I will be disappointed if they have fast travel in the same manner as the fast travel in GW2.
I enjoyed the travel in EQ1, it made the world feel big.
In GW2, the cost for the portal travel is a joke, it's so low it doesn't even make it hard to decide to use it or not, you will always use it. It makes the world feel very very small.
I would prefer they have boats ala EQ1, wizard and druid travel.
Insta travel - no matter how large and seamless your world is, makes the world feel small.
-Briz
I agree...the travel is a part of the adventure, too many ista travels ruin the feeling of exploration and make the world too small.
What is stopping you from traveling even if there are fast travel mechanics?
I already know the answer. "I dont want the temptation/I want people to play the same way I play."
It always comes down to "I want others to enjoy the game how I do" a lot of people are greedy consumers. Some people only have a few hours to kill. They dont want to spend 3/4 of it traveling, and the other 1/4 of their free time drinking after every single mob/actual gameplay.
Are you going to say "If they only can play 3 hours a day they shouldnt play at all?" That isnt a good marketing strategy for SOE when they have said their future is relying on EQN being a successful game.
What is a common trend for 3 of the biggest multi player games in the world right now? Call of Duty, League of Legends, World of Warcaft. Have an hour or two to kill? You can with those games. You can also play those games for 12 hours and benefit more than someone who plays for 2.
And even look at the growing sensation of cell phone games. On a break? Play your cell phone game. Wanna sit on the couch/in a comfy chair? Play your cell phone game.
I don't see how 3 hours is only 3 hours. 3 hours of playing is a LOT.
You and I both see it that way, but there were plenty of people on the earlier pages of this thread who think 3 hours should be the time it takes you to travel between towns.
People are incorrect if they think this game will not be the second coming of MMOs.
Lets face some facts here.
1. There has never been a modern day MMORPG that did open world sandbox correctly.
2. You have never been able to set fire to the forests in an MMORPG.
3. There have been only a small handful of full MMORPG's where you had as much building and destruction upon the lands.
4. This IS Everquest franchise so EXPECT to be amazed by the sheer number of choices you have in the game compared to most others.
5. Be ready to NOT get your hand held and guided through quest hubs to kill scripted encounters that never change. This is NOT a Theme Park game.
6. Be ready for a very deep system of factions between other players and npc's that inhabit the lands.
Most WoW, LoL, Rift players are coming from theme parks and will be shocked when they find out how sandbox games work. They will be sad there is no EZmode and quit after they don't get the hand holding they have been used to all these recent years.
Fast Travel will probably be either player made (sandbox style) or very sparse. Also player spells.
Okay, I have this CRAZY idea how to solve this fast travel dilemma in EQN. If the game has a very large seamless world, why not give the gamers the tools to build teleportation/magic gates if they choose to do so? However, building the gates is not easy and they are DESTRUCTIBLE.
Now we have this feature in the game, think of all the possibilities in a faction-based hybrid PVP/PVE world. If some of the gamers want fast travel, more power to them. Vice verse for those who hates fast travel.
So for the peple saying it would be too much time to travel to a dungeon:
playing the game what to spend up your time. if there was a teleport everywhere from a to b to c then people would use those to get to the dungeon.
ok.
so after the dungeon, then what?.
look what i'm just saying is: why do people say they don't want to waste time traveling, THAT'S THE FUN OF IT.
if you ever did for the horde in wow it was extremely fun to go and get the boat,then walk/ground mount yourself instead of flying or use teleporters, and if it was the teeleports you would be using you would just be in the main city doing nothing.
the point of an mmo is that its always changing, your always out on adventure. not in the main city just flying around bored.
i'm just saying why do people whine about the time it would take to travel....
I like GW2s and Rift's method. There are portals throughout but getting from one to another is a challenge. Though I like the additinal step of removing mounts as in GW2, thus making portal to portal very hazardous to your health at later levels.
I hate "speed racing" travel. I see no point in wasting my time by showing me a creature move from one place to another.
It wasn't the voce acting that hurt STar Wars, it was the travel methods. They were slow and horrendous.
If you want to turn off most gamers, tell them it will take an hour or two on occasion to play with family and friends.
well clearly it would all depend on how the big/small/etc the world itself is.
