I think Rift has sold around 200-300k looking at the estimates of sales by certain sites, that is not good news for a company that has invested $50m+ into a game. That number sounds about right 1 in 3 buying the game after open beta, the big test for Trion will be next month and the retention of subs. Myself ended up buying the game despite not being it's biggest fan mainly because I haven't got anything better to play at the moment, I have had fun pvping but the side with the most healers wins it seems. IT & DM became boring after the first run, they are far to easy and the boss fights are uninspiring. I am 28 now with my Nightblade and I am starting to feel the strain of levelling, I don't think I will be resubbing this month the game just isn't for me. I hope Trion does well and can become a sustainable gaming company, I just don't see these over hyped estimates by people saying "1m+" no chance!
I think Rift has sold around 200-300k looking at the estimates of sales by certain sites, that is not good news for a company that has invested $50m+ into a game. That number sounds about right 1 in 3 buying the game after open beta, the big test for Trion will be next month and the retention of subs. Myself ended up buying the game despite not being it's biggest fan mainly because I haven't got anything better to play at the moment, I have had fun pvping but the side with the most healers wins it seems. IT & DM became boring after the first run, they are far to easy and the boss fights are uninspiring. I am 28 now with my Nightblade and I am starting to feel the strain of levelling, I don't think I will be resubbing this month the game just isn't for me. I hope Trion does well and can become a sustainable gaming company, I just don't see these over hyped estimates by people saying "1m+" no chance!
Yes if they really spent 50 million making the game there in deep. 300k x 50 bucks is only 15 million. We all know that when you put a box you you have shipping cost, also and all that. So they had to pay some of that that means they might have made 7 to 8 million return up front on the investment.
Even if they had 1 million folks buy the game, that would be 50 million minus about 8 - 10 mill for cost of getting the boxes out. There still in the hole big time.
My problem is 50 million got us that game, I have to shake my head.
The real truth is when the subs come due next month. They would have to maintain 300k subs at 19.95 a month for 7 to 8 months just to get the return on initial investment. Then your still adding cost of salary and what not. That means Actually to break even point your going to have to keep the game running minimum of 1 year 6 months. That's when you start making a profit, but you have to be at the 300k sub mark to do that.
This is complete bS...there are no 1kk paid accounts.
Who said anything about paid accounts? Aside from you that is?
Do not go off topic...you are talking about money arent you?!
You're confusing accounts created in Trion's system with subscribers. These are not the same. A good portion of those accounts were created in beta and a good portion of the people who played the beta did not like the beta and thus did not subscribe to the game.
The only thing that the 1million accounts number is indicative of, is the big interest in a game that a couple months ago few knew anything about by a totally unknown developing company. That's it, nothing more than that really.
This is complete bS...there are no 1kk paid accounts.
Who said anything about paid accounts? Aside from you that is?
Do not go off topic...you are talking about money arent you?!
You're confusing accounts created in Trion's system with subscribers. These are not the same. A good portion of those accounts were created in beta and a good portion of the people who played the beta did not like the beta and thus did not subscribe to the game.
The only thing that the 1million subscribers number is indicative of, is the big interest in a game that a couple months ago few knew anything about by a totally unknown developing company. That's it, nothing more than that really.
Most of the haters here aren't in the game playing right now. If you have actually played the game for a reasonable amount of time during beta, you'll know why it garnered so much interest. Just at the early launch, we're already seeing why this game is around to stay! Congratulations Trion!
I would personally expect none of the "haters" would be in-game playing it and would find it odd if any actually were. That would be like saying "most vegetarians aren't eating a steak right now", or "most citrus fruit haters aren't eating an orange right now". It's kind of a self-affirming statement.
While I did spend time in the Beta (3 of them altogether), I honestly could have still told you why the game garnered so much interest even if I hadn't. People were discussing the reasons all over the forums... the most prominent ones being "it's one of the few MMOs to actually be polished and ready for launch", another being "it has Rifts, which are more dynamic versions of WAR's PQ's with more influence on the surrounding area", and of course its soul trees.
