I beg to differ, in UO, your armor determins how hard someone hits u, just like your weapon and skill(game skill, not your personal one) determins how hard u hit the opponent... Just like in WoW. With Eve - same story, new char with newbie weapon is in no way competetive vs seasoned player. However, in Eve it is slightly easierto be a noob since you can become a tackler in a group fight, but still, you wont be a real hitter, just someone to suicide but slow down the enemy so your main force can intercept and destroy him. You dont stand a chance against someone in a ship that is 100x times larger then yours (im talking here from the noob, just joined eve and someone with 10 mil SPs perspective, not someone in a noob ship but with 10mil SPs). So this all looks just like WoW, except there is no level dependancy, but rather item, skill or a combination of those 2.
when I PvPed in WoW, sometimes my group of 10 kicked 20-men enemy group, and sometimes 5-men group kicked our 10-men group ass. Sometimes the enemy is dumb and uses basic autoattack *snicker*... but sometimes the basterds use crazy stunts that leave me eyes-out-on-the-monitor-jaw-down-on-the-ground saying "how the F$%^&^ did he do that"? Try being a rogue, a subtiety rogue in wow, I had so much fun because most rogues are combat ones, and those do not have that many options to escape or stun. Subtiety rogues deal less dmg but have many skills (in-game) to escape the fight just to jump right in onto the enemy who though im running away for my life. Takes skills (real ones) to use skills (in-game) to beat an opponent of equal strength.
Sure, equipment matters but it is not the deciding factor like in WOW.
Oh yeah, killing people with a rogue required lots of skill - stun locks for the win! Heh... 2 horde rogues jumped my rogue and they THOUGHT theyd do just what u were suggesting... They tried to chain stun me, 2 rogues, chain stun me to death... hehe. Well, I killed 1 and dmg the other half way before I was forced to flash myself out of trouble... Needles to say I received a purple coded whisper "omg u Pu**y, you sucks u n00b"... I never laughed harded then that day ROFL... I wish i was recording that fight to post it.. hmmm, id have to search throughmy recording collections, I might find something interesting to show...
PS: if you are wondering how I beat them, I managed to blind one of them to put him out of business for a bit, then deal with the other rogue - a little chain stunning of my own, till his buddy finaly cleaned his eyes and tried to save him... just to see his undead buddy... dying...again...LOL
Once again I consolidate my position and make the outrageous claim that WOW is the closest thing to perfection any of you ahve ever experienced in terms of a mmorpg......i say close because it is lacking in certain areas but PVE wise it's the best...pvp second and all the rest is pish posh...
To you.
TO YOU.
You are forgetting that not everyone likes meaningless, zero risk PVP experiences which outcomes are mainly dictated by your grinding ability (read equipment, read level). And not everyone hates that either. Being an optimist myself, Id rather think that 8 million of people who play WoW play so for their entertainment, and not because of their stupidity.
Its funny because, theres so many of these little forums all over the internet of people bitchin about whats wrong with world of warcraft, and complaining about how many people play. Then people reading them who have never played need to know why theres so much talk about it. So they try it, and they get hooked. Blizzard should be thankful for people like you!
Once again I consolidate my position and make the outrageous claim that WOW is the closest thing to perfection any of you ahve ever experienced in terms of a mmorpg......i say close because it is lacking in certain areas but PVE wise it's the best...pvp second and all the rest is pish posh...
To you.
TO YOU.
You are forgetting that not everyone likes meaningless, zero risk PVP experiences which outcomes are mainly dictated by your grinding ability (read equipment, read level).
but again what mmorpg's PvP isnt impacted directly by the PvE/grinding? thats the whole point of mmorpg PvP vs FPS. mmorpg PvP you get to bulid your character and customize/outfit him and see the fruition of that later on. FPS is like playing Pacman. When the game ends you start all over again at the same point with the same stuff. no character building or attachment.
As for zero risk PvP being so bad, i've played ShadowBane which is probably one of the harshest PvP based games in terms of deaths and penalizing the player. I'd much rather have WoW's death system since i play for fun, not to reallly ruin other peoples days, where dying means hours of grinding just to repair your equipment or weeks to get your city back.
And not everyone hates that either. Being an optimist myself, Id rather think that 8 million of people who play WoW play so for their entertainment, and not because of their stupidity.
With 3.5 million of them being chinese - yes, the people who LOVE grinding.
but again what mmorpg's PvP isnt impacted directly by the PvE/grinding? thats the whole point of mmorpg PvP vs FPS. mmorpg PvP you get to bulid your character and customize/outfit him and see the fruition of that later on. FPS is like playing Pacman. When the game ends you start all over again at the same point with the same stuff. no character building or attachment. As for zero risk PvP being so bad, i've played ShadowBane which is probably one of the harshest PvP based games in terms of deaths and penalizing the player. I'd much rather have WoW's death system since i play for fun, not to reallly ruin other peoples days, where dying means hours of grinding just to repair your equipment or weeks to get your city back. Grief is overated.
Man, it's already being said a million times already. I suggest you look back over the last few pages.
And FPS in WOW is like playing pacman in that case - because when you die you start all over again - hey, you said it! When you die, you click respawn - who the f. cares? Exactly. It's pointless. If i kill someone they just respawn, as if nothing had just happened - rinse - repeat - fun.
So i prefer the thrill of playing poker with real money. You prefer the fun aspect of playing poker with fake money. Different wants, different needs - neither right - neither wrong.
& with that, this time im out of this reptitious thread.
Lets run down the list now PVE wise........for wow and compare it to other games...... UO - Close but pve was slow and not very entertaining...A statement of fact. Neurologists study neuroactivity and link the activity to feeling sof excitment. More neuroactivity means more excitement hands down you can't argue this. Agree
EQ - Same as above plus half hour down times = really really bad game. Any game where your staring at the screen doing nothing waiting almost a half hour for your mana and life to recharge is pathetic. And if your grouped you still have downtime but lets be fair and cut it downt o 25 minutes instead of 30... Agree, although the downtime is a bit exaggerated, I think med time at high levels is more like 5-10 minutes, depends on the class though. Druids and necros could probly kill 2-3 mobs of similar level (regular mobs, not some uber undercon) and then had to med for 5-10 mins (newspaper time!)
EQ II - Well considering combat is still broken we can't even go here..........bad game mechanics = unfinished game. Not sure how its broken. I havent played it in a while, but EQ2 combat was ... different. I sort of liked heroics and was incredibly surprised that a vast number of players completely ignored heroics. Its a good game but it does feel unfinished or underdeveloped, if such word exists.
