I don't know. I am done with this topic for sure. I care because I like the game. But even that answer that "they don't plan to charge people who don't want to play" leaves them with the option of saying "all you have to do is cancel"
My guess is that someone is doing their billing / account creation etc. and they truly don't know but are finding out and working on some way to fix it.
Same as the game. I give them the benefit of the doubt for intentions. . just not the ability to always be able to implement or fix it in a timely manner.
Why is it worth discussing. Because (A) If they don't know how it will work and they planned on releaseing last month. . . that looks bad for their ability to stay on top of all the aspects of what makes a MMO work.
(B) I like the game and want it to succeed. It is okay to say we are a small group and making the game for a niche market. That is fine, but you should clearly state that in the main page of your site then. Not have a "buy now" button. You can't offer a game to the masses and not expect to deal with the lowest common denominator. Yes some people will not like the game because it is "niche" . . but the billing system shouldn't be.
So not only is MO a sandbox, and it gives pre-orders a "sandbox art book", but now even the billing system is a sandbox. The only billing system of any mmo where *you*, the player, get to make your own predictions on what will happen on that date.
If you stand VERY still, and close your eyes, after a minute you can actually FEEL the universe revolving around PvP.
Even more annoying is people complaining about the "trolls". If their claims are unreasonable, just correct them by being polite and helpful. Some people replying on these forums throw on even darker light on Mortal Online by generally being unfriendly and aggressive towards anyone who is negative about "their" game. So, if you have to say something about the thread, say it, if you have to say something about a person, PM them. Don't annoy us again and again with how that and this person is only trolling. If they were acting against the ToS, I think the staff would be more than captable to handle them,
I don't think they are "trolls" as they don't fit into the proper definition of trolling.Trolls don't give a rats ass about a topic, they post only to provoke. That's not what I am seeing, more so they just like to point out the negative points about MO. That's not really trolling.
I try and be polite when I question one of their posts. However at the same time, this thread is an example of their inability to reason on the subject of MO. Their minds are made up, everything this company does is just plain unethical to them. I'm not even saying they shoudn't feel that way, I'm only saying they shouldn't expect everyone to feel the same way. Some of us like to base our opinions on facts, not conjecture.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Thanks for the info OP. This prompted me to check my account and, believe it or not, I was set to automatically renew! I haven't played the game, nor logged into my account, for quite some time. So SV is defaulting its users to agree to something without the users' knowledge. For some reason, I expected this from SV. Everything else just seems like a scam from this POS company.
You can't use the tools if you don't know they exist... http://www.ic3.gov - Internet Crime Complaint Center - Report cyber crimes to the FBI.
I don't think they are "trolls" as they don't fit into the proper definition of trolling.Trolls don't give a rats ass about a topic, they post only to provoke. That's not what I am seeing, more so they just like to point out the negative points about MO. That's not really trolling.
I try and be polite when I question one of their posts. However at the same time, this thread is an example of their inability to reason on the subject of MO. Their minds are made up, everything this company does is just plain unethical to them. I'm not even saying they shoudn't feel that way, I'm only saying they shouldn't expect everyone to feel the same way. Some of us like to base our opinions on facts, not conjecture.
#2 The game was slated to go live at the end of March.. this was confirmed mid March. It was pushed back due to technical issues with desync on March 29th. Next part is not a fact but common sense says that 3 days before release a company should know who they plan to bill. Still no clarification issued at that point.
#3 This thread is created. Many people read and for the first time are alerted to the possibility that SV will be doing this. Threads are opened on the official forums asking for clarification. Days go by with no response.
#4 Not a fact.. more of a substantiated rumor as confirmed in his message a day or so later. Maerlyn states on IRC that he is aware of the issue but doesn't have an answer. He has informed "management" and hopes to have an answer soon.
#5 Maerlyn posts yesterday stating that he hopes to have an official response next week
#6 The actually have a Customer Service guy named "Shady"... Somewhat not relevant but when the guy ducking your questions or only indirectly answering them is named "Shady" it doesn't help the situation.
Now.. there is nothing really left to discuss until this Press Release is sent out on Monday. It just seems very strange that a simply Yes/No question has taken weeks to answer and will eventually be done via a Press Release... Again, not a "fact" but I don't think it's really a stretch to assume that there would be no answer and no Press Release if it wasn't for this thread.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Thanks for the info OP. This prompted me to check my account and, believe it or not, I was set to automatically renew! I haven't played the game, nor logged into my account, for quite some time. So SV is defaulting its users to agree to something without the users' knowledge. For some reason, I expected this from SV. Everything else just seems like a scam from this POS company.