We could start the old fashion EQ way with a few classes able to cast run speed modifiers. Then introduce player made portals. After this at higher level you can also pay a few classes to bind a location in the game to a stone and that will enable any class to have several stones labled for various favorite spots in backpack or on a belt and use the stored charges on the stone to port to location. These stones would start with maybe only a 10 charge limit before needing recharge from a certain class. As character levels advance you can use higher charge stones.
So basically mounts would never need to be introduced and player interdependence along with economy will be preserved.
The stones idea comes from Ultima Online using rune stones to bind a location to it and then being able to get around using these stones, but it really does make sense and sounds like alot of fun for players to be in control of such things.
yeah that sounds great.
and the other thing is reaching some type of max level and getting it unlocked.
Which group do you think is larger, the group that wants the game like EQ1, or the group that plays 3 hours a day?
Again, I am not in favor of one way or the other, but from a business strategy standpoint, there is no way I'm shunning the majority of the MMORPG base.
Everquest 1 came out in 1999... Everquest 1 came out in 1999...
When I come home from work and have 2 hours to invest into a game Im interested in gameplay. Travel is not gameplay.
So to all you that remain online 24/7 feel free to travel for hours on end just don't drag me along into your chores.
Applies the same to LFG spamming or trade channel auctioning. I'm fine if you find joy in all of the above and have time to waste for such activities just don't DEMAND it's like that for everyone else.
Then continue playing Gnome Wankers 2 or whatever the fast travel game there is for you atm,there are multitudes of them. In saying that i am pretty sure EQN will have fast travel
If it's anything like they size of PS2 you will NEED fast travel in some form, or it will literally take all day to walk to where your going. Hopefully in a limited way like PS2.
As for flying mounts, I hope they never put them in game because that was one of the biggest mistakes in wow. Sadly they probably will have them because the engine allows for it
It should take all day. The object is to isolate people from the vast majority of the rest of the world. That is how you keep the populace dispersed so as not to crowd areas.
People are incorrect if they think this game will not be the second coming of MMOs.
Lets face some facts here.
1. There has never been a modern day MMORPG that did open world sandbox correctly.
2. You have never been able to set fire to the forests in an MMORPG.
3. There have been only a small handful of full MMORPG's where you had as much building and destruction upon the lands.
4. This IS Everquest franchise so EXPECT to be amazed by the sheer number of choices you have in the game compared to most others.
5. Be ready to NOT get your hand held and guided through quest hubs to kill scripted encounters that never change. This is NOT a Theme Park game.
6. Be ready for a very deep system of factions between other players and npc's that inhabit the lands.
Most WoW, LoL, Rift players are coming from theme parks and will be shocked when they find out how sandbox games work. They will be sad there is no EZmode and quit after they don't get the hand holding they have been used to all these recent years.
Fast Travel will probably be either player made (sandbox style) or very sparse. Also player spells.
you seem to have much more informationon what this game is and what's in ti than anyone else on the planet...even Smedley!!!
I do not like SOE's reaction at all. Sure sounds like they are going to permit insta travel. Insta travel makes an otherwise virtual game world feel like a lobby game.
Originally posted by Fangrim Gnome Wankers 2
ROFL!
Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon. In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
I do not like SOE's reaction at all. Sure sounds like they are going to permit insta travel. Insta travel makes an otherwise virtual game world feel like a lobby game.
Originally posted by Fangrim Gnome Wankers 2
ROFL!
Well if they make traveling fun, interesting and rewarding, then you can always choose to not use the fast travel, and then the fast travel will be there so people can link up with their friends in a hurry when needed.
The key though is exactly what I said. Simply saying "Just don't use it" is not the solution. The solution is to make people want to travel because interesting and rewarding things happen along the way that makes the traveling a part of the game experience, not just a barrier/time sink between experiences.
If they do that, then you probably wouldn't even want to use the fast travel except in rare situations. This would make the world feel like a world, improve the game drastically and still offer instant travel.
Remember, EQ had fast travel, and you won't ever hear anyone complain that EQ's world felt small or like a lobby.
It can go either way, just saying.... it's all on the delivery.
I do not like SOE's reaction at all. Sure sounds like they are going to permit insta travel. Insta travel makes an otherwise virtual game world feel like a lobby game.
Originally posted by Fangrim Gnome Wankers 2
ROFL!
