Yes OP it is an MMO....sigh....**rolls eyes**. Yet another "I dont like SWTOR thread so everyone listen to me as my opinion is better than everyone elses and please and stop playing now thread"
***fires soiled plungers at OP!***
All my opinions are just that..opinions. If you like my opinions..coolness.If you dont like my opinion....I really dont care. Playing: ESO, WOT, Smite, and Marvel Heroes
Or it could be you judge and think all new gen mmogs are trash because the genre moved forward and widened the access to all people.Do I miss some of my old mmogs and the community ? For sure but that time is gone and will not be back for alot of reasons.Back then you had Eq1 at one time being top dog when they boasted 300-350k subs now you got WoW with 11 million or w/e your never gonna get that tight community feel again in a mmog unless you go into the game even WoW and make it with a group of like minded people.Any good game that comes out your gonna be dealin with roughly 5x the population a Eq1 had back in that time period.
The genre has moved yes, but I systematically disagree that it was in the forward direction. Also the fact that there are more people in an MMO(RPG) doesn't necessarily mean their is any less potential for great communities. Eve proves this, with an average of 40,000 players online simultaneously. By widening access though, developers have catered to gamers that value soloing and instant gratification in their games (console players) This type of gamer could care less about the social aspects of MMO(RPG)s, which in turn creats subpar and detestable communities. Granted there will always be bad apples, but when people who care nothing about the social aspect are allowed into games which feature social aspects as one of their main drawing points, it stands to reason that aspect will suffer greatly.
Dude if you dont think SWTOR is any different an experience than WOW or RIFT but your holding out for GW2? Then uuh? Just through in the towel now on MMO's. There is nothing in the development period that breaks the current MMO mold that I have seen, nohting. Not GW2 not ARchage not the Secret World, they are all based on EXACTLY the same model, at least SWTOR makes the questing leveling part of the grind stomachable with their voice overs and quality story telling (Sith side anyhow). ARchage has some sandbox elements to keep you busier but the questing model is IDENTICAL with pages of text to read through about killing x number of spiders in some poor damsels garden. GW2 generic fantasy setting with standard classes.
I will most likely play them all and enjoy them all but you wont see me on these fourms crying about how I thought an MMO was gong to change my life like its the second coming of christ. I dont know OP maybe take up a new hobby.
...but the questing model is IDENTICAL with pages of text to read through about killing x number of spiders in some poor damsels garden.
The reason those quests are all so boring is because they have no bearing on your character, nor are they in the overall interest to whatever it is your character happens to be doing. This exists regardless of whether your character is the Hero or Uncle Owen. In an MMO(RPG) where the players are given the opportunity to create their own content and stories, these stupid quests would dissapear. Why, because there would be no reason for their existence in the first place.
I think GW2 will be a better game that SWTOR, but it certainly won't be the MMO equivalent of a messiah.
The only thing people like you miss is having this false sense on control of being able to make others depend on you for there own enjoyment of a game they paid for.And yes I am a mmo dino as you say also from UO to Eq1 to SWTOR to everything in between.Your the kinda player who wants the game to FORCE ppl to depend on you for your own self worth and enjoyment to have to have em log in sit and spam for a group for 2 hours to find out they rolled a class no one wanted or needed for there group so they could log off getting nothing at all done.Yes the good ole days as you call em.
First of all you do not know me, and you are totally wrong in your representation of me. The aspect of player dependency is not that I could get off on a power or control trip, it was simply as I stated. It is the fact the interdependency allows for community development and growth. In any game I played I was never in a position of control, and even if I had that capability, the things I produced were given to the benefit of my guild or friends. It sounds to me as though you ran into some rather unscrupulous individuals in previous games, and we are not all like that.
