I am not a big fan of a cash shop that has anything but cosmetic for the most part....Their may be some exceptions, but I am not a fan of buying an advantage...I do not have time to 'compete' with those with no job/school either (as I have a job/wife/house etc...), but I would prefer they earn things with time, rather than a credit card. The mmo was b2p, but the cash shop is as bad or worse than a lot of f2p mmos....I thought the b2p was going to help towards them not needing to make the cash shop as reaching as it is.
It is my opinion...A lot do not agree.
I do not agree that the cash shop is as bad or worse than a lot of F2P MMO's. Please give me a few examples of AAA (or at least really good) F2P MMO's with a cash shop where you can buy less "power". I'm not saying there aren't any, but I'm not familiar with any. LotRO? SWTOR? AoW maybe? Where are those shining examples?
Originally posted by Razeekster One of the main reasons I quit Guild Wars 2 was because of all the RNG events and "living" story lock-boxes. That and GW2's endgame is garbage. It's basically "see who can be the fashion King/Queen of all of Tyria."
First go play the game then come here and talk. That living story lock boxes already gone. They're selling weapon and armor skins directly on the gem store which you can know the price and directly buy them or you can drop in the game.
First, they are SKINS, You apply it to a weapon you already have. It doesn't change the weapon other than look and what is the big deal about that?
The same can be said for the armor skins. You have to have the armor you want to put it on.
Originally posted by botrytis Originally posted by WyrdfellOriginally posted by RazeeksterOne of the main reasons I quit Guild Wars 2 was because of all the RNG events and "living" story lock-boxes. That and GW2's endgame is garbage. It's basically "see who can be the fashion King/Queen of all of Tyria."
First go play the game then come here and talk. That living story lock boxes already gone. They're selling weapon and armor skins directly on the gem store which you can know the price and directly buy them or you can drop in the game.First, they are SKINS, You apply it to a weapon you already have. It doesn't change the weapon other than look and what is the big deal about that?
The same can be said for the armor skins. You have to have the armor you want to put it on.
I think you get me wrong lol. I'm saying that rng thing is mostly gone. And this is a good think. You can buy which weapon or armor skin you want from tp or gem store. 2 months ago there is only one way that we can get this skins. And that was the rng boxes. And with that way you can't calculate how much gold or gem you needed. Now you can know the price and get one that you want. If you look at the first pages you can see my posts. I love this game and Gw2 isn't a p2w game.
It really just all depends on your definition of p2w.
If you are using the traditional connotation of it as originally formed from the original p2w mmos, then yes GW2 is pay to win, you can buy stuff that gives you an immediate advantage over players with similar characters. XP boosts are a p2w feature, you can deny it all you want, or downplay how much leveling matters in gw2, it doesn't change the fact that being max level > being lower level, and an XP boost gives you an advantage in attaining that.
GW2 has no end-game, well it does, but the end-game is dress-up barbie, and in that sense the game is also P2W.
The one way that it isn't pay 2 win, is by the fact that anet has made such a ridiculously easy game, that there is no losing in it, so you don't have to pay to win, because everyone simply wins no matter what in gw2, because there is no challenge or failing.
It really just all depends on your definition of p2w.
If you are using the traditional connotation of it as originally formed from the original p2w mmos, then yes GW2 is pay to win, you can buy stuff that gives you an immediate advantage over players with similar characters. XP boosts are a p2w feature, you can deny it all you want, or downplay how much leveling matters in gw2, it doesn't change the fact that being max level > being lower level, and an XP boost gives you an advantage in attaining that.
GW2 has no end-game, well it does, but the end-game is dress-up barbie, and in that sense the game is also P2W.
The one way that it isn't pay 2 win, is by the fact that anet has made such a ridiculously easy game, that there is no losing in it, so you don't have to pay to win, because everyone simply wins no matter what in gw2, because there is no challenge or failing.
Hi my in-game name is Faulty Conditions I will be waiting for this everyone wins situation, Please leave me a mail in-game to where you would like to fight and prove to me that everyone wins cheers hope to see a message from you.
Personally I think Guild Wars 2 is dominated by pay to look good.