Well if they make traveling fun, interesting and rewarding, then you can always choose to not use the fast travel, and then the fast travel will be there so people can link up with their friends in a hurry when needed.
The key though is exactly what I said. Simply saying "Just don't use it" is not the solution. The solution is to make people want to travel because interesting and rewarding things happen along the way that makes the traveling a part of the game experience, not just a barrier/time sink between experiences.
If they do that, then you probably wouldn't even want to use the fast travel except in rare situations. This would make the world feel like a world, improve the game drastically and still offer instant travel.
Remember, EQ had fast travel, and you won't ever hear anyone complain that EQ's world felt small or like a lobby.
It can go either way, just saying.... it's all on the delivery.
Actually there were quite a few complaints once PoP launched that the PoK stones did exactly that. Shrunk the world and really hurt the world feel of the game.
I'm for fast travel, but how it was done pre-PoP. Druid / Wizard ports and maybe something like the Luclin ports in something that goes every 15 minutes. Anything like GW2 or most of the games now would really hurt I think.
Played: EQ1 (10 Years), Guild Wars, Rift, TERA Tried: EQ2, Vanguard, Lord of the Rings Online, Dungeons and Dragons Online, Runes of Magic and countless others... Currently Playing: GW2
I personally don't mind spending a lot of time traveling and i'm not a big fan of fast travel. I realise i'm a minority though and that most people don't want to waste their time running around / sitting on a ship or whatnot.
I do not like SOE's reaction at all. Sure sounds like they are going to permit insta travel. Insta travel makes an otherwise virtual game world feel like a lobby game.
Originally posted by Fangrim Gnome Wankers 2
ROFL!
Well if they make traveling fun, interesting and rewarding, then you can always choose to not use the fast travel, and then the fast travel will be there so people can link up with their friends in a hurry when needed.
The key though is exactly what I said. Simply saying "Just don't use it" is not the solution. The solution is to make people want to travel because interesting and rewarding things happen along the way that makes the traveling a part of the game experience, not just a barrier/time sink between experiences.
If they do that, then you probably wouldn't even want to use the fast travel except in rare situations. This would make the world feel like a world, improve the game drastically and still offer instant travel.
Remember, EQ had fast travel, and you won't ever hear anyone complain that EQ's world felt small or like a lobby.
It can go either way, just saying.... it's all on the delivery.
Actually there were quite a few complaints once PoP launched that the PoK stones did exactly that. Shrunk the world and really hurt the world feel of the game.
I'm for fast travel, but how it was done pre-PoP. Druid / Wizard ports and maybe something like the Luclin ports in something that goes every 15 minutes. Anything like GW2 or most of the games now would really hurt I think.
I played from day 1 launch in 1999 and stopped playing a few months and left slightly before PoP came out. Travel wasn't an issue up until then.
Skyrim lets you fast travel from any place on the map, to any visited location, and it's one of the highest rated and best selling RPGs. The key though is that Skyrim's travel is fun. Getting attacked by dragons, running into a fight between a two factions, getting asked for help and then being lead into an ambush, etc. It makes traveling fun and worth doing, so even if you could fast travel, often times you choose not to.
Not saying EQN need to be as extreme as Skyrim or GW2 on the fast travel. Just saying that if you make the world worth exploring, then having fast travel in the game is just a bonus to use when you need it.
I do not like SOE's reaction at all. Sure sounds like they are going to permit insta travel. Insta travel makes an otherwise virtual game world feel like a lobby game.
Originally posted by Fangrim Gnome Wankers 2
ROFL!
Well if they make traveling fun, interesting and rewarding, then you can always choose to not use the fast travel, and then the fast travel will be there so people can link up with their friends in a hurry when needed.
The key though is exactly what I said. Simply saying "Just don't use it" is not the solution. The solution is to make people want to travel because interesting and rewarding things happen along the way that makes the traveling a part of the game experience, not just a barrier/time sink between experiences.
If they do that, then you probably wouldn't even want to use the fast travel except in rare situations. This would make the world feel like a world, improve the game drastically and still offer instant travel.
Remember, EQ had fast travel, and you won't ever hear anyone complain that EQ's world felt small or like a lobby.
It can go either way, just saying.... it's all on the delivery.
