Saga of Lucimia on Subscriptions - 'The More Options You Provide a Player, the Better' - MMORPG.com

SBFord

Saga of Lucimia on Subscriptions - 'The More Options You Provide a Player, the Better' - MMORPG.com

The Saga of Lucimia site has been updated with a new Mondays in MMOs that deals with one of the genre's most enduring subjects: To Subscribe or Not to Subscribe. In it, Tim "Renfail" Anderson examines the issue starting with a look at the division of the market with regard to subscriptions vs non-subscription games. From there, the post looks at collected data from a number of sources before coming to the conclusion that players will support a game regardless IF the game is "fun & immersive".

Read the full story here

Renfail

Also worth noting is that no matter HOW we decide to do our monthly sub, it will never include microtransactions for real cash: https://sagaoflucimia.com/mondays-in-mmorpgs-microtransactions-and-why-we-dont-have-them

jj7009

Wait isn't this the same game that bans you for having silly names? It sounds like it wants to be a 90s mmo which is good. The problem I have is it only seems to want RPers. I don't see the point of being an mmo if your forced into a certain type of arbitrary interaction.

Renfail

jj7009 said:

Wait isn't this the same game that bans you for having silly names? It sounds like it wants to be a 90s mmo which is good. The problem I have is it only seems to want RPers. I don't see the point of being an mmo if your forced into a certain type of arbitrary interaction.

Yep, we are absolutely enforcing a fantasy roleplay naming environment. 

jj7009 wouldn't fly, that's for sure  

"From names like Puffmaster or Gandalfff that just don’t quite fit, to offensive names like Fisturmom or Babykillr, MMORPGs are rife with examples of bad nomes de plum. Once upon a time in the golden age before profits became the only concern, companies actually took the time to uphold naming policies, at least to weed out the most offensive. Sadly, those days have long since passed, with most titles these days allowing players to call themselves whatever they desire."

We will be working together with our community to create a safe haven for roleplayers and those who prefer their fantasy worlds to be free of real-world references or references to other fantastical settings.

Because no matter who you are as a player, you can come up with something other than Teabagger, Cokzsucker, or the millionth variation of Drizzt or Legolas.

https://sagaoflucimia.com/mondays-in-mmorpgs-naming-policies/

jj7009

Renfail said:

jj7009 said:

Wait isn't this the same game that bans you for having silly names? It sounds like it wants to be a 90s mmo which is good. The problem I have is it only seems to want RPers. I don't see the point of being an mmo if your forced into a certain type of arbitrary interaction.

Yep, we are absolutely enforcing a fantasy roleplay naming environment. 

jj7009 wouldn't fly, that's for sure  

"From names like Puffmaster or Gandalfff that just don’t quite fit, to offensive names like Fisturmom or Babykillr, MMORPGs are rife with examples of bad nomes de plum. Once upon a time in the golden age before profits became the only concern, companies actually took the time to uphold naming policies, at least to weed out the most offensive. Sadly, those days have long since passed, with most titles these days allowing players to call themselves whatever they desire."

We will be working together with our community to create a safe haven for roleplayers and those who prefer their fantasy worlds to be free of real-world references or references to other fantastical settings.

Because no matter who you are as a player, you can come up with something other than Teabagger, Cokzsucker, or the millionth variation of Drizzt or Legolas.

https://sagaoflucimia.com/mondays-in-mmorpgs-naming-policies/

When was this golden age? Cocktimusprime Tig'ol PPalloverme were all names in everquest. Maybe ultima had a naming policy but I never played it so I wouldn't know. Hell Even back when i played meridian59 they had no naming policy. Only played a few muds but even most of those didn't have a naming policy. (This excludes obvious racism in names which has always been a big nono) Don't get me wrong RPing is fun but even when I do that I hardly fit in universe. Back in burning crusade I had an orc only guild on dalaran called "Gutspilla's Spoiky Boyz" We role played as warhammer 40k orks that crashed on azeroth. Had to speak "Orky" all the time or /gkick. Part of the fun of having real people to play with in mmos is the absurdity it brings. I think it would make more sense to have some rp servers with rules like this. Also most Mmos still enforce a ban/name change on offensive names even when not offenseive in context. Had a mage called Analthought. Which the use of anal denotes being obsessed with detail. Got a 3 day ban for offensive name on gw2. Got a name change in wow. Got a perma ban in rift (which was lifted after an explanation was sent). FFXIV didn't do anything and thats the best game I listed.

