Ok, love WoW or hate it, it wouldnt be successful if it wasn't well made or fun, right? At least to most people. But really, when has blizzard ever released a BAD game. Not a game you don't like, or that's too easy, etc. Ignoring WoW completely, when has blizzard fucked ANYTHING up?
I'm pretty sure their going to come up with a persistant world MMORTS somewhat loosely based on Farmland+UO+Wow. When this comes to pass I expect all of you who dident believe to donate 1 dollar to the charity of your choice in my name.
Refugee from UO,EQ,AC,AC2,AO,DAOC,L2,SB,HZ,CoH,PT,EQ2,WoW,VG,SWG,EVE,WAR,DF,MO,AI,GA,LOTRO, SWTOR... Gw2 on Deck
OK i have no clue what blizz is working on. Will it be a wow clone maybe. IN that they will have a ui thats simple and easy to follow. they will probably have quests and objectives . Some sort of group based play like raids and pvp. Weather as an rts or an fps. Id assume they wouldnt do an rpg as that wouldnt be new and would compete with wow.
That said blizz fanbois dont bluy there games cause they suck or are bad games. They buy them cause they are fun interesting and give u and immersive style of gameplay that u can play for hrs and not realize it. All u wow haters seems to wanna bash wow is really a moot point.
Your one point of contention is they want to appeal to a braod player base and not a small click of people who might play there game. duh thats good buisness they are in this to make money after all. I dont understand your nerd rage its like u are upset that they let 11 million people play there games.
Like u are upset they made the game fun and enjoyable for all and not just for 5 pct of there population. If they made the game for 5 pct of the population that is so pissy on all the forums theyd lose 95 pct of the players and lose money and there game would go under so deal with the fact u arent more important then the majority. Just cause u think u are some kinda hardcore gamer and casuals arent worth keeping.
Also im tired of casual gamer being used like a swear word. What is so bad with being a casual gamer? why wouldnt the majority of mmos wanan makes games that appeal to 11 mill people as opposed to hard core mmos that appeal to maybe 50 thousand ?
Most game companines if they are smart pick the 11 mill over the 50 thousand.
The average age is 26.. but for every million players in the 30's & 40's, there are equal players in the teens.. to hit that average... there are actually moar kids, than adults.. because there are people who are 50 playing too.. but not people who are 3.. (take a statistics class)
Secondly, nobody said that adults wouldn't, or can't enjoy a chilldren's game. These are not insults, as any Dad playing will tell you, that their kids know more about the game.
That has nothing to do with the remedial challenges the game offers. If you are insulted, then you'll understand how those of us who have been inadated and barraged with children's games throughout the MMO spectrum over the years, without an respect to veteran roldeplayers... etc.
And yes, playing MMO's for the last 4 years, is nothing to playing for the last 13..
I do understand how stats work, having taken several classes in them and have had to work with many publishing researchers. Lets take your number of 26. As you say for every million players in the 30's and 40's there are people in the teens, but an average doesn't tell us how much.
To get an average of 26 for every player who is 40 you need a player who is 12, not two 12 year olds. And yes there probably is some people who are 50 but two 12 year olds can account for that conversely you can have a whole lot of 25 year old to counter that 1 50 year old. As long as they are over 18 (the age of majority for most developed countries) they are not children.
Either way unless the people are very old, you still cannot say that there are more kids that play it than adults, that would be the mode which we don't have.
All things being being equal all we can say are that the average age is 26 which is not a child.
2nd - adults can enjoy a childrens game. However a childrens game is defined as being designed for and played primarily by children. WoW was not designed for children, no matter what you actually say, as the evidence of scaling arena's and hard mode challenges exist that the average child does not have the capabilities to do, and the fact that the average age is not a child. So if the game wasn't designed primarily for children and the average age is not a child - we can say the game is not a childs game. Making a game that children can play and making a game primarily targeted towards children are two different things.
Your right playing MMO's for 4 years is not the same as playing for 13- however playing for 13 is not the amount of time required to no longer be considered new. I don't think there is an actual timeline but I think we can all appreciate that someone who has been here for 4 years is not new to the genre. To a 90 year old, a 70 year old is a young un, but they aren't. Similarly to a 13 year MMO met a 4 year vet is a young un, but they are not new.
And I'm not insulted. However by the use of your language and the few facts we can present, you are attempting to insult others. A game not primarily designed for children, or played by a majority of children is not a childrens game. That you insist on calling it so shows you are being condescending.
Venge Sunsoar
edit: Actually I'm sure we can take any discussion of who the primary target was out as there are probably a few exampls of games designed for adults that primarily children play and so are considered childrens games. Conversely there are probably a few games out there that were designed for children but are played by a majority of adults.
I can't think of either example but I'm sure they are there.
Dude, it doesn't matter. .
Secondly, that was only an ancillary point I was making. WoW is still a kids games. Thanks for the long diatribe, but teenagers and younger are playing the game... millions of them. Nothing more needs to be said. For those who have played other games, WoW is a remedial experience...!
I know you probably don't beleive that. But WoW was nick-named a "theme park" for a reason, it is a walk-thru experience for a good many players. Glad your able to crunch numbers and find WoW challenging. Your rebuttal means nothing when you can join guild vent and here prepubecent boys chatting and telling you what you should be doing.
It's hilarious..
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
Secondly, that was only an ancillary point I was making. WoW is still a kids games. Thanks for the long diatribe, but teenagers and younger are playing the game... millions of them. Nothing more needs to be said. For those who have played other games, WoW is a remedial experience...!
I know you probably don't beleive that. But WoW was nick-named a "theme park" for a reason, it is a walk-thru experience for a good many players. Glad your able to crunch numbers and find WoW challenging. Your rebuttal means nothing when you can join guild vent and here prepubecent boys chatting and telling you what you should be doing.
It's hilarious..
No it isn't a kids game. You saying it is does not make it so. As I stated before the target was not kids, and the average age is not kids, therefore it is not a kids game. There are millions of people playing that are not kids. Nothing more needs to be said. The average age is not a child therefore it is not a kids game.