Those are the three main reasons that have been given over and over and overa gain as to why people felt Rift was going to be a great release.
And they were right.
While I personally opted to not buy the game, finding it to feel too much like other games I've already played and stopped for the same reasons... I do give kudos to Trion for their achievement. Assuming its success continues long after the honeymoon period ends and the novelty wears off, I'm hoping the upshot is of Rift is to become a lesson for other developers to hold their games to similar standards of readiness upon release. Will it happen that way? I doubt it. But one can hope.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
I love how, on the forums, the guy that still lives at home and only works part-time suddenly becomes a financial genius that can track financial earnings of multi-million dollar companies.
You don't have to be a genius to see the numbers just don't add up, Rift has cost Trion upwards of $50m with Trion World's getting $100m investment in total. If Rift sell between 300-500k thats $18m-$30m minus what retailers will take + tax, Trion will hope they get more in digital sales. Trion has over 200 employees, say the average yearly wage for that is $25,000 (Being generous) thats $5m+ in wages.
100k Subs - $18m a year before tax
200k Subs - $36m a year before tax
300k Subs - $54m a year before tax
Rift will need upwards of 200k subs for over a year for the investors to get a return let alone the costs for further development of the game, if Rift doesn't have atleast 300k subs by next month it is in big trouble and will have to start laying off staff and that means a slowing down of development to improve Rift. If I had invested in Trion I would be very anxious right now.
I love how, on the forums, the guy that still lives at home and only works part-time suddenly becomes a financial genius that can track financial earnings of multi-million dollar companies.
You don't have to be a genius to see the numbers just don't add up, Rift has cost Trion upwards of $50m with Trion World's getting $100m investment in total. If Rift sell between 300-500k thats $18m-$30m minus what retailers will take + tax, Trion will hope they get more in digital sales. Trion has over 200 employees, say the average yearly wage for that is $25,000 (Being generous) thats $5m+ in wages.
100k Subs - $18m a year before tax
200k Subs - $36m a year before tax
300k Subs - $54m a year before tax
Rift will need upwards of 200k subs for over a year for the investors to get a return let alone the costs for further development of the game, if Rift doesn't have atleast 300k subs by next month it is in big trouble and will have to start laying off staff and that means a slowing down of development to improve Rift. If I had invested in Trion I would be very anxious right now.
I love how, on the forums, the guy that still lives at home and only works part-time suddenly becomes a financial genius that can track financial earnings of multi-million dollar companies.
You don't have to be a genius to see the numbers just don't add up, Rift has cost Trion upwards of $50m with Trion World's getting $100m investment in total. If Rift sell between 300-500k thats $18m-$30m minus what retailers will take + tax, Trion will hope they get more in digital sales. Trion has over 200 employees, say the average yearly wage for that is $25,000 (Being generous) thats $5m+ in wages.
100k Subs - $18m a year before tax
200k Subs - $36m a year before tax
300k Subs - $54m a year before tax
Rift will need upwards of 200k subs for over a year for the investors to get a return let alone the costs for further development of the game, if Rift doesn't have atleast 300k subs by next month it is in big trouble and will have to start laying off staff and that means a slowing down of development to improve Rift. If I had invested in Trion I would be very anxious right now.
$25,000 is far to low for an average.
Yea I was being very generous with that I'd expect alot of people will be on $60,000+ a year but I was thinking at the same time of people working in call centre's etc.
My contribution to this on-going thread. We can all accept SWToR has dropped just stupid
high amounts of money into their game. 300 MILLION by some estimates.
SWToR CEO specifically said and you can search on Massively they need 500k subs to break even
Now SWToR is about 6 times as expensive.
I honestly think Trion broke even already just from Box sales or they are really close to it.
The game is not a failure and end game is pretty intense, so I expect a ton of recurring subs.
They haven't broke even not anywhere near, the reason SWTOR has that sort of budget is because it's Bioware and they have made many times that before hand. Bioware can afford to fail with SWTOR, Mass Effect 3 will just make up the numbers however Trion doesn't have this luxury.
