You ignored the most important part then acted like it was completely irrelevant. Chris said 2 WEEKS. Yea thats the ENTIRE point here. Anyone who can be that ignorant about a launch date is either lying or a complete moron.
Most important part? It was completely irrelevant because at no point i was talking about release dates.
Do me a favor and go scream 2 weeks at that wall right there <<<.
You ignored the most important part then acted like it was completely irrelevant. Chris said 2 WEEKS. Yea thats the ENTIRE point here. Anyone who can be that ignorant about a launch date is either lying or a complete moron.
Most important part? It was completely irrelevant because at no point i was talking about release dates.
Do me a favor and go scream 2 weeks at that wall right there <<<.
He was using that as the focal point of his statements. You can't remove the focal point then pretend it isnt there and start a new discussion about what he was saying.
Well then let's put it another way. CR tends to make promises before the R&D is done. I'm going to assume the teams get put under undue stress when he opens his big mouth and promises something that the teams might not be able to deliver on but work their asses off to try and do.
As far development reports goes the netcode rewrites and the zoning system are very well on development for quite some time already. The first mentions of this both systems were made last year.
On an monthly report several months ago it was reported i think by Austin / Germany studios that they had a prototype of the solar system up and running, so this things are clearly past "figuring stuff out" phases.
He was using that as the focal point of his statements. You can't remove the focal point then pretend it isnt there and start a new discussion about what he was saying.
It wasn't for me?
Also that claim yuou just did reminds me of the discussions i had with you, on a moment it's Oranges the other is Bananas, always derailing the discussion to a point of nit-picking on irrelevant things because why not? Like the posts you are just doing against me, great contribution to the thread!
He was using that as the focal point of his statements. You can't remove the focal point then pretend it isnt there and start a new discussion about what he was saying.
It wasn't for me?
Also that claim yuou just did reminds me of the discussions i had with you, on a moment it's Oranges the other is Bananas, always derailing the discussion to a point of nit-picking on irrelevant things because why not? Like the posts you are just doing against me, great contribution to the thread!
No the major point of the thread was that this is nothing new and what I said about 6 months ago, that SC and CR took a HUGE step backwards when Elite Dangerous revealed what it already had going on for a fraction of the money.
Roberts had to start delivering something, thats why this whole procedural planets thing got going, no where were these things mentioned in the SC lexicon until Elite Dangerous was released and then released this portion of their game themselves. Then it was suddenly Roberts who figured he might as well try and do them and do them better.
I also said that Elite Dangerous would either destroy SC or finally get them to at least deliver something. It is the game that SC claimed to be. That point has been made a few times. So either Roberts learns a few things from what they have done or are doing or he tries to out do them. The former is a much smarter plan. The latter will never work.
But as these progress it will highlight either what has been wrong with Roberts and the project (again highlighted here by others( or it could ark a turning point for them and possibly see some actual progress that isnt concept, cinematic, or dream walking. But so far it looks like he hasnt learned anything and is still trying to reinvent stuff that is more than good enough and still trying to prove he can make his project better than anything else. And the more Elite Dangerous continues to grow and IMPLEMENT these things for people to actually play in a game the further behind SC will fall and the more ground Roberts will try and make up and then try and get ahead of.
It was bad enough when Roberts was competing with air (and his own imagination) in trying to deliver this game, but now that there sis an actual viable product out that if you called Star Citizen people could believe it he is in a very bad position.
No the major point of the thread was that this is nothing new and what I said about 6 months ago, that SC and CR took a HUGE step backwards when Elite Dangerous revealed what it already had going on for a fraction of the money.
Roberts had to start delivering something, thats why this whole procedural planets thing got going, no where were these things mentioned in the SC lexicon until Elite Dangerous was released and then released this portion of their game themselves. Then it was suddenly Roberts who figured he might as well try and do them and do them better.