Your comments mean nothing. You can join any game and hear prepubecent boys chatting and telling you what you should be doing.
And there are only a handful of guilds that have completed everything at the highest setting. Sadly not me, I haven't played it almost half a year. The point still stands. The game can be played easy or hard. I've played the game only doing quests and mobs that are harder than what I'm playing in Vanguard now, or what I did in EQ years ago. I've played just strolling along winding down for the evening. If you choose to play it as easy only that says something about you. EQ wasn't any harder, just more tedius and longer.
Yes WoW was nicknamed themepark. IMO inacurrately because there is more choice in that game than in many other games. You can choose many different ways to level up, unlike many different games, you can go anywhere (not without risk as it should be) unlike many different games. There is lots of choice in that game more IMO than in EQ. In EQ my druid, bard, monk, paladin were exactly the same as every other druid, monk, bard, paladin. At least in WoW I could make it I can be somewhat different from the others.
And guess what, in a themepark you can choose many many different rides to go on, giving more choices than in many other locations.
So your points are meaningless. Everything you have stated can be reduced to personal bias. Your points are not objective or reasonable.
Venge Sunsoar
edit:
Actually I just logged out of Vanguard because of the pre-pubescant boys chatting over general thestra.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
The average age is 26.. but for every million players in the 30's & 40's, there are equal players in the teens.. to hit that average... there are actually moar kids, than adults.. because there are people who are 50 playing too.. but not people who are 3.. (take a statistics class)
Secondly, nobody said that adults wouldn't, or can't enjoy a chilldren's game. These are not insults, as any Dad playing will tell you, that their kids know more about the game.
That has nothing to do with the remedial challenges the game offers. If you are insulted, then you'll understand how those of us who have been inadated and barraged with children's games throughout the MMO spectrum over the years, without an respect to veteran roldeplayers... etc.
And yes, playing MMO's for the last 4 years, is nothing to playing for the last 13..
I do understand how stats work, having taken several classes in them and have had to work with many publishing researchers. Lets take your number of 26. As you say for every million players in the 30's and 40's there are people in the teens, but an average doesn't tell us how much.
To get an average of 26 for every player who is 40 you need a player who is 12, not two 12 year olds. And yes there probably is some people who are 50 but two 12 year olds can account for that conversely you can have a whole lot of 25 year old to counter that 1 50 year old. As long as they are over 18 (the age of majority for most developed countries) they are not children.
Either way unless the people are very old, you still cannot say that there are more kids that play it than adults, that would be the mode which we don't have.
All things being being equal all we can say are that the average age is 26 which is not a child.
2nd - adults can enjoy a childrens game. However a childrens game is defined as being designed for and played primarily by children. WoW was not designed for children, no matter what you actually say, as the evidence of scaling arena's and hard mode challenges exist that the average child does not have the capabilities to do, and the fact that the average age is not a child. So if the game wasn't designed primarily for children and the average age is not a child - we can say the game is not a childs game. Making a game that children can play and making a game primarily targeted towards children are two different things.
Your right playing MMO's for 4 years is not the same as playing for 13- however playing for 13 is not the amount of time required to no longer be considered new. I don't think there is an actual timeline but I think we can all appreciate that someone who has been here for 4 years is not new to the genre. To a 90 year old, a 70 year old is a young un, but they aren't. Similarly to a 13 year MMO met a 4 year vet is a young un, but they are not new.
And I'm not insulted. However by the use of your language and the few facts we can present, you are attempting to insult others. A game not primarily designed for children, or played by a majority of children is not a childrens game. That you insist on calling it so shows you are being condescending.
Venge Sunsoar
edit: Actually I'm sure we can take any discussion of who the primary target was out as there are probably a few exampls of games designed for adults that primarily children play and so are considered childrens games. Conversely there are probably a few games out there that were designed for children but are played by a majority of adults.
I can't think of either example but I'm sure they are there.
Dude, it doesn't matter. .
Secondly, that was only an ancillary point I was making. WoW is still a kids games. Thanks for the long diatribe, but teenagers and younger are playing the game... millions of them. Nothing more needs to be said. For those who have played other games, WoW is a remedial experience...!
I know you probably don't beleive that. But WoW was nick-named a "theme park" for a reason, it is a walk-thru experience for a good many players. Glad your able to crunch numbers and find WoW challenging. Your rebuttal means nothing when you can join guild vent and here prepubecent boys chatting and telling you what you should be doing.
It's hilarious..
Really wow is not a kids game at all. Kids have almost no interest in wow today. Kids that were into it in 2005 aren't even kids anymore. You make no sense.
What is wrong with games that kids like? Again its like casual gamer being treated as a swear word. Ive tried ddo online i cant stand it. Ive tried warhammer and guildwars i didnt like them either i actually think wow has better graphics. Im always lookng for something to play when my gf isnt playing. Wow is the only mmo that has appealed to me
That said the fact that kids play it isnt a bad thing. My nephews love this game. My nephew who is 12 knows the icc fights as well as some adults i know. Hell my nephew moves outta fire and does a much better job on rot and festur then some adults ive run with.
Just cause kids play a game doesnt make it a kids game. Wow is aimed at teens and older. I for one am a 37 year old man i play wow in a guild with a few other 30 somethings a few 20 somethings and a few 60 something people. Wow is so popular not because its a kids game but because it appeals to a wide veariety of people and gamers. That is why it has an 11.5 mil playerbase.
Im pretty sure that when the hear people like u spouting off that its a kids game the laugh. And go who really cares what he thinks we have 11.5 mil subscribers let him go play a game with no one in it if he doesnt like our game Its not like well miss him. Really get over the fact that wow caters to a wide variety of people
get over the fact that now 90 pct of its playerbase has a shot at seeing icc. get over it. It wasnt worth the money to put into making raids for 6 pct of the pop to see there end game raids. Just cause u are upset u cant look down on everyone not in same gear as u anymore isnt a reason to flame all over the web.