My contribution to this on-going thread. We can all accept SWToR has dropped just stupid
high amounts of money into their game. 300 MILLION by some estimates.
SWToR CEO specifically said and you can search on Massively they need 500k subs to break even
Now SWToR is about 6 times as expensive.
I honestly think Trion broke even already just from Box sales or they are really close to it.
The game is not a failure and end game is pretty intense, so I expect a ton of recurring subs.
I agree,I think Trion is going to earn loads of cash on this game,at release there are 99 us and eu servers and most of those are high populatet, I have no idea how many accounts you need for each server to become high but for sure they sold severl houndreds thousend copyes.
Game will do fin in the long run even if they hade to merge servers down to 20.Most games never even have 10 servers at release and make good mony for it owner.Look at Asherons Call it as never had more than 8 servers(Ithink) and is still making cash to its owner.
Where does it state that the investment has to be returned on box sales?
Where does it state that all the money put into making a game has to be returned on box sales?
Investments are just that you put your money into something that will pay you back in the long run. You don't put your money into something (stockmarket, bonds, etc.) and then go back the next day and say 'oh my money hasn't doubled? Then this investment is a complete failure'
{mod edit}
Trion is doing fine financially find something else since you can't bash box sales anymore for your theroies on what defines failure.
They haven't broke even not anywhere near, the reason SWTOR has that sort of budget is because it's Bioware and they have made many times that before hand. Bioware can afford to fail with SWTOR, Mass Effect 3 will just make up the numbers however Trion doesn't have this luxury.
What exactly do you think that other 50million dollars is being used for? Trion has 2 other
games and judging by Rift's quality these guys know how to hire non-idiots to work at a place.
These guys took 50 million dollars + WoW suggestion forums for 7 years + WAR + EQ + some
original ideas = Amazing game
I promise you SWToR better be PERFECT and I mean FLAWLESS on release or they are screwed. GW2 better be paying attention also. After what there fans put Rift through any mess up and we are going to swoop in like vultures.
Trion just literally proved you can release a game and have like 3 bugs in it and then the
best part fix those bugs within a day.
OK this is just amazing to me. There was an XP exploit. Those people got banned for the period
of time it would have taken them to get that XP, so now they can play again.
People who used the Runecrafting money exploit probably got banned for like a day or two and
WITHIN ONE day disabled the ability...fixed any economy impact..then released the ability
They haven't broke even not anywhere near, the reason SWTOR has that sort of budget is because it's Bioware and they have made many times that before hand. Bioware can afford to fail with SWTOR, Mass Effect 3 will just make up the numbers however Trion doesn't have this luxury.
What exactly do you think that other 50million dollars is being used for? Trion has 2 other
games and judging by Rift's quality these guys know how to hire non-idiots to work at a place.
These guys took 50 million dollars + WoW suggestion forums for 7 years + WAR + EQ + some
original ideas = Amazing game
I promise you SWToR better be PERFECT and I mean FLAWLESS on release or they are screwed. GW2 better be paying attention also. After what there fans put Rift through any mess up and we are going to swoop in like vultures.
Trion just literally proved you can release a game and have like 3 bugs in it and then the
best part fix those bugs within a day.
OK this is just amazing to me. There was an XP exploit. Those people got banned for the period
of time it would have taken them to get that XP, so now they can play again.
People who used the Runecrafting money exploit probably got banned for like a day or two and
WITHIN ONE day disabled the ability...fixed any economy impact..then released the ability
fixed this morning.
Whoa whoa whoa I can see some of you frothing at the mouth over this, I am just stating numbers and what Trion needs to hit. I was even being kind over some of those numbers.
RIFT (PC) is the only game to be in its final week before launch. The game added 13,000 pre-orders for a total of 59,000. Expect first week sales to be in the 75,000 to 125,000 unit range. RIFT (PC) is an MMORPG developed by Trion Worlds.
Thats by VGCharts those numbers are simply not going to keep Trion above water.
Rift servers had a first trial capacity of 1500 users per server. A Mod later added they upped that number, but my guess is that if you start with 1.5K, you don't double that.
