I think Ashes of Creation will be the one to rule them all
yeap just like age of Conan, star wars the old republic, and what ever is next on the list of unreleased MMOs, with very nice pre-release video´s. Any way find your comment misplaced since Pantheon is for people who want classic PvE MMO experience while Ashes try to catch the dreamers
I think Ashes of Creation will be the one to rule them all
Why would you post that in a Pantheon forum lol. I'm following Ashes as well but so far we know next to nothing about combat. So we don't even know who will like it.
I have a problem with a cashshop + monthly fees, I pay so I wont see that.
Sure, GW2s cashshop is fine in a B2P game but not in aP2P game like Pantheon. You can't both keep the cake and eat it, at least not if you want me as your customer.
Pantheon with cashshop would be like EQ2 the last year before it went F2P. As I see it if they need more funds then $15 a month and box price they should just raise the monthly fee so we get all included.
Tonight on MMO News at 11: MMOs need money to exist. We'll have more on this story as it develops. And now Brian with sports.
And how would YOU propose they raise money on a continual basis? Its a very niche MMO so that $15 a month from the thousands playing wont pay for much.
THIS is why these indie MMOs are going to fail. People want them to be made but they dont want them to make money. I mean, what, did you think that MMOs are made by the MMO fairies with pixie dust and dreams?
The game is already decided as P2P and the team say on the official forum that they can go even (with salaries and so on) with 25K players paying that fee. I would link to it but it is for backers only.
How many P2P games without itemshop is there around? 3? 4? There are actually more then a few of us willing to pay for playing. The game is focused particularly on oldschool fans and the majority of us still prefer P2P.
Besides the monthly fees I expect them to use the same funding as EQ did for many years: selling expansions. And while you might not think much of EQ the game do have earned in rather much money in the 18 years it's been around, not Wow much but no-one besides Wow ever gotten Wow much.
I can see Pantheon having at least 100K paying customers and that is 4 times what they need, not all games are actually trying for millions and millions of players, if you want something free look elsewhere.
So, according to their projections and planning they could survive off just the subscription fees from 25,000 players?
Quite frankly, that is hilarious.
Yeah, and if everything had gone according to their initial projections and planning we would probably have the game by now.
When it comes to video games and video game budgets(especially for MMOs) things can go off the rails very easily.
Just as for people you can plan for the future and budget accordingly but how many times does that actually work? Before you know it you break your glasses and need to get new ones, your son gets sick and needs to go the hospital and the brakes go out on the car. So, hows that budget looking now?
Mismanagement. Maybe Vanguard 2.0 ... er, I mean Pantheon can rise above it, but I won't hold my breath.
Totally agree. If Brad doesn't screw this up like he's notorious for, I'll consider paying for this game... but until i see something more than vaporware / customer driven & funded alpha / beta phases, I'm on the fence. Vanguard was such a HUGE disappointment.
I have a problem with a cashshop + monthly fees, I pay so I wont see that.
Sure, GW2s cashshop is fine in a B2P game but not in aP2P game like Pantheon. You can't both keep the cake and eat it, at least not if you want me as your customer.
Pantheon with cashshop would be like EQ2 the last year before it went F2P. As I see it if they need more funds then $15 a month and box price they should just raise the monthly fee so we get all included.
Tonight on MMO News at 11: MMOs need money to exist. We'll have more on this story as it develops. And now Brian with sports.
And how would YOU propose they raise money on a continual basis? Its a very niche MMO so that $15 a month from the thousands playing wont pay for much.
THIS is why these indie MMOs are going to fail. People want them to be made but they dont want them to make money. I mean, what, did you think that MMOs are made by the MMO fairies with pixie dust and dreams?
The game is already decided as P2P and the team say on the official forum that they can go even (with salaries and so on) with 25K players paying that fee. I would link to it but it is for backers only.
How many P2P games without itemshop is there around? 3? 4? There are actually more then a few of us willing to pay for playing. The game is focused particularly on oldschool fans and the majority of us still prefer P2P.
Besides the monthly fees I expect them to use the same funding as EQ did for many years: selling expansions. And while you might not think much of EQ the game do have earned in rather much money in the 18 years it's been around, not Wow much but no-one besides Wow ever gotten Wow much.
I can see Pantheon having at least 100K paying customers and that is 4 times what they need, not all games are actually trying for millions and millions of players, if you want something free look elsewhere.