Actually there were quite a few complaints once PoP launched that the PoK stones did exactly that. Shrunk the world and really hurt the world feel of the game.
I'm for fast travel, but how it was done pre-PoP. Druid / Wizard ports and maybe something like the Luclin ports in something that goes every 15 minutes. Anything like GW2 or most of the games now would really hurt I think.
I wouldn't know. I played from day 1 launch in 1999 and stopped playing a few months after SoL launched when I joined the Army.
Skyrim lets you fast travel from any place on the map, to any visited location, and it's one of the highest rated and best selling RPGs. The key though is that Skyrim's travel is fun. Getting attacked by dragons, running into a fight between a two factions, getting asked for help and then being lead into an ambush, etc. It makes traveling fun and worth doing, so even if you could fast travel, often times you choose not to.
Not saying EQN need to be as extreme as Skyrim or GW2 on the fast travel. Just saying that if you make the world worth exploring, then having fast travel in the game is just a bonus to use when you need it.
It helps in Skyrim that, even though you're "fast traveling", the world is still going on as you do it. Time passes, NPCs do their thing, everything still happens while you travel. It's not the same in a persistant world like an MMO with many others around, which is why fast travel needs to be limited and not just in everyone's back pocket all the time.
I loved in EQ that traveling was more thought out and planned. If I was going to make a trip to Kunark from Greater Faydark when I was ready, I made sure I was leveled up enough, grabbed supplies and planned out a few weeks where I was going to hunt. Really made it seemed more adventurous and interesting. I'd look for an outpost or town close by, stop there to familiarize myself with the area and then head out to find a hunting spot. Now there's really no need to do any of that because you just bounce around without any thought at all.
Played: EQ1 (10 Years), Guild Wars, Rift, TERA Tried: EQ2, Vanguard, Lord of the Rings Online, Dungeons and Dragons Online, Runes of Magic and countless others... Currently Playing: GW2
I'm not paying real money every time I want to travel anywhere. I shouldn't need a second mortgage to play a game.
"When people don't know much about something, they tend to fill in the blanks the way they want them to be filled in. They are almost always disappointed." - Will Wright
I do not like SOE's reaction at all. Sure sounds like they are going to permit insta travel. Insta travel makes an otherwise virtual game world feel like a lobby game.
Originally posted by Fangrim Gnome Wankers 2
ROFL!
Well if they make traveling fun, interesting and rewarding, then you can always choose to not use the fast travel, and then the fast travel will be there so people can link up with their friends in a hurry when needed.
The key though is exactly what I said. Simply saying "Just don't use it" is not the solution. The solution is to make people want to travel because interesting and rewarding things happen along the way that makes the traveling a part of the game experience, not just a barrier/time sink between experiences.
If they do that, then you probably wouldn't even want to use the fast travel except in rare situations. This would make the world feel like a world, improve the game drastically and still offer instant travel.
Remember, EQ had fast travel, and you won't ever hear anyone complain that EQ's world felt small or like a lobby.
It can go either way, just saying.... it's all on the delivery.
Actually there were quite a few complaints once PoP launched that the PoK stones did exactly that. Shrunk the world and really hurt the world feel of the game.
I'm for fast travel, but how it was done pre-PoP. Druid / Wizard ports and maybe something like the Luclin ports in something that goes every 15 minutes. Anything like GW2 or most of the games now would really hurt I think.
I wouldn't know. I played from day 1 launch in 1999 and stopped playing a few months after SoL launched when I joined the Army.
Skyrim lets you fast travel from any place on the map, to any visited location, and it's one of the highest rated and best selling RPGs. The key though is that Skyrim's travel is fun. Getting attacked by dragons, running into a fight between a two factions, getting asked for help and then being lead into an ambush, etc. It makes traveling fun and worth doing, so even if you could fast travel, often times you choose not to.
Not saying EQN need to be as extreme as Skyrim or GW2 on the fast travel. Just saying that if you make the world worth exploring, then having fast travel in the game is just a bonus to use when you need it.
It helps in Skyrim that, even though you're "fast traveling", the world is still going on as you do it. Time passes, NPCs do their thing, everything still happens while you travel. It's not the same in a persistant world like an MMO with many others around, which is why fast travel needs to be limited and not just in everyone's back pocket all the time.
