It is a fair write-up on 15 minutes from someone that looks to detest themepark games and is looking for skill building and FPS/twich based combat. Most of his conclusions are based on past experiences and not TOR really, but that is to be expected with a limited noob zone experience. So I have no problem with him not being excited by that.
I am lucky enough to have a full 3 day weekend and another this weekend. So my feelings are different about the game. But opinions are fine. It helps those who are in the same boat to have more pieces to the puzzle if they are not sure about buying the game.
This is actually a very important point about all of this. He only played for a little while on a trade show. The impression he got was from the little amount of stuff he could play which in the case of TOR looks and feels too similar to other MMO's because he only touched the surface. Probably with more time you can see his opinion change or at least base his opnion with more information once he gets into the grit of the game.
I have no problem with giving impressions based on maybe a couple hours of player, hell initial impressions are some of the most important when it comes to an mmo. My problem lies when reviewers say lines like -
"I wish Bioware well, but they deserve little praise for what they’ve achieved. Blizzard did all the hard work, after all."
Somehow the reviewer seems fully qualified to say that after spending a couple hours in the game when leveling is supposed to take hundreds of hours filled with content? Sorry that line kills the entire article for me. No one can make that claim at this time, not until at least 1-2 months invested in the game seeing all their is to see and how Bioware has done it.
Humm looks like a guild wars 2 fan bashing SW:TOR in a review how new and interesting...
May I ask why SWTOR fans cannot maturely receive any not-overly-positive discussions about SWTOR?
Why must you always jump to the conclusion that if someone doesn't find the game exactly to their fancy, then they must have some agenda against SWTOR, or an agenda for some other game?
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
Seeing as almost everyone is in this weekends beta we dont need any of these fake reviews anymore, or people talking about their "friends" who are in beta showing them how different it is from WoW. You will see first hand what the game is really like come Friday.
Logic is mostly absent in these forums so dont waste ur time on the fanboys with the WoW similarity argument. Heavily instanced dungeons / battlegrounds combined with badge grinding at endgame speaks for itself. All I want to know is what else do they have at endgame to peak my interest besides open world pvp cuz if its all about the leveling and experiencing the story they could have made a badass co-op KOTOR 3 for a lot less money lol.
It is a fair write-up on 15 minutes from someone that looks to detest themepark games and is looking for skill building and FPS/twich based combat. Most of his conclusions are based on past experiences and not TOR really, but that is to be expected with a limited noob zone experience. So I have no problem with him not being excited by that.
I am lucky enough to have a full 3 day weekend and another this weekend. So my feelings are different about the game. But opinions are fine. It helps those who are in the same boat to have more pieces to the puzzle if they are not sure about buying the game.
This is actually a very important point about all of this. He only played for a little while on a trade show. The impression he got was from the little amount of stuff he could play which in the case of TOR looks and feels too similar to other MMO's because he only touched the surface. Probably with more time you can see his opinion change or at least base his opnion with more information once he gets into the grit of the game.
We may also want to keep in mind, when you work for a company where your sole purpose is playing games, its undoubtedly possibly that you're likely burned out on plenty of similar games in a particular genre.
"Oh another shooter with Halo controls" "Oh, a post apocalyptic setting, how mundane" "Look how cute, a survival zombie game" "Another themepark styled MMO, where have I seen that before?"
But, then again, can't really say much else. I'm not this person who wrote the article, and when I write mine, people will probably wonder wth I'm talking about as their impressions will undoubtedly differ. Its all relative.
I have no problem with giving impressions based on maybe a couple hours of player, hell initial impressions are some of the most important when it comes to an mmo. My problem lies when reviewers say lines like -
"I wish Bioware well, but they deserve little praise for what they’ve achieved. Blizzard did all the hard work, after all."
Somehow the reviewer seems fully qualified to say that after spending a couple hours in the game when leveling is supposed to take hundreds of hours filled with content? Sorry that line kills the entire article for me. No one can make that claim at this time, not until at least 1-2 months invested in the game seeing all their is to see and how Bioware has done it.