jj7009

Also jj7009 was my name in runescape given by the generator when jj7 was taken.

Renfail

Our world, our way. We aren't interested in names that break the immersion of our fantasy world. 

Panther2103

Renfail said:

Our world, our way. We aren't interested in names that break the immersion of our fantasy world. 

Aren't you also basically developing around forced grouping as well?

You are severely limiting your already niche audience by creating these walls. 

Sovrath

Panther2103 said:

Renfail said:

Our world, our way. We aren't interested in names that break the immersion of our fantasy world. 

Aren't you also basically developing around forced grouping as well?

You are severely limiting your already niche audience by creating these walls. 

Except the people playing the game would know it's a grouping game and most likely flock to it provided they do a good job. That's key.

None of these are walls so much as selling points for those wanting to buy this type of experience.

jj7009

Renfail said:

Our world, our way. We aren't interested in names that break the immersion of our fantasy world. 

Oh look at that you just threw civil conversation out the window "My way or the highway." I'll take the highway as it looks like those roads lead to greener pastures. You seem to be unaware that one of the big draws of mmos is player agency. The freedom to play a game in the way you find most enjoyable. You are taking away that agency by limiting player choice. I'll end the conversation here as you don't seem interested in discourse. I wish you the best of luck in you endeavors.

Renfail

Panther2103 said:

Renfail said:

Our world, our way. We aren't interested in names that break the immersion of our fantasy world. 

Aren't you also basically developing around forced grouping as well?

You are severely limiting your already niche audience by creating these walls. 

Nope, it's absolutely not forced grouping. That's a myth propogated by the misinformed. 


As per our FAQ Page: 

"If you make the decision to leave the safety of town and its guards, it’s not a decision you should be making lightly. While there are little things you can do on your own just outside of outposts and cities in micro-sessions of 30 minutes to 1.5 hours (gather pelts and harvesting supplies, take on small bandit outposts, etc.), the further you go afield, the less civilized the world is, and the more dangerous things become.

Think early EverQuest. You can head out, harvest a few things, craft a bit, kill a few mobs close to town within the safety of the guards if you need to run, but if you want to hit up Orc Hill you’ll need 3-4 other players, and if you want to head into Crushbone and handle the Throne Room, you’ll need a full group. You need a well-balanced group of adventurers to handle whatever you might come across in the wild. You need gear. You need supplies. Bandages. Potions. Scrolls. A pack mule. Rope. Never leave home without a good length of rope."

More info: https://sagaoflucimia.com/game/faq

Panther2103

Renfail said:

Panther2103 said:

Renfail said:

Our world, our way. We aren't interested in names that break the immersion of our fantasy world. 

Aren't you also basically developing around forced grouping as well?

You are severely limiting your already niche audience by creating these walls. 

Nope, it's absolutely not forced grouping. That's a myth propogated by the misinformed. 


As per our FAQ Page: 

"If you make the decision to leave the safety of town and its guards, it’s not a decision you should be making lightly. While there are little things you can do on your own just outside of outposts and cities in micro-sessions of 30 minutes to 1.5 hours (gather pelts and harvesting supplies, take on small bandit outposts, etc.), the further you go afield, the less civilized the world is, and the more dangerous things become.