So, according to their projections and planning they could survive off just the subscription fees from 25,000 players?
Quite frankly, that is hilarious.
Yeah, and if everything had gone according to their initial projections and planning we would probably have the game by now.
When it comes to video games and video game budgets(especially for MMOs) things can go off the rails very easily.
Just as for people you can plan for the future and budget accordingly but how many times does that actually work? Before you know it you break your glasses and need to get new ones, your son gets sick and needs to go the hospital and the brakes go out on the car. So, hows that budget looking now?
Mismanagement. Maybe Vanguard 2.0 ... er, I mean Pantheon can rise above it, but I won't hold my breath.
Totally agree. If Brad doesn't screw this up like he's notorious for, I'll consider paying for this game... but until i see something more than vaporware / customer driven & funded alpha / beta phases, I'm on the fence. Vanguard was such a HUGE disappointment.
IMO thinking back to my Epic weapon quest in EQ1. I lost myself in that and SoE had me as a customer because of it. I think an MMO thats not designed for a cash shop will change how we play. I think we have forgotten what its like to log in and all of the game is there to consume with no other micro pay walls.
I don't think there is a chance in a thousand that there won't be some form of cash shop. If, for no other reason, than it facilitates in-game use of pre-paid gift cards.
That said, I don't see you being able to buy much more than the standard game-time(along with some tradeable item like Krono), cosmetic items, etc. Probably bigger bags, those are usually a best seller without really getting panties in a bunch, particiularly if in-game means are available to do the same thing. But quality gear? Nope.
The thing you have to understand is that they've bolted themselves to the EQ1 model in basically a reboot or reimagining. Eventually, most stuff that went into EQ1 can and will migrate over in some form if they're successful, for the same reasons it was put in there in the first place. Its like saying you're going to walk the Appalachian Trail again and not expect to run into a lot of the same spots along the way.
IMO thinking back to my Epic weapon quest in EQ1. I lost myself in that and SoE had me as a customer because of it. I think an MMO thats not designed for a cash shop will change how we play. I think we have forgotten what its like to log in and all of the game is there to consume with no other micro pay walls.
I don't think there is a chance in a thousand that there won't be some form of cash shop. If, for no other reason, than it facilitates in-game use of pre-paid gift cards.
That said, I don't see you being able to buy much more than the standard game-time(along with some tradeable item like Krono), cosmetic items, etc. Probably bigger bags, those are usually a best seller without really getting panties in a bunch, particiularly if in-game means are available to do the same thing. But quality gear? Nope.
The thing you have to understand is that they've bolted themselves to the EQ1 model in basically a reboot or reimagining. Eventually, most stuff that went into EQ1 can and will migrate over in some form if they're successful, for the same reasons it was put in there in the first place. Its like saying you're going to walk the Appalachian Trail again and not expect to run into a lot of the same spots along the way.
If there is any what so ever pay for an advantage in game item I'm walking, and I bet a lot of old school eq players will walk as well. IMO It'll be the nail in their coffin if they do this but they have told us they are not so I think the Pantheon team gets it.
What would be acceptable and I think it was discussed earlier in this thread was that real world items would be ok to sell in a cash shop. Shirts, hats, posters, silk cloth prints ect ect... No issues with that for extra income if they need it.
IMO thinking back to my Epic weapon quest in EQ1. I lost myself in that and SoE had me as a customer because of it. I think an MMO thats not designed for a cash shop will change how we play. I think we have forgotten what its like to log in and all of the game is there to consume with no other micro pay walls.
I don't think there is a chance in a thousand that there won't be some form of cash shop. If, for no other reason, than it facilitates in-game use of pre-paid gift cards.
That said, I don't see you being able to buy much more than the standard game-time(along with some tradeable item like Krono), cosmetic items, etc. Probably bigger bags, those are usually a best seller without really getting panties in a bunch, particiularly if in-game means are available to do the same thing. But quality gear? Nope.
The thing you have to understand is that they've bolted themselves to the EQ1 model in basically a reboot or reimagining. Eventually, most stuff that went into EQ1 can and will migrate over in some form if they're successful, for the same reasons it was put in there in the first place. Its like saying you're going to walk the Appalachian Trail again and not expect to run into a lot of the same spots along the way.
If there is any what so ever pay for an advantage in game item I'm walking, and I bet a lot of old school eq players will walk as well. IMO It'll be the nail in their coffin if they do this but they have told us they are not so I think the Pantheon team gets it.
