster pack for City of Heroes was released in 2008, fully four years after the game launched! The first C-Store sale items went up for sale on day one in Star Trek Online.
Issue 17 of City of Heroes (to use a single Issue example) will include enough free content to put STO's "Season 1" to absolute shame. There will be new constume parts, new emotes, and lots and lots of other stuff included for every one who subscribes without them paying an extra dime. This shows that City of Heroes will still be releasing free content for their game that is the usual content type for booster packs. STO has not released a single new race for the game that hasn't been a C-Store item. They'll even be charging for the fan favourite Caitian race.
Any reason that the paying customer thinks is reason enough for them to quit. Have you not bought something because you did not like the color of it? If you said yes, then that was a lame reason not to buy something. If you go to a fast food place and constantly have to tell the cook, no cheese on my hamburger and he keeps putting cheese on will you stop going there? If you said yes, then that is a lame reason to quit the place.
WOW i want you for a customer. I would rob you blind then when you had no money left i would toss you and your foolish attitude out the door.
That's the way Cryptic is operating with their C-Store.
I was just look at those City of Heroes booster packs. A single costume and some gameplay effecting powers for $10? The Aion store is even worse. Cryptic makes NCsoft look extremely greedy by comparison.
Aww come on, there is a big difference.
NCSoft weren't trying to force booster packs down customers throats before the game was finished.
The C Store didn't sell anything before launch. Calling the game unfinished is your opinion. In a sense, no MMO is ever finished. STO has more Star Trek content then any other MMO.
The City of Heroes game was several years in to production and had several issues of content before there was even a store. Cryptic look both greedy and needy in comparison with NCSoft and City of Heroes.
Oops you forgot about AION which launched with microtrans. Do you honestly believe NCsoft will ever launch a game without micro-trans again?
NCsoft didn't wait till 2008 because they cared about CoH being finished, it was just the earliest time they could get away with such greed.
However, the Aion store options are: character customization, gender change (!), character name change and legion name change. Comparing those options with the STO store you become more aware that the STO store is "content for sale".
Any reason that the paying customer thinks is reason enough for them to quit. Have you not bought something because you did not like the color of it? If you said yes, then that was a lame reason not to buy something. If you go to a fast food place and constantly have to tell the cook, no cheese on my hamburger and he keeps putting cheese on will you stop going there? If you said yes, then that is a lame reason to quit the place.
WOW i want you for a customer. I would rob you blind then when you had no money left i would toss you and your foolish attitude out the door.
That's the way Cryptic is operating with their C-Store.
I was just look at those City of Heroes booster packs. A single costume and some gameplay effecting powers for $10? The Aion store is even worse. Cryptic makes NCsoft look extremely greedy by comparison.
City of Heroes releases about two booster packs a year. They include multiple costume sets, emotes, and special powers that are absolutely not necessary to play the game. That means you get all that content for about $20 extra a year.
So far, the C-Store for Star Trek Online comes to about $25 dollars (at three months after release) with over half (!!) of the upcoming updates being C-Store items. If Cryptic continues to fill the C-Store at the same rate then in the end a dedicated player will be spending $100 extra per year in the C-Store.
Nevermind the extrapolation, the point is that a new City of Heroes player needs to shell out $40 for booster packs = costumes and powers, and that is more than the cost of all the costumes in Champions Online's C Store, and Cryptic doesn't sell powers through microtransactions, they include them with the game.
The first booster pack for City of Heroes was released in 2008, fully four years after the game launched! The first C-Store sale items went up for sale on day one in Star Trek Online.
Yes, this makes the micro-trans have a lower value since the game is already old, the sequel is registered.
Issue 17 of City of Heroes (to use a single Issue example) will include enough free content to put STO's "Season 1" to absolute shame. There will be new constume parts, new emotes, and lots and lots of other stuff included for every one who subscribes without them paying an extra dime. This shows that City of Heroes will still be releasing free content for their game that is the usual content type for booster packs. STO has not released a single new race for the game that hasn't been a C-Store item. They'll even be charging for the fan favourite Caitian race.
My only point is the higher severity of greed in NCsoft's store. Comparing free updates is a seperate issue. If your argument is that it's OK for NCsoft's store to charge more for less, since they also have a better game with better updates, I agree with that for STO. Just like WoW charges much more, for much less in its store. But let's be honest about the C store costing less than the NCsoft store, and drop the rhetoric about the C store being a mugging, unless the NCsoft store is an even more grand theft in that analogy.
I find it funny that the game is not even 6 months old and there are that many I quit posts on the official forrums.
I am still waiting for the 6 months to get here before I try it again, However I continue to read things that are very bothersome about this game. I know that it was bad in beta.
One thing that I am surpised about is the fact the I quit post are not being deleted as soon as posted, considering how fast and how draconic a lot of the negitive posting get locked and deleted.
My advise to the op, if you don't like them dont read them and post some positive posts. After all that is what forums are for so that everybody can express what they are thinking.
City of Heroes releases about two booster packs a year. They include multiple costume sets, emotes, and special powers that are absolutely not necessary to play the game. That means you get all that content for about $20 extra a year.