Or it could be you judge and think all new gen mmogs are trash because the genre moved forward and widened the access to all people.Do I miss some of my old mmogs and the community ? For sure but that time is gone and will not be back for alot of reasons.Back then you had Eq1 at one time being top dog when they boasted 300-350k subs now you got WoW with 11 million or w/e your never gonna get that tight community feel again in a mmog unless you go into the game even WoW and make it with a group of like minded people.Any good game that comes out your gonna be dealin with roughly 5x the population a Eq1 had back in that time period.
The "new MMO" has widened the appeal, yet locked out a lot of people for the same reasons.
Because there is only the "new MMO" having a stranglehold on the genre.
Somehow in the single-player FPS market for example we get wildly varying games, from Modern Warfare 3 and Halo 3, over Deus EX HR, past STALKER and Skyrim, PREY 2 and Hard Reset to Team Fortress 2 , Minecraft and Portal, while on the MMO market we are forced to play the same shit with different skinns for over 7 years now.
Variety is lacking, severely, the market is dominated, monopolized by one, singular, idea/design philosophy.
Nobody can argue that this is a good thing.
How would you feel if every FPS game would be MW3 with a different setting?
Or it could be you judge and think all new gen mmogs are trash because the genre moved forward and widened the access to all people.Do I miss some of my old mmogs and the community ? For sure but that time is gone and will not be back for alot of reasons.Back then you had Eq1 at one time being top dog when they boasted 300-350k subs now you got WoW with 11 million or w/e your never gonna get that tight community feel again in a mmog unless you go into the game even WoW and make it with a group of like minded people.Any good game that comes out your gonna be dealin with roughly 5x the population a Eq1 had back in that time period.
The genre has moved yes, but I systematically disagree that it was in the forward direction. Also the fact that there are more people in an MMO(RPG) doesn't necessarily mean their is any less potential for great communities. Eve proves this, with an average of 40,000 players online simultaneously. By widening access though, developers have catered to gamers that value soloing and instant gratification in their games (console players) This type of gamer could care less about the social aspects of MMO(RPG)s, which in turn creats subpar and detestable communities. Granted there will always be bad apples, but when people who care nothing about the social aspect are allowed into games which feature social aspects as one of their main drawing points, it stands to reason that aspect will suffer greatly.
There are still great communities in new gen mmogs you just have to look for them harder now.It isn't about instant gratification but what about the dad or mom who work 8-12 hours a day 5 days a week have kids also still enjoy mmogs even if they only have a few days a week they can play for a few hours think it is fair to them that they would have to log in like old Eq1 sit in freeport and spam in hopes of finding a group for the lil time they do have available? How is them soloing effecting and ruining your game play? Because they aren't forced to depend on you to advance there character?
Like I said there is still good guilds in all mmogs you just have to find them if you can't make your own there are enough like minded people I am sure they would be willing to join.
I just moved from RIFT to SWTOR and I totally regret even buying this game now .
It feels worse than RIFT and WOW , they have taken a huge step backwards in game play .
Fallacy 1: Assuming that there is one line of "progression" for combat systems that all MMOs can be placed on, and that it's actually possible to take a "step backwards"
Fallacy 1: There is a line of progression for combat systems. Since game B came after game A, and B is modeled after A, then B better have similar or better combat system than A since both are heavily combat-oriented games. If B's is worse or dumbed down compared to A, then B's system is a "step backwards".
Sure the story cutscenes are great but the actual game is pure garbage .
I quit WOW years ago so I definately wouldnt want to play that game again with a new skin .
Fallacy 2: Saying the game is just WoW with a new skin without any evidence. And to top it off, saying that even though the sentence before you clearly indicated that you felt the game had a unique combat system
Fallacy 2: The poster needs no evidence as there are already tons of testaments that state this game is clearly modeled after WoW.
Nothing feels right , the animation feels jerky and broken .
Fallacy 3: Blaming the game for your archaic computer not being able to display the incredibly smooth animations properly
Fallacy 3: Assuming that the poster has an "archaic computer". Its funny that you would chastise the OP in your "fallacy 1" for assuming, then you assume here.
The quests are shallow and the entire world feels instanced ( probably because it is ) .