I also said that Elite Dangerous would either destroy SC or finally get them to at least deliver something. It is the game that SC claimed to be. That point has been made a few times. So either Roberts learns a few things from what they have done or are doing or he tries to out do them. The former is a much smarter plan. The latter will never work.
But as these progress it will highlight either what has been wrong with Roberts and the project (again highlighted here by others( or it could ark a turning point for them and possibly see some actual progress that isnt concept, cinematic, or dream walking. But so far it looks like he hasnt learned anything and is still trying to reinvent stuff that is more than good enough and still trying to prove he can make his project better than anything else. And the more Elite Dangerous continues to grow and IMPLEMENT these things for people to actually play in a game the further behind SC will fall and the more ground Roberts will try and make up and then try and get ahead of.
It was bad enough when Roberts was competing with air (and his own imagination) in trying to deliver this game, but now that there sis an actual viable product out that if you called Star Citizen people could believe it he is in a very bad position.
I have no idea why did you come quoting me with a wall of text about Elite. It has nothing to do with the thread and it's just your opinions and views on pretty much Elite Dangerous vs Star Citizen. For me they are 2 different games that you wouldn't play for the same game experience, far from it.
If you prefer Elite Dangerous and it identify more with that game, go play it then...
, no where were these things mentioned in the SC lexicon until Elite Dangerous was released
Nowhere ? You call 1 year 5 months in advance a "not mentioned" ?
--> 41 M$ Stretch Goal ..... achieved 31st March 2014
"Advanced procedural generation will be necessary for creating entire
planets worth of exploration and development content. A special strike
team of procedural generation-oriented developers will be assembled to
make this technology a reality."
E:D Horizon Expansion with PG airless planets and moons was announced on August 5, 2015 at Gamescom. Before that E:D only used PG to generate systems (NOT planets, NOT moons). You could not land on any planetary bodies.
, no where were these things mentioned in the SC lexicon until Elite Dangerous was released
Nowhere ? You call 1 year 5 months in advance a "not mentioned" ?
--> 41 M$ Stretch Goal ..... achieved 31st March 2014
"Advanced procedural generation will be necessary for creating entire
planets worth of exploration and development content. A special strike
team of procedural generation-oriented developers will be assembled to
make this technology a reality."
E:D Horizon Expansion with PG airless planets and moons was announced on August 5, 2015 at Gamescom. Before that E:D only used PG to generate systems (NOT planets, NOT moons). You could not land on any planetary bodies.
Have fun
So E:D was able to do it faster and more then likely cheaper then what SC can do? So you're saying SC is incompetent in comparison?
Well then let's put it another way. CR tends to make promises before the R&D is done. I'm going to assume the teams get put under undue stress when he opens his big mouth and promises something that the teams might not be able to deliver on but work their asses off to try and do.
As far development reports goes the netcode rewrites and the zoning system are very well on development for quite some time already. The first mentions of this both systems were made last year.
On an monthly report several months ago it was reported i think by Austin / Germany studios that they had a prototype of the solar system up and running, so this things are clearly past "figuring stuff out" phases.
I'm not sure how that reply fits in with what I said so sure?
So E:D was able to do it faster and more then likely cheaper then what SC can do? So you're saying SC is incompetent in comparison?
Any comparative is flawed because the man-power and time put on it was definitely different on both. On an interview Brian Chambers (head of GER office) revealed the first prototype we shown last year of PG was worked on by 2-3 people during 2-3 months.
I'm not sure how that reply fits in with what I said so sure?
The "promise" before R&D was done was already made last year. They are already developing the solutions, unfortunately it will take its time and we can only judge once the results are released.
So E:D was able to do it faster and more then likely cheaper then what SC can do? So you're saying SC is incompetent in comparison?
I am saying that E:D and SC follow two different paths.
E:D follows the incremental approach. Small steps. Reach for the low hanging fruits first (like airless barren moons as a first step to PG planets). Use existing technologies in innovative ways.
SC follows the cinematic, completionist approach - create a complete (or almost complete) package and drop it in one piece, using newly developed technologies that allow more than the current state of the (console compatibility restricted) art.
