Originally posted by Calibanvov Lets look at the Background of these pictures for a second. Ignore the models for now.
Seems to me you nailed it. Nobody can deny the environmental artists are doing a great job. What is controversial now is the models, and some animations.
For the animations you can expect them to be polished since launch. For the models the art is set.
I couldnt disagree with the folks saying the graphics are bad more. I've played Kotor a million times and I think they went with this "art style" because it is kotor like. If you really go take the time to look at all of the gameplay footage and the screen shots on the website you'll be amazed at the level of detail.
I for one am excited. I'll be running with my group of friends at a smooth 50-60 fps expriencing what will most likely be the most polished mmo i'll ever play.
If your sad about the graphics then dont play. There will be 20 other releases this year for you to try out.
When will people get it through their thick skulls, games are about GAMEplay, not looks? It's in the freakin word for god sakes.
Like it or not Githern, looks do matter. Not as much as how a game plays, but it is still important. A good example of this for me at least is WoW. Decent game play but so dang ugly I would NEVER pay for it myself. Granted, a good look will not make a game, but it certainly doesn't hurt either.
For myself though, I think the look of this game could be a little better, but I like it just fine right now too.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
For those of you who think the graphics suck, please do not buy this game.
For those of you who think the space combat sucks even though you've never experienced it firsthand, do not buy this game.
All we need on opening week is a bunch of narrow minded leetsauce jerkholes whining like theyre back in vanilla barrens.
You folks just stay wherever you are and pretend that whatever you play at the moment gives your life true meaning.
You may even find some way to make jokes about someone other than Chuck Norris' half wookie arse.
For the rest of us who want to play something that actually has a story, a real different gaming experience that doesnt just involve grinding wolf cubs and a hand holding quest system, I will see you in game.
In short, this may be the alcohol talking but I hereby pre label all you whining little apron string bearing, overzealous, wannabe leetists the true NERFHERDERS.
Nerfherder: <Nurf hurter> a person or persons who consistantly whine, cry or otherwise annoy game developers by complaining that class x is too tough because they can't faceroll in response and overpower. Also someone who bellyaches because they think graphics engines in mmorpg's should be on par with Crysis etc, yet they haven't a clue as to how much raw processing power it takes to make this a possibility.
Now regarding the post below Gman3 has a point. Would we speak about Pong/PacMan and so on, graphics wouldn't matter that much. However for an MMO they are very important. It's the way to display the world to the player. Part of the MMO objectives is to immerse the player in a virtual world. If the player don't like the graphics then it can be a huge handicap in the fun factor.
Originally posted by GMan3
Originally posted by Githern
When will people get it through their thick skulls, games are about GAMEplay, not looks? It's in the freakin word for god sakes.
Like it or not Githern, looks do matter. Not as much as how a game plays, but it is still important. A good example of this for me at least is WoW. Decent game play but so dang ugly I would NEVER pay for it myself. Granted, a good look will not make a game, but it certainly doesn't hurt either.
For myself though, I think the look of this game could be a little better, but I like it just fine right now too.
Originally posted by GMan3
Originally posted by Githern
When will people get it through their thick skulls, games are about GAMEplay, not looks? It's in the freakin word for god sakes.
Like it or not Githern, looks do matter. Not as much as how a game plays, but it is still important. A good example of this for me at least is WoW. Decent game play but so dang ugly I would NEVER pay for it myself. Granted, a good look will not make a game, but it certainly doesn't hurt either.
For myself though, I think the look of this game could be a little better, but I like it just fine right now too.
People complaining about the graphics sucking would be the first to complain that they were getting lag whenever you had more then 10 players in one spot.
Aion has great graphics until you PvP in the abyss at a fort raid, then you have to turn everything to min. and it looks 100x's worst then SWTOR. A lot of people in Aion have to turn off the models all together so you don't even see your team mates or the enemy if there more then 10 feet away from you.
The graphics in SWTOR are a lot better then WOW graphics, the graphics in SWTOR are copying the art style of the Series "The Clone Wars" on Cartoon Network (which by the way is a good series)...
As others have said Game play trumps Graphics... Case in point Final Fantasy Online. That said I think the graphics are pretty cool looking.....
Now regarding the post below Gman3 has a point. Would we speak about Pong/PacMan and so on, graphics wouldn't matter that much. However for an MMO they are very important. It's the way to display the world to the player. Part of the MMO objectives is to immerse the player in a virtual world. If the player don't like the graphics then it can be a huge handicap in the fun factor.
