If, say, an average player had $100,000 in his bank/home and upon death you lose about an average of $2,000 worth of items. Would this be acceptable? Or are you still afraid of losing this? If so, why?
Because those people usually come from games where they spent X many hours spawn camping/ raiding to get certain items and they think "OMG I'll lose my uber dress-up girlyboy hot pants!" and don't realize that for the most part gear isn't like that here and player-crafted is pretty much top dog anyway.
If I lost 2000$ worth of items every time I died, I would be choked. But were not talking about 2000$ worth of items were talking virtual items that exist in a computer game and have no real value.
For alot of people like me it will bring both more fun and frustration to the game. I like how you will need to really watch your back, or rely on your fellow guild members or friends. It brings a more "real world" situation to the game that not alot have experienced. Which then brings in the frustration. If you are not used to something like this, then ya... you will be mad when someone steals your items. Maybe you will be made that you lost money, or just made that you will need to craft another or buy another.
Over all, I will have a great time with this style of game!
If, say, an average player had $100,000 in his bank/home and upon death you lose about an average of $2,000 worth of items. Would this be acceptable? Or are you still afraid of losing this? If so, why?
We will have to earn that money first, hiding from hordes of gankers. Not that this is not cool, but can be a pain in the ass if you get ganked too often.
because these items take time, effort and dedication to acquire. it sounds like a nice concept, but i am yet to be convinced that this type of game mechanic can support an MMO.
features this revolutionary tend to be game making or game breaking. furthermore, this game looks sort of old, just the graphics, cursors, interface menus etc.. so i fear the mechanics of movement and pvp might be less than awesome, if this is the case then yo have to worry about losing items you work for on a less than awesome pvp engine.
i know some of you sleep with darkfall admins every night and can't stand to hear criticism, and while i give credit for trying new things, some of these features just sound like they are too exclusive to be widely accepted and embraced.
because these items take time, effort and dedication to acquire. it sounds like a nice concept, but i am yet to be convinced that this type of game mechanic can support an MMO. features this revolutionary tend to be game making or game breaking. furthermore, this game looks sort of old, just the graphics, cursors, interface menus etc.. so i fear the mechanics of movement and pvp might be less than awesome, if this is the case then yo have to worry about losing items you work for on a less than awesome pvp engine.
i know some of you sleep with darkfall admins every night and can't stand to hear criticism, and while i give credit for trying new things, some of these features just sound like they are too exclusive to be widely accepted and embraced.
you don't google much, do you?
err . . . this is not a loot centric game like WoW
Hence, DF being a niche game . . . not a WoW killer.
because these items take time, effort and dedication to acquire. it sounds like a nice concept, but i am yet to be convinced that this type of game mechanic can support an MMO. features this revolutionary tend to be game making or game breaking. furthermore, this game looks sort of old, just the graphics, cursors, interface menus etc.. so i fear the mechanics of movement and pvp might be less than awesome, if this is the case then yo have to worry about losing items you work for on a less than awesome pvp engine.
But you have to realize one thing. The items won't be as hard to get in Darkfall when compared to games like WoW. If you kept that in mind, would you still feel the same way?
My point is, I have a feeling people who are afraid of full loot don't understand that their items won't really take that long to get. And if they do realize it and are still complaining, well, they probably should not be playing videogames - as it would seem they can't handle losing, ever.
The biggest problem with full looting (especially today, not so bad about 10 years ago) is that there will ALWAYS be a group of players running around KoS anyone. And there will not always be a group of people to fight and defend against them. In the older full loot mmos there were at least guilds that stood against these "ganksquads". I'm afraid that in the community of today's MMO market (no offense, but you darkfall fans seem rather childish) all this game will be is a massive gankfest. Add the fact that in EVERY video I've seen of gameplay players die in 1-4 hits, and what you have in the makings is "Gankfall"
As for the dying part, I have no problem dying. I suicide sometimes just for a laugh lol. I guess the plus side of full looting is that there really won't be a reason for the gank squads to corpse camp, other than being @$$es, which there will be plenty of those around (*cough* WoW PvP Servers *cough*) I've played several games that had full loot. One of which where it was hard to get your items, and I loved those games. The thing that made it lovable is that you could run to the nearest town, gather up a group of people and go destroy the gank squad, and steal all thier stuff . As I said though, this day and age, half the server will probably just /ignore you if you bring up a LFG flag for an anti-gank squad squad.
