Appearances used to be something that was earned and something to play/work for, cash shops take that part of the game out, and are in that way counter productive to the game's survival.
In a perfect world, cash shops in any form need to go away and games need to be a complete product or service again.
We have had endless debates over the past year on the above.
Allowing players customization via cosmetics is a HUGE win in terms of keeping players in a game in the modern generation of streamers and gaming celebrities who focus on selfies and constantly tweaking the look of their toon.
But you completely lose the "earned" element, which means someone looking at you has no idea if you actually went out and spent time + effort to get that piece, or if you just paid for it with cash.
We're looking forward to tackle the appearance problem in our own unique way. We have nothing ready to announce publicly yet, but suffice to say we're looking into ways that we can include apperance options for players as part of their monthly subscription in a way that doesn't trivialize the items so that players will still be able to look at you and KNOW exactly where you got that armor, and that you earned it before you used it
You can just do two sets of cosmetics. One could be earned only and consist of skill based effects, other in cash shop and deal with the color of gear.
Also, i 100% agree with naming policy. I hate it when people have silly names in MMO's. Because of your naming policy ill keep a close watch on the game . . .
Catch me streaming at twitch.tv/cryomatrix You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations.
Once again? Naming standards like that have never been a thing in any popular mmos that I am aware of. You guys must be from the berenstain bears universe, hate to be the one to break it to you but that never happened over here in the berenstien bears universe.
“They have a anti-semetic policy and there’s nothing else to say about it. Your feelings are no ones responsibility but your own.” Wow that statement looks pretty outlandish and nonsensical now. If See something isn’t fun I’ll call it out. If the developer chooses to engage in this forum then I’ll ask him about this policy. The post has nothing to do with feelings and I pointed out specific points. Why is it every advocate for this game is a dismissive tool? If you think I’m wrong then tell me why. Don’t say “idc about your feelings” becuase you took the time to write a response. It’s not my fault you didn’t take the time to think about it. Heaven forbid a discussion occur in a forum.
Once again? Naming standards like that have never been a thing in any popular mmos that I am aware of. You guys must be from the berenstain bears universe, hate to be the one to break it to you but that never happened over here in the berenstien bears universe.
“They have a anti-semetic policy and there’s nothing else to say about it. Your feelings are no ones responsibility but your own.” Wow that statement looks pretty outlandish and nonsensical now. If See something isn’t fun I’ll call it out. If the developer chooses to engage in this forum then I’ll ask him about this policy. The post has nothing to do with feelings and I pointed out specific points. Why is it every advocate for this game is a dismissive tool? If you think I’m wrong then tell me why. Don’t say “idc about your feelings” becuase you took the time to write a response. It’s not my fault you didn’t take the time to think about it. Heaven forbid a discussion occur in a forum.
But naming policies were a thing back in the day, at least on the games I used to play.
Lineage 1, DAOC, Lineage 2, WOW, Vanguard and LOTRO, it was pretty much a hobby of mine to report players with names which were outlandish, proprietary or just annoyed me and I recorded dozens of "kills" for each game.
Why did I do it? If your "fun" infringes on my "fun" I'll use every reporting tool available to take you down. I've turned in guild mates who have openly admitted to cheating, as I did for some who were radar hacking in DAOC. It is not without reason I often play a Paladin (lawful good) in MMORPGs.
I recall in vanilla WOW cringing when my 12 yr old son chose punkrockker for his character name, especially when some person actually pinged him and gave him some grief about it. (I couldn't really blame them)
I figured he would get reported and be asked to change it but never happened, but then WOW was the beginning of the end for many good things, enforcement of a proper naming policy being among the least.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Once again? Naming standards like that have never been a thing in any popular mmos that I am aware of. You guys must be from the berenstain bears universe, hate to be the one to break it to you but that never happened over here in the berenstien bears universe.
“They have a anti-semetic policy and there’s nothing else to say about it. Your feelings are no ones responsibility but your own.” Wow that statement looks pretty outlandish and nonsensical now. If See something isn’t fun I’ll call it out. If the developer chooses to engage in this forum then I’ll ask him about this policy. The post has nothing to do with feelings and I pointed out specific points. Why is it every advocate for this game is a dismissive tool? If you think I’m wrong then tell me why. Don’t say “idc about your feelings” becuase you took the time to write a response. It’s not my fault you didn’t take the time to think about it. Heaven forbid a discussion occur in a forum.
As Kyleran said...it absolutely WAS a thing. I used the report function in games quite often when i saw people trying to get around the naming policies games had back when. Very few games do not have the naming policy in their TOS they may not enforce it strictly, but you will find a policy if you look.