So far, the C-Store for Star Trek Online comes to about $25 dollars (at three months after release) with over half (!!) of the upcoming updates being C-Store items. If Cryptic continues to fill the C-Store at the same rate then in the end a dedicated player will be spending $100 extra per year in the C-Store.
1) Nevermind the extrapolation, the point is that a new City of Heroes player needs to shell out $40 for booster packs = costumes and powers, and that is more than the cost of all the costumes in Champions Online's C Store, and Cryptic doesn't sell powers through microtransactions, they include them with the game.
The first booster pack for City of Heroes was released in 2008, fully four years after the game launched! The first C-Store sale items went up for sale on day one in Star Trek Online.
2) Yes, this makes the micro-trans have a lower value since the game is already old, the sequel is registered.
Issue 17 of City of Heroes (to use a single Issue example) will include enough free content to put STO's "Season 1" to absolute shame. There will be new constume parts, new emotes, and lots and lots of other stuff included for every one who subscribes without them paying an extra dime. This shows that City of Heroes will still be releasing free content for their game that is the usual content type for booster packs. STO has not released a single new race for the game that hasn't been a C-Store item. They'll even be charging for the fan favourite Caitian race.
3) My only point is the higher severity of greed in NCsoft's store. Comparing free updates is a seperate issue. If your argument is that it's OK for NCsoft's store to charge more for less, since they also have a better game with better updates, I agree with that for STO. Just like WoW charges much more, for much less in its store. But let's be honest about the C store costing less than the NCsoft store, and drop the rhetoric about the C store being a mugging, unless the NCsoft store is an even more grand theft in that analogy.
1) A new CoH/CoV player doesn't need to shell out any additional money, as just the core game that has been fully updated will give that player a huge amount of content in regards to powers and character customization. Unfortunately for the STO player, their character customization is lacking even compared to CO. Given that Cryptic seems to have shied away from free updates that add in more character customization options since their CoH/CoV days, The STO player is left holding the short end of the stick when comparing the two games.
2) The value would only decrease if you could get the same items/powers in the game; not similar ones mind you, but the same exact things. Once that happens, then the packages would devalue. Age has absolutely nothing to do with their value, as long as you can't get those items in the game.
3) You can speak of severity of greed once both CO and STO have both been out for one year. You can then compare a year's worth of store items versus what CoH/CoV has for offer and get a far better idea of which company is more greedy. Hint: Unless Cryptic radically changes the ratio of C-Store content versus free content in updates, his extrapolation is more than likely going to be on target. While things may not be as bad in CO as in STO, don't forget that Vibro Bay was originally planned to be a paid update.
"Oh my, how horrible, someone is criticizing a MMO. Oh yeah, that is what a forum is about, looking at both sides. You rather have to be critical of anything in this genre as of late because the track record of these major studios has just been appalling." -Ozmodan
1) A new CoH/CoV player doesn't need to shell out any additional money, as just the core game that has been fully updated will give that player a huge amount of content in regards to powers and character customization. Unfortunately for the STO player, their character customization is lacking even compared to CO. Given that Cryptic seems to have shied away from free updates that add in more character customization options since their CoH/CoV days, The STO player is left holding the short end of the stick when comparing the two games.
2) The value would only decrease if you could get the same items/powers in the game; not similar ones mind you, but the same exact things. Once that happens, then the packages would devalue. Age has absolutely nothing to do with their value, as long as you can't get those items in the game.
3) You can speak of severity of greed once both CO and STO have both been out for one year. You can then compare a year's worth of store items versus what CoH/CoV has for offer and get a far better idea of which company is more greedy. Hint: Unless Cryptic radically changes the ratio of C-Store content versus free content in updates, his extrapolation is more than likely going to be on target. While things may not be as bad in CO as in STO, don't forget that Vibro Bay was originally planned to be a paid update.
Cryptic sells ZERO content in their C-Store, its "FREE" with the subscription. All it contains is fluff that has zero impact on the game and account services. All of which are cheaper than many of its competitors. There has also been more content added than C-Store fluff.
While VB was orginally going to be a micro-transaction its also quite a decent size, equating to a mini-expansion. Hence why it was going to be chargable, given releasing multple mini-expansions in the same time and (ultimate) cost as a larger one is no different. As quite a few don't seem to understand that, the discontent it caused made them remove the fee, and also lead them to make a statement that in the future for both STO and CO all content would be free, other than for major expansions.
1) A new CoH/CoV player doesn't need to shell out any additional money, as just the core game that has been fully updated will give that player a huge amount of content in regards to powers and character customization. Unfortunately for the STO player, their character customization is lacking even compared to CO. Given that Cryptic seems to have shied away from free updates that add in more character customization options since their CoH/CoV days, The STO player is left holding the short end of the stick when comparing the two games.
2) The value would only decrease if you could get the same items/powers in the game; not similar ones mind you, but the same exact things. Once that happens, then the packages would devalue. Age has absolutely nothing to do with their value, as long as you can't get those items in the game.