People like me are noit concerned with what might be lost to a full loot incident. My concern is that every one of the thousands I'll mow down on a daily basis will be wearing crap gear that i wouldn't even want cluttering my inventory.
The biggest problem with full looting (especially today, not so bad about 10 years ago) is that there will ALWAYS be a group of players running around KoS anyone. And there will not always be a group of people to fight and defend against them. In the older full loot mmos there were at least guilds that stood against these "ganksquads". I'm afraid that in the community of today's MMO market (no offense, but you darkfall fans seem rather childish) all this game will be is a massive gankfest. Add the fact that in EVERY video I've seen of gameplay players die in 1-4 hits, and what you have in the makings is "Gankfall"
As for the dying part, I have no problem dying. I suicide sometimes just for a laugh lol. I guess the plus side of full looting is that there really won't be a reason for the gank squads to corpse camp, other than being @$$es, which there will be plenty of those around (*cough* WoW PvP Servers *cough*) I've played several games that had full loot. One of which where it was hard to get your items, and I loved those games. The thing that made it lovable is that you could run to the nearest town, gather up a group of people and go destroy the gank squad, and steal all thier stuff . As I said though, this day and age, half the server will probably just /ignore you if you bring up a LFG flag for an anti-gank squad squad.
I think you're right, if we bring a bunch of wow players, but from the sound of it... it's going to be a bunch of UO players.
I don't plan on griefing/pk'ing. I plan on helping kill them like I did in UO (like a lot of people did in UO).
Thus far, the darkfall community reminds me of the UO community, so there should be plenty of anti-pk squads around.
because these items take time, effort and dedication to acquire. it sounds like a nice concept, but i am yet to be convinced that this type of game mechanic can support an MMO. features this revolutionary tend to be game making or game breaking. furthermore, this game looks sort of old, just the graphics, cursors, interface menus etc.. so i fear the mechanics of movement and pvp might be less than awesome, if this is the case then yo have to worry about losing items you work for on a less than awesome pvp engine.
But you have to realize one thing. The items won't be as hard to get in Darkfall when compared to games like WoW. If you kept that in mind, would you still feel the same way?
My point is, I have a feeling people who are afraid of full loot don't understand that their items won't really take that long to get. And if they do realize it and are still complaining, well, they probably should not be playing videogames - as it would seem they can't handle losing, ever.
You are using the wrong term because quite frankly you are being dismissive. No one is "afraid" of full loot. They don't find it fun. There is a HUGE difference.
You want to attribute the idea that it takes some sort of constitution of the will for anyone who can handle such a game mechanic.
What it takes is the idea that it is fun to be looted and to loot others. What you can't understand is that there are people who will find no fun in either. Myself included quite frankly. I could care less about looting others and can't understand why anyone would find that fun. conversely, the idea of constantly replenishing my items, no matter how easy to get seems kind of pedantic and tiresome.
Some people love crafting, some exploring, some pvp'ing and some heavy death penalties, some ganking, some role playing.
It's more about the difference in how people are wired.
But for some reason, no matter how many times society screams "people are different" it just doesn't seem to soak in.
So one more time, "people are different". I'm sure we have different favorite colors and different favorite pies. Yet no one is screaming "why are people afraid of lemon merengue.
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I hope there are alot of them around. I would love to see Darkfall become the best game. It combines 2 of my favorite Vintage MMOs, UO and Ashen Empires, into a 3D version. If all the WoW players stay out of it, then I will probably come to play it a couple months after release. There's a reason why 90% of the WoW PvP servers are listed as "Low"....Griefers.
because these items take time, effort and dedication to acquire. it sounds like a nice concept, but i am yet to be convinced that this type of game mechanic can support an MMO. features this revolutionary tend to be game making or game breaking. furthermore, this game looks sort of old, just the graphics, cursors, interface menus etc.. so i fear the mechanics of movement and pvp might be less than awesome, if this is the case then yo have to worry about losing items you work for on a less than awesome pvp engine.
But you have to realize one thing. The items won't be as hard to get in Darkfall when compared to games like WoW. If you kept that in mind, would you still feel the same way?
My point is, I have a feeling people who are afraid of full loot don't understand that their items won't really take that long to get. And if they do realize it and are still complaining, well, they probably should not be playing videogames - as it would seem they can't handle losing, ever.