Now I automatically know people's responses to this. "It's only cosmetic! etc. etc."
So let me rephrase that. Guild Wars 2 is pay to not look like some one took a big dump all over your armor.
Essentially in MMOs. One of the core end game elements is to make your avatar look good. With Guild Wars 2. The only way that is achievable is through the gem shop.
So basically what it comes down to in the end.
Guild Wars 2 /IS/ Pay to Win.
Also instant credit card legendaries. I know one person on my server who has bought 5.
well i dont agree 100%, cause for the most players of GW2 win, are the achievements (which you cant get them with gold) to spent tons of money to get gems to sell them for gold to get exotics which you can obtain far easier... its not pay to win its pay to proove yourself you are stupid...
anyway back to statement about looking there isnt any win, cause its a personal taste the image... so you cant "win" in any kind of cat walk... throwing money in WvW is also a disaster...
how much money costs one legendary ??? in terms of how much money you need in order to purchase gems, so you will be able to sell them to get gold and buy some items which costs thousands of gold... how much gold offers you one gem ?
My definition of Pay 2 Win: Paying real money for an in-game item that gives an advantage over others.
Time spent, was the only advantage anyone could ever have over someone else, but his has all changed now.
Almost all MMO's have the p2w philosophy now. It was unthinkable just 4-5 years ago, except in asian mmos, where it was mostly accepted.
Whether it's gear, xp boosts, level boosts. etc.; it's still pay 2 win. The MMO market is like those Zynga games on Facebook now.
I wasn't really surprised when GW2 did this, since it was already p2w from the beginning. Anyone who thinks otherwise is fooling themselves.
I've just come to accept MMOs as p2w now, because they are. I will stop playing them, when i'm forced to pay real money to advance in progression, or access content. Sadly, it's getting harder and harder to justify GW2's p2w model with this latest change.
My definition of Pay 2 Win: Paying real money for an in-game item that gives an advantage over others.
Time spent, was the only advantage anyone could ever have over someone else, but his has all changed now.
Almost all MMO's have the p2w philosophy now. It was unthinkable just 4-5 years ago, except in asian mmos, where it was mostly accepted.
Whether it's gear, xp boosts, level boosts. etc.; it's still pay 2 win. The MMO market is like those Zynga games on Facebook now.
I wasn't really surprised when GW2 did this, since it was already p2w from the beginning. Anyone who thinks otherwise is fooling themselves.
I've just come to accept MMOs as p2w now, because they are. I will stop playing them, when i'm forced to pay real money to advance in progression, or access content. Sadly, it's getting harder and harder to justify GW2's p2w model with this latest change.
Your definition of Pay 2 Win clearly contradicts the further explanation you have given. You stated that Pay 2 Win is any purchase which gives one advantages over another. In GW2, this is not the case. Just because you look better than someone else doesn't mean you have an advantage over the other person. Additionally, congruent to this note, aesthetics are purely based on opinion. For example, one person may believe that the first set of gear you receive in the game is the best looking, however, contrary to this, another player may disagree and hold an opinion based on the idea that the end-game gear is better, aesthetically speaking of course. Furthermore, would you say that every other MMO on the market is Pay 2 Win? Doesn't each and every title in the genre have a basis of the philosophy that you invest time to progress. I mean really, you are entitled to your opinion, though I believe that the general consensus will strongly disagree with you.
TLDR: You have to be kidding me when you say that GW2 is Pay 2 WIN.
My definition of Pay 2 Win: Paying real money for an in-game item that gives an advantage over others.
Time spent, was the only advantage anyone could ever have over someone else, but his has all changed now.
Almost all MMO's have the p2w philosophy now. It was unthinkable just 4-5 years ago, except in asian mmos, where it was mostly accepted.
Whether it's gear, xp boosts, level boosts. etc.; it's still pay 2 win. The MMO market is like those Zynga games on Facebook now.
I wasn't really surprised when GW2 did this, since it was already p2w from the beginning. Anyone who thinks otherwise is fooling themselves.
