How about this... in actuallity arent all these games single player games with ur buddies? seriously, in WOW u may both run up to a npc, but u aren't both talking to him. ok, maybe u get to share kills as a group, but u dont share drops. in Aion, same thing, only the cover that part up by force grouping u in order to finish the campaign quests. At the end of the day, all u and ur friends did was run a series of parrellel quests. So why not just go a little further and have some really detailed game play. i was reading one hands on review of SWTOR where the person writing the review said that the choice he made while interrogating a captureed guard resulted in a story twist that made him feel like a complete jackass for making that choice. i have never played a game that made me feel bad about a choice... i think that is something with promise.. real emotional involvement in agame... imagine that possibility
I think you're stretching a bit too far there. You are trying to hate the haters a bit too much.
Stopped here, skimmed the rest. Here's is why.
I don't hate anybody.
(now this is me being serious)
I don't give a damn if they're tired of current MMOs, they can go back to these games they claimed were amazing, the ones with no subs. Their opinion will change nothing here.
I don't care if you like my negativity torwards negativy.
If this MMO sucks I'm done with the genre, oh well, don't see me squeezing tears out about it.
Not sorry for the lack of sympathy against the manbabies on this forum.
Also there is a problem when somebody says "ToR is a single player RPG" while never posting evidence and evading the question of proof to follow it. You can find multiple examples like this litered all around the board.
No evidence, role-playing a forum parrot. Nah I'll stick to telling these guys their opinions are dumb.
As Carlin said, "Well, I have a right to my opinion, and my opinion is that you have no right to your opinion.".
Let's see, Anarchy Online still goin' at 10 years old soon, content still goin', new engine and artwork a few months or less down the road.. AoC just released an expansion which even has release critics praising the game again.
Explains its popularity.
Funcom's record is bad launches and then making great games from them. So putting up with a shaky launch knowing that the game will be continually developed, to me, is a lot better than a company ONLY known for singleplayer games and praising themselves before they even release their first mmo.
Mmhmm, right, your praise of bad launches creating empty games has enlightened me. Maybe they'll get it right this time? I'm pretty sure a stable launch is one of the most important things to keeping players. Atleast the remaining players have some pixel boobs to look at in AoC.
Edit: My name is just fine. At least I'm not 104th in line.
neon is a great example of debate on a subject. good, well thought out opinion. i too am looking forward to the next generation game. the science channel had a special on it a while back. virtual reality is going to be the new crack...watch
You made me go all mushy inside. Awwwww.
I'm pretty excited by the selection of upcoming games too actually. They all seem to be offering something of interest. This virtual reality topic on the science channel sounds interesting too.
They are right though, most MMOs have no point in playing them once you complete all the content. If Bioware thinks that throwing better content that can be eaten through at the same rate will save the game 3-4 months in, they need to take more notes.
The point of an MMO is to advance your character and progress with the most common of all human characteristics: greed and need.
Shaping it in a pleasant format and keeping it up is what makes an mmorpg.
We brag with a new car and pants in real life. Just like we want to show off a new mount or sword or achievement title.
That's the driving force of prolonged play, not the fixed scenario movie part.
In a good mmorpg you have the choice to arrive at those greedy parts.
A story is a back drop to acquire the greedy needs in a free undetermined way.
That's where this guy doesn't understand the meaning of "grind".
I have to disagree, that's like saying the point of eating out is getting greasy salty food from a fast food joint. The point of playing a game is to have fun. The point of making a game is to enable other people to have fun through your efforts. If you have to offer prizes to get people to play your game, you are admitting a failure of game design. If the prizes you have to offer to get people to play/keep playing are those that appeal to the worst in people - well, I think my point is obvious.
Let's see, Anarchy Online still goin' at 10 years old soon, content still goin', new engine and artwork a few months or less down the road.. AoC just released an expansion which even has release critics praising the game again.
Explains its popularity.
Funcom's record is bad launches and then making great games from them. So putting up with a shaky launch knowing that the game will be continually developed, to me, is a lot better than a company ONLY known for singleplayer games and praising themselves before they even release their first mmo.
Mmhmm, right, your praise of bad launches creating empty games has enlightened me. Maybe they'll get it right this time? I'm pretty sure a stable launch is one of the most important things to keeping players. Atleast the remaining players have some pixel boobs to look at.
Edit: My name is just fine. At least I'm not 104th in line.
Jesus, that was horrible.
So basically the only thing that makes a game "successful" to you is a large subscriber base. Gotcha. WoW is that way.--->
Edit: And "Guide"? I'd hate to be on your tour group.
-Letting Derek Smart work on your game is like letting Osama bin Laden work in the White House. Something will burn.- -And on the 8th day, man created God.-
Ok so how many people have recently played WoW? CoS the starting dailog, remember it? Now who wasn't annoyed as hell by this role play the 10th time through?