Vanguard - Haven't played but from what I hear very uninspiring... Its a beautiful game, but I think mechanics follow EQ1 rule in principle. Very sad if thats how it will go, I dont have much time to invest into games, but I felt in love with graphics and the world of VSoH.
WOW. No downtime. Constant movement means constant thinking constant decision making but not intense to the point that causes anxiety which can slowly kill you like someo f the other games. Perfection achieved. A very descriptive and to the point satement.
SWG - Combat not impletment yet even three years after release SWG is still using it's beta combat system.... If you are being sarcastic, then hehe, yeah. SWG combat has been reorked what, 3 times now? I kind of liked the very first combat style, but luckliy I droped out before the first CU so I missed out on "The Great SWG Depression".
Ever - No combat what so ever. Entirely micromanaged. Better then the rest for those who have trouble making spontaneous decisions but not more exciting. Do you mean Eve? I wouldnt say it has no combat, it has different combat. A sort of true star-ship-combat feel. I mean, a captain of a ship is not gonna have a joystick mounted on his captains chair and directly linked to his engines, laser beams and photon torpedoes, right? heh.. goofy idea.
Guild wars- Anxiety level = cancer. Too much luck involved no skill required what so ever. Started a pvp char joined a guild wooped on tricks like crazy the first day got 10,000 faction in less than three hours...couldn't ever do it again. Prognosis...game of luck. Multiply the above by 20 since all 20 of my guildmates from uo experienced 99.9 perecent similar results. I'll show you the spread sheet later. There is a completely different type of combat style here. The main shift from level based style went into skill based style. Now you dont necessarily "pwn" becuase you have that godly sword of nerdiness, but becuase you have a killer set of skills. You dont just bring default pack of skills to use in your fight, you make your own pack, and if u r in a team, your pack ( called build ) can be very effective or..not. This shift from tactical to strategic planning is different. Now you have to think ahead, what would the other team bring into the fight? Are they gonna have a spike build (where they save the most damagin skills that are usualy on high recycle time to quickly kill off their healers and then finish their melees/dmg casters? Or are they gonna use a more defencive build, with lots of healing/buffing skills to protect them from the spike build of their opponent? It is an interesting concept, but was a bit hard to get for me. I tried GW about 3 times before I finaly "got it". Now I hunt skills just like id hunt items in WoW, i want to build a perfect spike build, healer build and running build... if there is such a thing as a perfect build... nah, there isnt.
Now let's get to lineage - You basically get two attacks for 75 levels which equals 200 wow levels. These types of games are usually better in the east where people think less on there own and more collectively. I.e. my suffering is his gain and this is good because society improves where as us westerners think entirely differen.t Thats one of the reasons I personaly dislike L2. I hear, however, that L2 PvP is pretty good at high levels, with capturable castles and sieges and stuff. But its not worth it to spend months and months of grind just to reach the good stuff. If im paying money, I want to enjoy it from day 1, like I did in WoW. And I hear the bot problem is very serious in L2.
And not everyone hates that either. Being an optimist myself, Id rather think that 8 million of people who play WoW play so for their entertainment, and not because of their stupidity.
With 3.5 million of them being chinese - yes, the people who LOVE grinding. What about the other 4.5 millions? 2 mils of those in NA, which is a HUGE number considering NA has been historicaly very low on MMORPG pop numbers. And cmon, not all chinese like grinding. Before WoW, where there was EQ1 and... nothing else, you could say that NA liked to grind too.
I think China and Asia in general is going through what NA went through 5-10 years ago. Once they taste the casualness of WoW they will be more likely to buy another game that is less grinding and more casual.
but again what mmorpg's PvP isnt impacted directly by the PvE/grinding? thats the whole point of mmorpg PvP vs FPS. mmorpg PvP you get to bulid your character and customize/outfit him and see the fruition of that later on. FPS is like playing Pacman. When the game ends you start all over again at the same point with the same stuff. no character building or attachment. As for zero risk PvP being so bad, i've played ShadowBane which is probably one of the harshest PvP based games in terms of deaths and penalizing the player. I'd much rather have WoW's death system since i play for fun, not to reallly ruin other peoples days, where dying means hours of grinding just to repair your equipment or weeks to get your city back. Grief is overated.
Man, it's already being said a million times already. I suggest you look back over the last few pages.
And FPS in WOW is like playing pacman in that case - because when you die you start all over again - hey, you said it! When you die, you click respawn - who the f. cares? Exactly. It's pointless. If i kill someone they just respawn, as if nothing had just happened - rinse - repeat - fun.
So i prefer the thrill of playing poker with real money. You prefer the fun aspect of playing poker with fake money. Different wants, different needs - neither right - neither wrong.
& with that, this time im out of this reptitious thread.
true and thats the exact reason why you end up hating what you play and calling everything a grind because your whole focus is about the gain. You wont ever enjoy it if all your focusing on is the end reward throughout whatever 'grind' you set yourself upon.
i enjoy myself in the moment, in the act of fighting and PvP. the endgame PvP rewards are an afterthought for me, while for you it'd be the whole goal.
just like your poker example. I can enjoy the game of Poker for what it is, it doesnt take winning money to make it fun for me. Its the act of playing that makes it fun. the act of PvP is fun, for you its a chore for the rewards. youre just shooting yourself in the foot with that mentality especially when it comes to games.
but again what mmorpg's PvP isnt impacted directly by the PvE/grinding? thats the whole point of mmorpg PvP vs FPS. mmorpg PvP you get to bulid your character and customize/outfit him and see the fruition of that later on. FPS is like playing Pacman. When the game ends you start all over again at the same point with the same stuff. no character building or attachment. As for zero risk PvP being so bad, i've played ShadowBane which is probably one of the harshest PvP based games in terms of deaths and penalizing the player. I'd much rather have WoW's death system since i play for fun, not to reallly ruin other peoples days, where dying means hours of grinding just to repair your equipment or weeks to get your city back. Grief is overated.
Man, it's already being said a million times already. I suggest you look back over the last few pages.
And FPS in WOW is like playing pacman in that case - because when you die you start all over again - hey, you said it! When you die, you click respawn - who the f. cares? Exactly. It's pointless. If i kill someone they just respawn, as if nothing had just happened - rinse - repeat - fun.
So i prefer the thrill of playing poker with real money. You prefer the fun aspect of playing poker with fake money. Different wants, different needs - neither right - neither wrong.