I've just come to accept MMOs as p2w now, because they are. I will stop playing them, when i'm forced to pay real money to advance in progression, or access content. Sadly, it's getting harder and harder to justify GW2's p2w model with this latest change.
Your definition of Pay 2 Win clearly contradicts the further explanation you have given. You stated that Pay 2 Win is any purchase which gives one advantages over another. In GW2, this is not the case. Just because you look better than someone else doesn't mean you have an advantage over the other person. Additionally, congruent to this note, aesthetics are purely based on opinion. For example, one person may believe that the first set of gear you receive in the game is the best looking, however, contrary to this, another player may disagree and hold an opinion based on the idea that the end-game gear is better, aesthetically speaking of course. Furthermore, would you say that every other MMO on the market is Pay 2 Win? Doesn't each and every title in the genre have a basis of the philosophy that you invest time to progress. I mean really, you are entitled to your opinion, though I believe that the general consensus will strongly disagree with you.
TLDR: You have to be kidding me when you say that GW2 is Pay 2 WIN.
Show me the contradiction. You say there is, but you failed to point it out.
Your argument is based on aesthetics, which is fine, but it still doesn't negate the fact that aesthetics, is one goal of many, in GW2. How we obtain these goals, achievements, or items, is a means to an end. Any advantage, using real money, is "paying to win", to achieve that end. It doesn't matter if it's aesthetics, crafting, leveling, or any other progression aspect in a game.
Furthermore, your argument fails, by comparing the first set of gear in the game to other gear. There are many tiers of gear in GW2, and Ascended is one of them, and acquiring this top-tier gear with real money, is paying for an advantage. This is the whole point of this thread.
"Furthermore, would you say that every other MMO on the market is Pay 2 Win? Doesn't each and every title in the genre have a basis of the philosophy that you invest time to progress."
Re-read my post. Time spent was the only advantage people had over each other, but now the genre shifted to money.
My definition of Pay 2 Win: Paying real money for an in-game item that gives an advantage over others.
Time spent, was the only advantage anyone could ever have over someone else, but his has all changed now.
Almost all MMO's have the p2w philosophy now. It was unthinkable just 4-5 years ago, except in asian mmos, where it was mostly accepted.
Whether it's gear, xp boosts, level boosts. etc.; it's still pay 2 win. The MMO market is like those Zynga games on Facebook now.
I wasn't really surprised when GW2 did this, since it was already p2w from the beginning. Anyone who thinks otherwise is fooling themselves.
I've just come to accept MMOs as p2w now, because they are. I will stop playing them, when i'm forced to pay real money to advance in progression, or access content. Sadly, it's getting harder and harder to justify GW2's p2w model with this latest change.
Your definition of Pay 2 Win clearly contradicts the further explanation you have given. You stated that Pay 2 Win is any purchase which gives one advantages over another. In GW2, this is not the case. Just because you look better than someone else doesn't mean you have an advantage over the other person. Additionally, congruent to this note, aesthetics are purely based on opinion. For example, one person may believe that the first set of gear you receive in the game is the best looking, however, contrary to this, another player may disagree and hold an opinion based on the idea that the end-game gear is better, aesthetically speaking of course. Furthermore, would you say that every other MMO on the market is Pay 2 Win? Doesn't each and every title in the genre have a basis of the philosophy that you invest time to progress. I mean really, you are entitled to your opinion, though I believe that the general consensus will strongly disagree with you.
TLDR: You have to be kidding me when you say that GW2 is Pay 2 WIN.
Show me the contradiction. You say there is, but you failed to point it out.
Your argument is based on aesthetics, which is fine, but it still doesn't negate the fact that aesthetics, is one goal of many, in GW2. How we obtain these goals, achievements, or items, is a means to an end. Any advantage, using real money, is "paying to win", to achieve that end. It doesn't matter if it's aesthetics, crafting, leveling, or any other progression aspect in a game.
Furthermore, your argument fails, by comparing the first set of gear in the game to other gear. There are many tiers of gear in GW2, and Ascended is one of them, and acquiring this top-tier gear with real money, is paying for an advantage. This is the whole point of this thread.
"Furthermore, would you say that every other MMO on the market is Pay 2 Win? Doesn't each and every title in the genre have a basis of the philosophy that you invest time to progress."