I am a firm believer that having a strict policy on names will have a positive effect on the player base not to have to be grouped, or see others running around with, names nasty or just plain garbage text.
If you do not have the care or intelligence to come up with a basic game name that is fitting...why should others care to take the time to bother trying to get to know you? You obviously do not care much about the game and will most likely not be around long.
I completely disagree that whether the customization comes from earning it or from a cash shop isn't the important thing. Getting cool looking gear is important like you say, but short-cutting that out to cash shops rather than earning it removes that part of the motivation that person would have had to play the amount of time it would have taken to earn that gear.
I think you get that, but like other dev out there, you see an opportunity to make more money in the short term. I guarantee WOW and Everquest back when would not have been around as long as it they have been had they taken that approach. They had enough else going for them that they were able to make money without stooping to that. Maybe things have changed, but if someone builds a truly good game, people will support via sub just like they still do WOW, without that cash shop.
Wow isn't my favorite game to reference because they've taken shortcuts in their own ways too, but the reference works.
The point I'm trying to make (in a roundabout way), is that the data shows that it doesn't matter if it's via a cash shop OR via other means within the subscription (such as dye packs or faction recipes), players WANT a means to customize their appearance.
The old way of "wearing only what you found in a dungeon" doesn't work in the modern era. Even WoW allows for transmogrification of gear (did I spell that right?) with their mandatory subscription.
Our entire development team is HARD stance on "your appearance should ONLY show what you earned by questing and/or running dungeons".
However....
There are also modern audiences to consider, which is why taking a look at how games like WoW, for example, do things is a good starting point for looking at hybrid models.
Once again? Naming standards like that have never been a thing in any popular mmos that I am aware of. You guys must be from the berenstain bears universe, hate to be the one to break it to you but that never happened over here in the berenstien bears universe.
“They have a anti-semetic policy and there’s nothing else to say about it. Your feelings are no ones responsibility but your own.” Wow that statement looks pretty outlandish and nonsensical now. If See something isn’t fun I’ll call it out. If the developer chooses to engage in this forum then I’ll ask him about this policy. The post has nothing to do with feelings and I pointed out specific points. Why is it every advocate for this game is a dismissive tool? If you think I’m wrong then tell me why. Don’t say “idc about your feelings” becuase you took the time to write a response. It’s not my fault you didn’t take the time to think about it. Heaven forbid a discussion occur in a forum.
But naming policies were a thing back in the day, at least on the games I used to play.
Lineage 1, DAOC, Lineage 2, WOW, Vanguard and LOTRO, it was pretty much a hobby of mine to report players with names which were outlandish, proprietary or just annoyed me and I recorded dozens of "kills" for each game.
Why did I do it? If your "fun" infringes on my "fun" I'll use every reporting tool available to take you down. I've turned in guild mates who have openly admitted to cheating, as I did for some who were radar hacking in DAOC. It is not without reason I often play a Paladin (lawful good) in MMORPGs.
I recall in vanilla WOW cringing when my 12 yr old son chose punkrockker for his character name, especially when some person actually pinged him and gave him some grief about it. (I couldn't really blame them)
I figured he would get reported and be asked to change it but never happened, but then WOW was the beginning of the end for many good things, enforcement of a proper naming policy being among the least.
Reporting names was always part and parcel in EverQuest 1, and EverQuest 2.
On the European LOTRO RP server, if your name wasn't fantasy-based or in any way broke the immersion of the server, your name was petititioned. In many cases, there were whole forum threads dedicated to listing names and screenshots of folks who had ridiculous, non-fantasy titles.
Reporting names was also in Vanguard and World of Warcraft.
Appearances used to be something that was earned and something to play/work for, cash shops take that part of the game out, and are in that way counter productive to the game's survival.
In a perfect world, cash shops in any form need to go away and games need to be a complete product or service again.
We have had endless debates over the past year on the above.
Allowing players customization via cosmetics is a HUGE win in terms of keeping players in a game in the modern generation of streamers and gaming celebrities who focus on selfies and constantly tweaking the look of their toon.
But you completely lose the "earned" element, which means someone looking at you has no idea if you actually went out and spent time + effort to get that piece, or if you just paid for it with cash.
We're looking forward to tackle the appearance problem in our own unique way. We have nothing ready to announce publicly yet, but suffice to say we're looking into ways that we can include apperance options for players as part of their monthly subscription in a way that doesn't trivialize the items so that players will still be able to look at you and KNOW exactly where you got that armor, and that you earned it before you used it
You can just do two sets of cosmetics. One could be earned only and consist of skill based effects, other in cash shop and deal with the color of gear.
