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No PvP = Bad Game
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Can't speak for where you live but around here Best Buy, CompUSA, EB Games and Circuit City have EQ, EQ2, SWG, L2, UO, DAOC, And lately AC's been on the shelf at CompUSA again. All side by side.
Top shelves my eye. Do you even have a clue what you're talking about? I have never seen EQ singled out on a 'top shelf' away from the other MMORPG's. Most places that sell video games group them together by category kinda sorta. At least around here.
Unlike some folks I don't keep magazines laying around once I read them. They go in the good ol' trash can. So unfortunately I can't scan 'em for you. But I specifically remember the add for L2 because *gasp* that's how I found out about it a couple years ago. I was in the beta for it because of an article about it in PC Gamer and I remember seeing the adds when it was getting close to release. There was an add for it recently in PC Gamer as well.... don't remember which month it was though.
QFE
I am amazed that such an idiotic OP has spawned such a violent rhetorical back and forth. I guess that's what message boards are for :-/
I don't want to write this, and you don't want to read it. But now it's too late for both of us.
I'd just like to say not all us PVPer's as as dumb as the OP.
Thanks.
I'm disappointed in this thread. I'm an avid PvP'er, and I avoid games that don't contain open PvP. Why am I posting here? ..Because it caught my eye as the most active thread.
What annoys me most, is the general concensus in regards to PvP'ers by those of you who are seemingly anti-PvP. While there is a fair share that are immature, annoying, and straight up mind-numbingly ignorant, the PvP'ers posting here far from represent the entire PvP community. Although I'm sure it's easy for you to come to that conclusion, coupled with your obvious bad experiences in open PvP MMORPG's. You get ganked once, the person acts like an asshole, and suddenly that's your conclusion about all of us.
Personally, I wouldn't step foot into EQ2. For one, my NCOIC plays it. Two, it doesn't have PvP. But I won't call it a bad game, because obviously it's fun for some of you. As a PvP player, I do understand that there are those out there that don't like open PvP. I also strongly disagree that if there's no PvP, then you're not truly interacting and there's no point in even playing it online. It can be fun to group up and go into some dungeon and kill an AI boss. For some people that's what it's all about, just not me.
Another thing I feel I should mention, is that some of you posting your hatred toward PvP and PvP'ers as a whole are acting far more immature than those you're referencing. To be honest, the most immature and flame-filled encounter I've ever had in an MMORPG was with someone who was anti-PvP and pro-PvE. I mean the person wanted to kill me in real life because I destroyed his pixelated body. While it was extremely amusing, it was also very pathetic.
Next time you choose to bash PvP in the name of RP, or vice versa ..remember that both sides have their fair share of nimrods, and that neither style is more right than the other outside of personal preference.
In the end, you will have your fun in EQ2, and I will have mine in 'Dark and Light' and in 'Darkfall' ..when (if) they release.
Shadow of Apophis - Council Member
Quote, "There is hardly any skill in PvPs overall. PvP are ultimately decided by tactics, exploiting your class advantage over others; using certain weapons that give you a distinct advantage over most, if not all classes and exploiting bugs. Guild War is a primary example of people using tactics, not skill, to beat other class. (Spike Groups just require you to aim for the same target.), WoW's Shaman can kite/snare you to death with it's spell, proving exploiting your class gives you a huge advantage over others. A axe wielding warrior in WoW is example of how using certain weapons gives you a big advantage over those who don't since investing in axe attribute allows you to critical hit often. And exploiting bugs like the rumored "End of the World" bug in Halo 2 pretty much destroys all game. (End of the World bug allows players to float outside of the virtual sphere, allowing players to stand in thin air making them difficult to target and giving players a huge sniping advantage.)
There no doubt about it, there is no skill in PvP, if you can easily cheat to win and cheater only prove they aren't badasses, but dumbasses for ruining the game with exploits and cheats."
With the except of Guild Wars, intelligent people play PvE and morons PvP.
how do you balance classes for PVP and PVE? you really cant without gimping one or the other. PVP and PVE are best left apart.