Does it really take hundreds of hours for someone to recognize a blatant WoW clone? You can do it in about 2 minutes just from reading about TOR's gameplay features.
Anyone who thought this game wasnt following the themepark formula is the worst kind of moron / fanboi..
No its not WOW, but its been obvious since day 1 that it is in the same neighborhood as wow / rift / aion etc etc the list goes on for ever...
Does that mean it sucks? Not at all.. I still wouldnt touch GW2 at launch.. and have 3 copies preordered for my family.. Gonna play the hell out of ToR..
I guess some people are less worried about what goes on behind studio doors, and more excited about having something new to play :)
This link is a waste of time... if you read this first please save yourself 3 minutes of your life, my 3 minutes are gone forever...
Here's the thing though. How narrow should "theme-park" be defined?
Does a theme park have to have GCDs?
Does it have to have trinity combat?
Does it have to have an interface similar to WoW?
Does it have to have quest-node leveling?
Does it have to have raids?
Does it have to have instanced dungeons?
Now for me, all of those things above are not NECESSARY for a game to be a theme park. They are how WoW and its imitators decided to create their specific theme park game. Everquest is a theme park and it had very few of the things I listed above.
When you limit "theme park" to being almost exactly like WoW, then I really think you kill your options. There are SO many different things a theme park game could do.
Honestly man I couldnt tell you. I mean I consider myself to be a "real" gamer, whatever that is.. being able to play any game ever made in the top tier of players.. Having played 1000+ games in my life, beaten many.. But as I get older, I worry less and less about all those questions you asked. I have no set parameters for what makes a game fun or not. I have had a blast playing really bad games with friends, and have had no fun at all playing some of the best games alone..
All that has taught me is.. Games are exactly like flavors of food. No 2 people are going to ever agree or feel the same about a certain restaurants famous dish.
Of course I have feelings about certain features.. I am going with ToR as my game of choice kind of sadly because of 2 things and 2 things alone. I mean GW2 looks really awesome, but the instant ressing and teleporting around the world map just COMPLETELY turn me off. Other people are salivating over those features... *shrug*
I think people would have alot more enjoyment from games if they stopped worryng so much.
I think we may be losing some perspective here. Let's go back in time to when Champions Online was in closed beta. Word began leaking out that the game had some major issues with it, mostly correct. Does anyone really, honestly feel that the critisism of ToR is anywhere near as bad? How about another one: Remember The Tabula Rasa Closed beta? Remember the massive amount of fail wails that were coming from the forums? Do they even resemble anything that's going on now?
In my opinion, no, they don't.
At this point we have all seen the media pofile of a game with serious quality issues. I used those two examples as they were the most populare whipping boys at the time. ToR is not fitting that profile. I'm sure it will have issues and I'm sure there will be lag, bugs, server crashes, login failures and much more. Despite all of that and despite all of these public-spirited posters doing there best to warn their fellow gamers of impending heartache, Tor still does not fit the observed profile of a 'bad or half cooked' game.
I realize this will have no influence upon someone liking the game or not. I just think we need to listen a bit less to the forums right now as this has become more about the posters than the game.
There is NO miracle patch.
95% of what you see in beta won't change by launch.
Hope is not a stategy. ______________________________ "This kind of topic is like one of those little cartoon boxes held up by a stick on a string, with a piece of meat under it. In other words, bait."
I have no problem with giving impressions based on maybe a couple hours of player, hell initial impressions are some of the most important when it comes to an mmo. My problem lies when reviewers say lines like -
"I wish Bioware well, but they deserve little praise for what they’ve achieved. Blizzard did all the hard work, after all."
Somehow the reviewer seems fully qualified to say that after spending a couple hours in the game when leveling is supposed to take hundreds of hours filled with content? Sorry that line kills the entire article for me. No one can make that claim at this time, not until at least 1-2 months invested in the game seeing all their is to see and how Bioware has done it.
Does it really take hundreds of hours for someone to recognize a blatant WoW clone? You can do it in about 2 minutes just from reading about TOR's gameplay features.
Sometimes its easier to see the similarities in something first before you notice the differences.