Fallacy 4: Using the word "instanced" even though you clearly do not understand what the term means (why else would you call the entire game instanced?)
Fallacy 4: Actually, its you that doesn't know what the term "instanced" means. Having multiple instances of the exact same zone due to population IS instanced. People complained about it in Guild Wars, Champions Online, and Star Trek Online. They're complaining about it here.
I never connected to my character like I did back in EQ days when the thought of possibly dying bought excitement and fear of going into a new dungeon or area .
Fallacy 5: Giving way too much credit to a game that clearly impressed you simply because it was one of the first MMOs you encountered death penalties in rather than any innovative game features it had
Fallacy 5: It's called an opinion. The OP finds that game feature better due to the excitement of loot drop upon death. There is no fallacy in the OP stating his opinion. There is a fallacy in you attempting to claim this is a fallacy because you simply disagree with the OP.
It's hard for me to feel sympathy with these people who have the nerve to make another hate thread while putting so little effort in to prove their point. If the graphics are so bad, or the design is so similar to WoW, please feel free to take screenshots or movies and actually prove your point.
Fallacy 6: You assume that this is a "hate thread" because you simply disagree with the OP. And, this is the second time you assumed on this post after chastising the OP in "fallacy 1". I will point my finger at you for being the one that is spewing hate. Hate that you can't tolerate a difference of your opinion. That's clear as day within your post.
There are still great communities in new gen mmogs you just have to look for them harder now.It isn't about instant gratification but what about the dad or mom who work 8-12 hours a day 5 days a week have kids also still enjoy mmogs even if they only have a few days a week they can play for a few hours think it is fair to them that they would have to log in like old Eq1 sit in freeport and spam in hopes of finding a group for the lil time they do have available? How is them soloing effecting and ruining your game play? Because they aren't forced to depend on you to advance there character?
Like I said there is still good guilds in all mmogs you just have to find them if you can't make your own there are enough like minded people I am sure they would be willing to join.
Oh yes, the casual argument. I've never stated that themeparks should never be made. I think there is room for a variety of MMO(RPG)s. However, because the genre has been dominated by one type of design mechanic, it prevents games of a different design from being made. Just like dominating the genre with one type would prevent Mom & Pop from enjoying their time, dominating the genre with another might prevent those of us who want something different from enjoying our time.
There is room for variety, but the same thing over and over doesn't benefit anyone.
...but the questing model is IDENTICAL with pages of text to read through about killing x number of spiders in some poor damsels garden.
The reason those quests are all so boring is because they have no bearing on your character, nor are they in the overall interest to whatever it is your character happens to be doing. This exists regardless of whether your character is the Hero or Uncle Owen. In an MMO(RPG) where the players are given the opportunity to create their own content and stories, these stupid quests would dissapear. Why, because there would be no reason for their existence in the first place.
I think GW2 will be a better game that SWTOR, but it certainly won't be the MMO equivalent of a messiah.
That is an excellent point, most quests in MMO have little or nothing to do with you other than the fact that YOU have to read them, and they certainly dont allow you any options or choices with regards to the outcome or how you deal with the quest giver, this is SWTOR's strength and they spent a wheelbarrel full of money to do it.
The only thing people like you miss is having this false sense on control of being able to make others depend on you for there own enjoyment of a game they paid for.And yes I am a mmo dino as you say also from UO to Eq1 to SWTOR to everything in between.Your the kinda player who wants the game to FORCE ppl to depend on you for your own self worth and enjoyment to have to have em log in sit and spam for a group for 2 hours to find out they rolled a class no one wanted or needed for there group so they could log off getting nothing at all done.Yes the good ole days as you call em.
First of all you do not know me, and you are totally wrong in your representation of me. The aspect of player dependency is not that I could get off on a power or control trip, it was simply as I stated. It is the fact the interdependency allows for community development and growth. In any game I played I was never in a position of control, and even if I had that capability, the things I produced were given to the benefit of my guild or friends. It sounds to me as though you ran into some rather unscrupulous individuals in previous games, and we are not all like that.
