So are you ready to admit that gaming takes skill yet?
I think I bring up a legit point when I say that the military uses several programs that could be defined as videogames to hone the skills of the troops do i not?
It would also be safe to assume that this would be a miniscule portion of the training, with exception of flight crew/pilot training, the rest is very real world and hands on. You learn how to jump out of an airplane by going from platforms and lines on up to real planes for instance, doing so on a computer would help you very little for instance.
So are you ready to admit that gaming takes skill yet?
I think I bring up a legit point when I say that the military uses several programs that could be defined as videogames to hone the skills of the troops do i not?
It would also be safe to assume that this would be a miniscule portion of the training, with exception of flight crew/pilot training, the rest is very real world and hands on. You learn how to jump out of an airplane by going from platforms and lines on up to real planes for instance, doing so on a computer would help you very little for instance.
but it does help correct? if not im sure they wouldnt use it.
So are you ready to admit that gaming takes skill yet?
I think I bring up a legit point when I say that the military uses several programs that could be defined as videogames to hone the skills of the troops do i not?
It would also be safe to assume that this would be a miniscule portion of the training, with exception of flight crew/pilot training, the rest is very real world and hands on. You learn how to jump out of an airplane by going from platforms and lines on up to real planes for instance, doing so on a computer would help you very little for instance.
but it does help correct? if not im sure they wouldnt use it.
As I said for most MOS(your job in the service) I imagine most of your training, and by most I mean 99.9% is very physical and hands on in nature, vehicle training would be the exception.
So are you ready to admit that gaming takes skill yet?
In the same way that sitting on a couch takes skill, yes.
Sad.
true, it is just as important and only slightly less difficult.
and what do you say about the people that make a living playing games in Korea. Are they not skilled at the trade they have chosen to go into? Does it not provide ample lump sums of money for them? Would that skill not be important to them on a personal level? Surely these people didn't just go to a tournament never having played the game they were competing in and win first prize. Or how about the people who have made millions selling online commodities for real money. Is there not skill involved in that?
So are you ready to admit that gaming takes skill yet?
In the same way that sitting on a couch takes skill, yes.
Sad.
true, it is just as important and only slightly less difficult.
and what do you say about the people that make a living playing games in Korea. Are they not skilled at the trade they have chosen to go into? Does it not provide ample lump sums of money for them? Would that skill not be important to them on a personal level? Surely these people didn't just go to a tournament never having played the game they were competing in and win first prize. Or how about the people who have made millions selling online commodities for real money. Is there not skill involved in that?
Fine, fine, fine mmorpgs require tons of skill, anyone that doesn't play according to the mmorpgs code of orthodoxy is a bad and should be ostricized, this is as important a field of human endeavor as there is! Happy?
So are you ready to admit that gaming takes skill yet?
In the same way that sitting on a couch takes skill, yes.
Sad.
true, it is just as important and only slightly less difficult.
and what do you say about the people that make a living playing games in Korea. Are they not skilled at the trade they have chosen to go into? Does it not provide ample lump sums of money for them? Would that skill not be important to them on a personal level? Surely these people didn't just go to a tournament never having played the game they were competing in and win first prize. Or how about the people who have made millions selling online commodities for real money. Is there not skill involved in that?
Fine, fine, fine mmorpgs require tons of skill, anyone that doesn't play according to the mmorpgs code of orthodoxy is a bad and should be ostricized, this is as important a field of human endeavor as there is! Happy?
You were the one in an earlier post that pointed out athletes making money from the sport they play. Just don't see how an esport, guitar or anything that has to be learned through time, patience and dedication is any different.
the ability, coming from one's knowledge, practice, aptitude,etc., to do something well:
You'll notice that how important something is has nothing to do with it. It's too bad you are still, after having being told over 9000 times, are not able to understand a simple definition.
So are you ready to admit that gaming takes skill yet?
In the same way that sitting on a couch takes skill, yes.
Sad.
true, it is just as important and only slightly less difficult.
and what do you say about the people that make a living playing games in Korea. Are they not skilled at the trade they have chosen to go into? Does it not provide ample lump sums of money for them? Would that skill not be important to them on a personal level? Surely these people didn't just go to a tournament never having played the game they were competing in and win first prize. Or how about the people who have made millions selling online commodities for real money. Is there not skill involved in that?