I have no problem with giving impressions based on maybe a couple hours of player, hell initial impressions are some of the most important when it comes to an mmo. My problem lies when reviewers say lines like -
"I wish Bioware well, but they deserve little praise for what they’ve achieved. Blizzard did all the hard work, after all."
Somehow the reviewer seems fully qualified to say that after spending a couple hours in the game when leveling is supposed to take hundreds of hours filled with content? Sorry that line kills the entire article for me. No one can make that claim at this time, not until at least 1-2 months invested in the game seeing all their is to see and how Bioware has done it.
Does it really take hundreds of hours for someone to recognize a blatant WoW clone? You can do it in about 2 minutes just from reading about TOR's gameplay features.
Everyone I know who has played the game has paused me mid sentence to explain that it is NOT a wow clone. They specified that having a few aspects similar to WoW, and being a themepark doesn't make a game a clone. I'm more inclined to believe my friends who have been playing the game than some reviewer or the rampant forum calls that this is WoW 2.0.
Anyone who thought this game wasnt following the themepark formula is the worst kind of moron / fanboi..
No its not WOW, but its been obvious since day 1 that it is in the same neighborhood as wow / rift / aion etc etc the list goes on for ever...
Does that mean it sucks? Not at all.. I still wouldnt touch GW2 at launch.. and have 3 copies preordered for my family.. Gonna play the hell out of ToR..
I guess some people are less worried about what goes on behind studio doors, and more excited about having something new to play :)
This link is a waste of time... if you read this first please save yourself 3 minutes of your life, my 3 minutes are gone forever...
Here's the thing though. How narrow should "theme-park" be defined?
Does a theme park have to have GCDs?
Does it have to have trinity combat?
Does it have to have an interface similar to WoW?
Does it have to have quest-node leveling?
Does it have to have raids?
Does it have to have instanced dungeons?
Now for me, all of those things above are not NECESSARY for a game to be a theme park. They are how WoW and its imitators decided to create their specific theme park game. Everquest is a theme park and it had very few of the things I listed above.
When you limit "theme park" to being almost exactly like WoW, then I really think you kill your options. There are SO many different things a theme park game could do.
Honestly man I couldnt tell you. I mean I consider myself to be a "real" gamer, whatever that is.. being able to play any game ever made in the top tier of players.. Having played 1000+ games in my life, beaten many.. But as I get older, I worry less and less about all those questions you asked. I have no set parameters for what makes a game fun or not. I have had a blast playing really bad games with friends, and have had no fun at all playing some of the best games alone..
All that has taught me is.. Games are exactly like flavors of food. No 2 people are going to ever agree or feel the same about a certain restaurants famous dish.
Of course I have feelings about certain features.. I am going with ToR as my game of choice kind of sadly because of 2 things and 2 things alone. I mean GW2 looks really awesome, but the instant ressing and teleporting around the world map just COMPLETELY turn me off. Other people are salivating over those features... *shrug*
I think people would have alot more enjoyment from games if they stopped worryng so much.
Can't argue with that, different strokes and all. The only point I was trying to make was that "Theme Park" as a subgenre should probably not be limited to being almost exactly like WoW.
Once again, different strokes, some people like the WoW formula I'm sure, but others would like to see it improved. Just like how WoW did with EQ. WoW looked at EQ and tried to improve on several aspects of the game, creating something unique in the process.
Seeing as almost everyone is in this weekends beta we dont need any of these fake reviews anymore, or people talking about their "friends" who are in beta showing them how different it is from WoW. You will see first hand what the game is really like come Friday.
Logic is mostly absent in these forums so dont waste ur time on the fanboys with the WoW similarity argument. Heavily instanced dungeons / battlegrounds combined with badge grinding at endgame speaks for itself. All I want to know is what else do they have at endgame to peak my interest besides open world pvp cuz if its all about the leveling and experiencing the story they could have made a badass co-op KOTOR 3 for a lot less money lol.
Only a small fraction got into this weekend so pretty much everything else you said is moot, except the point about try for yourself rather than rely on others impressions.
