Again, by saying nothing, Escapist has said a lot.
In the interest of fairness they have probably been advised to stay mum not out of any moral high ground. It does show they are smart enough to seek competent legal advice before speaking.
I didn't mean to imply they were taking moral high ground, though. Just that they were basically telling CIG to file the lawsuit if they really thought they'd win it. The silence only says Escapist thinks they're not at fault for defamation.
What if The Escapists lack of response is because the email has been sitting in their spam folder the last few days?!? I've heard these things can happen
Again, by saying nothing, Escapist has said a lot.
In the interest of fairness they have probably been advised to stay mum not out of any moral high ground. It does show they are smart enough to seek competent legal advice before speaking.
I didn't mean to imply they were taking moral high ground, though. Just that they were basically telling CIG to file the lawsuit if they really thought they'd win it. The silence only says Escapist thinks they're not at fault for defamation.
Sorry then my mistake
I'd be willing to bet Escapist's legal team did advise them to say nothing. I totally agree with you there. That basically sends the appropriate message without coming off as antagonistic.
Again, by saying nothing, Escapist has said a lot.
In the interest of fairness they have probably been advised to stay mum not out of any moral high ground. It does show they are smart enough to seek competent legal advice before speaking.
I didn't mean to imply they were taking moral high ground, though. Just that they were basically telling CIG to file the lawsuit if they really thought they'd win it. The silence only says Escapist thinks they're not at fault for defamation.
Sorry then my mistake
I'd be willing to bet Escapist's legal team did advise them to say nothing. I totally agree with you there. That basically sends the appropriate message without coming off as antagonistic.
Or as I've stated, it makes them look like they are possibly pissing themselves in fear. Schrodinger's cat as it were. A statement even one sentence long could go a long way to set their record straight.
If they are pissing themselves with fear and know they are in wrong wouldn't they just retract the story and apologize.
Again, by saying nothing, Escapist has said a lot.
In the interest of fairness they have probably been advised to stay mum not out of any moral high ground. It does show they are smart enough to seek competent legal advice before speaking.
I didn't mean to imply they were taking moral high ground, though. Just that they were basically telling CIG to file the lawsuit if they really thought they'd win it. The silence only says Escapist thinks they're not at fault for defamation.
Sorry then my mistake
I'd be willing to bet Escapist's legal team did advise them to say nothing. I totally agree with you there. That basically sends the appropriate message without coming off as antagonistic.
Or as I've stated, it makes them look like they are possibly pissing themselves in fear. Schrodinger's cat as it were. A statement even one sentence long could go a long way to set their record straight.
Again, by saying nothing, Escapist has said a lot.
In the interest of fairness they have probably been advised to stay mum not out of any moral high ground. It does show they are smart enough to seek competent legal advice before speaking.
I didn't mean to imply they were taking moral high ground, though. Just that they were basically telling CIG to file the lawsuit if they really thought they'd win it. The silence only says Escapist thinks they're not at fault for defamation.
Sorry then my mistake
I'd be willing to bet Escapist's legal team did advise them to say nothing. I totally agree with you there. That basically sends the appropriate message without coming off as antagonistic.
Or as I've stated, it makes them look like they are possibly pissing themselves in fear. Schrodinger's cat as it were. A statement even one sentence long could go a long way to set their record straight.
If they are pissing themselves with fear and know they are in wrong wouldn't they just retract the story and apologize.
Well no because in the narrative of the thread so far that CR and CIG won't open their books because they know they are guilty the same rules apply for the Escapist. If they just back down and retract the story they color themselves as automatically guilty. If they force a lawsuit they can possibly weasel out by looking like the victim of a bully with an agenda, guilty or not. Prolonged silence is only going to make these speculative attacks against them worse.
Not to me. I think silence is perfectly reasonable and shines a negative light not on the Escapist article, but on CIG. I'm actually surprised that anyone would give a shit about a sentence or two when it's obvious they are leaving this thing up.
LOL after they verifyed the whistleblowers they sent it all to their legal team. From that point on no matter what CR said in any letter they would not go back on story. It was a waste for CR to even ask for a retraction, it was never going to happen.
Again, by saying nothing, Escapist has said a lot.
