Meens everyone got like 10 alts , els it includes beta testers chars and that is pahtetic. They are blowing it out of proportion.
Probly not beta characters as those were erased unless pre-ordered. Also it is the same with EQ2 numbers or WoW saying they have 9 million subscribers when 7 million are in china playing for 2 cents an hour.
Marketing is marketing and you can spin numbers anyway you want. Hell the Senate of the U.S. almost passed a ban on Dihydro Oxide due to the fact that it is one of the largest causes of death in the United States.
Spin it how they spin it the max chars you can have on an acct is 5. So they are at 800k accounts. I gotta say that is pretty dam good for being only out in the US and UK right?
No 5 toons per server i think. Dunno anyone who has 5 toons pers server, but Im sure some do. Its probably all chars created since launch, including founders from beta. Its immpossible to know how many subs..but no where near 800k. A guess would be 175-250. I have no idea really.
See you in the dream.. The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
Well I already know a lot of people leaving the game because they made 50 and don't want to farm or gind for nothing. Just like WOW it isn't active players only total supscribers. Not very accurate data but than it won't make them look as small as they are.
Meens everyone got like 10 alts , els it includes beta testers chars and that is pahtetic. They are blowing it out of proportion.
Probly not beta characters as those were erased unless pre-ordered. Also it is the same with EQ2 numbers or WoW saying they have 9 million subscribers when 7 million are in china playing for 2 cents an hour.
Marketing is marketing and you can spin numbers anyway you want. Hell the Senate of the U.S. almost passed a ban on Dihydro Oxide due to the fact that it is one of the largest causes of death in the United States.
Spin it how they spin it the max chars you can have on an acct is 5. So they are at 800k accounts. I gotta say that is pretty dam good for being only out in the US and UK right?
I hate to pick on anyone seeing as how we have had so much agreement and all but this post is a good example of why turbine is so wrong doing what they are doing and why the 'F' label is applicable in many cases (not to mention it shows again how much hype and exaggeration comes from Turbine and LotROs fans).
Consider the X million character thing - it is totally a bogus and irrelevant number. Tons could be from the first couple weeks where people are trying out things, many could be left over from open beta, many could be the result of the stupid 'undefeated' titles which have people regularly re-rolling if they die in the first 15 levels. Heck, Turbine could have created 3 million characters themselves just to make the number seem more impressive. Point is the number is as meaningless as meaningless can be - that is what makes it a BS claim, BS hype, and BS marketing.
The reaction of Namelessbob and some others is what I have been arguing against all this time in this thread or others where meaningless numbers or hype and marketing crap gets spun without basis into LotRO having 800k subs. LotRO may very well have 800k subs, or 2 million, or 20 subscriptions - I have no idea. He has no idea. Nobody has any idea. The only real thing we can base a 'guesstimate' off of is the server count and the fact that it remains the same as launch - this likely says growth is not fast and I suppose we can estimate a max possible population from it but that is about it. Turbine keeps spinning this crap precisely because they know people will think it is meaningful and because fan___s will take it and run with it all over the place spinning it into the most elaborate fantasy of LotRO greatness imaginable.
If you think I am being harsh then understand that I am not really directing this reply at Namelessbob per se, but at the tons of similar type hype/spin purveyors across all boards and such all over. LotRO has a ton of people running around making far worse and far more exaggerated comments than does Namelessbob above but it is of a similar vein and what I was talking about before. I also believe that Turbine keeps doing this marketing as they are precisely because they know it will charge up thier supporters and create more hype and such. Either way, I think it is clear that Turbine is full of it with thier advertising and marketing and even thier comments related to the game and I think you can see, at least a little, what people are talking about when they say they are sick of LotRO fans going on and on about being WoW like or million sub like in terms of success when there is no information to say it is in any way remarkably in terms of its success.
Either way, I think it is clear that Turbine is full of it with thier advertising and marketing and even thier comments related to the game and I think you can see, at least a little, what people are talking about when they say they are sick of LotRO fans going on and on about being WoW like or million sub like in terms of success when there is no information to say it is in any way remarkably in terms of its success.
I was in full agreement till this statement here. Marketing teams do take the numbers and spin them the way they have to be spun in order to look good. Just like tobacco companies are able to say that milk kills more people than smoking since cancer is what kills people not the actual cig leaping up and strangling them or something. Spinning numbers is a job these days and to make your thing look good is what it is all about whether that is right or not is truly the question. I don't believe it is. Just like EQ2 saying their over inflated numbers to SWG denying claims of accounts closed to WoW selling over 5million accounts to The9 and claiming they are active since the9 holds their value open with their agreement.