& with that, this time im out of this reptitious thread. Strategic PvP in WoW is nonexistant, but I wouldnt call it pointless... according to XFIRE ( xfire.com ) here are the stats for the top games:
World of Warcraft
20,219,145
Counter-Strike Source
7,838,525
Call of Duty 2 Multiplayer
6,607,175
Battlefield 2
2,778,228
Guild Wars
2,079,666
Counter-Strike 1.6
1,880,792
Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory
1,457,984
Battlefield 2142
1,401,955
Silkroad Online
1,377,180
Warcraft III - The Frozen Throne
1,194,215
the 2nd, 3rd,4th,6th,7th,8th and 9th game are strategicaly nonexistant ( well im actualy unsure about WC3, whether the world is persistent or not, i assume its like starcraft, u play a round, u win/lose, u start a new round) from the PvP standpoint. Meaning your success or failure will not affect you in your future games, your score and ego may suffer but thats it. And yet those games are so popular, becuase its fun! it may not make sense in the long run, but its getin-havefun-getout playstyle is addictive and entertaining.
but again what mmorpg's PvP isnt impacted directly by the PvE/grinding? thats the whole point of mmorpg PvP vs FPS. mmorpg PvP you get to bulid your character and customize/outfit him and see the fruition of that later on. FPS is like playing Pacman. When the game ends you start all over again at the same point with the same stuff. no character building or attachment. As for zero risk PvP being so bad, i've played ShadowBane which is probably one of the harshest PvP based games in terms of deaths and penalizing the player. I'd much rather have WoW's death system since i play for fun, not to reallly ruin other peoples days, where dying means hours of grinding just to repair your equipment or weeks to get your city back. Grief is overated.
Man, it's already being said a million times already. I suggest you look back over the last few pages.
And FPS in WOW is like playing pacman in that case - because when you die you start all over again - hey, you said it! When you die, you click respawn - who the f. cares? Exactly. It's pointless. If i kill someone they just respawn, as if nothing had just happened - rinse - repeat - fun.
So i prefer the thrill of playing poker with real money. You prefer the fun aspect of playing poker with fake money. Different wants, different needs - neither right - neither wrong.
& with that, this time im out of this reptitious thread.
true and thats the exact reason why you end up hating what you play and calling everything a grind because your whole focus is about the gain. You wont ever enjoy it if all your focusing on is the end reward throughout whatever 'grind' you set yourself upon.
i enjoy myself in the moment, in the act of fighting and PvP. the endgame PvP rewards are an afterthought for me, while for you it'd be the whole goal.
just like your poker example. I can enjoy the game of Poker for what it is, it doesnt take winning money to make it fun for me. Its the act of playing that makes it fun. the act of PvP is fun, for you its a chore for the rewards. youre just shooting yourself in the foot with that mentality especially when it comes to games.
Best poker example ever! heh. I wouldnt have posted my previous post if I saw your reply before submitting mine.
Originally posted by rohbshop true and thats the exact reason why you end up hating what you play and calling everything a grind because your whole focus is about the gain. You wont ever enjoy it if all your focusing on is the end reward throughout whatever 'grind' you set yourself upon. i enjoy myself in the moment, in the act of fighting and PvP. the endgame PvP rewards are an afterthought for me, while for you it'd be the whole goal. just like your poker example. I can enjoy the game of Poker for what it is, it doesnt take winning money to make it fun for me. Its the act of playing that makes it fun. the act of PvP is fun, for you its a chore for the rewards. youre just shooting yourself in the foot with that mentality especially when it comes to games.
Again, you are missing the point by a mile.
You will find a lot of people enjoy the THRILL of gambling - knowing that they are risking something of value. It is same with PVP.
So basically you are saying that the feelings, excitement and emotions of playing poker with fake money (no risk) is the same as playing poker with real money (risk).
When infact a playmoney table, you dont care at all. You put "all in" in situations that you wouldnt do on a real money table. You are "dumbed" down, not thinking straight and really are not paying any attention on that table IF you play on a real money table at the same time. Where the real action happens.
On the real money table, your feelings are completely different from the playmoney table. You are more focused and things you do will matter. Your palm gets sweaty when you have a good hand and are "all in" vs one guy. If you lose you your stomach will churn and you will learn from the experience, but if you win a great pot, that feeling is about the same as you would have skyjumping - oh the adrenaline rush!
Simply said, the feeling you have on a real money table is not the same as you would have on a playmoney table. Same with PVP. No risk - no excitement - no meaning - or at least to alot of us old school PVPers.
And no, its not about reward at all as you keep trying to push (stop twisting peoples words FFS), its about the feeling of that possibility, that you can lose or gain everything.
PS - before you reply and say 'wah wah wah, but it's a game' - don't bother. As we have already noted that you are looking for different qualities in your MMORPG gaming experience than I, and others in this thread - which is fine. Just quit trying to twist peoples words, ignore posts and continually push WOW as the best PVP gaming experience for every single playstyle - BECAUSE, IT ISN'T.
WoW PvP is skilless. The Rock, Paper, Scissors example makes sure of this. If you (class X) attack (Class Y) you'll win (if class Y == your class killer). That said, if (class Y) has T3 gear and you have T1 or less, your loose again. Its the FORCED GRIND I think most are talking about. I HAVE to PvE so that I can just compete in PvP. The fact that my guild rolled Horde and DID NOT GET PALLADINS or D0rf Preists with Fear ward and therefore nerfing our own PvE potential makes it all the worse. WoW is, as an above poster said, all about the grind. And thats true. World PvP is more or less dead. So what do they do, put in cross server battlegroups. Now there is allways enough people to make the next BG (AkA Honor Grind zone) spawn. You have to grind items to grind PvP honor, grind grind grind grind. meh. As for the whole, skill in PvP argument. Wow requires a lot of button mashing, they have not make the classes simple to play at all. From a technical standpoint its actually a fairly complicated game toplay. That said, IMO, complex character control is not skill. The use of tactics to win the 1 v 1 battles that exist are more akin to skill than deciding what button to mash. An example. In a more 'pure' PvP game, casters (mage for this example) are fodder. If a melee class gets near the caster he dies. (in WoW the casters have 'get out of jail free cards to negate this (PoM Polly, Frost Nova, Blink, in a more skillfull game they would require people to guard them so they can rain down holy terror on the enemy). The skill here is multifold. As a group, you have to fight the 1 v 1's, take out enemy healers/casters while protecting yours. Collsion detection makes this even more skill based. It requires group tactics in order to win. That said I feel that my group of 5 (or 6 or 8 depending on game) is better than most. In WoW, its almost purely zerg on zerg, honor grinding, random PuG people etc. So, go play WSG you'd say!. We actually did that. And after going I would honestly say 500-50, it A got old and B lost its allure. AB was fun as I could organize 15 of us to Play together, and we also did well here, prolly 300 or 400 to mebbe 40 or 50 losses. But that got old too. AV.... we do Preform AV's but the map just makes it too hard, and waiting around for a queue when I can get all 40 of my people in sucks. I yearn (as does most of my guild) for Emain Macha again. Im not knocking WoW PvP, hey if you did the Naxx grind to get 9/9 Naxx gear, I guess, you deserve something for it. What i've found after 20 years of gaming (ya im old) is that PvP'ers make the absolute WORST PvE'ers.