"The title - due for release next year - contains 'over 50 novels-worth' of voice-over content, according to Bioware."
They are putting way too much effort into this voice-over content. It will be cool the first time and annoying the 3rd and every time after. Will this voice-over spam be in combat also? Will your character say "I will show you the power of the dark side" 100 times a day? I personally don't even have my games sounds on minus combat effects due to vent or my own music while playing. Thousands of voice actors? Maybe this is why their animations still appear to be rather stiff. Forcing me to listen to npcs ramble on does not add immersion for me. I don't want my character shouting nonsense while fighting either (unless I command him to do so).
EVE might not been an RPG but it is indeed a perfect example of an MMO and player driven universe. SW:TOR doesn't seem to be an MMO but rather a really long RPG. I could be wrong but if voice acting is all they are banking on, then how can this not be a disaster waiting to happen?
the new games r basically like a big hamsterball on a roller base. u get inside with the virtual reality helmet on and vr gloves. if u want to jump, u jump. if u want to run... u get a little exercise.. best part is, u r completely emersed in the game u are playing
Let's see, Anarchy Online still goin' at 10 years old soon, content still goin', new engine and artwork a few months or less down the road.. AoC just released an expansion which even has release critics praising the game again.
Explains its popularity.
Funcom's record is bad launches and then making great games from them. So putting up with a shaky launch knowing that the game will be continually developed, to me, is a lot better than a company ONLY known for singleplayer games and praising themselves before they even release their first mmo.
Mmhmm, right, your praise of bad launches creating empty games has enlightened me. Maybe they'll get it right this time? I'm pretty sure a stable launch is one of the most important things to keeping players. Atleast the remaining players have some pixel boobs to look at.
Edit: My name is just fine. At least I'm not 104th in line.
Jesus, that was horrible.
So basically the only thing that makes a game "successful" to you is a large subscriber base. Gotcha. WoW is that way.--->
Edit: And "Guide"? I'd hate to be on your tour group.
Yup, because that's exactly what I said. Anarchy online is old stuff, it has its merrits. Popularity dwindles. Congrats funcom, you competed in a once-not-so-tough market.
AoC was bad, bad launch, bad game, bad zones, but it had boobs. Wonderful. What is the TSW? Explain why this game will be a success, deliver me some knowledge here.
Nobody said I was a good guide. Your fault for tagging along.
Ok so how many people have recently played WoW? CoS the starting dailog, remember it? Now who wasn't annoyed as hell by this role play the 10th time through?
Dumb arguement, considering you can skip dialogue in ToR from the get go. There was also no interaction, just god awful voice acting.
How about this... in actuallity arent all these games single player games with ur buddies? seriously, in WOW u may both run up to a npc, but u aren't both talking to him. ok, maybe u get to share kills as a group, but u dont share drops. in Aion, same thing, only the cover that part up by force grouping u in order to finish the campaign quests. At the end of the day, all u and ur friends did was run a series of parrellel quests. So why not just go a little further and have some really detailed game play. i was reading one hands on review of SWTOR where the person writing the review said that the choice he made while interrogating a captureed guard resulted in a story twist that made him feel like a complete jackass for making that choice. i have never played a game that made me feel bad about a choice... i think that is something with promise.. real emotional involvement in agame... imagine that possibility
Indeed. The fact is most mmos dont really allow you to make any decisions at all other than where to walk in the virtual landscape......and even then the players are usually funneled somewhere. You can either accept a "quest" (although really its just a chore) or decline it and then lose out. Thats not really a choice at all. Not only are these mmos pretty much just single player games placed on a server but they are also rather bad ones with all the good stuff removed. Its quantity in favour of quality with mmos. SWTOR however is focusing on quality which is a nice change.......although I much prefer the dynamic content with an evolving gameworld being offered by other upcoming games.
Let's see, Anarchy Online still goin' at 10 years old soon, content still goin', new engine and artwork a few months or less down the road.. AoC just released an expansion which even has release critics praising the game again.
Explains its popularity.
Funcom's record is bad launches and then making great games from them. So putting up with a shaky launch knowing that the game will be continually developed, to me, is a lot better than a company ONLY known for singleplayer games and praising themselves before they even release their first mmo.
Mmhmm, right, your praise of bad launches creating empty games has enlightened me. Maybe they'll get it right this time? I'm pretty sure a stable launch is one of the most important things to keeping players. Atleast the remaining players have some pixel boobs to look at.
Edit: My name is just fine. At least I'm not 104th in line.
Jesus, that was horrible.
So basically the only thing that makes a game "successful" to you is a large subscriber base. Gotcha. WoW is that way.--->
Edit: And "Guide"? I'd hate to be on your tour group.