Also, i 100% agree with naming policy. I hate it when people have silly names in MMO's. Because of your naming policy ill keep a close watch on the game . . .
Well, we're firmly on the "no cash shop allowed" side of the fence, for starters.
However, we *do* have a plan in place that allows for appearance customization. That being said, it won't be available to players just starting out; you'll have to put in time + effort and you'll have to FIRST earn gear the old fashioned way (by pulling it out of dungeons and doing quests) before you are allowed to then customize your appearance.
Why is it that people who have an untenable position always make themselves out to be the victim? Is it easier for them to make their points about their untenable position and while insulting the developer and then still get the pity and commiseration.
Look the rule is clear deal with it. I mean especially because you're advocating rubbish names and trying to make it sound like that is not what you're advocating. Like you really care about the discussion. Leave this poor beleaguered developer alone for god's sake and let him get on to more important things then your reasons for names like 'koksyucker'.
I read "The More Options You Provide a Player, the Better" on the front page. And so I clicked on the article, only to see your posts and your "Our game, our rules" mentality. I'm not sure you truly understand the concept of "more player options"
More options doesn't by necessity mean all options whether they mesh well with or at all with their design goals for their game.
They have an uncompromising naming policy, that I'm sure will provide plentiful options for setting appropriate choice. It wouldn't be necessary if they could count on players voluntarily choosing names that enhance the verity of their setting, but clearly any expectation of that on their part would be the height of naivete.
It is refreshing to once again see a MMORPG company that recognizes the importance of naming standards in helping to maintain the verisimilitude of their setting, which in turn aids in the suspension of disbelief that can make such games so compelling.
Thank you We're working hard to make it a compelling fantasy world to immerse yourself into.
Once again? Naming standards like that have never been a thing in any popular mmos that I am aware of. You guys must be from the berenstain bears universe, hate to be the one to break it to you but that never happened over here in the berenstien bears universe.
“They have a anti-semetic policy and there’s nothing else to say about it. Your feelings are no ones responsibility but your own.” Wow that statement looks pretty outlandish and nonsensical now. If See something isn’t fun I’ll call it out. If the developer chooses to engage in this forum then I’ll ask him about this policy. The post has nothing to do with feelings and I pointed out specific points. Why is it every advocate for this game is a dismissive tool? If you think I’m wrong then tell me why. Don’t say “idc about your feelings” becuase you took the time to write a response. It’s not my fault you didn’t take the time to think about it. Heaven forbid a discussion occur in a forum.
As Kyleran said...it absolutely WAS a thing. I used the report function in games quite often when i saw people trying to get around the naming policies games had back when. Very few games do not have the naming policy in their TOS they may not enforce it strictly, but you will find a policy if you look.
I am a firm believer that having a strict policy on names will have a positive effect on the player base not to have to be grouped, or see others running around with, names nasty or just plain garbage text.
If you do not have the care or intelligence to come up with a basic game name that is fitting...why should others care to take the time to bother trying to get to know you? You obviously do not care much about the game and will most likely not be around long.
The point I'm trying to make (in a roundabout way), is that the data shows that it doesn't matter if it's via a cash shop OR via other means within the subscription (such as dye packs or faction recipes), players WANT a means to customize their appearance.
The old way of "wearing only what you found in a dungeon" doesn't work in the modern era. Even WoW allows for transmogrification of gear (did I spell that right?) with their mandatory subscription.
In what game did this "old way" exist? In DAOC I could dye almost everything, even weapons.
Players often wore crafted gear with the specific stats they desired to perfect their builds.
I submit it was newer MMOs which took away customization, many older games had it.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
The point I'm trying to make (in a roundabout way), is that the data shows that it doesn't matter if it's via a cash shop OR via other means within the subscription (such as dye packs or faction recipes), players WANT a means to customize their appearance.
The old way of "wearing only what you found in a dungeon" doesn't work in the modern era. Even WoW allows for transmogrification of gear (did I spell that right?) with their mandatory subscription.
In what game did this "old way" exist? In DAOC I could dye almost everything, even weapons.
Players often wore crafted gear with the specific stats they desired to perfect their builds.
I submit it was newer MMOs which took away customization, many older games had it.
You couldn't customize your appearance in vanilla EverQuest, not for many years.