Fine, fine, fine mmorpgs require tons of skill, anyone that doesn't play according to the mmorpgs code of orthodoxy is a bad and should be ostricized, this is as important a field of human endeavor as there is! Happy?
You were the one in an earlier post that pointed out athletes making money from the sport they play. Just don't see how an esport, guitar or anything that has to be learned through time, patience and dedication is any different.
esport....made up term, comparing it to a real sport is insulting to the participants who put their blood sweat and tears in it, I assume you've never taken part in competitive athletics?(honest question) And how much patience and dedication does it take to farm goblins utilizing a few keybinds and mouse movement, how is that at all equivelant to making music/art etc?
the ability, coming from one's knowledge, practice, aptitude,etc., to do something well:
You'll notice that how important something is has nothing to do with it. It's too bad you are still, after having being told over 9000 times, are not able to understand a simple definition.
So are you ready to admit that gaming takes skill yet?
In the same way that sitting on a couch takes skill, yes.
Sad.
true, it is just as important and only slightly less difficult.
There goes that ridiculous "important" argument. It's too bad you are unable to see past that.
By your definition sitting on a couch indian style would be a skill, no? Therefore there is equivalency there. They're both skills.
As a baby you acquired the ability to sit up. You also acquired the ability to walk and talk. All 3 skills. Or perhaps walking isn't important to you?
So, sitting on a couch is indeed a skill?
In the simplest sense of the word..........yes it is.
We're in agreement, playing an mmorpg is to real world skills as sitting on the couch is compared to the skill required to play an mmorpg. That is sort of where I have been trying to get through out this little discussion we've been having.
So are you ready to admit that gaming takes skill yet?
In the same way that sitting on a couch takes skill, yes.
Sad.
true, it is just as important and only slightly less difficult.
and what do you say about the people that make a living playing games in Korea. Are they not skilled at the trade they have chosen to go into? Does it not provide ample lump sums of money for them? Would that skill not be important to them on a personal level? Surely these people didn't just go to a tournament never having played the game they were competing in and win first prize. Or how about the people who have made millions selling online commodities for real money. Is there not skill involved in that?
Fine, fine, fine mmorpgs require tons of skill, anyone that doesn't play according to the mmorpgs code of orthodoxy is a bad and should be ostricized, this is as important a field of human endeavor as there is! Happy?
You were the one in an earlier post that pointed out athletes making money from the sport they play. Just don't see how an esport, guitar or anything that has to be learned through time, patience and dedication is any different.
esport....made up term, comparing it to a real sport is insulting to the participants who put their blood sweat and tears in it, I assume you've never taken part in competitive athletics?(honest question) And how much patience and dedication does it take to farm goblins utilizing a few keybinds and mouse movement, how is that at all equivelant to making music/art etc?
esport made up? and was the term sport not made up at some point? I have kickboxed when I was a bit younger. Fought in 3 matches. Won 2 out of 3. Just because something is physically harder doesn't make it a SKILL and not a skill to refer to an above post with a "made up" word you used earlier...........although you are trolling the word esport in a most hypocritcal fashion when you have done the same thing yourself today.....................much as they did when the word "sport" was invented.
the ability, coming from one's knowledge, practice, aptitude,etc., to do something well:
You'll notice that how important something is has nothing to do with it. It's too bad you are still, after having being told over 9000 times, are not able to understand a simple definition.
It doesn't but it also doesn't require much of those things to be good at an mmorpg, thus why I think of it as less important. Anything a fat kid can be good at isn't really that skilled imho.
Let me start off by saying im looking forward to a skill based game. No more hearing "you suck baddie, your geared out". But I was wondering how the unskilled population (probably 35%) would take the game.
Now everyone has been in a guild where you got a few unskilled players (downright horrible) in the guild at pvp. Of course you would never say that to them or hurt there feelings but you still think it. Well alot of them can still be commited to the game and work hard to get gear because they really want to be better but unfortunatly you can only learn so much "skill" the rest is pretty much flat out talent for games. I feel like it does hurt those players alot because they are kinda stuck in that no mans land. At least if they got gear they could become almost average and contribute to a team and feel like they arn't as bad as they are (kinda a false sense of acheivement) but its going to be hard for them if they have no way getting better.