That's a double edged sword and both edges are dull. If you lose a lot you're continually grinding out gear anyway. If you win a lot you'r'e just accumulating a mass of worthless crap gear. On the other hand if you're like most people ypou pretty much break even and it's not a factor. So if gear isn't a factor full loot isn't a factor and it loses both reasons for having full loot. There's no increased sense of accomplishment in winning and no risk in losing. The gear is either meaningfiull or full loot isn't. So which is it?
It would be meaningful to a point. It won't be like you won the lottery, but you would get some decent stuff and hurt your enemy's ego. This is how it was in UO and I never found it to be dull.
The game isn't about who wins loot. This plays like Shadowbane. Players build cities and try and control regions and take regions from each other. I'm still not certain why we want to sack cities yet beyond to /lol /hug /hug /rude the dead though. Maybe resources or something. Maybe some underlying structure will be added later.
But I loved Shadowbane but I hate the controls and crappy servers. If Darkfall just improves on those two aspects then I'm down to stay.
I think you're right, if we bring a bunch of wow players, but from the sound of it... it's going to be a bunch of UO players. I don't plan on griefing/pk'ing. I plan on helping kill them like I did in UO (like a lot of people did in UO). Thus far, the darkfall community reminds me of the UO community, so there should be plenty of anti-pk squads around.
Yeah I think its going to be teh UO crowd also moer than the WoW crowd...i dont think the majority of the WOW crowd will like a FFA PVP game.....As for being deathly afraid, well its just a game..... I tried UO out in its early days......My first day I wandered through Brittain, listened to about 20 different people tell me that they were going to kill me, then went outside the gates and was dead in 2 seconds with 3-4 people just waiting to kill me and other new players......This is what Darkfall will be like also.....Wherever the major hub is that new players will be, there the gankers and losers will be also....Their only fun is to make sure they try to ruin someone else's play.......Most gankers dont kill other players because they have uber gear, they do it because the players they are killing have no chance....Its the thrill of the kill for them and the less chance the other player has the better.....I'm sure there were anti-PK squads in UO but alot of players will never get to that point......Many players simply get tired of being killed over and over and over and just move on to one of the other 300+ MMOs that are out there.
You are using the wrong term because quite frankly you are being dismissive. No one is "afraid" of full loot. They don't find it fun. There is a HUGE difference.
You want to attribute the idea that it takes some sort of constitution of the will for anyone who can handle such a game mechanic.
What it takes is the idea that it is fun to be looted and to loot others. What you can't understand is that there are people who will find no fun in either. Myself included quite frankly. I could care less about looting others and can't understand why anyone would find that fun. conversely, the idea of constantly replenishing my items, no matter how easy to get seems kind of pedantic and tiresome.
Some people love crafting, some exploring, some pvp'ing and some heavy death penalties, some ganking, some role playing.
It's more about the difference in how people are wired.
But for some reason, no matter how many times society screams "people are different" it just doesn't seem to soak in.
So one more time, "people are different". I'm sure we have different favorite colors and different favorite pies. Yet no one is screaming "why are people afraid of lemon merengue.
Games by definition are competitions or contests. What is the fun in a game with no consequence? This, in my opinion, can be seen as a decline in videogames as a whole. If you play an old NES game, you'd have maybe 3 lives and then you'd lose the game. Now, most every game has unlimited continuation - no penalty - boring.
Some people are wired for games and others just want to hang around and chat in a virtual environment, I suppose. And if you're the latter (and you say that we need to understand that everyone is different) why try to change Darkfall? Let our "niche" be. But in my opinion, if given the chance, most people would love this type of game... it's much more thrilling (albeit less convenient) when losing a game has a consequence. But more importantly, it's also much more rewarding.
Without risks, the rewards are minimal - that is, not fun.
And that is why I have zero interest in Darkfall. However I hope all you "hardcore" gamers just love, Love, LOVE it! Then maybe you'll stfu about casual gamers, care bears and WoW killers. I have tried almost every MMO and haven't found the perfect one for me yet, but all the MMO hatred on this site is wearisome.
Shouldn't we, as a gaming community, be encouraging people to play? The more successful the genre is, the more games will be made. You won't like every one, but you will have more choice.
I, personally, tried a PvP server for Asheron's Call years ago and experienced the gankers as soon as you left the starting area. They were not killing for loot but to satisfy their pitiful egos. Not fun to not be able to actually PLAY the game you're playing. But if that makes you happy I hope its everything you wanted. Go play and stop bitching.
You are using the wrong term because quite frankly you are being dismissive. No one is "afraid" of full loot. They don't find it fun. There is a HUGE difference.