Think early EverQuest. You can head out, harvest a few things, craft a bit, kill a few mobs close to town within the safety of the guards if you need to run, but if you want to hit up Orc Hill you’ll need 3-4 other players, and if you want to head into Crushbone and handle the Throne Room, you’ll need a full group. You need a well-balanced group of adventurers to handle whatever you might come across in the wild. You need gear. You need supplies. Bandages. Potions. Scrolls. A pack mule. Rope. Never leave home without a good length of rope."

More info: https://sagaoflucimia.com/game/faq

Alright that shines a bit more light on it. I kept reading that in other threads so I guess I just had assumed that it was a fact. 

While I'm not 100% on the naming thing I can understand it. That passage does make me more interested in this game now as well, as I thought it was 100% grouping. 

Thanks

Renfail

Sovrath said:

Panther2103 said:

Renfail said:

Our world, our way. We aren't interested in names that break the immersion of our fantasy world. 

Aren't you also basically developing around forced grouping as well?

You are severely limiting your already niche audience by creating these walls. 

Except the people playing the game would know it's a grouping game and most likely flock to it provided they do a good job. That's key.

None of these are walls so much as selling points for those wanting to buy this type of experience.

This ties directly into something we were talking about the other day, the thought that group-based games are "niche" titles. 

They aren't. There are well beyond 100m players on the global, English speaking market who prefer group-based, sub-based games. 

But let's ignore the data and pay attention to the free-to-play, give-it-to-me-solo-or-I-won't-play-it market 

Renfail

parrotpholk said:

Renfail said:

Our world, our way. We aren't interested in names that break the immersion of our fantasy world. 

I support what you guys are doing as I think it is admirable such a small team is attempting something like this in this day and age.

That being said it is not your fantasy world, yes you are creating it but it will be the players world.  No players then no world.  Yes having names that are just plain silly or overtly racist or sexual for the sake of being cute is stupid and I would rather not see them.  But instead of engaging in conversation which jj was attempting to do you resort to its my ball so I am going home.

Public relations is as important as producing a good game.  No one wants to play in the douchebag kids sandbox.  Maybe a different tone would be good.

Just as much as a restaurant reserves the right to say "no shirt, no shoes, no service", we reserve the right to say "pick a fantasy-themed name". 

kitarad

Their game so they are entitled to decide what they don't want in the game.

Renfail

Panther2103 said:

Renfail said:

Panther2103 said:

Renfail said:

Our world, our way. We aren't interested in names that break the immersion of our fantasy world. 

Aren't you also basically developing around forced grouping as well?

You are severely limiting your already niche audience by creating these walls. 

Nope, it's absolutely not forced grouping. That's a myth propogated by the misinformed. 


As per our FAQ Page: 

"If you make the decision to leave the safety of town and its guards, it’s not a decision you should be making lightly. While there are little things you can do on your own just outside of outposts and cities in micro-sessions of 30 minutes to 1.5 hours (gather pelts and harvesting supplies, take on small bandit outposts, etc.), the further you go afield, the less civilized the world is, and the more dangerous things become.

Think early EverQuest. You can head out, harvest a few things, craft a bit, kill a few mobs close to town within the safety of the guards if you need to run, but if you want to hit up Orc Hill you’ll need 3-4 other players, and if you want to head into Crushbone and handle the Throne Room, you’ll need a full group. You need a well-balanced group of adventurers to handle whatever you might come across in the wild. You need gear. You need supplies. Bandages. Potions. Scrolls. A pack mule. Rope. Never leave home without a good length of rope."

More info: https://sagaoflucimia.com/game/faq

Alright that shines a bit more light on it. I kept reading that in other threads so I guess I just had assumed that it was a fact. 

While I'm not 100% on the naming thing I can understand it. That passage does make me more interested in this game now as well, as I thought it was 100% grouping. 

Thanks

Cheers. 

We see the same myth propogated across various media outlets (here, Massively, a couple of other places), and yet these outlets have never attempted to fix their reporting, despite our prolonged "we are NOT forced grouping" replies to folks. 

