Are you guys blind or what? Or is it just bashing for bashings sake?
Both. They are blind, and just bashing for the sake of bashing. No one with any amount of sense could say those animations are bad. TOR has the best animations of any combat I can recall in an MMO.
I'd say AOC has it beat, and IMO SWG's original animations were off the hook, pikeman and TK especially followed closely by my main profession fencer.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I think the melee choreography looks good, when everyone is in the proper place. It falls appart for me, when people are not in the right place.
I like a lot of the range combat animations, but I really dislike the way it all looks in action -- as the range just seems silly. It is as if they are fighting with 18th century firearms, with limited range and accuracy.
The animations lack any sort of flow whatsoever and this has been a complaint from the earliest demo videos. Are they passable? Yeah.
Not really my style though. And frankly, I think it's shameful for a 2011 game, but what can you do.
Oh, and let me just add how jarring it is to lightsabers hit the target and nothing happens. Talk about uninspired and stupid. Also, LMAO at the comment, "Do the NPC in this game ever move?????? Do they have any AI?????? They are so freaking boring,? just stand still... pew pew pew......"
Yeah I agree.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
Fanboys must be blind or something. Ive played sith sorceror and when he is casing he stands still in dumb pose. Wow' s animation is ten times more smooth.
Both. They are blind, and just bashing for the sake of bashing. No one with any amount of sense could say those animations are bad. TOR has the best animations of any combat I can recall in an MMO.
LOL, seriously? Better than WoW of course, no question. Better than LOTRO.. but those are the only two I can even think of that are more boring, unless you count first gen MMOs like EQ and DAOC.
true.. although most of these type of MMO's animations are pretty bad anyway.. watch osme videos of vindictus http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGkOqPkyf-s although its more along the lines of guild wars 1 type game it does how some very good combat animations... it is an action mmo though. But many of these free ones do have pretty good if not in many cases better animations than swtor although besides some pretty animations and usually big boobs those games don't really offer much. I will say star wars animations are passable with some great ones and some really bad ones but for anyone who sees them as insanly good is really kidding themself.
Both. They are blind, and just bashing for the sake of bashing. No one with any amount of sense could say those animations are bad. TOR has the best animations of any combat I can recall in an MMO.
LOL, seriously? Better than WoW of course, no question. Better than LOTRO.. but those are the only two I can even think of that are more boring, unless you count first gen MMOs like EQ and DAOC.
WoW how an innate fluidity that is lacking in most games. Which puts WoW miles above SWTOR.
Of course, people might just be mistaking aesthetics/graphics for animation quality.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
WoW how an innate fluidity that is lacking in most games. Which puts WoW miles above SWTOR.
Of course, people might just be mistaking aesthetics/graphics for animation quality.
main difference is WOW like rift is much more twitch type gameplay. This make it feel much quicker and flow better. Swtor went the other way and decided to make there combat little slower and drop auto-attack. I wouldn't say either way is good or bad but it does make SWTOR feel little less fluid when you are used to the quicker gameplay most other MMOs have.
I would classify myself as a fanboi. I will love this game (at least for a while) regardless of minor issues.
That being said, I have to agree with the haters. BW was bragging about how their combat is so much more fluid than other games. And, in some cases, like lightsaber on lightsaber combat, it is more fluid. But if you put a lightsaber on a guy with a gun, it looks just a stupid as any other game; one guy stands there shooting, another guy stands there swinging.
The biggest problem is that BW was toting some revolutionary combat system, but in fact it looks the same as any other game. So, because they essentially bullcrapped us all, it seems so much worse
Edit:
Also, in addition, I think their choice to force long combat animations on players makes combat seem less fun. I feel like I push a button and just watch.
Don't get me wrong, overall, I think swtor combat is pretty good, but there are major flaws in their design
WoW how an innate fluidity that is lacking in most games. Which puts WoW miles above SWTOR.
