But spending money should not be fun. That's what makes the lootbox model so insiduous even outside of the "is it illegal gambling?" question (it is illegal gambling).
While I am against loot boxes.. you really lost me when you said spending money should not be fun.
Spending money on your hobby should be one of the things that brings you joy, just like going to the movies, or out to dinner, etc.
If you are crying like you got kicked in the nuts every time you spend money on your hobby.. something is very wrong with that whole situation.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
What if you opened loot boxes with a key, and you can either get the key by finishing a quest, or you can buy it?
Still illegal gambling?
Distinctions like this becomes an issue and perhaps a total ban on any form of loot box might help unless the game is rated M. Might seem draconian but the industry will face too many loopholes or else.
The traditional argument is that it isn't P2W if you can also get it in the game without paying for it. Of course, they might make it extremely hard to get, but it is technically possible.
So I can see the game companies simply making the loot box keys available, but very hard to get. You can "pay for the convenience" of speeding it up.
Unfortunately this very idea of convenience is what is allowing them to introduce the keys for real money. No such mechanics should exist except in games for adults.
I think it is about time we make some tough decisions to stop companies using this loophole to exploit our children.
Adults can go spend their money on whatever they want, any game marketed to teens should not have any real money method of opening loot boxes. Those can only be opened through solely in game methods.
Also they should introduce a means to tax any revenue made off these loot boxes marketed to adults.
But spending money should not be fun. That's what makes the lootbox model so insiduous even outside of the "is it illegal gambling?" question (it is illegal gambling).
While I am against loot boxes.. you really lost me when you said spending money should not be fun.
Spending money on your hobby should be one of the things that brings you joy, just like going to the movies, or out to dinner, etc.
If you are crying like you got kicked in the nuts every time you spend money on your hobby.. something is very wrong with that whole situation.
I think you misunderstand. The act of spending money on a game is not fun in and of itself; the playing of the game is fun, and it remains fun whether you got the game for free, discounted, or full price. It's reasonable enough to derive satisfaction from supporting a studio you like, and that feeling might override the desire to wait for a lower price (I'm in fact preordering Trails of Cold Steel 4 despite not being anywhere near done with 3 for that very reason), but there is a distinction.
Microtransactions are a form of instant gratification, and lootboxes/gacha gamify that instant gratification. When you are purchasing a lootbox, you're really purchasing the rush of endorphins that come with a randomized reward, whether you realize it or not.
“Loot boxes are considered part of the compulsion loop of game design to keep players invested in a game. Such compulsion loops are known to contribute towards videogame addiction and are frequently compared to gambling addiction."
Is this exactly the design founders of facebook and other social media say they used to addict their audience with various designs and features? I wouldn't mind these laws restricting what adults can spend their time and money on if they were consistent. This isn't okay but this other thing that is pretty much the same is okay. Like alcohol and marijuana; I'm glad the laws in the US are changing and allow adults to be adults. I'm very ashamed so many in this thread feel so smug that their authoritarian desires are going to be imposed on others.
For me, any situation where I pay money and have no way to know what I'm receiving, that's a gambling transaction. Games are entertainment, but paying for a roll on the RNG table is a big 'no'. It doesn't matter if that same roll can be earned in game, the money for a chance thing is the basis of gambling.
Now, if the transaction is reversed, a fixed result for an indeterminate amount of money, companies would have never implemented it.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
“Loot boxes are considered part of the compulsion loop of game design to keep players invested in a game. Such compulsion loops are known to contribute towards videogame addiction and are frequently compared to gambling addiction."
Is this exactly the design founders of facebook and other social media say they used to addict their audience with various designs and features? I wouldn't mind these laws restricting what adults can spend their time and money on if they were consistent. This isn't okay but this other thing that is pretty much the same is okay. Like alcohol and marijuana; I'm glad the laws in the US are changing and allow adults to be adults. I'm very ashamed so many in this thread feel so smug that their authoritarian desires are going to be imposed on others.
The risk versus reward mechanic can produce organic chemicals in your brain. That's based on scientific fact. But that mechanic was wide spread in real life and games well before loot boxes. Aeader's claim that publishers are drug dealers selling you loot boxes to get high is kind of out there.
“Loot boxes are considered part of the compulsion loop of game design to keep players invested in a game. Such compulsion loops are known to contribute towards videogame addiction and are frequently compared to gambling addiction."