You want to attribute the idea that it takes some sort of constitution of the will for anyone who can handle such a game mechanic.
What it takes is the idea that it is fun to be looted and to loot others. What you can't understand is that there are people who will find no fun in either. Myself included quite frankly. I could care less about looting others and can't understand why anyone would find that fun. conversely, the idea of constantly replenishing my items, no matter how easy to get seems kind of pedantic and tiresome.
Some people love crafting, some exploring, some pvp'ing and some heavy death penalties, some ganking, some role playing.
It's more about the difference in how people are wired.
But for some reason, no matter how many times society screams "people are different" it just doesn't seem to soak in.
So one more time, "people are different". I'm sure we have different favorite colors and different favorite pies. Yet no one is screaming "why are people afraid of lemon merengue.
Games by definition are competitions or contests. What is the fun in a game with no consequence? This, in my opinion, can be seen as a decline in videogames as a whole. If you play an old NES game, you'd have maybe 3 lives and then you'd lose the game. Now, most every game has unlimited continuation - no penalty - boring.
Some people are wired for games and others just want to hang around and chat in a virtual environment, I suppose. And if you're the latter (and you say that we need to understand that everyone is different) why try to change Darkfall? Let our "niche" be. But in my opinion, if given the chance, most people would love this type of game... it's much more thrilling (albeit less convenient) when losing a game has a consequence. But more importantly, it's also much more rewarding.
Without risks, the rewards are minimal - that is, not fun.
The problem is you are not understanding what you are saying.
What is the risk if you lose in chess? Nothing. You lose in chess. What is the risk if you lose in Monopoly? Nothing you lose the game. What is the risk if you lose in poker? Depends. You either lose the game OR you also lose money.
The risk and reward have to mean something. This is what you don't get. If it doesn't mean anything to the player then there is no point playing. But what you don't understand is that different risks carry differnt meanings to people. A person who prides themselves in their chess doens't lose anything but they have a great desire NOT to lose.
But someone who cares litle for chess might play it and later go "meh... so what... where's the pie".
Same with full loot. Who really cares? Well, people who become exhilarated by this type of gameplay. But for others they will say "bah... waste of time.. where's the pie.
It all depends on what you value and what you find exhilarating. But you are trying to one size fits all the whole thing and say that everyone cares in the same way you care.
But nothing could be further from the truth. If it was then EVERYBODY would be wanting to play darkfall. But the type of gameplay that it offers is just not "all that" for some people. But to others this game has to succeed in order for a disenfranchised contingent of players to find something that is fun for them.
If it's not fun then it doesn't matter the risk. If it means nothing to someone to loot another then it's not fun. Same with being looted.
You can't ascribe your definition of risk/reward to someone else because we all value different things. I would rather beat someone at Chess than to loot another player because that is more fun and has greater meaning for me.
So sure, there needs to be risk/reward but that means so many different things to so many different people.
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People like me are noit concerned with what might be lost to a full loot incident. My concern is that every one of the thousands I'll mow down on a daily basis will be wearing crap gear that i wouldn't even want cluttering my inventory.
Aye - one of them would be me.
A game where I dont have to grind for my boots of cornhole prancing? Great! Kill me and loot my leaking clogs any time.
Darkfall will be like any other MMO that hits the market. It will start off with the stoic "We wont ever change X feature"
Six months down the road "We needed to alter the X feature"
One year down the road "X feature was counter intuitive to new players and has been removed to help increase the overall game experience"
No MMO developer has ever stuck to thier guns. When it comes to it in the end, Profit will always be > promises. You could write a novel from things a dev team will promise wont ever happen or wont ever change. But the reality is they always change.
There are 3 types of people in the world. 1.) Those who make things happen 2.) Those who watch things happen 3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
The problem is you are not understanding what you are saying. What is the risk if you lose in chess? Nothing. You lose in chess. What is the risk if you lose in Monopoly? Nothing you lose the game. What is the risk if you lose in poker? Depends. You either lose the game OR you also lose money.
There are too risks in those game. Especially in Monopoly. You lose the properties that you acquire through time. Those properties in monopoly are just as real as your items in an MMO. If we had it your way, nobody would lose their property in Monopoly. Everyone would just keep on buying homes and we'd all live happily ever after.
Sure, when the ENTIRE monoply game is finished, you won't have lost anything but your time. And when you finally retire from the MMO (the only real end-game), again you won't have lost anything but your time.