I think the greatest pisconception about WoW's PvP is when people say WoW PvP sux they think tactical PvP. Tactical PvP is what your char does next, as opposed to strategic PvP where you plan ahead what city to capture, send your troops there, watch results of that battle, plan your next move. In a strategic sense, WoW has no PvP - there is nothing to capture, there is just grind honor, thats it. From a tactical view, however, WoW has a pretty elaborate, fast paced and fun PvP. I had fun raiding opponents or defending against opponents (TM for hte win WOOOO). The fact that PvE items would make people who could afford to spend 80+ hours a week with much better chances of survival did some damage to the fun level ( I hate when peeps with ultimate godly sword of nerding would own many people before falling down, who doesnt? ), but still, that aside WoW PvP was fun - just like Counterstrike, fun for a round, next round, all over again.
If WoW had strategic PvP of anything DAOC like, or L2 like, or Planetside (OMG Bliz plz do that!) like, then WoW's pop would double for sure.
Your posts are well thought out, lucid and flame free, its nice to be able to engauge in a debate on a forum without it degrading to a "MY DAD'S EPEEN IS STUCK IN J00 MOMMY!!" type dialogue.
WoW WILL Implement some form of Strategic PvP before WAR, they have too. Also I saw a blue post saying they were looking at new ruleset server type, mabey a FFA PvP server? Blizzard as ive said has done a number of things right, and with little effort or minor tweaks here and there I think they could get a lot more of the Tactical team based PvP people involved. That said, the game would need some serious revision to be considered a PvP game, serious mechanics changes and im not sure that Blizzard would be willing to sacrifice the Lore of the game for a FFA Unlimited class PvP server. Ive now leveled 3 characters to 60, and have T2 or better gear on all of them, ive played the game and quit some time back. I don't want to grind anymore, I do truly long for DAoC RvR again... Angry Elves neone
Oh and for the posted who said that "its fact" that no one under 15 has a PC.. My 8 year old daugeters school send home a notice last week, THAT REQUIRES us to have a PC available for her to use by next year in the 4th grade. Im fortunate that I live in a prosperous country and area where I can't think of anyone without a computer, so please, sir, get your FACTS correct before you post them. Remember wat confucious said,"Tis better to be thought the fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt"
Originally posted by rohbshop true and thats the exact reason why you end up hating what you play and calling everything a grind because your whole focus is about the gain. You wont ever enjoy it if all your focusing on is the end reward throughout whatever 'grind' you set yourself upon. i enjoy myself in the moment, in the act of fighting and PvP. the endgame PvP rewards are an afterthought for me, while for you it'd be the whole goal. just like your poker example. I can enjoy the game of Poker for what it is, it doesnt take winning money to make it fun for me. Its the act of playing that makes it fun. the act of PvP is fun, for you its a chore for the rewards. youre just shooting yourself in the foot with that mentality especially when it comes to games.
Again, you are missing the point by a mile.
You will find a lot of people enjoy the THRILL of gambling - knowing that they are risking something of value. It is same with PVP.
So basically you are saying that the feelings, excitement and emotions of playing poker with fake money (no risk) is the same as playing poker with real money (risk).
When infact a playmoney table, you dont care at all. You put "all in" in situations that you wouldnt do on a real money table. You are "dumbed" down, not thinking straight and really are not paying any attention on that table IF you play on a real money table at the same time. Where the real action happens.
On the real money table, your feelings are completely different from the playmoney table. You are more focused and things you do will matter. Your palm gets sweaty when you have a good hand and are "all in" vs one guy. If you lose you your stomach will churn and you will learn from the experience, but if you win a great pot, that feeling is about the same as you would have skyjumping - oh the adrenaline rush!
Simply said, the feeling you have on a real money table is not the same as you would have on a playmoney table. Same with PVP. No risk - no excitement - no meaning - or at least to alot of us old school PVPers.
And no, its not about reward at all as you keep trying to push (stop twisting peoples words FFS), its about the feeling of that possibility, that you can lose or gain everything.
Thanks for coming.
Well put, sir.
To quote (I forget who, James Hetfeild comes to mind tho) Without darkness there can be no light.
No risk no reward. Nothing ventured nothing gained.
Im willing to risk real loss for the chance of real gain, I think thats another one of WoWs big problems. PvP is completelly gainless. When casters suicide for a free mana bar, there is something inherently wrong with the game mechanics.
Originally posted by rohbshop true and thats the exact reason why you end up hating what you play and calling everything a grind because your whole focus is about the gain. You wont ever enjoy it if all your focusing on is the end reward throughout whatever 'grind' you set yourself upon. i enjoy myself in the moment, in the act of fighting and PvP. the endgame PvP rewards are an afterthought for me, while for you it'd be the whole goal. just like your poker example. I can enjoy the game of Poker for what it is, it doesnt take winning money to make it fun for me. Its the act of playing that makes it fun. the act of PvP is fun, for you its a chore for the rewards. youre just shooting yourself in the foot with that mentality especially when it comes to games.
Again, you are missing the point by a mile.
You will find a lot of people enjoy the THRILL of gambling - knowing that they are risking something of value. It is same with PVP.
So basically you are saying that the feelings, excitement and emotions of playing poker with fake money (no risk) is the same as playing poker with real money (risk).
When infact a playmoney table, you dont care at all. You put "all in" in situations that you wouldnt do on a real money table. You are "dumbed" down, not thinking straight and really are not paying any attention on that table IF you play on a real money table at the same time. Where the real action happens.
On the real money table, your feelings are completely different from the playmoney table. You are more focused and things you do will matter. Your palm gets sweaty when you have a good hand and are "all in" vs one guy. If you lose you your stomach will churn and you will learn from the experience, but if you win a great pot, that feeling is about the same as you would have skyjumping - oh the adrenaline rush!
Simply said, the feeling you have on a real money table is not the same as you would have on a playmoney table. Same with PVP. No risk - no excitement - no meaning - or at least to alot of us old school PVPers.
And no, its not about reward at all as you keep trying to push (stop twisting peoples words FFS), its about the feeling of that possibility, that you can lose or gain everything.