Is this exactly the design founders of facebook and other social media say they used to addict their audience with various designs and features? I wouldn't mind these laws restricting what adults can spend their time and money on if they were consistent. This isn't okay but this other thing that is pretty much the same is okay. Like alcohol and marijuana; I'm glad the laws in the US are changing and allow adults to be adults. I'm very ashamed so many in this thread feel so smug that their authoritarian desires are going to be imposed on others.
The risk versus reward mechanic can produce organic chemicals in your brain. That's based on scientific fact. But that mechanic was wide spread in real life and games well before loot boxes. Aeader's claim that publishers are drug dealers selling you loot boxes to get high is kind of out there.
Don't put words in my mouth.
Drug dealers have more integrity than EA and Activision. You purchase from them, and you know what you're getting.
But spending money should not be fun. That's what makes the lootbox model so insiduous even outside of the "is it illegal gambling?" question (it is illegal gambling).
While I am against loot boxes.. you really lost me when you said spending money should not be fun.
Spending money on your hobby should be one of the things that brings you joy, just like going to the movies, or out to dinner, etc.
If you are crying like you got kicked in the nuts every time you spend money on your hobby.. something is very wrong with that whole situation.
I think you misunderstand. The act of spending money on a game is not fun in and of itself; the playing of the game is fun, and it remains fun whether you got the game for free, discounted, or full price. It's reasonable enough to derive satisfaction from supporting a studio you like, and that feeling might override the desire to wait for a lower price (I'm in fact preordering Trails of Cold Steel 4 despite not being anywhere near done with 3 for that very reason), but there is a distinction.
Microtransactions are a form of instant gratification, and lootboxes/gacha gamify that instant gratification. When you are purchasing a lootbox, you're really purchasing the rush of endorphins that come with a randomized reward, whether you realize it or not.
I realize that fully.
But There should always be that sense of joy in that purchase to get something you want for a hobby you play for fun.
For example, when I bought a Dreadnaught for my WH40K Chaos legions, I knew what was in the box, there was zero RNG involved, I knew EXACTLY what was in that box, but I was happy to buy it, I would even go so far as to say I was excited to add that unit to expand my army, and thus there was a sense of joy in that purchase.
No different than when I bought a set of fancy solid metal dice, for playing D&D at the table top. There was a sense of joy in that purchase. To have something fun to add to my game.
There should equally be similar amount of joy if I bought a specific cosmetic skin, or adventure pack, or whatever the hell from the Cash Shop in an MMO I am playing.
I sincerely think that if a MMO needs to play an RNG gambling racket, to drum up sales, and prey upon people's addictions or worse, selling direct power for P2W to prey upon peoples inadequacy, they are not doing a good job of enacting that joy in buying something for their game and hobby that other games do.
I sincerely think also, that if you do not find joy in buying things from the game you play to enhance the experience, that is the hallmark moment, that would be the apex signature mark, by which it is time to stop playing that game, because if you find no joy in adding to your game experience, then the game itself is not a joy to you.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Why are they specifically targeting EA? There are hundreds of other PC & mobile games with the exact same type of monetization systems. Did EA not pay off the right people or something?
For the same reason that lawsuits target McDonalds and not Winerschnitzel (outside ease of spelling and saying the name of course), is because high profile cases attract public eye and support, and gain attention for the cause.
Show me a real example of that happening.
Unless Canada turned into a communist country recently you can't target a single entity over the same thing hundreds of others do. It has to be specific otherwise it's just a show lawsuit that a 1st year law student for EA can win.
CA - You have gambling in your games.
EA 1st year law student - Here are examples of hundreds of other games with the exact same monetization systems that make 10x the amount we do.
The end.
False. The court can find that something is against law no matter how many people do it.
A lot of laws about consumer protection, advertising, and business practices actually evolve that way. Business constantly evolves and does new and different things, and occasionally some of those are taken into court so far that it becomes a precedent for whether something is allowed or forbidden. Often rest of the business world then follows that precedent out of their own initiative if it's something that's not too expensive to change.
This specific case a person at all times is fully aware of their own actions and the 'rules' are laid out for them to see. It is no different than the surprise Funko surprise boxes. If anything online games make their customers more aware cause they post the win % and I don't see any win % on Funko boxes. The person charges their credit card the same way they charge their card to buy those surprise boxes. How about Magic & Yu-Gi-Oh cards at stores? They all have to be sued too for decades of doing exactly what EA has been doing just since 2015(GoH). What's that old saying? "Don't like it, don't buy it". No one is forcing anyone to buy anything and like I said before the customer is fully aware of what they are doing at all times.
