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Star Citizen - Alpha 2.3 Patch now live on PTU server (With Starfarer Tanker and Khartu Scout)

135

Comments

  • Adjuvant1Adjuvant1 Member RarePosts: 2,100
    edited March 2016
    Erillion said:
    Adjuvant1 said:
    It's not fact checked or peer reviewed. We have no way to know what those numbers mean or if they're real. If it can't be investigated and legitimized, the number is meaningless.
    Except that it HAS been investigated and legitimized by outside, very trusted sources

    https://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/2015/preview/files/assets/basic-html/page17.html

    because nothing enters the Guiness Book of World records without verification.

    http://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/FAQ/

    "When you submit an application, the Records Management Team carefully assess this to confirm whether or not your proposal can be accepted, and when you submit your evidence, the team will run comprehensive checks on this evidence to confirm whether it is sufficient enough to demonstrate that you have achieved the record title in question."

    I doubt that CIG has changed its "money counter" since 4th March 2014 and those 39,68 M$ mentioned in the Guiness Book 2015.


    Have fun
    They didn't check to see if each amount paid into that sum was from an individual or spend days doing any sort of source work. They see x amount of money, going into x crowdfunding and call it good. They have no idea what is the source of that number, only that it funnelled through the account.

    edit: There could be 10 people, each contributing 1 million and drawing interest for all anyone knows. Where is the interest or dividend on the fund's balance? Does it get channelled right back through the process or do some shadowy investor people keep it? You don't know.

    edit 2: " I " know that " I " don't let money just sit in a jar collecting zero interest or dividend. Why do you think these people do that? Where is that 3.5 years worth of interest/dividend?

    edit 3: And what about all this 10-20 dollars a month people pay to "sub to the development process", when the people who are supposedly "paid" with the funds are already CIG employees and collecting a check from the company? Is that reflected in the funding sum?

    edit 4: How many "actual human contributors" are there? You can't say that, either, when each person might have 2 or 10 accounts. There might be a grand total of 400k or 500k people , rather than the "millionish" people number you like to cite. You don't know what any of these numbers mean past a flashy big figure of 110 million, yet you throw it around like it's a great indication of success.
  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,329
    Adjuvant1 said:
    They didn't check
    So ... you were there ? Great !

    Tell us in detail about the Guiness Team and how they verified CIG's claim !

    We are priviledged to be able to listen to your personal eye witness account.



    Have fun

  • Adjuvant1Adjuvant1 Member RarePosts: 2,100
    Guiness is not paying some person to sit around, auditing the accounts, fact checking the source of all revenue. That is an absurd thing to assume. It's probably based on what the company is compelled to report to the feds.

  • BrenicsBrenics Member RarePosts: 1,939
    Talonsin said:
    Erillion said:
    -->  You an expert on Brain farts ?
    As an expert on brain farts, I can safely say that they sometimes smell but not always.  To prevent future cases, it helps to understand what causes them.  In that regard, I present this fascinating post about 10 things that can cause them.

    http://www.livescience.com/33841-10-everyday-brain-farts.html



    That was very informative, thanks for the link. So I guess if we make CR deaf and blind it may be possible for him to finish the game without redoing it once a year to new technology. I like it!
    I'm not perfect but I'm always myself!

    Star Citizen – The Extinction Level Event


    4/13/15 > ELE has been updated look for 16-04-13.

    http://www.dereksmart.org/2016/04/star-citizen-the-ele/

    Enjoy and know the truth always comes to light!

  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,329
    edited March 2016
    Adjuvant1 said:
    Guiness is not paying some person to sit around, auditing the accounts, fact checking the source of all revenue. That is an absurd thing to assume. It's probably based on what the company is compelled to report to the feds.

    Were

    You

    There ?


    If not - thank you for your individual opinion.

    Personally I will stick with the Guiness FAQ and what is mentioned there.