I loved in EQ that traveling was more thought out and planned. If I was going to make a trip to Kunark from Greater Faydark when I was ready, I made sure I was leveled up enough, grabbed supplies and planned out a few weeks where I was going to hunt. Really made it seemed more adventurous and interesting. I'd look for an outpost or town close by, stop there to familiarize myself with the area and then head out to find a hunting spot. Now there's really no need to do any of that because you just bounce around without any thought at all.
Regardless of what goes on, or doesn't go on during fast travel, the fast travel serves a purpose many people playing a game want.
My point is that if you make traveling fun* (Remember this is a game and finding the fun is important), then people will have choice. People zipping around with fast travel all the time is not a symptom of fast travel itself. It's a symptom of a boring and lifeless world not worth exploring. Why would anyone want to spend 2 hours holding W when nothing interesting is going to happen in those two hours and there isn't anything to be earned or gain from the travel itself? It just makes people want to get it over with so they can get to the actual game experience. (The dungeon, the raid, the named mob, etc etc)
The key is to promote standard traveling as the most fun and preferred method of traveling, and offer fast travel as a utility to be used by people who need to use it to link up with friends or catch up to a raid or something like that.
In Skyrim, traveling is alive and part of the experience. You run into unique situations that are fun and exciting. Traveling is not a time sink, it's a part of the experience.
I have faith that EQN dev team can make traveling appealing and have fast travel at the same time.
I'm not paying real money every time I want to travel anywhere. I shouldn't need a second mortgage to play a game.
I agree, and so does the dev that was talking about that.
As for how much you pay for a F2P game, it can range from nothing, to hundreds of dollars a month. The way I look at it is that if I spend $60 in the cash shop, and pay $15 a month in the cash shop every month after that, there's no difference from F2P and P2P.
I have yet to play a F2P game where I felt I needed to spend more than this in the cash shop. A few times I think I chose to spend a little bit more ($20 or $25 at the cash shop for the month instead of $15), but it was out of convenience, not necessity.
Originally posted by Gallus85 ...you can always choose to not use the fast travel
Player-imposed limitations have no effect because people will always choose the past of least resistance. As a result, the one person who temporarily chooses to run instead of insta-click will find the game world absolutely barren. He won't bump into any other travelers.
Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon. In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
Originally posted by Gallus85 ...you can always choose to not use the fast travel
Player-imposed limitations have no effect because people will always choose the past of least resistance. As a result, the one person who temporarily chooses to run instead of insta-click will find the game world absolutely barren. He won't bump into any other travelers.
I suggest you re-read the posts I made. You appear to have honed in on one sentence and failed to see how fast travel works without making the world barren.
I also shouldn't to mention that many games had lively and active worlds even with fast travel. GW2 is a recent example that had an extreme amount of fast travel, yet the world was alive with tons of people. Dynamic events would bring people together and the open world rewarded exploration. So you met people all the time.
EQ had fast travel, and people were always running around.
Fast travel is not the problem. The problem is when a game is bad it doesn't reward or promote normal travel or playing in the open world as part of a fun and rewarding experience.
I think fast travel should kinda work like in UO.. In UO, you traveled by rune and runebook, you would buy some blank rune-stones off NPC vendors and you could mark those runes and travel off them if you had the reagents for it or a "recall scroll" which could be found in the game or made by someone with the "inscription" skill, it was also the only way to get runebooks was if a inscribe made them and it made quite a few players money cause if you didn't have the skills you'd have to find a player vendor that would sell them...
You could then use the magery skill to mark runes to anywhere you want to and you'd drop them in runebooks, you'd find players making full runebooks and selling them "this is a runebook to all the dungeons" and so forth..
For non-mages to travel, there was multiple ways to do it, all you needed was a certain amount of intelligence (like 11 or 13) you didn't need magery, just recall scrolls, which scribes would sell off vendors, to make a recall scroll you just had to buy ink and blank scrolls off NPC vendors, I remember always having to keep my runebooks stocked with scrolls to travel and would have several in my pack, I would always have to buy more since I never had a scribe. And you wouldn't always succeed at your spells in the game, they would fizzle as a low level mage, but as you used the skill, it would go up and even at 100.0 magery, you wouldn't always succeed in moongate travel..
Now and days warriors travel with Chivalry in UO which all the skill costs is a bit of gold..