Exactly. There is nothing wrong with a game that kids like. But calling it a kids game when the only evidence available is that most are not kids is just a person trying to be insulting to everyone that does play it.
Venge Sunsoar
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
Secondly, that was only an ancillary point I was making. WoW is still a kids games. Thanks for the long diatribe, but teenagers and younger are playing the game... millions of them. Nothing more needs to be said. For those who have played other games, WoW is a remedial experience...!
I know you probably don't beleive that. But WoW was nick-named a "theme park" for a reason, it is a walk-thru experience for a good many players. Glad your able to crunch numbers and find WoW challenging. Your rebuttal means nothing when you can join guild vent and here prepubecent boys chatting and telling you what you should be doing.
It's hilarious..
No it isn't a kids game. You saying it is does not make it so. As I stated before the target was not kids, and the average age is not kids, therefore it is not a kids game. There are millions of people playing that are not kids. Nothing more needs to be said. The average age is not a child therefore it is not a kids game.
Your comments mean nothing. You can join any game and hear prepubecent boys chatting and telling you what you should be doing.
And there are only a handful of guilds that have completed everything at the highest setting. Sadly not me, I haven't played it almost half a year. The point still stands. The game can be played easy or hard. I've played the game only doing quests and mobs that are harder than what I'm playing in Vanguard now, or what I did in EQ years ago. I've played just strolling along winding down for the evening. If you choose to play it as easy only that says something about you. EQ wasn't any harder, just more tedius and longer.
Yes WoW was nicknamed themepark. IMO inacurrately because there is more choice in that game than in many other games. You can choose many different ways to level up, unlike many different games, you can go anywhere (not without risk as it should be) unlike many different games. There is lots of choice in that game more IMO than in EQ. In EQ my druid, bard, monk, paladin were exactly the same as every other druid, monk, bard, paladin. At least in WoW I could make it I can be somewhat different from the others.
And guess what, in a themepark you can choose many many different rides to go on, giving more choices than in many other locations.
So your points are meaningless. Everything you have stated can be reduced to personal bias. Your points are not objective or reasonable.
Venge Sunsoar
edit:
Actually I just logged out of Vanguard because of the pre-pubescant boys chatting over general thestra.
Dude, your trying too hard.
How long have you been playing WoW..? I believe that is all the answer anyone needs to understand why your so adamant about this.
Everquest is a vastly more richer, deeper game with more robust game mechanics and raid mechanics. No amount of your banter will change this fact. Mobs in WoW don't have the metrics that EQ mobs do... Blizzard openly admits to this. Therefore mobs cannot be crafted to be as diverse... thus, encounters are heavily instances, to give the apperences of certain situations, but if raiding is your thing... then WoW is a joke.
It's a wlk in the park, things are just handed to you.. themepark walk-thru.
Enough said!
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
How long have you been playing WoW..? I believe that is all the answer anyone needs to understand why your so adamant about this.
Everquest is a vastly more richer, deeper game with more robust game mechanics and raid mechanics. No amount of your banter will change this fact. Mobs in WoW don't have the metrics that EQ mobs do... Blizzard openly admits to this. Therefore mobs cannot be crafted to be as diverse... thus, encounters are heavily instances, to give the apperences of certain situations, but if raiding is your thing... then WoW is a joke.
It's a wlk in the park, things are just handed to you.. themepark walk-thru.
Enough said!
I would say your trying to hard. You are adamant it is easy but ignore the hard settings. You are adamant it's a kids game but ignore the majority being not kids. An opinion without any substance.
How long I've been playing really has nothing to do with any of the points you brought up. But if you must know I've been playing WoW on and off for about 2 years. I've been off for about 6-7 months. My highest was a druid, only lvl 50.
I started in EQ just after Kunark. Played EQ, HZ, SWG (pre-NGE), CoH/V, AoC, WoW, Vanguard, EQ2, Fallen Earth and probably a few more. I've been playing for over about a decade.
EQ has more content certainly. It's been around twice as long with many many more expansions. But every encounter was a typical tank and spank. And no amount of your banter will change that. Even when the sleeper was killed. It took a great many people, but dps and tanks got him and dozens of clerics chain healed. That is a tank and spank, just with many many more people. The most complicated part about it was organizing the clerics to chain heal and specific time intervals.
And once again you've ignored the fact that many/most guilds have not beat end raids at hard mode. Just like many guilds have not beat some of EQ's raids.
There wasn't anymore depth. There were mechanics that were tedious such as CR, and xp loss, and hell levels, and medding with a book in front of your face so you couldn't see anything. That doesn't make it harder just silly. Which is why many were taken out. Needing food and water doesn't give it more depth. We all just had 3-4 stacks of everything, and would last for days and days RL time. There wasn't nothing deep or challenging about any of that. Mobs just had more HP or more Regen, or more Armor, pretty much the same as any MMO ever done with raiding.
If it was a walk in the park than the majority of guilds would have accomplished all the raids at the hardest setting. They haven't. If it was a walk in the park for you, choose a harder mob or harder settting.
The encounters are instances for a great many reasons: more tailoring to the story, no ksing, no camping. Once again you haven't mentioned any facts, just personal opinion.
Fact - most guild haven't completed all the raids at hard mode. Why? If it was easy they would
FAct - many/most of EQ raids were just tank and spank.
edit- Fact - the majority are over the age of majority
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
That is a tough question and i have no clue at all right of the spot i cant think of any Story/world they could copy this time so maybe they will finally release something they invented on there own really would like to see what that might be tho.
As for the game play well i dont think it would be different at all from WoW why would it WoW works.....somehow
voted no. I dont think they will release another themepark to take customers away from their flagship game. I'm expecting a theme that isnt fantasy (sci-fi, modern, etc), and possibly a game that isnt as geared towards casual players as WoW is. If we're lucky it may even be skill based. After WoW's success, you would assume their next mmo project would have alot of lee-way to go out and do something different, something niche (possibly). Either way it should be interesting.