Originally posted by GMan3
Originally posted by Githern
When will people get it through their thick skulls, games are about GAMEplay, not looks? It's in the freakin word for god sakes.
Like it or not Githern, looks do matter. Not as much as how a game plays, but it is still important. A good example of this for me at least is WoW. Decent game play but so dang ugly I would NEVER pay for it myself. Granted, a good look will not make a game, but it certainly doesn't hurt either.
For myself though, I think the look of this game could be a little better, but I like it just fine right now too.
Originally posted by GMan3
Originally posted by Githern
When will people get it through their thick skulls, games are about GAMEplay, not looks? It's in the freakin word for god sakes.
Like it or not Githern, looks do matter. Not as much as how a game plays, but it is still important. A good example of this for me at least is WoW. Decent game play but so dang ugly I would NEVER pay for it myself. Granted, a good look will not make a game, but it certainly doesn't hurt either.
For myself though, I think the look of this game could be a little better, but I like it just fine right now too.
They aren't important only for MMO's. RPG's in general really because you like to see a lush world. TOR's graphics are really pretty high up for an MMO. I can't name many that look better apart from maybe AoC and TERA.
Yeah graphics are important. I don't want to be completely crappy but they don't need to be top of the line super graphics ala Crysis either, as long as they are good i'm okay with it.
I still like to play the duke nuke em and the Wolfenstien games from time to time. Granted the graphics are bad now but that doesn't stop me from playing em. I play old games because of the game play way more then the graphics. Heck I still play The longest journey even though it's graphics are not great for this time period.
I'm focusing way more on the story aspect of this game then anything else. Everything else is just gravy to me. I miss great stories in games. I'm replaying Single player games instead of MMOs for the story aspect. Now once the two are together i'm gonna be hook on MMOs again. All i need is the graphics to be good, which this game has far exceeded that requirement for me.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
If graphics are so important how come all you guys complaining aren't playing Age of Conan? It has the best graphics of any MMO plus boobies... Seems to me you guys should be playing that right now....
If graphics are so important how come all you guys complaining aren't playing Age of Conan? It has the best graphics of any MMO plus boobies... Seems to me you guys should be playing that right now....
big juicey boobies
Playing: Smite, Marvel Heroes Played: Nexus:Kingdom of the Winds, Everquest, DAoC, Everquest 2, WoW, Matrix Online, Vangaurd, SWG, DDO, EVE, Fallen Earth, LoTRo, CoX, Champions Online, WAR, Darkfall, Mortal Online, Guild Wars, Rift, Tera, Aion, AoC, Gods and Heroes, DCUO, FF14, TSW, SWTOR, GW2, Wildstar, ESO, ArcheAge Waiting On: Nothing. Mmorpg's are dead.
i agree a visually beautiful game is a great experience, but great graphics go right out the window if the game you are playing is boring/ frustrateing to play. i have played aion, and conan, and found both stunning, yet left both games. the graphics are important, but still secondary to needing the game to be the real draw.
I don't know if your proving your point at all with that video coz most of those games shown are still fun to play today and many peopel do use emulators to play them.
If graphics are so important how come all you guys complaining aren't playing Age of Conan? It has the best graphics of any MMO plus boobies... Seems to me you guys should be playing that right now....
Because even though graphics are important, they aren't all important. A game has to offer visuals but it also has to offer content. The only good thing about AoC is its graphics and its ridiculous healers. It brings nothing else to the table.
Did anyone post how horrible the graphics look b/c it does. I mean out of all the highly anticipated games coming out soon, SWTOR looks the worst. Skill animations look also pretty lame. Comparing it to WOW's graphics, since it's so outdated now, I don't see that much of a difference. I mean other than it being Star Wars, I don't kno why so many people are so excited about this game, other than being Star Wars. Let's pretend this game wasn't Star Wars, would you be still so hyped about it. I kno hard it would be to forget the "Star Wars" part of it all but try very hard.
For me the major attraction is that the game is made by Bioware. I loved the KOTOR games, so that feeds into it too. In all honestly I will probably play TOR like a single player game, completing the stories and quests. If I want decent visuals, PvP or fun gameplay I'll be playing something else.
not sure if a type of clutching at the last straw as some say.
Certainly not, you are right. I don't get why some are saying this. For some other companies, it can be logic but BioWare?