Or it could be you judge and think all new gen mmogs are trash because the genre moved forward and widened the access to all people.Do I miss some of my old mmogs and the community ? For sure but that time is gone and will not be back for alot of reasons.Back then you had Eq1 at one time being top dog when they boasted 300-350k subs now you got WoW with 11 million or w/e your never gonna get that tight community feel again in a mmog unless you go into the game even WoW and make it with a group of like minded people.Any good game that comes out your gonna be dealin with roughly 5x the population a Eq1 had back in that time period.
The "new MMO" has widened the appeal, yet locked out a lot of people for the same reasons.
Because there is only the "new MMO" having a stranglehold on the genre.
Somehow in the single-player FPS market for example we get wildly varying games, from Modern Warfare 3 and Halo 3, over Deus EX HR, past STALKER and Skyrim, PREY 2 and Hard Reset to Team Fortress 2 , Minecraft and Portal, while on the MMO market we are forced to play the same shit with different skinns for over 7 years now.
Variety is lacking, severely, the market is dominated, monopolized by one, singular, idea/design philosophy.
Nobody can argue that this is a good thing.
How would you feel if every FPS game would be MW3 with a different setting?
MMO is not a genre. And FPS isn't either.
Game companies are gonna do what they can do to make the most money they can which is the way all companies as far as I know have started try to do in anything.Right now this model is where the most success is does not mean it will always be that way Look at TV,movies or anything else and you will see something come out great followed by 500 identical like the 2 dozen different l stupid aw and order tv shows and ones like it.
Some companies have tied to step out of the mold but they do not have the money to compete with a EA or a Blizzard therefore they aren't as polished or missing features people want. it gets deemed as buggy and s**t and they end up shutting down or barely able to stay open.
Hell look how overall how polished SWTOR is and you got people already compaining how they want dungeon finder,etc etc. Player bases decide what direction games head you cannot expect small upstart companies to risk there money doing something that the overall playerbase does not want.
There are still great communities in new gen mmogs you just have to look for them harder now.It isn't about instant gratification but what about the dad or mom who work 8-12 hours a day 5 days a week have kids also still enjoy mmogs even if they only have a few days a week they can play for a few hours think it is fair to them that they would have to log in like old Eq1 sit in freeport and spam in hopes of finding a group for the lil time they do have available? How is them soloing effecting and ruining your game play? Because they aren't forced to depend on you to advance there character?
Like I said there is still good guilds in all mmogs you just have to find them if you can't make your own there are enough like minded people I am sure they would be willing to join.
Oh yes, the casual argument. I've never stated that themeparks should never be made. I think there is room for a variety of MMO(RPG)s. However, because the genre has been dominated by one type of design mechanic, it prevents games of a different design from being made. Just like dominating the genre with one type would prevent Mom & Pop from enjoying their time, dominating the genre with another might prevent those of us who want something different from enjoying our time.
There is room for variety, but the same thing over and over doesn't benefit anyone.
There ARE different mmogs out there that aren't modeled after the current mmo's you do not like the issue is that you do not like them.They just aren't big mmog companies who can afford to do all that a player like you wants .What would you do as a CEO or owner of a gaming company go with the formula with the best chance to recover your investment and have the chance to profit as well or try something totally different and risk losing millions of dollars?
There ARE different mmogs out there that aren't modeled after the current mmo's you do not like the issue is that you do not like them.They just aren't big mmog companies who can afford to do all that a player like you wants .What would you do as a CEO or owner of a gaming company go with the formula with the best chance to recover your investment and have the chance to profit as well or try something totally different and risk losing millions of dollars?
I think there is a middle ground, where in the business can produce a game that caters to the playstyle than I and others want which will also generate profit. A game doesn't need millions of subscribers to be successful. Case in point, Eve-Online. Game development shouldn't be dominated entirely by money.
