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No dedicated healer means ........
Lord.Bachus
Member RarePosts: 9,686
That healing will be a group responsibillity and that everyone in the group has a task to heal others when needed or the chance you fail hard tasks raises by a huge amount.
This will also mea that you can't just spam your DPS skills but allways need to keep an eye on your friends or the even the random players near you participating in the event.
The more i think about it the more i realise that healing will be just as important in this game as in other games to succeed, the only thing thats different is that there will not be one single person responsible for spamming the "I heal you" button.
Best MMO experiences : EQ(PvE), DAoC(PvP), WoW(total package) LOTRO (worldfeel) GW2 (Artstyle and animations and worlddesign) SWTOR (Story immersion) TSW (story) ESO (character advancement)
Comments
No "dedicated healer class" does NOT mean you can't have a dedicated healing templeted character.
It does NOT mean everyone needs to heal others. It just means there is more freedom to stray away from the tired lame format that plagues most MMO's today.
While this idea is good and teamwork and enforcing it are good. I've seen quite a few people who have done healing and are not good at it. If you spread this out more your more likely to hit someone who just doesn't do a good job healing, so this could possibly be a double edged sword
On one side you have team work and everyone getting involved in the healing which makes for more dynamic gameplay
but on the reverse theres more chance that when you need that healing the person up for the healing that can, won't heal or won't heal correctly.
But that can be all worked out i suppose by weeding out those that don't heal well. I still think people will try to put other people into the holy trinity slots. If you do more DPS your a dps, if you have decent healing spells your a healer, so on and so forth.
Final Note: it's good they are trying something different, i just hope it's handled well, cause ditching the holy trinity can be done, but is tricky to do well.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
You do know that you only will have one dedicated slot and possibly 3 more? That doesn't sound enough to use a single character as a healer. You will have 5 times 2 weapon skills to compare with.
There will be no tanks either so you better keep your eyes out in combat both on your allies and your enemies.
I like it, I think it will also make PvP a lot more fun and PvP and PvE closer to eachother.
I think some groups will have people only healing themselves while the best groups will run everything. But there will always be some groups that are better than others no matter what the system.
People can't really play the holy trio, there are no tanking. I doubt there even will be a single taunt in it so holy duo is more like it if people actually manages to make something close to a dedicated healer which is doubtful.
You make it sound like every class has to stop what they are doing, turn around and heal their friends but its not exactly like that.
Just like in the several gameplay footage we've seen every class has some way to SUPPORT their allies and that doesn't necessarily mean healing. For instance; a warrior can plunk down a banner of courage that boosts his allies armour stats, an ele can attune to either water for healing or earth for damage mitigation or even air for a different time of damage mitigation, a ranger can pop out its support pet when need be and a necro can put down a well of blood that gives allies within it health regen. No class really needs to stop, drop and heal, all each class needs is a way to support their allies whilst doing what they do best.
This is not a game.
I think that no dedicated healer means that you will have to look more to find some heals to form a group ...
Exemple: your trying to form a group :
oki what are you? .. im a healer hunter,
and you?, ho im a healer assassin...
ho well im a healer warrior...
who has the most skills?
hunter: we i got 2 spells,
assasin: i got 3 spells ,
hunter again: yeah but mine are better...
hell in sight...
Your only allowed to take one healing spell if your non support e.g elementalist, necro, or unanounced class. It will still be perfectly viable without one of those classes you'll just need to change your play style slightly.
means...
...No power leveling!
Meh, I'm sure they'll find a way.
I don't see why you use healer-class typology.
Every class got healing spells and revive spell, at this point only the elementalist has got some augmented spells through the water attunement.
Kicking out dedicated healer, tank (and in a way dps) makes the gameplay much more interesting.
It used to be tank = spam taunt, healer = spam heals; dps = spam dps (ok with some variations but you know what I mean).
Now you have to be in your toes, coz tha tank is not gonna keep agro, so when that dragon lashes out, you have to dodge (yes we have dodge abilities now, kinda same as in AOC = double tap). And when the dragon targets one player, other players can heal or revive downed players if necessary, while other dps, etc.
Hell warriors can even do ranged attacks with their bows, and no it is not only for pulling, they do real damage.
Evrybody is helping each other in every way they can.
It gives for a much more moving/active gameplay.
I see the same thing when I make popcorn.
It's called Chaos.
This is the answer, but it is easier said than done. It is trying to get players to think and play this way that will be difficult. If a group is thinking of support as well as DPS, then it will work. It will be interesting to see how this plays out with groups over time. There are many players that are resistant to change.
How many people long for that "past, simpler, and better world," I wonder, without ever recognizing the truth that perhaps it was they who were simpler and better, and not the world about them?
R.A.Salvatore
Unfortunately, for those of those who enjoy playing healers (my mains are a warden in EQ2, a mini in LotRO, a priest in WoW, and a cleric in Aion...see a pattern?), we're simply out of luck.
Then they should join The Borg
On a more serious note, you are probably right, but ...
Isn't the majority of the mmo communty crying for a change? So why not embrace it?
Change is good, it evolves the genre, leeds to new experiences.
Like all things new, it's scary (for some), but you never know ... it might be the most fun we had in years.
Roll Elementalist, I think you will be quite happy.