In the interest of fairness they have probably been advised to stay mum not out of any moral high ground. It does show they are smart enough to seek competent legal advice before speaking.
I didn't mean to imply they were taking moral high ground, though. Just that they were basically telling CIG to file the lawsuit if they really thought they'd win it. The silence only says Escapist thinks they're not at fault for defamation.
Sorry then my mistake
I'd be willing to bet Escapist's legal team did advise them to say nothing. I totally agree with you there. That basically sends the appropriate message without coming off as antagonistic.
Or as I've stated, it makes them look like they are possibly pissing themselves in fear. Schrodinger's cat as it were. A statement even one sentence long could go a long way to set their record straight.
If they are pissing themselves with fear and know they are in wrong wouldn't they just retract the story and apologize.
Well no because in the narrative of the thread so far that CR and CIG won't open their books because they know they are guilty the same rules apply for the Escapist. If they just back down and retract the story they color themselves as automatically guilty. If they force a lawsuit they can possibly weasel out by looking like the victim of a bully with an agenda, guilty or not. Prolonged silence is only going to make these speculative attacks against them worse.
All this tells me is that escapist is confident in the verified checks they did on the people they interviewed or they have real legal advice and are not just saying what comes to mind which Chris Roberts did.
If it is understandable why I may have read it that way then his response carries no merit. He just injected himself into the conversation in an effort to troll and it backfired on him. Next time I trust he will think twice before trying so hard to be "witty."
Oh really?
Actually a little chuckle and an apology to Sedryn would have been classy and cool. Instead of being rude.
Back fired eh? how so?
Think twice eh?
???
....... ask for clarification. This way things won't get out of hand. Respect begets respect.
Practice what you preach?
The other guy made a flat out statement you assumed XYZ, you were wrong and went on in very poor form.
Is funny I read the article found it rather humorously written as well as informative and saw no sarcasm in the other guys comment.
Be a big boy, take foot out of mouth and move on.
That article has me even more interested on how all this is going to play out though that is for sure.
Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
Or as I've stated, it makes them look like they are possibly pissing themselves in fear. Schrodinger's cat as it were. A statement even one sentence long could go a long way to set their record straight.
Prrrrrobably not. No serious person writes their own legal threat and then CCs their lawyer.
Threatening a journalistic publication with a lawsuit is usually a joke, in and of itself. A libel claim would effectively have to show that the claims were false, that they knowingly published the false, and then there's still the issue of the actually claiming damages ("They hit me in the feefees," doesn't cut it).
Given the number sources cited in the article, any reasonable degree of vetting on the part of The Escapist means that such a suit would fail the "knowingly false" test for a libel suit.
If you publish that Bob said X, and you reasonably believe what Bob said to be true, and it turns out to be false, it's not libel (at least on the part of the publication - it could very well be defamation on Bob's part) - it's just incorrect.
All this tells me is that escapist is confident in the verified checks they did on the people they interviewed or they have real legal advice and are not just saying what comes to mind which Chris Roberts did.
Yeah I suspect Escapist's sources might be solid. Otherwise they aren't going to open themselves up intentionally to litigation by running such a damning article.
They are a online magazine, online advertising don't actually make that much money. They ain't exactly swimming around in money there.
If there are no retractions this week imo we assume that there won't be one.
If you publish that Bob said X, and you reasonably believe what Bob said to be true, and it turns out to be false, it's not libel - just incorrect.
And subject to redaction and public apology by the publishing media. However to get there you need at least a discovery hearing. Which is likely why they(CGI) likely won't follow trough on the threat if they have any concerns over what might come out.
I'd be willing to bet Escapist's legal team did advise them to say nothing. I totally agree with you there. That basically sends the appropriate message without coming off as antagonistic.
Or as I've stated, it makes them look like they are possibly pissing themselves in fear. Schrodinger's cat as it were. A statement even one sentence long could go a long way to set their record straight.
If they are pissing themselves with fear and know they are in wrong wouldn't they just retract the story and apologize.
It depends on if lawyers are involved and what they were told to do.
It could be that the legal team looked at everything and said "Don't respond, don't react" .