Now.. there is nothing really left to discuss until this Press Release is sent out on Monday. It just seems very strange that a simply Yes/No question has taken weeks to answer and will eventually be done via a Press Release... Again, not a "fact" but I don't think it's really a stretch to assume that there would be no answer and no Press Release if it wasn't for this thread.
As I said about 10 pages ago, starting the thread for awareness is fine. As anyone would want to know something like this possibly may happen. You as well as I know, there's a lot more going on in this thread than that.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Where I work as a Manager I am constantly having to explain things in the simplest of terms so my coworkers can understand what I want done. So here I go:
When MO was purchased on Pre-order/Paid Beta (LOL what!?) SV took the CC info from those purchases and linked them to accounts MUCH LATER than the initial purchase WITHOUT AUTHORIZATION FROM THE PURCHASER! Can't legally do that. It's stupid besides that anyway. SV should not make an assumption that the person buying the game will also A: play it themselves B: use the same CC to pay for sub. Bad SV! Everything else doesn't matter. Just that. Regardless of whether or not anyone has been charged yet it's still wrong. Doesn't take a Legally Blond Poster to throw up legalise to muddy the waters. You can't link ANY CC INFO TO AN ACCOUNT WITHOUT AUTHORIZATION FROM THE PURCHASER! Simple as that.
Now if I got my facts wrong I am sorry in advance. But that looks like what is being attempted.
BTW I'm in a hurry so if I made any spelling mistakes then please crucify me after I get home from work. TIA!
Bartoni's Law definition: As an Internet discussion grows volatile, the probability of a comparison involving Donald Trump approaches 1.
Response from MO forums from Andreas Springare (Level Designer):
Talked to Henrik about this and not entirely sure what he said. Something about that there was something when the system was first launched. But he said that he are going to send out a a press release or something soon to clear things out.
I'm not sure when but should be in a day or to.
I must clarify that we do not intend to charge people that do not want to play the game. So I believe that all this is just one big misunderstanding. I don't know how it works so just wait for Henrik's statement.
Doesn't know how it works????? Wow talk about clueless regarding the simple things in life.
Glad you posted this OP, checked and I was auto subbed also. Got the game back in Block B and NEVER signed up for any sub package. In fact I don't remember them ever stating oficially back in July what the monthly cost would be, so who in their right mind would have agreed to that BS?
A press release?? Yeah right, more like an arse covering spin written by some low value hack posing as a CEO.
Doesn't know how it works????? Wow talk about clueless regarding the simple things in life.
Glad you posted this OP, checked and I was auto subbed also. Got the game back in Block B and NEVER signed up for any sub package. In fact I don't remember them ever stating oficially back in July what the monthly cost would be, so who in their right mind would have agreed to that BS?
A press release?? Yeah right, more like an arse covering spin written by some low value hack posing as a CEO.
If you check about 13 posts ago, you'll notice that Andreas Springare is a level designer. As such, his job is to design areas within the game, not to understand their billing system. He just happens to be working on the weekend and decided to address this. A press release is the best means of putting out information officially.
It is nice to see that the topic I started is actually getting people to turn off their auto subscriptions.
Anything LESS than turning it off globally is nothing short of a total scam by SV. They cannot enter your subscription FOR you, they cannot make you cancel -- they have to give you the option of doing it in the first place.
The comment by Andreas is meaningless really, because this issue has been out there for a while now, people are hotly debating it, and the best we can do is get Maerlyn to say "I'm looking into it" and for a level designer to say "oh, that's not what we mean!"
Just imagine when this game goes live -- severe problems will have the same amount of attention given and a similar response time. And this is supposed to be a 24/7 MMO, right? We already had confirmation multiple times that people will be FORCED to cancel before the month is out, so seeing SV's unethical behavior is plain and simple. It's funny and sad to see how many people just accepted point blank what some level designer said, when their own statements only weeks before this whole incident showed they had full intention to charge customers without warning or their knowledge. The only thing that can be done now is to backtrack from this position and turn it off for everybody globally -- and hope they resubscribe.
