Every publicly listed company in the US creates a yearly financial report and you don't see them being attacked over every little line item in there. People like transparency and if the equity is in the green no one will complain and those that do will be shut up faster than you can say "Derek Smart".
I have said this many times before: There is no good reason not to disclose your financials like every other publicly listed company in the world does. If you have nothing to hide then this will only help your Company.
If the company as a whole is healthy then it does not matter how much they spend or what the line items say. In fact, if the books are in order the press will surely praise the project to the crowdfunding heavens. They will fuel the hype train an make it go so fast your heads will spin.
When are we really ever looking at those reports in such a manner? I can't recall a single thread here about investigating a companies financial reports. All most people use them for is to argue about who has failed and who hasn't. I can't think of a single time anyone brought up itemized lists in reference to these reports.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
i wanna know with all the people on this website backing Dsmart.. My question for you is. How may Games from Dsmart do you own? and currently play? LOL
Nice try, you need to learn how to build a good straw man argument though, this was really pathetic. I will refer you to Chris Roberts first reply, he does a pretty decent although very obvious job at building the Derek Smart straw man.
im not, it was just an honest question. I can't stand the guy. This isn't the first time he has done this to CR or other companies. I am a pro CR supporter. I love the Wingcommander series. i have put a fair share of money into Star Citizen and im not worried at all. yeah i would like to see faster progession in the game but i also dont want to see it rushed. With what the game plan is with Star citizen im pretty happy with my investment and can't wait to see what they do with the fps module and can't wait for squad42 module. the game is going on the 4th year of production and couldn't be happier with the direction of the game. but then again im not one for instant satisfaction.
with that being said i think what the escapist did was just wrong. and i agree with CR in his responce most on just about 95% of everything he has said. (can't say i agree on somethings) but thats to be expected for any project. and the fact the Dsmart was so desperate to get a rise out of CR to bring his wife and kid into the mix while posting his home address. that right their should have gotten the Dsmart supporters to jump off his "band wagon". i mean really who does that. the mans a psychopath. that whole escapist article was a farce.
also I have read that entire article and the one from the escapist. so the stuff said about Dsmart was a long time coming and needed to be said imo.
As someone who works in audit, I can tell you for a fact that making that kind of report is not only time consuming, but costly as well. Not to mention the extra burden placed on people for validate, be validated, etc etc.
This is why you don't see many private companies disclosing their financial details. If public companies don't have to do it, I'm sure many will choose not to do it either. It is a way for CIG ti defend themselves, but for them it may not be the best option.
The amusing part about all of this back and forth bullshit with CIG is that if they'd just open up the accounting ledger and give everyone some transparency about the crowdfunded money, then most of this bullshit would stop.
We spent 'x' on payroll, We spent 'x' on equipment, We spent 'x' on office space, We spent 'x' on voice acting, We spent 'x' on motion capture, My wife and I are paying ourselves 'x' amount per year to create this game.
Sure, there will be new bitching in the form of "Why did you guys spend so much money on that?" and "I didn't crowdfund this game so you can make a million per year salary!", but no one will be able to say that the game isn't being produced. No one will be able to call it vaporware.
I've thought about this as well as I'm sure have a lot of folks following this story. The thing is, though, if CIG starts giving out detailed information then I foresee Derek Smart in all of his self-proclaimed expertise criticizing every single line item in that report and stirring up even more bullshit. He'll be spouting things like "there's no reason they should have spent X amount on Y. I've made a dozen shitty, forgettable games and it never cost me that much!" I can imagine that with more information at their disposal the detractors could use it as ammunition to try and disrupt the game's progress even further.
Having said that, it probably wouldn't hurt at this point for CIG to reveal a ballpark figure about how long they can continue development with their current funds. A statement like "with our current funds, we can pay for the game's develop for another 6 months based on our cost history thus far" or whatever might be in order at this point. But a detailed expense report? I don't know ... that may actually make things worse for them even if it's on the up-and-up.
Every publicly listed company in the US creates a yearly financial report and you don't see them being attacked over every little line item in there. People like transparency and if the equity is in the green no one will complain and those that do will be shut up faster than you can say "Derek Smart".