Lately i have huge doubts about the game whether it's for me or not, some of them through reviews but mostly through the leak information all over the web. That wont stop me buying the game and seeing for myself but it certainly makes me doubtful.
Humm looks like a guild wars 2 fan bashing SW:TOR in a review how new and interesting...
May I ask why SWTOR fans cannot maturely receive any not-overly-positive discussions about SWTOR?
Why must you always jump to the conclusion that if someone doesn't find the game exactly to their fancy, then they must have some agenda against SWTOR, or an agenda for some other game?
IMO it is not that simple. First, it is "some" fans, not all, and it is the same for every game. Every game has some of those type of fans. Just the way it is.
And many conclusions are based on pre-conceived notions, expectations of the future and past experiences. They tend not to be just based on game experience and lack objectivity. So many tend to have an agenda, even if it isn't intentional. If you can't stand the current themepark features, you will bash a game that is based on those. If you see a game that is trying to break the mold, you will have a much more possitive feeling about an experience.
How many people long for that "past, simpler, and better world," I wonder, without ever recognizing the truth that perhaps it was they who were simpler and better, and not the world about them? R.A.Salvatore
So much condemnation, from so little, sub-par hands-on time with starting characters ...
He didn't even get to do a flashpoint and rants about seeing too many quests ...
He just stumbled around for a bit (getting stuck and crashing) near his character's spawning point with some basic low level skills, yet he's seen and experienced enough to condemn the combat system ...
MY mommy taught me to "never judge a book by its cover" ...
Ah well, bashing a highly anticipated game like that will generate a shitloads of hits I reckon.
I for one, shall wait with granting reviews any solid credibility untill the NDA is dropped and people who have months of beta exposure on their retinas will have their say.
If those people will echo this negativity (based on actual SOLID gameplay experience), I shall tremble.
Agreed, there is still a huge audience(I think) for the wow-esque type MMO.
Should be somewhere in the neighborhood of eleven million or so.
I doubt that anyone who doesn't dwell on this forum is terribly worried about it.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Good article, illustrating what i've heard about the game so far.
Instead of bringing back fun again into a genre suffering from 10+ years old mechanics and concepts, Bioware thinks that putting cutscenes into their game would be enough innovation (and i give them 2 weeks until folks cry for a fast forward button to skip them).
But i doubt that the CloneWars theme hits for 6mio+ in Asia like WoW did.
If they never open in Asia, that's a pretty sure bet.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Humm looks like a guild wars 2 fan bashing SW:TOR in a review how new and interesting...
May I ask why SWTOR fans cannot maturely receive any not-overly-positive discussions about SWTOR?
Why must you always jump to the conclusion that if someone doesn't find the game exactly to their fancy, then they must have some agenda against SWTOR, or an agenda for some other game?
IMO it is not that simple. First, it is "some" fans, not all, and it is the same for every game. Every game has some of those type of fans. Just the way it is.
I'm sorry, but it seems most fans on this forums are your "some" fans. Or perhaps it is only these "some" fans that populate the MMORPG forums and the cool, reasonable fans are off elsewhere?
I mean take a stroll through the threads here. People are accused of trolling, being ADHD kiddies, and worse simply for having different opinions than the norm. It isn't a mature way to behave with someone who simply has commited the heinous crime of having a different opinion.
It's true that all games have these types of people, but this issue is amplified when it comes to SWTOR IMO. I mean read through the comments on the recent article at Massively. Appalling.
And many conclusions are based on pre-conceived notions, expectations of the future and past experiences.
Can you honestly fault people for that? We don't live in a vacuum so for someone to evaluate a product based on the same is a preposterous notion.
They tend not to be just based on game experience and lack objectivity.
Couldn't that be said about a fan-nerd who is so high on hype that he lambasts anyone who disagrees with him? In fact, usually, this type of person is given a pass. Why? He is just as bad as the troll who posts outrageous claims to incite a reaction.
So many tend to have an agenda, even if it isn't intentional. If you can't stand the current themepark features, you will bash a game that is based on those.
This is so much more than what preference one has for what. As I stated, even the slightest criticism, or doubt is met with outright hostility, or utter derisive condescension.
