And since the difference is purely cosmetic, there is no reason not to treat male and female avatars in a game, the same.
Well, other than realism because the difference in genders is not simply cosmetic, but nobody wants that truth to be acknowledged.
Or is it more nobody could deliver that in a game without being crucified because many prefer to pretend these differences don't exist.
It's not all that horrible a pretense with gaming largely being escapist entertainment, especially in the case of MMORPGs, but it undermines any attempt at simulation of low magic and low technology settings which is my main annoyance with it.
Realism... LOL. Chainmail bikinis' and Boobplate is anything BUT realistic.
In fact there is nothing.. nothing at all realistic about Sexualized Body Armor. End of Discussion.
Don't these tiny armors give females a "distraction bonus" of some kind?
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse. - FARGIN_WAR
And since the difference is purely cosmetic, there is no reason not to treat male and female avatars in a game, the same.
Well, other than realism because the difference in genders is not simply cosmetic, but nobody wants that truth to be acknowledged.
Or is it more nobody could deliver that in a game without being crucified because many prefer to pretend these differences don't exist.
It's not all that horrible a pretense with gaming largely being escapist entertainment, especially in the case of MMORPGs, but it undermines any attempt at simulation of low magic and low technology settings which is my main annoyance with it.
Realism... LOL. Chainmail bikinis' and Boobplate is anything BUT realistic.
In fact there is nothing.. nothing at all realistic about Sexualized Body Armor. End of Discussion.
You're not the only one capable of shifting gears in the middle of a conversation. This was my redirect into a broader context.
Aesthetics isn't the only difference between genders. Their is a general disparity in strength that should be quite relevant in low magic, low technology settings that is routinely ignored. There is also a general disparity in size that could also be quite relevant, which is again routinely ignored.
As a result any attempt at producing a realistic simulation of such is undermined from the beginning by fundamentally being contrary to reality. I find this annoying and would much rather have the setting either adapt to recognize those realities or provide a plausible reason as to why it deviates from them.
In the typical high fantasy setting it doesn't much matter as the realistic is cast aside with abandon from the get go through the abundance of magic and the fantastic. In such worlds the chain mail bikini and boob plate armour need not make any more sense than any of the other nonsensical things that surround them.
Ahh yes. REALISM!
Shall you also want to play Perma Death, and watch your character shit and piss themselves before dying?
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
This thread has given me an idea for the next abusive cash shop practise for 2020, maybe a MMO or two can squeeze it in before the end of the year...as it were.
You have a gambling loot box system which gives you a "peek-a-boo" outfit, not the actual outfit but the ability to see less of the outfit on women's avatars. Did I say this was just for women's avatar's? I guess that just sort of slipped out.
We can call this surprise mechanic P2P (Pay-to-Perv) and I think the games gals would really be surprised when they find out, surprisingly furious in fact.
Joking aside, there is somebody working for a MMO somewhere right now who is trying to see how much more they can wring out of us with the latest abusive cash shop practice in time for Xmas, happy holidays everyone.
I hate to say it.. and.. I REALLY hate to say this.. but.. if they put something like this in for NPCs/Mobs, so that you could see the Boobs on harpies, or so that Dryads and Mermaids were naked, the painting on churches were nude, even things like Centaurs and such running around topless..
It would sell.
It will sell by the bucket on.
Like just some kind of "Adult" filter, so that all the hinted at nudity was no longer censored.
Now before you harp on this, keep in mind in China they are not allowed to show anything dead, this means, no skulls, no bones, no Skelton's, no Zombies, so making this twin skin graphic, is not something new, it is already being done, so making one PG and one R rated graphic setup would not that hard.
And no doubt... a LOT of people would buy it.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
And since the difference is purely cosmetic, there is no reason not to treat male and female avatars in a game, the same.
Well, other than realism because the difference in genders is not simply cosmetic, but nobody wants that truth to be acknowledged.
Or is it more nobody could deliver that in a game without being crucified because many prefer to pretend these differences don't exist.
It's not all that horrible a pretense with gaming largely being escapist entertainment, especially in the case of MMORPGs, but it undermines any attempt at simulation of low magic and low technology settings which is my main annoyance with it.
Realism... LOL. Chainmail bikinis' and Boobplate is anything BUT realistic.
In fact there is nothing.. nothing at all realistic about Sexualized Body Armor. End of Discussion.
You're not the only one capable of shifting gears in the middle of a conversation. This was my redirect into a broader context.
Aesthetics isn't the only difference between genders. Their is a general disparity in strength that should be quite relevant in low magic, low technology settings that is routinely ignored. There is also a general disparity in size that could also be quite relevant, which is again routinely ignored.
As a result any attempt at producing a realistic simulation of such is undermined from the beginning by fundamentally being contrary to reality. I find this annoying and would much rather have the setting either adapt to recognize those realities or provide a plausible reason as to why it deviates from them.
In the typical high fantasy setting it doesn't much matter as the realistic is cast aside with abandon from the get go through the abundance of magic and the fantastic. In such worlds the chain mail bikini and boob plate armour need not make any more sense than any of the other nonsensical things that surround them.
Ahh yes. REALISM!
Shall you also want to play Perma Death, and watch your character shit and piss themselves before dying?
As for permadeath, that would depend on what it comes along with. If there were features of interest substantially different from the norm the overall package could be worth it. As for bodily function mechanics, I'll leave such to your speculation.
Perhaps you could make a thoughtful response to what I said rather than dragging your part of this exchange into the sewer. If you truly can't do better than there is little point in discussion.
I hate to say it.. and.. I REALLY hate to say this.. but.. if they put something like this in for NPCs/Mobs, so that you could see the Boobs on harpies, or so that Dryads and Mermaids were naked, the painting on churches were nude, even things like Centaurs and such running around topless..
It would sell.
It will sell by the bucket on.
Like just some kind of "Adult" filter, so that all the hinted at nudity was no longer censored.