3) You can speak of severity of greed once both CO and STO have both been out for one year. You can then compare a year's worth of store items versus what CoH/CoV has for offer and get a far better idea of which company is more greedy. Hint: Unless Cryptic radically changes the ratio of C-Store content versus free content in updates, his extrapolation is more than likely going to be on target. While things may not be as bad in CO as in STO, don't forget that Vibro Bay was originally planned to be a paid update.
Cryptic sells ZERO content in their C-Store, its "FREE" with the subscription. All it contains is fluff that has zero impact on the game and account services. All of which are cheaper than many of its competitors. There has also been more content added than C-Store fluff.
While VB was orginally going to be a micro-transaction its also quite a decent size, equating to a mini-expansion. Hence why it was going to be chargable, given releasing multple mini-expansions in the same time and (ultimate) cost as a larger one is no different. As quite a few don't seem to understand that, the discontent it caused made them remove the fee, and also lead them to make a statement that in the future for both STO and CO all content would be free, other than for major expansions.
Just wondering do you not consider buying races and certain brige officer races not = content?
No its not content, as in things for people to do. Its optional fluff, which have no affect on if one can play the game equally as others.
BTW, you can't buy bridge officers from the C-Store. The fluff is optional ship/bridge skins, the must have emote pack and some playable races. The latter are little more than pre-made alien options with some costume options. The ship skins are simply "costume" options, for existing ships, not changing their function in anyway.
Buying any of the fluff as zero affect or benfit to the game, other than something to show off.
Any reason that the paying customer thinks is reason enough for them to quit. Have you not bought something because you did not like the color of it? If you said yes, then that was a lame reason not to buy something. If you go to a fast food place and constantly have to tell the cook, no cheese on my hamburger and he keeps putting cheese on will you stop going there? If you said yes, then that is a lame reason to quit the place.
WOW i want you for a customer. I would rob you blind then when you had no money left i would toss you and your foolish attitude out the door.
That's the way Cryptic is operating with their C-Store.
I was just look at those City of Heroes booster packs. A single costume and some gameplay effecting powers for $10? The Aion store is even worse. Cryptic makes NCsoft look extremely greedy by comparison.
City of Heroes releases about two booster packs a year. They include multiple costume sets, emotes, and special powers that are absolutely not necessary to play the game. That means you get all that content for about $20 extra a year.
So far, the C-Store for Star Trek Online comes to about $25 dollars (at three months after release) with over half (!!) of the upcoming updates being C-Store items. If Cryptic continues to fill the C-Store at the same rate then in the end a dedicated player will be spending $100 extra per year in the C-Store.
Nevermind the extrapolation, the point is that a new City of Heroes player needs to shell out $40 for booster packs = costumes and powers, and that is more than the cost of all the costumes in Champions Online's C Store, and Cryptic doesn't sell powers through microtransactions, they include them with the game.
And in 4 years (if the game survives) a new STO player will be shelling out $400 to get all the C-Store extras. Both use microtransactions, just one is slower and more subdued about it and the other is more greedy.
CoH will be six years old soon, in six years a new STO player can expect to shell out $600 total for all the STO C-Store items at the current rate they are adding them to the game. With CoH a pack comes out twice a years, with STO a huge chunk of development time is being spent to constantly fill the C-Store with as many items as possible. Development time that players are already spening $15 a month for.
The first booster pack for City of Heroes was released in 2008, fully four years after the game launched! The first C-Store sale items went up for sale on day one in Star Trek Online.
Yes, this makes the micro-trans have a lower value since the game is already old, the sequel is registered.
This makes the micro-trans for STO a lower value as the game is half-finished, and new content (other than C-Store items) comes out at a snail's pace.
Issue 17 of City of Heroes (to use a single Issue example) will include enough free content to put STO's "Season 1" to absolute shame. There will be new constume parts, new emotes, and lots and lots of other stuff included for every one who subscribes without them paying an extra dime. This shows that City of Heroes will still be releasing free content for their game that is the usual content type for booster packs. STO has not released a single new race for the game that hasn't been a C-Store item. They'll even be charging for the fan favourite Caitian race.
My only point is the higher severity of greed in NCsoft's store. Comparing free updates is a seperate issue. If your argument is that it's OK for NCsoft's store to charge more for less, since they also have a better game with better updates, I agree with that for STO. Just like WoW charges much more, for much less in its store. But let's be honest about the C store costing less than the NCsoft store, and drop the rhetoric about the C store being a mugging, unless the NCsoft store is an even more grand theft in that analogy.
No, the free updates are the same issue. How can you claim any degree of greed when it is quite apperant that Paragon Studios develops a huge amount of free content for the game, and microtransactions are a relatively small piece of the pie. I17 will be massive, and it will be free to all players. I know my $15 a month is going toward developing the game I paid the monthly subscription for. If I were to subscribe to STO, I'd be essentially charged twice to play the game because of the huge amount of content that gets developed for the C-Store. This is especially bad when you consider that the game is only half finished and extremely light on content.