Of course, people might just be mistaking aesthetics/graphics for animation quality.
main difference is WOW like rift is much more twitch type gameplay. This make it feel much quicker and flow better. Swtor went the other way and decided to make there combat little slower and drop auto-attack. I wouldn't say either way is good or bad but it does make SWTOR feel little less fluid when you are used to the quicker gameplay most other MMOs have.
That's a good point.
That said, I play AoC (which doesn't have autoattack) and the combat animations are pretty fluid. The whole combat in AoC is probably one of the nicer ones in the themepark MMORPG genre.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
Both. They are blind, and just bashing for the sake of bashing. No one with any amount of sense could say those animations are bad. TOR has the best animations of any combat I can recall in an MMO.
LOL, seriously? Better than WoW of course, no question. Better than LOTRO.. but those are the only two I can even think of that are more boring, unless you count first gen MMOs like EQ and DAOC.
WoW how an innate fluidity that is lacking in most games. Which puts WoW miles above SWTOR.
Of course, people might just be mistaking aesthetics/graphics for animation quality.
"Innate fluidity" - very nice wording, I've been trying to point out how important character and NPC animation fluidity is important more than once.
It's one of those things that can make or break a game, one of those things that is hard to describe for a player, when you ask him why he thinks some game "sux" or is "good"...
WoW how an innate fluidity that is lacking in most games. Which puts WoW miles above SWTOR.
Of course, people might just be mistaking aesthetics/graphics for animation quality.
QFT.
As much as I hate WoW, it did a really good job with smoothing out the animations and making them feel fluid. Sure they are all exaggerated / stylized, but that doesn't make the animation bad, just unrealistic. Not unlike what Pixar does in their movies.
I'd also agree that TOR's animations seem to all be designed for static combat, they just don't feel right when things are moving (which they almost always are). Kind of a mistake imho. It's especially noticeable during boss fights / pvp. Things feel locked, instead of free-flowing and smooth.
That said, I play AoC (which doesn't have autoattack) and the combat animations are pretty fluid. The whole combat in AoC is probably one of the nicer ones in the themepark MMORPG genre.
AoC combat ones were pretty good the deathblow animations were great but the jumping!!! like LOTRO online the jumping animation was just horrifyingly bad. But Swtor one isn't much better. I dunno why but jumping animations bother me so much when they are done bad and there are pretty awful in most MMOs
AoC combat ones were pretty good the deathblow animations were great but the jumping!!! like LOTRO online the jumping animation was just horrifyingly bad. But Swtor one isn't much better. I dunno why but jumping animations bother me so much when they are done bad and there are pretty awful in most MMOs
Yeah, it's not the greatest. It's even worse in RIFT. I don't know why but WoW is the only game where the jumping feels great.
Edit: Maybe Aion too... Can't remember Aion to be honest.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
"Memories, Like the corners of my mind Misty water-colored memories Of the way we were Scattered pictures, Of the smiles we left behind Smiles we gave to one another For the way we were
Can it be that it was all so simple then? Or has time re-written every line? If we had the chance to do it all again Tell me, would we? could we?
Memories, may be beautiful and yet Whats too painful to remember We simply choose to forget
So its the laughter We will remember Whenever we remember The way we were The way we were "
LOL, seriously? Better than WoW of course, no question. Better than LOTRO.. but those are the only two I can even think of that are more boring, unless you count first gen MMOs like EQ and DAOC.
WoW how an innate fluidity that is lacking in most games. Which puts WoW miles above SWTOR.
Of course, people might just be mistaking aesthetics/graphics for animation quality.
"Innate fluidity" - very nice wording, I've been trying to point out how important character and NPC animation fluidity is important more than once.
It's one of those things that can make or break a game, one of those things that is hard to describe for a player, when you ask him why he thinks some game "sux" or is "good"...
My issue with WoW animations is that there are so few of them. All my attacks seemed to be the same move over and over, interspersed with the same auto-attack over and over. It flowed well, but struck me as extremely simplistic and primitive. I'm surprised Blizzard hasn't added more animation variety over the years.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
AoC combat ones were pretty good the deathblow animations were great but the jumping!!! like LOTRO online the jumping animation was just horrifyingly bad. But Swtor one isn't much better. I dunno why but jumping animations bother me so much when they are done bad and there are pretty awful in most MMOs
Yeah, it's not the greatest. It's even worse in RIFT. I don't know why but WoW is the only game where the jumping feels great.