I admit that I myself am a heavy Gacha / Gambling addict, Lootbox make me overspend in games especially if they don't disclose % chance.
I've also heard kids in Mobile Games on voice crying for not getting certain outfits in games, it's a real problem and something needs to be done.
I've put at much as $400 for a costume before and never got it because the company changed the odds and didn't disclose them even though they are required to since it was a cross platform app.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
This specific case a person at all times is fully aware of their own actions and the 'rules' are laid out for them to see. It is no different than the surprise Funko surprise boxes. If anything online games make their customers more aware cause they post the win % and I don't see any win % on Funko boxes. The person charges their credit card the same way they charge their card to buy those surprise boxes. How about Magic & Yu-Gi-Oh cards at stores? They all have to be sued too for decades of doing exactly what EA has been doing just since 2015(GoH). What's that old saying? "Don't like it, don't buy it". No one is forcing anyone to buy anything and like I said before the customer is fully aware of what they are doing at all times.
I admit that I myself am a heavy Gacha / Gambling addict, Lootbox make me overspend in games especially if they don't disclose % chance.
I've also heard kids in Mobile Games on voice crying for not getting certain outfits in games, it's a real problem and something needs to be done.
I've put at much as $400 for a costume before and never got it because the company changed the odds and didn't disclose them even though they are required to since it was a cross platform app.
There's 12 step programs which can help you with your addictions, but doesn't mean everyone needs to be blocked from accessing such.
This is true, but keep in mind casinos, and other organizations that deal with gambling are required by law to make it clear that this is a gamble, that what that are engaging in, is in no uncertain terms, gambling.
I think a huge part of the problem with loot boxes is that they try to play off that they are NOT gambling, and that is misleading to the client.
Which is a HUGE point of contention with this.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
When you are purchasing a lootbox, you're really purchasing the rush of endorphins that come with a randomized reward, whether you realize it or not.
Your saying that they are selling you a item that produces a chemical reaction in your brain. So you think they are Dope dealers because Dopamine levels tend to increase when playing games.
dope
(dōp),
1. Any drug, either stimulating or depressing, administered for its temporary effect, or taken habitually or addictively.
What it comes down to is game companies are looking at casino's and wanting to cash in on the big bucks but in their games.
If a game wants to go that route sure...fine but they should be held to the same standards and regulations as every other online casino or gambling website.
However they wish to avoid this for obvious reasons of wanting to double dip in what should really be two total different audiences.
Ideally however they should just get rid of bloody lootboxes where peeps spend tons of cash to get that one +5 sword of bullpoop explosion or skill.
Either straight up sell this junk in the shop and be properly labeled p2w or let people earn it the old fashioned way ... in game via bosses and mob drops.
It's the wild wild west right now when it comes to online gaming and the companies are taking advantage to the max but sooner or later this is going to come to an end just like public lynching and hangings in www did.
“Loot boxes are considered part of the compulsion loop of game design to keep players invested in a game. Such compulsion loops are known to contribute towards videogame addiction and are frequently compared to gambling addiction."
Is this exactly the design founders of facebook and other social media say they used to addict their audience with various designs and features? I wouldn't mind these laws restricting what adults can spend their time and money on if they were consistent. This isn't okay but this other thing that is pretty much the same is okay. Like alcohol and marijuana; I'm glad the laws in the US are changing and allow adults to be adults. I'm very ashamed so many in this thread feel so smug that their authoritarian desires are going to be imposed on others.
The only one's being smug here are the people pretending this is okay and should be treated any different than going to a casino.
Just like alcohol and maijuana it should follow the appropriate laws and regulations even if MJ is sometimes called pot it's still the same thing.....same poop different names so should follow the same laws etc.
Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
But really the biggest issue with this filed claim that Canadians should really be worried about. The lawyers claim that lootboxes are just a extension of the randomized loot system in all video games. So by extension the case could be made if they win that all video games have illegal gambling in them.
And while that may sound extreme you can see what china does under the pretense of child welfare when it comes to video games. If you don't like lootboxs in games that and want them gone thats fine. But don't use false pretense to do so like many are trying to do.
But really the biggest issue with this filed claim that Canadians should really be worried about. The lawyers claim that lootboxes are just a extension of the randomized loot system in all video games. So by extension the case could be made if they win that all video games have illegal gambling in them.
And while that may sound extreme you can see what china does under the pretense of child welfare when it comes to video games. If you don't like lootboxs in games that and want them gone thats fine. But don't use false pretense to do so like many are trying to do.