Obviously, my opinion is that they did this because they simply knew almost nobody was going to resubscribe after the first month, and this is how they'd get a bunch of subscription fees from people other than fanboys in order to keep the game afloat. Henrik's dad seems to have sold all his stock in order to delay the launch, so SV is running on thin ice. This is what happens when you find that the "Blizzard" method of developing games is not for you (you know, a standard) and when you try to make a Ferrari after you made a soap box racer. But that's just my opinion. The rest of SV's unethical behavior and shady business practices speak for themselves.
It is nice to see that the topic I started is actually getting people to turn off their auto subscriptions.
In essence, by making this post, you saved me money. Thank you. Not sure how much, because I have no idea how much SV is charging for a monthly sub. Who knows, maybe they signed me up for a 1 year sub. That's the issue, THEY signed me up for a subscription to their game. Illegal? Yes. SV very simply failed. And for them to claim "ignorance" doesn't help their situation. They are learning a very important lesson in how not to treat their customers.
You can't use the tools if you don't know they exist... http://www.ic3.gov - Internet Crime Complaint Center - Report cyber crimes to the FBI.
Where I work as a Manager I am constantly having to explain things in the simplest of terms so my coworkers can understand what I want done. So here I go:
When MO was purchased on Pre-order/Paid Beta (LOL what!?) SV took the CC info from those purchases and linked them to accounts MUCH LATER than the initial purchase WITHOUT AUTHORIZATION FROM THE PURCHASER! Can't legally do that. It's stupid besides that anyway. SV should not make an assumption that the person buying the game will also A: play it themselves B: use the same CC to pay for sub. Bad SV! Everything else doesn't matter. Just that. Regardless of whether or not anyone has been charged yet it's still wrong. Doesn't take a Legally Blond Poster to throw up legalise to muddy the waters. You can't link ANY CC INFO TO AN ACCOUNT WITHOUT AUTHORIZATION FROM THE PURCHASER! Simple as that.
Now if I got my facts wrong I am sorry in advance. But that looks like what is being attempted.
BTW I'm in a hurry so if I made any spelling mistakes then please crucify me after I get home from work. TIA!
We're all aware that the concern lies in the fact that (seemingly) people who pre-ordered are automatically signed up for a recurring subscription.
What has yet to be established so far is whether or not this was an error, a planned scam, a place holder page that meant nothing etc... We do not know any of this, because SV has not addressed it.
Is that the sum of it? Yes, we established all of this by page 2.
The reason this thread has turned out this way is because none of this has been established as FACT. outside of the webpage that showed users as "Renew".
The reason there is confusion on this issue is because according to some they do not have an active subscription model in place (supposedly) which will not be active until SV considers the game "gone gold". Only then will people be signing up as subscribers. According to SV you have to pick a sub (1 month, 6 month, 12 month) before you will be considered a subsciber. Which if true means the auto "renew" issue means nothing at present.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Where I work as a Manager I am constantly having to explain things in the simplest of terms so my coworkers can understand what I want done. So here I go:
When MO was purchased on Pre-order/Paid Beta (LOL what!?) SV took the CC info from those purchases and linked them to accounts MUCH LATER than the initial purchase WITHOUT AUTHORIZATION FROM THE PURCHASER! Can't legally do that. It's stupid besides that anyway. SV should not make an assumption that the person buying the game will also A: play it themselves B: use the same CC to pay for sub. Bad SV! Everything else doesn't matter. Just that. Regardless of whether or not anyone has been charged yet it's still wrong. Doesn't take a Legally Blond Poster to throw up legalise to muddy the waters. You can't link ANY CC INFO TO AN ACCOUNT WITHOUT AUTHORIZATION FROM THE PURCHASER! Simple as that.
Now if I got my facts wrong I am sorry in advance. But that looks like what is being attempted.
BTW I'm in a hurry so if I made any spelling mistakes then please crucify me after I get home from work. TIA!
We're all aware that the concern lies in the fact that (seemingly) people who pre-ordered are automatically signed up for a recurring subscription.
What has yet to be established so far is whether or not this was an error, a planned scam, a place holder page that meant nothing etc... We do not know any of this, because SV has not addressed it.
Is that the sum of it? Yes, we established all of this by page 2.
The reason this thread has turned out this way is because none of this has been established as FACT. outside of the webpage that showed users as "Renew".