If you see a game that is trying to break the mold, you will have a much more possitive feeling about an experience.
And what if one can't see that? I mean, to make such a decision takes a full understanding of what's in store. And it's not as if BW has been forthcoming with information.
See artemisentr4, I appreciate your civility, but even in your post, I get the feeling that you regard anyone who doesn't share your enthusiasm and belief for SWTOR and its allleged greatness with utter disbelief and ridicule. Why is that?
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
Well I have logged several hours in beta and have had a lot of fun. I'm tired of reviewers stating that without twitch combat you can't get that Star Wars feeling. Way off IMO. I'm not going to break the NDA, but just say that those comparing the game to WOW are way off. In fact those comparing SWToR to any current MMO are way off. The game reminds me of three other games that I won't mention, none of them are MMO's. Another poster on this thread hit the nail on the head without realizing it and I will leave it at that. A good number of people will absolutely love this game, and good number will hate it for what it is, or represents I guess. Sad. BW has done an amazing job IMO
I seem to recall not to long ago complaints against SOE because they,amongst other things, changed a game they loved to twitched based combat. Why the sudden change in tune?
I seem to recall not to long ago complaints against SOE because they,amongst other things, changed a game they loved to twitched based combat. Why the sudden change in tune?
Long agendas and short memories.
There is NO miracle patch.
95% of what you see in beta won't change by launch.
Hope is not a stategy. ______________________________ "This kind of topic is like one of those little cartoon boxes held up by a stick on a string, with a piece of meat under it. In other words, bait."
Anyone who thought this game wasnt following the themepark formula is the worst kind of moron / fanboi..
No its not WOW, but its been obvious since day 1 that it is in the same neighborhood as wow / rift / aion etc etc the list goes on for ever...
Does that mean it sucks? Not at all.. I still wouldnt touch GW2 at launch.. and have 3 copies preordered for my family.. Gonna play the hell out of ToR..
I guess some people are less worried about what goes on behind studio doors, and more excited about having something new to play :)
This link is a waste of time... if you read this first please save yourself 3 minutes of your life, my 3 minutes are gone forever...
EDIT: There is a hilarious part of the review, where he whines about having to buy skills, because running all the way back to town and not having enough money to buy skills is a time sink... LMAO WHO DOES THIS HAPPEN TO?!?! Omg you would have to be the most epic failure of a mmorpg player to have this happen... never once have I been that poor in an MMO.. the first thing you figure out beyond controls and what not is the damn economy...
Firstly, its not about following the themepark model that infuriates the author or the thousands of other MMO vets, its the fact that SWToR implements even the smallest annoying issues with themepark games like WoW. Contrary to what you might believe there are serious issues with those types of games and the author described in perfect detail why it makes the themepark genre archaic and bland.
Secondly, bravo if you dont want to play GW2, im sure the game will get along just fine without you, just as surely that SWToR will get along jsut fine without me, as I dont intend to touch the game with a 10 ft pole. It doesnt take a rocket surgeon to figure out that SWToR will be a WoW clone.
Thirdly, yes it happens all the time in every game that you will run into situations where you wont have the gold to purchase newly aquired skills, dont be so naive to think otherwise. The only time I have never had that problem is when I use gold from my main to fund an alt, and do not call me stupid because it happened to me. It happens all the time but the main thing you are missing is that this archaic fundemental flaw in implementing artifical time sinks is stupid and idiotic and that is what the author is trying to showcase.
