Try 10 years ago. I made it to level 16 I think. I don't even know what a 5.3 is.
Yeah, I don't remember when I left WoW, I played for like 6 months because friends wanted to play it but I hated it the whole time, couldn't stand the community and eventually just left my friends there and went and did something else. I've never had the slightest interest in returning.
Quests at perfectly natural in mmorg's, quests tell a story, they provide lore and meaning and weight to the virtual world. Mmo'd evolved from rpg, rpg evolved from desktop d&d style games - all have story and lore at their core. The issue is modern players don't read and have little imagination or ability to role play - they are too busy worrying about the dps of other players.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
The issue is modern players don't read and have little imagination or ability to role play - they are too busy worrying about the dps of other players.
Originally posted by Bladestrom The issue is modern players don't read and have little imagination or ability to role play - they are too busy worrying about the dps of other players.
No, the issue is that modern players don't have a clue what roleplaying is and they think they can do it in a video game at all. Video games in general and MMOs in particular just are not set up for roleplaying. They have rules and victory conditions that are antithetical to roleplaying. You cannot both roleplay, especially if you're trying to play something outside of the normal combat-heavy MMO gameplay, and still play the game effectively.
If you want to roleplay, get a bunch of friends together, sit around a table and roll dice. Videogames are not where it's at.
No, the issue is that modern players don't have a clue what roleplaying is and they think they can do it in a video game at all. Video games in general and MMOs in particular just are not set up for roleplaying. They have rules and victory conditions that are antithetical to roleplaying. You cannot both roleplay, especially if you're trying to play something outside of the normal combat-heavy MMO gameplay, and still play the game effectively.
If you want to roleplay, get a bunch of friends together, sit around a table and roll dice. Videogames are not where it's at.
No .. it is not an issue. People are just not that interested in RPing. There are RPing servers in WOW and other games, and i don't think they are that popular.
People are playing video games, not RPing to have fun.
Originally posted by zymurgeist Because so many gamers have the socialization skills of Pondoland cannibal snails. Let loose in a competitive setting with zero real accountability they default to the worst behavior possible.
Is that inability to socialize or unwillingness to socialize? There is a difference.
No narius, modern player have associated 'RP' with Using their imagination and playing a role in a game. If you cannot role play on a game, what exactly do you have - moving pixels and no emotional engagement perhaps? Sounds familiar huh
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
In a game everyone needs to be treated equal because they are paying to play,you can not 100% simulate a real world scenario for pvp.That means EVERY player wants to feel 100% in balance with every other player ,that alone makes for unrealistic combat and ruins a lot of ideas that could simply not be accomplished because of pvp.
I will use a simple example,imagine you were a BLM with Sleep and the game is going to use some realism.Ok so i sleep you,now you have no chance of defending or attacking me until you awake.Ok so i run as far away as possible to just be able to reach you with my strongest nuke.Now the realism,i land a powerful nuke and it awakes you,problem is i am so far away,i just recast sleep then rinse and repeat and your dead,never once having any chance to hit me.
However in PVE all of that is not needed because in PVE each player should have a role and that does not need balance,it only needs balance versus the game design so as to not overpower anything.Perfect example is you could give a player no dps at all and it would not matter as long as a couple other players have dps.The other problem is devs are designing players to solo and removing the group+ MMO aspect.
I think that is why this new age trend of jack of all trades character design,devs are simply too lazy to differentiate between PVe and PVP and don't want the burden or hassle of constantly balancing.That way they let you choose and make your own mistakes that way they are off the hook for creating the balance needed in PVP.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
In a game everyone needs to be treated equal because they are paying to play,you can not 100% simulate a real world scenario for pvp.That means EVERY player wants to feel 100% in balance with every other player ,that alone makes for unrealistic combat and ruins a lot of ideas that could simply not be accomplished because of pvp.
I will use a simple example,imagine you were a BLM with Sleep and the game is going to use some realism.Ok so i sleep you,now you have no chance of defending or attacking me until you awake.Ok so i run as far away as possible to just be able to reach you with my strongest nuke.Now the realism,i land a powerful nuke and it awakes you,problem is i am so far away,i just recast sleep then rinse and repeat and your dead,never once having any chance to hit me.
However in PVE all of that is not needed because in PVE each player should have a role and that does not need balance,it only needs balance versus the game design so as to not overpower anything.Perfect example is you could give a player no dps at all and it would not matter as long as a couple other players have dps.The other problem is devs are designing players to solo and removing the group+ MMO aspect.
I think that is why this new age trend of jack of all trades character design,devs are simply too lazy to differentiate between PVe and PVP and don't want the burden or hassle of constantly balancing.That way they let you choose and make your own mistakes that way they are off the hook for creating the balance needed in PVP.
Crafters will equalize all things. Some "require" a permanent weak opponent in pvp and or pve or else this game sucks.