The reason there is confusion on this issue is because according to some they do not have an active subscription model in place (supposedly) which will not be active until SV considers the game "gone gold". Only then will people be signing up as subscribers. According to SV you have to pick a sub (1 month, 6 month, 12 month) before you will be considered a subsciber. Which if true means the auto "renew" issue means nothing at present.
Their own customer support agent already said that you have to actively cancel the renewal in order for you not to be charged. That's a *fact*.
Now if they do an about-face on it, that's a good thing for all of us as consumers because you don't have this unethical company being able to get away with this kind of behavior and rip people off, as they INTENDED TO DO. Again -- it's a fact they wanted to rip people off. It's established. The debate for the last bunch of pages has been mostly in defense of SV from the fans who would never admonish them, and then counters from people who look at the facts and say, WTF are they thinking? And a lot of "thanks" for saving them the hassle and money of playing this terrible piece of programming.
Their own customer support agent already said that you have to actively cancel the renewal in order for you not to be charged. That's a *fact*.
Didn't see that..
Now if they do an about-face on it, that's a good thing for all of us as consumers because you don't have this unethical company being able to get away with this kind of behavior and rip people off, as they INTENDED TO DO. Again -- it's a fact they wanted to rip people off. It's established. The debate for the last bunch of pages has been mostly in defense of SV from the fans who would never admonish them, and then counters from people who look at the facts and say, WTF are they thinking? And a lot of "thanks" for saving them the hassle and money of playing this terrible piece of programming.
Well I agree if they planned on doing this it is good, people know about it. I have been waiting to see the end result. Got a link to that btw wanna read it myself, about the cancel thing ?
What this means is the earlier statements being quoted were lies, (the subscription model issue) right? Why is that not a bigger issue? As a few pages back this was the big point being argued. When was this proven to be false, I was gone a few days obviously?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Their own customer support agent already said that you have to actively cancel the renewal in order for you not to be charged. That's a *fact*.
Didn't see that..
Now if they do an about-face on it, that's a good thing for all of us as consumers because you don't have this unethical company being able to get away with this kind of behavior and rip people off, as they INTENDED TO DO. Again -- it's a fact they wanted to rip people off. It's established. The debate for the last bunch of pages has been mostly in defense of SV from the fans who would never admonish them, and then counters from people who look at the facts and say, WTF are they thinking? And a lot of "thanks" for saving them the hassle and money of playing this terrible piece of programming.
Well I agree if they planned on doing this it is good, people know about it. I have been waiting to see the end result. Got a link to that btw wanna read it myself, about the cancel thing ?
What this means is the earlier statements being quoted were lies, (the subscription model issue) right? Why is that not a bigger issue? As a few pages back this was the big point being argued. When was this proven to be false, I was gone a few days obviously?
The possibility to cancel your subscription is now, since yesterday, available when you log in to your account. Just choose "do not renew" and then "update", and no further charges will be made from your account.
They are making the ridiculous assertion that people who bought Mortal back in July and never even signed up for a subscription will be charged monthly once it goes live. Even if they quit 8 months ago.
Can someone with posting privileges there please go and explain that this would never happen...
It's almost Wednesday in Sweden, and we've yet to hear a single comment or update about this fiasco.
In my head though, I am laughing with the "I told you so" line ringing...
Henrik has been online pretty frequently as well, so it's not like he hasn't had enough time to address it.
My guess is that they are going to ignore it, and instead the next big announcement from Henrik will be an update to MO, and everybody will forget about this topic.
Then when they bill people on a recurring basis without them knowing, they will say "Oh! Our bad! You can email us for a refund!"
And we already know how good their customer support is. And at that point -- they will already have your money.
Hmm.. On Sat a dev said they would send out an announcement in a day or two..
Well.. it's now Thursday in Sweden. Wonder what the holdup could be...
Just chalk it up to the wonderful level of communication from SV (Looks live their CM has gone back into hiding after his sudden outburst of posting on Saturday). At least they are consistent !!
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Hmm.. On Sat a dev said they would send out an announcement in a day or two..
Well.. it's now Thursday in Sweden. Wonder what the holdup could be...
Just chalk it up to the wonderful level of communication from SV (Looks live their CM has gone back into hiding after his sudden outburst of posting on Saturday). At least they are consistent !!
ROFL I bought my block A pre-order on Ebay. So does that mean if I leave Autorenew checked then the poor SOB that originally ordered it will be charged?