Ridiculous.
This is how the courts determine the limits of such things so we exactly do not turn into a CCP communist type country.
There's no false pretenses here just outdated laws catching up to a quickly evolving technology and changes in society due to those new technologies.
Saying we can't have laws to protect XYZ or we will become some communist dictatorship is just as silly as saying...... that letting adults make choices for themselves, like on whether to go to gamble all their weeks pay in a casino, will lead to a libertarian anarchic state where anything goes.
Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
But really the biggest issue with this filed claim that Canadians should really be worried about. The lawyers claim that lootboxes are just a extension of the randomized loot system in all video games. So by extension the case could be made if they win that all video games have illegal gambling in them.
And while that may sound extreme you can see what china does under the pretense of child welfare when it comes to video games. If you don't like lootboxs in games that and want them gone thats fine. But don't use false pretense to do so like many are trying to do.
The main issue here with this case, is the involvement of real money.
They make it clear that this case ONLY pertains to loot boxes where the player buys the key or the box (or both) with real money or with game tokens bought with real money, and then take a gamble on what you get.
Any other form of RNG that does not directly or indirectly involve real money is not part of this issue. So any condition where a player gets a Loot Chest after completing an in game activity, regardless of the RNG involved, it is not classified as gambling, because no real money is involved.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
When you are purchasing a lootbox, you're really purchasing the rush of endorphins that come with a randomized reward, whether you realize it or not.
Your saying that they are selling you a item that produces a chemical reaction in your brain. So you think they are Dope dealers because Dopamine levels tend to increase when playing games.
dope
(dōp),
1. Any drug, either stimulating or depressing, administered for its temporary effect, or taken habitually or addictively.
The reason why what you're saying is fucking dumb is that the video games and the lootboxes are not being inserted into your body to cause said effect. The dopamine is already there, and it can be activated by any number of non-drug activities.
When they start physically shoving a copy of FIFA up your ass to achieve that result, then you can call them drug dealers.
What if you opened loot boxes with a key, and you can either get the key by finishing a quest, or you can buy it?
Still illegal gambling?
I would still class this as gambling. If it is a key to purchase a specific item or group of items then its not gambling.
As I side note, I really dislike this kind of gambling mechanic even when its just using in game currencies. Like the way ESO requires you to spend alliance points to buy a "loot box" with a random piece of gear in it really ticks me off.
As I side note, I really dislike this kind of gambling mechanic even when its just using in game currencies. Like the way ESO requires you to spend alliance points to buy a "loot box" with a random piece of gear in it really ticks me off.
100% agree. They've also extended that in game currency to buy an RNG box to seasonal events with their event ticket rewards.
It's a perversion of the original reason for giving you some type of currency instead of an RNG drop for the completion of difficult or rare content.
It originally started as a better way to get gear that wasn't subject to RNG. I first saw it in the DAoC Darkfall open world dungeon where you earned tickets that you could then use at the dungeon merchants to buy the specific gear you were after. Later on WOW did it with both raid and PvP tokens used the same way.
ESO's method of using PvP Alliance Point currency or PvE event tickets to buy RNG boxes is nonsensical and utter shit.
"Social media gives legions of idiots the right to speak when they once only spoke at a bar after a glass of wine, without harming the community ... but now they have the same right to speak as a Nobel Prize winner. It's the invasion of the idiots”
― Umberto Eco
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?” ― CD PROJEKT RED
But really the biggest issue with this filed claim that Canadians should really be worried about. The lawyers claim that lootboxes are just a extension of the randomized loot system in all video games. So by extension the case could be made if they win that all video games have illegal gambling in them.
And while that may sound extreme you can see what china does under the pretense of child welfare when it comes to video games. If you don't like lootboxs in games that and want them gone thats fine. But don't use false pretense to do so like many are trying to do.
The main issue here with this case, is the involvement of real money.
They make it clear that this case ONLY pertains to loot boxes where the player buys the key or the box (or both) with real money or with game tokens bought with real money, and then take a gamble on what you get.
Any other form of RNG that does not directly or indirectly involve real money is not part of this issue. So any condition where a player gets a Loot Chest after completing an in game activity, regardless of the RNG involved, it is not classified as gambling, because no real money is involved.
But the use of real money always takes place. Even if it's some thing as simple as a micro transaction that gives you a drop rate buff. Kitarad for example in this thread even said all loot chest even those in game should be banned as well as convenience items.