If they pull the article it would be admitting they did wrong. If they let it ride, more evidence could come to light, something stronger and more valid than the anon 9 that the lawyers could use, as any legal action filed by CIG wouldn't be an overnight thing.
If anything their lawyers are reviewing anything and everything involved with this article from author to sources just to make sure everything lines up. If they do find that the anon 9 were working with and on behalf of a third party we may see an apology and the article come down. But right now there is so much going on, so many fingers being pointed at different people/groups that leaving the article up is actually a sign of strength for the Escapist. Because if any of the allegations hold true, they stood their ground.
Now if it comes to light that all this was in fact orchestrated by a certain third party and the Escapist did publish without actually checking sources, we will most likely see "The author is no longer with our magazine as we have discovered the cited sources were in fact false. We at the Escapist pride ourselves on integrity and offer our sincerest apologies to blah blah blah blah..." Because throwing one reporter under the bus is better than admitting negligence on behalf of the whole company.
Right now though, if any legal action does take place, we will more than likely hear nothing about it until its over. But time will tell.
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
If they are pissing themselves with fear and know they are in wrong wouldn't they just retract the story and apologize.
It depends on if lawyers are involved and what they were told to do.
It could be that the legal team looked at everything and said "Don't respond, don't react" .
If they pull the article it would be admitting they did wrong. If they let it ride, more evidence could come to light, something stronger and more valid than the anon 9 that the lawyers could use, as any legal action filed by CIG wouldn't be an overnight thing.
If anything their lawyers are reviewing anything and everything involved with this article from author to sources just to make sure everything lines up. If they do find that the anon 9 were working with and on behalf of a third party we may see an apology and the article come down. But right now there is so much going on, so many fingers being pointed at different people/groups that leaving the article up is actually a sign of strength for the Escapist. Because if any of the allegations hold true, they stood their ground.
Now if it comes to light that all this was in fact orchestrated by a certain third party and the Escapist did publish without actually checking sources, we will most likely see "The author is no longer with our magazine as we have discovered the cited sources were in fact false. We at the Escapist pride ourselves on integrity and offer our sincerest apologies to blah blah blah blah..." Because throwing one reporter under the bus is better than admitting negligence on behalf of the whole company.
Right now though, if any legal action does take place, we will more than likely hear nothing about it until its over. But time will tell.
It would've been much simpler and less word intensive if you just said "we'll see, just waiting until the end of the week", because that's basically what you are saying anyways
No need to over analyze. Just wait and see is also my opinion.
"Update:The Escapist, notwithstanding Cloud Imperium Games' notice and posting, stands by its coverage of Star Citizen and intends to continue to investigate the developing story. Since publishing our original stories, we have been contacted by, and are currently interviewing, additional sources corroborating a variety of the reported allegations. Additionally, if Mr. Roberts' offer for The Escapist to "meet the developers making the game and see how we're building one of the most ambitious PC games first hand" remains open, we take the opportunity to accept such invitation so as to hopefully provide the public with sufficient information and opportunity to vet such sources' allegations and claims for themselves. We have also communicated the foregoing directly to Cloud Imperium Games."
Not seeing how they are raising, calling a bluff maybe?
Here is the "update".
Update:The Escapist, notwithstanding Cloud Imperium Games' notice and posting, stands by its coverage of Star Citizen
and intends to continue to investigate the developing story. Since
publishing our original stories, we have been contacted by, and are
currently interviewing, additional sources corroborating a variety of
the reported allegations. Additionally, if Mr. Roberts' offer for The Escapist
to "meet the developers making the game and see how we're building one
of the most ambitious PC games first hand" remains open, we take the
opportunity to accept such invitation so as to hopefully provide the
public with sufficient information and opportunity to vet such sources'
allegations and claims for themselves. We have also communicated the
foregoing directly to Cloud Imperium Games.
Barring the update, quoted above, this only rehashes the previous article with a small update at the beginning in which they claim to have contacted CIG about that tour if it was still open.
Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
Well, business hours are coming to a close on the West Coast. I guess everybody better lawyer up. Party at Derek's place?
This is why people think you're a troll because of posts like this and i have to agree with them.