I have said this many times before: There is no good reason not to disclose your financials like every other publicly listed company in the world does. If you have nothing to hide then this will only help your Company.
If the company as a whole is healthy then it does not matter how much they spend or what the line items say. In fact, if the books are in order the press will surely praise the project to the crowdfunding heavens. They will fuel the hype train an make it go so fast your heads will spin.
MrSnuffles I'll save you the wait for the responses from the usual suspects and answer for them. They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books.
At which point you will bring up some very good arguments as to why it would help their case if they did show some transparency and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You will follow it up with some more points about how it could only serve to help things and you are sure a full blown detailed report isn't necessary but something with substance to blow away the cloud of doubt and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You might as well have an argument with a cheese sandwich at this point, it will get you just as far but at least at the end of the argument you can eat the sandwich and feel like you haven't completely wasted your time.
i wanna know with all the people on this website backing Dsmart.. My question for you is. How may Games from Dsmart do you own? and currently play? LOL
Nice try, you need to learn how to build a good straw man argument though, this was really pathetic. I will refer you to Chris Roberts first reply, he does a pretty decent although very obvious job at building the Derek Smart straw man.
im not, it was just an honest question. I can't stand the guy. This isn't the first time he has done this to CR or other companies. I am a pro CR supporter. I love the Wingcommander series. i have put a fair share of money into Star Citizen and im not worried at all. yeah i would like to see faster progession in the game but i also dont want to see it rushed. With what the game plan is with Star citizen im pretty happy with my investment and can't wait to see what they do with the fps module and can't wait for squad42 module. the game is going on the 4th year of production and couldn't be happier with the direction of the game. but then again im not one for instant satisfaction.
with that being said i think what the escapist did was just wrong. and i agree with CR in his responce most on just about 95% of everything he has said. (can't say i agree on somethings) but thats to be expected for any project. and the fact the Dsmart was so desperate to get a rise out of CR to bring his wife and kid into the mix while posting his home address. that right their should have gotten the Dsmart supporters to jump off his "band wagon". i mean really who does that. the mans a psychopath. that whole escapist article was a farce.
also I have read that entire article and the one from the escapist. so the stuff said about Dsmart was a long time coming and needed to be said imo.
That's what about every SC fan seems to miss. This isn't Twilight. There is no Team Smart Vs. Team Roberts. Every time someone brings up Derek Smart to try and defend SC it reeks of desperation. If tomorrow Derek Smart was caught sacrificing children to Satan it would do nothing to increase my confidence in CIG.
MrSnuffles I'll save you the wait for the responses from the usual suspects and answer for them. They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books.
At which point you will bring up some very good arguments as to why it would help their case if they did show some transparency and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You will follow it up with some more points about how it could only serve to help things and you are sure a full blown detailed report isn't necessary but something with substance to blow away the cloud of doubt and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You might as well have an argument with a cheese sandwich at this point, it will get you just as far but at least at the end of the argument you can eat the sandwich and feel like you haven't completely wasted your time.
DO you really believe at this point anything is going to slow down the wave here? It's beyond the point of no return IMO. They show this, people will demand that, that's just the way it is, as most of these people arguing back and forth are doing so from a position that is pretty irrelevant. We're arguing to argue, we have no stake in this. Besides, when does the greater I-net populace ever trust companies to begin with?
I also don't think it's a secret that most of those jumping on this were already against SC/RSI anyway. As most of the hate and vitriol is about their ship related money making practices.
How long before people start claiming "the books were rigged", "you can't trust a salesman" etc...? Something will always be amiss, the backer woes is just one more topic to cling to for an "I told ya so".. Just as the opposite goes for those steadfast in the CR camp... nothing will ever be amiss..
SO sure we can say all we want about it being an act of good will to do this or do that, but in the end it will make little difference.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
MrSnuffles I'll save you the wait for the responses from the usual suspects and answer for them. They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books.