Whats everyone's thoughts on this? Will it force the "unskilled" players out of the game?
With just a few skill on ur bar, long CDs and a perma-autoatk, we wont frind problems with Unskilled players on gw2, is a casual MMO where everyone is dps.
I don't see how secondary benefits one can get from gaming are any worse or better than secondary benefits one can get from other activities or hobbies.
Some things make you more fit (soccer, tennis).
Some things make you smarter (chess).
Some things train your language (books).
Some are more specific concepts (i.e., learning attention to detail via modeling).
Shooters train reaction time, reflexes, hand-eye coordination. Something you can also get from, say, fencing.
Games like StarCraft (RTS) are a combination of planning, implementing plans, tactics and strategy, multitasking, and also some reflexes/hand-eye coordination.
Heroes of Might and Magic has repeatedly been considered a simpler version of chess, with both tactics and strategy. In fact, people better at games like chess are typically good at games like HoMM.
MMO's are usually representative of highly complex systems with a lot of details. Of course, you can just follow cookie cutter guides, but if you really want to understand how one of these games work, you need to keep track of multitudes of interactions between various concepts of the game. Furthermore, MMO's, and other team based games, can teach a lot of social aspects. You need to change your attitude if you want to lead a team to victory in League of Legends.
A lot of these things also have detrimental effects. Sports can cripple or even kill you. Addiction to games can lead to an unhealthy lifestyle. You can also engage in these things without a benefit. Amateur involvement, in fact, is more likely to leave you withot a benefit than being serious about something, whether it's a sport or a game. That is kinda beside the point, though, and there are worse ways to live your life than being a fat kid in a basement.
Some things have no positive side at all. Such as drugs. Gaming > drugs.
the ability, coming from one's knowledge, practice, aptitude,etc., to do something well:
You'll notice that how important something is has nothing to do with it. It's too bad you are still, after having being told over 9000 times, are not able to understand a simple definition.
It doesn't but it also doesn't require much of those things to be good at an mmorpg, thus why I think of it as less important. Anything a fat kid can be good at isn't really that skilled imho.
And if the fat kid beats you in an eating contest? Are you still more skilled than him in that particular case?
Certain skillsets and weapon combinations have a serious advantage over others.. and those might have an advantage over another type. There will most definately be situations for every class/build where you come up against someone who has a skillset that is much more difficult to beat with your own. Sometimes you will get lucky, sometimes you won't, Just because vertical gear progession has been left behind in GW2 doesn't mean that the most skilled players will always win or that the lesser skilled players won't ever win, it's about builds as well.
Thats how it's intended to work anyway, from what I remember in dev Q&As. Whether it's like that at launch, who knows yet.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Comments
It would also be safe to assume that this would be a miniscule portion of the training, with exception of flight crew/pilot training, the rest is very real world and hands on. You learn how to jump out of an airplane by going from platforms and lines on up to real planes for instance, doing so on a computer would help you very little for instance.
but it does help correct? if not im sure they wouldnt use it.
true, it is just as important and only slightly less difficult.
As I said for most MOS(your job in the service) I imagine most of your training, and by most I mean 99.9% is very physical and hands on in nature, vehicle training would be the exception.
There goes that ridiculous "important" argument. It's too bad you are unable to see past that.
By your definition sitting on a couch indian style would be a skill, no? Therefore there is equivalency there. They're both skills.
and what do you say about the people that make a living playing games in Korea. Are they not skilled at the trade they have chosen to go into? Does it not provide ample lump sums of money for them? Would that skill not be important to them on a personal level? Surely these people didn't just go to a tournament never having played the game they were competing in and win first prize. Or how about the people who have made millions selling online commodities for real money. Is there not skill involved in that?
As a baby you acquired the ability to sit up. You also acquired the ability to walk and talk. All 3 skills. Or perhaps walking isn't important to you?
Fine, fine, fine mmorpgs require tons of skill, anyone that doesn't play according to the mmorpgs code of orthodoxy is a bad and should be ostricized, this is as important a field of human endeavor as there is! Happy?