The time and effort that Bioware have put into the detail is starting to make the vocal minority look a tad foolish.
TOR started in dec 2005 and most analysts agree on the budget is around $100 millions. Now for comparison TabulaRasa development lasted 6 years with a budget of $105 millions.
ROLL on RELEASE,
The dev costs will be easily recovered, if this is a value for money discussion then fine but it isn't.
I care little for what they spend , but what I do know is my Bioware experiences have always been great value and professionally done. So I am struggling to accept they will fail to deliver on Graphics especially baed on what I am seeing.
First you are saying the vocal minority will look a tad foolish considering how much effort was put into TOR then you don't care how much they spend. There's something that does't work in your logic. In our economy system employees effort = $$$.
The discussion is about Graphics .... Someone else bought money into the discussion oh yes YOU did.
I am not complaining about the graphics, all i said is I have faith in Bioware and that they will deliver on the Graphics!!!
You seem to be wanting to mix me responding to off topic money comments (by yourself) and then coming back on topic (my opinion) as one in the same thing. I have to laugh I am nothing but consistent.
If you want to change the topic to has the money they have been spent in the right areas of the game well thats another discussion but as far as graphics go for me they look more than fine.
Gameplay is what is important to me , nothing else really matters.
________________________________________________________ Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
not sure if a type of clutching at the last straw as some say.
Certainly not, you are right. I don't get why some are saying this. For some other companies, it can be logic but BioWare?
The time and effort that Bioware have put into the detail is starting to make the vocal minority look a tad foolish.
TOR started in dec 2005 and most analysts agree on the budget is around $100 millions. Now for comparison TabulaRasa development lasted 6 years with a budget of $105 millions.
ROLL on RELEASE,
The dev costs will be easily recovered, if this is a value for money discussion then fine but it isn't.
I care little for what they spend , but what I do know is my Bioware experiences have always been great value and professionally done. So I am struggling to accept they will fail to deliver on Graphics especially baed on what I am seeing.
First you are saying the vocal minority will look a tad foolish considering how much effort was put into TOR then you don't care how much they spend. There's something that does't work in your logic. In our economy system employees effort = $$$.
The discussion is about Graphics .... Someone else bought money into the discussion oh yes YOU did.
I am not complaining about the graphics, all i said is I have faith in Bioware and that they will deliver on the Graphics!!!
You seem to be wanting to mix me responding to off topic money comments (by yourself) and then coming back on topic (my opinion) as one in the same thing. I have to laugh I am nothing but consistent.
If you want to change the topic to has the money they have been spent in the right areas of the game well thats another discussion but as far as graphics go for me they look more than fine.
Gameplay is what is important to me , nothing else really matters.
==> Quote: "The time and effort that Bioware have put into the detail is starting to make the vocal minority look a tad foolish."
Time and effort in our beloved civilization means money, at least for most people. Especially the one working in non charitable fields like the video gaming industry. But maybe I miss understood, what did you want to say with your time and effort mention?
I thought the graphics looked pretty good. Not earth shattering, but certainly not bad. If these graphics suck so bad, I'd hate to think what it would take to get a 'good graphics' rating.
I see a lot of excuses made or false either/or logic.
Everyone keeps saying it's all about gameplay but thats also baseless because we can only attest to the graphics at this point right? (Let's ignore there is nothing new here other than the "new" choose your own adventure format.
not sure if a type of clutching at the last straw as some say.
Certainly not, you are right. I don't get why some are saying this. For some other companies, it can be logic but BioWare?
The time and effort that Bioware have put into the detail is starting to make the vocal minority look a tad foolish.
TOR started in dec 2005 and most analysts agree on the budget is around $100 millions. Now for comparison TabulaRasa development lasted 6 years with a budget of $105 millions.
ROLL on RELEASE,
The dev costs will be easily recovered, if this is a value for money discussion then fine but it isn't.
I care little for what they spend , but what I do know is my Bioware experiences have always been great value and professionally done. So I am struggling to accept they will fail to deliver on Graphics especially baed on what I am seeing.
First you are saying the vocal minority will look a tad foolish considering how much effort was put into TOR then you don't care how much they spend. There's something that does't work in your logic. In our economy system employees effort = $$$.
The discussion is about Graphics .... Someone else bought money into the discussion oh yes YOU did.
I am not complaining about the graphics, all i said is I have faith in Bioware and that they will deliver on the Graphics!!!