Originally posted by Brizlyn In GW2, the cost for the portal travel is a joke, it's so low it doesn't even make it hard to decide to use it or not, you will always use it. It makes the world feel very very small.
When you hit level 80 fast travel is too expensive. The cost of fast traveling from Lions Arch to Cursed Shore and then back again is like half an hour's worth of farming. It sucked.
Uh, GW2 too expensive travel at 80? I think its at most 3s to go anywhere in the world which would be like 2 greens vendored. One chest event and you make it back plus more. It's not even a hesitation for me if I want to go anywhere, even if it's back and forth a few times checking on events.
Played: EQ1 (10 Years), Guild Wars, Rift, TERA Tried: EQ2, Vanguard, Lord of the Rings Online, Dungeons and Dragons Online, Runes of Magic and countless others... Currently Playing: GW2
:O I wonder if they changed it. I haven't played GW2 in many months and the cost of fast travel at level 80 was something people complained about on the forums. Maybe it was the stupid mechanic of cost increasing based on level, even if you are traveling the same distance.
Comments
You and I both see it that way, but there were plenty of people on the earlier pages of this thread who think 3 hours should be the time it takes you to travel between towns.
People are incorrect if they think this game will not be the second coming of MMOs.
Lets face some facts here.
1. There has never been a modern day MMORPG that did open world sandbox correctly.
2. You have never been able to set fire to the forests in an MMORPG.
3. There have been only a small handful of full MMORPG's where you had as much building and destruction upon the lands.
4. This IS Everquest franchise so EXPECT to be amazed by the sheer number of choices you have in the game compared to most others.
5. Be ready to NOT get your hand held and guided through quest hubs to kill scripted encounters that never change. This is NOT a Theme Park game.
6. Be ready for a very deep system of factions between other players and npc's that inhabit the lands.
Most WoW, LoL, Rift players are coming from theme parks and will be shocked when they find out how sandbox games work. They will be sad there is no EZmode and quit after they don't get the hand holding they have been used to all these recent years.
Fast Travel will probably be either player made (sandbox style) or very sparse. Also player spells.
Okay, I have this CRAZY idea how to solve this fast travel dilemma in EQN. If the game has a very large seamless world, why not give the gamers the tools to build teleportation/magic gates if they choose to do so? However, building the gates is not easy and they are DESTRUCTIBLE.
Now we have this feature in the game, think of all the possibilities in a faction-based hybrid PVP/PVE world. If some of the gamers want fast travel, more power to them. Vice verse for those who hates fast travel.
LOL
So for the peple saying it would be too much time to travel to a dungeon:
playing the game what to spend up your time. if there was a teleport everywhere from a to b to c then people would use those to get to the dungeon.
ok.
so after the dungeon, then what?.
look what i'm just saying is: why do people say they don't want to waste time traveling, THAT'S THE FUN OF IT.
if you ever did for the horde in wow it was extremely fun to go and get the boat,then walk/ground mount yourself instead of flying or use teleporters, and if it was the teeleports you would be using you would just be in the main city doing nothing.
the point of an mmo is that its always changing, your always out on adventure. not in the main city just flying around bored.
i'm just saying why do people whine about the time it would take to travel....
well clearly it would all depend on how the big/small/etc the world itself is.
how the distance/scale/etc works and the speed...
yeah that sounds great.
and the other thing is reaching some type of max level and getting it unlocked.
Then continue playing Gnome Wankers 2 or whatever the fast travel game there is for you atm,there are multitudes of them. In saying that i am pretty sure EQN will have fast travel
It should take all day. The object is to isolate people from the vast majority of the rest of the world. That is how you keep the populace dispersed so as not to crowd areas.
you seem to have much more informationon what this game is and what's in ti than anyone else on the planet...even Smedley!!!
I do not like SOE's reaction at all. Sure sounds like they are going to permit insta travel. Insta travel makes an otherwise virtual game world feel like a lobby game.
ROFL!
Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon.
In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
Well if they make traveling fun, interesting and rewarding, then you can always choose to not use the fast travel, and then the fast travel will be there so people can link up with their friends in a hurry when needed.
The key though is exactly what I said. Simply saying "Just don't use it" is not the solution. The solution is to make people want to travel because interesting and rewarding things happen along the way that makes the traveling a part of the game experience, not just a barrier/time sink between experiences.