So, sitting on a couch is indeed a skill?
You were the one in an earlier post that pointed out athletes making money from the sport they play. Just don't see how an esport, guitar or anything that has to be learned through time, patience and dedication is any different.
I don't know where you got my definition from, but here is my definition:
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/skill
the ability, coming from one's knowledge, practice, aptitude,etc., to do something well:
You'll notice that how important something is has nothing to do with it. It's too bad you are still, after having being told over 9000 times, are not able to understand a simple definition.
In the simplest sense of the word..........yes it is.
esport....made up term, comparing it to a real sport is insulting to the participants who put their blood sweat and tears in it, I assume you've never taken part in competitive athletics?(honest question) And how much patience and dedication does it take to farm goblins utilizing a few keybinds and mouse movement, how is that at all equivelant to making music/art etc?
this made me lol for real +1 ^
We're in agreement, playing an mmorpg is to real world skills as sitting on the couch is compared to the skill required to play an mmorpg. That is sort of where I have been trying to get through out this little discussion we've been having.
esport made up? and was the term sport not made up at some point? I have kickboxed when I was a bit younger. Fought in 3 matches. Won 2 out of 3. Just because something is physically harder doesn't make it a SKILL and not a skill to refer to an above post with a "made up" word you used earlier...........although you are trolling the word esport in a most hypocritcal fashion when you have done the same thing yourself today.....................much as they did when the word "sport" was invented.
It doesn't but it also doesn't require much of those things to be good at an mmorpg, thus why I think of it as less important. Anything a fat kid can be good at isn't really that skilled imho.
With just a few skill on ur bar, long CDs and a perma-autoatk, we wont frind problems with Unskilled players on gw2, is a casual MMO where everyone is dps.
Gaming skill can be taught.
I charge 15$/2hours of Guild wars PvP training.
Contact me for other games!
I don't see how secondary benefits one can get from gaming are any worse or better than secondary benefits one can get from other activities or hobbies.
Some things make you more fit (soccer, tennis).
Some things make you smarter (chess).
Some things train your language (books).
Some are more specific concepts (i.e., learning attention to detail via modeling).
Shooters train reaction time, reflexes, hand-eye coordination. Something you can also get from, say, fencing.
Games like StarCraft (RTS) are a combination of planning, implementing plans, tactics and strategy, multitasking, and also some reflexes/hand-eye coordination.
Heroes of Might and Magic has repeatedly been considered a simpler version of chess, with both tactics and strategy. In fact, people better at games like chess are typically good at games like HoMM.
MMO's are usually representative of highly complex systems with a lot of details. Of course, you can just follow cookie cutter guides, but if you really want to understand how one of these games work, you need to keep track of multitudes of interactions between various concepts of the game. Furthermore, MMO's, and other team based games, can teach a lot of social aspects. You need to change your attitude if you want to lead a team to victory in League of Legends.
A lot of these things also have detrimental effects. Sports can cripple or even kill you. Addiction to games can lead to an unhealthy lifestyle. You can also engage in these things without a benefit. Amateur involvement, in fact, is more likely to leave you withot a benefit than being serious about something, whether it's a sport or a game. That is kinda beside the point, though, and there are worse ways to live your life than being a fat kid in a basement.
Some things have no positive side at all. Such as drugs. Gaming > drugs.
And if the fat kid beats you in an eating contest? Are you still more skilled than him in that particular case?
My younger self is mortified that my older self sort of agrees with you here.
In an attempt to get this tread back on topic...
Certain skillsets and weapon combinations have a serious advantage over others.. and those might have an advantage over another type. There will most definately be situations for every class/build where you come up against someone who has a skillset that is much more difficult to beat with your own. Sometimes you will get lucky, sometimes you won't, Just because vertical gear progession has been left behind in GW2 doesn't mean that the most skilled players will always win or that the lesser skilled players won't ever win, it's about builds as well.
Thats how it's intended to work anyway, from what I remember in dev Q&As. Whether it's like that at launch, who knows yet.
Alright, I have to get back to work, fine I'll admit that mmorpgs require as much skill as couch sitting and eating contest, happy?
Peace