At which point you will bring up some very good arguments as to why it would help their case if they did show some transparency and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You will follow it up with some more points about how it could only serve to help things and you are sure a full blown detailed report isn't necessary but something with substance to blow away the cloud of doubt and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You might as well have an argument with a cheese sandwich at this point, it will get you just as far but at least at the end of the argument you can eat the sandwich and feel like you haven't completely wasted your time.
DO you really believe at this point anything is going to slow down the wave here? It's beyond the point of no return IMO. They show this, people will demand that, that's just the way it is, as most of these people arguing back and forth are doing so from a position that is pretty irrelevant. We're arguing to argue we have no stake in this, besides, when does the greater I-net populace ever trust companies to begin with?
I also don't think it's a secret that most of those jumping on this were already against SC/RSI anyway, as most of the hate and vitriol is about their ship related money making practices. How long before people start claiming "the books were rigged", "you can't trust a salesman" etc...? Something will always be amiss, according to most of those against RSI here, the backer woes is just one more topic to cling to for an "I told ya so" Just as it goes for those steadfast in the CR camp... nothing will ever be amiss..
SO sure we can say all we want that it would be an act of good will to do this or do that, but in the end it will make little difference.
Actually, all they really have to do to prove their critics wrong is to keep going. If they have the funds to keep going at or near their current size then the ex-employees were full of B.S. and there is nothing to worry about. If what Mr. Smart says is true then they'll collapse soon having spent all their funds. There actually is little need to see the books, time will make everything clear.
MrSnuffles I'll save you the wait for the responses from the usual suspects and answer for them. They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books.
At which point you will bring up some very good arguments as to why it would help their case if they did show some transparency and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You will follow it up with some more points about how it could only serve to help things and you are sure a full blown detailed report isn't necessary but something with substance to blow away the cloud of doubt and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You might as well have an argument with a cheese sandwich at this point, it will get you just as far but at least at the end of the argument you can eat the sandwich and feel like you haven't completely wasted your time.
DO you really believe at this point anything is going to slow down the wave here? It's beyond the point of no return IMO. They show this, people will demand that, that's just the way it is, as most of these people arguing back and forth are doing so from a position that is pretty irrelevant. We're arguing to argue we have no stake in this, besides, when does the greater I-net populace ever trust companies to begin with?
I also don't think it's a secret that most of those jumping on this were already against SC/RSI anyway, as most of the hate and vitriol is about their ship related money making practices. How long before people start claiming "the books were rigged", "you can't trust a salesman" etc...? Something will always be amiss, according to most of those against RSI here, the backer woes is just one more topic to cling to for an "I told ya so" Just as it goes for those steadfast in the CR camp... nothing will ever be amiss..
SO sure we can say all we want that it would be an act of good will to do this or do that, but in the end it will make little difference.
Actually, all they really have to do to prove their critics wrong is to keep going. If they have the funds to keep going at or near their current size then the ex-employees were full of B.S. and there is nothing to worry about. If what Mr. Smart says is true then they'll collapse soon having spent all their funds. There actually is little need to see the books, time will make everything clear.
Actually no. They're still raising funds at the rate of a couple of million per month. If they keep that up they can keep going indefinitely. Your scenario about former employees being full of BS only works if they stop raising money and build the promised game with what they already raised.
It's entirely possible that they have been pissing the money away and then stop doing so under scrutiny, bare down and produce the game with the $2 mil per month they're currently raising.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
DO you really believe at this point anything is going to slow down the wave here? It's beyond the point of no return IMO. They show this, people will demand that, that's just the way it is, as most of these people arguing back and forth are doing so from a position that is pretty irrelevant. We're arguing to argue we have no stake in this, besides, when does the greater I-net populace ever trust companies to begin with?
I also don't think it's a secret that most of those jumping on this were already against SC/RSI anyway, as most of the hate and vitriol is about their ship related money making practices. How long before people start claiming "the books were rigged", "you can't trust a salesman" etc...? Something will always be amiss, according to most of those against RSI here, the backer woes is just one more topic to cling to for an "I told ya so" Just as it goes for those steadfast in the CR camp... nothing will ever be amiss..
SO sure we can say all we want that it would be an act of good will to do this or do that, but in the end it will make little difference.