You seem to be wanting to mix me responding to off topic money comments (by yourself) and then coming back on topic (my opinion) as one in the same thing. I have to laugh I am nothing but consistent.
If you want to change the topic to has the money they have been spent in the right areas of the game well thats another discussion but as far as graphics go for me they look more than fine.
Gameplay is what is important to me , nothing else really matters.
==> Quote: "The time and effort that Bioware have put into the detail is starting to make the vocal minority look a tad foolish."
Time and effort in our beloved civilization means money, at least for most people. Especially the one working in non charitable fields like the video gaming industry. But maybe I miss understood, what did you want to say with your time and effort mention?
Thread about Graphics..... Please keep on topic else youll get boring.
Stating the obvious doesn't get you brownie points, but generally the more time spent and invested will deliver a more professional finish and thats the way I see the graphics going in game...
It's the graphics that we are talking about ...
If you believe that time and effort doesn't deliver results , when the company is highly professional then thats your call.
________________________________________________________ Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
Comments
For the animations you can expect them to be polished since launch. For the models the art is set.
I couldnt disagree with the folks saying the graphics are bad more. I've played Kotor a million times and I think they went with this "art style" because it is kotor like. If you really go take the time to look at all of the gameplay footage and the screen shots on the website you'll be amazed at the level of detail.
I for one am excited. I'll be running with my group of friends at a smooth 50-60 fps expriencing what will most likely be the most polished mmo i'll ever play.
If your sad about the graphics then dont play. There will be 20 other releases this year for you to try out.
Graphics look good. Its a MMO. If you expect MMOs to look like the newest first person shooters, you are bound to be disappointed.
No such thing. The thing that sets SWTOR apart is the attempt to remove grinds, which are present in all other MMORPGs to date.
Those screenshots actually look pretty good and I'm not a fan of Clone Wars.
"I'm sorry but your mmo has been diagnosed with EA and only has X number of days to live."
When will people get it through their thick skulls, games are about GAMEplay, not looks? It's in the freakin word for god sakes.
Like it or not Githern, looks do matter. Not as much as how a game plays, but it is still important. A good example of this for me at least is WoW. Decent game play but so dang ugly I would NEVER pay for it myself. Granted, a good look will not make a game, but it certainly doesn't hurt either.
For myself though, I think the look of this game could be a little better, but I like it just fine right now too.
"If half of what you tell me is a lie, how can I believe any of it?"
For those of you who think the graphics suck, please do not buy this game.
For those of you who think the space combat sucks even though you've never experienced it firsthand, do not buy this game.
All we need on opening week is a bunch of narrow minded leetsauce jerkholes whining like theyre back in vanilla barrens.
You folks just stay wherever you are and pretend that whatever you play at the moment gives your life true meaning.
You may even find some way to make jokes about someone other than Chuck Norris' half wookie arse.
For the rest of us who want to play something that actually has a story, a real different gaming experience that doesnt just involve grinding wolf cubs and a hand holding quest system, I will see you in game.
In short, this may be the alcohol talking but I hereby pre label all you whining little apron string bearing, overzealous, wannabe leetists the true NERFHERDERS.
Nerfherder: <Nurf hurter> a person or persons who consistantly whine, cry or otherwise annoy game developers by complaining that class x is too tough because they can't faceroll in response and overpower. Also someone who bellyaches because they think graphics engines in mmorpg's should be on par with Crysis etc, yet they haven't a clue as to how much raw processing power it takes to make this a possibility.
Well I guess someone had a bad day...
Now regarding the post below Gman3 has a point. Would we speak about Pong/PacMan and so on, graphics wouldn't matter that much. However for an MMO they are very important. It's the way to display the world to the player. Part of the MMO objectives is to immerse the player in a virtual world. If the player don't like the graphics then it can be a huge handicap in the fun factor.
People complaining about the graphics sucking would be the first to complain that they were getting lag whenever you had more then 10 players in one spot.
Aion has great graphics until you PvP in the abyss at a fort raid, then you have to turn everything to min. and it looks 100x's worst then SWTOR. A lot of people in Aion have to turn off the models all together so you don't even see your team mates or the enemy if there more then 10 feet away from you.
The graphics in SWTOR are a lot better then WOW graphics, the graphics in SWTOR are copying the art style of the Series "The Clone Wars" on Cartoon Network (which by the way is a good series)...
As others have said Game play trumps Graphics... Case in point Final Fantasy Online. That said I think the graphics are pretty cool looking.....