1) A new CoH/CoV player doesn't need to shell out any additional money, as just the core game that has been fully updated will give that player a huge amount of content in regards to powers and character customization. Unfortunately for the STO player, their character customization is lacking even compared to CO. Given that Cryptic seems to have shied away from free updates that add in more character customization options since their CoH/CoV days, The STO player is left holding the short end of the stick when comparing the two games.
2) The value would only decrease if you could get the same items/powers in the game; not similar ones mind you, but the same exact things. Once that happens, then the packages would devalue. Age has absolutely nothing to do with their value, as long as you can't get those items in the game.
3) You can speak of severity of greed once both CO and STO have both been out for one year. You can then compare a year's worth of store items versus what CoH/CoV has for offer and get a far better idea of which company is more greedy. Hint: Unless Cryptic radically changes the ratio of C-Store content versus free content in updates, his extrapolation is more than likely going to be on target. While things may not be as bad in CO as in STO, don't forget that Vibro Bay was originally planned to be a paid update.
Cryptic sells ZERO content in their C-Store, its "FREE" with the subscription. All it contains is fluff that has zero impact on the game and account services. All of which are cheaper than many of its competitors. There has also been more content added than C-Store fluff.
While VB was orginally going to be a micro-transaction its also quite a decent size, equating to a mini-expansion. Hence why it was going to be chargable, given releasing multple mini-expansions in the same time and (ultimate) cost as a larger one is no different. As quite a few don't seem to understand that, the discontent it caused made them remove the fee, and also lead them to make a statement that in the future for both STO and CO all content would be free, other than for major expansions.
I'm sorry, but I know for a fact that this is not true at all. There are emotes, costumes, races, bridges and ship variants all for sale in the C-Store.
The C-Store (excluding account services) items are little more than costume options, hence why they are fluff for those thay like shiny things. The other items listed (above) however are worth it, being two raids and additions to game mechanics. Having much more development time invested in them, than simply optional skins for existing items. They are also "free".
1) A new CoH/CoV player doesn't need to shell out any additional money, as just the core game that has been fully updated will give that player a huge amount of content in regards to powers and character customization. Unfortunately for the STO player, their character customization is lacking even compared to CO. Given that Cryptic seems to have shied away from free updates that add in more character customization options since their CoH/CoV days, The STO player is left holding the short end of the stick when comparing the two games.
2) The value would only decrease if you could get the same items/powers in the game; not similar ones mind you, but the same exact things. Once that happens, then the packages would devalue. Age has absolutely nothing to do with their value, as long as you can't get those items in the game.
3) You can speak of severity of greed once both CO and STO have both been out for one year. You can then compare a year's worth of store items versus what CoH/CoV has for offer and get a far better idea of which company is more greedy. Hint: Unless Cryptic radically changes the ratio of C-Store content versus free content in updates, his extrapolation is more than likely going to be on target. While things may not be as bad in CO as in STO, don't forget that Vibro Bay was originally planned to be a paid update.
Cryptic sells ZERO content in their C-Store, its "FREE" with the subscription. All it contains is fluff that has zero impact on the game and account services. All of which are cheaper than many of its competitors. There has also been more content added than C-Store fluff.
While VB was orginally going to be a micro-transaction its also quite a decent size, equating to a mini-expansion. Hence why it was going to be chargable, given releasing multple mini-expansions in the same time and (ultimate) cost as a larger one is no different. As quite a few don't seem to understand that, the discontent it caused made them remove the fee, and also lead them to make a statement that in the future for both STO and CO all content would be free, other than for major expansions.
I'm sorry, but I know for a fact that this is not true at all. There are emotes, costumes, races, bridges and ship variants all for sale in the C-Store.
There are no player (character) costume options for STO in the C-Store. Other than the laughable emote pack there are "costume" options for existing ships (i.e. they are not selling new ships, simply expanding upon exterior and interior apperance options for existing ones). That is in addition to race options, which are essentially just costume options and pre-set trait selections for the existing Alien option. All of which add zero value to ones game play, aside from looks.
Optional skins for already existing items is not content. Content is new missions, raids, PvP scenarios, etc. None of which are sold through the C-Store.
No, the free updates are the same issue. How can you claim any degree of greed when it is quite apperant that Paragon Studios develops a huge amount of free content for the game, and microtransactions are a relatively small piece of the pie. I17 will be massive, and it will be free to all players. I know my $15 a month is going toward developing the game I paid the monthly subscription for. If I were to subscribe to STO, I'd be essentially charged twice to play the game because of the huge amount of content that gets developed for the C-Store. This is especially bad when you consider that the game is only half finished and extremely light on content.
IMO, like Turbine, Paragon creates a good combination of content via different pricing models. CoX offers cash shop stuff, sub updates with lots of stuff, and on top of it a pretty big expansion for sale. More stuff than STO and CO combined. That's aside from being a game with much more content to start with.
Then, factor in that most MMO's grow the fastest in the first year or so, as alot of stuff that's mostly done but didn't make it to the release comes out. LotRO with Evendim and Forochel, for example. Provided with your sub.