Dye packs were the first step. But in the first few years (don't remember exactly the time period), you could ONLY wear what you earned from dungeons/quests/drops OR had crafted for you (which was not customizable; it was however it turned out based on the recipe, which did not allow for customization)
It's difficult to argue taking customization away from the way used to be in older games and putting it in the cash shop isn't bad. However considering how the cost of developing games have gone up and players are not willing any more to accept even subscriptions and let alone higher subscriptions I think this devolution can be something we as players cannot really complain about seeing as we are partly responsible for the rise of F2P games and cash shops.
If players didn't 'whale', these things wouldn't be so popular. This is a direct fault of players being greedy and buying what they want with wanton abandon.
It's difficult to argue taking customization away from the way used to be in older games and putting it in the cash shop isn't bad. However considering how the cost of developing games have gone up and players are not willing any more to accept even subscriptions and let alone higher subscriptions I think this devolution can be something we as players cannot really complain about seeing as we are partly responsible for the rise of F2P games and cash shops.
If players didn't 'whale', these things wouldn't be so popular. This is a direct fault of players being greedy and buying what they want with wanton abandon.
It all comes down to gear should be EARNED (in our opinion).
However, the evolution of the gaming industry towards F2P titles with cash shops has given players that instant gratification "hit", and it's such a sweet, sweet feeling to be able to just pay a couple of bucks and BAM, have this badass fiery robe or skeleton horse or black cape or whatever.
When you take that away from players, they get grumpy =P
It's like WiFi on planes; we didn't use to have it. 10 years ago it wasn't that common; now it is. You get on a plane these days and they don't have WiFi, people are up in arms.
We've had some very interesting conversations with a few other developers over the past year as we've consulted on "what would you do if you had a chance to do things differently", and it's given us a lot of insight that we're using.
Our core philosophy is and has always been "you can only show what you earned by playing the game". Whatever solution we come up with for our players will be in line with that philosophy, NOT purchased via a cash shop.
You missed my point, many gamers rotate thru multiple MMORPGs, (see @DMKano) perhaps playing each 10 to 15 hours a month.
A monthly sub is not a good value in their eyes, especially not for every MMO they play. [...]
Maybe that's just because the games lately all suck and can't hold anyone's attention. [...]
Not at all (or at least not necessarly). Can't say for Kyleran or Kano, but I personally am a hopper, always was. And in my case it the opposite of your assumption, I hop because I want to play all my 3 favourite games (were 4 until last year...) but I simply don't have the time anymore. So, I rotate. Pick one as the 'main' for the month, and play the other two just on the side. Then switch. I try to time the picks around events and favourite activities in each game, occasionally those collide, at such weeks I do some loadbalancing and play the games concurrently.
I can agree with Kyleran that monthly sub is not going well with this kind of a gameplay. That's why I try to go with monthly hops, that way it is more "beneficial" to subscribe for that month.
On the European LOTRO RP server, if your name wasn't fantasy-based or in any way broke the immersion of the server, your name was petititioned. In many cases, there were whole forum threads dedicated to listing names and screenshots of folks who had ridiculous, non-fantasy titles.
Past tense is inaccurate, the two still-standing former Eu roleplay servers (Laurelin and Belegaer) still have the name policy.
(the third, Estel, fell at the server transfers, and the US roleplay server Landy never had the name policy... of course Landy is just roleplay-encouraged, and not an official roleplay server)
Once again? Naming standards like that have never been a thing in any popular mmos that I am aware of. You guys must be from the berenstain bears universe, hate to be the one to break it to you but that never happened over here in the berenstien bears universe.
“They have a anti-semetic policy and there’s nothing else to say about it. Your feelings are no ones responsibility but your own.” Wow that statement looks pretty outlandish and nonsensical now. If See something isn’t fun I’ll call it out. If the developer chooses to engage in this forum then I’ll ask him about this policy. The post has nothing to do with feelings and I pointed out specific points. Why is it every advocate for this game is a dismissive tool? If you think I’m wrong then tell me why. Don’t say “idc about your feelings” becuase you took the time to write a response. It’s not my fault you didn’t take the time to think about it. Heaven forbid a discussion occur in a forum.
As has been confirmed by Kyleran and Sandmanjw, naming standards were indeed a thing, a rather pervasive and major thing, back in the day.
Back in the day when maintaining standards was as a thing, as the only way to succeed was to focus on the long-term building of a devoted and committed community. That is hard to do if your game is filled with elements detracting from the play environment, such as a host of players with names totally unsuited to the atmosphere you are striving for.
Nowadays games that generally apply naming standards are rare, with the exception of glaring abuses that might get them sued if they weren't attended to. Why bother maintaining standards when your revenue model is primarily based on burst and casual spending which can just as easily be derived from flyby players as invested ones, even more so if there is an initial entry cost.