So 2K is a safe bet. Since the game is brand new you can count 30% is on line on prime time. Everyone wants to join the fray.
6-7K per server as active players * 99 servers = 600K with but a few servers still on low pop and not reaching full server cap.
Out of 1 M accounts created 60% play the game.
Safe bet.
I prefer the 700k figure myself. I do not think Trion will release total numbers until later this month when they get the final EU figures.
Comments
as well as the game turned out, id be suprised if the number's go even higher very soon
AMD Phenom(tm) II X4 955 Processor (4 CPUs), ~3.2GHz
6142MB RAM
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 260
Antec Gaming Phenom
Windows Vista Home Premium
I think Rift has sold around 200-300k looking at the estimates of sales by certain sites, that is not good news for a company that has invested $50m+ into a game. That number sounds about right 1 in 3 buying the game after open beta, the big test for Trion will be next month and the retention of subs. Myself ended up buying the game despite not being it's biggest fan mainly because I haven't got anything better to play at the moment, I have had fun pvping but the side with the most healers wins it seems. IT & DM became boring after the first run, they are far to easy and the boss fights are uninspiring. I am 28 now with my Nightblade and I am starting to feel the strain of levelling, I don't think I will be resubbing this month the game just isn't for me. I hope Trion does well and can become a sustainable gaming company, I just don't see these over hyped estimates by people saying "1m+" no chance!
Yes if they really spent 50 million making the game there in deep. 300k x 50 bucks is only 15 million. We all know that when you put a box you you have shipping cost, also and all that. So they had to pay some of that that means they might have made 7 to 8 million return up front on the investment.
Even if they had 1 million folks buy the game, that would be 50 million minus about 8 - 10 mill for cost of getting the boxes out. There still in the hole big time.
My problem is 50 million got us that game, I have to shake my head.
The real truth is when the subs come due next month. They would have to maintain 300k subs at 19.95 a month for 7 to 8 months just to get the return on initial investment. Then your still adding cost of salary and what not. That means Actually to break even point your going to have to keep the game running minimum of 1 year 6 months. That's when you start making a profit, but you have to be at the 300k sub mark to do that.
The subscription cost for those opted for the 6 month period will be 10€ per month, not 19.
This is complete bS...there are no 1kk paid accounts.
Who said anything about paid accounts? Aside from you that is?
Do not go off topic...you are talking about money arent you?!
You're confusing accounts created in Trion's system with subscribers. These are not the same. A good portion of those accounts were created in beta and a good portion of the people who played the beta did not like the beta and thus did not subscribe to the game.
The only thing that the 1million accounts number is indicative of, is the big interest in a game that a couple months ago few knew anything about by a totally unknown developing company. That's it, nothing more than that really.
Understood! Thumbs up.
I would personally expect none of the "haters" would be in-game playing it and would find it odd if any actually were. That would be like saying "most vegetarians aren't eating a steak right now", or "most citrus fruit haters aren't eating an orange right now". It's kind of a self-affirming statement.
While I did spend time in the Beta (3 of them altogether), I honestly could have still told you why the game garnered so much interest even if I hadn't. People were discussing the reasons all over the forums... the most prominent ones being "it's one of the few MMOs to actually be polished and ready for launch", another being "it has Rifts, which are more dynamic versions of WAR's PQ's with more influence on the surrounding area", and of course its soul trees.
Those are the three main reasons that have been given over and over and overa gain as to why people felt Rift was going to be a great release.
And they were right.
While I personally opted to not buy the game, finding it to feel too much like other games I've already played and stopped for the same reasons... I do give kudos to Trion for their achievement. Assuming its success continues long after the honeymoon period ends and the novelty wears off, I'm hoping the upshot is of Rift is to become a lesson for other developers to hold their games to similar standards of readiness upon release. Will it happen that way? I doubt it. But one can hope.
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
You don't have to be a genius to see the numbers just don't add up, Rift has cost Trion upwards of $50m with Trion World's getting $100m investment in total. If Rift sell between 300-500k thats $18m-$30m minus what retailers will take + tax, Trion will hope they get more in digital sales. Trion has over 200 employees, say the average yearly wage for that is $25,000 (Being generous) thats $5m+ in wages.