I follow both paths with interest, playing both E:D and SC Alpha.
When both games are finally "complete", i will personally decide who was "better", "faster", "cheaper" or more "competent". In both cases I expect this to take a few more years and expansions.
Huh? You know on game development what is R&D? On several cases you have to figure out what you can do to fit the plan and then get to do it.
Same thing with PG, they had to do R&D to figure out what they could do first.
Same thing with when the land-able zones landings were AI controlled to something where the player has control.
Same thing even with the game's audio team that had to R&D a way to automatically add audio to animations as the game has thousands of them.
Same thing even on FPS as they push on things they shown recently as Procedural Covers.
And same thing is happening with netcode.
This poor developers working for this evil company that forces them to do this unthinkable things as R&D better solutions for problems
The networking and instancing are core to the whole project, they are the engine that makes the cogs turn, the things you listed are things attached to the cogs, they don't matter if they get chopped and changed.
Then again, the untried and untested networking code they are going to use has just reached release status so perhaps doing all of this now is ok.... almost 5 years into the project LOL
The networking and instancing are core to the whole project, they are the engine that makes the cogs turn, the things you listed are things attached to the cogs, they don't matter if they get chopped and changed.
Then again, the untried and untested networking code they are going to use has just reached release status so perhaps doing all of this now is ok.... almost 5 years into the project LOL
It would be, if they haven't always prioritized everything Squadron 42 related.
Finally with the 2.x releases the dev specific to the PU is catching up.
You have stated that you expect to have an Alpha up and going in about 12 months, with a beta roughly 10 months after that and then launch. For a game of this size and scope, do you think you can really be done in the next two years?
Really it is all about constant iteration from launch. The whole idea is to be constantly updating. It isn’t like the old days where you had to have everything and the kitchen sink in at launch because you weren’t going to come back to it for awhile. We’re already one year in - another two years puts us at 3 total which is ideal. Any more and things would begin to get stale.
You have a funny way of counting .... Even if you count the founding date of CIG (April 2012) as a start,its significantly less than 5 years.
Have fun
This has been covered time and time again and you're fully aware of that. If Roberts says it is one year in then it's one year in... revising history will not change the fact.
You have stated that you expect to have an Alpha up and going in about 12 months, with a beta roughly 10 months after that and then launch. For a game of this size and scope, do you think you can really be done in the next two years?
Really it is all about constant iteration from launch. The whole idea is to be constantly updating. It isn’t like the old days where you had to have everything and the kitchen sink in at launch because you weren’t going to come back to it for awhile. We’re already one year in - another two years puts us at 3 total which is ideal. Any more and things would begin to get stale.
Erillion likes to gloss over that statement made by Chris or try and justify it by saying it's not really game dev time since the studio didn't exist yet
Erillion likes to gloss over that statement made by Chris or try and justify it by saying it's not really game dev time since the studio didn't exist yet
Well let him squirm as much as he likes.. the statement from his Lord and Saviour is out there, lighting the truth in this dark world of hate and misinformation.
There is no argument when you're discussing with walls of bias, you'd be not worth the waste of time. Is it preferable repeating the same things like a macro for years and years as some people have been doing?
I recall years ago on their very first delay his wife made a small joke on stage about him always being late.
Having seen that even the best developer when it comes to time management are almost always late that if an insider that close to him sees him as a personality of 'being late' that this project is going to be very very late.
So I stopped following very shortly after that, that was about 2+ years ago I think.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Comments
Most important part? It was completely irrelevant because at no point i was talking about release dates.
Do me a favor and go scream 2 weeks at that wall right there <<<.
On an monthly report several months ago it was reported i think by Austin / Germany studios that they had a prototype of the solar system up and running, so this things are clearly past "figuring stuff out" phases.