Although I'm the idiot for actually paying $100 for a pre-order that only cost $75... for this POS game.
Comments
I don't know. I am done with this topic for sure. I care because I like the game. But even that answer that "they don't plan to charge people who don't want to play" leaves them with the option of saying "all you have to do is cancel"
My guess is that someone is doing their billing / account creation etc. and they truly don't know but are finding out and working on some way to fix it.
Same as the game. I give them the benefit of the doubt for intentions. . just not the ability to always be able to implement or fix it in a timely manner.
Why is it worth discussing. Because (A) If they don't know how it will work and they planned on releaseing last month. . . that looks bad for their ability to stay on top of all the aspects of what makes a MMO work.
(B) I like the game and want it to succeed. It is okay to say we are a small group and making the game for a niche market. That is fine, but you should clearly state that in the main page of your site then. Not have a "buy now" button. You can't offer a game to the masses and not expect to deal with the lowest common denominator. Yes some people will not like the game because it is "niche" . . but the billing system shouldn't be.
Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!
So not only is MO a sandbox, and it gives pre-orders a "sandbox art book", but now even the billing system is a sandbox. The only billing system of any mmo where *you*, the player, get to make your own predictions on what will happen on that date.
If you stand VERY still, and close your eyes, after a minute you can actually FEEL the universe revolving around PvP.
I don't think they are "trolls" as they don't fit into the proper definition of trolling.Trolls don't give a rats ass about a topic, they post only to provoke. That's not what I am seeing, more so they just like to point out the negative points about MO. That's not really trolling.
I try and be polite when I question one of their posts. However at the same time, this thread is an example of their inability to reason on the subject of MO. Their minds are made up, everything this company does is just plain unethical to them. I'm not even saying they shoudn't feel that way, I'm only saying they shouldn't expect everyone to feel the same way. Some of us like to base our opinions on facts, not conjecture.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Thanks for the info OP. This prompted me to check my account and, believe it or not, I was set to automatically renew! I haven't played the game, nor logged into my account, for quite some time. So SV is defaulting its users to agree to something without the users' knowledge. For some reason, I expected this from SV. Everything else just seems like a scam from this POS company.
You can't use the tools if you don't know they exist...
http://www.ic3.gov - Internet Crime Complaint Center - Report cyber crimes to the FBI.
http://www.spamcop.net - SpamCop.net - Report spam and scam emails.
http://www.networksolutions.com/whois/ - Network Solutions WHOIS - Investigate and reveal suspcious websites.
OK... Facts pertaining to the issue:
#1 This issue has existed for MONTHS. The first thread I know of is found here from Jan (It starts as purely related to The "free month" but then goes on to include the auto subscribing of pre-order folks who never agreed. http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/30465-choosing-when-free-month-starts.html
#2 The game was slated to go live at the end of March.. this was confirmed mid March. It was pushed back due to technical issues with desync on March 29th. Next part is not a fact but common sense says that 3 days before release a company should know who they plan to bill. Still no clarification issued at that point.
#3 This thread is created. Many people read and for the first time are alerted to the possibility that SV will be doing this. Threads are opened on the official forums asking for clarification. Days go by with no response.
#4 Not a fact.. more of a substantiated rumor as confirmed in his message a day or so later. Maerlyn states on IRC that he is aware of the issue but doesn't have an answer. He has informed "management" and hopes to have an answer soon.
#5 Maerlyn posts yesterday stating that he hopes to have an official response next week
#6 The actually have a Customer Service guy named "Shady"... Somewhat not relevant but when the guy ducking your questions or only indirectly answering them is named "Shady" it doesn't help the situation.
Now.. there is nothing really left to discuss until this Press Release is sent out on Monday. It just seems very strange that a simply Yes/No question has taken weeks to answer and will eventually be done via a Press Release... Again, not a "fact" but I don't think it's really a stretch to assume that there would be no answer and no Press Release if it wasn't for this thread.
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
Im happy the thread helped!!!