If, say, an average player had $100,000 in his bank/home and upon death you lose about an average of $2,000 worth of items. Would this be acceptable? Or are you still afraid of losing this? If so, why?
Isn't it obvious?
For example: You work extremely hard for "X item", say you grinded several weeks just for this one item. Then one fateful day some a-hole comes and ganks you when you're fighting a mob or w/e and you lost that item. Now even though it may have been one item and you can get it back eventually, you just lost a months work...
So as you can clearly tell, it just sucks when you lose something you worked so hard to get. Some people might say, "well life's like that", well this isn't life, it's a game.
The problem is you are not understanding what you are saying. What is the risk if you lose in chess? Nothing. You lose in chess. What is the risk if you lose in Monopoly? Nothing you lose the game. What is the risk if you lose in poker? Depends. You either lose the game OR you also lose money.
There are too risks in those game. Especially in Monopoly. You lose the properties that you acquire through time. Those properties in monopoly are just as real as your items in an MMO. If we had it your way, nobody would lose their property in Monopoly. Everyone would just keep on buying homes and we'd all live happily ever after.
Sure, when the ENTIRE monoply game is finished, you won't have lost anything but your time. And when you finally retire from the MMO (the only real end-game), again you won't have lost anything but your time.
Ok then let me skew it a bit differently.
If I lose at monopoly or win at monopoly then that was a fun time and either way I've enjoyed it. If I lose at Chess or win at chess, the same thing.
But even if I win at dark fall I say "so what". I don't want to loot anyone. no desire and don't get it. As another person said, it's just stuff to clog up my inventory and if it would cause them a bad play experience I would just assume not loot them. So then what is the point? Also, If I lose then I have to replace my gear. Not a big deal but after a while it's like "sigh, what else is on". I'd much rather do anything else.
To many, winning or losing at darkfall is just that "so what, what else is on". It becomes tiresome either way because they just don't care about it. But if they like and enjoy monopoly then they care enough to play well and if they lose, no harm no foul.
And let's put it this way,I've never heard of anyone winning in monopoly so they could hurt their opponent's ego.
Some just aren't wired for that sense of accomplishment.
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Comments
Because those people usually come from games where they spent X many hours spawn camping/ raiding to get certain items and they think "OMG I'll lose my uber dress-up girlyboy hot pants!" and don't realize that for the most part gear isn't like that here and player-crafted is pretty much top dog anyway.
If I lost 2000$ worth of items every time I died, I would be choked. But were not talking about 2000$ worth of items were talking virtual items that exist in a computer game and have no real value.
For alot of people like me it will bring both more fun and frustration to the game. I like how you will need to really watch your back, or rely on your fellow guild members or friends. It brings a more "real world" situation to the game that not alot have experienced. Which then brings in the frustration. If you are not used to something like this, then ya... you will be mad when someone steals your items. Maybe you will be made that you lost money, or just made that you will need to craft another or buy another.
Over all, I will have a great time with this style of game!
We will have to earn that money first, hiding from hordes of gankers. Not that this is not cool, but can be a pain in the ass if you get ganked too often.
because these items take time, effort and dedication to acquire. it sounds like a nice concept, but i am yet to be convinced that this type of game mechanic can support an MMO.
features this revolutionary tend to be game making or game breaking. furthermore, this game looks sort of old, just the graphics, cursors, interface menus etc.. so i fear the mechanics of movement and pvp might be less than awesome, if this is the case then yo have to worry about losing items you work for on a less than awesome pvp engine.
i know some of you sleep with darkfall admins every night and can't stand to hear criticism, and while i give credit for trying new things, some of these features just sound like they are too exclusive to be widely accepted and embraced.
you don't google much, do you?
err . . . this is not a loot centric game like WoW
Hence, DF being a niche game . . . not a WoW killer.
Now go play on the freeway carebear
But you have to realize one thing. The items won't be as hard to get in Darkfall when compared to games like WoW. If you kept that in mind, would you still feel the same way?
My point is, I have a feeling people who are afraid of full loot don't understand that their items won't really take that long to get. And if they do realize it and are still complaining, well, they probably should not be playing videogames - as it would seem they can't handle losing, ever.