Now before you harp on this, keep in mind in China they are not allowed to show anything dead, this means, no skulls, no bones, no Skelton's, no Zombies, so making this twin skin graphic, is not something new, it is already being done, so making one PG and one R rated graphic setup would not that hard.
And no doubt... a LOT of people would buy it.
It would sell, and there is no reason why it shouldn't. Such is abundant in classical art and we somehow managed to survive to the present regardless. This would effectively be no different. That such a big deal is made of this is absurd.
Realism... LOL. Chainmail bikinis' and Boobplate is anything BUT realistic.
In fact there is nothing.. nothing at all realistic about Sexualized Body Armor. End of Discussion.
You're not the only one capable of shifting gears in the middle of a conversation. This was my redirect into a broader context.
Aesthetics isn't the only difference between genders. Their is a general disparity in strength that should be quite relevant in low magic, low technology settings that is routinely ignored. There is also a general disparity in size that could also be quite relevant, which is again routinely ignored.
As a result any attempt at producing a realistic simulation of such is undermined from the beginning by fundamentally being contrary to reality. I find this annoying and would much rather have the setting either adapt to recognize those realities or provide a plausible reason as to why it deviates from them.
In the typical high fantasy setting it doesn't much matter as the realistic is cast aside with abandon from the get go through the abundance of magic and the fantastic. In such worlds the chain mail bikini and boob plate armour need not make any more sense than any of the other nonsensical things that surround them.
Ahh yes. REALISM!
Shall you also want to play Perma Death, and watch your character shit and piss themselves before dying?
As for permadeath, that would depend on what it comes along with. If there were features of interest substantially different from the norm the overall package could be worth it. As for bodily function mechanics, I'll leave such to your speculation.
Realism.. that's all it comes with and the only reason why it is there.. Realism. Might also add that you only get 1 life per account, just like real life.
Which is why I think "realism" is a lame argument.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Realism... LOL. Chainmail bikinis' and Boobplate is anything BUT realistic.
In fact there is nothing.. nothing at all realistic about Sexualized Body Armor. End of Discussion.
You're not the only one capable of shifting gears in the middle of a conversation. This was my redirect into a broader context.
Aesthetics isn't the only difference between genders. Their is a general disparity in strength that should be quite relevant in low magic, low technology settings that is routinely ignored. There is also a general disparity in size that could also be quite relevant, which is again routinely ignored.
As a result any attempt at producing a realistic simulation of such is undermined from the beginning by fundamentally being contrary to reality. I find this annoying and would much rather have the setting either adapt to recognize those realities or provide a plausible reason as to why it deviates from them.
In the typical high fantasy setting it doesn't much matter as the realistic is cast aside with abandon from the get go through the abundance of magic and the fantastic. In such worlds the chain mail bikini and boob plate armour need not make any more sense than any of the other nonsensical things that surround them.
Ahh yes. REALISM!
Shall you also want to play Perma Death, and watch your character shit and piss themselves before dying?
As for permadeath, that would depend on what it comes along with. If there were features of interest substantially different from the norm the overall package could be worth it. As for bodily function mechanics, I'll leave such to your speculation.
Realism.. that's all it comes with and the only reason why it is there.. Realism. Might also add that you only get 1 life per account, just like real life.
Which is why I think "realism" is a lame argument.
That depends rather much on the type of game a person wants to play.
If I'm playing a game supposedly largely based on realism then I'd like it to actually reflect it to a reasonable degree, or provide reasonable justification for whatever deviations are present.
If I'm playing a high fantasy MMORPG that violates reality routinely in all manner of ways then I'm not going to care if yet another aspect, such as the viability of worn armour as depicted, is also unrealistic. It's just another part of the absurdity tapestry I'm surrounded by.
Realism is a lame argument, for that not intended to be realistic.
Realism... LOL. Chainmail bikinis' and Boobplate is anything BUT realistic.
In fact there is nothing.. nothing at all realistic about Sexualized Body Armor. End of Discussion.
You're not the only one capable of shifting gears in the middle of a conversation. This was my redirect into a broader context.
Aesthetics isn't the only difference between genders. Their is a general disparity in strength that should be quite relevant in low magic, low technology settings that is routinely ignored. There is also a general disparity in size that could also be quite relevant, which is again routinely ignored.
As a result any attempt at producing a realistic simulation of such is undermined from the beginning by fundamentally being contrary to reality. I find this annoying and would much rather have the setting either adapt to recognize those realities or provide a plausible reason as to why it deviates from them.
In the typical high fantasy setting it doesn't much matter as the realistic is cast aside with abandon from the get go through the abundance of magic and the fantastic. In such worlds the chain mail bikini and boob plate armour need not make any more sense than any of the other nonsensical things that surround them.
Ahh yes. REALISM!
Shall you also want to play Perma Death, and watch your character shit and piss themselves before dying?
As for permadeath, that would depend on what it comes along with. If there were features of interest substantially different from the norm the overall package could be worth it. As for bodily function mechanics, I'll leave such to your speculation.
Realism.. that's all it comes with and the only reason why it is there.. Realism. Might also add that you only get 1 life per account, just like real life.
Which is why I think "realism" is a lame argument.
I think that the way Mario(or Crash or Spyro) handles the # of lives is the perfect one. Depending on difficulty and desired atmosphere etc that can be manipulated. So, in a Hardcore Mode, you might get only one life. Or one life / milestone(difficulty cleared in aRPGs, every x levels etc).
If I'm playing a high fantasy MMORPG that violates reality routinely in all manner of ways then I'm not going to care if yet another aspect, such as the viability of worn armour as depicted, is also unrealistic. It's just another part of the absurdity tapestry I'm surrounded by.
Realism is a lame argument, for that not intended to be realistic.
and yet.. this whole discussion has been about high fantasy armors that sexualize females..