Edit: Maybe Aion too... Can't remember Aion to be honest.
Aion was fine although you glided most of the time with the wings anyway
LOL, seriously? Better than WoW of course, no question. Better than LOTRO.. but those are the only two I can even think of that are more boring, unless you count first gen MMOs like EQ and DAOC.
WoW how an innate fluidity that is lacking in most games. Which puts WoW miles above SWTOR.
Of course, people might just be mistaking aesthetics/graphics for animation quality.
"Innate fluidity" - very nice wording, I've been trying to point out how important character and NPC animation fluidity is important more than once.
It's one of those things that can make or break a game, one of those things that is hard to describe for a player, when you ask him why he thinks some game "sux" or is "good"...
My issue with WoW animations is that there are so few of them. All my attacks seemed to be the same move over and over, interspersed with the same auto-attack over and over. It flowed well, but struck me as extremely simplistic and primitive. I'm surprised Blizzard hasn't added more animation variety over the years.
Me too. Haven't really been following the MOP news but I recall reading that the new class, Monk, is animation-intensive... hopefully that's a sign that the combat/character models will get some sort of upgrade.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
AoC combat ones were pretty good the deathblow animations were great but the jumping!!! like LOTRO online the jumping animation was just horrifyingly bad. But Swtor one isn't much better. I dunno why but jumping animations bother me so much when they are done bad and there are pretty awful in most MMOs
Yeah, it's not the greatest. It's even worse in RIFT. I don't know why but WoW is the only game where the jumping feels great.
Edit: Maybe Aion too... Can't remember Aion to be honest.
Aion was fine although you glided most of the time with the wings anyway
Both Blade and Soul and Age of Wulin have awesome combat animations. To the OP, I do not think posting a slo mo video of SW:ToR's combat is scoring the game any points...if anything it just strengthens a lot of peoples argument that SW:ToR's combat is a boring snore fest.
so sexy.. hopefully they put more into this game than just nice looking combat.. honestly haven't really been following it much but still love the videos of the combat.
Yet another game I'm looking forward to that isn't going to be out until god knows when.. So many upcoming MMOs, and yet I look at what's actually here.. and well, there's TOR, and.. no, just TOR.
I actually misunderstood the title ,i thought the OP actually broke down some of the animations so we can see how many frames they used.Korean game and F2p are famous for going cheap,that is why their animations look so fast.I don't think many truly understand all the effort that goes into making games.That is why i get frustrated when i hear someone say something looks great when it is a rubbish effort.
Those slo mo needed to be a little slower but based on what i see ,Bioware did not put a lot of effort into the .ani frames either.I would love to see someone actually break them down into frame by frame.At some point somone might create a viewer for the game.However of course the developer in this case Bioware might not like it lol.Developers don't like any of their player base to know when they are going cheap on game design.A top quality animation would have around 20>30 .ani frames sometimes with world bosses or those special ones you will have even more..The very old original 2D based games had around 3-5.
I noticed in a few GW2 videos that they didn't allow their bosses to move they were scripted then became stationary,this again makes for some easier/lazier animation work.
This topic also will show players why devs soemtimes don't give mobs any abilities beyond them using the gun to pew pew,they don't want to spend the time and effort to create more animations.Then again this entire topic goes even further into why Bioware made only one model each,again less work on animations if only one model.
Maybe because it's too expensive and the masses would not even notice or care after the first or 2nd kill. So all that work to detail goes to waste in the long run. MMOs are a business and they need to work within a budget, not needlessly waste it on details people in the long run could care less about.
Also, you increase the quality of animation and graphics and thier goes possibly half your customer base as they find out they can't play the game with any exceptable Frame Rate. I remember Age of Conan for me. It looked awesome, graphics were great, yet it destroyed my frame rate that I had too at the end quit the game because it was unplayable. That was the sole reason for me quitting that MMO and nothing else. I could just not play it.