Notice that games with PvP are the ones that do a LOT of nerfing to classes. PvPers are more likely to whine about how unfair another class advantage is over them resulting in unfair nerfs.
EQ2 is failing in comparison to other MMORPGs...
http://mmogchart.com/Chart1.html
SOE sold out and is now allowing ingame stuff to be sold on their site + no PvP = tanking game and by tanking... I mean failing
Is that how come 95% of almost everyones characters in wow are spent doing.. pve... is that why even though you play on a high/medium population server you still get long load times because nobody your level wants to pvp either on your side or the other.... Is that how come they force you to do endless hours of high level instance grinding for your final "OMGWTFBBQ" gear.
and if you werent so blockheaded you would know that eq2 is getting pvp......
And sephin stop spamming
Can't speak for where you live but around here Best Buy, CompUSA, EB Games and Circuit City have EQ, EQ2, SWG, L2, UO, DAOC, And lately AC's been on the shelf at CompUSA again. All side by side.
Top shelves my eye. Do you even have a clue what you're talking about? I have never seen EQ singled out on a 'top shelf' away from the other MMORPG's. Most places that sell video games group them together by category kinda sorta. At least around here.
Unlike some folks I don't keep magazines laying around once I read them. They go in the good ol' trash can. So unfortunately I can't scan 'em for you. But I specifically remember the add for L2 because *gasp* that's how I found out about it a couple years ago. I was in the beta for it because of an article about it in PC Gamer and I remember seeing the adds when it was getting close to release. There was an add for it recently in PC Gamer as well.... don't remember which month it was though.
At the walmarts I go to EQ is on the bottom shelf atm, and WoW is mixed in with a bunch of other stuff in the middle.
At the Gamestop I go to EQ II is mixed in with everything else and WoW is still kept behind the counter I think (but then again so was MxO). The next time I hit gamestop I will axe the guys about this and see what they say.
- Scaris
"What happened to you, Star Wars Galaxies? You used to look like Leia. Not quite gold bikini Leia (more like bad-British-accent-and-cinnamon-bun-hair Leia), but still Leia nonetheless. Now you look like Chewbacca." - Computer Gaming World
Bull, most everyone here has made comments at some time or another that not all PvP'ers are greifers and gankers. The topic has come up time and time again and its been noted that there are plenty of good decent PvP'ers. However, its also been noted time and time again that it only takes a few jerks to mess it up for everyone. So until a game company can come up with a solution for the jerk factor full open PvP will never be mainstream viable. So quit trying to make it out like everyone is saying all PvP'ers are jerks and gankers.
And I hate to break it to ya sport, but if you killed that person you were referring to in your last paragraph in UO I will tell you exactly why he was upset. because you stole time from him that he paid money for. Not because you killed him.
- Scaris
"What happened to you, Star Wars Galaxies? You used to look like Leia. Not quite gold bikini Leia (more like bad-British-accent-and-cinnamon-bun-hair Leia), but still Leia nonetheless. Now you look like Chewbacca." - Computer Gaming World
Plain fact concerning PvPer = ganker statements. There are more than a just a few jerks. If there was just one or two here or there, they would not be a problem. Solution to that problem is simple, mass > ganker. However, this is not the case. Gankers don't run solo or even in small groups. They zerg hunting grounds or whatever happens to be the point of interest in the area and kill people who are lower than half their level or are in small groups. I've been playing MMOs since EQ and this has been true in every PvP game I have participated in. I've never played UO but from what I have heard, I don't think I would want to waste my time or the ulcer on it.
To date, they only equally fun PvP/PvE game released and being successful is DAoC. You want to PvE, fine, there are a ton of places you can go without need to worry about ganking greifers coming around to piss in your cheerios. You want to PvP, there is a place to go there too. They even have places you can PvP and PvE, for those daring people who want to risk xp loss.