In fact, maintaining standards such as a naming policy is contrary to success in the micro-transaction world of today, as it would inhibit their primary source of revenue rather than protect it as would be the case when sustained revenue was the only game in town.
This is why I was pleasantly surprised to see a modern company wishing to return to the standards of old despite most abandoning them as a speed bump to the current market focus on revenue generation over the short term rather than the long.
Subsequently learning of the subscription only intent, it became obvious as to why strict adherence to a naming policy was important to them. You can't hope to build communities akin to those of the past without maintaining the standards of the past.
If you don't see that as important, or feel that the naming policy would overly inhibit your fun, then this simply isn't the game for you, nor was it designed to be. It is intended for those that do care for such things and value them.
That's the way of things, though. Not every game will appeal to everyone, nor should they. Trying to concurrently appeal to everyone compromises your ability to appeal to anyone. Focusing on the interests and desires of a particular group of players provides a greater chance of adequately addressing and satisfying them.
No it wasn’t a thing in Everquest if it was you were on an rp server. Dogbackwards my ogre from way back when is still around. Koolaidkain the night elf hunter is still around on wow. Fourfootgiant the hobbit bard is still around. And holy shit dude you report people because they have a silly name? That somehow infringes on your fun? You also call it a kill count. What a despicable person.
Also comparing rules in a game game to the no shirt no shoes or the speed limit is ridiculous. Speed limit keeps you and other drivers safe. Right to deny service is at the discretion of the business. Goofy or identifiable names that aren’t offensive or sexual should be up to the player. Not some elitist pricks that think they know better because “muh good old days” only place where naming policy should be instated is an rp server. (which seem to be the only examples you’ve provided)
On the European LOTRO RP server, if your name wasn't fantasy-based or in any way broke the immersion of the server, your name was petititioned. In many cases, there were whole forum threads dedicated to listing names and screenshots of folks who had ridiculous, non-fantasy titles.
Past tense is inaccurate, the two still-standing former Eu roleplay servers (Laurelin and Belegaer) still have the name policy.
(the third, Estel, fell at the server transfers, and the US roleplay server Landy never had the name policy... of course Landy is just roleplay-encouraged, and not an official roleplay server)
Laurelin, that's the one I was thinking of. I spent about three years on that server, and remember the naming brigades quite fondly. Kept the atmosphere very Tolkien/fantasy.
Wasn't aware the naming policies were still being enforced. Good to know!
Once again? Naming standards like that have never been a thing in any popular mmos that I am aware of. You guys must be from the berenstain bears universe, hate to be the one to break it to you but that never happened over here in the berenstien bears universe.
“They have a anti-semetic policy and there’s nothing else to say about it. Your feelings are no ones responsibility but your own.” Wow that statement looks pretty outlandish and nonsensical now. If See something isn’t fun I’ll call it out. If the developer chooses to engage in this forum then I’ll ask him about this policy. The post has nothing to do with feelings and I pointed out specific points. Why is it every advocate for this game is a dismissive tool? If you think I’m wrong then tell me why. Don’t say “idc about your feelings” becuase you took the time to write a response. It’s not my fault you didn’t take the time to think about it. Heaven forbid a discussion occur in a forum.
As has been confirmed by Kyleran and Sandmanjw, naming standards were indeed a thing, a rather pervasive and major thing, back in the day.
Back in the day when maintaining standards was as a thing, as the only way to succeed was to focus on the long-term building of a devoted and committed community. That is hard to do if your game is filled with elements detracting from the play environment, such as a host of players with names totally unsuited to the atmosphere you are striving for.
Nowadays games that generally apply naming standards are rare, with the exception of glaring abuses that might get them sued if they weren't attended to. Why bother maintaining standards when your revenue model is primarily based on burst and casual spending which can just as easily be derived from flyby players as invested ones, even more so if there is an initial entry cost.
In fact, maintaining standards such as a naming policy is contrary to success in the micro-transaction world of today, as it would inhibit their primary source of revenue rather than protect it as would be the case when sustained revenue was the only game in town.
This is why I was pleasantly surprised to see a modern company wishing to return to the standards of old despite most abandoning them as a speed bump to the current market focus on revenue generation over the short term rather than the long.
Subsequently learning of the subscription only intent, it became obvious as to why strict adherence to a naming policy was important to them. You can't hope to build communities akin to those of the past without maintaining the standards of the past.
If you don't see that is important, or feel that the naming policy would overly inhibit your fun, then this simply isn't the game for you, nor was it designed to be. It is intended for those that do care for such things and value them.