What would be acceptable and I think it was discussed earlier in this thread was that real world items would be ok to sell in a cash shop. Shirts, hats, posters, silk cloth prints ect ect... No issues with that for extra income if they need it.
Fair enough. My main point was that you are going to see a cash shop in some form or another, something you agree with. What level that takes is a different story for another time.
A couple years from now when its in release and they're hurting for money? We'll see then. Best case scenario, they'll never, ever use the term 'cash shop' .
I absolutely agree with his second part about them not likely to ever sell any advantage over another player. But then, you could easily parse that to not include bags. Remember.. the current 'cash shop' in EQ1 has few options for anything more than cosmetic enhancements, play time, or bags. It all really depends on how integral bags are going to be in this game tbh.
The simple fact is that the gravity pull of having an in-game method to handle transactions with the player far outweighs developer snobbery. And generally.. when the time comes, they like paying the mortgage and feeding the kids, rather than resting on principle.
Just like.. sometime in the future.. 5-7 years down the road if this is successful, for there suddenly to be a collectible digital card game pop up.. for no other reason than $$.
A couple years from now when its in release and they're hurting for money? We'll see then. Best case scenario, they'll never, ever use the term 'cash shop' .
I absolutely agree with his second part about them not likely to ever sell any advantage over another player. But then, you could easily parse that to not include bags. Remember.. the current 'cash shop' in EQ1 has few options for anything more than cosmetic enhancements, play time, or bags. It all really depends on how integral bags are going to be in this game tbh.
The simple fact is that the gravity pull of having an in-game method to handle transactions with the player far outweighs developer snobbery. And generally.. when the time comes, they like paying the mortgage and feeding the kids, rather than resting on principle.
Just like.. sometime in the future.. 5-7 years down the road if this is successful, for there suddenly to be a collectible digital card game pop up.. for no other reason than $$.
Still there won't be a cash shop, atleast that's the plan and it will stay that way until something changes.
A couple years from now when its in release and they're hurting for money? We'll see then. Best case scenario, they'll never, ever use the term 'cash shop' .
I absolutely agree with his second part about them not likely to ever sell any advantage over another player. But then, you could easily parse that to not include bags. Remember.. the current 'cash shop' in EQ1 has few options for anything more than cosmetic enhancements, play time, or bags. It all really depends on how integral bags are going to be in this game tbh.
The simple fact is that the gravity pull of having an in-game method to handle transactions with the player far outweighs developer snobbery. And generally.. when the time comes, they like paying the mortgage and feeding the kids, rather than resting on principle.
Just like.. sometime in the future.. 5-7 years down the road if this is successful, for there suddenly to be a collectible digital card game pop up.. for no other reason than $$.
Still there won't be a cash shop, atleast that's the plan and it will stay that way until something changes.
Right. Like the Little Things that change. Release... cash flow problems... those pesky things!
But ya.. right now.. when they're in development and flush with development $$ and no care in the world other than to get the game done... Hence! The plan is certainly to never have a cash shop.
There are two types of people in this world. Those who believe whatever they're told by an authority, and those who have walked this road before, have experience with it, and realize how and why 'plans' tend to change when they meet real world issues.
If Pantheon makes it that far, such stuff will go in. If it helps, it won't be B MQ who does it, as he'll likely be off making a different game. I give him 2-3 years tops after release before he gets the itch to make something else. He's not a Long Haul guy. He's a game developer and as such.. likes developing games, not maintaining them.
I don't know about anyone else, but I'd like at least 6 months total of alpha, closed and open beta testing before release. If it were to release in 2017, I would expect another disastrous technical failure like Vanguard's release.
A couple years from now when its in release and they're hurting for money? We'll see then. Best case scenario, they'll never, ever use the term 'cash shop' .
I absolutely agree with his second part about them not likely to ever sell any advantage over another player. But then, you could easily parse that to not include bags. Remember.. the current 'cash shop' in EQ1 has few options for anything more than cosmetic enhancements, play time, or bags. It all really depends on how integral bags are going to be in this game tbh.
The simple fact is that the gravity pull of having an in-game method to handle transactions with the player far outweighs developer snobbery. And generally.. when the time comes, they like paying the mortgage and feeding the kids, rather than resting on principle.
Just like.. sometime in the future.. 5-7 years down the road if this is successful, for there suddenly to be a collectible digital card game pop up.. for no other reason than $$.
