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David Georgeson on travel/fast travel
hMJem
Member Posts: 465
I was surprised I didnt see a thread for this on the past few pages, so I can only assume no one made a thread regarding it
Yes, it's vague, but its the nature to post whatever Georgeson/Smedley say regarding MMOs onto the forums. This was a fan tweeting to Georgeson their opinion, and Georgeson replying yesterday.
Kinya @DaveGeorgeson Travelling across lands should be challenging not click - pay SC - done. With all those mounts it is fast atm
David Georgeson @WindstalkerEQ2 It's an opinion thing. Some players happier when travel to areas already explored is easy.
I guess we can change this into a discussion/opinionated thread as well: How much travel is too much for you?
Personally I've been expecting some form of fast travel in the game. Not flying mounts, but your typical "Been to this stable in this area? You can now instantly go to it from another stable/etc" and fast ground mounts. I just dont think the world will be like it was in EQ1 and make you take hours. They know people love convenience nowadays, but that's my opinion. I would be surprised if there were flying mounts, not surprised at other ways of travel.
Comments
Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!
Subscription Gaming, especially MMO gaming is a Cash grab bigger then the most P2W cash shop!
Bring Back Exploration and lengthy progression times. RPG's have always been about the Journey not the destination!!!
Doesn't matter if they go with different server rules. If you want to play on a server where it's casual and you really don't have to work to achieve anything then play on that server. Hopefully Smed will still have harsher server rules where there is no fast travel and you have to work to achieve anything.
He did mention that it would be a possibility but that was before the revamp, can't really seeing that still not being an option.
Ack no no - no travel for station cash. If they are referring to bought mounts in EQ - there are plenty of fast mounts to get without SC. I don't want to see any mechanic you can insta-buy and win with.
Mounts & Mass Transit of all types, sizes, and shapes should be the reliable method of travel and faster traveling mounts/mass transit does make sense.
Whats the point of having a big world if you can just blip here and there anytime you feel like it?
This isn't Star Trek folks; so immersion is lost with any kind of Teleportation.
EQ doesn't need mounts.
We could start the old fashion EQ way with a few classes able to cast run speed modifiers. Then introduce player made portals. After this at higher level you can also pay a few classes to bind a location in the game to a stone and that will enable any class to have several stones labled for various favorite spots in backpack or on a belt and use the stored charges on the stone to port to location. These stones would start with maybe only a 10 charge limit before needing recharge from a certain class. As character levels advance you can use higher charge stones.
So basically mounts would never need to be introduced and player interdependence along with economy will be preserved.
The stones idea comes from Ultima Online using rune stones to bind a location to it and then being able to get around using these stones, but it really does make sense and sounds like alot of fun for players to be in control of such things.
I will be disappointed if they have fast travel in the same manner as the fast travel in GW2.
I enjoyed the travel in EQ1, it made the world feel big.
In GW2, the cost for the portal travel is a joke, it's so low it doesn't even make it hard to decide to use it or not, you will always use it. It makes the world feel very very small.
I would prefer they have boats ala EQ1, wizard and druid travel.
Insta travel - no matter how large and seamless your world is, makes the world feel small.
-Briz
Do you guys realize some of the things you pretend to like would kill the games player base ? NO ONE wants to spend 30 minutes running across the world just to join a friend who has to log off now.
There are ways to do travel. Ships, Boats, Spells, Run Speed buffs etc. I don't support the wow, rift way or the way EQ is now, but there has to be some kind of fast ship travel this isnt 1999 no one wants to spend 15 minutes on a boat.
When I come home from work and have 2 hours to invest into a game Im interested in gameplay. Travel is not gameplay.
So to all you that remain online 24/7 feel free to travel for hours on end just don't drag me along into your chores.
Applies the same to LFG spamming or trade channel auctioning. I'm fine if you find joy in all of the above and have time to waste for such activities just don't DEMAND it's like that for everyone else.
The problem with travelling in MMO's is not that people don't have the time for it. The problem is that, just like everything else people want to skip... it's boring.
No one wants to skip moving from mission to mission in Grand Theft Auto. Why not? Because it's fun to drive around in that game. This is like the game APB Reloaded. Driving is a blast in that game these days, especially when you have your own tricked out car.
The answer to travelling in MMO's is not a matter of time. It's a matter of it being fun and engaging. To me, this is one of the biggest missed opportunities for creating a unique mini-game.
Horses should feel like they do in Red Dead Redemption of Shadow of the Colossus. People should be able to customize these mounts and take care of them in such a way that they might perform better. For modern and futuristic games, players should be able to rebuild and micromanage their cars and bikes and planes to at least some level of detail. They have to have ownership of these things to the point where they say, "YES! I WANT to drive my car." And then the game should make that experience fun and engaging.
Fast travel was a good option back in the day. But... it's time to move on. It's the little things like this that can make up for a lot of other issues.
Even run speeds were not enough in EQ before Luclin and POp, you relied on a Wizard or a Druid. I use to ferry people about with my wizard and it was fun getting a gating spell to higher level areas. Those days you really looked forward to getting new skills, you had worked hard and really were happy finally get that special spell.
Killing dragons is my shit
I agree...the travel is a part of the adventure, too many ista travels ruin the feeling of exploration and make the world too small.
"Brute force not work? It because you not use enought of it"
-Karg, Ogryn Bone'ead.
What is stopping you from traveling even if there are fast travel mechanics?
I already know the answer. "I dont want the temptation/I want people to play the same way I play."