If I had to guess I'd say some Vampire/Modern Gothic thing.
yeah you lol at that.......but thats the only type of players they dont own yet.....they got the RTS market, the MMO(RP)G market and maybe now they will go FPS (online)?......thats a big market (see counterstrike) they dont have yet.....so maybe your idea aint that crazy m8.
How long have you been playing WoW..? I believe that is all the answer anyone needs to understand why your so adamant about this.
Everquest is a vastly more richer, deeper game with more robust game mechanics and raid mechanics. No amount of your banter will change this fact. Mobs in WoW don't have the metrics that EQ mobs do... Blizzard openly admits to this. Therefore mobs cannot be crafted to be as diverse... thus, encounters are heavily instances, to give the apperences of certain situations, but if raiding is your thing... then WoW is a joke.
It's a wlk in the park, things are just handed to you.. themepark walk-thru.
Enough said!
I would say your trying to hard. You are adamant it is easy but ignore the hard settings. You are adamant it's a kids game but ignore the majority being not kids. An opinion without any substance.
How long I've been playing really has nothing to do with any of the points you brought up. But if you must know I've been playing WoW on and off for about 2 years. I've been off for about 6-7 months. My highest was a druid, only lvl 50.
I started in EQ just after Kunark. Played EQ, HZ, SWG (pre-NGE), CoH/V, AoC, WoW, Vanguard, EQ2, Fallen Earth and probably a few more. I've been playing for over about a decade.
EQ has more content certainly. It's been around twice as long with many many more expansions. But every encounter was a typical tank and spank. And no amount of your banter will change that. Even when the sleeper was killed. It took a great many people, but dps and tanks got him and dozens of clerics chain healed. That is a tank and spank, just with many many more people. The most complicated part about it was organizing the clerics to chain heal and specific time intervals.
And once again you've ignored the fact that many/most guilds have not beat end raids at hard mode. Just like many guilds have not beat some of EQ's raids.
There wasn't anymore depth. There were mechanics that were tedious such as CR, and xp loss, and hell levels, and medding with a book in front of your face so you couldn't see anything. That doesn't make it harder just silly. Which is why many were taken out. Needing food and water doesn't give it more depth. We all just had 3-4 stacks of everything, and would last for days and days RL time. There wasn't nothing deep or challenging about any of that. Mobs just had more HP or more Regen, or more Armor, pretty much the same as any MMO ever done with raiding.
If it was a walk in the park than the majority of guilds would have accomplished all the raids at the hardest setting. They haven't. If it was a walk in the park for you, choose a harder mob or harder settting.
The encounters are instances for a great many reasons: more tailoring to the story, no ksing, no camping. Once again you haven't mentioned any facts, just personal opinion.
Fact - most guild haven't completed all the raids at hard mode. Why? If it was easy they would
FAct - many/most of EQ raids were just tank and spank.
edit- Fact - the majority are over the age of majority
Dude, the simple fact that there are "hard mode" in World of Warcraft tells you something... it's a joke.
Secondly, almost every "raid" in WoW is trivial and easy.. you make it sound hard to kill things. It is juts a matter of showing up with the right people and putting the time in... only little girls and kids fail on raids in WoW. A group of 30 year olds won't have any problem.. specially a veteran gamer.
I highly doubt your WoW guild could take out the first dragons in Everquest.. because they are not prepared for the AI, or the plethora of strats and tactics mobs employ. That little experiment was done a few years back. The WoW guild failed miserbly over 3 months. You simple don't get how fraking easy WoW is.. it's so easy in fact, that it has a hard mode set for certain instances....
When the last time you were on a 12 hour raid..? Or where half you party died and you had to continue without them, because the rest must remain invised, etc... but don't take my word for it bro, there are many pro guilds that steam threw WoW in 9 months laughing. I've done it twice...
Children all around me.. perhaps you need a taste of something more challenging for a year... so when you go back to WoW, you'll realise how uninteresting and easy the game is. Then realize it is time to graduate to something more meaningful and challenging.
But I understand, WoW provides a nice sefety net for you and the rest of the kids...
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
I am a newcomer to mmorpgs, having played only SWG, Asheron's Call 2 and a little Everquest 2 before settling for WoW. But to say all raids in WoW are simple is just plain ignorant. Sure the Wotlk fights in their simple version are easy. That's the whole point and you are missing it. They were designed to not be challenging so most people can see and experince them. If you want though fights you go do hardmodes. Being all elitist and seeing kids on every corner doesn't further your opinion, it just makes you look rather angry, bitter and certainly not someone with whom one could have a meaningful debate.
Again I'm not saying Everquest had less complex boss design (which by reading the tactics for Lord Nagafen I could say - He is the dragon you're talking about right?), just that not all WoW bosses are simple and easy.
I play games for fun, not to have a second job. Does that make me a kid in your eyes? I certainly could not care less.
Blizzard has said that it wont have anything to do with WoW but that it will be a new IP. That being said, I havent heard much more about what they are working on. Its about time they try something new. One can only take so many years of WoW, especially since the textures and quests are to simiiar from xpac to xpac.
Lets just hope they throw the old rules of WoW out the window and go with something innovative. No more point a click. Make it hard and challenging and at the same time fun. = WIN.
Dude, the simple fact that there are "hard mode" in World of Warcraft tells you something... it's a joke.
Once again you are displaying your own bias and personal ignorance. It has a hard mode and an easy so people can play feeling more challenged or play at their own pace. Whichever they want. That you think it's a joke shows you are against choice.
Secondly, almost every "raid" in WoW is trivial and easy.. you make it sound hard to kill things. It is juts a matter of showing up with the right people and putting the time in... only little girls and kids fail on raids in WoW. A group of 30 year olds won't have any problem.. specially a veteran gamer.
Almost every raid in WoW is trivial and easy if you play at an easy mode. If you play at a hard mode it is hard, as evidenced by most guild not having completed the top raids in hard mode yet. Just a matter of showing up with the right people and time is all EQ raids were. And for a guy who was adamant he wasn't insulting anyone you have shown yourself to be a lier here.