PS - before you reply and say 'wah wah wah, but it's a game' - don't bother. As we have already noted that you are looking for different qualities in your MMORPG gaming experience than I, and others in this thread - which is fine. Just quit trying to twist peoples words, ignore posts and continually push WOW as the best PVP gaming experience for every single playstyle - BECAUSE, IT ISN'T.
Thanks for coming. Now that we have broken down the argument to pieces, its clear to understand where the issue is. For you, there has to be some kind of reward for the win, and some kind of penalty for loss. As you said with the poker example, ud rather bet real money on a chance to win/lose, rather then play for fun/fake money. rohbshop however does not. I dont either. Id rather be on a safe side and not gamble becuase a LOT of things in poker depend on chance, and I HATE betting on chance. I like to bet on my skill, my intelligence, my stamina, or anything that depend purely on something influenced by me, not by random chance. Thats the core difference between these 2 types of PvPers.
Theres nothing wrong with either one, its up for a taste. But, if a game was designed for one type, it cannot be for the other. So if WoW was designed for the type of people who do not like to risk their daily earnings and their left nut, then why complain? Thats one thing I dont understand, if a game was designed to be one thing, why expect a completely different thing and then complain about it? Its often a good idea to disscuss something in particular to find a way to improve things, but a complete overhaul of a combat system? That would be SWG all over again. Ill try to give an example.
Lets say you bought a digital receiver and subscribed to a playboy channel. It was advertised to showcase the hottest women in the world. The digital receiver itself cost u 50$ (one time non-refundable fee), and the monthly subscribtion costs u 15$ per month. 3 months later, they suddenly change Playboy Tv to PlayToy TV, where all they do is promote toys... just toys... but with hot women... Well, you are frustrated a bit, becuase you were signing up for something hotter. but you think it over and you find those girls with toys somewhat... entertaining. So you dont cancel a subscribtion. 3 months later the channel is being reorganized once more and it is now called PlayMartha where they show "The Martha Stewart Show" 24/7 ... Needless to say you dont find that show enternaining or hot enough. What does that leave u with? a 50$ non-refundable receiver, sour feeling of being slightly scammed and a huge desire for that someone who changed the original show to take that receiver and show it up their collective a... thats how i'd feel.
The point of the story is, if you sell a product, you cannot change it drasticaly or u risk alienating lots of current subscribers, and not gaining any new ones. Judging from the subscriber numbers, there are a LOT of people who dont realy like to bet their left testicle playing poker.I think ShadowBane would fit your playstyle most, and while Id never play it myself, if anyone would ask me how is it, id say "Meh, not my type of game", but id never ask them to change it to softcore PvP just becuase I like it that way.
Dont get me wrong, I understand that often people try to give suggestions that in their eyes would make a positive change to the game. I tried that once in Eve forum. I got some flames and some intelligent responces becuase what I was suggesting would drasticaly change their gameplay. I was puzzled of the reaction by the players, to me I was merely suggesting changes that in my view would improve the game. but in their eyes, all I was doing is change the game that they like NOW, but may hate LATER. Thats why theres such a tension between followers of these play-styles. I say, if it works, dont fix it. From financial point of view, WoW is a huge success, so I doubt very much they will do any major changes to WoW... Im afraid to imagine what would happen if WoW would have a CU.. SWG style... LOL wed probably have riots in real life.
Now that we have broken down the argument to pieces, its clear to understand where the issue is. For you, there has to be some kind of reward for the win, and some kind of penalty for loss. As you said with the poker example, ud rather bet real money on a chance to win/lose, rather then play for fun/fake money. rohbshop however does not. I dont either. Id rather be on a safe side and not gamble becuase a LOT of things in poker depend on chance, and I HATE betting on chance. I like to bet on my skill, my intelligence, my stamina, or anything that depend purely on something influenced by me, not by random chance. Thats the core difference between these 2 types of PvPers.
PVP isn't poker though. The PVP mechanics still stay the same, i am not suggesting they take away the skill side of things, infact, quite the opposite. It's just the reward/risk aspect that was relevant in the anology and the THRILL and EXCITEMENT of knowing there is something of value to risk should I die. So you argument here is mute.
Theres nothing wrong with either one, its up for a taste. But, if a game was designed for one type, it cannot be for the other. So if WoW was designed for the type of people who do not like to risk their daily earnings and their left nut, then why complain? Thats one thing I dont understand, if a game was designed to be one thing, why expect a completely different thing and then complain about it? Its often a good idea to disscuss something in particular to find a way to improve things, but a complete overhaul of a combat system? That would be SWG all over again. Ill try to give an example.
Which is what i said - neither is write or wrong, different playstyle different wants. And i am merely saying why i disliked WOW - i am not on the WOW forums nor am i emailing the dev's trying to change the game. I am simply discussing MMORPG's on a community forum, it's that simple.
Lets say you bought a digital receiver and subscribed to a playboy channel. It was advertised to showcase the hottest women in the world. The digital receiver itself cost u 50$ (one time non-refundable fee), and the monthly subscribtion costs u 15$ per month. 3 months later, they suddenly change Playboy Tv to PlayToy TV, where all they do is promote toys... just toys... but with hot women... Well, you are frustrated a bit, becuase you were signing up for something hotter. but you think it over and you find those girls with toys somewhat... entertaining. So you dont cancel a subscribtion. 3 months later the channel is being reorganized once more and it is now called PlayMartha where they show "The Martha Stewart Show" 24/7 ... Needless to say you dont find that show enternaining or hot enough. What does that leave u with? a 50$ non-refundable receiver, sour feeling of being slightly scammed and a huge desire for that someone who changed the original show to take that receiver and show it up their collective a... thats how i'd feel.
Irrelevant. See above.
The point of the story is, if you sell a product, you cannot change it drasticaly or u risk alienating lots of current subscribers, and not gaining any new ones. Judging from the subscriber numbers, there are a LOT of people who dont realy like to bet their left testicle playing poker.I think ShadowBane would fit your playstyle most, and while Id never play it myself, if anyone would ask me how is it, id say "Meh, not my type of game", but id never ask them to change it to softcore PvP just becuase I like it that way.
Irrelevant. See above.
Dont get me wrong, I understand that often people try to give suggestions that in their eyes would make a positive change to the game. I tried that once in Eve forum. I got some flames and some intelligent responces becuase what I was suggesting would drasticaly change their gameplay. I was puzzled of the reaction by the players, to me I was merely suggesting changes that in my view would improve the game. but in their eyes, all I was doing is change the game that they like NOW, but may hate LATER. Thats why theres such a tension between followers of these play-styles. I say, if it works, dont fix it. From financial point of view, WoW is a huge success, so I doubt very much they will do any major changes to WoW... Im afraid to imagine what would happen if WoW would have a CU.. SWG style... LOL wed probably have riots in real life.