Also that claim yuou just did reminds me of the discussions i had with you, on a moment it's Oranges the other is Bananas, always derailing the discussion to a point of nit-picking on irrelevant things because why not? Like the posts you are just doing against me, great contribution to the thread!
Roberts had to start delivering something, thats why this whole procedural planets thing got going, no where were these things mentioned in the SC lexicon until Elite Dangerous was released and then released this portion of their game themselves. Then it was suddenly Roberts who figured he might as well try and do them and do them better.
I also said that Elite Dangerous would either destroy SC or finally get them to at least deliver something. It is the game that SC claimed to be. That point has been made a few times. So either Roberts learns a few things from what they have done or are doing or he tries to out do them. The former is a much smarter plan. The latter will never work.
But as these progress it will highlight either what has been wrong with Roberts and the project (again highlighted here by others( or it could ark a turning point for them and possibly see some actual progress that isnt concept, cinematic, or dream walking. But so far it looks like he hasnt learned anything and is still trying to reinvent stuff that is more than good enough and still trying to prove he can make his project better than anything else. And the more Elite Dangerous continues to grow and IMPLEMENT these things for people to actually play in a game the further behind SC will fall and the more ground Roberts will try and make up and then try and get ahead of.
It was bad enough when Roberts was competing with air (and his own imagination) in trying to deliver this game, but now that there sis an actual viable product out that if you called Star Citizen people could believe it he is in a very bad position.
If you prefer Elite Dangerous and it identify more with that game, go play it then...
--> 41 M$ Stretch Goal ..... achieved 31st March 2014
"Advanced procedural generation will be necessary for creating entire planets worth of exploration and development content. A special strike team of procedural generation-oriented developers will be assembled to make this technology a reality."
https://www.robertsspaceindustries.com/funding-goals
E:D Horizon Expansion with PG airless planets and moons was announced on August 5, 2015 at Gamescom. Before that E:D only used PG to generate systems (NOT planets, NOT moons). You could not land on any planetary bodies.
Have fun
The "promise" before R&D was done was already made last year. They are already developing the solutions, unfortunately it will take its time and we can only judge once the results are released.
E:D follows the incremental approach. Small steps. Reach for the low hanging fruits first (like airless barren moons as a first step to PG planets). Use existing technologies in innovative ways.
SC follows the cinematic, completionist approach - create a complete (or almost complete) package and drop it in one piece, using newly developed technologies that allow more than the current state of the (console compatibility restricted) art.
I follow both paths with interest, playing both E:D and SC Alpha.
When both games are finally "complete", i will personally decide who was "better", "faster", "cheaper" or more "competent". In both cases I expect this to take a few more years and expansions.
Have fun
The networking and instancing are core to the whole project, they are the engine that makes the cogs turn, the things you listed are things attached to the cogs, they don't matter if they get chopped and changed.
Then again, the untried and untested networking code they are going to use has just reached release status so perhaps doing all of this now is ok.... almost 5 years into the project LOL
Finally with the 2.x releases the dev specific to the PU is catching up.
You have a funny way of counting ....
Even if you count the founding date of CIG (April 2012) as a start,its significantly less than 5 years.
Have fun
You have stated that you expect to have an Alpha up and going in about 12 months, with a beta roughly 10 months after that and then launch. For a game of this size and scope, do you think you can really be done in the next two years?
Really it is all about constant iteration from launch. The whole idea is to be constantly updating. It isn’t like the old days where you had to have everything and the kitchen sink in at launch because you weren’t going to come back to it for awhile. We’re already one year in - another two years puts us at 3 total which is ideal. Any more and things would begin to get stale.
..Cake..
This has been covered time and time again and you're fully aware of that.
If Roberts says it is one year in then it's one year in... revising history will not change the fact.
Have fun
..Cake..
..Cake..
Hurrah for stuff that must go on!
Having seen that even the best developer when it comes to time management are almost always late that if an insider that close to him sees him as a personality of 'being late' that this project is going to be very very late.
So I stopped following very shortly after that, that was about 2+ years ago I think.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me