Actually, all they really have to do to prove their critics wrong is to keep going. If they have the funds to keep going at or near their current size then the ex-employees were full of B.S. and there is nothing to worry about. If what Mr. Smart says is true then they'll collapse soon having spent all their funds. There actually is little need to see the books, time will make everything clear.
I'd say that's a fine point, the problem for them though is if they need any additional funding down the road, that's where this kind of thing can really bite them. Working diligently or not that is always going to be a possibility, especially when they start putting these modules together, who knows what could go wrong, or how long it will take to get into decent working order. .
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
MrSnuffles I'll save you the wait for the responses from the usual suspects and answer for them. They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books.
At which point you will bring up some very good arguments as to why it would help their case if they did show some transparency and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You will follow it up with some more points about how it could only serve to help things and you are sure a full blown detailed report isn't necessary but something with substance to blow away the cloud of doubt and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You might as well have an argument with a cheese sandwich at this point, it will get you just as far but at least at the end of the argument you can eat the sandwich and feel like you haven't completely wasted your time.
DO you really believe at this point anything is going to slow down the wave here? It's beyond the point of no return IMO. They show this, people will demand that, that's just the way it is, as most of these people arguing back and forth are doing so from a position that is pretty irrelevant. We're arguing to argue, we have no stake in this. Besides, when does the greater I-net populace ever trust companies to begin with?
I also don't think it's a secret that most of those jumping on this were already against SC/RSI anyway. As most of the hate and vitriol is about their ship related money making practices.
How long before people start claiming "the books were rigged", "you can't trust a salesman" etc...? Something will always be amiss, the backer woes is just one more topic to cling to for an "I told ya so".. Just as the opposite goes for those steadfast in the CR camp... nothing will ever be amiss..
SO sure we can say all we want about it being an act of good will to do this or do that, but in the end it will make little difference.
I won't argue that there will be the nuts that won't believe anything anyway but the argument will start to lose traction if something was shown.
Granted it won't take long before someone does come along and calls into question if the books were legit or not but they will have bought themselves some peace and quiet (relatively speaking) for a little while and probably get an influx of donations from people straddling the fence.
MrSnuffles I'll save you the wait for the responses from the usual suspects and answer for them. They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books.
At which point you will bring up some very good arguments as to why it would help their case if they did show some transparency and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You will follow it up with some more points about how it could only serve to help things and you are sure a full blown detailed report isn't necessary but something with substance to blow away the cloud of doubt and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You might as well have an argument with a cheese sandwich at this point, it will get you just as far but at least at the end of the argument you can eat the sandwich and feel like you haven't completely wasted your time.
DO you really believe at this point anything is going to slow down the wave here? It's beyond the point of no return IMO. They show this, people will demand that, that's just the way it is, as most of these people arguing back and forth are doing so from a position that is pretty irrelevant. We're arguing to argue we have no stake in this, besides, when does the greater I-net populace ever trust companies to begin with?
I also don't think it's a secret that most of those jumping on this were already against SC/RSI anyway, as most of the hate and vitriol is about their ship related money making practices. How long before people start claiming "the books were rigged", "you can't trust a salesman" etc...? Something will always be amiss, according to most of those against RSI here, the backer woes is just one more topic to cling to for an "I told ya so" Just as it goes for those steadfast in the CR camp... nothing will ever be amiss..
SO sure we can say all we want that it would be an act of good will to do this or do that, but in the end it will make little difference.
Actually, all they really have to do to prove their critics wrong is to keep going. If they have the funds to keep going at or near their current size then the ex-employees were full of B.S. and there is nothing to worry about. If what Mr. Smart says is true then they'll collapse soon having spent all their funds. There actually is little need to see the books, time will make everything clear.
Actually no. They're still raising funds at the rate of a couple of million per month. If they keep that up they can keep going indefinitely. Your scenario about former employees being full of BS only works if they stop raising money and build the promised game with what they already raised.
It's entirely possible that they have been pissing the money away and then stop doing so under scrutiny, bare down and produce the game with the $2 mil per month they're currently raising.
Can you sustain 260 employees on 2 mil per month? My assumption is that to do that they would need to start shedding employees like crazy in which case it would also be fairly clear.