    Have fun
  • Adjuvant1Adjuvant1 Member RarePosts: 2,100
    Erillion said:
    Adjuvant1 said:
    Guiness is not paying some person to sit around, auditing the accounts, fact checking the source of all revenue. That is an absurd thing to assume. It's probably based on what the company is compelled to report to the feds.

    Where

    You

    There ?


    Have fun
    It's just common sense, Erillion.
  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,329
    Adjuvant1 said:
    Erillion said:
    Adjuvant1 said:
    Guiness is not paying some person to sit around, auditing the accounts, fact checking the source of all revenue. That is an absurd thing to assume. It's probably based on what the company is compelled to report to the feds.

    Where

    You

    There ?


    Have fun
    It's just common sense, Erillion.
    As you are not answering my direct question i will now assume that you were NOT there.

    Thank you for your personal OPINION.

    I will stick with the Guiness FAQ and what is mentioned there.


    Have fun
  • Adjuvant1Adjuvant1 Member RarePosts: 2,100
    edited March 2016
    Erillion said:
    Adjuvant1 said:
    Erillion said:
    Adjuvant1 said:
    Guiness is not paying some person to sit around, auditing the accounts, fact checking the source of all revenue. That is an absurd thing to assume. It's probably based on what the company is compelled to report to the feds.

    Where

    You

    There ?


    Have fun
    It's just common sense, Erillion.
    As you are not answering my direct question i will now assume that you were NOT there.

    Thank you for your personal OPINION.

    I will stick with the Guiness FAQ and what is mentioned there.


    Have fun
    Ok, you think this 110 million is purely "people paying for spaceships being built and a game being developed". Fine. Where is the rest of the money?

    CIG is basically holding all this money, spent some on paychecks and studio stuff surely, but not all of it. Where's the income on the balance?

    edit: Also, like I said, all the sub revenue, where's it go? The people to whom it supposedly goes collect a CIG paycheck already, so does it go into that "funding amount" to pay their paychecks?
  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183
    Adjuvant1 said:
    Erillion said:
    Adjuvant1 said:
    Guiness is not paying some person to sit around, auditing the accounts, fact checking the source of all revenue. That is an absurd thing to assume. It's probably based on what the company is compelled to report to the feds.

    Where

    You

    There ?


    Have fun
    It's just common sense, Erillion.
    Common sense would be avoiding arguing over things you can't prove one way or the other.

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,329
    Adjuvant1 said:
     Where is the rest of the money?
    You are asking the wrong person.

    You should send those questions to CIG.


    Have fun
  • DrDread74DrDread74 Member UncommonPosts: 308
    I still feel this game is going to be a fantastically flashy and expensive game which, in he end, has nothing interesting as far as gameplay

    http://baronsofthegalaxy.com/
     An MMO game I created, solo. It's live now and absolutely free to play!
  • BrenicsBrenics Member RarePosts: 1,939
    Erillion said:
    Adjuvant1 said:
     Where is the rest of the money?
    You are asking the wrong person.

    You should send those questions to CIG.


    Have fun
    There lies the problem. They refuse to answer such questions, or even open the books to show backers. But then again I guess when Roberts says if they don't make 3.2 million a month they will have to cut back and the game will take longer to make. So that one statement says they don't have this 110 million people keep bring up. 
    I'm not perfect but I'm always myself!

    Star Citizen – The Extinction Level Event


    4/13/15 > ELE has been updated look for 16-04-13.

    http://www.dereksmart.org/2016/04/star-citizen-the-ele/

    Enjoy and know the truth always comes to light!

  • Adjuvant1Adjuvant1 Member RarePosts: 2,100
    I have no problem believing the funding number is 110 million, the argument I'm presenting is the source of the funding.

    Erillion claims it's all from backer purchases of pledge accounts, spaceships, and physical merchandise.

    I claim it's a composite of not only the above, but also the sub income, the interest/dividend on the balance, private investors, plus all manners of incentives.

    IF Erillion is correct, the project is, somewhere, "bleeding" millions (read, millions) of dollars a year, with no reflection in the funding statistics, and goes into someone's pockets. It makes more sense for all that money to be dumped back into the project, thus reflected in the 110 million.