If they do that, then you probably wouldn't even want to use the fast travel except in rare situations. This would make the world feel like a world, improve the game drastically and still offer instant travel.
Remember, EQ had fast travel, and you won't ever hear anyone complain that EQ's world felt small or like a lobby.
It can go either way, just saying.... it's all on the delivery.
Legends of Kesmai, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, SB, RO, SWG, EVE, EQ2, CoH, GW, VG:SOH, WAR, Aion, DF, CO, MO, DN, Tera, SWTOR, RO2, DP, GW2, PS2, BnS, NW, FF:XIV, ESO, EQ:NL
Actually there were quite a few complaints once PoP launched that the PoK stones did exactly that. Shrunk the world and really hurt the world feel of the game.
I'm for fast travel, but how it was done pre-PoP. Druid / Wizard ports and maybe something like the Luclin ports in something that goes every 15 minutes. Anything like GW2 or most of the games now would really hurt I think.
Played: EQ1 (10 Years), Guild Wars, Rift, TERA
Tried: EQ2, Vanguard, Lord of the Rings Online, Dungeons and Dragons Online, Runes of Magic and countless others...
Currently Playing: GW2
Nytlok Sylas
80 Sylvari Ranger
I played from day 1 launch in 1999 and stopped playing a few months and left slightly before PoP came out. Travel wasn't an issue up until then.
Skyrim lets you fast travel from any place on the map, to any visited location, and it's one of the highest rated and best selling RPGs. The key though is that Skyrim's travel is fun. Getting attacked by dragons, running into a fight between a two factions, getting asked for help and then being lead into an ambush, etc. It makes traveling fun and worth doing, so even if you could fast travel, often times you choose not to.
Not saying EQN need to be as extreme as Skyrim or GW2 on the fast travel. Just saying that if you make the world worth exploring, then having fast travel in the game is just a bonus to use when you need it.
Legends of Kesmai, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, SB, RO, SWG, EVE, EQ2, CoH, GW, VG:SOH, WAR, Aion, DF, CO, MO, DN, Tera, SWTOR, RO2, DP, GW2, PS2, BnS, NW, FF:XIV, ESO, EQ:NL
It helps in Skyrim that, even though you're "fast traveling", the world is still going on as you do it. Time passes, NPCs do their thing, everything still happens while you travel. It's not the same in a persistant world like an MMO with many others around, which is why fast travel needs to be limited and not just in everyone's back pocket all the time.
I loved in EQ that traveling was more thought out and planned. If I was going to make a trip to Kunark from Greater Faydark when I was ready, I made sure I was leveled up enough, grabbed supplies and planned out a few weeks where I was going to hunt. Really made it seemed more adventurous and interesting. I'd look for an outpost or town close by, stop there to familiarize myself with the area and then head out to find a hunting spot. Now there's really no need to do any of that because you just bounce around without any thought at all.
Played: EQ1 (10 Years), Guild Wars, Rift, TERA
Tried: EQ2, Vanguard, Lord of the Rings Online, Dungeons and Dragons Online, Runes of Magic and countless others...
Currently Playing: GW2
Nytlok Sylas
80 Sylvari Ranger
I dont like the "click - pay sc - travel".
I'm not paying real money every time I want to travel anywhere. I shouldn't need a second mortgage to play a game.
"When people don't know much about something, they tend to fill in the blanks the way they want them to be filled in. They are almost always disappointed." - Will Wright
Regardless of what goes on, or doesn't go on during fast travel, the fast travel serves a purpose many people playing a game want.
My point is that if you make traveling fun* (Remember this is a game and finding the fun is important), then people will have choice. People zipping around with fast travel all the time is not a symptom of fast travel itself. It's a symptom of a boring and lifeless world not worth exploring. Why would anyone want to spend 2 hours holding W when nothing interesting is going to happen in those two hours and there isn't anything to be earned or gain from the travel itself? It just makes people want to get it over with so they can get to the actual game experience. (The dungeon, the raid, the named mob, etc etc)
The key is to promote standard traveling as the most fun and preferred method of traveling, and offer fast travel as a utility to be used by people who need to use it to link up with friends or catch up to a raid or something like that.