BTW, something I found rather funny in Shadowbane and L2. Most of the griefing jerks aren't these 12 to 15 year old people we like to put that picture to. They simply act that old but are really mid 20 to mid 30.
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Control is an illusion!
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Control is an illusion!
I like PvP in certain aspects. I have to say though, that most people who say this do not mean what they are saying. PvP, person vs person, not person vs AI1 AI2 AI3 Person. PvP, person vs person, not person vs person1 person2 person3 ..... person50.
You want a statistic concerning PvP and online gaming? How many MMO's can you list that are totally PvE. And I do mean totally. No option to turn it on or off, just straight out PvE. The next question to ask is, how many of those you just listed actually were successful. I personally can name none. Even EQ and EQ2 have dualling and EQ has/had pvp servers.
The "People want to pvp" statement is fundamentally true. Even the gamer looking for social digital interaction, at some point, wants to see how well they are doing, compared to other gamers. It's human nature to be competitive. Otherwise we would have ceased to exist as the head of the evolutionary ladder.
Now that I have beaten your comment about the head and shoulders with statistical fact and psycho analysis, let me just add. True, every gamer who signs onto a MMO wants to have competition in some form. However, being randomly digitally raped by XxXWTFPwnzordj00XxX because he wants to turn PvP into "I'm gonna force you to play this way because I want to" is not cool. I think that is where the meat of the subject is at.
The gaming industry in general is your statistical fact. As I stated, how many MMO games are PvE only and successful? None. Want a list of successful PvP games?
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look in the left panel.
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Control is an illusion!
The three biggest mmorps subscriber wize are as follows:
Lineage 2
World of Warcraft
Lineage
You cant say wow is a PvE game you dummy, even on the PvE servers they have PLENTY of PvP. EQ2 is a pure PvE game, therfor it will never be as successful as those three.
_____________________
I am the flipside of the coin on which the troll and the fanboy are but one side.
The three biggest mmorps subscriber wize are as follows:
Lineage 2
World of Warcraft
Lineage
You cant say wow is a PvE game you dummy, even on the PvE servers they have PLENTY of PvP. EQ2 is a pure PvE game, therfor it will never be as successful as those three.
What do you mean I can't. Is that not what the server is PvE? It is first and foremost PvE ONLY! Yes you can PvP but if I never PvP then it is PvE only. I played a few of my characters to level 60 with not one PvP encounter.
The reason there has not been a successful PvE only MMO is because no big developer has made one good enough (besides EQII which is pretty decent). Hopefully D&D Online will fix this but we will have to wait and see. It is hard because instead of PvP'ing players will actually have to play the game and not others.
We need to get back on topic too. No PvP does not make a bad game the developer does. It is all individual opinion anyways.
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Control is an illusion!
Ok, I can play your game as well. You state that every gamer wants PvP of some type. You back this up with the 'statistical fact' that there are no successful purely PvE games.
Alright, by this same token I can say that the only reason most games implement some form of PvP is because there is always that vocal minority of fans for any game that will demand PvP be included. Now are they really the minority, though? I cannot prove that, just as you cannot prove that the pro-PvP advocates for any given game are the majority.
My point is that there are a large number of people that like PvP, and an equally large number of people that enjoy PvE and want nothing to do with PvP. To state that everyone wants PvP of some form is a rather ignorant statement. By your logic, the only reason a game like EQ2 has 280,000+ subs is because all of those people are anxiously waiting for PvP to be implemented, and don't really care for the PvE at all.
Deleted
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Control is an illusion!
PVP is not an essential part of MMO's.
There, thats about as responsive as your first post.
http://www.greycouncil.org/
PVP is not an essential part of MMO's.
There, thats about as responsive as your first post.
lol! Nice one.
- Scaris
"What happened to you, Star Wars Galaxies? You used to look like Leia. Not quite gold bikini Leia (more like bad-British-accent-and-cinnamon-bun-hair Leia), but still Leia nonetheless. Now you look like Chewbacca." - Computer Gaming World