Originally posted by snapfusion
Originally posted by Royalkin
The reason those quests are all so boring is because they have no bearing on your character, nor are they in the overall interest to whatever it is your character happens to be doing. This exists regardless of whether your character is the Hero or Uncle Owen. In an MMO(RPG) where the players are given the opportunity to create their own content and stories, these stupid quests would dissapear. Why, because there would be no reason for their existence in the first place.
I think GW2 will be a better game that SWTOR, but it certainly won't be the MMO equivalent of a messiah.
That is an excellent point, most quests in MMO have little or nothing to do with you other than the fact that YOU have to read them, and they certainly dont allow you any options or choices with regards to the outcome or how you deal with the quest giver, this is SWTOR's strength and they spent a wheelbarrel full of money to do it.
Actually I disagree. Those quests present only the illusion of a derivative outcome, realistically they serve no other purpose but to "push" the story. By serving only that purpose they are still pointless, they prohibit the player from exploring and developing their character. Quests should exist within the world, but if the quest exists only to further the story, it exists only to promote the existence of the story, and produces no significant benefit for the development of the character.
The majority of the content is still very much on rails. With SWTOR, you are locked in to a very specific path, and regardless of whatever choice you choose in dialogue, it still results in the same potential outcome, and thus produces no impact on the world whatsoever. This is true because multiple people can repeat the exact some content with no change to the world, which by its very nature is conducive only towards a single player experience. Therefore the game containing these quests cannot allow change, and thus cannot be an MMO(RPG), and therefore the gameplay (and progression) must be designed primarilly as either a CORPG or a SPRPG experience.
Its fine if you are leveling solo but its horrible experience when you have a friend of different class with you.
Eaxactly, which is why it isn't an MMO(RPG). CORPG mechanics are designed first and foremost around solo gameplay, with 'optional' multiplayer elements. I keep hearing the same variation of comments from propontents of SWTOR, that they like this aspect because it doesn't force them to group (or as you've stated, "it's [a] horrible experience"), and thus the case is clearly indicated.
WoW I got bored with pretty quickly... click, quest, accept, kill, turn-in, reward... rinse, repeat.
RIFT I got bored with even more quickly... WoW in a different setting, nothing new at all.
SW:TOR I have been playing since the first day of early access (plus during beta) and I'm enjoying it thoroughly. Questing with a purpose makes it so much better than other "themeparks" that I've played. I feel like I'm playing out a part in my own movie. I'm actually attached to my character. I think the animations are far superior to those in any MMO except ultra-realistic ones like AoC, and I can forgive them for not being "ultra realistic" because the game is supposed to be a bit fantastic/sci-fi to begin with.
So... I guess it's all just a matter of opinion. Right now the only game that's ever been bigger is WoW. I doubt SW:TOR will ever surpass WoW, but I doubt that any other MMO will ever take the 2nd spot away from SW:TOR. Of course there's no way to know that for at least 6-12 months... so we'll see!
Lol its the same thing in swtor except with a nice story on it
The truth may be puzzling. It may take some work to grapple with. It may be counterintuitive. It may contradict deeply held prejudices. It may not be consonant with what we desperately want to be true. But our preferences do not determine what's true.
The only thing people like you miss is having this false sense on control of being able to make others depend on you for there own enjoyment of a game they paid for.And yes I am a mmo dino as you say also from UO to Eq1 to SWTOR to everything in between.Your the kinda player who wants the game to FORCE ppl to depend on you for your own self worth and enjoyment to have to have em log in sit and spam for a group for 2 hours to find out they rolled a class no one wanted or needed for there group so they could log off getting nothing at all done.Yes the good ole days as you call em.
First of all you do not know me, and you are totally wrong in your representation of me. The aspect of player dependency is not that I could get off on a power or control trip, it was simply as I stated. It is the fact the interdependency allows for community development and growth. In any game I played I was never in a position of control, and even if I had that capability, the things I produced were given to the benefit of my guild or friends. It sounds to me as though you ran into some rather unscrupulous individuals in previous games, and we are not all like that.