No you're not, all you need to do is be more creative and more aggressive at the same time. Grab a necro, a wand and a dagger(I'm guessing this gives you more support skills on your weapons bar), grab a well, grab your wind rider minion that heals you as it attacks and do damage whilst healing your allies or take the ele for example; attune to water to heal the warrior by attacking the person he's attacking, cast geyser at your location that knocks back all the enemies in your area whilst healing you and the allies around you.
I don't know... is healing whilst dealing damage hard to grasp?
This is not a game.
Ok no tanks and no healers. What about CC?
If no CC either then this game sounds awfully like an FPS in the regard that DPS is all that matters. Boring if you ask me.
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And more, many people fail to do only one job in the group ... either cc heal or tank ... now you ask them to heal dps and watch their aggro at the same time? its going to be fail festival soon.
If you watched any of the class skill videos you would see that CC is present.
In all honesty, the combat system kind of reminds me of a movie. Think about almost any fantasy movie you've seen and tell me who is in the back wiggling their fingers and healing others? Everyone has a role, but no one is a dedicated tank, healer or dps for that matter. Everyone is doing something to help support one another in battle, or being a blathering idiot and trying to not die.
Healers are mostly proactive support massive damage reduction for short periods of time, there's a lot of CC and a high amount of emphasis on positioning.
Well all of these roles are in Guild Wars 2, just sort of spread out as different types of utility. The 'problem' and the 'greatness' of such a system has been discussed for a decade and now we'll see it come to light. Well, sorta.
I kill other players because they're smarter than AI, sometimes.
are you sure you watched the same vids i watched?
that big evil dragon thing looked very... stationary to me, given with a bit of swinging here, a bit of random purpleballing there, a bit of lifting up an instagibbing a few folks... but it did not look very intense...
I mean hell the guy playing the demo had time to show off all kinds of abilities and stuff in the middle of that fight... he wasn't in a group and nothing... a bit lame
i said weeks ago that there are basically 2 ways this can go without healers:
1. The L4D way. everything does moderate to high damage, heals are weak or temporary and the most effective way is to just let people drop and pick em up again while everybody runs around spamming his dps.
2. the D2 way. pretty much all abilities are AoE in some way or another, you spam them at hordes of mobs while running around them/ away from them. Healing becomes more of a "don't run out of major rejuv pots" scenario than anything remotely connected to skill.
interestingly, while i was right, i would not have though that the true outcome would actually be a mix between both ways...
of course this all sounds a LOT better if you call it "Innovative Next Generation Action Ninja Turtle POW POW Combat"
Aside from ANet coming across as being extremely pretencious with all their "yeah this has been totally stupid in MMOs until now"... "we're gonna make it better for everyone with our large brains" "dungeons are super boring so we decided to finally make them fun" "healers are super lame and boring, but we totally had the best and most originaletists idea ever!!!! no healers in RPG!!! GENIOUZ!"
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You allways seem to be negative to any post concerning any game, well but thats ur perogative.
Dps is not all that matters, since if all ur group mebers are death, well so are you.
So its in your interest to keep an eye out.
If someone next to you goes down, and you have an opportunity to rez him, you are not gonna tell me that you will ignore him, keep dppssing, and wait for another player all the way on the other side to rez.
It's in your interest to rez/heal as quick as possible, coz the next time it could be you.
The difference is, you can't be lazy anymore, do dps, dodge attacks, heal ... you can't just rely on the tank to tank and the healer to heal.
You have to keep your eyes open. Does not sound boring to me at all.
Ever heard of grenades? Smoke grenades? Flash bangs? Yea FPSs have CC...
This is not a game.
Well we have to keep in mind this was a demo, and it is safe to asssume the boss was not at full-out mode.
Maybe this was a stationary boss, but we only saw this one, who knows how other bosses react/play?
Did you see the dodges? You need to jump away from attacks, that in itself does not seem so stationary to me.
Look I don't have all the answers, no-one does accept Anet, but to me at this point it seems to be a step in the right direction.
Look, react, play not only play as in mashing buttons coz u are that specific class.
"healers are super lame and boring"
They didn't say this, the said they wanted to give the option to healers to also do damage when they are soloing.
Copied this from GW2G:
Zyuu: I noticed that the elementalist has an ability to recover HP?
Jeff Grubb: Yes, they have their water attunement – you'll have a lot more healing with that. But I'm also talking about how if an ally falls, you can go and rally him. You can go bring him back up as opposed to in a game with a dedicated healer. Their dedicated healer would have a resurrection spell with a long timer and it'd be used, etc. This sort of thing created design problems for the fact that you had to figure out how to design around that – will we just assume everyone has a healer and then design accordingly or do we design like it could be anything and then having a healer would just make it an advantage? So, we ended up having everybody capable of rallying their allies. We've found that the players who like to run the priest, the cleric, the monk, the healer class, naturally continue to do what they were doing before because they had a style that basically made them happy. And that style is “I want to help others.”
Chris Lye: But they also have more options. Like my wife is a great healer, she loves playing a healing class. But there are always times where she has to play solo and she can't do enough damage. That's not going to be a problem if you are playing an elementalist.
Jeff Grubb: Yes. And it's going to be a case of, you know, not what do we need in the party, but what do we need in the situation.
I can't really figure out why does it seem a revolution now... in Eve Online RR (Remote Repair) based fleets have existed for years, sacrificing a bit of DPS to fit a single repair module on most ships in the fleet is quite common, both in PvP and PvE...