The biggest problem with full looting (especially today, not so bad about 10 years ago) is that there will ALWAYS be a group of players running around KoS anyone. And there will not always be a group of people to fight and defend against them. In the older full loot mmos there were at least guilds that stood against these "ganksquads". I'm afraid that in the community of today's MMO market (no offense, but you darkfall fans seem rather childish) all this game will be is a massive gankfest. Add the fact that in EVERY video I've seen of gameplay players die in 1-4 hits, and what you have in the makings is "Gankfall"
As for the dying part, I have no problem dying. I suicide sometimes just for a laugh lol. I guess the plus side of full looting is that there really won't be a reason for the gank squads to corpse camp, other than being @$$es, which there will be plenty of those around (*cough* WoW PvP Servers *cough*) I've played several games that had full loot. One of which where it was hard to get your items, and I loved those games. The thing that made it lovable is that you could run to the nearest town, gather up a group of people and go destroy the gank squad, and steal all thier stuff
. As I said though, this day and age, half the server will probably just /ignore you if you bring up a LFG flag for an anti-gank squad squad.
People like me are noit concerned with what might be lost to a full loot incident. My concern is that every one of the thousands I'll mow down on a daily basis will be wearing crap gear that i wouldn't even want cluttering my inventory.
I think you're right, if we bring a bunch of wow players, but from the sound of it... it's going to be a bunch of UO players.
I don't plan on griefing/pk'ing. I plan on helping kill them like I did in UO (like a lot of people did in UO).
Thus far, the darkfall community reminds me of the UO community, so there should be plenty of anti-pk squads around.
But you have to realize one thing. The items won't be as hard to get in Darkfall when compared to games like WoW. If you kept that in mind, would you still feel the same way?
My point is, I have a feeling people who are afraid of full loot don't understand that their items won't really take that long to get. And if they do realize it and are still complaining, well, they probably should not be playing videogames - as it would seem they can't handle losing, ever.
You are using the wrong term because quite frankly you are being dismissive. No one is "afraid" of full loot. They don't find it fun. There is a HUGE difference.
You want to attribute the idea that it takes some sort of constitution of the will for anyone who can handle such a game mechanic.
What it takes is the idea that it is fun to be looted and to loot others. What you can't understand is that there are people who will find no fun in either. Myself included quite frankly. I could care less about looting others and can't understand why anyone would find that fun. conversely, the idea of constantly replenishing my items, no matter how easy to get seems kind of pedantic and tiresome.
Some people love crafting, some exploring, some pvp'ing and some heavy death penalties, some ganking, some role playing.
It's more about the difference in how people are wired.
But for some reason, no matter how many times society screams "people are different" it just doesn't seem to soak in.
So one more time, "people are different". I'm sure we have different favorite colors and different favorite pies. Yet no one is screaming "why are people afraid of lemon merengue.
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Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
I hope there are alot of them around. I would love to see Darkfall become the best game. It combines 2 of my favorite Vintage MMOs, UO and Ashen Empires, into a 3D version. If all the WoW players stay out of it, then I will probably come to play it a couple months after release. There's a reason why 90% of the WoW PvP servers are listed as "Low"....Griefers.
But you have to realize one thing. The items won't be as hard to get in Darkfall when compared to games like WoW. If you kept that in mind, would you still feel the same way?
My point is, I have a feeling people who are afraid of full loot don't understand that their items won't really take that long to get. And if they do realize it and are still complaining, well, they probably should not be playing videogames - as it would seem they can't handle losing, ever.
That's a double edged sword and both edges are dull. If you lose a lot you're continually grinding out gear anyway. If you win a lot you'r'e just accumulating a mass of worthless crap gear. On the other hand if you're like most people ypou pretty much break even and it's not a factor. So if gear isn't a factor full loot isn't a factor and it loses both reasons for having full loot. There's no increased sense of accomplishment in winning and no risk in losing. The gear is either meaningfiull or full loot isn't. So which is it?
It would be meaningful to a point. It won't be like you won the lottery, but you would get some decent stuff and hurt your enemy's ego. This is how it was in UO and I never found it to be dull.
It is a happy medium.
The game isn't about who wins loot. This plays like Shadowbane. Players build cities and try and control regions and take regions from each other. I'm still not certain why we want to sack cities yet beyond to /lol /hug /hug /rude the dead though. Maybe resources or something. Maybe some underlying structure will be added later.
But I loved Shadowbane but I hate the controls and crappy servers. If Darkfall just improves on those two aspects then I'm down to stay.
You see? Exactly. who cares about hurting my enemies ego. Well, apparently you do and more power to you. That's how you are wired.
Personally that seems, well... to me, childish. But to those who love the thrill of a full on pvp game it's thrilling.