That's the way of things, though. Not every game will appeal to everyone, nor should they. Trying to concurrently appeal to everyone compromises your ability to appeal to anyone. Focusing on the interests and desires of a particular group of players provides a greater chance of adequately addressing and satisfying them.
Again it wasn’t a thing I eq, I never played lotro but another commenter did and confirmed it was on RP servers only. Pretty much DAOC was the only one that had a universal policy on that.
Once again? Naming standards like that have never been a thing in any popular mmos that I am aware of. You guys must be from the berenstain bears universe, hate to be the one to break it to you but that never happened over here in the berenstien bears universe.
“They have a anti-semetic policy and there’s nothing else to say about it. Your feelings are no ones responsibility but your own.” Wow that statement looks pretty outlandish and nonsensical now. If See something isn’t fun I’ll call it out. If the developer chooses to engage in this forum then I’ll ask him about this policy. The post has nothing to do with feelings and I pointed out specific points. Why is it every advocate for this game is a dismissive tool? If you think I’m wrong then tell me why. Don’t say “idc about your feelings” becuase you took the time to write a response. It’s not my fault you didn’t take the time to think about it. Heaven forbid a discussion occur in a forum.
As has been confirmed by Kyleran and Sandmanjw, naming standards were indeed a thing, a rather pervasive and major thing, back in the day.
Back in the day when maintaining standards was as a thing, as the only way to succeed was to focus on the long-term building of a devoted and committed community. That is hard to do if your game is filled with elements detracting from the play environment, such as a host of players with names totally unsuited to the atmosphere you are striving for.
Nowadays games that generally apply naming standards are rare, with the exception of glaring abuses that might get them sued if they weren't attended to. Why bother maintaining standards when your revenue model is primarily based on burst and casual spending which can just as easily be derived from flyby players as invested ones, even more so if there is an initial entry cost.
In fact, maintaining standards such as a naming policy is contrary to success in the micro-transaction world of today, as it would inhibit their primary source of revenue rather than protect it as would be the case when sustained revenue was the only game in town.
This is why I was pleasantly surprised to see a modern company wishing to return to the standards of old despite most abandoning them as a speed bump to the current market focus on revenue generation over the short term rather than the long.
Subsequently learning of the subscription only intent, it became obvious as to why strict adherence to a naming policy was important to them. You can't hope to build communities akin to those of the past without maintaining the standards of the past.
If you don't see that is important, or feel that the naming policy would overly inhibit your fun, then this simply isn't the game for you, nor was it designed to be. It is intended for those that do care for such things and value them.
That's the way of things, though. Not every game will appeal to everyone, nor should they. Trying to concurrently appeal to everyone compromises your ability to appeal to anyone. Focusing on the interests and desires of a particular group of players provides a greater chance of adequately addressing and satisfying them.
Stop it, @KnightFalz. You're making me all tingly! Or maybe that's my coffee =P
On a serious note, all of the above.
We are a MMORPG. Note the RP in there. That stands for ROLEPLAYING.
Furthermore, we are based on a home-brewed D&D campaign. More ROLEPLAYING.
We're far more focused on the long-term than we are the short-term. It's about building a world that players can immerse themselves in and call home.
It was absolutely a thing on Everquest too as I myself reported several obnoxious names and they were changed.
I remember one instance very clearly it was a half elf with some 'pussy' or 'cunt' in her name in Freeport and a level one toon. We all complained and GM came and changed it.
Also comparing rules in a game game to the no shirt no shoes or the speed limit is ridiculous. Speed limit keeps you and other drivers safe. Right to deny service is at the discretion of the business.
In our case, our "speed limit" is our naming policy. It keeps our community members safe from folks who want to "drive fast and loose" with their names. It's our "no shirt, no shoes, no service" policy that makes sure our community members can enjoy their meal without dealing with elements that take them away from that enjoyment.
Also, the last part of your comment is the first time we've ever agreed on anything.
The right to deny service is at the discretion of the business.
Why is it that people who have an untenable position always make themselves out to be the victim? Is it easier for them to make their points about their untenable position and while insulting the developer and then still get the pity and commiseration.
Look the rule is clear deal with it. I mean especially because you're advocating rubbish names and trying to make it sound like that is not what you're advocating. Like you really care about the discussion. Leave this poor beleaguered developer alone for god's sake and let him get on to more important things then your reasons for names like 'koksyucker'.