I win!!! LOL@U
As I said about 10 pages ago, starting the thread for awareness is fine. As anyone would want to know something like this possibly may happen. You as well as I know, there's a lot more going on in this thread than that.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Where I work as a Manager I am constantly having to explain things in the simplest of terms so my coworkers can understand what I want done. So here I go:
When MO was purchased on Pre-order/Paid Beta (LOL what!?) SV took the CC info from those purchases and linked them to accounts MUCH LATER than the initial purchase WITHOUT AUTHORIZATION FROM THE PURCHASER! Can't legally do that. It's stupid besides that anyway. SV should not make an assumption that the person buying the game will also A: play it themselves B: use the same CC to pay for sub. Bad SV! Everything else doesn't matter. Just that. Regardless of whether or not anyone has been charged yet it's still wrong. Doesn't take a Legally Blond Poster to throw up legalise to muddy the waters. You can't link ANY CC INFO TO AN ACCOUNT WITHOUT AUTHORIZATION FROM THE PURCHASER! Simple as that.
Now if I got my facts wrong I am sorry in advance. But that looks like what is being attempted.
BTW I'm in a hurry so if I made any spelling mistakes then please crucify me after I get home from work. TIA!
Bartoni's Law definition: As an Internet discussion grows volatile, the probability of a comparison involving Donald Trump approaches 1.
Response from MO forums from Andreas Springare (Level Designer):
Talked to Henrik about this and not entirely sure what he said. Something about that there was something when the system was first launched. But he said that he are going to send out a a press release or something soon to clear things out.
I'm not sure when but should be in a day or to.
I must clarify that we do not intend to charge people that do not want to play the game. So I believe that all this is just one big misunderstanding. I don't know how it works so just wait for Henrik's statement.
http://www.twitch.tv/got_game_tv/ (livestream)
The War Z Shenanigans(youtube)
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Doesn't know how it works????? Wow talk about clueless regarding the simple things in life.
Glad you posted this OP, checked and I was auto subbed also. Got the game back in Block B and NEVER signed up for any sub package. In fact I don't remember them ever stating oficially back in July what the monthly cost would be, so who in their right mind would have agreed to that BS?
A press release?? Yeah right, more like an arse covering spin written by some low value hack posing as a CEO.
If you check about 13 posts ago, you'll notice that Andreas Springare is a level designer. As such, his job is to design areas within the game, not to understand their billing system. He just happens to be working on the weekend and decided to address this. A press release is the best means of putting out information officially.
It is nice to see that the topic I started is actually getting people to turn off their auto subscriptions.
Anything LESS than turning it off globally is nothing short of a total scam by SV. They cannot enter your subscription FOR you, they cannot make you cancel -- they have to give you the option of doing it in the first place.
The comment by Andreas is meaningless really, because this issue has been out there for a while now, people are hotly debating it, and the best we can do is get Maerlyn to say "I'm looking into it" and for a level designer to say "oh, that's not what we mean!"
Just imagine when this game goes live -- severe problems will have the same amount of attention given and a similar response time. And this is supposed to be a 24/7 MMO, right? We already had confirmation multiple times that people will be FORCED to cancel before the month is out, so seeing SV's unethical behavior is plain and simple. It's funny and sad to see how many people just accepted point blank what some level designer said, when their own statements only weeks before this whole incident showed they had full intention to charge customers without warning or their knowledge. The only thing that can be done now is to backtrack from this position and turn it off for everybody globally -- and hope they resubscribe.
Obviously, my opinion is that they did this because they simply knew almost nobody was going to resubscribe after the first month, and this is how they'd get a bunch of subscription fees from people other than fanboys in order to keep the game afloat. Henrik's dad seems to have sold all his stock in order to delay the launch, so SV is running on thin ice. This is what happens when you find that the "Blizzard" method of developing games is not for you (you know, a standard) and when you try to make a Ferrari after you made a soap box racer. But that's just my opinion. The rest of SV's unethical behavior and shady business practices speak for themselves.
In essence, by making this post, you saved me money. Thank you. Not sure how much, because I have no idea how much SV is charging for a monthly sub. Who knows, maybe they signed me up for a 1 year sub. That's the issue, THEY signed me up for a subscription to their game. Illegal? Yes. SV very simply failed. And for them to claim "ignorance" doesn't help their situation. They are learning a very important lesson in how not to treat their customers.
You can't use the tools if you don't know they exist...
http://www.ic3.gov - Internet Crime Complaint Center - Report cyber crimes to the FBI.
http://www.spamcop.net - SpamCop.net - Report spam and scam emails.
http://www.networksolutions.com/whois/ - Network Solutions WHOIS - Investigate and reveal suspcious websites.
We're all aware that the concern lies in the fact that (seemingly) people who pre-ordered are automatically signed up for a recurring subscription.