100k Subs - $18m a year before tax
200k Subs - $36m a year before tax
300k Subs - $54m a year before tax
Rift will need upwards of 200k subs for over a year for the investors to get a return let alone the costs for further development of the game, if Rift doesn't have atleast 300k subs by next month it is in big trouble and will have to start laying off staff and that means a slowing down of development to improve Rift. If I had invested in Trion I would be very anxious right now.
O.o the doom and gloom posts of financial ruin!
You're late to bury this game this time, what happened?
$25,000 is far to low for an average.
Yea I was being very generous with that I'd expect alot of people will be on $60,000+ a year but I was thinking at the same time of people working in call centre's etc.
My contribution to this on-going thread. We can all accept SWToR has dropped just stupid
high amounts of money into their game. 300 MILLION by some estimates.
SWToR CEO specifically said and you can search on Massively they need 500k subs to break even
Now SWToR is about 6 times as expensive.
I honestly think Trion broke even already just from Box sales or they are really close to it.
The game is not a failure and end game is pretty intense, so I expect a ton of recurring subs.
They haven't broke even not anywhere near, the reason SWTOR has that sort of budget is because it's Bioware and they have made many times that before hand. Bioware can afford to fail with SWTOR, Mass Effect 3 will just make up the numbers however Trion doesn't have this luxury.
I doubt Bioware can afford to fail. If they do, they'll become the next Mythic and get absorbed by the EA sponge.
I agree,I think Trion is going to earn loads of cash on this game,at release there are 99 us and eu servers and most of those are high populatet, I have no idea how many accounts you need for each server to become high but for sure they sold severl houndreds thousend copyes.
Game will do fin in the long run even if they hade to merge servers down to 20.Most games never even have 10 servers at release and make good mony for it owner.Look at Asherons Call it as never had more than 8 servers(Ithink) and is still making cash to its owner.
{Mod edit}
Where does it state that the investment has to be returned on box sales?
Where does it state that all the money put into making a game has to be returned on box sales?
Investments are just that you put your money into something that will pay you back in the long run. You don't put your money into something (stockmarket, bonds, etc.) and then go back the next day and say 'oh my money hasn't doubled? Then this investment is a complete failure'
{mod edit}
Trion is doing fine financially find something else since you can't bash box sales anymore for your theroies on what defines failure.
What exactly do you think that other 50million dollars is being used for? Trion has 2 other
games and judging by Rift's quality these guys know how to hire non-idiots to work at a place.
These guys took 50 million dollars + WoW suggestion forums for 7 years + WAR + EQ + some
original ideas = Amazing game
I promise you SWToR better be PERFECT and I mean FLAWLESS on release or they are screwed. GW2 better be paying attention also. After what there fans put Rift through any mess up and we are going to swoop in like vultures.
Trion just literally proved you can release a game and have like 3 bugs in it and then the
best part fix those bugs within a day.
OK this is just amazing to me. There was an XP exploit. Those people got banned for the period
of time it would have taken them to get that XP, so now they can play again.
People who used the Runecrafting money exploit probably got banned for like a day or two and
WITHIN ONE day disabled the ability...fixed any economy impact..then released the ability
fixed this morning.
Whoa whoa whoa I can see some of you frothing at the mouth over this, I am just stating numbers and what Trion needs to hit. I was even being kind over some of those numbers.
RIFT (PC) is the only game to be in its final week before launch. The game added 13,000 pre-orders for a total of 59,000. Expect first week sales to be in the 75,000 to 125,000 unit range. RIFT (PC) is an MMORPG developed by Trion Worlds.
Thats by VGCharts those numbers are simply not going to keep Trion above water.
I prefer the 700k figure myself. I do not think Trion will release total numbers until later this month when they get the final EU figures.
Common I want to see Rift spam "1 Million Subscribers" on their Add's. That's what we need to get Rift to really take off!
How on earth do you believe Rift has sold 700k copies?
Gamebreaker T.V