So have fun and I hope Darkfall is beyond successful.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Yeah I think its going to be teh UO crowd also moer than the WoW crowd...i dont think the majority of the WOW crowd will like a FFA PVP game.....As for being deathly afraid, well its just a game..... I tried UO out in its early days......My first day I wandered through Brittain, listened to about 20 different people tell me that they were going to kill me, then went outside the gates and was dead in 2 seconds with 3-4 people just waiting to kill me and other new players......This is what Darkfall will be like also.....Wherever the major hub is that new players will be, there the gankers and losers will be also....Their only fun is to make sure they try to ruin someone else's play.......Most gankers dont kill other players because they have uber gear, they do it because the players they are killing have no chance....Its the thrill of the kill for them and the less chance the other player has the better.....I'm sure there were anti-PK squads in UO but alot of players will never get to that point......Many players simply get tired of being killed over and over and over and just move on to one of the other 300+ MMOs that are out there.
You are using the wrong term because quite frankly you are being dismissive. No one is "afraid" of full loot. They don't find it fun. There is a HUGE difference.
You want to attribute the idea that it takes some sort of constitution of the will for anyone who can handle such a game mechanic.
What it takes is the idea that it is fun to be looted and to loot others. What you can't understand is that there are people who will find no fun in either. Myself included quite frankly. I could care less about looting others and can't understand why anyone would find that fun. conversely, the idea of constantly replenishing my items, no matter how easy to get seems kind of pedantic and tiresome.
Some people love crafting, some exploring, some pvp'ing and some heavy death penalties, some ganking, some role playing.
It's more about the difference in how people are wired.
But for some reason, no matter how many times society screams "people are different" it just doesn't seem to soak in.
So one more time, "people are different". I'm sure we have different favorite colors and different favorite pies. Yet no one is screaming "why are people afraid of lemon merengue.
Games by definition are competitions or contests. What is the fun in a game with no consequence? This, in my opinion, can be seen as a decline in videogames as a whole. If you play an old NES game, you'd have maybe 3 lives and then you'd lose the game. Now, most every game has unlimited continuation - no penalty - boring.
Some people are wired for games and others just want to hang around and chat in a virtual environment, I suppose. And if you're the latter (and you say that we need to understand that everyone is different) why try to change Darkfall? Let our "niche" be. But in my opinion, if given the chance, most people would love this type of game... it's much more thrilling (albeit less convenient) when losing a game has a consequence. But more importantly, it's also much more rewarding.
Without risks, the rewards are minimal - that is, not fun.
And that is why I have zero interest in Darkfall. However I hope all you "hardcore" gamers just love, Love, LOVE it! Then maybe you'll stfu about casual gamers, care bears and WoW killers. I have tried almost every MMO and haven't found the perfect one for me yet, but all the MMO hatred on this site is wearisome.
Shouldn't we, as a gaming community, be encouraging people to play? The more successful the genre is, the more games will be made. You won't like every one, but you will have more choice.
I, personally, tried a PvP server for Asheron's Call years ago and experienced the gankers as soon as you left the starting area. They were not killing for loot but to satisfy their pitiful egos. Not fun to not be able to actually PLAY the game you're playing. But if that makes you happy I hope its everything you wanted. Go play and stop bitching.
You are using the wrong term because quite frankly you are being dismissive. No one is "afraid" of full loot. They don't find it fun. There is a HUGE difference.
You want to attribute the idea that it takes some sort of constitution of the will for anyone who can handle such a game mechanic.
What it takes is the idea that it is fun to be looted and to loot others. What you can't understand is that there are people who will find no fun in either. Myself included quite frankly. I could care less about looting others and can't understand why anyone would find that fun. conversely, the idea of constantly replenishing my items, no matter how easy to get seems kind of pedantic and tiresome.
Some people love crafting, some exploring, some pvp'ing and some heavy death penalties, some ganking, some role playing.
It's more about the difference in how people are wired.
But for some reason, no matter how many times society screams "people are different" it just doesn't seem to soak in.
So one more time, "people are different". I'm sure we have different favorite colors and different favorite pies. Yet no one is screaming "why are people afraid of lemon merengue.
Games by definition are competitions or contests. What is the fun in a game with no consequence? This, in my opinion, can be seen as a decline in videogames as a whole. If you play an old NES game, you'd have maybe 3 lives and then you'd lose the game. Now, most every game has unlimited continuation - no penalty - boring.