It is what it is. That's "journalism" these days for ya. 

We're no different than early EverQuest in our grouping mechanisms. 

You can solo a bit close to towns, and with certain skills/gear/etc. you can solo further afield, but if you want to do dungeons it's 100% group. 

Mikeha

I am totally on board with this game. Keep up the good work.

Renfail

Mikeha said:

I am totally on board with this game. Keep up the good work.

You and us also Thanks for the support!

Renfail

kitarad said:

Their game so they are entitled to decide what they don't want in the game.

Yep!

Honestly, it's Common Sense 101. If someone's idea of a "good" name is "Coknocker", they aren't going to fit in with our world, our lore, or our community. 

Mikeha

parrotpholk said:

Renfail said:

Our world, our way. We aren't interested in names that break the immersion of our fantasy world. 

I support what you guys are doing as I think it is admirable such a small team is attempting something like this in this day and age.

That being said it is not your fantasy world, yes you are creating it but it will be the players world.  No players then no world.  Yes having names that are just plain silly or overtly racist or sexual for the sake of being cute is stupid and I would rather not see them.  But instead of engaging in conversation which jj was attempting to do you resort to its my ball so I am going home.

Public relations is as important as producing a good game.  No one wants to play in the douchebag kids sandbox.  Maybe a different tone would be good.

What you all are not getting is that there is no reason to engage in conversation. He said that the game will have a strict naming policy and then explained why the game would have it. What else is there to say?

 If this is something a person does not accept in this game then they have 100 other mmos where they can make a character named turdboy33 or lolnoob.

jj7009

Mikeha said:

parrotpholk said:

Renfail said:

Our world, our way. We aren't interested in names that break the immersion of our fantasy world. 

I support what you guys are doing as I think it is admirable such a small team is attempting something like this in this day and age.

That being said it is not your fantasy world, yes you are creating it but it will be the players world.  No players then no world.  Yes having names that are just plain silly or overtly racist or sexual for the sake of being cute is stupid and I would rather not see them.  But instead of engaging in conversation which jj was attempting to do you resort to its my ball so I am going home.

Public relations is as important as producing a good game.  No one wants to play in the douchebag kids sandbox.  Maybe a different tone would be good.

What you all are not getting is that there is no reason to engage in conversation. He said that the game will have a strict naming policy and then explained why the game would have it. What else is there to say?

 If this is something a person does not accept in this game then they have 100 other mmos where they can make a character named turdboy33 or lolnoob.

He started a conversation with me by replying. Then ended it when he didnt want to addres my point. Marketing is just as important as the product itself. He's being openly rude and dismissive in a conversation he started when responding to my one off original comment. He's free to make his game however he sees fit but dont start a conversation and then rudely end it. If he cant moderate himself how can I expect him to moderate the game fairly. But im not his dad, im a potential customer. Was a potential customer.

Renfail

jj7009 said:

Mikeha said:

parrotpholk said:

Renfail said:

Our world, our way. We aren't interested in names that break the immersion of our fantasy world. 

I support what you guys are doing as I think it is admirable such a small team is attempting something like this in this day and age.

That being said it is not your fantasy world, yes you are creating it but it will be the players world.  No players then no world.  Yes having names that are just plain silly or overtly racist or sexual for the sake of being cute is stupid and I would rather not see them.  But instead of engaging in conversation which jj was attempting to do you resort to its my ball so I am going home.

Public relations is as important as producing a good game.  No one wants to play in the douchebag kids sandbox.  Maybe a different tone would be good.

What you all are not getting is that there is no reason to engage in conversation. He said that the game will have a strict naming policy and then explained why the game would have it. What else is there to say?

 If this is something a person does not accept in this game then they have 100 other mmos where they can make a character named turdboy33 or lolnoob.