Or it could be you judge and think all new gen mmogs are trash because the genre moved forward and widened the access to all people.Do I miss some of my old mmogs and the community ? For sure but that time is gone and will not be back for alot of reasons.Back then you had Eq1 at one time being top dog when they boasted 300-350k subs now you got WoW with 11 million or w/e your never gonna get that tight community feel again in a mmog unless you go into the game even WoW and make it with a group of like minded people.Any good game that comes out your gonna be dealin with roughly 5x the population a Eq1 had back in that time period.
The "new MMO" has widened the appeal, yet locked out a lot of people for the same reasons.
Because there is only the "new MMO" having a stranglehold on the genre.
Somehow in the single-player FPS market for example we get wildly varying games, from Modern Warfare 3 and Halo 3, over Deus EX HR, past STALKER and Skyrim, PREY 2 and Hard Reset to Team Fortress 2 , Minecraft and Portal, while on the MMO market we are forced to play the same shit with different skinns for over 7 years now.
Variety is lacking, severely, the market is dominated, monopolized by one, singular, idea/design philosophy.
Nobody can argue that this is a good thing.
How would you feel if every FPS game would be MW3 with a different setting?
MMO is not a genre. And FPS isn't either.
Game companies are gonna do what they can do to make the most money they can which is the way all companies as far as I know have started try to do in anything.Right now this model is where the most success is does not mean it will always be that way Look at TV,movies or anything else and you will see something come out great followed by 500 identical like the 2 dozen different l stupid aw and order tv shows and ones like it.
Some companies have tied to step out of the mold but they do not have the money to compete with a EA or a Blizzard therefore they aren't as polished or missing features people want. it gets deemed as buggy and s**t and they end up shutting down or barely able to stay open.
Hell look how overall how polished SWTOR is and you got people already compaining how they want dungeon finder,etc etc. Player bases decide what direction games head you cannot expect small upstart companies to risk there money doing something that the overall playerbase does not want.
Its the argument that since I don't like neither American Footbal nor Soccer, I clearly don't like sports that have balls in them, so we won't run Baseball on TV.
So then someone runs a baseball match on TV, but is only junior-league recorded with a super8, and nearly nobody watches it.
Then obviously nobody likes to watch baseball.
I never said upstarts need to do it. The big companies need to do it.
This topic title doesn't even make sense. Feels just like baiting really. Just because you don't like a game doesn't mean it isn't an mmo. All I see is that you aren't happy with the game. What does that have to do with the game being an mmo or not?
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
This topic title doesn't even make sense. Feels just like baiting really. Just because you don't like a game doesn't mean it isn't an mmo. All I see is that you aren't happy with the game. What does that have to do with the game being an mmo or not?
The OPs opinion is valid because the gameplay mechanics of the game are not conducive towards an MMO, but rather towards a CORPG or SPRPG. Primarilly the heavy use of instancing and soloability.
TOR is what you make it, there is content for just about any way you want to play. You can level from pvp, solo or group quests. The only thing your really required to do is the class quests.
Comments
Yes OP it is an MMO....sigh....**rolls eyes**. Yet another "I dont like SWTOR thread so everyone listen to me as my opinion is better than everyone elses and please and stop playing now thread"
***fires soiled plungers at OP!***
All my opinions are just that..opinions. If you like my opinions..coolness.If you dont like my opinion....I really dont care.
Playing: ESO, WOT, Smite, and Marvel Heroes
The genre has moved yes, but I systematically disagree that it was in the forward direction. Also the fact that there are more people in an MMO(RPG) doesn't necessarily mean their is any less potential for great communities. Eve proves this, with an average of 40,000 players online simultaneously. By widening access though, developers have catered to gamers that value soloing and instant gratification in their games (console players) This type of gamer could care less about the social aspects of MMO(RPG)s, which in turn creats subpar and detestable communities. Granted there will always be bad apples, but when people who care nothing about the social aspect are allowed into games which feature social aspects as one of their main drawing points, it stands to reason that aspect will suffer greatly.