Looking at the list Xondar provided, I see NONE of that effect evidenced there. And CO pretty much proves it. Some 8 months out and they've fixed some fatal flaws and added one zone with 3 levels of content. And they were gonna CHARGE you for it.
I can only hope they don't get to keep NWN. That will be such a massive waste...
CoX has been out for years, so of course it has more content. I was there at launch and played it for years also and it was lacking for quite some time, and more so than CO. In fact it didn't really start fleshing out until post release of CoV.
CO has been out seven months and has recieved plenty of additional content (i.e new missions, lairs, pvp scenarios, season events, a new powerset, etc). That's without mentioning VB, which a lot of people are impressed with. The next mini-expansion (i.e. issue) has also already been announced.
With STO they are releasing a STF (aka raid) every three weeks, with other content being added. I won't classify the work they've done for Klingons as additions, as they are in a disgusting state.
Intentially or not what was posted was not the complete list. That being : -
In Testing
(these items are included in the Season 1.1. update)
STF – “Undine: Terra Dome”
Difficulty Slider
Injury System
Exchange Expirations (1 week)
Exchange Result Sorting
Commodity Mission Improvements
Full Space Auto-Fire
Joined Trill – Klingon Faction
TOS Uniform Updates
Playable “Pakled” Fed species
Fed Cruiser Tier 5 – Emissary Variant “Nomad”
Klingon Bridge Pack “Carrier”
Fix for Breaking the Planet getting stuck on 4 of 5 objectives
Fix for Pre-emptive Strike getting stuck on 4 of 5 objectives
Fix for Temple Offerings not updating properly
Fix for Big Dig mission completion issue
Fix for mission loop during Badlands Episode
Fix for in-game mail issues
Potential fix for take-all loot bug
Under Investigation
Ground combat on Elite Difficulty
Injury System on Normal (default) Difficulty
Maximum injuries possible
Difficulty Slider Reward Scales
Players unable to turn in missions
Allowing items to be purchased in bulk
Increasing stack counts of certain items
Players unable to see Bridge Officer Powers
Older Science Consoles
Weapons Locking up in space
Displaying player class in friends, fleet, and other windows
Away team issue with forcefield during Hunting the Hunters episode
Chat and other UI usability improvements
PVP Queue Teaming Bugs
PVP Match and Balance Bugs
Players ending up in improper ships during DS9 Fleet Action
Ability to set a private instance for Fleet Actions (so Fleets can do Fleet Actions)
Global Help Chat Channel
Power levels not resetting after map transfer
Reroute power to shields bug
Player ship interior tech
In Development
Season 1.1 - April (remaining items)
Memory Alpha Update (1.1 or 1.2 - depends on feedback)
1) A new CoH/CoV player doesn't need to shell out any additional money, as just the core game that has been fully updated will give that player a huge amount of content in regards to powers and character customization. Unfortunately for the STO player, their character customization is lacking even compared to CO. Given that Cryptic seems to have shied away from free updates that add in more character customization options since their CoH/CoV days, The STO player is left holding the short end of the stick when comparing the two games.
2) The value would only decrease if you could get the same items/powers in the game; not similar ones mind you, but the same exact things. Once that happens, then the packages would devalue. Age has absolutely nothing to do with their value, as long as you can't get those items in the game.
3) You can speak of severity of greed once both CO and STO have both been out for one year. You can then compare a year's worth of store items versus what CoH/CoV has for offer and get a far better idea of which company is more greedy. Hint: Unless Cryptic radically changes the ratio of C-Store content versus free content in updates, his extrapolation is more than likely going to be on target. While things may not be as bad in CO as in STO, don't forget that Vibro Bay was originally planned to be a paid update.
Cryptic sells ZERO content in their C-Store, its "FREE" with the subscription. All it contains is fluff that has zero impact on the game and account services. All of which are cheaper than many of its competitors. There has also been more content added than C-Store fluff.
While VB was orginally going to be a micro-transaction its also quite a decent size, equating to a mini-expansion. Hence why it was going to be chargable, given releasing multple mini-expansions in the same time and (ultimate) cost as a larger one is no different. As quite a few don't seem to understand that, the discontent it caused made them remove the fee, and also lead them to make a statement that in the future for both STO and CO all content would be free, other than for major expansions.
I'm sorry, but I know for a fact that this is not true at all. There are emotes, costumes, races, bridges and ship variants all for sale in the C-Store.
There are no player (character) costume options for STO in the C-Store. Other than the laughable emote pack there are "costume" options for existing ships (i.e. they are not selling new ships, simply expanding upon exterior and interior apperance options for existing ones). That is in addition to race options, which are essentially just costume options and pre-set trait selections for the existing Alien option. All of which add zero value to ones game play, aside from looks.
Optional skins for already existing items is not content. Content is new missions, raids, PvP scenarios, etc. None of which are sold through the C-Store.
You have a weird definition of content. Content is anything in the game. The developers can't say that a new game website is content, but new ship variations and new races are content.