I won't argue that there will be the nuts that won't believe anything anyway but the argument will start to lose traction if something was shown.
Granted it won't take long before someone does come along and calls into question if the books were legit or not but they will have bought themselves some peace and quiet (relatively speaking) for a little while and probably get an influx of donations from people straddling the fence.
That's a good point as well. It may help in regard to those on the fence.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
MrSnuffles I'll save you the wait for the responses from the usual suspects and answer for them. They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books.
At which point you will bring up some very good arguments as to why it would help their case if they did show some transparency and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You will follow it up with some more points about how it could only serve to help things and you are sure a full blown detailed report isn't necessary but something with substance to blow away the cloud of doubt and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You might as well have an argument with a cheese sandwich at this point, it will get you just as far but at least at the end of the argument you can eat the sandwich and feel like you haven't completely wasted your time.
DO you really believe at this point anything is going to slow down the wave here? It's beyond the point of no return IMO. They show this, people will demand that, that's just the way it is, as most of these people arguing back and forth are doing so from a position that is pretty irrelevant. We're arguing to argue we have no stake in this, besides, when does the greater I-net populace ever trust companies to begin with?
I also don't think it's a secret that most of those jumping on this were already against SC/RSI anyway, as most of the hate and vitriol is about their ship related money making practices. How long before people start claiming "the books were rigged", "you can't trust a salesman" etc...? Something will always be amiss, according to most of those against RSI here, the backer woes is just one more topic to cling to for an "I told ya so" Just as it goes for those steadfast in the CR camp... nothing will ever be amiss..
SO sure we can say all we want that it would be an act of good will to do this or do that, but in the end it will make little difference.
Actually, all they really have to do to prove their critics wrong is to keep going. If they have the funds to keep going at or near their current size then the ex-employees were full of B.S. and there is nothing to worry about. If what Mr. Smart says is true then they'll collapse soon having spent all their funds. There actually is little need to see the books, time will make everything clear.
Actually no. They're still raising funds at the rate of a couple of million per month. If they keep that up they can keep going indefinitely. Your scenario about former employees being full of BS only works if they stop raising money and build the promised game with what they already raised.
It's entirely possible that they have been pissing the money away and then stop doing so under scrutiny, bare down and produce the game with the $2 mil per month they're currently raising.
Can you sustain 260 employees on 2 mil per month? My assumption is that to do that they would need to start shedding employees like crazy in which case it would also be fairly clear.
Depending on whether we're talking about 260 full time equivalent (FTE) or 260 bodies some of whom work part time. Even if we're talking about 260 FTE and their average salary is $70K per year (which would be on the high side since hat 260 includes support staff) that's $18 mil per year. So yeah, it sort of works.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
MrSnuffles I'll save you the wait for the responses from the usual suspects and answer for them. They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books.
At which point you will bring up some very good arguments as to why it would help their case if they did show some transparency and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You will follow it up with some more points about how it could only serve to help things and you are sure a full blown detailed report isn't necessary but something with substance to blow away the cloud of doubt and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
You might as well have an argument with a cheese sandwich at this point, it will get you just as far but at least at the end of the argument you can eat the sandwich and feel like you haven't completely wasted your time.
DO you really believe at this point anything is going to slow down the wave here? It's beyond the point of no return IMO. They show this, people will demand that, that's just the way it is, as most of these people arguing back and forth are doing so from a position that is pretty irrelevant. We're arguing to argue we have no stake in this, besides, when does the greater I-net populace ever trust companies to begin with?
I also don't think it's a secret that most of those jumping on this were already against SC/RSI anyway, as most of the hate and vitriol is about their ship related money making practices. How long before people start claiming "the books were rigged", "you can't trust a salesman" etc...? Something will always be amiss, according to most of those against RSI here, the backer woes is just one more topic to cling to for an "I told ya so" Just as it goes for those steadfast in the CR camp... nothing will ever be amiss..
SO sure we can say all we want that it would be an act of good will to do this or do that, but in the end it will make little difference.