Thank you for finally expressing how asinine it is to use the stand of realism in such a game environment. Why it took this many posts and you were not already at this pint from the onset, I guess is one of those magical things about MMO players, where they need to argue for the sake of it, even when they know they are deadass wrong by their own standards.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
I hate to say it.. and.. I REALLY hate to say this.. but.. if they put something like this in for NPCs/Mobs, so that you could see the Boobs on harpies, or so that Dryads and Mermaids were naked, the painting on churches were nude, even things like Centaurs and such running around topless..
It would sell.
It will sell by the bucket on.
Like just some kind of "Adult" filter, so that all the hinted at nudity was no longer censored.
Now before you harp on this, keep in mind in China they are not allowed to show anything dead, this means, no skulls, no bones, no Skelton's, no Zombies, so making this twin skin graphic, is not something new, it is already being done, so making one PG and one R rated graphic setup would not that hard.
And no doubt... a LOT of people would buy it.
It would sell, and there is no reason why it shouldn't. Such is abundant in classical art and we somehow managed to survive to the present regardless. This would effectively be no different. That such a big deal is made of this is absurd.
Now that I think about it, Filters really is a good way to go about it, and we easily have the technology.
Hummmmm
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
If I'm playing a high fantasy MMORPG that violates reality routinely in all manner of ways then I'm not going to care if yet another aspect, such as the viability of worn armour as depicted, is also unrealistic. It's just another part of the absurdity tapestry I'm surrounded by.
Realism is a lame argument, for that not intended to be realistic.
and yet.. this whole discussion has been about high fantasy armors that sexualize females..
Thank you for finally expressing how asinine it is to use the stand of realism in such a game environment. Why it took this many posts and you were not already at this pint from the onset, I guess is one of those magical things about MMO players, where they need to argue for the sake of it, even when they know they are deadass wrong by their own standards.
That hasn't been the whole discussion by either of us, as any reader of this thread can easily determine. If you feel that I expressed something contrary to the complimentary stances I have maintained all along or in accordance with the contrasting ones of your own, then you didn't understand what I wrote or you are trying to apply it in a contrary manner to which I expressed and intended it.
I hate to say it.. and.. I REALLY hate to say this.. but.. if they put something like this in for NPCs/Mobs, so that you could see the Boobs on harpies, or so that Dryads and Mermaids were naked, the painting on churches were nude, even things like Centaurs and such running around topless..
It would sell.
It will sell by the bucket on.
Like just some kind of "Adult" filter, so that all the hinted at nudity was no longer censored.
Now before you harp on this, keep in mind in China they are not allowed to show anything dead, this means, no skulls, no bones, no Skelton's, no Zombies, so making this twin skin graphic, is not something new, it is already being done, so making one PG and one R rated graphic setup would not that hard.
And no doubt... a LOT of people would buy it.
It would sell, and there is no reason why it shouldn't. Such is abundant in classical art and we somehow managed to survive to the present regardless. This would effectively be no different. That such a big deal is made of this is absurd.
Now that I think about it, Filters really is a good way to go about it, and we easily have the technology.
Hummmmm
I suppose it would depend on the amount that would need to be filtered, and what impact that would have on the game's performance.
I hate to say it.. and.. I REALLY hate to say this.. but.. if they put something like this in for NPCs/Mobs, so that you could see the Boobs on harpies, or so that Dryads and Mermaids were naked, the painting on churches were nude, even things like Centaurs and such running around topless..
It would sell.
It will sell by the bucket on.
Like just some kind of "Adult" filter, so that all the hinted at nudity was no longer censored.
Now before you harp on this, keep in mind in China they are not allowed to show anything dead, this means, no skulls, no bones, no Skelton's, no Zombies, so making this twin skin graphic, is not something new, it is already being done, so making one PG and one R rated graphic setup would not that hard.
And no doubt... a LOT of people would buy it.
It would sell, and there is no reason why it shouldn't. Such is abundant in classical art and we somehow managed to survive to the present regardless. This would effectively be no different. That such a big deal is made of this is absurd.
Now that I think about it, Filters really is a good way to go about it, and we easily have the technology.
Hummmmm
I suppose it would depend on the amount that would need to be filtered, and what impact that would have on the game's performance.
It's already done with any game that expects to be released in China where they need to hide anything relating to dead or death, like bones, skulls, etc. So, games like WoW already have this kind of filter in place.
Games like GW2 have various filters and the like for people on various paths in their personal story, along with instanced content, and again, also have filters for retail in China.
So it would stand to reason that any of these games would have zero issues with having various filters in to say remove modesty "Sea shells" from a mermaids tits, with the only real question being, how profitable would it be to do this.
I mean obviously sales in China are huge, so the profit potential far outweighs the work to put in the filters. There is however some issues, like for example, Japan has a direct hard block against genitalia, and it must be censored, and in that sense, it would then depend on the level of nudity.
There would also be an issue that it could not change other players outfits, as that would be dishonest to the player that was not running with the adults content on.
So there would be some things to work out, but the technology is already there, and has been there for well over a decade.
I wonder why no one thought to work in such a thing?
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
I hate to say it.. and.. I REALLY hate to say this.. but.. if they put something like this in for NPCs/Mobs, so that you could see the Boobs on harpies, or so that Dryads and Mermaids were naked, the painting on churches were nude, even things like Centaurs and such running around topless..
It would sell.
It will sell by the bucket on.
Like just some kind of "Adult" filter, so that all the hinted at nudity was no longer censored.
Now before you harp on this, keep in mind in China they are not allowed to show anything dead, this means, no skulls, no bones, no Skelton's, no Zombies, so making this twin skin graphic, is not something new, it is already being done, so making one PG and one R rated graphic setup would not that hard.
And no doubt... a LOT of people would buy it.
It would sell, and there is no reason why it shouldn't. Such is abundant in classical art and we somehow managed to survive to the present regardless. This would effectively be no different. That such a big deal is made of this is absurd.