Maybe you should choose ur words with more tender and care , i have several lvl 60's in WoW and i dislike the game, mostly because of its community , when the word "epic" comes into play in WoW , every person changes attitude and personality, never seen a community that is more immature than WoW and you wont be able to find one at this present time, and most people did make it to lvl 60 since it doesnt take a very long amount of time, and the only thing WoW has to offer consuming alot of ur IRL time because you have to instance to be able to keep up with the "hardcore" players, there is simple aint enough room for casual gamers in WoW.
Several level 60s? And you think the game sucks. Isn't that just because it got old for you?
I said i dislike the game , didnt say i hate it , but there is other games i would choose over it, and yea maybe WoW got to old for me, you may have a point there which i wont deny.
Several level 60s? And you think the game sucks. Isn't that just because it got old for you?
I said i dislike the game , didnt say i hate it , but there is other games i would choose over it, and yea maybe WoW got to old for me, you may have a point there which i wont deny.
Then your reason for disliking WoW had nothing to do with having an inferior complex when you're not one of those people. So you have nothing to be upset about.
1.) I have played almost every mmorpg since UO. I hated Lineage and EQ 1&2. I loved pre-suck SWG. I like WoW
2.) Most of the people I have met on the game have been pretty good people. Yeah, you have bad apples, but tell me where you won't have them
3.) Peeps on this site are anti-Blizz, anti-SOE, and think that Eve and DAoC are the best games created. Nothing compares. If you do not like their point of view, they call you names, acting like the "kids" they despise in WoW. Honestly, I don not care for EvE. Too boring for me. DAoC was okay, but not my style. WoW is good for me. Thank you. If you do not like it . . . shove it, shut your trap, and let other enjoy WoW as you enjoy EvE, DAoC, and UO.
As I was sitting here reading a few posts, it occured to me that WoW Bashing is rampant here. It's hard to get through a thread without someone making some comparison to WoW and then explaining why their MMO is better. Of course there's a fair amount of posts also that just say WoW sucks. I've also noticed that these threads are not confined to just MMORPG.com. They're everywhere. Now here's the strange thing....WoW has over 8 million players and it's apparently growing. That is a boat load of people. So what's the deal? Do these people not post on forums in support of the game, do they just ignore the WoW bashing, or are they bashing the game themselves while they're subscribed? I just don't understand why 99% of the WoW posts are negative towards the game, but the game itself continues to thrive and grow. My guess is that it's a bad case of MMO-envy on the basher's parts. They wish their game was as successful as WoW. Of course, that's just a guess. Anywho, just for clarification, I don't play the game myself. I tried it for about six months, and had a lot of fun during that time. However, I decided to move on and see what else is out there. I have yet to find a game that is as easy to get into and fun to play at the same time.
WoW has mainly first time players, and is very succesfull with them. In the forums you are most of the time reading posts from veteran mmorpg players. They just know how a mmorpg can be and with that have a much higher standard. Its easier to please first timers.
------------------------------------------------------ Do I ever sleep?
It's pretty obvious that you haven't actually ever played GW, based on your description. Maxing your faction isn't something you generally want to do, as it acts as a currency to buy skill unlocks and item unlocks. If you played it to 10k and then quit thinking that you had reached the end, then you are sorely mistaken.
And I don't think it's actually physically possible to gain faction that fast. Not even holding Hero's Ascent for 3 hours straight could do that. And holding HA for three hours on your first day is improbable at best, if not almost impossible.
When you first started posting I was pretty sure you were just trolling... but as the thread continues (I'm only about 11 pages in) I begin to fear that you might actually be the real deal.
And if thats true I feel truly sorry for you and the people that have to deal with you in real life on a daily basis.
*EDIT* This post is aimed squarely at roadwarriors. this is my first time posting and I figured that when I hit the quote button it would actually quote the post :P
Comments
Oh yeah, killing people with a rogue required lots of skill - stun locks for the win! Heh... 2 horde rogues jumped my rogue and they THOUGHT theyd do just what u were suggesting... They tried to chain stun me, 2 rogues, chain stun me to death... hehe. Well, I killed 1 and dmg the other half way before I was forced to flash myself out of trouble... Needles to say I received a purple coded whisper "omg u Pu**y, you sucks u n00b"... I never laughed harded then that day ROFL... I wish i was recording that fight to post it.. hmmm, id have to search throughmy recording collections, I might find something interesting to show...
PS: if you are wondering how I beat them, I managed to blind one of them to put him out of business for a bit, then deal with the other rogue - a little chain stunning of my own, till his buddy finaly cleaned his eyes and tried to save him... just to see his undead buddy... dying...again...LOL
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
TO YOU.
You are forgetting that not everyone likes meaningless, zero risk PVP experiences which outcomes are mainly dictated by your grinding ability (read equipment, read level). And not everyone hates that either. Being an optimist myself, Id rather think that 8 million of people who play WoW play so for their entertainment, and not because of their stupidity.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
TO YOU.
You are forgetting that not everyone likes meaningless, zero risk PVP experiences which outcomes are mainly dictated by your grinding ability (read equipment, read level).
but again what mmorpg's PvP isnt impacted directly by the PvE/grinding? thats the whole point of mmorpg PvP vs FPS. mmorpg PvP you get to bulid your character and customize/outfit him and see the fruition of that later on. FPS is like playing Pacman. When the game ends you start all over again at the same point with the same stuff. no character building or attachment.
As for zero risk PvP being so bad, i've played ShadowBane which is probably one of the harshest PvP based games in terms of deaths and penalizing the player. I'd much rather have WoW's death system since i play for fun, not to reallly ruin other peoples days, where dying means hours of grinding just to repair your equipment or weeks to get your city back.
Grief is overated.
And FPS in WOW is like playing pacman in that case - because when you die you start all over again - hey, you said it! When you die, you click respawn - who the f. cares? Exactly. It's pointless. If i kill someone they just respawn, as if nothing had just happened - rinse - repeat - fun.
So i prefer the thrill of playing poker with real money. You prefer the fun aspect of playing poker with fake money. Different wants, different needs - neither right - neither wrong.