Now your being deliberatly disingenuous. I have stated REPEATEDLY sexual or racist names shouldn’t be allowed. “Poor beleaguered dev” he’s presenting a product I stated my concerns with said product and tried to ask questions on it. He’s also presenting it through a news outlet with an open forum. Kinda like when apple removed headphone jack and got criticized for it. The only thing I’ve gone after the developer for is his poor PR and rude behavior.
I’ve gotten in response is “it’s the rule your opinion doesn’t matter” and people attacking my character by misrepresenting me like you have just now. I’m advocating for player choice which should always be a thing as long as it doesn’t directly inhibit your ability to play, antagonize or harass, or give them an unfair advantage. If someone finds joy in goofy names such as dirtydan papapete hydrogen why should they not be allowed?
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You can just do two sets of cosmetics. One could be earned only and consist of skill based effects, other in cash shop and deal with the color of gear.
Also, i 100% agree with naming policy. I hate it when people have silly names in MMO's. Because of your naming policy ill keep a close watch on the game . . .
You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations.
“They have a anti-semetic policy and there’s nothing else to say about it. Your feelings are no ones responsibility but your own.” Wow that statement looks pretty outlandish and nonsensical now. If See something isn’t fun I’ll call it out. If the developer chooses to engage in this forum then I’ll ask him about this policy. The post has nothing to do with feelings and I pointed out specific points. Why is it every advocate for this game is a dismissive tool? If you think I’m wrong then tell me why. Don’t say “idc about your feelings” becuase you took the time to write a response. It’s not my fault you didn’t take the time to think about it. Heaven forbid a discussion occur in a forum.
Lineage 1, DAOC, Lineage 2, WOW, Vanguard and LOTRO, it was pretty much a hobby of mine to report players with names which were outlandish, proprietary or just annoyed me and I recorded dozens of "kills" for each game.
Why did I do it? If your "fun" infringes on my "fun" I'll use every reporting tool available to take you down. I've turned in guild mates who have openly admitted to cheating, as I did for some who were radar hacking in DAOC. It is not without reason I often play a Paladin (lawful good) in MMORPGs.
I recall in vanilla WOW cringing when my 12 yr old son chose punkrockker for his character name, especially when some person actually pinged him and gave him some grief about it. (I couldn't really blame them)
I figured he would get reported and be asked to change it but never happened, but then WOW was the beginning of the end for many good things, enforcement of a proper naming policy being among the least.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I am a firm believer that having a strict policy on names will have a positive effect on the player base not to have to be grouped, or see others running around with, names nasty or just plain garbage text.
If you do not have the care or intelligence to come up with a basic game name that is fitting...why should others care to take the time to bother trying to get to know you? You obviously do not care much about the game and will most likely not be around long.
The point I'm trying to make (in a roundabout way), is that the data shows that it doesn't matter if it's via a cash shop OR via other means within the subscription (such as dye packs or faction recipes), players WANT a means to customize their appearance.
The old way of "wearing only what you found in a dungeon" doesn't work in the modern era. Even WoW allows for transmogrification of gear (did I spell that right?) with their mandatory subscription.
Our entire development team is HARD stance on "your appearance should ONLY show what you earned by questing and/or running dungeons".
However....
There are also modern audiences to consider, which is why taking a look at how games like WoW, for example, do things is a good starting point for looking at hybrid models.
The speed limit on a highway isn't up for debate or discussion; it's the rule/policy/law.
No shirt, no shoes, no service isn't up for debate or discussion; it's the rule/policy/law.
Our naming policy isn't up for debate or discussion; it's the rule/policy/law in our world.
On the European LOTRO RP server, if your name wasn't fantasy-based or in any way broke the immersion of the server, your name was petititioned. In many cases, there were whole forum threads dedicated to listing names and screenshots of folks who had ridiculous, non-fantasy titles.
Reporting names was also in Vanguard and World of Warcraft.
I could go on.
However, we *do* have a plan in place that allows for appearance customization. That being said, it won't be available to players just starting out; you'll have to put in time + effort and you'll have to FIRST earn gear the old fashioned way (by pulling it out of dungeons and doing quests) before you are allowed to then customize your appearance.
Wish I could say more, but it's still under wraps
Look the rule is clear deal with it. I mean especially because you're advocating rubbish names and trying to make it sound like that is not what you're advocating. Like you really care about the discussion. Leave this poor beleaguered developer alone for god's sake and let him get on to more important things then your reasons for names like 'koksyucker'.
^ This.
Players often wore crafted gear with the specific stats they desired to perfect their builds.