Still there won't be a cash shop, atleast that's the plan and it will stay that way until something changes.
Right. Like the Little Things that change. Release... cash flow problems... those pesky things!
But ya.. right now.. when they're in development and flush with development $$ and no care in the world other than to get the game done... Hence! The plan is certainly to never have a cash shop.
There are two types of people in this world. Those who believe whatever they're told by an authority, and those who have walked this road before, have experience with it, and realize how and why 'plans' tend to change when they meet real world issues.
If Pantheon makes it that far, such stuff will go in. If it helps, it won't be B MQ who does it, as he'll likely be off making a different game. I give him 2-3 years tops after release before he gets the itch to make something else. He's not a Long Haul guy. He's a game developer and as such.. likes developing games, not maintaining them.
Don't know how closely you've been following Pantheon, but flush for cash is something they've never been.
As they scraped by over the last years, they could have resorted to selling significant items to help drawn pledges and fund development. They did not.
They could still do it later, but it really goes against the ethos of the game.
Comments
Dragnon - Guildmaster - Albion Central Bank in Albion Online
www.albioncentralbank.enjin.com
yeap just like age of Conan, star wars the old republic, and what ever is next on the list of unreleased MMOs, with very nice pre-release video´s. Any way find your comment misplaced since Pantheon is for people who want classic PvE MMO experience while Ashes try to catch the dreamers
Why would you post that in a Pantheon forum lol. I'm following Ashes as well but so far we know next to nothing about combat. So we don't even know who will like it.
It could be. It would be great to have a bunch of new great MMOs to play. Genre needs it badly.
Totally agree. If Brad doesn't screw this up like he's notorious for, I'll consider paying for this game... but until i see something more than vaporware / customer driven & funded alpha / beta phases, I'm on the fence. Vanguard was such a HUGE disappointment.
lol @ "vaporware"
That said, I don't see you being able to buy much more than the standard game-time(along with some tradeable item like Krono), cosmetic items, etc. Probably bigger bags, those are usually a best seller without really getting panties in a bunch, particiularly if in-game means are available to do the same thing. But quality gear? Nope.
The thing you have to understand is that they've bolted themselves to the EQ1 model in basically a reboot or reimagining. Eventually, most stuff that went into EQ1 can and will migrate over in some form if they're successful, for the same reasons it was put in there in the first place. Its like saying you're going to walk the Appalachian Trail again and not expect to run into a lot of the same spots along the way.
What would be acceptable and I think it was discussed earlier in this thread was that real world items would be ok to sell in a cash shop. Shirts, hats, posters, silk cloth prints ect ect... No issues with that for extra income if they need it.
last comment by Kilsin, confirmed by Brad.
https://www.pantheonmmo.com/content/forums/topic/2957/cash-shop-some-ideas-add-yours-and-concerns/view/page/4
Nope. Not currently.
A couple years from now when its in release and they're hurting for money? We'll see then. Best case scenario, they'll never, ever use the term 'cash shop'
I absolutely agree with his second part about them not likely to ever sell any advantage over another player. But then, you could easily parse that to not include bags. Remember.. the current 'cash shop' in EQ1 has few options for anything more than cosmetic enhancements, play time, or bags. It all really depends on how integral bags are going to be in this game tbh.
The simple fact is that the gravity pull of having an in-game method to handle transactions with the player far outweighs developer snobbery. And generally.. when the time comes, they like paying the mortgage and feeding the kids, rather than resting on principle.
Just like.. sometime in the future.. 5-7 years down the road if this is successful, for there suddenly to be a collectible digital card game pop up.. for no other reason than $$.
Right. Like the Little Things that change. Release... cash flow problems... those pesky things!
But ya.. right now.. when they're in development and flush with development $$ and no care in the world other than to get the game done... Hence! The plan is certainly to never have a cash shop.
There are two types of people in this world. Those who believe whatever they're told by an authority, and those who have walked this road before, have experience with it, and realize how and why 'plans' tend to change when they meet real world issues.
If Pantheon makes it that far, such stuff will go in. If it helps, it won't be B MQ who does it, as he'll likely be off making a different game. I give him 2-3 years tops after release before he gets the itch to make something else. He's not a Long Haul guy. He's a game developer and as such.. likes developing games, not maintaining them.
As they scraped by over the last years, they could have resorted to selling significant items to help drawn pledges and fund development. They did not.
They could still do it later, but it really goes against the ethos of the game.