Re-read my post. Time spent was the only advantage people had over each other, but now the genre shifted to money.
Still trying to find out a source where your definition and what you wrote match. Still can't find it ANYWHERE ON THE WEB, but here in this thread. Damn I need up my game on how to search for these things.
Originally posted by elitero Still trying to find out a source where your definition and what you wrote match. Still can't find it ANYWHERE ON THE WEB, but here in this thread. Damn I need up my game on how to search for these things.
That's because it doesn't exist. People are making their own definitions, and then saying they apply universally. The closest we have to a definition that exists outside of the definitions that people are making up on the spot are a F2P game that blocks all progress unless you buy something from the cash shop or a game where becoming competitive in PvP is impossible without using the cash shop. A key component is an unbalanced game where gear, not skill is the determining factor in whether a player wins.
It's easy to see how this relates to F2P games because many F2P games make progress impossible or content unavailable unless the player buys something from the cash shop. Players cannot win if they do not pay. Requiem is a game that does this, or at least it used to. Somewhere between level 10 and level 20 character progression stops and parts of a character's progression are simply unavailable without spending money in the cash shop. It is theoretically possible for a character to level for free, but in practice it never happens. The reason this has to be F2P specific is because all P2P games require the player to pay money, or they can't even play, much less level a character.
The other is pretty easy to see too. Players who do not spend money in the cash shop will lose to players who spend money in the cash shop.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
My definition of Pay 2 Win: Paying real money for an in-game item that gives an advantage over others.
Time spent, was the only advantage anyone could ever have over someone else, but his has all changed now.
Almost all MMO's have the p2w philosophy now. It was unthinkable just 4-5 years ago, except in asian mmos, where it was mostly accepted.
Whether it's gear, xp boosts, level boosts. etc.; it's still pay 2 win. The MMO market is like those Zynga games on Facebook now.
I wasn't really surprised when GW2 did this, since it was already p2w from the beginning. Anyone who thinks otherwise is fooling themselves.
I've just come to accept MMOs as p2w now, because they are. I will stop playing them, when i'm forced to pay real money to advance in progression, or access content. Sadly, it's getting harder and harder to justify GW2's p2w model with this latest change.
What do you have to buy in GW2 to advance in progression or access content ? What's sad is having to read a post like this and trying to reason with any amount of common sense as to where this train of thought comes from .
I haven't been keeping up with GW2 lately, but I actually quit because of this. I could see the company moving this direction and it sucked. It was only a matter of time before you had the 'option' to buy gear or grind a crazy amount of time get it. Sad really
With the underwhelming performance last quarter despite their course correction, I believe they will slowly add even more and more p2w type items to the shop.
I really hope anet can fix their game, but it's not looking good. A heavy indication of anets shift as a company should have been apparent when the successor to gw1 had very little to do with guilds and gvg.
With the underwhelming performance last quarter despite their course correction, I believe they will slowly add even more and more p2w type items to the shop.
I really hope anet can fix their game, but it's not looking good. A heavy indication of anets shift as a company should have been apparent when the successor to gw1 had very little to do with guilds and gvg.
My definition of Pay 2 Win: Paying real money for an in-game item that gives an advantage over others.
Time spent, was the only advantage anyone could ever have over someone else, but his has all changed now.
Almost all MMO's have the p2w philosophy now. It was unthinkable just 4-5 years ago, except in asian mmos, where it was mostly accepted.
Whether it's gear, xp boosts, level boosts. etc.; it's still pay 2 win. The MMO market is like those Zynga games on Facebook now.
I wasn't really surprised when GW2 did this, since it was already p2w from the beginning. Anyone who thinks otherwise is fooling themselves.
I've just come to accept MMOs as p2w now, because they are. I will stop playing them, when i'm forced to pay real money to advance in progression, or access content. Sadly, it's getting harder and harder to justify GW2's p2w model with this latest change.
What do you have to buy in GW2 to advance in progression or access content ? What's sad is having to read a post like this and trying to reason with any amount of common sense as to where this train of thought comes from .