Dude if you dont think SWTOR is any different an experience than WOW or RIFT but your holding out for GW2? Then uuh? Just through in the towel now on MMO's. There is nothing in the development period that breaks the current MMO mold that I have seen, nohting. Not GW2 not ARchage not the Secret World, they are all based on EXACTLY the same model, at least SWTOR makes the questing leveling part of the grind stomachable with their voice overs and quality story telling (Sith side anyhow). ARchage has some sandbox elements to keep you busier but the questing model is IDENTICAL with pages of text to read through about killing x number of spiders in some poor damsels garden. GW2 generic fantasy setting with standard classes.
I will most likely play them all and enjoy them all but you wont see me on these fourms crying about how I thought an MMO was gong to change my life like its the second coming of christ. I dont know OP maybe take up a new hobby.
The reason those quests are all so boring is because they have no bearing on your character, nor are they in the overall interest to whatever it is your character happens to be doing. This exists regardless of whether your character is the Hero or Uncle Owen. In an MMO(RPG) where the players are given the opportunity to create their own content and stories, these stupid quests would dissapear. Why, because there would be no reason for their existence in the first place.
I think GW2 will be a better game that SWTOR, but it certainly won't be the MMO equivalent of a messiah.
The "new MMO" has widened the appeal, yet locked out a lot of people for the same reasons.
Because there is only the "new MMO" having a stranglehold on the genre.
Somehow in the single-player FPS market for example we get wildly varying games, from Modern Warfare 3 and Halo 3, over Deus EX HR, past STALKER and Skyrim, PREY 2 and Hard Reset to Team Fortress 2 , Minecraft and Portal, while on the MMO market we are forced to play the same shit with different skinns for over 7 years now.
Variety is lacking, severely, the market is dominated, monopolized by one, singular, idea/design philosophy.
Nobody can argue that this is a good thing.
How would you feel if every FPS game would be MW3 with a different setting?
MMO is not a genre. And FPS isn't either.
There are still great communities in new gen mmogs you just have to look for them harder now.It isn't about instant gratification but what about the dad or mom who work 8-12 hours a day 5 days a week have kids also still enjoy mmogs even if they only have a few days a week they can play for a few hours think it is fair to them that they would have to log in like old Eq1 sit in freeport and spam in hopes of finding a group for the lil time they do have available? How is them soloing effecting and ruining your game play? Because they aren't forced to depend on you to advance there character?
Like I said there is still good guilds in all mmogs you just have to find them if you can't make your own there are enough like minded people I am sure they would be willing to join.
lol......get back under the bridge
Oh yes, the casual argument. I've never stated that themeparks should never be made. I think there is room for a variety of MMO(RPG)s. However, because the genre has been dominated by one type of design mechanic, it prevents games of a different design from being made. Just like dominating the genre with one type would prevent Mom & Pop from enjoying their time, dominating the genre with another might prevent those of us who want something different from enjoying our time.
There is room for variety, but the same thing over and over doesn't benefit anyone.
I'll ask a better question than the OP.
Is this even a thread?
That is an excellent point, most quests in MMO have little or nothing to do with you other than the fact that YOU have to read them, and they certainly dont allow you any options or choices with regards to the outcome or how you deal with the quest giver, this is SWTOR's strength and they spent a wheelbarrel full of money to do it.
Game companies are gonna do what they can do to make the most money they can which is the way all companies as far as I know have started try to do in anything.Right now this model is where the most success is does not mean it will always be that way Look at TV,movies or anything else and you will see something come out great followed by 500 identical like the 2 dozen different l stupid aw and order tv shows and ones like it.
Some companies have tied to step out of the mold but they do not have the money to compete with a EA or a Blizzard therefore they aren't as polished or missing features people want. it gets deemed as buggy and s**t and they end up shutting down or barely able to stay open.