Actually alot of us are hoping this game is small to keep the idiots out. WoW can keep their subscription base. I rather play with people that has more common sense. Greed has plenty of time said he rather have the community of SW:ToR to be small in many many posts.
clock u make some good points... i too prefer to be on vent with my partners in crime while playing and would get rather annoyed with constant chattering in my ear. this is the kind of thing that only play time with answer. i signed up to beta test the game and hopefully i will get a chance to do so.. i agree that it could wear thin like that, but in the vids i watched, the story/ conversations seem to be only in spots, but with expanded plot. who knows.... i do know i cant wait to find out.... and if it sucks,, oh well.. i gave aion 6 months... i gave CoH 2 weeks.... u never know
"He added: "I don't think that [MMO creators] set out in the beginning to say: 'Hey, let's make this a grind. Let's not have any interesting content here.' A lot of the better ones more recently have interesting content for the first few levels, you know - and some of them for the first 20 levels, whatever. But it's still not the interesting content you'd expect in a single-player game."
So this guy is still thinking MMO's is the equivalent of a single player adventure game "on line".
Oh Boy, You don't play MMo's for 4 years for a predefined movie based story line...
--> Well it is his neck, not mine. I smell Age of Conan here.
Yes I do think succesful MMO's are being played for the excellent grind (meaning you keep playing the same content with different options and choices over and over and over again, because to this player it is fun and even conveniant (or he wouldn't be paying).
In fact millions of people want to look at matches for a thousand times.
How many of these people want to read the same book/movie for a hundred times?
If you strip away the online aspects, name one single thing MMOs do better than single player games.
So, they took a look at the first 20 levels of AOC, saw the praise it garnered from "some" people and decided that's what the world needed, more story telling throughout the entire leveling experience.
And they consider this to be the point of MMORPG gaming?
Seems like some folks never played EVE over there.
EVE isn't a RPG in the classic sense. It's more of a simulation and virtual enviroment. I can see why Bioware coming from a very story driven tradition doesn't get the interaction as content princpal.
I agree with you, that is precisely where they are coming from.
And in some ways they are right:
"You shouldn't be trying to ignore all of the content to get to the end as fast as possible."
Are they wrong?
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
If you strip away the online aspects, name one single thing MMOs do better than single player games.
Good point. Frankly, the multiplayer aspect is the only plus to an MMO, and companies have been leaning on that as a crutch - resulting in games that wouldn`t sell if they were single player.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Dumb arguement, considering you can skip dialogue in ToR from the get go. There was also no interaction, just god awful voice acting.
Exactly what I'm saying. If they are are so focused on voice-over content, will there be anything else? If you decide to skip the voice-overs will you find yourself at the "wall" after a week of playing? I will say that they were rather smart on making the game voice acted. This would slow down game progression for anyone that sits through all the chatter they have put together.
Comments
How about this... in actuallity arent all these games single player games with ur buddies? seriously, in WOW u may both run up to a npc, but u aren't both talking to him. ok, maybe u get to share kills as a group, but u dont share drops. in Aion, same thing, only the cover that part up by force grouping u in order to finish the campaign quests. At the end of the day, all u and ur friends did was run a series of parrellel quests. So why not just go a little further and have some really detailed game play. i was reading one hands on review of SWTOR where the person writing the review said that the choice he made while interrogating a captureed guard resulted in a story twist that made him feel like a complete jackass for making that choice. i have never played a game that made me feel bad about a choice... i think that is something with promise.. real emotional involvement in agame... imagine that possibility
Stopped here, skimmed the rest. Here's is why.
I don't hate anybody.
(now this is me being serious)
I don't give a damn if they're tired of current MMOs, they can go back to these games they claimed were amazing, the ones with no subs. Their opinion will change nothing here.
I don't care if you like my negativity torwards negativy.
If this MMO sucks I'm done with the genre, oh well, don't see me squeezing tears out about it.
Not sorry for the lack of sympathy against the manbabies on this forum.
Also there is a problem when somebody says "ToR is a single player RPG" while never posting evidence and evading the question of proof to follow it. You can find multiple examples like this litered all around the board.
No evidence, role-playing a forum parrot. Nah I'll stick to telling these guys their opinions are dumb.
As Carlin said, "Well, I have a right to my opinion, and my opinion is that you have no right to your opinion.".
No, that is not targeted at you.
Bioware are putting me off their game before I have much to go on to judge it. Hmmmmm but it's Star Wars...
THE SECRET WORLD - PAY ONCE PLAY FOREVER - Give it a go!
http://www.thesecretworld.com/buy/
OR PM ME FOR A BUDDY KEY (need your email address).
You made me go all mushy inside. Awwwww.
I'm pretty excited by the selection of upcoming games too actually. They all seem to be offering something of interest. This virtual reality topic on the science channel sounds interesting too.