I never said GW2 did this. I said, "I will stop playing them, when i'm forced to pay real money to advance in progression, or access content."
Still trying to find out a source where your definition and what you wrote match. Still can't find it ANYWHERE ON THE WEB, but here in this thread. Damn I need up my game on how to search for these things.
I never claimed it was an official source, i said it was my definition. It's not hard to define something arbitrarily either. Use logical deduction, and you'll come to a conclusion and similar outcomes.
I spend £x and outright buy a legendary which is the Top item in the game along with max ever - I walk into pvp and my gear does not make me dominate anything, it doesn't give me access to 'top tier' content, I still wipe in dungeons becuase I stand in the fire. I've paid and won nothing. Those people who claim it's pay to win, either do not play the game or just don't have the intelligence to comprehend, or worse trapped in some horrific negative cycle where they feel compelled to argue black is white in a forum, I would be worried if that was me.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Personally I think Guild Wars 2 is dominated by pay to look good.
Now I automatically know people's responses to this. "It's only cosmetic! etc. etc."
So let me rephrase that. Guild Wars 2 is pay to not look like some one took a big dump all over your armor.
Essentially in MMOs. One of the core end game elements is to make your avatar look good. With Guild Wars 2. The only way that is achievable is through the gem shop.
So basically what it comes down to in the end.
Guild Wars 2 /IS/ Pay to Win.
Also instant credit card legendaries. I know one person on my server who has bought 5.
With the underwhelming performance last quarter despite their course correction, I believe they will slowly add even more and more p2w type items to the shop.
I really hope anet can fix their game, but it's not looking good. A heavy indication of anets shift as a company should have been apparent when the successor to gw1 had very little to do with guilds and gvg.
Last Quarter Anet only outsold by 50% their release quarters of Factions, Nightfall and Eye of the North.
GW1 changed to a PvE game long ago and GW2 followed it, because PvE is where the money is.
Currently playing: GW2 Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
With the underwhelming performance last quarter despite their course correction, I believe they will slowly add even more and more p2w type items to the shop.
I really hope anet can fix their game, but it's not looking good. A heavy indication of anets shift as a company should have been apparent when the successor to gw1 had very little to do with guilds and gvg.
Last Quarter Anet only outsold by 50% their release quarters of Factions, Nightfall and Eye of the North.
GW1 changed to a PvE game long ago and GW2 followed it, because PvE is where the money is.
They don't seem to be doing well on the PvE or PvP front right now... Both have been considered fairly shallow by genre standards... probably why their player retention isn't so good.
Maybe the next earnings report will show less of a decline in revenue we will see.
With the underwhelming performance last quarter despite their course correction, I believe they will slowly add even more and more p2w type items to the shop.
I really hope anet can fix their game, but it's not looking good. A heavy indication of anets shift as a company should have been apparent when the successor to gw1 had very little to do with guilds and gvg.
Last Quarter Anet only outsold by 50% their release quarters of Factions, Nightfall and Eye of the North.
GW1 changed to a PvE game long ago and GW2 followed it, because PvE is where the money is.
They don't seem to be doing well on the PvE or PvP front right now... Both have been considered fairly shallow by genre standards... probably why their player retention isn't so good.
Maybe the next earnings report will show less of a decline in revenue we will see.
...pretty sure the Fractal Account Bound levels, WvW account bound levels, and PvP gold earning is fairly well received.
And while I am sure they have been considered fairly shallow by you and others like yourself, there are plenty of others who disagree, despite these forums.
"As you read these words, a release is seven days or less away or has just happened within the last seven days those are now the only two states youll find the world of Tyria."...Guild Wars 2
Comments
I do not agree that the cash shop is as bad or worse than a lot of F2P MMO's. Please give me a few examples of AAA (or at least really good) F2P MMO's with a cash shop where you can buy less "power". I'm not saying there aren't any, but I'm not familiar with any. LotRO? SWTOR? AoW maybe? Where are those shining examples?
First, they are SKINS, You apply it to a weapon you already have. It doesn't change the weapon other than look and what is the big deal about that?
The same can be said for the armor skins. You have to have the armor you want to put it on.