    So you have to make a choice. Is the funding representative of all of this, or just the popularly quoted "over a million backers!". If Erillion is "right", someone's running off with a shit ton of cash. If I'm "right" the funding amount of "110 million" is a misleading figure, self-perpetuating.
  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,329
    Adjuvant1 said:
    Erillion claims .....
    Feel free to link to a post where i claim this .....


    Have fun
  • Adjuvant1Adjuvant1 Member RarePosts: 2,100
    Erillion said:
    Adjuvant1 said:
    Erillion claims .....
    Feel free to link to a post where i claim this .....


    Have fun
    http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/423334/star-citizen-crowdfunding-milestones-discussion#latest

    plus the argument about the Guiness record legitimizing it all as backer funding, because my position, you say, is all opinion.

    You can't have it both ways, man. Own your side of the debate.

  • DeathengerDeathenger Member UncommonPosts: 880
    edited March 2016
    Never mind the money stuff. I cant believe Erillion has the gall to once again try and claim SC was not being developed in 2011. Even though he completely embarrassed himself in another thread trying to make the claim it wasnt.
    https://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/441955/they-built-a-team-from-only-8-people-to-270-in-short-time-that-alone-is-a-massive-accomplishment/p3

    I'm sure you'll try and spin doctor this again to "I" meaning "him all by his lonesome" (this should be good for 5 more pages to this thread)
    https://www.simplygon.com/news/cloud-imperium-games-chooses-simplygon

    Cloud Imperium Chief Creative Officer and Co-founder Chris Roberts said, “When I was first prototyping Star Citizen back in 2011 I did a lot of research on various LOD processes as I knew this would be important considering the large poly counts I was aiming for. Simplygon was the best tool that I used and the folks at Donya Labs were incredibly patient and supportive of me and Star Citizen in our early days when the game was far from a sure thing. I couldn’t be happier to announce that Simplygon is our official LOD tool for Star Citizen.”


     
  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,329
    I cant believe Erillion has the gall to once again try and claim SC was not being developed in 2011.
    Wanna revisit that same argument for the ... let me check ... 32nd time ... with the same outcome ?

    I do not.

    Groundhog Day much ?


    Have fun
  • ErillionErillion Member EpicPosts: 10,329
    Adjuvant1 said:
    Erillion said:
    Adjuvant1 said:
    Erillion claims .....
    Feel free to link to a post where i claim this .....


    Have fun
    http://forums.mmorpg.com/discussion/423334/star-citizen-crowdfunding-milestones-discussion#latest
    Nothing that you mentioned in your post is claimed by me in that link.  I talk about the funding milestone reached, the number of Star Citizens, the UEE Fleet number and recent SC news.

    Try again.


    Have fun
  • JohnP0100JohnP0100 Member UncommonPosts: 401
    Erillion said:
    JohnP0100 said:
    So..Did a single feature that Chris Roberts promise in 2.3 actually get delivered in 2.3?

    *Looks through the notes*

    Don't see any.
    /shrug
    Look again e.g. MISC Starfarer Tanker.


    Have fun
    So a ship was added from the 2.3 promised list?

    Okay.

    It shows what PvP games are really all about, and no, it's not about more realism and immersion. It's about cowards hiding behind a screen to they can bully other defenseless players without any risk of direct retaliation like there would be if they acted like asshats in "real life". -Jean-Luc_Picard

    Life itself is a game. So why shouldn't your game be ruined? - justmemyselfandi

  • rodarinrodarin Member EpicPosts: 2,611
    You know its bad when Erillion cant even spin this in a positive way, add that him being the only white knight left in here trying to defend the patch I wouldnt hail this as some sort of achievement.

    At best they added a few more ships to the tech demo and more than likely introduced even more bugs to it. I saw about 30 streams Saturday night which for a new patch and a free weekend is just sad.

    Of course they will try to spin  it in some way as meaningless but most people with brains know better.