Actually, all they really have to do to prove their critics wrong is to keep going. If they have the funds to keep going at or near their current size then the ex-employees were full of B.S. and there is nothing to worry about. If what Mr. Smart says is true then they'll collapse soon having spent all their funds. There actually is little need to see the books, time will make everything clear.
Actually no. They're still raising funds at the rate of a couple of million per month. If they keep that up they can keep going indefinitely. Your scenario about former employees being full of BS only works if they stop raising money and build the promised game with what they already raised.
It's entirely possible that they have been pissing the money away and then stop doing so under scrutiny, bare down and produce the game with the $2 mil per month they're currently raising.
Can you sustain 260 employees on 2 mil per month? My assumption is that to do that they would need to start shedding employees like crazy in which case it would also be fairly clear.
Depending on whether we're talking about 260 full time equivalent (FTE) or 260 bodies some of whom work part time. Even if we're talking about 260 FTE and their average salary is $70K per year (which would be on the high side since hat 260 includes support staff) that's $18 mil per year. So yeah, it sort of works.
Employees cost a lot more than just their base salary and they're not
the only expense so I have my doubts they could do it unless a significant portion of the employees were part time which is... completely possible.
So if Roberts can pull a complete 180 on spending he might be able to pull through assuming he can manage to keep the books closed. Interesting.
Employees cost a lot more than just their base salary and they're not
the only expense so I have my doubts they could do it unless a significant portion of the employees were part time which is... completely possible.
So if Roberts can pull a complete 180 on spending he might be able to pull through assuming he can manage to keep the books closed. Interesting.
The whole controversy could be a blessing in disguise for backers ... provided of course, that the funding doesn't dry-up. That's the biggest danger and probably their biggest fear.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
Can you sustain 260 employees on 2 mil per month? My assumption is that to do that they would need to start shedding employees like crazy in which case it would also be fairly clear.
Depending on whether we're talking about 260 full time equivalent (FTE) or 260 bodies some of whom work part time. Even if we're talking about 260 FTE and their average salary is $70K per year (which would be on the high side since hat 260 includes support staff) that's $18 mil per year. So yeah, it sort of works.
add 50%-150% onto each employees salary. If we are assuming 70k a year and 261 full time employees then you are looking between 27,405,000 mil to 45,675,000 mil. Lets pick middle ground of 100% and say 36,540,000 mil a year. Burn rate is rather high looking at it that way for cash.
40 pages of speculation, that's what this thread is. I imagine this thread could go on for eternity until proof is revealed against the claims made. I'm sure no one here really cares about proof though. We would much rather beat a dead horse for a few weeks and not get any further in the discussion than when it first started.
Hey now! I care about proof! Since I know none is forthcoming from any side I will happily beat the horse until it is nothing but a gooey pile of pink pulp.
Can you sustain 260 employees on 2 mil per month? My assumption is that to do that they would need to start shedding employees like crazy in which case it would also be fairly clear.
Depending on whether we're talking about 260 full time equivalent (FTE) or 260 bodies some of whom work part time. Even if we're talking about 260 FTE and their average salary is $70K per year (which would be on the high side since hat 260 includes support staff) that's $18 mil per year. So yeah, it sort of works.
add 50%-150% onto each employees salary. If we are assuming 70k a year and 261 full time employees then you are looking between 27,405,000 mil to 45,675,000 mil. Lets pick middle ground of 100% and say 36,540,000 mil a year. Burn rate is rather high looking at it that way for cash.
Well I won't argue about figures we actually know nothing about without looking at the books. And of course there are many other costs on top of salary and benefits. The point is that it's entirely possible that what is being said about CIG's mishandling of the funds at this point is correct and that they also can still pull the game off anyway with new funds that they're getting daily.
Delivering the game, more or less as promised, could still happen whether or not there has been some malfeasance.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
40 pages of speculation, that's what this thread is. I imagine this thread could go on for eternity until proof is revealed against the claims made. I'm sure no one here really cares about proof though. We would much rather beat a dead horse for a few weeks and not get any further in the discussion than when it first started.