Comments
I'd say AOC has it beat, and IMO SWG's original animations were off the hook, pikeman and TK especially followed closely by my main profession fencer.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
thanks for the link, I liked it a lot
I think the melee choreography looks good, when everyone is in the proper place. It falls appart for me, when people are not in the right place.
I like a lot of the range combat animations, but I really dislike the way it all looks in action -- as the range just seems silly. It is as if they are fighting with 18th century firearms, with limited range and accuracy.
I definately think there is room for improvement.
First of all, thanks for these videos.
The animations lack any sort of flow whatsoever and this has been a complaint from the earliest demo videos. Are they passable? Yeah.
Not really my style though. And frankly, I think it's shameful for a 2011 game, but what can you do.
Oh, and let me just add how jarring it is to lightsabers hit the target and nothing happens. Talk about uninspired and stupid. Also, LMAO at the comment, "Do the NPC in this game ever move?????? Do they have any AI?????? They are so freaking boring,? just stand still... pew pew pew......"
Yeah I agree.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
I need to take this advice more.
true.. although most of these type of MMO's animations are pretty bad anyway.. watch osme videos of vindictus http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DGkOqPkyf-s although its more along the lines of guild wars 1 type game it does how some very good combat animations... it is an action mmo though. But many of these free ones do have pretty good if not in many cases better animations than swtor although besides some pretty animations and usually big boobs those games don't really offer much. I will say star wars animations are passable with some great ones and some really bad ones but for anyone who sees them as insanly good is really kidding themself.
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/339443/Video-FollowUp-Guide-For-Enhancing-Graphics-and-Performance-in-SWTORSorry-still-Nvidia-Only.html
WoW how an innate fluidity that is lacking in most games. Which puts WoW miles above SWTOR.
Of course, people might just be mistaking aesthetics/graphics for animation quality.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
I need to take this advice more.
main difference is WOW like rift is much more twitch type gameplay. This make it feel much quicker and flow better. Swtor went the other way and decided to make there combat little slower and drop auto-attack. I wouldn't say either way is good or bad but it does make SWTOR feel little less fluid when you are used to the quicker gameplay most other MMOs have.
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/339443/Video-FollowUp-Guide-For-Enhancing-Graphics-and-Performance-in-SWTORSorry-still-Nvidia-Only.html
I would classify myself as a fanboi. I will love this game (at least for a while) regardless of minor issues.
That being said, I have to agree with the haters. BW was bragging about how their combat is so much more fluid than other games. And, in some cases, like lightsaber on lightsaber combat, it is more fluid. But if you put a lightsaber on a guy with a gun, it looks just a stupid as any other game; one guy stands there shooting, another guy stands there swinging.
The biggest problem is that BW was toting some revolutionary combat system, but in fact it looks the same as any other game. So, because they essentially bullcrapped us all, it seems so much worse
Edit:
Also, in addition, I think their choice to force long combat animations on players makes combat seem less fun. I feel like I push a button and just watch.
Don't get me wrong, overall, I think swtor combat is pretty good, but there are major flaws in their design
http://f.cl.ly/items/3n15423i0G2i111y3c2b/computer.gif
That's a good point.
That said, I play AoC (which doesn't have autoattack) and the combat animations are pretty fluid. The whole combat in AoC is probably one of the nicer ones in the themepark MMORPG genre.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
I need to take this advice more.
"Innate fluidity" - very nice wording, I've been trying to point out how important character and NPC animation fluidity is important more than once.
It's one of those things that can make or break a game, one of those things that is hard to describe for a player, when you ask him why he thinks some game "sux" or is "good"...
NEW IDEAS that can refresh the STALE state of MMORPGs
QFT.
As much as I hate WoW, it did a really good job with smoothing out the animations and making them feel fluid. Sure they are all exaggerated / stylized, but that doesn't make the animation bad, just unrealistic. Not unlike what Pixar does in their movies.