    But thats the thing the people without a lot of brains are the ones who believe most if not everything positive abut this hype train and little to nothing of the criticisms and provided links and facts that have proven that CIG/Roberts have not just missed deadlines but outright lied about some things.

    The BEST thing the pro side can say is 'its not vaproware', which I suppose might be a positive since the hardest of hardcore critics claimed thats just hat it was. 

    While it still hasnt been proven to NOT be a scam yet (depending on ones definition of scam) they (pro SC crowd) still have that hurdle to over come.

    Citing make believe numbers (from both sides) doesnt do anyone any good. The pro camp  should probably embrace the fact they HAVENT raised as much money as they claim simply because what people have seen cannot justify any such number. But at this point that is also a positive they can hang their hat on as they claim 'made the most money of any kickstarter ever' problem is if the numbers are fake and the game is a flop what good does that do?
  • GrumpyHobbitGrumpyHobbit Member RarePosts: 1,220
    rodarin said:
    You know its bad when Erillion cant even spin this in a positive way, add that him being the only white knight left in here trying to defend the patch I wouldnt hail this as some sort of achievement.

    At best they added a few more ships to the tech demo and more than likely introduced even more bugs to it. I saw about 30 streams Saturday night which for a new patch and a free weekend is just sad.

    Of course they will try to spin  it in some way as meaningless but most people with brains know better.

    But thats the thing the people without a lot of brains are the ones who believe most if not everything positive abut this hype train and little to nothing of the criticisms and provided links and facts that have proven that CIG/Roberts have not just missed deadlines but outright lied about some things.

    The BEST thing the pro side can say is 'its not vaproware', which I suppose might be a positive since the hardest of hardcore critics claimed thats just hat it was. 

    While it still hasnt been proven to NOT be a scam yet (depending on ones definition of scam) they (pro SC crowd) still have that hurdle to over come.

    Citing make believe numbers (from both sides) doesnt do anyone any good. The pro camp  should probably embrace the fact they HAVENT raised as much money as they claim simply because what people have seen cannot justify any such number. But at this point that is also a positive they can hang their hat on as they claim 'made the most money of any kickstarter ever' problem is if the numbers are fake and the game is a flop what good does that do?
    White Knight....derrogatory name calling.

    People without brains...more name calling.

    Still not proven to NOT be a scam...now we must prosecute first and ask for evidence later?

    Tell me why your post isn't pure troll bait worthy of a report?
  • DistopiaDistopia Member EpicPosts: 21,183
    rodarin said:


    Citing make believe numbers (from both sides) doesnt do anyone any good. The pro camp  should probably embrace the fact they HAVENT raised as much money as they claim simply because what people have seen cannot justify any such number. But at this point that is also a positive they can hang their hat on as they claim 'made the most money of any kickstarter ever' problem is if the numbers are fake and the game is a flop what good does that do?
    Is this the angle we're moving to now, they never had that money to begin with? Which is a fact? 

    For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson


  • rodarinrodarin Member EpicPosts: 2,611
    Distopia said:
    rodarin said:


    Citing make believe numbers (from both sides) doesnt do anyone any good. The pro camp  should probably embrace the fact they HAVENT raised as much money as they claim simply because what people have seen cannot justify any such number. But at this point that is also a positive they can hang their hat on as they claim 'made the most money of any kickstarter ever' problem is if the numbers are fake and the game is a flop what good does that do?
    Is this the angle we're moving to now, they never had that money to begin with? Which is a fact? 
    thatd the thing there are no real facts or proof of anything. Other than what we can see with our own eyes or they have tried to show people.

    This game has been all hype and a money making machine for almost 5 years, so if there were really more to show besides the tech demo people are 'playing' we would see it. Because its the hype generating the money. Do I believe its 110 million? No I dont. But I dont know how much it really is. Enough to pay all the people he has hired and rent officers and cars and buy houses on a few continents (unless he is just leasing those). So it is probably a significant number, but how much has gone DIRECTLY into the game itself? NO one can or will answer that question.