I have to disagree, that's like saying the point of eating out is getting greasy salty food from a fast food joint. The point of playing a game is to have fun. The point of making a game is to enable other people to have fun through your efforts. If you have to offer prizes to get people to play your game, you are admitting a failure of game design. If the prizes you have to offer to get people to play/keep playing are those that appeal to the worst in people - well, I think my point is obvious.
So basically the only thing that makes a game "successful" to you is a large subscriber base. Gotcha. WoW is that way.--->
Edit: And "Guide"? I'd hate to be on your tour group.
-Letting Derek Smart work on your game is like letting Osama bin Laden work in the White House. Something will burn.-
-And on the 8th day, man created God.-
Ok so how many people have recently played WoW? CoS the starting dailog, remember it? Now who wasn't annoyed as hell by this role play the 10th time through?
"The title - due for release next year - contains 'over 50 novels-worth' of voice-over content, according to Bioware."
They are putting way too much effort into this voice-over content. It will be cool the first time and annoying the 3rd and every time after. Will this voice-over spam be in combat also? Will your character say "I will show you the power of the dark side" 100 times a day? I personally don't even have my games sounds on minus combat effects due to vent or my own music while playing. Thousands of voice actors? Maybe this is why their animations still appear to be rather stiff. Forcing me to listen to npcs ramble on does not add immersion for me. I don't want my character shouting nonsense while fighting either (unless I command him to do so).
EVE might not been an RPG but it is indeed a perfect example of an MMO and player driven universe. SW:TOR doesn't seem to be an MMO but rather a really long RPG. I could be wrong but if voice acting is all they are banking on, then how can this not be a disaster waiting to happen?
the new games r basically like a big hamsterball on a roller base. u get inside with the virtual reality helmet on and vr gloves. if u want to jump, u jump. if u want to run... u get a little exercise.. best part is, u r completely emersed in the game u are playing
Yup, because that's exactly what I said. Anarchy online is old stuff, it has its merrits. Popularity dwindles. Congrats funcom, you competed in a once-not-so-tough market.
AoC was bad, bad launch, bad game, bad zones, but it had boobs. Wonderful. What is the TSW? Explain why this game will be a success, deliver me some knowledge here.
Nobody said I was a good guide. Your fault for tagging along.
Dumb arguement, considering you can skip dialogue in ToR from the get go. There was also no interaction, just god awful voice acting.
Indeed. The fact is most mmos dont really allow you to make any decisions at all other than where to walk in the virtual landscape......and even then the players are usually funneled somewhere. You can either accept a "quest" (although really its just a chore) or decline it and then lose out. Thats not really a choice at all. Not only are these mmos pretty much just single player games placed on a server but they are also rather bad ones with all the good stuff removed. Its quantity in favour of quality with mmos. SWTOR however is focusing on quality which is a nice change.......although I much prefer the dynamic content with an evolving gameworld being offered by other upcoming games.
Actually alot of us are hoping this game is small to keep the idiots out. WoW can keep their subscription base. I rather play with people that has more common sense. Greed has plenty of time said he rather have the community of SW:ToR to be small in many many posts.
clock u make some good points... i too prefer to be on vent with my partners in crime while playing and would get rather annoyed with constant chattering in my ear. this is the kind of thing that only play time with answer. i signed up to beta test the game and hopefully i will get a chance to do so.. i agree that it could wear thin like that, but in the vids i watched, the story/ conversations seem to be only in spots, but with expanded plot. who knows.... i do know i cant wait to find out.... and if it sucks,, oh well.. i gave aion 6 months... i gave CoH 2 weeks.... u never know
If you strip away the online aspects, name one single thing MMOs do better than single player games.
You have all sorts of choices in an MMO - in your dealings with other players, rather than NPCs.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
I agree with you, that is precisely where they are coming from.
And in some ways they are right:
"You shouldn't be trying to ignore all of the content to get to the end as fast as possible."
Are they wrong?
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
u deal with other players here too
Good point. Frankly, the multiplayer aspect is the only plus to an MMO, and companies have been leaning on that as a crutch - resulting in games that wouldn`t sell if they were single player.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2
Exactly what I'm saying. If they are are so focused on voice-over content, will there be anything else? If you decide to skip the voice-overs will you find yourself at the "wall" after a week of playing? I will say that they were rather smart on making the game voice acted. This would slow down game progression for anyone that sits through all the chatter they have put together.
see... this is dialog and debate
could someone please tell me how to add the block i'm responding to in my response?
Talking about quoting? Bottom right of their chat box, there is "edit" "Quote" and "reply", you want quote.
Use the quote function - not reply.
"" Voice acting isn't an RPG element....it's just a production value." - grumpymel2