Yeah, most of these 40 pages are just wasted energy, but even the defenders keep it going as long as the real issue is not discussed: Are CIG running out of money? The rest is just... Bleh... Who cares. Even CIG uses a lot of energy on keeping the debate off-topic, and Mr. Smart really is not heping either as even he can't manage to keep on the real issue.
As someone who works in audit, I can tell you for a fact that making that kind of report is not only time consuming, but costly as well. Not to mention the extra burden placed on people for validate, be validated, etc etc.
This is why you don't see many private companies disclosing their financial details. If public companies don't have to do it, I'm sure many will choose not to do it either. It is a way for CIG ti defend themselves, but for them it may not be the best option.
Complete and utter nonsense. They use a software package like every other company and they come with a module to create these financial reports because the CEO and the bean counters need these reports on a monthly basis.
It takes a workday to create such high level a report with the software available. If they don;t do their books with a software package, then they got a real Problem.
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling." - Michael Bitton Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about." - SEANMCAD
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling." - Michael Bitton Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about." - SEANMCAD
Comments
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
with that being said i think what the escapist did was just wrong. and i agree with CR in his responce most on just about 95% of everything he has said. (can't say i agree on somethings) but thats to be expected for any project. and the fact the Dsmart was so desperate to get a rise out of CR to bring his wife and kid into the mix while posting his home address. that right their should have gotten the Dsmart supporters to jump off his "band wagon". i mean really who does that. the mans a psychopath. that whole escapist article was a farce.
also I have read that entire article and the one from the escapist. so the stuff said about Dsmart was a long time coming and needed to be said imo.
This is why you don't see many private companies disclosing their financial details. If public companies don't have to do it, I'm sure many will choose not to do it either. It is a way for CIG ti defend themselves, but for them it may not be the best option.
MrSnuffles I'll save you the wait for the responses from the usual suspects and answer for them. They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books.
At which point you will bring up some very good arguments as to why it would help their case if they did show some transparency and the response will be "They aren't a publicly traded company so they don't have to open their books."
I also don't think it's a secret that most of those jumping on this were already against SC/RSI anyway. As most of the hate and vitriol is about their ship related money making practices.
How long before people start claiming "the books were rigged", "you can't trust a salesman" etc...? Something will always be amiss, the backer woes is just one more topic to cling to for an "I told ya so".. Just as the opposite goes for those steadfast in the CR camp... nothing will ever be amiss..
SO sure we can say all we want about it being an act of good will to do this or do that, but in the end it will make little difference.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
It's entirely possible that they have been pissing the money away and then stop doing so under scrutiny, bare down and produce the game with the $2 mil per month they're currently raising.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
I won't argue that there will be the nuts that won't believe anything anyway but the argument will start to lose traction if something was shown.
Granted it won't take long before someone does come along and calls into question if the books were legit or not but they will have bought themselves some peace and quiet (relatively speaking) for a little while and probably get an influx of donations from people straddling the fence.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
And people say critics are out to gain something. Fuck you CIG, I wasn't going to but upon seeing this I am seeking a refund.
So if Roberts can pull a complete 180 on spending he might be able to pull through assuming he can manage to keep the books closed. Interesting.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
Hey now! I care about proof! Since I know none is forthcoming from any side I will happily beat the horse until it is nothing but a gooey pile of pink pulp.
Delivering the game, more or less as promised, could still happen whether or not there has been some malfeasance.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
It takes a workday to create such high level a report with the software available. If they don;t do their books with a software package, then they got a real Problem.
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling."
- Michael Bitton
Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about."
- SEANMCAD
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Note: The functionality to apply skins has not been implemented yet and will be available at some point in the future!
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There is no game. The game is a lie! :awesome:
"It's pretty simple, really. If your only intention in posting about a particular game or topic is to be negative, then yes, you should probably move on. Voicing a negative opinion is fine, continually doing so on the same game is basically just trolling."
- Michael Bitton
Community Manager, MMORPG.com
"As an online discussion about Star Citizen grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Derek Smart approaches 1" - MrSnuffles's law
"I am jumping in here a bit without knowing exactly what you all or talking about."
- SEANMCAD
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HAHA
I guess that one is for the new legal fees?
Or is he just trying to get all he can before it dies..
Life IS Feudal