I highly doubt your WoW guild could take out the first dragons in Everquest.. because they are not prepared for the AI, or the plethora of strats and tactics mobs employ. That little experiment was done a few years back. The WoW guild failed miserbly over 3 months. You simple don't get how fraking easy WoW is.. it's so easy in fact, that it has a hard mode set for certain instances....
My WoW guild probably couldn't take out any raids in EQ. Mostly because I didn't bother with guilds in WoW for very long. However I"m sure there are a great many guilds in WoW that not only could but have taken out many/all EQ raids.
When the last time you were on a 12 hour raid..? Or where half you party died and you had to continue without them, because the rest must remain invised, etc... but don't take my word for it bro, there are many pro guilds that steam threw WoW in 9 months laughing. I've done it twice...
I've never done a 12 hour raid, personally I think that is ridiculous and really besides the point - longer is not harder, it is just longer. I've been on many raids where most of the party died and we had to continue without them using whatever skills we posessed. Too many pro guilds that steam through WoW - ignores the fact that most guilds haven't done all the top raids in hard mode - facts are not your friend it seems. You can verify this for yourself at the amory.
Children all around me.. perhaps you need a taste of something more challenging for a year... so when you go back to WoW, you'll realise how uninteresting and easy the game is. Then realize it is time to graduate to something more meaningful and challenging.
Once again for a person saying he is not insulting you are now shown to be a lier. I've done many things, hard and easy. You can choose the level of difficulty in any game. Choose harder mobs, harder quests, harder raids. That you don't shows that you like the easy mode or prefer to be carried by people who are just better. And there is certainly enough challenges in my life. Actually I'm going to write the MCATS this friday - kind of a big freaky test, for me anyway.
But I understand, WoW provides a nice sefety net for you and the rest of the kids...
True colors are not your friend either it seems. Provide some facts with data that can be verified. Everything I've stated can be verified through studies whose links are on here (you confirmed the age) and through the armory. All I've seen from you is bias, inuendo, outright lies, insults and condescension. In short you seem to be a bitter small person.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
Dude, the simple fact that there are "hard mode" in World of Warcraft tells you something... it's a joke.
Once again you are displaying your own bias and personal ignorance. It has a hard mode and an easy so people can play feeling more challenged or play at their own pace. Whichever they want. That you think it's a joke shows you are against choice.
Secondly, almost every "raid" in WoW is trivial and easy.. you make it sound hard to kill things. It is juts a matter of showing up with the right people and putting the time in... only little girls and kids fail on raids in WoW. A group of 30 year olds won't have any problem.. specially a veteran gamer.
Almost every raid in WoW is trivial and easy if you play at an easy mode. If you play at a hard mode it is hard, as evidenced by most guild not having completed the top raids in hard mode yet. Just a matter of showing up with the right people and time is all EQ raids were. And for a guy who was adamant he wasn't insulting anyone you have shown yourself to be a lier here.
I highly doubt your WoW guild could take out the first dragons in Everquest.. because they are not prepared for the AI, or the plethora of strats and tactics mobs employ. That little experiment was done a few years back. The WoW guild failed miserbly over 3 months. You simple don't get how fraking easy WoW is.. it's so easy in fact, that it has a hard mode set for certain instances....
My WoW guild probably couldn't take out any raids in EQ. Mostly because I didn't bother with guilds in WoW for very long. However I"m sure there are a great many guilds in WoW that not only could but have taken out many/all EQ raids.
When the last time you were on a 12 hour raid..? Or where half you party died and you had to continue without them, because the rest must remain invised, etc... but don't take my word for it bro, there are many pro guilds that steam threw WoW in 9 months laughing. I've done it twice...
I've never done a 12 hour raid, personally I think that is ridiculous and really besides the point - longer is not harder, it is just longer. I've been on many raids where most of the party died and we had to continue without them using whatever skills we posessed. Too many pro guilds that steam through WoW - ignores the fact that most guilds haven't done all the top raids in hard mode - facts are not your friend it seems. You can verify this for yourself at the amory.
Children all around me.. perhaps you need a taste of something more challenging for a year... so when you go back to WoW, you'll realise how uninteresting and easy the game is. Then realize it is time to graduate to something more meaningful and challenging.
Once again for a person saying he is not insulting you are now shown to be a lier. I've done many things, hard and easy. You can choose the level of difficulty in any game. Choose harder mobs, harder quests, harder raids. That you don't shows that you like the easy mode or prefer to be carried by people who are just better. And there is certainly enough challenges in my life. Actually I'm going to write the MCATS this friday - kind of a big freaky test, for me anyway.
But I understand, WoW provides a nice sefety net for you and the rest of the kids...
True colors are not your friend either it seems. Provide some facts with data that can be verified. Everything I've stated can be verified through studies whose links are on here (you confirmed the age) and through the armory. All I've seen from you is bias, inuendo, outright lies, insults and condescension. In short you seem to be a bitter small person.
Dude, WoW is easy gameplay and made nearly a Billion Dollars.... so every game since WoW, has been easy...
Secondly, none of your complaining and ultra-QQ'ing is going to change the fact that World of Warcraft is not challenging for a good portion of the MMO player base.. it offers nothing for them, and doesn't challenge them.
TO me... that is because to people who do go on 8~12h raids and play at that level (nearly every EQ player over the last 11 years)... World of Warcraft seems moot, or absolutely pointless because it offers nothing.....!!!
Absolutely no point to playing such a Fisher Price style of game, when there are other games without training wheels. Other than if you are a kid, or an adult in training. BTW... preping for those "hard" raids in WoW doesn't take months, or years... like for some EQ raids. That is not saying World of Warcraft is all easy.. but when compared to other games, what you consider hard kinda becomes an inside joke... if you know what I mean.
It is only considered hard by you, because it's harder than other WoW mobs... but compared to other games ??? (Fisher Price bro....)
Though, I kinda understand why you defend your position so hard, you thought you where accomplishing something in that game.. when someone like me comes along and lets you know that a crayon book, is not a Terry Brooks novel... you get mad.