They aren't important only for MMO's. RPG's in general really because you like to see a lush world. TOR's graphics are really pretty high up for an MMO. I can't name many that look better apart from maybe AoC and TERA.
Try watch this and then say again that graphics is not important:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PZqf5xqKgCE
Yeah graphics are important. I don't want to be completely crappy but they don't need to be top of the line super graphics ala Crysis either, as long as they are good i'm okay with it.
I still like to play the duke nuke em and the Wolfenstien games from time to time. Granted the graphics are bad now but that doesn't stop me from playing em. I play old games because of the game play way more then the graphics. Heck I still play The longest journey even though it's graphics are not great for this time period.
I'm focusing way more on the story aspect of this game then anything else. Everything else is just gravy to me. I miss great stories in games. I'm replaying Single player games instead of MMOs for the story aspect. Now once the two are together i'm gonna be hook on MMOs again. All i need is the graphics to be good, which this game has far exceeded that requirement for me.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
Now I feel old!
Thx for the great link.
If graphics are so important how come all you guys complaining aren't playing Age of Conan? It has the best graphics of any MMO plus boobies... Seems to me you guys should be playing that right now....
big juicey boobies
Playing: Smite, Marvel Heroes
Played: Nexus:Kingdom of the Winds, Everquest, DAoC, Everquest 2, WoW, Matrix Online, Vangaurd, SWG, DDO, EVE, Fallen Earth, LoTRo, CoX, Champions Online, WAR, Darkfall, Mortal Online, Guild Wars, Rift, Tera, Aion, AoC, Gods and Heroes, DCUO, FF14, TSW, SWTOR, GW2, Wildstar, ESO, ArcheAge
Waiting On: Nothing. Mmorpg's are dead.
i agree a visually beautiful game is a great experience, but great graphics go right out the window if the game you are playing is boring/ frustrateing to play. i have played aion, and conan, and found both stunning, yet left both games. the graphics are important, but still secondary to needing the game to be the real draw.
I don't know if your proving your point at all with that video coz most of those games shown are still fun to play today and many peopel do use emulators to play them.
Great link, but this thread is about MMORPG's, with character development, a persistent exporable world, roleplaying, community, commerce, etc.
FPS have nothing really to offer but an exciting and viceral experience, so yeah graphics are definitely important for thier success.
Because even though graphics are important, they aren't all important. A game has to offer visuals but it also has to offer content. The only good thing about AoC is its graphics and its ridiculous healers. It brings nothing else to the table.
For me the major attraction is that the game is made by Bioware. I loved the KOTOR games, so that feeds into it too. In all honestly I will probably play TOR like a single player game, completing the stories and quests. If I want decent visuals, PvP or fun gameplay I'll be playing something else.
The discussion is about Graphics .... Someone else bought money into the discussion oh yes YOU did.
I am not complaining about the graphics, all i said is I have faith in Bioware and that they will deliver on the Graphics!!!
You seem to be wanting to mix me responding to off topic money comments (by yourself) and then coming back on topic (my opinion) as one in the same thing. I have to laugh I am nothing but consistent.
If you want to change the topic to has the money they have been spent in the right areas of the game well thats another discussion but as far as graphics go for me they look more than fine.
Gameplay is what is important to me , nothing else really matters.
________________________________________________________
Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel
==> Quote: "The time and effort that Bioware have put into the detail is starting to make the vocal minority look a tad foolish."
Time and effort in our beloved civilization means money, at least for most people. Especially the one working in non charitable fields like the video gaming industry. But maybe I miss understood, what did you want to say with your time and effort mention?
I thought the graphics looked pretty good. Not earth shattering, but certainly not bad. If these graphics suck so bad, I'd hate to think what it would take to get a 'good graphics' rating.
I self identify as a monkey.
its 2011, why cant we have both?
I see a lot of excuses made or false either/or logic.
Everyone keeps saying it's all about gameplay but thats also baseless because we can only attest to the graphics at this point right? (Let's ignore there is nothing new here other than the "new" choose your own adventure format.
Thread about Graphics..... Please keep on topic else youll get boring.
Stating the obvious doesn't get you brownie points, but generally the more time spent and invested will deliver a more professional finish and thats the way I see the graphics going in game...
It's the graphics that we are talking about ...
If you believe that time and effort doesn't deliver results , when the company is highly professional then thats your call.
________________________________________________________
Sorcery must persist, the future is the Citadel