    But when numbers stopped adding up they start the 'subscriber' to the 'developmental news' and started using that (someone in this thread doesnt think theyre counting it but then again who is to say) but if they do have subscribers for simple news (when most people wont sub to an actual game) then it tells people everything they need to know about the type of people funding this project.

    We are almost 4 months into 2016, when was the release date again? For just the first phase which isnt even an MMO? How much more time will it take to release the actual MMO part after that? Any time table? Where was the game/demo/alpha supposed to be now? I could have sworn they claimed they were going to update the alpha every month, which I suppose they technically have but if it makes more bugs and really doesnt expand on what is already there, other than a reskinning of a ship is that really an update?

    A year from now and theyre still on some alpha stage then what? After they claim they had to reinvent something else to make the game truly epic. What then? The remaking and reinventing and remodeling excuses have to have an expiration date dont they? Thats why I say is a con (depending on definition) because a con is simply milking money from someone or something for as long as you can, or as quick as you can) for something that doesnt come close to equal value. Or no value at all.


  • BrenicsBrenics Member RarePosts: 1,939
    rodarin said:
    Distopia said:
    rodarin said:


    Citing make believe numbers (from both sides) doesnt do anyone any good. The pro camp  should probably embrace the fact they HAVENT raised as much money as they claim simply because what people have seen cannot justify any such number. But at this point that is also a positive they can hang their hat on as they claim 'made the most money of any kickstarter ever' problem is if the numbers are fake and the game is a flop what good does that do?
    Is this the angle we're moving to now, they never had that money to begin with? Which is a fact? 
    thatd the thing there are no real facts or proof of anything. Other than what we can see with our own eyes or they have tried to show people.

    This game has been all hype and a money making machine for almost 5 years, so if there were really more to show besides the tech demo people are 'playing' we would see it. Because its the hype generating the money. Do I believe its 110 million? No I dont. But I dont know how much it really is. Enough to pay all the people he has hired and rent officers and cars and buy houses on a few continents (unless he is just leasing those). So it is probably a significant number, but how much has gone DIRECTLY into the game itself? NO one can or will answer that question.

    But when numbers stopped adding up they start the 'subscriber' to the 'developmental news' and started using that (someone in this thread doesnt think theyre counting it but then again who is to say) but if they do have subscribers for simple news (when most people wont sub to an actual game) then it tells people everything they need to know about the type of people funding this project.

    We are almost 4 months into 2016, when was the release date again? For just the first phase which isnt even an MMO? How much more time will it take to release the actual MMO part after that? Any time table? Where was the game/demo/alpha supposed to be now? I could have sworn they claimed they were going to update the alpha every month, which I suppose they technically have but if it makes more bugs and really doesnt expand on what is already there, other than a reskinning of a ship is that really an update?

    A year from now and theyre still on some alpha stage then what? After they claim they had to reinvent something else to make the game truly epic. What then? The remaking and reinventing and remodeling excuses have to have an expiration date dont they? Thats why I say is a con (depending on definition) because a con is simply milking money from someone or something for as long as you can, or as quick as you can) for something that doesnt come close to equal value. Or no value at all.


    I think no one could state it better. Well said, and we wait for the attack on you. But then again a lot of threads are getting deleted over on the official forums. Lot more people are starting to ask the exact same questions rest of us have been asking. 
    I'm not perfect but I'm always myself!

    Star Citizen – The Extinction Level Event


    4/13/15 > ELE has been updated look for 16-04-13.

    http://www.dereksmart.org/2016/04/star-citizen-the-ele/

    Enjoy and know the truth always comes to light!

  • RealizerRealizer Member RarePosts: 724
     It's cringe worthy how some people don't understand the difference between some of these words such as, prototyping, and development. What are you anti-fans going to do when this argument is over? Are you going to get over it, and move on with your life? Or are you going to sit here still talking trash about things you don't have proof of? Maybe you guys should switch over to a different conspiracy, like JFK or something. Might be a better use of your time.
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