The only thing that there is proof of is first month sales between WoW and Lotr:O if you truly are going to go their with the claims and WoW sold about 100k less first 30 days than Lotr:O. Now yeah I understand marketing and Lord of the Rings being in everyones vocabulary already from the movies, but in comparison there are initial sales. From beyond that there can be very little comparison between any games unless they were released on same day with the same budget for marketing ect..
Shrug in the end it doesn't matter. Everyone plays the game they want to play and who cares about the numbers unless it is being threatened to close down like Auto Assault which I think is one of the more popular MMo's to be shut down as of recently due to the team picking up and moving on to Tabula Rasa.
Either way, I think it is clear that Turbine is full of it with thier advertising and marketing and even thier comments related to the game and I think you can see, at least a little, what people are talking about when they say they are sick of LotRO fans going on and on about being WoW like or million sub like in terms of success when there is no information to say it is in any way remarkably in terms of its success.
I was in full agreement till this statement here. Marketing teams do take the numbers and spin them the way they have to be spun in order to look good.
For the low, low price of only $9.99... That's right... for under $10.00....
Kinda like that
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
Either way, I think it is clear that Turbine is full of it with thier advertising and marketing and even thier comments related to the game and I think you can see, at least a little, what people are talking about when they say they are sick of LotRO fans going on and on about being WoW like or million sub like in terms of success when there is no information to say it is in any way remarkably in terms of its success.
I was in full agreement till this statement here. Marketing teams do take the numbers and spin them the way they have to be spun in order to look good.
For the low, low price of only $9.99... That's right... for under $10.00....
Kinda like that
Sure things like that are part of business and marketing - no doubt. But the difference here is that in your example it is UNDER $10 so they are spinning truthfully. I think Turbine is spinning untruthfully in so far as it seems unlikely they have the sub numbers they keep implying (a presumption I know but i think we can all probably agree it is unlikely they have millions of subs on 20 servers or tht they would not announce such an accomplishment officially. It isn't so much the spin as it is the spin of a falsehood that find so distasteful, and the way that carries forward to the fans and community.
Originally posted by FikusOfAhazi
I think I can see what your saying now smith. Not sure If I agree with everything totally, but i get it now.
As understanding can often be more valuable than agreement , perhaps i will rest on that. :-)
Comments
Probly not beta characters as those were erased unless pre-ordered. Also it is the same with EQ2 numbers or WoW saying they have 9 million subscribers when 7 million are in china playing for 2 cents an hour.
Marketing is marketing and you can spin numbers anyway you want. Hell the Senate of the U.S. almost passed a ban on Dihydro Oxide due to the fact that it is one of the largest causes of death in the United States.
Spin it how they spin it the max chars you can have on an acct is 5. So they are at 800k accounts. I gotta say that is pretty dam good for being only out in the US and UK right?
No 5 toons per server i think. Dunno anyone who has 5 toons pers server, but Im sure some do. Its probably all chars created since launch, including founders from beta. Its immpossible to know how many subs..but no where near 800k. A guess would be 175-250. I have no idea really.
See you in the dream..
The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
Well I already know a lot of people leaving the game because they made 50 and don't want to farm or gind for nothing. Just like WOW it isn't active players only total supscribers. Not very accurate data but than it won't make them look as small as they are.
Probly not beta characters as those were erased unless pre-ordered. Also it is the same with EQ2 numbers or WoW saying they have 9 million subscribers when 7 million are in china playing for 2 cents an hour.
Marketing is marketing and you can spin numbers anyway you want. Hell the Senate of the U.S. almost passed a ban on Dihydro Oxide due to the fact that it is one of the largest causes of death in the United States.
Spin it how they spin it the max chars you can have on an acct is 5. So they are at 800k accounts. I gotta say that is pretty dam good for being only out in the US and UK right?
I hate to pick on anyone seeing as how we have had so much agreement and all but this post is a good example of why turbine is so wrong doing what they are doing and why the 'F' label is applicable in many cases (not to mention it shows again how much hype and exaggeration comes from Turbine and LotROs fans).
Consider the X million character thing - it is totally a bogus and irrelevant number. Tons could be from the first couple weeks where people are trying out things, many could be left over from open beta, many could be the result of the stupid 'undefeated' titles which have people regularly re-rolling if they die in the first 15 levels. Heck, Turbine could have created 3 million characters themselves just to make the number seem more impressive. Point is the number is as meaningless as meaningless can be - that is what makes it a BS claim, BS hype, and BS marketing.