Oh come on, since when is it foul play to have a little fun with this? This is the most interesting thing to happen in gaming news in quite some time.
Yes this is what trolls usually do make fun of a subject for their own amusement.
So no fun, huh? Well that's disappointing. Fair enough. You may resume fighting about who's speculation is more accurate and I'll try not to get in the way of that.
Yes, please stop trying to make light of all this, it's serious!
Sorry, couldn't resist
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
Not seeing how they are raising, calling a bluff maybe?
The update only rehashes the previous article with a small update at the beginning in which they claim to have contacted CIG about that tour if it was still open.
Update: The Escapist, notwithstanding Cloud Imperium Games' notice and posting, stands by its coverage of Star Citizen and intends to continue to investigate the developing story. Since publishing our original stories, we have been contacted by, and are currently interviewing, additional sources corroborating a variety of the reported allegations. Additionally, if Mr. Roberts' offer for The Escapist to "meet the developers making the game and see how we're building one of the most ambitious PC games first hand" remains open, we take the opportunity to accept such invitation so as to hopefully provide the public with sufficient information and opportunity to vet such sources' allegations and claims for themselves. We have also communicated the foregoing directly to Cloud Imperium Games.
This is the raise, " and are currently interviewing, additional sources corroborating a variety of the reported allegations." merely stating we stand by reporting yada yada yada would be a call
Hmmm did I ever in any post I've made question the viability of anonymous sources? Or the veracity of the ones used by The Escapist? That has absolutely nothing to do with my post what so ever as I've never opined about that one way or another. So please stop with this strawman argument over something I did not say.
It makes perfect sense. They wrote the article and now that they are getting a response from CIG seem to have gone mum on the subject leaving me, and everyone else, to speculate they are busy getting their wagons in a circle in anticipation of a legal siege. And yes that is ONLY rampant speculation on my part, the very reason I think crystal clear transparency about their current and future actions surrounding this issue are so important. And if they aren't willing to let the public in on the fallout against them over this article I once again call hypocrisy on their part.
Ah- My bad for misunderstanding.
Legal would have told them to keep Mum right now. This is another reason the SC threat letters are bullshit- it would have been done silently.
I'm sure we'll hear from the Escapist over this. Right now its best they wait and see what CIG does.
Again, by saying nothing, Escapist has said a lot.
And @MisterZebub that analogy doesn't really hold, as the Escapist hasn't received $90 million in donations from folks in preparation for a legal battle.
EDIT- CIG's lawyer made it very clear being silent on the subject was intent to fight the battle in court. Escapist has remained silent. The message is clear.
No they haven't said shit. The message is not clear. They've just left themselves open to rampant speculation and rumor mongering and ab hominem attacks, much like CIG over their financials. And *ahem* much like what I'm doing to them right now in this very thread.
The Escapist decided to throw a rock through CIG's window and now that the owners of that house are out yelling in anger on the lawn the Escapist just seems to be busy hiding under their desks. A simple statement that they refuse to be bullied and will take the bull by the horns if a lawsuit is imminent would go a long way in helping their own public image, ... in my not so humble opinion.
Under these circumstances, the last thing an entity under legal attack should do is concern themselves with rampant speculation, rumor mongering, and ad hominem attacks. By expecting a response you are asking them to repeat the same mistake that CIG/Chris Roberts has made. The Escapist are doing what CIG/Chris Roberts should have done. They are keeping their traps shut and letting their legal team handle the matter. Two responses from Chris Roberts did not stop the rampant speculation, rumor mongering, and ad hominem attacks from flying what would make you think that they will stop with a response from The Escapist?
Comments
Sorry then my mistake
I've heard these things can happen
If that's your perception go with it.
Star Citizen – The Extinction Level Event
4/13/15 > ELE has been updated look for 16-04-13.
http://www.dereksmart.org/2016/04/star-citizen-the-ele/
Enjoy and know the truth always comes to light!
The other guy made a flat out statement you assumed XYZ, you were wrong and went on in very poor form.
Is funny I read the article found it rather humorously written as well as informative and saw no sarcasm in the other guys comment.
Be a big boy, take foot out of mouth and move on.
That article has me even more interested on how all this is going to play out though that is for sure.
Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
Threatening a journalistic publication with a lawsuit is usually a joke, in and of itself. A libel claim would effectively have to show that the claims were false, that they knowingly published the false, and then there's still the issue of the actually claiming damages ("They hit me in the feefees," doesn't cut it).
Given the number sources cited in the article, any reasonable degree of vetting on the part of The Escapist means that such a suit would fail the "knowingly false" test for a libel suit.
If you publish that Bob said X, and you reasonably believe what Bob said to be true, and it turns out to be false, it's not libel (at least on the part of the publication - it could very well be defamation on Bob's part) - it's just incorrect.
They are a online magazine, online advertising don't actually make that much money. They ain't exactly swimming around in money there.
If there are no retractions this week imo we assume that there won't be one.
It could be that the legal team looked at everything and said "Don't respond, don't react" .
If they pull the article it would be admitting they did wrong. If they let it ride, more evidence could come to light, something stronger and more valid than the anon 9 that the lawyers could use, as any legal action filed by CIG wouldn't be an overnight thing.
If anything their lawyers are reviewing anything and everything involved with this article from author to sources just to make sure everything lines up. If they do find that the anon 9 were working with and on behalf of a third party we may see an apology and the article come down. But right now there is so much going on, so many fingers being pointed at different people/groups that leaving the article up is actually a sign of strength for the Escapist. Because if any of the allegations hold true, they stood their ground.
Now if it comes to light that all this was in fact orchestrated by a certain third party and the Escapist did publish without actually checking sources, we will most likely see "The author is no longer with our magazine as we have discovered the cited sources were in fact false. We at the Escapist pride ourselves on integrity and offer our sincerest apologies to blah blah blah blah..." Because throwing one reporter under the bus is better than admitting negligence on behalf of the whole company.
Right now though, if any legal action does take place, we will more than likely hear nothing about it until its over. But time will tell.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
No need to over analyze. Just wait and see is also my opinion.
"Update: The Escapist, notwithstanding Cloud Imperium Games' notice and posting, stands by its coverage of Star Citizen and intends to continue to investigate the developing story. Since publishing our original stories, we have been contacted by, and are currently interviewing, additional sources corroborating a variety of the reported allegations. Additionally, if Mr. Roberts' offer for The Escapist to "meet the developers making the game and see how we're building one of the most ambitious PC games first hand" remains open, we take the opportunity to accept such invitation so as to hopefully provide the public with sufficient information and opportunity to vet such sources' allegations and claims for themselves. We have also communicated the foregoing directly to Cloud Imperium Games."
New players can get a welcome package and old/returning players can also get a welcome back package and 7 days free subscription time! Just click here to use my referral invitation
Here is the "update".
Barring the update, quoted above, this only rehashes the previous article with a small update at the beginning in which they claim to have contacted CIG about that tour if it was still open.
Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
Sorry, couldn't resist
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
Update: The Escapist, notwithstanding Cloud Imperium Games' notice and posting, stands by its coverage of Star Citizen and intends to continue to investigate the developing story. Since publishing our original stories, we have been contacted by, and are currently interviewing, additional sources corroborating a variety of the reported allegations. Additionally, if Mr. Roberts' offer for The Escapist to "meet the developers making the game and see how we're building one of the most ambitious PC games first hand" remains open, we take the opportunity to accept such invitation so as to hopefully provide the public with sufficient information and opportunity to vet such sources' allegations and claims for themselves. We have also communicated the foregoing directly to Cloud Imperium Games.
This is the raise, " and are currently interviewing, additional sources corroborating a variety of the reported allegations." merely stating we stand by reporting yada yada yada would be a call
I admit I misjudged what the would do / did
Under these circumstances, the last thing an entity under legal attack should do is concern themselves with rampant speculation, rumor mongering, and ad hominem attacks. By expecting a response you are asking them to repeat the same mistake that CIG/Chris Roberts has made. The Escapist are doing what CIG/Chris Roberts should have done. They are keeping their traps shut and letting their legal team handle the matter. Two responses from Chris Roberts did not stop the rampant speculation, rumor mongering, and ad hominem attacks from flying what would make you think that they will stop with a response from The Escapist?