CoX has been out for years, so of course it has more content. I was there at launch and played it for years also and it was lacking for quite some time, and more so than CO. In fact it didn't really start fleshing out until post release of CoV.
Really? So new stuff like The Shadow Shard, The Hollows, the badge system, Peregrin Island, the Rikti Crash Site, additional costume slots, Malta, Carvival of Shadows, Praetorians, capes, auras, the trials (Terra Volta, Cavern of Transcendance, Eden,) sidekicking, Rularuu, Peacebringers, Warshades, giant monsters, Epic Power Pools, mission difficulty, Striga Isle, Arenas, Croatoa, Cabal, Fir Bolg, Red Caps, Tuatha de Dannan, Archery, Trick Arrow, Sonic Attack, Sonic Resonance power sets, Hellion arson and Troll rave zone events, new mission types, new mission maps, etc. etc. etc. doesn't count as new content?
City of Heroes had 5 full Issues before CoV came out. Some of the stuff that was added to the game seems so central that it's hard to believe it was added after the game launched, not before.
It should also be mentioned that these five issues full of stuff came out between the CoH launch date of April 27th 2004 and Auguest 31st, 2005. That means that all this stuff was added before the game was even a year and a half old!
Yes, there was stuff added before CoV, which actually covered a decent period. However most of the fleshing out occured post its launch. It was also around a three month cycle between issues. So the comparison is still out. CO's not been out a year and a half.
Comments
Any reason that the paying customer thinks is reason enough for them to quit. Have you not bought something because you did not like the color of it? If you said yes, then that was a lame reason not to buy something. If you go to a fast food place and constantly have to tell the cook, no cheese on my hamburger and he keeps putting cheese on will you stop going there? If you said yes, then that is a lame reason to quit the place.
I am sick and tired of people saying "I am sick and tired of I quit threads."
It's a forum. Shut up.
Hows that for irony....
Be nice nice and polite and blah blah blah.
In other words, "give these companies their out. Let them get away with ripping you off and just keep quiet and polite about it. Then the next company down the street can do the exact same thing to you, and so on and so on and so on. Let them get away with releasing unfinished and poorly designed games."(and yes mmos do get released unfinished too, An unfinished mmo is totally different from an evolving one, but these dishonest companies have twisted the way finished mmos evolve into "release with 1/4 of the content a mmo should release with, grab cash, work on finishing it later, but make sure to keep saying "no mmo is ever finished") "Sure have your say, but do it in a way that looks like you'll still be paying for the game so you can contribute to a facade used to suck in more people."
Screw that. Hammer them. Bury them. They don't deserve to be able to "fix it" later. They shouldn't be able to last that long. If a game has been marketed as a finished mmo and has sold a few hundred thousand copies at/near release based on that marketing, but is limping along just weeks later, then obviously more than enough people agree that the game was sub-par, and regardless of their being a few hangers on, that game developer needs to be taught a lesson. A lesson other mmo developers should be able to learn from. The I quit threads are usually the ones these companies can REALLY learn from, because those threads are cutting to the core of why those people are leaving. As opposed to dancing around and pretending everything is going to be rosy. Yes it's often emotional, because people should be emotional when they've been ripped off and their hard earned money and valuable leisure time has been wasted.
The only example games that manage to survive after being released in a sub-par state offer is an example to companies like Cryptic that they can make money even if they push incomplete crap out the door, which is exactly the lesson Cryptic took to heart. They knew exactly what they were doing and how they were scamming people. That's the true legacy of games like EvE and a couple of others that managed to hang on. It's not this rosy picture of games that managed to hang in there and eventually thrive. It's been them showing these unscrupulous developers that money can still be made rushing development and releasing crap, but selling a few hundred thousand copies. Just look at what we've been getting out of them the last few years..... rushed out the door crap that's survived because they managed to sell enough copies initially and a few hangers on provide more gravy.
If a company out there falls short of development funds and/or wants us to pay for finishing their game (which is exactly what Cryptic is trying to pull), then they should offer shares to the gamers willing to do that. Then those "investors" can someday get a return on their investment too, just like the EA's and Ataris. Otherwise these companies should get hammered down for trying to scam people, and hammered hard.
So people spread your anger when you quit. Spread it far and wide. Don't stop at the game in question's site either. Spread your anger to every forum, blog, tweet, facebook post, etc etc you can. That's what these dishonest developers are doing when they're promoting the crap, so fair is fair.
WOW i want you for a customer. I would rob you blind then when you had no money left i would toss you and your foolish attitude out the door.
That's the way Cryptic is operating with their C-Store.
I was just look at those City of Heroes booster packs. A single costume and some gameplay effecting powers for $10? The Aion store is even worse. Cryptic makes NCsoft look extremely greedy by comparison.
Cryptic is trying a Customer Development approach to MMO creation.
Aww come on, there is a big difference.
NCSoft weren't trying to force booster packs down customers throats before the game was finished. The City of Heroes game was several years in to production and had several issues of content before there was even a store. Cryptic look both greedy and needy in comparison with NCSoft and City of Heroes.
I don't know about Aion having never played it.