The reaction of Namelessbob and some others is what I have been arguing against all this time in this thread or others where meaningless numbers or hype and marketing crap gets spun without basis into LotRO having 800k subs. LotRO may very well have 800k subs, or 2 million, or 20 subscriptions - I have no idea. He has no idea. Nobody has any idea. The only real thing we can base a 'guesstimate' off of is the server count and the fact that it remains the same as launch - this likely says growth is not fast and I suppose we can estimate a max possible population from it but that is about it. Turbine keeps spinning this crap precisely because they know people will think it is meaningful and because fan___s will take it and run with it all over the place spinning it into the most elaborate fantasy of LotRO greatness imaginable.
If you think I am being harsh then understand that I am not really directing this reply at Namelessbob per se, but at the tons of similar type hype/spin purveyors across all boards and such all over. LotRO has a ton of people running around making far worse and far more exaggerated comments than does Namelessbob above but it is of a similar vein and what I was talking about before. I also believe that Turbine keeps doing this marketing as they are precisely because they know it will charge up thier supporters and create more hype and such. Either way, I think it is clear that Turbine is full of it with thier advertising and marketing and even thier comments related to the game and I think you can see, at least a little, what people are talking about when they say they are sick of LotRO fans going on and on about being WoW like or million sub like in terms of success when there is no information to say it is in any way remarkably in terms of its success.
--------------------------------
Achiever 60.00%, Socializer 53.00%, Killer 47.00%, Explorer 40.00%
Intel Core i7 Quad, Intel X58 SLi, 6G Corsair XMS DDR3, Intel X-25 SSD, 3 WD Velociraptor SATA SuperTrak SAS EX8650 Array, OCZ 1250W PS, GTX 295, xFi, 32" 1080p LCD
I think I can see what your saying now smith. Not sure If I agree with everything totally, but i get it now.
See you in the dream..
The Fires from heaven, now as cold as ice. A rapid ascension tolls a heavy price.
I was in full agreement till this statement here. Marketing teams do take the numbers and spin them the way they have to be spun in order to look good. Just like tobacco companies are able to say that milk kills more people than smoking since cancer is what kills people not the actual cig leaping up and strangling them or something. Spinning numbers is a job these days and to make your thing look good is what it is all about whether that is right or not is truly the question. I don't believe it is. Just like EQ2 saying their over inflated numbers to SWG denying claims of accounts closed to WoW selling over 5million accounts to The9 and claiming they are active since the9 holds their value open with their agreement.
The only thing that there is proof of is first month sales between WoW and Lotr:O if you truly are going to go their with the claims and WoW sold about 100k less first 30 days than Lotr:O. Now yeah I understand marketing and Lord of the Rings being in everyones vocabulary already from the movies, but in comparison there are initial sales. From beyond that there can be very little comparison between any games unless they were released on same day with the same budget for marketing ect..
Shrug in the end it doesn't matter. Everyone plays the game they want to play and who cares about the numbers unless it is being threatened to close down like Auto Assault which I think is one of the more popular MMo's to be shut down as of recently due to the team picking up and moving on to Tabula Rasa.
I was in full agreement till this statement here. Marketing teams do take the numbers and spin them the way they have to be spun in order to look good.
For the low, low price of only $9.99... That's right... for under $10.00....
Kinda like that
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
I was in full agreement till this statement here. Marketing teams do take the numbers and spin them the way they have to be spun in order to look good.
For the low, low price of only $9.99... That's right... for under $10.00....
Kinda like that
Sure things like that are part of business and marketing - no doubt. But the difference here is that in your example it is UNDER $10 so they are spinning truthfully. I think Turbine is spinning untruthfully in so far as it seems unlikely they have the sub numbers they keep implying (a presumption I know but i think we can all probably agree it is unlikely they have millions of subs on 20 servers or tht they would not announce such an accomplishment officially. It isn't so much the spin as it is the spin of a falsehood that find so distasteful, and the way that carries forward to the fans and community.
As understanding can often be more valuable than agreement , perhaps i will rest on that. :-)
--------------------------------
Achiever 60.00%, Socializer 53.00%, Killer 47.00%, Explorer 40.00%
Intel Core i7 Quad, Intel X58 SLi, 6G Corsair XMS DDR3, Intel X-25 SSD, 3 WD Velociraptor SATA SuperTrak SAS EX8650 Array, OCZ 1250W PS, GTX 295, xFi, 32" 1080p LCD