But none of that was my over-all point.
Which was that I hope Blizzard's new MMO is even more carebear, more themepark and more (for)giving to the players... because that will keep these children locked up in that game for another 4~5 years and me and many other won't have to deal with their incessant rambling on all these message boards.
They can just have their cotten candy armor and walk around proud of what they accomplished (ie: blizzard gave them).
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
Dude, WoW is easy gameplay and made nearly a Billion Dollars.... so every game since WoW, has been easy...
And it can be played harder if you choose to. That you don't says more about you than the game. And the amount of money something makes does not really relate to the level of challenge that it portrays. And just like WoW every game can be played more challenging - not by setting the actually difficulty of raids like in WoW but by choosing how you spend your time and what mobs/quests you choose to do.
Secondly, none of your complaining and ultra-QQ'ing is going to change the fact that World of Warcraft is not challenging for a good portion of the MMO player base.. it offers nothing for them, and doesn't challenge them.
None of your complaining or crying is going to change the fact that it can be played harder, it can be challenging. That you choose not to says more about you than the game.
TO me... that is because to people who do go on 8~12h raids and play at that level (nearly every EQ player over the last 11 years)... World of Warcraft seems moot, or absolutely pointless because it offers nothing.....!!!
Actually most EQ players never did any raids at all, most players in MMO's don't raid. And once again if hard mode was easy than all the guilds would have done it. They haven't it and yet are attempting it, so it isn't - and since it can be challenging as evidence by most guilds not having don it - it must still offere a challenge.
Absolutely no point to playing such a Fisher Price style of game, when there are other games without training wheels. Other than if you are a kid, or an adult in training. BTW... preping for those "hard" raids in WoW doesn't take months, or years... like for some EQ raids. That is not saying World of Warcraft is all easy.. but when compared to other games, what you consider hard kinda becomes an inside joke... if you know what I mean.
And yet top guilds prep Sunwell for 6 months to take out the boss - no thats easy isn't it, just like some EQ raids.
I havent' found any game to be hard. All the ones I listed before are pretty much the same, you can make them harder or easier by the style you play, by the mobs you fight, and the dungeons, raids you go on. EQ wasn't hard, just a fun tank and spank time sink. Vanguard isn't hard, Eve isn't hard - just dull IMO. MMO's aren't hard. There is nothing challenging about them, all any of them take is time and enough people.
It is only considered hard by you, because it's harder than other WoW mobs... but compared to other games ??? (Fisher Price bro....)
I dont' consider it harder or easier than any other MMO - probably because I have enough intelligence and ability to realize that how I choose to play is my choice. I can make it hard or easy by the actions I decide to engage in. And for a fischer price game those professional top guilds seem to find the hard mode top raids pretty challenging.
Though, I kinda understand why you defend your position so hard, you thought you where accomplishing something in that game.. when someone like me comes along and lets you know that a crayon book, is not a Terry Brooks novel... you get mad.
I'm not accomplishing anything in an MMO. I realize they are just time wasters, downtime, casual entertainment. Sorry buy I get my sense of accomplishment from things outside games. And IMO most Terry Brooks novels weren't that great- Landover was entertaining but hte Shannara series was pretty lame, although my family liked them - they just weren't for me. Give me Guy Gavriel Kay, some older David Eddings, or even Brett Weeks or Peter Brett for some newer novels any day.
See you can dislike something without insulting everyone that does like it. You should try it sometime.
You seem to be under the impression that I'm defending Warcraft when in fact I couldn't care less about warcraft. What I'm arguing is your logic - of which there is none, and your opinion which is completely unfounded and ignorant of the facts at hand and your constant unreasonable attempts to belittle something that a great many people enjoy all to stroke your own ego that you are worth something. But keep trying - sooner or later you'll learn to be objective. Maybe you should take a few basic sciene or reasoning classes - you don't seem to have the hang of it yet.
But none of that was my over-all point.
Which was that I hope Blizzard's new MMO is even more carebear, more themepark and more (for)giving to the players... because that will keep these children locked up in that game for another 4~5 years and me and many other won't have to deal with their incessant rambling on all these message boards.
They can just have their cotten candy armor and walk around proud of what they accomplished (ie: blizzard gave them).
And yet your point seems to be lost in your effort to belittle people. Small and sad. Too bad the rest of the population will have to put up with your incessant rambling on the degradation of well everything.
Just because you don't like it doesn't mean it is bad.
Comments
Ok, love WoW or hate it, it wouldnt be successful if it wasn't well made or fun, right? At least to most people. But really, when has blizzard ever released a BAD game. Not a game you don't like, or that's too easy, etc. Ignoring WoW completely, when has blizzard fucked ANYTHING up?
of couse not
I'm pretty sure their going to come up with a persistant world MMORTS somewhat loosely based on Farmland+UO+Wow. When this comes to pass I expect all of you who dident believe to donate 1 dollar to the charity of your choice in my name.
Refugee from UO,EQ,AC,AC2,AO,DAOC,L2,SB,HZ,CoH,PT,EQ2,WoW,VG,SWG,EVE,WAR,DF,MO,AI,GA,LOTRO, SWTOR... Gw2 on Deck
OK i have no clue what blizz is working on. Will it be a wow clone maybe. IN that they will have a ui thats simple and easy to follow. they will probably have quests and objectives . Some sort of group based play like raids and pvp. Weather as an rts or an fps. Id assume they wouldnt do an rpg as that wouldnt be new and would compete with wow.
That said blizz fanbois dont bluy there games cause they suck or are bad games. They buy them cause they are fun interesting and give u and immersive style of gameplay that u can play for hrs and not realize it. All u wow haters seems to wanna bash wow is really a moot point.
Your one point of contention is they want to appeal to a braod player base and not a small click of people who might play there game. duh thats good buisness they are in this to make money after all. I dont understand your nerd rage its like u are upset that they let 11 million people play there games.