However, the Aion store options are: character customization, gender change (!), character name change and legion name change. Comparing those options with the STO store you become more aware that the STO store is "content for sale".
City of Heroes releases about two booster packs a year. They include multiple costume sets, emotes, and special powers that are absolutely not necessary to play the game. That means you get all that content for about $20 extra a year.
So far, the C-Store for Star Trek Online comes to about $25 dollars (at three months after release) with over half (!!) of the upcoming updates being C-Store items. If Cryptic continues to fill the C-Store at the same rate then in the end a dedicated player will be spending $100 extra per year in the C-Store.
The first booster pack for City of Heroes was released in 2008, fully four years after the game launched! The first C-Store sale items went up for sale on day one in Star Trek Online.
Issue 17 of City of Heroes (to use a single Issue example) will include enough free content to put STO's "Season 1" to absolute shame. There will be new constume parts, new emotes, and lots and lots of other stuff included for every one who subscribes without them paying an extra dime. This shows that City of Heroes will still be releasing free content for their game that is the usual content type for booster packs. STO has not released a single new race for the game that hasn't been a C-Store item. They'll even be charging for the fan favourite Caitian race.
Now, who is more greedy?
Cryptic is trying a Customer Development approach to MMO creation.
Cryptic is trying a Customer Development approach to MMO creation.
I find it funny that the game is not even 6 months old and there are that many I quit posts on the official forrums.
I am still waiting for the 6 months to get here before I try it again, However I continue to read things that are very bothersome about this game. I know that it was bad in beta.
One thing that I am surpised about is the fact the I quit post are not being deleted as soon as posted, considering how fast and how draconic a lot of the negitive posting get locked and deleted.
My advise to the op, if you don't like them dont read them and post some positive posts. After all that is what forums are for so that everybody can express what they are thinking.
1) A new CoH/CoV player doesn't need to shell out any additional money, as just the core game that has been fully updated will give that player a huge amount of content in regards to powers and character customization. Unfortunately for the STO player, their character customization is lacking even compared to CO. Given that Cryptic seems to have shied away from free updates that add in more character customization options since their CoH/CoV days, The STO player is left holding the short end of the stick when comparing the two games.
2) The value would only decrease if you could get the same items/powers in the game; not similar ones mind you, but the same exact things. Once that happens, then the packages would devalue. Age has absolutely nothing to do with their value, as long as you can't get those items in the game.
3) You can speak of severity of greed once both CO and STO have both been out for one year. You can then compare a year's worth of store items versus what CoH/CoV has for offer and get a far better idea of which company is more greedy. Hint: Unless Cryptic radically changes the ratio of C-Store content versus free content in updates, his extrapolation is more than likely going to be on target. While things may not be as bad in CO as in STO, don't forget that Vibro Bay was originally planned to be a paid update.
"Oh my, how horrible, someone is criticizing a MMO. Oh yeah, that is what a forum is about, looking at both sides. You rather have to be critical of anything in this genre as of late because the track record of these major studios has just been appalling." -Ozmodan
Cryptic sells ZERO content in their C-Store, its "FREE" with the subscription. All it contains is fluff that has zero impact on the game and account services. All of which are cheaper than many of its competitors. There has also been more content added than C-Store fluff.
While VB was orginally going to be a micro-transaction its also quite a decent size, equating to a mini-expansion. Hence why it was going to be chargable, given releasing multple mini-expansions in the same time and (ultimate) cost as a larger one is no different. As quite a few don't seem to understand that, the discontent it caused made them remove the fee, and also lead them to make a statement that in the future for both STO and CO all content would be free, other than for major expansions.
Just wondering do you not consider buying races and certain brige officer races not = content?
No its not content, as in things for people to do. Its optional fluff, which have no affect on if one can play the game equally as others.
BTW, you can't buy bridge officers from the C-Store. The fluff is optional ship/bridge skins, the must have
emote pack and some playable races. The latter are little more than pre-made alien options with some costume options. The ship skins are simply "costume" options, for existing ships, not changing their function in anyway.
Buying any of the fluff as zero affect or benfit to the game, other than something to show off.
Here is a list of upcoming content for STO:
I have no idea how you can claim this is worth it.
I'm sorry, but I know for a fact that this is not true at all. There are emotes, costumes, races, bridges and ship variants all for sale in the C-Store.
The C-Store (excluding account services) items are little more than costume options, hence why they are fluff for those thay like shiny things. The other items listed (above) however are worth it, being two raids and additions to game mechanics. Having much more development time invested in them, than simply optional skins for existing items. They are also "free".
There are no player (character) costume options for STO in the C-Store. Other than the laughable emote pack there are "costume" options for existing ships (i.e. they are not selling new ships, simply expanding upon exterior and interior apperance options for existing ones). That is in addition to race options, which are essentially just costume options and pre-set trait selections for the existing Alien option. All of which add zero value to ones game play, aside from looks.
Optional skins for already existing items is not content. Content is new missions, raids, PvP scenarios, etc. None of which are sold through the C-Store.