Now that I think about it, Filters really is a good way to go about it, and we easily have the technology.
Hummmmm
I suppose it would depend on the amount that would need to be filtered, and what impact that would have on the game's performance.
It's already done with any game that expects to be released in China where they need to hide anything relating to dead or death, like bones, skulls, etc. So, games like WoW already have this kind of filter in place.
Games like GW2 have various filters and the like for people on various paths in their personal story, along with instanced content, and again, also have filters for retail in China.
So it would stand to reason that any of these games would have zero issues with having various filters in to say remove modesty "Sea shells" from a mermaids tits, with the only real question being, how profitable would it be to do this.
I mean obviously sales in China are huge, so the profit potential far outweighs the work to put in the filters. There is however some issues, like for example, Japan has a direct hard block against genitalia, and it must be censored, and in that sense, it would then depend on the level of nudity.
There would also be an issue that it could not change other players outfits, as that would be dishonest to the player that was not running with the adults content on.
So there would be some things to work out, but the technology is already there, and has been there for well over a decade.
I wonder why no one thought to work in such a thing?
I interpreted the situation as 'No nudity = easily distracted developers'. So it never got finished.
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
I hate to say it.. and.. I REALLY hate to say this.. but.. if they put something like this in for NPCs/Mobs, so that you could see the Boobs on harpies, or so that Dryads and Mermaids were naked, the painting on churches were nude, even things like Centaurs and such running around topless..
It would sell.
It will sell by the bucket on.
Like just some kind of "Adult" filter, so that all the hinted at nudity was no longer censored.
Now before you harp on this, keep in mind in China they are not allowed to show anything dead, this means, no skulls, no bones, no Skelton's, no Zombies, so making this twin skin graphic, is not something new, it is already being done, so making one PG and one R rated graphic setup would not that hard.
And no doubt... a LOT of people would buy it.
It would sell, and there is no reason why it shouldn't. Such is abundant in classical art and we somehow managed to survive to the present regardless. This would effectively be no different. That such a big deal is made of this is absurd.
Now that I think about it, Filters really is a good way to go about it, and we easily have the technology.
Hummmmm
I suppose it would depend on the amount that would need to be filtered, and what impact that would have on the game's performance.
It's already done with any game that expects to be released in China where they need to hide anything relating to dead or death, like bones, skulls, etc. So, games like WoW already have this kind of filter in place.
Games like GW2 have various filters and the like for people on various paths in their personal story, along with instanced content, and again, also have filters for retail in China.
So it would stand to reason that any of these games would have zero issues with having various filters in to say remove modesty "Sea shells" from a mermaids tits, with the only real question being, how profitable would it be to do this.
I mean obviously sales in China are huge, so the profit potential far outweighs the work to put in the filters. There is however some issues, like for example, Japan has a direct hard block against genitalia, and it must be censored, and in that sense, it would then depend on the level of nudity.
There would also be an issue that it could not change other players outfits, as that would be dishonest to the player that was not running with the adults content on.
So there would be some things to work out, but the technology is already there, and has been there for well over a decade.
I wonder why no one thought to work in such a thing?
I was under the impression that the Chinese client for WoW was separate from others rather than the same client filtered in some way. Otherwise it would be rather easy to bypass the filter by those appropriately skilled which I suspect their government wouldn't be rather keen on. The market is sizable enough that it would be worth the effort of making a dedicated client for it.
In GW2 the game simply needs to keep track of which options out of a limited set the player chooses for any particular character and present them with the appropriate prepackaged section of content. It's basically a "choose your own adventure" book where the choices made take minimal effort to track.
So, I don't know that either of the above approaches the technical demands of a system that would allow every individual player in an area to concurrently filter what can be seen in their field of view on the fly. In areas of high population concentration I expect it could be rather difficult to maintain without some compromise in performance, which may be why it isn't done.
I suppose it would depend on the amount that would need to be filtered, and what impact that would have on the game's performance.
It's already done with any game that expects to be released in China where they need to hide anything relating to dead or death, like bones, skulls, etc. So, games like WoW already have this kind of filter in place.
Games like GW2 have various filters and the like for people on various paths in their personal story, along with instanced content, and again, also have filters for retail in China.
So it would stand to reason that any of these games would have zero issues with having various filters in to say remove modesty "Sea shells" from a mermaids tits, with the only real question being, how profitable would it be to do this.
I mean obviously sales in China are huge, so the profit potential far outweighs the work to put in the filters. There is however some issues, like for example, Japan has a direct hard block against genitalia, and it must be censored, and in that sense, it would then depend on the level of nudity.
There would also be an issue that it could not change other players outfits, as that would be dishonest to the player that was not running with the adults content on.
So there would be some things to work out, but the technology is already there, and has been there for well over a decade.
I wonder why no one thought to work in such a thing?
I was under the impression that the Chinese client for WoW was separate from others rather than the same client filtered in some way. Otherwise it would be rather easy to bypass the filter by those appropriately skilled which I suspect their government wouldn't be rather keen on. The market is sizable enough that it would be worth the effort of making a dedicated client for it.
In GW2 the game simply needs to keep track of which options out of a limited set the player chooses for any particular character and present them with the appropriate prepackaged section of content. It's basically a "choose your own adventure" book where the choices made take minimal effort to track.
So, I don't know that either of the above approaches the technical demands of a system that would allow every individual player in an area to concurrently filter what can be seen in their field of view on the fly. In areas of high population concentration I expect it could be rather difficult to maintain without some compromise in performance, which may be why it isn't done.
Nahh.. in fact with GW2, which is a great example.
Case in point, You have the option to turn miniatures off/on, and the game filters this for every player in an area.
Not to mention options to use generic models, team colors, etc, in WvW, so the ability to set graphical standards is already there, and available for free to the player and used in high demand applications like Open World PvP Siege battles.