First, they are SKINS, You apply it to a weapon you already have. It doesn't change the weapon other than look and what is the big deal about that?
The same can be said for the armor skins. You have to have the armor you want to put it on.
I think you get me wrong lol. I'm saying that rng thing is mostly gone. And this is a good think. You can buy which weapon or armor skin you want from tp or gem store. 2 months ago there is only one way that we can get this skins. And that was the rng boxes. And with that way you can't calculate how much gold or gem you needed. Now you can know the price and get one that you want. If you look at the first pages you can see my posts. I love this game and Gw2 isn't a p2w game.
It really just all depends on your definition of p2w.
If you are using the traditional connotation of it as originally formed from the original p2w mmos, then yes GW2 is pay to win, you can buy stuff that gives you an immediate advantage over players with similar characters. XP boosts are a p2w feature, you can deny it all you want, or downplay how much leveling matters in gw2, it doesn't change the fact that being max level > being lower level, and an XP boost gives you an advantage in attaining that.
GW2 has no end-game, well it does, but the end-game is dress-up barbie, and in that sense the game is also P2W.
The one way that it isn't pay 2 win, is by the fact that anet has made such a ridiculously easy game, that there is no losing in it, so you don't have to pay to win, because everyone simply wins no matter what in gw2, because there is no challenge or failing.
Hi my in-game name is Faulty Conditions I will be waiting for this everyone wins situation, Please leave me a mail in-game to where you would like to fight and prove to me that everyone wins
cheers hope to see a message from you.
well i dont agree 100%, cause for the most players of GW2 win, are the achievements (which you cant get them with gold) to spent tons of money to get gems to sell them for gold to get exotics which you can obtain far easier... its not pay to win its pay to proove yourself you are stupid...
anyway back to statement about looking there isnt any win, cause its a personal taste the image... so you cant "win" in any kind of cat walk... throwing money in WvW is also a disaster...
how much money costs one legendary ??? in terms of how much money you need in order to purchase gems, so you will be able to sell them to get gold and buy some items which costs thousands of gold... how much gold offers you one gem ?
LOL!!
Best opinion ever on this
:P
My definition of Pay 2 Win: Paying real money for an in-game item that gives an advantage over others.
Time spent, was the only advantage anyone could ever have over someone else, but his has all changed now.
Almost all MMO's have the p2w philosophy now. It was unthinkable just 4-5 years ago, except in asian mmos, where it was mostly accepted.
Whether it's gear, xp boosts, level boosts. etc.; it's still pay 2 win. The MMO market is like those Zynga games on Facebook now.
I wasn't really surprised when GW2 did this, since it was already p2w from the beginning. Anyone who thinks otherwise is fooling themselves.
I've just come to accept MMOs as p2w now, because they are. I will stop playing them, when i'm forced to pay real money to advance in progression, or access content. Sadly, it's getting harder and harder to justify GW2's p2w model with this latest change.
Your definition of Pay 2 Win clearly contradicts the further explanation you have given. You stated that Pay 2 Win is any purchase which gives one advantages over another. In GW2, this is not the case. Just because you look better than someone else doesn't mean you have an advantage over the other person. Additionally, congruent to this note, aesthetics are purely based on opinion. For example, one person may believe that the first set of gear you receive in the game is the best looking, however, contrary to this, another player may disagree and hold an opinion based on the idea that the end-game gear is better, aesthetically speaking of course. Furthermore, would you say that every other MMO on the market is Pay 2 Win? Doesn't each and every title in the genre have a basis of the philosophy that you invest time to progress. I mean really, you are entitled to your opinion, though I believe that the general consensus will strongly disagree with you.
TLDR: You have to be kidding me when you say that GW2 is Pay 2 WIN.
Show me the contradiction. You say there is, but you failed to point it out.
Your argument is based on aesthetics, which is fine, but it still doesn't negate the fact that aesthetics, is one goal of many, in GW2. How we obtain these goals, achievements, or items, is a means to an end. Any advantage, using real money, is "paying to win", to achieve that end. It doesn't matter if it's aesthetics, crafting, leveling, or any other progression aspect in a game.