I submit it was newer MMOs which took away customization, many older games had it.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Dye packs were the first step. But in the first few years (don't remember exactly the time period), you could ONLY wear what you earned from dungeons/quests/drops OR had crafted for you (which was not customizable; it was however it turned out based on the recipe, which did not allow for customization)
If players didn't 'whale', these things wouldn't be so popular. This is a direct fault of players being greedy and buying what they want with wanton abandon.
However, the evolution of the gaming industry towards F2P titles with cash shops has given players that instant gratification "hit", and it's such a sweet, sweet feeling to be able to just pay a couple of bucks and BAM, have this badass fiery robe or skeleton horse or black cape or whatever.
When you take that away from players, they get grumpy =P
It's like WiFi on planes; we didn't use to have it. 10 years ago it wasn't that common; now it is. You get on a plane these days and they don't have WiFi, people are up in arms.
We've had some very interesting conversations with a few other developers over the past year as we've consulted on "what would you do if you had a chance to do things differently", and it's given us a lot of insight that we're using.
Our core philosophy is and has always been "you can only show what you earned by playing the game". Whatever solution we come up with for our players will be in line with that philosophy, NOT purchased via a cash shop.
So, I rotate. Pick one as the 'main' for the month, and play the other two just on the side. Then switch. I try to time the picks around events and favourite activities in each game, occasionally those collide, at such weeks I do some loadbalancing and play the games concurrently.
I can agree with Kyleran that monthly sub is not going well with this kind of a gameplay. That's why I try to go with monthly hops, that way it is more "beneficial" to subscribe for that month.
Past tense is inaccurate, the two still-standing former Eu roleplay servers (Laurelin and Belegaer) still have the name policy.
(the third, Estel, fell at the server transfers, and the US roleplay server Landy never had the name policy... of course Landy is just roleplay-encouraged, and not an official roleplay server)
Nowadays games that generally apply naming standards are rare, with the exception of glaring abuses that might get them sued if they weren't attended to. Why bother maintaining standards when your revenue model is primarily based on burst and casual spending which can just as easily be derived from flyby players as invested ones, even more so if there is an initial entry cost.
In fact, maintaining standards such as a naming policy is contrary to success in the micro-transaction world of today, as it would inhibit their primary source of revenue rather than protect it as would be the case when sustained revenue was the only game in town.
This is why I was pleasantly surprised to see a modern company wishing to return to the standards of old despite most abandoning them as a speed bump to the current market focus on revenue generation over the short term rather than the long.
Subsequently learning of the subscription only intent, it became obvious as to why strict adherence to a naming policy was important to them. You can't hope to build communities akin to those of the past without maintaining the standards of the past.
If you don't see that as important, or feel that the naming policy would overly inhibit your fun, then this simply isn't the game for you, nor was it designed to be. It is intended for those that do care for such things and value them.
That's the way of things, though. Not every game will appeal to everyone, nor should they. Trying to concurrently appeal to everyone compromises your ability to appeal to anyone. Focusing on the interests and desires of a particular group of players provides a greater chance of adequately addressing and satisfying them.
Also comparing rules in a game game to the no shirt no shoes or the speed limit is ridiculous. Speed limit keeps you and other drivers safe. Right to deny service is at the discretion of the business. Goofy or identifiable names that aren’t offensive or sexual should be up to the player. Not some elitist pricks that think they know better because “muh good old days” only place where naming policy should be instated is an rp server. (which seem to be the only examples you’ve provided)
Wasn't aware the naming policies were still being enforced. Good to know!
On a serious note, all of the above.
We are a MMORPG. Note the RP in there. That stands for ROLEPLAYING.
Furthermore, we are based on a home-brewed D&D campaign. More ROLEPLAYING.
We're far more focused on the long-term than we are the short-term. It's about building a world that players can immerse themselves in and call home.
Community first.
I remember one instance very clearly it was a half elf with some 'pussy' or 'cunt' in her name in Freeport and a level one toon. We all complained and GM came and changed it.
In our case, our "speed limit" is our naming policy. It keeps our community members safe from folks who want to "drive fast and loose" with their names. It's our "no shirt, no shoes, no service" policy that makes sure our community members can enjoy their meal without dealing with elements that take them away from that enjoyment.
Also, the last part of your comment is the first time we've ever agreed on anything.
The right to deny service is at the discretion of the business.
You couldn't be more correct.
I’ve gotten in response is “it’s the rule your opinion doesn’t matter” and people attacking my character by misrepresenting me like you have just now. I’m advocating for player choice which should always be a thing as long as it doesn’t directly inhibit your ability to play, antagonize or harass, or give them an unfair advantage. If someone finds joy in goofy names such as dirtydan papapete hydrogen why should they not be allowed?