IMO, like Turbine, Paragon creates a good combination of content via different pricing models. CoX offers cash shop stuff, sub updates with lots of stuff, and on top of it a pretty big expansion for sale. More stuff than STO and CO combined. That's aside from being a game with much more content to start with.
Then, factor in that most MMO's grow the fastest in the first year or so, as alot of stuff that's mostly done but didn't make it to the release comes out. LotRO with Evendim and Forochel, for example. Provided with your sub.
Looking at the list Xondar provided, I see NONE of that effect evidenced there. And CO pretty much proves it. Some 8 months out and they've fixed some fatal flaws and added one zone with 3 levels of content. And they were gonna CHARGE you for it.
I can only hope they don't get to keep NWN. That will be such a massive waste...
CoX has been out for years, so of course it has more content. I was there at launch and played it for years also and it was lacking for quite some time, and more so than CO. In fact it didn't really start fleshing out until post release of CoV.
CO has been out seven months and has recieved plenty of additional content (i.e new missions, lairs, pvp scenarios, season events, a new powerset, etc). That's without mentioning VB, which a lot of people are impressed with. The next mini-expansion (i.e. issue) has also already been announced.
With STO they are releasing a STF (aka raid) every three weeks, with other content being added. I won't classify the work they've done for Klingons as additions, as they are in a disgusting state.
Intentially or not what was posted was not the complete list. That being : -
In Testing
(these items are included in the Season 1.1. update)
STF – “Undine: Terra Dome”
Difficulty Slider
Injury System
Exchange Expirations (1 week)
Exchange Result Sorting
Commodity Mission Improvements
Full Space Auto-Fire
Joined Trill – Klingon Faction
TOS Uniform Updates
Playable “Pakled” Fed species
Fed Cruiser Tier 5 – Emissary Variant “Nomad”
Klingon Bridge Pack “Carrier”
Fix for Breaking the Planet getting stuck on 4 of 5 objectives
Fix for Pre-emptive Strike getting stuck on 4 of 5 objectives
Fix for Temple Offerings not updating properly
Fix for Big Dig mission completion issue
Fix for mission loop during Badlands Episode
Fix for in-game mail issues
Potential fix for take-all loot bug
Under Investigation
Ground combat on Elite Difficulty
Injury System on Normal (default) Difficulty
Maximum injuries possible
Difficulty Slider Reward Scales
Players unable to turn in missions
Allowing items to be purchased in bulk
Increasing stack counts of certain items
Players unable to see Bridge Officer Powers
Older Science Consoles
Weapons Locking up in space
Displaying player class in friends, fleet, and other windows
Away team issue with forcefield during Hunting the Hunters episode
Chat and other UI usability improvements
PVP Queue Teaming Bugs
PVP Match and Balance Bugs
Players ending up in improper ships during DS9 Fleet Action
Ability to set a private instance for Fleet Actions (so Fleets can do Fleet Actions)
Global Help Chat Channel
Power levels not resetting after map transfer
Reroute power to shields bug
Player ship interior tech
In Development
Season 1.1 - April (remaining items)
Memory Alpha Update (1.1 or 1.2 - depends on feedback)
Mirror Universe Female Costume Update (1.1)
Season 1.2 - May
Social System Improvements (1.2)
Accolade System (1.2)
Fleet Feature Improvements(1.2)
Squad System (Sidekicking) (1.2)
Episode Replay (1.2)
Bridge Officer Trading (1.2)
Team mission journal updates (1.2)
Random Bridge Officer Requisition (1.2 or 1.3)
Sitting in Chairs tech (1.2)
Playable “Caitian” Fed species (1.2)
Fed Bridge Pack “Prometheus” (1.2)
Fed Escort Tier 5 – Dervish Variant “Maelstrom” (1.2)
Fed Science Tier 4 – Luna Variant “Comet” (1.2)
Season 1.3 - June
STF – “Into the Hive” (1.3)
Klingon Bridge Pack “Raptor” (1.3)
New Emotes (1.3)
Dabo MiniGame (1.3)
Random BOFF Stores (1.3)
Season 2 - July
As a special addition - Here's a sneak preview of updates we are already working on for Season 2
New Skillpoint Level Cap
High End Episode Sector
Multi-Faction Episode Sector
Klingon Episodes
Federation Diplomatic Corps
Player Ship Interiors
New Enemy Ship Designs
Ambient Wildlife Creatures
New Off-Duty Costumes
Season 3 titbits are also being annouced. Such as persistant PvP zones.
wow, so by july they hope to have most of the stuff in the game that needed to be there at release?
IF THE ONLY DEFENCE FOR CRITICISM OF A GAME IS CALLING SOMEONE A TROLL OR HATER, THAT SAYS A LOT ABOUT THE QUALITY OF THE GAME
You have a weird definition of content. Content is anything in the game. The developers can't say that a new game website is content, but new ship variations and new races are content.
Yes, there was stuff added before CoV, which actually covered a decent period. However most of the fleshing out occured post its launch. It was also around a three month cycle between issues. So the comparison is still out. CO's not been out a year and a half.