Playing: GW2 Waiting on: TESO Next Flop: Planetside 2 Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
Well I nave logged several hours beta and have had a lot of fun. I'm tired of reviewers stating that without twitch combat you can't get that Star Wars feeling. Way off IMO. I'm not going to break the NDA, but just say that those comparing the game to WOW are way off. Infect those comparing this to any Curresnt MMO are way off. The game reminds me of three other games that I won't mention, none of them are MMO's another poster on this thread hit the nail on the head without realizing it and I will leave it at that. A good number of people will absolutely love this game, and good number will hate what it is, or represents I guess. Sad. BW has done an amazing job IMO
Same here,
I find it bordering on hilarious at this point, SO many people are trying to bash the HELL out of SWTOR and make really bold claims that are negative, with little to no real time with the game. I have played the game through several builds, I have friends who have done the same, none of us have anything truly negative to say about the game. In fact it's all mostly positive, there were bugs and performance issues before the latest build but this is all public knowledge now so I'm not breaking NDA by stating so. I was not somebody who was looking forward to this game by any means, for quite some time. It wasn't until about the last year that I really took an interest in it and I'm glad I did. The game is fantastic, fun, it's got it's innovations and BioWare never claimed that it would be the most innovative game ever in regard to mechanics. I don't really know WHAT people are hoping to get out of this game, OR Guild Wars 2. I have played both games, GW2 on the show floor and SWTOR in beta and the show floor. GW2 is NOT great which is another thing that cracks me up about this article and the people trying to basically snap the hype up from SWTOR and place it onto the next offering for the genre. If you're disappointed in SWTOR, you WILL be disappointed in GW2, no question about that one at all. If you find SWTOR's innovations to be minimalistic and next to nothing than GW2 will make you cry. Between the two from personal experience, SWTOR wins the cake easily. I'm being completely honest here.
I seem to recall not to long ago complaints against SOE because they,amongst other things, changed a game they loved to twitched based combat. Why the sudden change in tune?
There were some who thought SWG should have had twitch combat mechanics from the beginning. I was not one of those and left when the NGE hit. Came a back few times. The NGE was some weierd twitch wannabe anyways. Never worked. If SWToR was twitch then I wouldn't even being posting nor care about the game as I would have no intention of playing. Happily it is standard RPG mechanics.
Comments
This is actually a very important point about all of this. He only played for a little while on a trade show. The impression he got was from the little amount of stuff he could play which in the case of TOR looks and feels too similar to other MMO's because he only touched the surface. Probably with more time you can see his opinion change or at least base his opnion with more information once he gets into the grit of the game.
I have no problem with giving impressions based on maybe a couple hours of player, hell initial impressions are some of the most important when it comes to an mmo. My problem lies when reviewers say lines like -
"I wish Bioware well, but they deserve little praise for what they’ve achieved. Blizzard did all the hard work, after all."
Somehow the reviewer seems fully qualified to say that after spending a couple hours in the game when leveling is supposed to take hundreds of hours filled with content? Sorry that line kills the entire article for me. No one can make that claim at this time, not until at least 1-2 months invested in the game seeing all their is to see and how Bioware has done it.
My Guild Wars 2 Vids
May I ask why SWTOR fans cannot maturely receive any not-overly-positive discussions about SWTOR?
Why must you always jump to the conclusion that if someone doesn't find the game exactly to their fancy, then they must have some agenda against SWTOR, or an agenda for some other game?
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
I need to take this advice more.
Seeing as almost everyone is in this weekends beta we dont need any of these fake reviews anymore, or people talking about their "friends" who are in beta showing them how different it is from WoW. You will see first hand what the game is really like come Friday.
Logic is mostly absent in these forums so dont waste ur time on the fanboys with the WoW similarity argument. Heavily instanced dungeons / battlegrounds combined with badge grinding at endgame speaks for itself. All I want to know is what else do they have at endgame to peak my interest besides open world pvp cuz if its all about the leveling and experiencing the story they could have made a badass co-op KOTOR 3 for a lot less money lol.
"LOL"
We may also want to keep in mind, when you work for a company where your sole purpose is playing games, its undoubtedly possibly that you're likely burned out on plenty of similar games in a particular genre.
"Oh another shooter with Halo controls" "Oh, a post apocalyptic setting, how mundane" "Look how cute, a survival zombie game" "Another themepark styled MMO, where have I seen that before?"
But, then again, can't really say much else. I'm not this person who wrote the article, and when I write mine, people will probably wonder wth I'm talking about as their impressions will undoubtedly differ. Its all relative.
Does it really take hundreds of hours for someone to recognize a blatant WoW clone? You can do it in about 2 minutes just from reading about TOR's gameplay features.