A crafter would craft coffee to counter your sleep spell, then the BLM would quit.
"If the Damned gave you a roadmap, then you'd know just where to go"
Originally posted by zymurgeist Because so many gamers have the socialization skills of Pondoland cannibal snails. Let loose in a competitive setting with zero real accountability they default to the worst behavior possible.
Is that inability to socialize or unwillingness to socialize? There is a difference.
Both and it's a distinction without a difference. People who socialize well tend to enjoy it.
Of course there is.
May be people just want to socialize in chatrooms, and bars .. and not in their games. There is no rule saying people have to enjoy socialization in every setting.
Originally posted by zymurgeist Because so many gamers have the socialization skills of Pondoland cannibal snails. Let loose in a competitive setting with zero real accountability they default to the worst behavior possible.
Is that inability to socialize or unwillingness to socialize? There is a difference.
Both and it's a distinction without a difference. People who socialize well tend to enjoy it.
Of course there is.
May be people just want to socialize in chatrooms, and bars .. and not in their games. There is no rule saying people have to enjoy socialization in every setting.
You're off point. If I was discussing social dynamics of chatrooms and bars I would be posing in a chatroom about bars.
Still, you have not make any compelling argument that players who want to socialize in games have no ability to.
Comments
You haven't played WoW since 5.3, huh? lol
.:| Kevyne@Shandris - Armory |:. - When WoW was #1 - .:| I AM A HOLY PALADIN - Guild Theme |:.
Try 10 years ago. I made it to level 16 I think. I don't even know what a 5.3 is.
"If the Damned gave you a roadmap, then you'd know just where to go"
Yeah, I don't remember when I left WoW, I played for like 6 months because friends wanted to play it but I hated it the whole time, couldn't stand the community and eventually just left my friends there and went and did something else. I've never had the slightest interest in returning.
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
That is just a preference, not an issue.
No, the issue is that modern players don't have a clue what roleplaying is and they think they can do it in a video game at all. Video games in general and MMOs in particular just are not set up for roleplaying. They have rules and victory conditions that are antithetical to roleplaying. You cannot both roleplay, especially if you're trying to play something outside of the normal combat-heavy MMO gameplay, and still play the game effectively.
If you want to roleplay, get a bunch of friends together, sit around a table and roll dice. Videogames are not where it's at.
Played: UO, EQ, WoW, DDO, SWG, AO, CoH, EvE, TR, AoC, GW, GA, Aion, Allods, lots more
Relatively Recently (Re)Played: HL2 (all), Halo (PC, all), Batman:AA; AC, ME, BS, DA, FO3, DS, Doom (all), LFD1&2, KOTOR, Portal 1&2, Blink, Elder Scrolls (all), lots more
Now Playing: None
Hope: None
No .. it is not an issue. People are just not that interested in RPing. There are RPing servers in WOW and other games, and i don't think they are that popular.
People are playing video games, not RPing to have fun.
Is that inability to socialize or unwillingness to socialize? There is a difference.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
The point of pvp and pve isn't to work, it's to make people think they are hardcore.
They work fine together when designed to.
"If the Damned gave you a roadmap, then you'd know just where to go"
The answer is actually quite simple.
In a game everyone needs to be treated equal because they are paying to play,you can not 100% simulate a real world scenario for pvp.That means EVERY player wants to feel 100% in balance with every other player ,that alone makes for unrealistic combat and ruins a lot of ideas that could simply not be accomplished because of pvp.
I will use a simple example,imagine you were a BLM with Sleep and the game is going to use some realism.Ok so i sleep you,now you have no chance of defending or attacking me until you awake.Ok so i run as far away as possible to just be able to reach you with my strongest nuke.Now the realism,i land a powerful nuke and it awakes you,problem is i am so far away,i just recast sleep then rinse and repeat and your dead,never once having any chance to hit me.
However in PVE all of that is not needed because in PVE each player should have a role and that does not need balance,it only needs balance versus the game design so as to not overpower anything.Perfect example is you could give a player no dps at all and it would not matter as long as a couple other players have dps.The other problem is devs are designing players to solo and removing the group+ MMO aspect.
I think that is why this new age trend of jack of all trades character design,devs are simply too lazy to differentiate between PVe and PVP and don't want the burden or hassle of constantly balancing.That way they let you choose and make your own mistakes that way they are off the hook for creating the balance needed in PVP.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Crafters will equalize all things. Some "require" a permanent weak opponent in pvp and or pve or else this game sucks.
A crafter would craft coffee to counter your sleep spell, then the BLM would quit.
"If the Damned gave you a roadmap, then you'd know just where to go"
Of course there is.
May be people just want to socialize in chatrooms, and bars .. and not in their games. There is no rule saying people have to enjoy socialization in every setting.
Still, you have not make any compelling argument that players who want to socialize in games have no ability to.