Like u are upset they made the game fun and enjoyable for all and not just for 5 pct of there population. If they made the game for 5 pct of the population that is so pissy on all the forums theyd lose 95 pct of the players and lose money and there game would go under so deal with the fact u arent more important then the majority. Just cause u think u are some kinda hardcore gamer and casuals arent worth keeping.
Also im tired of casual gamer being used like a swear word. What is so bad with being a casual gamer? why wouldnt the majority of mmos wanan makes games that appeal to 11 mill people as opposed to hard core mmos that appeal to maybe 50 thousand ?
Most game companines if they are smart pick the 11 mill over the 50 thousand.
Dude, it doesn't matter. .
Secondly, that was only an ancillary point I was making. WoW is still a kids games. Thanks for the long diatribe, but teenagers and younger are playing the game... millions of them. Nothing more needs to be said. For those who have played other games, WoW is a remedial experience...!
I know you probably don't beleive that. But WoW was nick-named a "theme park" for a reason, it is a walk-thru experience for a good many players. Glad your able to crunch numbers and find WoW challenging. Your rebuttal means nothing when you can join guild vent and here prepubecent boys chatting and telling you what you should be doing.
It's hilarious..
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
No it isn't a kids game. You saying it is does not make it so. As I stated before the target was not kids, and the average age is not kids, therefore it is not a kids game. There are millions of people playing that are not kids. Nothing more needs to be said. The average age is not a child therefore it is not a kids game.
Your comments mean nothing. You can join any game and hear prepubecent boys chatting and telling you what you should be doing.
And there are only a handful of guilds that have completed everything at the highest setting. Sadly not me, I haven't played it almost half a year. The point still stands. The game can be played easy or hard. I've played the game only doing quests and mobs that are harder than what I'm playing in Vanguard now, or what I did in EQ years ago. I've played just strolling along winding down for the evening. If you choose to play it as easy only that says something about you. EQ wasn't any harder, just more tedius and longer.
Yes WoW was nicknamed themepark. IMO inacurrately because there is more choice in that game than in many other games. You can choose many different ways to level up, unlike many different games, you can go anywhere (not without risk as it should be) unlike many different games. There is lots of choice in that game more IMO than in EQ. In EQ my druid, bard, monk, paladin were exactly the same as every other druid, monk, bard, paladin. At least in WoW I could make it I can be somewhat different from the others.
And guess what, in a themepark you can choose many many different rides to go on, giving more choices than in many other locations.
So your points are meaningless. Everything you have stated can be reduced to personal bias. Your points are not objective or reasonable.
Venge Sunsoar
edit:
Actually I just logged out of Vanguard because of the pre-pubescant boys chatting over general thestra.
Really wow is not a kids game at all. Kids have almost no interest in wow today. Kids that were into it in 2005 aren't even kids anymore. You make no sense.
What is wrong with games that kids like? Again its like casual gamer being treated as a swear word. Ive tried ddo online i cant stand it. Ive tried warhammer and guildwars i didnt like them either i actually think wow has better graphics. Im always lookng for something to play when my gf isnt playing. Wow is the only mmo that has appealed to me
That said the fact that kids play it isnt a bad thing. My nephews love this game. My nephew who is 12 knows the icc fights as well as some adults i know. Hell my nephew moves outta fire and does a much better job on rot and festur then some adults ive run with.
Just cause kids play a game doesnt make it a kids game. Wow is aimed at teens and older. I for one am a 37 year old man i play wow in a guild with a few other 30 somethings a few 20 somethings and a few 60 something people. Wow is so popular not because its a kids game but because it appeals to a wide veariety of people and gamers. That is why it has an 11.5 mil playerbase.
Im pretty sure that when the hear people like u spouting off that its a kids game the laugh. And go who really cares what he thinks we have 11.5 mil subscribers let him go play a game with no one in it if he doesnt like our game Its not like well miss him. Really get over the fact that wow caters to a wide variety of people
get over the fact that now 90 pct of its playerbase has a shot at seeing icc. get over it. It wasnt worth the money to put into making raids for 6 pct of the pop to see there end game raids. Just cause u are upset u cant look down on everyone not in same gear as u anymore isnt a reason to flame all over the web.
You heard it here first, It is a western...
Exactly. There is nothing wrong with a game that kids like. But calling it a kids game when the only evidence available is that most are not kids is just a person trying to be insulting to everyone that does play it.
Venge Sunsoar
Dude, your trying too hard.
How long have you been playing WoW..? I believe that is all the answer anyone needs to understand why your so adamant about this.
Everquest is a vastly more richer, deeper game with more robust game mechanics and raid mechanics. No amount of your banter will change this fact. Mobs in WoW don't have the metrics that EQ mobs do... Blizzard openly admits to this. Therefore mobs cannot be crafted to be as diverse... thus, encounters are heavily instances, to give the apperences of certain situations, but if raiding is your thing... then WoW is a joke.
It's a wlk in the park, things are just handed to you.. themepark walk-thru.
Enough said!
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
I would say your trying to hard. You are adamant it is easy but ignore the hard settings. You are adamant it's a kids game but ignore the majority being not kids. An opinion without any substance.
How long I've been playing really has nothing to do with any of the points you brought up. But if you must know I've been playing WoW on and off for about 2 years. I've been off for about 6-7 months. My highest was a druid, only lvl 50.
I started in EQ just after Kunark. Played EQ, HZ, SWG (pre-NGE), CoH/V, AoC, WoW, Vanguard, EQ2, Fallen Earth and probably a few more. I've been playing for over about a decade.
EQ has more content certainly. It's been around twice as long with many many more expansions. But every encounter was a typical tank and spank. And no amount of your banter will change that. Even when the sleeper was killed. It took a great many people, but dps and tanks got him and dozens of clerics chain healed. That is a tank and spank, just with many many more people. The most complicated part about it was organizing the clerics to chain heal and specific time intervals.
And once again you've ignored the fact that many/most guilds have not beat end raids at hard mode. Just like many guilds have not beat some of EQ's raids.