As for the case only pertaining to lootboxes I don't think that is true. Part of their opening argument is that publishers design games to keep you playing them. They go on to list the full history of video games pointing out things like game expansions and subs. They say that the random loot system has been around from the very start and lootboxes are just a extension of it. So while yes they are trying to use the gambling loophole it does not sound like that is the only thing this case is really about.
When you are purchasing a lootbox, you're really purchasing the rush of endorphins that come with a randomized reward, whether you realize it or not.
Your saying that they are selling you a item that produces a chemical reaction in your brain. So you think they are Dope dealers because Dopamine levels tend to increase when playing games.
dope
(dōp),
1. Any drug, either stimulating or depressing, administered for its temporary effect, or taken habitually or addictively.
The reason why what you're saying is fucking dumb is that the video games and the lootboxes are not being inserted into your body to cause said effect. The dopamine is already there, and it can be activated by any number of non-drug activities.
When they start physically shoving a copy of FIFA up your ass to achieve that result, then you can call them drug dealers.
Eh your the one saying publishers are selling items to intentionally alter your mind and body. If only people really had to PHYICALLY consume content from publishers.
But really the biggest issue with this filed claim that Canadians should really be worried about. The lawyers claim that lootboxes are just a extension of the randomized loot system in all video games. So by extension the case could be made if they win that all video games have illegal gambling in them.
And while that may sound extreme you can see what china does under the pretense of child welfare when it comes to video games. If you don't like lootboxs in games that and want them gone thats fine. But don't use false pretense to do so like many are trying to do.
The main issue here with this case, is the involvement of real money.
They make it clear that this case ONLY pertains to loot boxes where the player buys the key or the box (or both) with real money or with game tokens bought with real money, and then take a gamble on what you get.
Any other form of RNG that does not directly or indirectly involve real money is not part of this issue. So any condition where a player gets a Loot Chest after completing an in game activity, regardless of the RNG involved, it is not classified as gambling, because no real money is involved.
But the use of real money always takes place. Even if it's some thing as simple as a micro transaction that gives you a drop rate buff. Kitarad for example in this thread even said all loot chest even those in game should be banned as well as convenience items.
As for the case only pertaining to lootboxes I don't think that is true. Part of their opening argument is that publishers design games to keep you playing them. They go on to list the full history of video games pointing out things like game expansions and subs. They say that the random loot system has been around from the very start and lootboxes are just a extension of it. So while yes they are trying to use the gambling loophole it does not sound like that is the only thing this case is really about.
What some other poster wants or does not want, has no relevance to the case being put forth.
As for MMO's being addicting, that was settled in the late 90's when AOL lost a court case, with their pay by the minute plan, because it was deemed that the online games were addictive and designed to keep users logged in, and thus AOL was forced to offer an unlimited plan, so as not to gouge their clients or take advantage of them.
The relevance of that to loot boxes, I am not sure.
But as far as this case goes, it focuses on paying for RNG stuff. Personally, I would rather MMO's be upfront with their sales and transactions and not need to depend on gambling mechanics.
Can you imagine if any other company did, like you go to buy a car, and they say "Well put 20,000 in the pot, and roll the bones to see what you get, you might get a marazati, you might get a bicycle.. who knows!"
I always feel that if your product is good, you should be able to just sell it.
But my feelings also do not matter, what matters is the scope of the case, and AFAIK, it's just about the paid loot boxes or RNG mechanics.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Comments
Spending money on your hobby should be one of the things that brings you joy, just like going to the movies, or out to dinner, etc.
If you are crying like you got kicked in the nuts every time you spend money on your hobby.. something is very wrong with that whole situation.
I think it is about time we make some tough decisions to stop companies using this loophole to exploit our children.
Adults can go spend their money on whatever they want, any game marketed to teens should not have any real money method of opening loot boxes. Those can only be opened through solely in game methods.
Also they should introduce a means to tax any revenue made off these loot boxes marketed to adults.
Microtransactions are a form of instant gratification, and lootboxes/gacha gamify that instant gratification. When you are purchasing a lootbox, you're really purchasing the rush of endorphins that come with a randomized reward, whether you realize it or not.
Is this exactly the design founders of facebook and other social media say they used to addict their audience with various designs and features? I wouldn't mind these laws restricting what adults can spend their time and money on if they were consistent. This isn't okay but this other thing that is pretty much the same is okay. Like alcohol and marijuana; I'm glad the laws in the US are changing and allow adults to be adults. I'm very ashamed so many in this thread feel so smug that their authoritarian desires are going to be imposed on others.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
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Drug dealers have more integrity than EA and Activision. You purchase from them, and you know what you're getting.