& with that, this time im out of this reptitious thread.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
I think China and Asia in general is going through what NA went through 5-10 years ago. Once they taste the casualness of WoW they will be more likely to buy another game that is less grinding and more casual.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
And FPS in WOW is like playing pacman in that case - because when you die you start all over again - hey, you said it! When you die, you click respawn - who the f. cares? Exactly. It's pointless. If i kill someone they just respawn, as if nothing had just happened - rinse - repeat - fun.
So i prefer the thrill of playing poker with real money. You prefer the fun aspect of playing poker with fake money. Different wants, different needs - neither right - neither wrong.
& with that, this time im out of this reptitious thread.
true and thats the exact reason why you end up hating what you play and calling everything a grind because your whole focus is about the gain. You wont ever enjoy it if all your focusing on is the end reward throughout whatever 'grind' you set yourself upon.
i enjoy myself in the moment, in the act of fighting and PvP. the endgame PvP rewards are an afterthought for me, while for you it'd be the whole goal.
just like your poker example. I can enjoy the game of Poker for what it is, it doesnt take winning money to make it fun for me. Its the act of playing that makes it fun. the act of PvP is fun, for you its a chore for the rewards. youre just shooting yourself in the foot with that mentality especially when it comes to games.
And FPS in WOW is like playing pacman in that case - because when you die you start all over again - hey, you said it! When you die, you click respawn - who the f. cares? Exactly. It's pointless. If i kill someone they just respawn, as if nothing had just happened - rinse - repeat - fun.
So i prefer the thrill of playing poker with real money. You prefer the fun aspect of playing poker with fake money. Different wants, different needs - neither right - neither wrong.
& with that, this time im out of this reptitious thread. Strategic PvP in WoW is nonexistant, but I wouldnt call it pointless... according to XFIRE ( xfire.com ) here are the stats for the top games:
the 2nd, 3rd,4th,6th,7th,8th and 9th game are strategicaly nonexistant ( well im actualy unsure about WC3, whether the world is persistent or not, i assume its like starcraft, u play a round, u win/lose, u start a new round) from the PvP standpoint. Meaning your success or failure will not affect you in your future games, your score and ego may suffer but thats it. And yet those games are so popular, becuase its fun! it may not make sense in the long run, but its getin-havefun-getout playstyle is addictive and entertaining.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
And FPS in WOW is like playing pacman in that case - because when you die you start all over again - hey, you said it! When you die, you click respawn - who the f. cares? Exactly. It's pointless. If i kill someone they just respawn, as if nothing had just happened - rinse - repeat - fun.
So i prefer the thrill of playing poker with real money. You prefer the fun aspect of playing poker with fake money. Different wants, different needs - neither right - neither wrong.
& with that, this time im out of this reptitious thread.
true and thats the exact reason why you end up hating what you play and calling everything a grind because your whole focus is about the gain. You wont ever enjoy it if all your focusing on is the end reward throughout whatever 'grind' you set yourself upon.
i enjoy myself in the moment, in the act of fighting and PvP. the endgame PvP rewards are an afterthought for me, while for you it'd be the whole goal.
just like your poker example. I can enjoy the game of Poker for what it is, it doesnt take winning money to make it fun for me. Its the act of playing that makes it fun. the act of PvP is fun, for you its a chore for the rewards. youre just shooting yourself in the foot with that mentality especially when it comes to games.
Best poker example ever! heh. I wouldnt have posted my previous post if I saw your reply before submitting mine.I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
You will find a lot of people enjoy the THRILL of gambling - knowing that they are risking something of value. It is same with PVP.
So basically you are saying that the feelings, excitement and emotions of playing poker with fake money (no risk) is the same as playing poker with real money (risk).
When infact a playmoney table, you dont care at all. You put "all in" in situations that you wouldnt do on a real money table. You are "dumbed" down, not thinking straight and really are not paying any attention on that table IF you play on a real money table at the same time. Where the real action happens.
On the real money table, your feelings are completely different from the playmoney table. You are more focused and things you do will matter. Your palm gets sweaty when you have a good hand and are "all in" vs one guy. If you lose you your stomach will churn and you will learn from the experience, but if you win a great pot, that feeling is about the same as you would have skyjumping - oh the adrenaline rush!
Simply said, the feeling you have on a real money table is not the same as you would have on a playmoney table. Same with PVP. No risk - no excitement - no meaning - or at least to alot of us old school PVPers.
And no, its not about reward at all as you keep trying to push (stop twisting peoples words FFS), its about the feeling of that possibility, that you can lose or gain everything.
PS - before you reply and say 'wah wah wah, but it's a game' - don't bother. As we have already noted that you are looking for different qualities in your MMORPG gaming experience than I, and others in this thread - which is fine. Just quit trying to twist peoples words, ignore posts and continually push WOW as the best PVP gaming experience for every single playstyle - BECAUSE, IT ISN'T.
Thanks for coming.
Your posts are well thought out, lucid and flame free, its nice to be able to engauge in a debate on a forum without it degrading to a "MY DAD'S EPEEN IS STUCK IN J00 MOMMY!!" type dialogue.
WoW
WILL Implement some form of Strategic PvP before WAR, they have too. Also I saw a blue post saying they were looking at new ruleset server type, mabey a FFA PvP server? Blizzard as ive said has done a number of things right, and with little effort or minor tweaks here and there I think they could get a lot more of the Tactical team based PvP people involved. That said, the game would need some serious revision to be considered a PvP game, serious mechanics changes and im not sure that Blizzard would be willing to sacrifice the Lore of the game for a FFA Unlimited class PvP server. Ive now leveled 3 characters to 60, and have T2 or better gear on all of them, ive played the game and quit some time back. I don't want to grind anymore, I do truly long for DAoC RvR again... Angry Elves neone
Oh and for the posted who said that "its fact" that no one under 15 has a PC.. My 8 year old daugeters school send home a notice last week, THAT REQUIRES us to have a PC available for her to use by next year in the 4th grade. Im fortunate that I live in a prosperous country and area where I can't think of anyone without a computer, so please, sir, get your FACTS correct before you post them. Remember wat confucious said,"Tis better to be thought the fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt"
Wink
Well put, sir.
To quote (I forget who, James Hetfeild comes to mind tho) Without darkness there can be no light.
No risk no reward. Nothing ventured nothing gained.
Im willing to risk real loss for the chance of real gain, I think thats another one of WoWs big problems. PvP is completelly gainless. When casters suicide for a free mana bar, there is something inherently wrong with the game mechanics.
Wink
You will find a lot of people enjoy the THRILL of gambling - knowing that they are risking something of value. It is same with PVP.
So basically you are saying that the feelings, excitement and emotions of playing poker with fake money (no risk) is the same as playing poker with real money (risk).