What has yet to be established so far is whether or not this was an error, a planned scam, a place holder page that meant nothing etc... We do not know any of this, because SV has not addressed it.
Is that the sum of it? Yes, we established all of this by page 2.
The reason this thread has turned out this way is because none of this has been established as FACT. outside of the webpage that showed users as "Renew".
The reason there is confusion on this issue is because according to some they do not have an active subscription model in place (supposedly) which will not be active until SV considers the game "gone gold". Only then will people be signing up as subscribers. According to SV you have to pick a sub (1 month, 6 month, 12 month) before you will be considered a subsciber. Which if true means the auto "renew" issue means nothing at present.
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Their own customer support agent already said that you have to actively cancel the renewal in order for you not to be charged. That's a *fact*.
Now if they do an about-face on it, that's a good thing for all of us as consumers because you don't have this unethical company being able to get away with this kind of behavior and rip people off, as they INTENDED TO DO. Again -- it's a fact they wanted to rip people off. It's established. The debate for the last bunch of pages has been mostly in defense of SV from the fans who would never admonish them, and then counters from people who look at the facts and say, WTF are they thinking? And a lot of "thanks" for saving them the hassle and money of playing this terrible piece of programming.
Well I agree if they planned on doing this it is good, people know about it. I have been waiting to see the end result. Got a link to that btw wanna read it myself, about the cancel thing ?
What this means is the earlier statements being quoted were lies, (the subscription model issue) right? Why is that not a bigger issue? As a few pages back this was the big point being argued. When was this proven to be false, I was gone a few days obviously?
For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson
Here's a link to where the proof is:
http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/38049-when-cancel-subscription-option-going-available.html#post784844
"Hi!
After MO goes gold, the option to cancel your subscription will be available at your account page.
Best regards,
Star Vault support"
And here:
http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/38415-sv-planning-charge-us-monthly-even-when-not-got-game-installed.html#post789391
"Update:
The possibility to cancel your subscription is now, since yesterday, available when you log in to your account. Just choose "do not renew" and then "update", and no further charges will be made from your account.
Best regards,
Star Vault support"
Starvault did not want anyone discussing this on their site, the moderators completely erased the thread on the Mo forums:
http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/40170-more-mmorpg-com-lies.html
Was this the first post of that thread ?
Calidor
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Can a mod go over there and put them to rest:
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cf...-behavior.html
They are making the ridiculous assertion that people who bought Mortal back in July and never even signed up for a subscription will be charged monthly once it goes live. Even if they quit 8 months ago.
Can someone with posting privileges there please go and explain that this would never happen...
If so, it got merged, not deleted. http://www.mortalonline.com/forums/38415-sv-planning-charge-us-monthly-even-when-not-got-game-installed.html Either way, it pretty clearly demonstrates that they are allowing discussion of the topic.
It's almost Wednesday in Sweden, and we've yet to hear a single comment or update about this fiasco.
In my head though, I am laughing with the "I told you so" line ringing...
Henrik has been online pretty frequently as well, so it's not like he hasn't had enough time to address it.
He who keeps his cool best wins.
My guess is that they are going to ignore it, and instead the next big announcement from Henrik will be an update to MO, and everybody will forget about this topic.
Then when they bill people on a recurring basis without them knowing, they will say "Oh! Our bad! You can email us for a refund!"
And we already know how good their customer support is. And at that point -- they will already have your money.
Hmm.. On Sat a dev said they would send out an announcement in a day or two..
Well.. it's now Thursday in Sweden. Wonder what the holdup could be...
Just chalk it up to the wonderful level of communication from SV (Looks live their CM has gone back into hiding after his sudden outburst of posting on Saturday). At least they are consistent !!
All time classic MY NEW FAVORITE POST! (Keep laying those bricks)
"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator
Proudly wearing the Harbinger badge since Dec 23, 2017.
Coined the phrase "Role-Playing a Development Team" January 2018
"Oddly Slap is the main reason I stay in these forums." - Mystichaze April 9th 2018
I believe my prediction may pan out to be right.
This is hilariously sad.
ROFL I bought my block A pre-order on Ebay. So does that mean if I leave Autorenew checked then the poor SOB that originally ordered it will be charged?
Although I'm the idiot for actually paying $100 for a pre-order that only cost $75... for this POS game.