As a player you also have the option to turn off the graphics for various pieces of armor, like Helm, Back, Gloves, or to swap to outfits as opposed to showing armor, so even on an individual level this also not an issue to set filters and what is shown and not shown.
So, given what is already out there, something as simple as nudity filter for NPC's/MOBS, would not be anything major.
In fact, I would wager that even having outfits that have dual filters to them, where it can be shown as Adult Graphic or PG Content, would not be that big an issue, but something that could be sold and changed extra for, and no doubt players would pay for it.
Seems like too easy an idea.. I would wager too much offence in the whole idea of nudity in a Video.. all the while we have heroines in metal thongs and tit tassel's for armor.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
I suppose it would depend on the amount that would need to be filtered, and what impact that would have on the game's performance.
It's already done with any game that expects to be released in China where they need to hide anything relating to dead or death, like bones, skulls, etc. So, games like WoW already have this kind of filter in place.
Games like GW2 have various filters and the like for people on various paths in their personal story, along with instanced content, and again, also have filters for retail in China.
So it would stand to reason that any of these games would have zero issues with having various filters in to say remove modesty "Sea shells" from a mermaids tits, with the only real question being, how profitable would it be to do this.
I mean obviously sales in China are huge, so the profit potential far outweighs the work to put in the filters. There is however some issues, like for example, Japan has a direct hard block against genitalia, and it must be censored, and in that sense, it would then depend on the level of nudity.
There would also be an issue that it could not change other players outfits, as that would be dishonest to the player that was not running with the adults content on.
So there would be some things to work out, but the technology is already there, and has been there for well over a decade.
I wonder why no one thought to work in such a thing?
I was under the impression that the Chinese client for WoW was separate from others rather than the same client filtered in some way. Otherwise it would be rather easy to bypass the filter by those appropriately skilled which I suspect their government wouldn't be rather keen on. The market is sizable enough that it would be worth the effort of making a dedicated client for it.
In GW2 the game simply needs to keep track of which options out of a limited set the player chooses for any particular character and present them with the appropriate prepackaged section of content. It's basically a "choose your own adventure" book where the choices made take minimal effort to track.
So, I don't know that either of the above approaches the technical demands of a system that would allow every individual player in an area to concurrently filter what can be seen in their field of view on the fly. In areas of high population concentration I expect it could be rather difficult to maintain without some compromise in performance, which may be why it isn't done.
Nahh.. in fact with GW2, which is a great example.
Case in point, You have the option to turn miniatures off/on, and the game filters this for every player in an area.
Not to mention options to use generic models, team colors, etc, in WvW, so the ability to set graphical standards is already there, and available for free to the player and used in high demand applications like Open World PvP Siege battles.
As a player you also have the option to turn off the graphics for various pieces of armor, like Helm, Back, Gloves, or to swap to outfits as opposed to showing armor, so even on an individual level this also not an issue to set filters and what is shown and not shown.
So, given what is already out there, something as simple as nudity filter for NPC's/MOBS, would not be anything major.
In fact, I would wager that even having outfits that have dual filters to them, where it can be shown as Adult Graphic or PG Content, would not be that big an issue, but something that could be sold and changed extra for, and no doubt players would pay for it.
Seems like too easy an idea.. I would wager too much offence in the whole idea of nudity in a Video.. all the while we have heroines in metal thongs and tit tassel's for armor.
Yeah, GW2 has so many good systems. Now, if only the most important interlocking connective tissue was operational: meaningful, fun gameplay. But not everything is perfect, huh.
I hate to say it.. and.. I REALLY hate to say this.. but.. if they put something like this in for NPCs/Mobs, so that you could see the Boobs on harpies, or so that Dryads and Mermaids were naked, the painting on churches were nude, even things like Centaurs and such running around topless..
It would sell.
It will sell by the bucket on.
Like just some kind of "Adult" filter, so that all the hinted at nudity was no longer censored.
Now before you harp on this, keep in mind in China they are not allowed to show anything dead, this means, no skulls, no bones, no Skelton's, no Zombies, so making this twin skin graphic, is not something new, it is already being done, so making one PG and one R rated graphic setup would not that hard.
And no doubt... a LOT of people would buy it.
It would sell, and there is no reason why it shouldn't. Such is abundant in classical art and we somehow managed to survive to the present regardless. This would effectively be no different. That such a big deal is made of this is absurd.
Now that I think about it, Filters really is a good way to go about it, and we easily have the technology.
Hummmmm
I suppose it would depend on the amount that would need to be filtered, and what impact that would have on the game's performance.
It's already done with any game that expects to be released in China where they need to hide anything relating to dead or death, like bones, skulls, etc. So, games like WoW already have this kind of filter in place.
Games like GW2 have various filters and the like for people on various paths in their personal story, along with instanced content, and again, also have filters for retail in China.
So it would stand to reason that any of these games would have zero issues with having various filters in to say remove modesty "Sea shells" from a mermaids tits, with the only real question being, how profitable would it be to do this.
I mean obviously sales in China are huge, so the profit potential far outweighs the work to put in the filters. There is however some issues, like for example, Japan has a direct hard block against genitalia, and it must be censored, and in that sense, it would then depend on the level of nudity.
There would also be an issue that it could not change other players outfits, as that would be dishonest to the player that was not running with the adults content on.
So there would be some things to work out, but the technology is already there, and has been there for well over a decade.
I wonder why no one thought to work in such a thing?
I was under the impression that the Chinese client for WoW was separate from others rather than the same client filtered in some way. Otherwise it would be rather easy to bypass the filter by those appropriately skilled which I suspect their government wouldn't be rather keen on. The market is sizable enough that it would be worth the effort of making a dedicated client for it.
In GW2 the game simply needs to keep track of which options out of a limited set the player chooses for any particular character and present them with the appropriate prepackaged section of content. It's basically a "choose your own adventure" book where the choices made take minimal effort to track.