I'd also agree that TOR's animations seem to all be designed for static combat, they just don't feel right when things are moving (which they almost always are). Kind of a mistake imho. It's especially noticeable during boss fights / pvp. Things feel locked, instead of free-flowing and smooth.
AoC combat ones were pretty good the deathblow animations were great but the jumping!!! like LOTRO online the jumping animation was just horrifyingly bad. But Swtor one isn't much better. I dunno why but jumping animations bother me so much when they are done bad and there are pretty awful in most MMOs
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/339443/Video-FollowUp-Guide-For-Enhancing-Graphics-and-Performance-in-SWTORSorry-still-Nvidia-Only.html
Yeah, it's not the greatest. It's even worse in RIFT. I don't know why but WoW is the only game where the jumping feels great.
Edit: Maybe Aion too... Can't remember Aion to be honest.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
I need to take this advice more.
"Memories,
Like the corners of my mind
Misty water-colored memories
Of the way we were
Scattered pictures,
Of the smiles we left behind
Smiles we gave to one another
For the way we were
Can it be that it was all so simple then?
Or has time re-written every line?
If we had the chance to do it all again
Tell me, would we? could we?
Memories, may be beautiful and yet
Whats too painful to remember
We simply choose to forget
So its the laughter
We will remember
Whenever we remember
The way we were
The way we were "
Yes, those ARE SWG fans in the stands
"TO MICHAEL!"
My issue with WoW animations is that there are so few of them. All my attacks seemed to be the same move over and over, interspersed with the same auto-attack over and over. It flowed well, but struck me as extremely simplistic and primitive. I'm surprised Blizzard hasn't added more animation variety over the years.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
Aion was fine although you glided most of the time with the wings anyway
best animations I think in upcomming game are blade & souls http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MJvagAxxus&feature=related
love that jumping:)
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/339443/Video-FollowUp-Guide-For-Enhancing-Graphics-and-Performance-in-SWTORSorry-still-Nvidia-Only.html
Me too. Haven't really been following the MOP news but I recall reading that the new class, Monk, is animation-intensive... hopefully that's a sign that the combat/character models will get some sort of upgrade.
"Never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."
I need to take this advice more.
Both Blade and Soul and Age of Wulin have awesome combat animations. To the OP, I do not think posting a slo mo video of SW:ToR's combat is scoring the game any points...if anything it just strengthens a lot of peoples argument that SW:ToR's combat is a boring snore fest.
Blade and Soul - Slo Mo Force Master << clicky
Blade and Soul Force Master in action <<< clicky
so sexy.. hopefully they put more into this game than just nice looking combat.. honestly haven't really been following it much but still love the videos of the combat.
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/339443/Video-FollowUp-Guide-For-Enhancing-Graphics-and-Performance-in-SWTORSorry-still-Nvidia-Only.html
Yet another game I'm looking forward to that isn't going to be out until god knows when.. So many upcoming MMOs, and yet I look at what's actually here.. and well, there's TOR, and.. no, just TOR.
$%@#! here's my $60...
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.
Maybe because it's too expensive and the masses would not even notice or care after the first or 2nd kill. So all that work to detail goes to waste in the long run. MMOs are a business and they need to work within a budget, not needlessly waste it on details people in the long run could care less about.
Also, you increase the quality of animation and graphics and thier goes possibly half your customer base as they find out they can't play the game with any exceptable Frame Rate. I remember Age of Conan for me. It looked awesome, graphics were great, yet it destroyed my frame rate that I had too at the end quit the game because it was unplayable. That was the sole reason for me quitting that MMO and nothing else. I could just not play it.
You want to see next gen MMORPG game - watch this from Blade and Soul - this game is going to change how we play MMORPG's.
Blade and Soul Force Master <<< clicky
More Blade and Soul
Blade and Soul Game Play Video <<< clicky
crouching tiger action going on there heh. Too bad its not slated for this time next year for release...
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/339443/Video-FollowUp-Guide-For-Enhancing-Graphics-and-Performance-in-SWTORSorry-still-Nvidia-Only.html