It always comes down to "I want others to enjoy the game how I do" a lot of people are greedy consumers. Some people only have a few hours to kill. They dont want to spend 3/4 of it traveling, and the other 1/4 of their free time drinking after every single mob/actual gameplay.
Are you going to say "If they only can play 3 hours a day they shouldnt play at all?" That isnt a good marketing strategy for SOE when they have said their future is relying on EQN being a successful game.
What is a common trend for 3 of the biggest multi player games in the world right now? Call of Duty, League of Legends, World of Warcaft. Have an hour or two to kill? You can with those games. You can also play those games for 12 hours and benefit more than someone who plays for 2.
And even look at the growing sensation of cell phone games. On a break? Play your cell phone game. Wanna sit on the couch/in a comfy chair? Play your cell phone game.
Agreed.
I loved the travel aspect of old mmos. The world felt real and dangerous, and that feeling no longer exists in new MMOs. I think travel should be limited to horses and player teleportation spells. I want to ride boats, not talk to an NPC or go thru a portal and appear anywhere in seconds.
I liked carriage systems. Age of wushu had a good one (but a stupid teleport system that ruined it). It took quite a while to travel across the map.
The only thing is on a pvp server or a hostile flagged territory, there needs to be a way to stop the carriage and prevent them from travelling. Nothing ruins pvp with territory control and city building like allowing people to instantly appear at your gate. They should have to fight their way up, and travelling should be dangerous and time consuming enough for the opposition to have some warning to your presence before 50 people magically appear at your gate.
Realism is so lost on the modern MMO; what hope is there of immersion in EQN when the simple concept of meaningful travel seems to be so arbitrary and unimportant to Georgeson?
Fact is - if there is fast travel, people will use it. I'm one of those people who prefer limited to no fast travel, but if the game has fast travel available at limited to no cost, I'm going to fast travel. And this is the case with most players.
The only way to get players to walk to destinations is by either removing that "temptation" or only provide it with a high cost. The argument I keep hearing about "Well if you don't like fast travel, just don't use it", just doesn't really work.
In the end you're going to piss off one group or another.
Which group do you think is larger, the group that wants the game like EQ1, or the group that plays 3 hours a day?
Again, I am not in favor of one way or the other, but from a business strategy standpoint, there is no way I'm shunning the majority of the MMORPG base.
Uh...I only have probably 3-4 hours a day to play and I want it to be more like EQ1...Not much different than when I played before. Just now instead of school + sports I have work + chores to do.
Played: EQ1 (10 Years), Guild Wars, Rift, TERA
Tried: EQ2, Vanguard, Lord of the Rings Online, Dungeons and Dragons Online, Runes of Magic and countless others...
Currently Playing: GW2
Nytlok Sylas
80 Sylvari Ranger
I'm not really sure what you're getting at. If SOE wanted to make an incredibly easy and convenient game to begin with, they would have made another WoW clone just like every other recent MMO.
It also would make sense to copy WoW from a "business strategy standpoint" instead of going for the niche sandbox crowd, right?
Ultimately, the group thats willing to play a hardcore game stand to be more profitable in the long term. Sure, those spike numbers are great at launch or during expansions with box sales, but you're talking about a F2P game they want to be sustainable. Casual games, draw casual players, and casual play does not sustain a F2P mmo.
If they bork the progression and the other mechanics that make gameplay meaningful, people will get bored and move on like everything else. For longevity, an EQ1 system is honestly a no brainer.
Making the game have fast travel doesnt make it incredibly easy, that's my point. Bad game design (kill the boss, get the loot, do it again on Tuesday when the raids reset" is what makes the games easy.
I think SOE should be looking to maximize gamers time, and give more incentive to play more. If someone can only play for 3 hours, they should get 3 hours of meaningful playtime. Not 2 hours of traveling, half hour of forming a group, half hour of playing, then having to leave. And assuming they are going to a more sandbox approach, they are probably aiming for natural player-driven fun, not mindlessly smashing heads into the mouse and keyboard getting loot off PvE bosses.
Yeah, they could make no world, just dungeons, and when you log in, you instantly get grouped and play a dungeon to maximize time!
I am dead set against any arbitrary inconveniences that are put in the game to create a 'challenge'. To give an example :
If you design a huge MMO world with travel on mount in mind, then don't treat mounts as some silly midlevel (if they use a lvl system) reward. That is not a reward, this is releaving players of an annoyance. It also never make sense that they need to level to a certain point to be able to learn how to ride a horse! It is a lot more difficult to learn to fight then learn how to drive/ride.
Some MMO's that had the better solution imo were Vanguard where you received a horse very early on in the game. During lvling you were able to obtain cooler and faster mounts. Crafting could provide you with 'upgrades' (horseshoes, saddles, horse armour) to make your horse, faster, more efficient etc.
Other good examples are Fallen Earth and Star Wars Galaxies (later on when they were introduced). You started with crappy mounts, but were able to obtain cooler, faster and more efficient mounts later on. Both also involved crafting in this. This is one of the things what makes a game feel like a sandbox and not a themepark imo.
As for faster travel systems. For me this is dependable on the world that has been created. It has to use an immersive travel system. But more importantly, it should be the player's call how often it is needed. I love exploring in a game, but I detest having to travel the same boring long road 19327898734 times because my inventory is so tiny that I have to visit a merchant every 5 minutes. This is one of those restrictions that can really piss me off. If is also not challenging, but incredibly annoying and it has no place in a GAME.