So, I don't know that either of the above approaches the technical demands of a system that would allow every individual player in an area to concurrently filter what can be seen in their field of view on the fly. In areas of high population concentration I expect it could be rather difficult to maintain without some compromise in performance, which may be why it isn't done.
Isn't Chinese WoW set up totally different, not just the models? I thought they paid by the hour, not a subscription for one. I could be wrong on this, but that alone says "totally different game" to me.
Also, we can't even get any improvements in MMOs and here is Ungood talking about "how easy" something would be. That alone is laughable. Maybe if developers charged for naked male models it may happen, yes? Then he could stare at hairy naked male butts all day long
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse. - FARGIN_WAR
There isn't more nudity because developers try to cater to as many people as possibly to the detriment of not only the game itself but the entire mmorpg genre. Simple as that. Im not advocating for nudity, Age of Conan had it and it was no biggie. I don't care if an MMO has it or not. But the reasoning is pretty simple. And the reasoning is why no MMO's have soul anymore. Its why we no longer have virtual worlds. Why invest time into something when you've already wasted so much time trying to not step on anyones toes? May as well just worry about monetization after.
I suppose it would depend on the amount that would need to be filtered, and what impact that would have on the game's performance.
It's already done with any game that expects to be released in China where they need to hide anything relating to dead or death, like bones, skulls, etc. So, games like WoW already have this kind of filter in place.
Games like GW2 have various filters and the like for people on various paths in their personal story, along with instanced content, and again, also have filters for retail in China.
So it would stand to reason that any of these games would have zero issues with having various filters in to say remove modesty "Sea shells" from a mermaids tits, with the only real question being, how profitable would it be to do this.
I mean obviously sales in China are huge, so the profit potential far outweighs the work to put in the filters. There is however some issues, like for example, Japan has a direct hard block against genitalia, and it must be censored, and in that sense, it would then depend on the level of nudity.
There would also be an issue that it could not change other players outfits, as that would be dishonest to the player that was not running with the adults content on.
So there would be some things to work out, but the technology is already there, and has been there for well over a decade.
I wonder why no one thought to work in such a thing?
I was under the impression that the Chinese client for WoW was separate from others rather than the same client filtered in some way. Otherwise it would be rather easy to bypass the filter by those appropriately skilled which I suspect their government wouldn't be rather keen on. The market is sizable enough that it would be worth the effort of making a dedicated client for it.
In GW2 the game simply needs to keep track of which options out of a limited set the player chooses for any particular character and present them with the appropriate prepackaged section of content. It's basically a "choose your own adventure" book where the choices made take minimal effort to track.
So, I don't know that either of the above approaches the technical demands of a system that would allow every individual player in an area to concurrently filter what can be seen in their field of view on the fly. In areas of high population concentration I expect it could be rather difficult to maintain without some compromise in performance, which may be why it isn't done.
Nahh.. in fact with GW2, which is a great example.
Case in point, You have the option to turn miniatures off/on, and the game filters this for every player in an area.
Not to mention options to use generic models, team colors, etc, in WvW, so the ability to set graphical standards is already there, and available for free to the player and used in high demand applications like Open World PvP Siege battles.
As a player you also have the option to turn off the graphics for various pieces of armor, like Helm, Back, Gloves, or to swap to outfits as opposed to showing armor, so even on an individual level this also not an issue to set filters and what is shown and not shown.
So, given what is already out there, something as simple as nudity filter for NPC's/MOBS, would not be anything major.
In fact, I would wager that even having outfits that have dual filters to them, where it can be shown as Adult Graphic or PG Content, would not be that big an issue, but something that could be sold and changed extra for, and no doubt players would pay for it.
Seems like too easy an idea.. I would wager too much offence in the whole idea of nudity in a Video.. all the while we have heroines in metal thongs and tit tassel's for armor.
Yeah, GW2 has so many good systems. Now, if only the most important interlocking connective tissue was operational: meaningful, fun gameplay. But not everything is perfect, huh.
Going to be honest with you, while I am not disagreeing with you, I am also not 100% sure what you mean by Meaningful Gameplay as I was often under the belief (At least for most games, not including educational games like Leap Frog for example) that playing games was often a means of meaningless fun and escapism.
So.. Going to ask you explain what you mean by Meaningful Gameplay.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
I hate to say it.. and.. I REALLY hate to say this.. but.. if they put something like this in for NPCs/Mobs, so that you could see the Boobs on harpies, or so that Dryads and Mermaids were naked, the painting on churches were nude, even things like Centaurs and such running around topless..
It would sell.
It will sell by the bucket on.
Like just some kind of "Adult" filter, so that all the hinted at nudity was no longer censored.
Now before you harp on this, keep in mind in China they are not allowed to show anything dead, this means, no skulls, no bones, no Skelton's, no Zombies, so making this twin skin graphic, is not something new, it is already being done, so making one PG and one R rated graphic setup would not that hard.
And no doubt... a LOT of people would buy it.
It would sell, and there is no reason why it shouldn't. Such is abundant in classical art and we somehow managed to survive to the present regardless. This would effectively be no different. That such a big deal is made of this is absurd.
Now that I think about it, Filters really is a good way to go about it, and we easily have the technology.
Hummmmm
I suppose it would depend on the amount that would need to be filtered, and what impact that would have on the game's performance.
It's already done with any game that expects to be released in China where they need to hide anything relating to dead or death, like bones, skulls, etc. So, games like WoW already have this kind of filter in place.
Games like GW2 have various filters and the like for people on various paths in their personal story, along with instanced content, and again, also have filters for retail in China.
So it would stand to reason that any of these games would have zero issues with having various filters in to say remove modesty "Sea shells" from a mermaids tits, with the only real question being, how profitable would it be to do this.
I mean obviously sales in China are huge, so the profit potential far outweighs the work to put in the filters. There is however some issues, like for example, Japan has a direct hard block against genitalia, and it must be censored, and in that sense, it would then depend on the level of nudity.