Furthermore, your argument fails, by comparing the first set of gear in the game to other gear. There are many tiers of gear in GW2, and Ascended is one of them, and acquiring this top-tier gear with real money, is paying for an advantage. This is the whole point of this thread.
"Furthermore, would you say that every other MMO on the market is Pay 2 Win? Doesn't each and every title in the genre have a basis of the philosophy that you invest time to progress."
Re-read my post. Time spent was the only advantage people had over each other, but now the genre shifted to money.
Still trying to find out a source where your definition and what you wrote match. Still can't find it ANYWHERE ON THE WEB, but here in this thread. Damn I need up my game on how to search for these things.
That's because it doesn't exist. People are making their own definitions, and then saying they apply universally. The closest we have to a definition that exists outside of the definitions that people are making up on the spot are a F2P game that blocks all progress unless you buy something from the cash shop or a game where becoming competitive in PvP is impossible without using the cash shop. A key component is an unbalanced game where gear, not skill is the determining factor in whether a player wins.
It's easy to see how this relates to F2P games because many F2P games make progress impossible or content unavailable unless the player buys something from the cash shop. Players cannot win if they do not pay. Requiem is a game that does this, or at least it used to. Somewhere between level 10 and level 20 character progression stops and parts of a character's progression are simply unavailable without spending money in the cash shop. It is theoretically possible for a character to level for free, but in practice it never happens. The reason this has to be F2P specific is because all P2P games require the player to pay money, or they can't even play, much less level a character.
The other is pretty easy to see too. Players who do not spend money in the cash shop will lose to players who spend money in the cash shop.
I can not remember winning or losing a single debate on the internet.
What do you have to buy in GW2 to advance in progression or access content ? What's sad is having to read a post like this and trying to reason with any amount of common sense as to where this train of thought comes from .
Pre AAA MMORPGs without sub fee.
"P2W - the ability to acquire items with real world money that are more powerful than those commonly available in game".
MMORPG.com after AAA MMORPGs without sub fee.
"A AAA MMORPG that has no subscription and has a cash shop and is not selling items that give power over what is available in game?
No problem!
We change the definition of Pay to Win.
Now GW2 is pay to win!
Subscription fees forever!"
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
So true.
With the underwhelming performance last quarter despite their course correction, I believe they will slowly add even more and more p2w type items to the shop.
I really hope anet can fix their game, but it's not looking good. A heavy indication of anets shift as a company should have been apparent when the successor to gw1 had very little to do with guilds and gvg.
Hey can you post a source please.
I never said GW2 did this. I said, "I will stop playing them, when i'm forced to pay real money to advance in progression, or access content."
It hasn't reached that point yet.
I never claimed it was an official source, i said it was my definition. It's not hard to define something arbitrarily either. Use logical deduction, and you'll come to a conclusion and similar outcomes.
rpg/mmorg history: Dun Darach>Bloodwych>Bards Tale 1-3>Eye of the beholder > Might and Magic 2,3,5 > FFVII> Baldur's Gate 1, 2 > Planescape Torment >Morrowind > WOW > oblivion > LOTR > Guild Wars (1900hrs elementalist) Vanguard. > GW2(1000 elementalist), Wildstar
Now playing GW2, AOW 3, ESO, LOTR, Elite D
I had to laugh at this so hard, thx dude!
Last Quarter Anet only outsold by 50% their release quarters of Factions, Nightfall and Eye of the North.
GW1 changed to a PvE game long ago and GW2 followed it, because PvE is where the money is.
Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, 7 Wonders
They don't seem to be doing well on the PvE or PvP front right now... Both have been considered fairly shallow by genre standards... probably why their player retention isn't so good.
Maybe the next earnings report will show less of a decline in revenue we will see.
...pretty sure the Fractal Account Bound levels, WvW account bound levels, and PvP gold earning is fairly well received.
And while I am sure they have been considered fairly shallow by you and others like yourself, there are plenty of others who disagree, despite these forums.
"As you read these words, a release is seven days or less away or has just happened within the last seven days those are now the only two states youll find the world of Tyria."...Guild Wars 2