He started a conversation with me by replying. Then ended it when he didnt want to addres my point. Marketing is just as important as the product itself. He's being openly rude and dismissive in a conversation he started when responding to my one off original comment. He's free to make his game however he sees fit but dont start a conversation and then rudely end it. If he cant moderate himself how can I expect him to moderate the game fairly. But im not his dad, im a potential customer. Was a potential customer.

This was never a topic about our naming policies; it was a topic about monthly subs. You asked about our naming policies, I gave you our answer. 

You did not like our answer, you went on a rant about how I didn't "address your point". 

Clearly, I did. When I first linked to our post about our naming policy. 

jj7009

So now my response is labeled a rant. I disagreed with your policy and posed another question about it and was dismissed. Your coming to these threads to comment is part of PR. You being rudely dismissive is poor pr. You never addressed the points raised in the follow up to your response.

My response was cordial in tone and simply raised the question of when was this supposed golden age. However since your are going to be antagonistic I'll be blunt. Your so called "Golden age" never existed. You probably Rp'd on EQ1 or ultima and were in a very serious guild that never broke character. Whenever someone challenges this illusion of nostalgia you become rude and antagonistic. I pointed out what I saw as flaws, in essence present you an opportunity to change my mind and the mind of other readers. You seem to be blind to the marketing troubles that the path your taking will lead to.

The game will already be niche. Now friends have to stay in character when talking in open chat or they will be reprimanded. Which will no doubt cause some to leave. Which in turn will make it harder to find groups for outside content. Which will cause more open an open complaint from a few. Which will result in a reprimand. You've already created a negative feedback loop for player growth.

But hey your world your rules, you know best. Im sure those millions of group content only players will be lining up to play your game that looks like it's being made on unity 3. It's not like that group has full time jobs. Your not going reach a new generation and frankly you dont seem willing to. And what 100 million players? Wow players? Ff14 players? Gw2? Eso? EQ1? Ultima? All of those together dont even make up a 100 million players. And most of those games group based content isnt even done by the majority of the player base in those. You're either misinformed delusional or both. (Btw this ^ is what rant looks like)

SBFord

Renfail said:

Cheers. 

We see the same myth propogated across various media outlets (here, Massively, a couple of other places), and yet these outlets have never attempted to fix their reporting, despite our prolonged "we are NOT forced grouping" replies to folks. 

It is what it is. That's "journalism" these days for ya. 

We're no different than early EverQuest in our grouping mechanisms. 

You can solo a bit close to towns, and with certain skills/gear/etc. you can solo further afield, but if you want to do dungeons it's 100% group. 

Wow so you come in and bad mouth the staff here rather than reach out to the reporter or writer to perhaps offer an interview to clarify your stance or even a developer blog to get the word out the way you  want it? Very nice.

Our site. Our reporting. As you say about SoL, you don't like it, feel free to leave if you're unwilling to engage in constructive dialog.

BillMurphy

@Renfail - You've reached out to us on numerous occasions for stories. If you want something reported on, you're better off reaching out to us than coming into our forums and badmouthing the hardest working news editor in gaming. 

jj7009

SBFord said:

Renfail said:

Cheers. 

We see the same myth propogated across various media outlets (here, Massively, a couple of other places), and yet these outlets have never attempted to fix their reporting, despite our prolonged "we are NOT forced grouping" replies to folks. 

It is what it is. That's "journalism" these days for ya. 

We're no different than early EverQuest in our grouping mechanisms. 

You can solo a bit close to towns, and with certain skills/gear/etc. you can solo further afield, but if you want to do dungeons it's 100% group. 

Wow so you come in and bad mouth the staff here rather than reach out to the reporter or writer to perhaps offer an interview to clarify your stance or even a developer blog to get the word out the way you  want it? Very nice.

Our site. Our reporting. As you say about SoL, you don't like it, feel free to leave if you're unwilling to engage in constructive dialog.

BillMurphy said:

@Renfail - You've reached out to us on numerous occasions for stories. If you want something reported on, you're better off reaching out to us than coming into our forums and badmouthing the hardest working news editor in gaming. 

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