Honestly man I couldnt tell you. I mean I consider myself to be a "real" gamer, whatever that is.. being able to play any game ever made in the top tier of players.. Having played 1000+ games in my life, beaten many.. But as I get older, I worry less and less about all those questions you asked. I have no set parameters for what makes a game fun or not. I have had a blast playing really bad games with friends, and have had no fun at all playing some of the best games alone..
All that has taught me is.. Games are exactly like flavors of food. No 2 people are going to ever agree or feel the same about a certain restaurants famous dish.
Of course I have feelings about certain features.. I am going with ToR as my game of choice kind of sadly because of 2 things and 2 things alone. I mean GW2 looks really awesome, but the instant ressing and teleporting around the world map just COMPLETELY turn me off. Other people are salivating over those features... *shrug*
I think people would have alot more enjoyment from games if they stopped worryng so much.
I think we may be losing some perspective here. Let's go back in time to when Champions Online was in closed beta. Word began leaking out that the game had some major issues with it, mostly correct. Does anyone really, honestly feel that the critisism of ToR is anywhere near as bad? How about another one: Remember The Tabula Rasa Closed beta? Remember the massive amount of fail wails that were coming from the forums? Do they even resemble anything that's going on now?
In my opinion, no, they don't.
At this point we have all seen the media pofile of a game with serious quality issues. I used those two examples as they were the most populare whipping boys at the time. ToR is not fitting that profile. I'm sure it will have issues and I'm sure there will be lag, bugs, server crashes, login failures and much more. Despite all of that and despite all of these public-spirited posters doing there best to warn their fellow gamers of impending heartache, Tor still does not fit the observed profile of a 'bad or half cooked' game.
I realize this will have no influence upon someone liking the game or not. I just think we need to listen a bit less to the forums right now as this has become more about the posters than the game.
There is NO miracle patch.
95% of what you see in beta won't change by launch.
Hope is not a stategy.
______________________________
"This kind of topic is like one of those little cartoon boxes held up by a stick on a string, with a piece of meat under it. In other words, bait."
Sometimes its easier to see the similarities in something first before you notice the differences.
Everyone I know who has played the game has paused me mid sentence to explain that it is NOT a wow clone. They specified that having a few aspects similar to WoW, and being a themepark doesn't make a game a clone. I'm more inclined to believe my friends who have been playing the game than some reviewer or the rampant forum calls that this is WoW 2.0.
/shrug
Can't argue with that, different strokes and all. The only point I was trying to make was that "Theme Park" as a subgenre should probably not be limited to being almost exactly like WoW.
Once again, different strokes, some people like the WoW formula I'm sure, but others would like to see it improved. Just like how WoW did with EQ. WoW looked at EQ and tried to improve on several aspects of the game, creating something unique in the process.
This is all I really want. The next evolution.
Are you team Azeroth, team Tyria, or team Jacob?
Only a small fraction got into this weekend so pretty much everything else you said is moot, except the point about try for yourself rather than rely on others impressions.
Lately i have huge doubts about the game whether it's for me or not, some of them through reviews but mostly through the leak information all over the web. That wont stop me buying the game and seeing for myself but it certainly makes me doubtful.
IMO it is not that simple. First, it is "some" fans, not all, and it is the same for every game. Every game has some of those type of fans. Just the way it is.
And many conclusions are based on pre-conceived notions, expectations of the future and past experiences. They tend not to be just based on game experience and lack objectivity. So many tend to have an agenda, even if it isn't intentional. If you can't stand the current themepark features, you will bash a game that is based on those. If you see a game that is trying to break the mold, you will have a much more possitive feeling about an experience.
How many people long for that "past, simpler, and better world," I wonder, without ever recognizing the truth that perhaps it was they who were simpler and better, and not the world about them?
R.A.Salvatore
Yeah right ...
So much condemnation, from so little, sub-par hands-on time with starting characters ...
He didn't even get to do a flashpoint and rants about seeing too many quests ...
He just stumbled around for a bit (getting stuck and crashing) near his character's spawning point with some basic low level skills, yet he's seen and experienced enough to condemn the combat system ...