Hell look how overall how polished SWTOR is and you got people already compaining how they want dungeon finder,etc etc. Player bases decide what direction games head you cannot expect small upstart companies to risk there money doing something that the overall playerbase does not want.
Quick answer...Yes...Move on.....
Deep into that darkness peering, long I stood there, wondering, fearing, doubting, dreaming dreams no mortal ever dared to dream before.
Edgar Allan Poe
There ARE different mmogs out there that aren't modeled after the current mmo's you do not like the issue is that you do not like them.They just aren't big mmog companies who can afford to do all that a player like you wants .What would you do as a CEO or owner of a gaming company go with the formula with the best chance to recover your investment and have the chance to profit as well or try something totally different and risk losing millions of dollars?
I think there is a middle ground, where in the business can produce a game that caters to the playstyle than I and others want which will also generate profit. A game doesn't need millions of subscribers to be successful. Case in point, Eve-Online. Game development shouldn't be dominated entirely by money.
Actually I disagree. Those quests present only the illusion of a derivative outcome, realistically they serve no other purpose but to "push" the story. By serving only that purpose they are still pointless, they prohibit the player from exploring and developing their character. Quests should exist within the world, but if the quest exists only to further the story, it exists only to promote the existence of the story, and produces no significant benefit for the development of the character.
The majority of the content is still very much on rails. With SWTOR, you are locked in to a very specific path, and regardless of whatever choice you choose in dialogue, it still results in the same potential outcome, and thus produces no impact on the world whatsoever. This is true because multiple people can repeat the exact some content with no change to the world, which by its very nature is conducive only towards a single player experience. Therefore the game containing these quests cannot allow change, and thus cannot be an MMO(RPG), and therefore the gameplay (and progression) must be designed primarilly as either a CORPG or a SPRPG experience.
Its fine if you are leveling solo but its horrible experience when you have a friend of different class with you.
Eaxactly, which is why it isn't an MMO(RPG). CORPG mechanics are designed first and foremost around solo gameplay, with 'optional' multiplayer elements. I keep hearing the same variation of comments from propontents of SWTOR, that they like this aspect because it doesn't force them to group (or as you've stated, "it's [a] horrible experience"), and thus the case is clearly indicated.
Its actually funny that a lot of people on this forum would kill to havethe genre to move backwards, like UO or AO
But yes, I want the genre to move forward. The developers are playing too safe.
How much WoW could a WoWhater hate, if a WoWhater could hate WoW?
As much WoW as a WoWhater would, if a WoWhater could hate WoW.
Ignore...
Lol its the same thing in swtor except with a nice story on it
The truth may be puzzling. It may take some work to grapple with. It may be counterintuitive. It may contradict deeply held prejudices. It may not be consonant with what we desperately want to be true. But our preferences do not determine what's true.
Carl Sagan-
Its the argument that since I don't like neither American Footbal nor Soccer, I clearly don't like sports that have balls in them, so we won't run Baseball on TV.
So then someone runs a baseball match on TV, but is only junior-league recorded with a super8, and nearly nobody watches it.
Then obviously nobody likes to watch baseball.
I never said upstarts need to do it. The big companies need to do it.
This topic title doesn't even make sense. Feels just like baiting really. Just because you don't like a game doesn't mean it isn't an mmo. All I see is that you aren't happy with the game. What does that have to do with the game being an mmo or not?
1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.
2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.
3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.
The OPs opinion is valid because the gameplay mechanics of the game are not conducive towards an MMO, but rather towards a CORPG or SPRPG. Primarilly the heavy use of instancing and soloability.
TOR is what you make it, there is content for just about any way you want to play. You can level from pvp, solo or group quests. The only thing your really required to do is the class quests.
Did I mention how bad the mobs are in this game ?
They just stand motionless waiting to be killed .
In Skyrim NPC move around as if they are in a living breathing world, SWTOR everything feels static.
I found it hard to get into the story because of this