But There should always be that sense of joy in that purchase to get something you want for a hobby you play for fun.
For example, when I bought a Dreadnaught for my WH40K Chaos legions, I knew what was in the box, there was zero RNG involved, I knew EXACTLY what was in that box, but I was happy to buy it, I would even go so far as to say I was excited to add that unit to expand my army, and thus there was a sense of joy in that purchase.
No different than when I bought a set of fancy solid metal dice, for playing D&D at the table top. There was a sense of joy in that purchase. To have something fun to add to my game.
There should equally be similar amount of joy if I bought a specific cosmetic skin, or adventure pack, or whatever the hell from the Cash Shop in an MMO I am playing.
I sincerely think that if a MMO needs to play an RNG gambling racket, to drum up sales, and prey upon people's addictions or worse, selling direct power for P2W to prey upon peoples inadequacy, they are not doing a good job of enacting that joy in buying something for their game and hobby that other games do.
I sincerely think also, that if you do not find joy in buying things from the game you play to enhance the experience, that is the hallmark moment, that would be the apex signature mark, by which it is time to stop playing that game, because if you find no joy in adding to your game experience, then the game itself is not a joy to you.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
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Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
I think a huge part of the problem with loot boxes is that they try to play off that they are NOT gambling, and that is misleading to the client.
Which is a HUGE point of contention with this.
When you are purchasing a lootbox, you're really purchasing the rush of endorphins that come with a randomized reward, whether you realize it or not.
Your saying that they are selling you a item that produces a chemical reaction in your brain. So you think they are Dope dealers because Dopamine levels tend to increase when playing games.
dope
(dōp),Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
And while that may sound extreme you can see what china does under the pretense of child welfare when it comes to video games. If you don't like lootboxs in games that and want them gone thats fine. But don't use false pretense to do so like many are trying to do.
Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
They make it clear that this case ONLY pertains to loot boxes where the player buys the key or the box (or both) with real money or with game tokens bought with real money, and then take a gamble on what you get.
Any other form of RNG that does not directly or indirectly involve real money is not part of this issue. So any condition where a player gets a Loot Chest after completing an in game activity, regardless of the RNG involved, it is not classified as gambling, because no real money is involved.
When they start physically shoving a copy of FIFA up your ass to achieve that result, then you can call them drug dealers.
I would still class this as gambling. If it is a key to purchase a specific item or group of items then its not gambling.
As I side note, I really dislike this kind of gambling mechanic even when its just using in game currencies. Like the way ESO requires you to spend alliance points to buy a "loot box" with a random piece of gear in it really ticks me off.
It's a perversion of the original reason for giving you some type of currency instead of an RNG drop for the completion of difficult or rare content.
It originally started as a better way to get gear that wasn't subject to RNG. I first saw it in the DAoC Darkfall open world dungeon where you earned tickets that you could then use at the dungeon merchants to buy the specific gear you were after. Later on WOW did it with both raid and PvP tokens used the same way.
ESO's method of using PvP Alliance Point currency or PvE event tickets to buy RNG boxes is nonsensical and utter shit.
“Microtransactions? In a single player role-playing game? Are you nuts?”
― CD PROJEKT RED
As for the case only pertaining to lootboxes I don't think that is true. Part of their opening argument is that publishers design games to keep you playing them. They go on to list the full history of video games pointing out things like game expansions and subs. They say that the random loot system has been around from the very start and lootboxes are just a extension of it. So while yes they are trying to use the gambling loophole it does not sound like that is the only thing this case is really about.
As for MMO's being addicting, that was settled in the late 90's when AOL lost a court case, with their pay by the minute plan, because it was deemed that the online games were addictive and designed to keep users logged in, and thus AOL was forced to offer an unlimited plan, so as not to gouge their clients or take advantage of them.
The relevance of that to loot boxes, I am not sure.
But as far as this case goes, it focuses on paying for RNG stuff. Personally, I would rather MMO's be upfront with their sales and transactions and not need to depend on gambling mechanics.
Can you imagine if any other company did, like you go to buy a car, and they say "Well put 20,000 in the pot, and roll the bones to see what you get, you might get a marazati, you might get a bicycle.. who knows!"
I always feel that if your product is good, you should be able to just sell it.
But my feelings also do not matter, what matters is the scope of the case, and AFAIK, it's just about the paid loot boxes or RNG mechanics.
Nobody with more than half a brain actually believed that was anything other than sarcasm.