MY mommy taught me to "never judge a book by its cover" ...
Ah well, bashing a highly anticipated game like that will generate a shitloads of hits I reckon.
I for one, shall wait with granting reviews any solid credibility untill the NDA is dropped and people who have months of beta exposure on their retinas will have their say.
If those people will echo this negativity (based on actual SOLID gameplay experience), I shall tremble.
My brand new bloggity blog.
Should be somewhere in the neighborhood of eleven million or so.
I doubt that anyone who doesn't dwell on this forum is terribly worried about it.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
Good article, illustrating what i've heard about the game so far.
Instead of bringing back fun again into a genre suffering from 10+ years old mechanics and concepts, Bioware thinks that putting cutscenes into their game would be enough innovation (and i give them 2 weeks until folks cry for a fast forward button to skip them).
The game is just another missed opportunity.
Yes, there may still be a huge audience for the wow-type of game.
But i doubt that the CloneWars theme hits for 6mio+ in Asia like WoW did.
If they never open in Asia, that's a pretty sure bet.
Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
I need to take this advice more.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
Long agendas and short memories.
There is NO miracle patch.
95% of what you see in beta won't change by launch.
Hope is not a stategy.
______________________________
"This kind of topic is like one of those little cartoon boxes held up by a stick on a string, with a piece of meat under it. In other words, bait."
Firstly, its not about following the themepark model that infuriates the author or the thousands of other MMO vets, its the fact that SWToR implements even the smallest annoying issues with themepark games like WoW. Contrary to what you might believe there are serious issues with those types of games and the author described in perfect detail why it makes the themepark genre archaic and bland.
Secondly, bravo if you dont want to play GW2, im sure the game will get along just fine without you, just as surely that SWToR will get along jsut fine without me, as I dont intend to touch the game with a 10 ft pole. It doesnt take a rocket surgeon to figure out that SWToR will be a WoW clone.
Thirdly, yes it happens all the time in every game that you will run into situations where you wont have the gold to purchase newly aquired skills, dont be so naive to think otherwise. The only time I have never had that problem is when I use gold from my main to fund an alt, and do not call me stupid because it happened to me. It happens all the time but the main thing you are missing is that this archaic fundemental flaw in implementing artifical time sinks is stupid and idiotic and that is what the author is trying to showcase.
Everything you need to know about Elder Scrolls Online
Playing: GW2
Waiting on: TESO
Next Flop: Planetside 2
Best MMO of all time: Asheron's Call - The first company to recreate AC will be the next greatest MMO.
Same here,
I find it bordering on hilarious at this point, SO many people are trying to bash the HELL out of SWTOR and make really bold claims that are negative, with little to no real time with the game. I have played the game through several builds, I have friends who have done the same, none of us have anything truly negative to say about the game. In fact it's all mostly positive, there were bugs and performance issues before the latest build but this is all public knowledge now so I'm not breaking NDA by stating so. I was not somebody who was looking forward to this game by any means, for quite some time. It wasn't until about the last year that I really took an interest in it and I'm glad I did. The game is fantastic, fun, it's got it's innovations and BioWare never claimed that it would be the most innovative game ever in regard to mechanics. I don't really know WHAT people are hoping to get out of this game, OR Guild Wars 2. I have played both games, GW2 on the show floor and SWTOR in beta and the show floor. GW2 is NOT great which is another thing that cracks me up about this article and the people trying to basically snap the hype up from SWTOR and place it onto the next offering for the genre. If you're disappointed in SWTOR, you WILL be disappointed in GW2, no question about that one at all. If you find SWTOR's innovations to be minimalistic and next to nothing than GW2 will make you cry. Between the two from personal experience, SWTOR wins the cake easily. I'm being completely honest here.
There were some who thought SWG should have had twitch combat mechanics from the beginning. I was not one of those and left when the NGE hit. Came a back few times. The NGE was some weierd twitch wannabe anyways. Never worked. If SWToR was twitch then I wouldn't even being posting nor care about the game as I would have no intention of playing. Happily it is standard RPG mechanics.