In Skyrim, traveling is alive and part of the experience. You run into unique situations that are fun and exciting. Traveling is not a time sink, it's a part of the experience.
I have faith that EQN dev team can make traveling appealing and have fast travel at the same time.
Legends of Kesmai, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, SB, RO, SWG, EVE, EQ2, CoH, GW, VG:SOH, WAR, Aion, DF, CO, MO, DN, Tera, SWTOR, RO2, DP, GW2, PS2, BnS, NW, FF:XIV, ESO, EQ:NL
I agree, and so does the dev that was talking about that.
As for how much you pay for a F2P game, it can range from nothing, to hundreds of dollars a month. The way I look at it is that if I spend $60 in the cash shop, and pay $15 a month in the cash shop every month after that, there's no difference from F2P and P2P.
I have yet to play a F2P game where I felt I needed to spend more than this in the cash shop. A few times I think I chose to spend a little bit more ($20 or $25 at the cash shop for the month instead of $15), but it was out of convenience, not necessity.
Legends of Kesmai, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, SB, RO, SWG, EVE, EQ2, CoH, GW, VG:SOH, WAR, Aion, DF, CO, MO, DN, Tera, SWTOR, RO2, DP, GW2, PS2, BnS, NW, FF:XIV, ESO, EQ:NL
Player-imposed limitations have no effect because people will always choose the past of least resistance. As a result, the one person who temporarily chooses to run instead of insta-click will find the game world absolutely barren. He won't bump into any other travelers.
Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon.
In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
I suggest you re-read the posts I made. You appear to have honed in on one sentence and failed to see how fast travel works without making the world barren.
I also shouldn't to mention that many games had lively and active worlds even with fast travel. GW2 is a recent example that had an extreme amount of fast travel, yet the world was alive with tons of people. Dynamic events would bring people together and the open world rewarded exploration. So you met people all the time.
EQ had fast travel, and people were always running around.
Fast travel is not the problem. The problem is when a game is bad it doesn't reward or promote normal travel or playing in the open world as part of a fun and rewarding experience.
Legends of Kesmai, UO, EQ, AO, DAoC, AC, SB, RO, SWG, EVE, EQ2, CoH, GW, VG:SOH, WAR, Aion, DF, CO, MO, DN, Tera, SWTOR, RO2, DP, GW2, PS2, BnS, NW, FF:XIV, ESO, EQ:NL
I think fast travel should kinda work like in UO.. In UO, you traveled by rune and runebook, you would buy some blank rune-stones off NPC vendors and you could mark those runes and travel off them if you had the reagents for it or a "recall scroll" which could be found in the game or made by someone with the "inscription" skill, it was also the only way to get runebooks was if a inscribe made them and it made quite a few players money cause if you didn't have the skills you'd have to find a player vendor that would sell them...
You could then use the magery skill to mark runes to anywhere you want to and you'd drop them in runebooks, you'd find players making full runebooks and selling them "this is a runebook to all the dungeons" and so forth..
For non-mages to travel, there was multiple ways to do it, all you needed was a certain amount of intelligence (like 11 or 13) you didn't need magery, just recall scrolls, which scribes would sell off vendors, to make a recall scroll you just had to buy ink and blank scrolls off NPC vendors, I remember always having to keep my runebooks stocked with scrolls to travel and would have several in my pack, I would always have to buy more since I never had a scribe. And you wouldn't always succeed at your spells in the game, they would fizzle as a low level mage, but as you used the skill, it would go up and even at 100.0 magery, you wouldn't always succeed in moongate travel..
Now and days warriors travel with Chivalry in UO which all the skill costs is a bit of gold..
When you hit level 80 fast travel is too expensive. The cost of fast traveling from Lions Arch to Cursed Shore and then back again is like half an hour's worth of farming. It sucked.
Played: EQ1 (10 Years), Guild Wars, Rift, TERA
Tried: EQ2, Vanguard, Lord of the Rings Online, Dungeons and Dragons Online, Runes of Magic and countless others...
Currently Playing: GW2
Nytlok Sylas
80 Sylvari Ranger
:O
I wonder if they changed it. I haven't played GW2 in many months and the cost of fast travel at level 80 was something people complained about on the forums. Maybe it was the stupid mechanic of cost increasing based on level, even if you are traveling the same distance.