Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
How is it that an Indie Developer can do things like...while AAA cannot?!
Badaboom
Member UncommonPosts: 2,380
For example some of the stuff in Xsyon:
Players can build roads, clear, level, raise and lower terrain.
Constantly changing resources can be renewed or depleted.
Availability dependent on season and weather conditions.
Four seasons: Winter, Spring, Summer, Fall.
Realistic sun path and shadows.
Realistic moon cycle and moonlight.
Volumetric and dynamic layered cloud system.
Accumulating snow.
Weather effects: Rain, Snow, Hail, Sleet.
Terrain surface affects movement.
Creatures react to adverse and favorable weather.
Weather conditions affect player actions and item durability.
Characters visibly gain or lose weight and muscle.
Characters age visibly. Ageing affects character statistics.
Different swim strokes are available based on skill.
Characters achieving the Supreme Master level of craftsmanship work with the Xsyon team to introduce a crafted item of their own design
No set creature spawns or re-spawns. Animals multiply based on the current creature population. Undead never truly die, or do they?
Creatures gain experience and power, potentially evolving into legendary beings.
Creatures can overrun areas or be depleted.
Creatures gravitate towards different areas based on mood and weather.
Creatures driven to the outer reaches of the world mutate.
Creatures possess realistic loot. If you see armor or a weapon on a creature you can take it. Animals can be carved up for raw materials.
Creatures are a primary resource for crafters.
Quests are assigned from one player to another using the quest system. Tribal chiefs and leaders will have the ability to assign specific quests.
Quests are posted at town totems so that players can obtain and complete quests without requiring the quest giver to be online. Types of quests include:
Delivery of goods.
Hunting.
Gathering resources.
Crafting.
Exploration.
I know that some AAA have some of these things but come on. Do the AAA titles think that these are unwanted features?
Comments
Those are all sim/sandbox type features.
Since the AAA games tend to be themepark with a heavy emphasis on the game aspect vs. the sim aspect, I'm not sure which heavily sim-sandbox AAA game you are disappointed with for not having those features.
Simplest answer is because those don't make the big bucks....games like that aim for 1 server capped out and thats it....because thats profit for them....big companies aim for multiple servers
But a lot of those features are very atmosphere oriented. They pull you into the world. Why wouldn't a AAA company want that?
You forgot to add the "I." As in, "can do things I like." Being small always lends to inventive in business. Large companies hire CEOs and talk about projections and mention investors a lot. Which translates into spreadsheets, powerpoints, meetings and people who know who to rob your 401k while ordering new office furniture and polishing their resume make key developing choices.
I think it is because most Indie game companies are made up of gamers that really love games. Nowadays, many game design houses higher, artist and level designers, and what not from these game design schools and colleges and the people that go there are not gamers...they just wish to make money making games - they really do not care to make interesting or diverse games. We can also blame the bean counters, the publishers. I am sure they are making sure that game design houses ae sticking to a paradigm that some consider the only road map to follow. Investors are afraid to take chances.
There are numerous things, but I think the main one is Indie companies are made up of gamers that want to make a better game.
I can't agree with this, it's one of those gut feeling things where you want to believe it because it sounds reasonable. I've met some very passionate gamers working for some very large game developers, I'm talking serious nerd cred. I think the business end of it all is where it gets murky. Seems like they are trying to apply Hollywood to the video game industry.
I agree. I would love to see a hybrid 50% sanbox/50% themepark with those features. If its a polished AAA game and with enough marketing I think it could get enough subscribers. Proably never as big as WoW...but perhaps 800K.
But investors are perhaps more afraid than they need to be. A good game will be a good game. The subgenre, IMO, is less important than quality. If the developers know how to make a fun game you will recognize that when you start playing it.
Bad developers will create bad games regardless what subgenre the game is. But a team that understands fun will be able to focus on more than one subgenre and still create something a lot of players can enjoy,,,
I can honestly say that of all the people that I have met who work in this industry, I have yet to meet one that wasn't a passionate gamer interested in making better games. It is disenchanting to hear that the devs you've met left such a bad impression.
To address the OP's question:
That is a really cool list of features. Many of which actually were in UO during development and when it was released. There's a lot of reasons they are in some games and not others.
- not of interest to target audience
- reource cost of feature negatively affect resource cost of more desirable features
- many novelty features often are of interest initially and a bother as the player gets more invested
- balance issues
- not of value to most themepark games
That jsut a few. There could be plenty of reasons why that feature list isn't in other games. Xsyon is targetting the MMO sandbox crowd and, for that audience, that's probably a really cool feature list. Most of those would add little or no value to most AAA titles for most of the people in their target audience.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Because they're prioritizing game-building over world-building?
Good point made, OP.
The only thing I can think of is RISK.
Large established companies who work with big investors and/or have to deal with their EA-like overlords sadly are really having a much harder time to truly innovate like independent companies can. They need to sell their concept first, to internal and external hotshots (who often aren't even gamers themselves), invest in engines, IP licenses and hire extra people, before they can commit their studio to a hugely expensive development proces of, say, 2-4 years.