There would also be an issue that it could not change other players outfits, as that would be dishonest to the player that was not running with the adults content on.
So there would be some things to work out, but the technology is already there, and has been there for well over a decade.
I wonder why no one thought to work in such a thing?
I was under the impression that the Chinese client for WoW was separate from others rather than the same client filtered in some way. Otherwise it would be rather easy to bypass the filter by those appropriately skilled which I suspect their government wouldn't be rather keen on. The market is sizable enough that it would be worth the effort of making a dedicated client for it.
In GW2 the game simply needs to keep track of which options out of a limited set the player chooses for any particular character and present them with the appropriate prepackaged section of content. It's basically a "choose your own adventure" book where the choices made take minimal effort to track.
So, I don't know that either of the above approaches the technical demands of a system that would allow every individual player in an area to concurrently filter what can be seen in their field of view on the fly. In areas of high population concentration I expect it could be rather difficult to maintain without some compromise in performance, which may be why it isn't done.
Isn't Chinese WoW set up totally different, not just the models? I thought they paid by the hour, not a subscription for one. I could be wrong on this, but that alone says "totally different game" to me.
Also, we can't even get any improvements in MMOs and here is Ungood talking about "how easy" something would be. That alone is laughable. Maybe if developers charged for naked male models it may happen, yes? Then he could stare at hairy naked male butts all day long
Last I looked it was purely a re-skin not a new model as far as China goes, Like making Skulls look like rocks, and removing all the details.
But, that aside, there have been a LOT of changes and innovation in MMO's over the years. Sure, WoW has done to MMO's what Henry Ford did to Cars.
But, when you deal with cars, there is a basic standard by which all cars are made, this is why we can get in and drive one, with very need for a tutorial to learn that specific car, sure we might need a basic showing of where all the buttons and things are, but, it's still going to be a Car. The same thing kinda happened to MMOs, we can get in and just play them. No one wants to rock the boat too much, as that would make the MMO harder to drive, and that does not sell the cars well. So keeping things closer to a standard is in fact better for the industry, as this makes it easier for people to just show up, buy the car and drive it off the lot without needing to go through a whole Drivers Education course to learn how to drive THAT car.
Outside the basic controls, you have the generic, 4 wheels, 2 seats in the front, rearview mirrors, trunk, the basic design and layout remains pretty much the same for most cars. That does not mean there isn't innovation going on, it just means most of it will be nuanced.
Like for example. Cosmetics. When EQ launched there was no such thing as "Cosmetics" in fact the Cosmetic of an Item was indicative of THAT specific item, is was meant to show off that you got a specific item, like Dragon Loot, or some such. In the early days, cosmetics for the sake it was an abomination, and gear graphics was a display of our prowess of loot and gear, showed what you earned, which you already know, but nowadays, graphics are a means of purely cosmetic things, to look a specific way, be damned the stats or quality of the item.
And while MMO's are at the stage of nuanced changes like cars, going purely cosmetic was a very big game changer overall. This was like going from the 40's to the 60's of the Car World, where style was the thing.
Now in that vein, what I am asking for is again, purely a cosmetic thing, along the lines of window tinting in the car world, or mechanical seats, yah, it's something new, and unique, but it is also just a nuanced change.
and yes.... it's been established that this would be a paid for account upgrade.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
You can find nudity in MMORPG's out there. Just google Mortal Online 2 female models (uncensored) and there you go
Full nudity in the game, with "adult filter" if you want them at least a little dressed up!
I can find it in Conan as well.. the question was is it so limited.
Egotism is the anesthetic that dullens the pain of stupidity, this is why when I try to beat my head against the stupidity of other people, I only hurt myself.
Any man that embraces the objectification/sexualization of a female, and not equally so a male.. Yes.. they have a very frail ego.. like Thin untempered glass that shatters at the tiniest little poke.
Why would or should I embrace the sexualization of something I have no sexual interest in? What would possibly be the point? It is an absurd expectation.
It's absurd to you that men and women be treated equally?
Is it absurd to you that people like what they like without bothering to consider whether that's unfair?
And since the difference is purely cosmetic, there is no reason not to treat male and female avatars in a game, the same.
Well, other than realism because the difference in genders is not simply cosmetic, but nobody wants that truth to be acknowledged.
Or is it more nobody could deliver that in a game without being crucified because many prefer to pretend these differences don't exist.
It's not all that horrible a pretense with gaming largely being escapist entertainment, especially in the case of MMORPGs, but it undermines any attempt at simulation of low magic and low technology settings which is my main annoyance with it.
Realism... LOL. Chainmail bikinis' and Boobplate is anything BUT realistic.
In fact there is nothing.. nothing at all realistic about Sexualized Body Armor. End of Discussion.
It is common for game worlds to have a particular material that makes for excellent armors, but is transparent. It's fairly expensive, which is why it is more commonly used in high level armors. But it causes horrible skin rashes on most males, which is why it is only worn by females.
Comments
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.- FARGIN_WAR
Shall you also want to play Perma Death, and watch your character shit and piss themselves before dying?
It would sell.
It will sell by the bucket on.
Like just some kind of "Adult" filter, so that all the hinted at nudity was no longer censored.
Now before you harp on this, keep in mind in China they are not allowed to show anything dead, this means, no skulls, no bones, no Skelton's, no Zombies, so making this twin skin graphic, is not something new, it is already being done, so making one PG and one R rated graphic setup would not that hard.
And no doubt... a LOT of people would buy it.
As for permadeath, that would depend on what it comes along with. If there were features of interest substantially different from the norm the overall package could be worth it. As for bodily function mechanics, I'll leave such to your speculation.
Perhaps you could make a thoughtful response to what I said rather than dragging your part of this exchange into the sewer. If you truly can't do better than there is little point in discussion.
It would sell, and there is no reason why it shouldn't. Such is abundant in classical art and we somehow managed to survive to the present regardless. This would effectively be no different. That such a big deal is made of this is absurd.