When infact a playmoney table, you dont care at all. You put "all in" in situations that you wouldnt do on a real money table. You are "dumbed" down, not thinking straight and really are not paying any attention on that table IF you play on a real money table at the same time. Where the real action happens.
On the real money table, your feelings are completely different from the playmoney table. You are more focused and things you do will matter. Your palm gets sweaty when you have a good hand and are "all in" vs one guy. If you lose you your stomach will churn and you will learn from the experience, but if you win a great pot, that feeling is about the same as you would have skyjumping - oh the adrenaline rush!
Simply said, the feeling you have on a real money table is not the same as you would have on a playmoney table. Same with PVP. No risk - no excitement - no meaning - or at least to alot of us old school PVPers.
And no, its not about reward at all as you keep trying to push (stop twisting peoples words FFS), its about the feeling of that possibility, that you can lose or gain everything.
PS - before you reply and say 'wah wah wah, but it's a game' - don't bother. As we have already noted that you are looking for different qualities in your MMORPG gaming experience than I, and others in this thread - which is fine. Just quit trying to twist peoples words, ignore posts and continually push WOW as the best PVP gaming experience for every single playstyle - BECAUSE, IT ISN'T.
Thanks for coming. Now that we have broken down the argument to pieces, its clear to understand where the issue is. For you, there has to be some kind of reward for the win, and some kind of penalty for loss. As you said with the poker example, ud rather bet real money on a chance to win/lose, rather then play for fun/fake money. rohbshop however does not. I dont either. Id rather be on a safe side and not gamble becuase a LOT of things in poker depend on chance, and I HATE betting on chance. I like to bet on my skill, my intelligence, my stamina, or anything that depend purely on something influenced by me, not by random chance. Thats the core difference between these 2 types of PvPers.
Theres nothing wrong with either one, its up for a taste. But, if a game was designed for one type, it cannot be for the other. So if WoW was designed for the type of people who do not like to risk their daily earnings and their left nut, then why complain? Thats one thing I dont understand, if a game was designed to be one thing, why expect a completely different thing and then complain about it? Its often a good idea to disscuss something in particular to find a way to improve things, but a complete overhaul of a combat system? That would be SWG all over again. Ill try to give an example.
Lets say you bought a digital receiver and subscribed to a playboy channel. It was advertised to showcase the hottest women in the world. The digital receiver itself cost u 50$ (one time non-refundable fee), and the monthly subscribtion costs u 15$ per month. 3 months later, they suddenly change Playboy Tv to PlayToy TV, where all they do is promote toys... just toys... but with hot women... Well, you are frustrated a bit, becuase you were signing up for something hotter. but you think it over and you find those girls with toys somewhat... entertaining. So you dont cancel a subscribtion. 3 months later the channel is being reorganized once more and it is now called PlayMartha where they show "The Martha Stewart Show" 24/7 ... Needless to say you dont find that show enternaining or hot enough. What does that leave u with? a 50$ non-refundable receiver, sour feeling of being slightly scammed and a huge desire for that someone who changed the original show to take that receiver and show it up their collective a... thats how i'd feel.
The point of the story is, if you sell a product, you cannot change it drasticaly or u risk alienating lots of current subscribers, and not gaining any new ones. Judging from the subscriber numbers, there are a LOT of people who dont realy like to bet their left testicle playing poker.I think ShadowBane would fit your playstyle most, and while Id never play it myself, if anyone would ask me how is it, id say "Meh, not my type of game", but id never ask them to change it to softcore PvP just becuase I like it that way.
Dont get me wrong, I understand that often people try to give suggestions that in their eyes would make a positive change to the game. I tried that once in Eve forum. I got some flames and some intelligent responces becuase what I was suggesting would drasticaly change their gameplay. I was puzzled of the reaction by the players, to me I was merely suggesting changes that in my view would improve the game. but in their eyes, all I was doing is change the game that they like NOW, but may hate LATER. Thats why theres such a tension between followers of these play-styles. I say, if it works, dont fix it. From financial point of view, WoW is a huge success, so I doubt very much they will do any major changes to WoW... Im afraid to imagine what would happen if WoW would have a CU.. SWG style... LOL wed probably have riots in real life.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
Maybe you should choose ur words with more tender and care , i have several lvl 60's in WoW and i dislike the game, mostly because of its community , when the word "epic" comes into play in WoW , every person changes attitude and personality, never seen a community that is more immature than WoW and you wont be able to find one at this present time, and most people did make it to lvl 60 since it doesnt take a very long amount of time, and the only thing WoW has to offer consuming alot of ur IRL time because you have to instance to be able to keep up with the "hardcore" players, there is simple aint enough room for casual gamers in WoW.
List of SOE lies
I said i dislike the game , didnt say i hate it , but there is other games i would choose over it, and yea maybe WoW got to old for me, you may have a point there which i wont deny.
List of SOE lies
I said i dislike the game , didnt say i hate it , but there is other games i would choose over it, and yea maybe WoW got to old for me, you may have a point there which i wont deny.
Then your reason for disliking WoW had nothing to do with having an inferior complex when you're not one of those people. So you have nothing to be upset about.
1.) I have played almost every mmorpg since UO. I hated Lineage and EQ 1&2. I loved pre-suck SWG. I like WoW
2.) Most of the people I have met on the game have been pretty good people. Yeah, you have bad apples, but tell me where you won't have them
3.) Peeps on this site are anti-Blizz, anti-SOE, and think that Eve and DAoC are the best games created. Nothing compares. If you do not like their point of view, they call you names, acting like the "kids" they despise in WoW. Honestly, I don not care for EvE. Too boring for me. DAoC was okay, but not my style. WoW is good for me. Thank you. If you do not like it . . . shove it, shut your trap, and let other enjoy WoW as you enjoy EvE, DAoC, and UO.
WoW has mainly first time players, and is very succesfull with them. In the forums you are most of the time reading posts from veteran mmorpg players. They just know how a mmorpg can be and with that have a much higher standard. Its easier to please first timers.
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Do I ever sleep?
And I don't think it's actually physically possible to gain faction that fast. Not even holding Hero's Ascent for 3 hours straight could do that. And holding HA for three hours on your first day is improbable at best, if not almost impossible.
When you first started posting I was pretty sure you were just trolling... but as the thread continues (I'm only about 11 pages in) I begin to fear that you might actually be the real deal.
And if thats true I feel truly sorry for you and the people that have to deal with you in real life on a daily basis.
*EDIT* This post is aimed squarely at roadwarriors. this is my first time posting and I figured that when I hit the quote button it would actually quote the post :P