So yes, they would naturally opt for the 'safe' choices: doing exactly what has proven to sell, dipping it in a fresh and popular IP + adding one or two new, or newish, features to get people all hyped up about it.
This is, next to not being so very innovative at all, another weakness: deciding to build the game on certain popular features and mechanics at the start of the development cycle might mean having to deal with a crowd who thinks you are doing the same old thing which everybody is so tired of come launch.
This is why Indy companies will always have their own niche in the game industry: they have the advantage of being able to do things really different, which is a good thing imo.
My brand new bloggity blog.
I think I said that. But I'm all jacked up on NyQuil, so maybe I didn't...
There are very few people working in direct development of games that couldn't easily make (a lot) more money working in some other industry with the same skills. Working on games because you love games more than money is the norm for most of us.
Simple fact, though. It's still a job and still has to pay the bills. Part of "Investor Fear of Taking Chances" is that a lot more than pocket money is on the line. There are jobs, families, friends, and a whole lot of effort to organize the effort in the first place.
I agree that the devs do have passion, but many of their perceptions have been skewed through a corporate filter. They say what they gotta say to get hired, which includes a lot of yeah, yeah, uhn huh, ok, that's cool, no no seriously that's awesome. Couple that with the percentage of devs that wanna be on the level of the publishers and actually start to see and think like the publishers, and you have a gaggle of sycophants with software licenses. Not good.The publishers? They just want money, they don't care if virtual chimps throwing poop at each other for achievement points draws subs, if it makes dollars, it makes sense, problem is they're not true gamers, they also have incredible ego (as do some of the devs) and cannot stand being told something they wanna do isn't "cool" or fun. They LOVE bootlickers with a fanboi rap, and therefore can't distinguish a good dev from a bad dev that just licks a good boot. The sad part is the young guys workin their way up from like tester or something think thats how you have to be to get ahead. Sadder than that? They're right.
GO INDIES!!!!
This raises another question. Are publishers obsolete?
A lot of companies are going digital download, but if you want to be on a shelf in a brick and mortar you're creating a lot of extra work for yourself by not going through a publisher. They are much more familair with the channels, hurdles and procedures to get to box and get on that coveted endcap in a major outlet.
There isn't a "right" or "wrong" way to play, if you want to use a screwdriver to put nails into wood, have at it, simply don't complain when the guy next to you with the hammer is doing it much better and easier. - Allein
"Graphics are often supplied by Engines that (some) MMORPG's are built in" - Spuffyre
Publisher's obsolete? In a way, YES. TECHNICALLY, we can do what AAA houses do, and believe it or not a lot cheaper, because we don't have to stick to age old business practices and paradigms that have worked for decades. Like any good resistence we change the rules of engagement to be victorious. Its guerrila game production! BUT...It still ain't cheap hehe.
I know that's definitely why I am a indie dev!
I will never sell out to "the man" or a mega-corp.
My goal for Emergence Online is 1000 players. That's my "dream" goal. 100 players is plenty fine.
My goal for Emergence as a whole is to release it as a MMOPRG with 4 realms and all the features I have planned. Whether or not it is released as a MMORPG or simply a MORPG with 2 or 4 realms and only a few or all features is entirely up to how popular it becomes.
Because honestly, if people don't like it--- then it stops where it is (a minimum of being a completed, polished, fun multiplayer game) and a new project begins. (The backup would be a permadeath cyberpunk MORPG).
If being a developer means being quiet, mature, well-spoken, and disconnected from the community, then by all means do me a favor and believe I'm not one.
This.
We also don't have to re-invent the wheel because of legal problems or fears of corporate espionage and competition.
This is SO MUCH waste and theft in AAA companies...ugh! I cannot believe how much money these developer teams get, and how crappy their products are compared to indie devs who have only a fraction (or none) of the budget.
For ex. Minecraft vs [Generic Failed AAA MMO #43]
If being a developer means being quiet, mature, well-spoken, and disconnected from the community, then by all means do me a favor and believe I'm not one.
I respect that. Go forth and dev in peace.
Bonne chance.
As stated, indie companies are made by gamers for gamers.
AAA developers are games made by corporations, with the least amount of effort involved in order to get money out of players.
Was that a feature list of Xyson, or stuff that is actually in the game? Earthrise had a feature list too. They barely got half of their features in and fully-working at launch.
Could you give us Earthrise's feature lists?
I'd like to know what made it in and what didn't.
If being a developer means being quiet, mature, well-spoken, and disconnected from the community, then by all means do me a favor and believe I'm not one.
Unfortunately, no. They have updated it for launch and deleted the beta forums. Their feature list included things like vehicles and faction warfare, which did not make it into the game yet. A lot of their features were functional but felt incomplete. PvP is one example. All someone has to do is strafe and bunny-hop and they can't be killed because humans don't have the reaction times to target someone who is moving erratically.
No they think they are features that won't make them money back on their investment.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I only put in the features that I know are in. Although to be fair, not sure the aging for our characters is in yet but assume it is because it is in for the animals.