There wasn't anymore depth. There were mechanics that were tedious such as CR, and xp loss, and hell levels, and medding with a book in front of your face so you couldn't see anything. That doesn't make it harder just silly. Which is why many were taken out. Needing food and water doesn't give it more depth. We all just had 3-4 stacks of everything, and would last for days and days RL time. There wasn't nothing deep or challenging about any of that. Mobs just had more HP or more Regen, or more Armor, pretty much the same as any MMO ever done with raiding.
If it was a walk in the park than the majority of guilds would have accomplished all the raids at the hardest setting. They haven't. If it was a walk in the park for you, choose a harder mob or harder settting.
The encounters are instances for a great many reasons: more tailoring to the story, no ksing, no camping. Once again you haven't mentioned any facts, just personal opinion.
Fact - most guild haven't completed all the raids at hard mode. Why? If it was easy they would
FAct - many/most of EQ raids were just tank and spank.
edit- Fact - the majority are over the age of majority
I lol'd hard at the ironic thread title.
You all know what I'm gonna say... Well, maybe.
WoSC please?
Yeah yeah I know, you want me to gtfo.
I'm never giving up hope of a WoSC one day!!!
I love the story / setting of SC but RTS games annoy me bigtime.
EDIT:
What is, the "T0p Sekr3t MM0" ?
Red Dead Online anyone?
/nerdrage
Total MMOs played: 274|Enjoyed: 9. >:|
well they already got a rpg and a rts...
isn't it obvious?
they are making a mmofps!!
(lol)
That is a tough question and i have no clue at all right of the spot i cant think of any Story/world they could copy this time so maybe they will finally release something they invented on there own really would like to see what that might be tho.
As for the game play well i dont think it would be different at all from WoW why would it WoW works.....somehow
If I had to guess I'd say some Vampire/Modern Gothic thing.
Give me liberty or give me lasers
5$ on contemporary setting "real life simulator".
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
yeah you lol at that.......but thats the only type of players they dont own yet.....they got the RTS market, the MMO(RP)G market and maybe now they will go FPS (online)?......thats a big market (see counterstrike) they dont have yet.....so maybe your idea aint that crazy m8.
Blizzard doesn't make WoW clones. Everyone else does.
>trollface.jpg
Dude, the simple fact that there are "hard mode" in World of Warcraft tells you something... it's a joke.
Secondly, almost every "raid" in WoW is trivial and easy.. you make it sound hard to kill things. It is juts a matter of showing up with the right people and putting the time in... only little girls and kids fail on raids in WoW. A group of 30 year olds won't have any problem.. specially a veteran gamer.
I highly doubt your WoW guild could take out the first dragons in Everquest.. because they are not prepared for the AI, or the plethora of strats and tactics mobs employ. That little experiment was done a few years back. The WoW guild failed miserbly over 3 months. You simple don't get how fraking easy WoW is.. it's so easy in fact, that it has a hard mode set for certain instances....
When the last time you were on a 12 hour raid..? Or where half you party died and you had to continue without them, because the rest must remain invised, etc... but don't take my word for it bro, there are many pro guilds that steam threw WoW in 9 months laughing. I've done it twice...
Children all around me.. perhaps you need a taste of something more challenging for a year... so when you go back to WoW, you'll realise how uninteresting and easy the game is. Then realize it is time to graduate to something more meaningful and challenging.
But I understand, WoW provides a nice sefety net for you and the rest of the kids...
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon
To Phelche,
I am a newcomer to mmorpgs, having played only SWG, Asheron's Call 2 and a little Everquest 2 before settling for WoW. But to say all raids in WoW are simple is just plain ignorant. Sure the Wotlk fights in their simple version are easy. That's the whole point and you are missing it. They were designed to not be challenging so most people can see and experince them. If you want though fights you go do hardmodes. Being all elitist and seeing kids on every corner doesn't further your opinion, it just makes you look rather angry, bitter and certainly not someone with whom one could have a meaningful debate.
Again I'm not saying Everquest had less complex boss design (which by reading the tactics for Lord Nagafen I could say - He is the dragon you're talking about right?), just that not all WoW bosses are simple and easy.
I play games for fun, not to have a second job. Does that make me a kid in your eyes? I certainly could not care less.
Blizzard has said that it wont have anything to do with WoW but that it will be a new IP. That being said, I havent heard much more about what they are working on. Its about time they try something new. One can only take so many years of WoW, especially since the textures and quests are to simiiar from xpac to xpac.
Lets just hope they throw the old rules of WoW out the window and go with something innovative. No more point a click. Make it hard and challenging and at the same time fun. = WIN.
Dude, WoW is easy gameplay and made nearly a Billion Dollars.... so every game since WoW, has been easy...
Secondly, none of your complaining and ultra-QQ'ing is going to change the fact that World of Warcraft is not challenging for a good portion of the MMO player base.. it offers nothing for them, and doesn't challenge them.
TO me... that is because to people who do go on 8~12h raids and play at that level (nearly every EQ player over the last 11 years)... World of Warcraft seems moot, or absolutely pointless because it offers nothing.....!!!
Absolutely no point to playing such a Fisher Price style of game, when there are other games without training wheels. Other than if you are a kid, or an adult in training. BTW... preping for those "hard" raids in WoW doesn't take months, or years... like for some EQ raids. That is not saying World of Warcraft is all easy.. but when compared to other games, what you consider hard kinda becomes an inside joke... if you know what I mean.
It is only considered hard by you, because it's harder than other WoW mobs... but compared to other games ??? (Fisher Price bro....)
Though, I kinda understand why you defend your position so hard, you thought you where accomplishing something in that game.. when someone like me comes along and lets you know that a crayon book, is not a Terry Brooks novel... you get mad.
But none of that was my over-all point.
Which was that I hope Blizzard's new MMO is even more carebear, more themepark and more (for)giving to the players... because that will keep these children locked up in that game for another 4~5 years and me and many other won't have to deal with their incessant rambling on all these message boards.
They can just have their cotten candy armor and walk around proud of what they accomplished (ie: blizzard gave them).
"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."
-Nariusseldon