Which is why I think "realism" is a lame argument.
That depends rather much on the type of game a person wants to play.
If I'm playing a game supposedly largely based on realism then I'd like it to actually reflect it to a reasonable degree, or provide reasonable justification for whatever deviations are present.
If I'm playing a high fantasy MMORPG that violates reality routinely in all manner of ways then I'm not going to care if yet another aspect, such as the viability of worn armour as depicted, is also unrealistic. It's just another part of the absurdity tapestry I'm surrounded by.
Realism is a lame argument, for that not intended to be realistic.
Thank you for finally expressing how asinine it is to use the stand of realism in such a game environment. Why it took this many posts and you were not already at this pint from the onset, I guess is one of those magical things about MMO players, where they need to argue for the sake of it, even when they know they are deadass wrong by their own standards.
Hummmmm
That hasn't been the whole discussion by either of us, as any reader of this thread can easily determine. If you feel that I expressed something contrary to the complimentary stances I have maintained all along or in accordance with the contrasting ones of your own, then you didn't understand what I wrote or you are trying to apply it in a contrary manner to which I expressed and intended it.
Nothing I said is contrary to my own standards.
I suppose it would depend on the amount that would need to be filtered, and what impact that would have on the game's performance.
Games like GW2 have various filters and the like for people on various paths in their personal story, along with instanced content, and again, also have filters for retail in China.
So it would stand to reason that any of these games would have zero issues with having various filters in to say remove modesty "Sea shells" from a mermaids tits, with the only real question being, how profitable would it be to do this.
I mean obviously sales in China are huge, so the profit potential far outweighs the work to put in the filters. There is however some issues, like for example, Japan has a direct hard block against genitalia, and it must be censored, and in that sense, it would then depend on the level of nudity.
There would also be an issue that it could not change other players outfits, as that would be dishonest to the player that was not running with the adults content on.
So there would be some things to work out, but the technology is already there, and has been there for well over a decade.
I wonder why no one thought to work in such a thing?
Logic, my dear, merely enables one to be wrong with great authority.
I was under the impression that the Chinese client for WoW was separate from others rather than the same client filtered in some way. Otherwise it would be rather easy to bypass the filter by those appropriately skilled which I suspect their government wouldn't be rather keen on. The market is sizable enough that it would be worth the effort of making a dedicated client for it.
In GW2 the game simply needs to keep track of which options out of a limited set the player chooses for any particular character and present them with the appropriate prepackaged section of content. It's basically a "choose your own adventure" book where the choices made take minimal effort to track.
So, I don't know that either of the above approaches the technical demands of a system that would allow every individual player in an area to concurrently filter what can be seen in their field of view on the fly. In areas of high population concentration I expect it could be rather difficult to maintain without some compromise in performance, which may be why it isn't done.
Case in point, You have the option to turn miniatures off/on, and the game filters this for every player in an area.
Not to mention options to use generic models, team colors, etc, in WvW, so the ability to set graphical standards is already there, and available for free to the player and used in high demand applications like Open World PvP Siege battles.
As a player you also have the option to turn off the graphics for various pieces of armor, like Helm, Back, Gloves, or to swap to outfits as opposed to showing armor, so even on an individual level this also not an issue to set filters and what is shown and not shown.
So, given what is already out there, something as simple as nudity filter for NPC's/MOBS, would not be anything major.
In fact, I would wager that even having outfits that have dual filters to them, where it can be shown as Adult Graphic or PG Content, would not be that big an issue, but something that could be sold and changed extra for, and no doubt players would pay for it.
Seems like too easy an idea.. I would wager too much offence in the whole idea of nudity in a Video.. all the while we have heroines in metal thongs and tit tassel's for armor.
Also, we can't even get any improvements in MMOs and here is Ungood talking about "how easy" something would be. That alone is laughable. Maybe if developers charged for naked male models it may happen, yes? Then he could stare at hairy naked male butts all day long
- Al
Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.- FARGIN_WAR
So.. Going to ask you explain what you mean by Meaningful Gameplay.
But, that aside, there have been a LOT of changes and innovation in MMO's over the years. Sure, WoW has done to MMO's what Henry Ford did to Cars.
But, when you deal with cars, there is a basic standard by which all cars are made, this is why we can get in and drive one, with very need for a tutorial to learn that specific car, sure we might need a basic showing of where all the buttons and things are, but, it's still going to be a Car. The same thing kinda happened to MMOs, we can get in and just play them. No one wants to rock the boat too much, as that would make the MMO harder to drive, and that does not sell the cars well. So keeping things closer to a standard is in fact better for the industry, as this makes it easier for people to just show up, buy the car and drive it off the lot without needing to go through a whole Drivers Education course to learn how to drive THAT car.
Outside the basic controls, you have the generic, 4 wheels, 2 seats in the front, rearview mirrors, trunk, the basic design and layout remains pretty much the same for most cars. That does not mean there isn't innovation going on, it just means most of it will be nuanced.
Like for example. Cosmetics.
When EQ launched there was no such thing as "Cosmetics" in fact the Cosmetic of an Item was indicative of THAT specific item, is was meant to show off that you got a specific item, like Dragon Loot, or some such. In the early days, cosmetics for the sake it was an abomination, and gear graphics was a display of our prowess of loot and gear, showed what you earned, which you already know, but nowadays, graphics are a means of purely cosmetic things, to look a specific way, be damned the stats or quality of the item.
And while MMO's are at the stage of nuanced changes like cars, going purely cosmetic was a very big game changer overall. This was like going from the 40's to the 60's of the Car World, where style was the thing.
Now in that vein, what I am asking for is again, purely a cosmetic thing, along the lines of window tinting in the car world, or mechanical seats, yah, it's something new, and unique, but it is also just a nuanced change.
and yes.... it's been established that this would be a paid for account upgrade.
Full nudity in the game, with "adult filter" if you want them at least a little dressed up!