Some people are wired for games and others just want to hang around and chat in a virtual environment, I suppose. And if you're the latter (and you say that we need to understand that everyone is different) why try to change Darkfall? Let our "niche" be. But in my opinion, if given the chance, most people would love this type of game... it's much more thrilling (albeit less convenient) when losing a game has a consequence. But more importantly, it's also much more rewarding.
Without risks, the rewards are minimal - that is, not fun.
The problem is you are not understanding what you are saying.
What is the risk if you lose in chess? Nothing. You lose in chess. What is the risk if you lose in Monopoly? Nothing you lose the game. What is the risk if you lose in poker? Depends. You either lose the game OR you also lose money.
The risk and reward have to mean something. This is what you don't get. If it doesn't mean anything to the player then there is no point playing. But what you don't understand is that different risks carry differnt meanings to people. A person who prides themselves in their chess doens't lose anything but they have a great desire NOT to lose.
But someone who cares litle for chess might play it and later go "meh... so what... where's the pie".
Same with full loot. Who really cares? Well, people who become exhilarated by this type of gameplay. But for others they will say "bah... waste of time.. where's the pie.
It all depends on what you value and what you find exhilarating. But you are trying to one size fits all the whole thing and say that everyone cares in the same way you care.
But nothing could be further from the truth. If it was then EVERYBODY would be wanting to play darkfall. But the type of gameplay that it offers is just not "all that" for some people. But to others this game has to succeed in order for a disenfranchised contingent of players to find something that is fun for them.
If it's not fun then it doesn't matter the risk. If it means nothing to someone to loot another then it's not fun. Same with being looted.
You can't ascribe your definition of risk/reward to someone else because we all value different things. I would rather beat someone at Chess than to loot another player because that is more fun and has greater meaning for me.
So sure, there needs to be risk/reward but that means so many different things to so many different people.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
A: No one is afraid of a looting option in a videogame
Q: Is it a function of ego or misplaced pride that makes Darkfall supporters think that the detractors are so because of a deficiency on their part?
Aye - one of them would be me.
A game where I dont have to grind for my boots of cornhole prancing? Great! Kill me and loot my leaking clogs any time.
Darkfall will be like any other MMO that hits the market. It will start off with the stoic "We wont ever change X feature"
Six months down the road "We needed to alter the X feature"
One year down the road "X feature was counter intuitive to new players and has been removed to help increase the overall game experience"
No MMO developer has ever stuck to thier guns. When it comes to it in the end, Profit will always be > promises. You could write a novel from things a dev team will promise wont ever happen or wont ever change. But the reality is they always change.
There are 3 types of people in the world.
1.) Those who make things happen
2.) Those who watch things happen
3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"
There are too risks in those game. Especially in Monopoly. You lose the properties that you acquire through time. Those properties in monopoly are just as real as your items in an MMO. If we had it your way, nobody would lose their property in Monopoly. Everyone would just keep on buying homes and we'd all live happily ever after.
Sure, when the ENTIRE monoply game is finished, you won't have lost anything but your time. And when you finally retire from the MMO (the only real end-game), again you won't have lost anything but your time.
Isn't it obvious?
For example: You work extremely hard for "X item", say you grinded several weeks just for this one item. Then one fateful day some a-hole comes and ganks you when you're fighting a mob or w/e and you lost that item. Now even though it may have been one item and you can get it back eventually, you just lost a months work...
So as you can clearly tell, it just sucks when you lose something you worked so hard to get. Some people might say, "well life's like that", well this isn't life, it's a game.
There are too risks in those game. Especially in Monopoly. You lose the properties that you acquire through time. Those properties in monopoly are just as real as your items in an MMO. If we had it your way, nobody would lose their property in Monopoly. Everyone would just keep on buying homes and we'd all live happily ever after.
Sure, when the ENTIRE monoply game is finished, you won't have lost anything but your time. And when you finally retire from the MMO (the only real end-game), again you won't have lost anything but your time.
Ok then let me skew it a bit differently.
If I lose at monopoly or win at monopoly then that was a fun time and either way I've enjoyed it. If I lose at Chess or win at chess, the same thing.
But even if I win at dark fall I say "so what". I don't want to loot anyone. no desire and don't get it. As another person said, it's just stuff to clog up my inventory and if it would cause them a bad play experience I would just assume not loot them. So then what is the point? Also, If I lose then I have to replace my gear. Not a big deal but after a while it's like "sigh, what else is on". I'd much rather do anything else.
To many, winning or losing at darkfall is just that "so what, what else is on". It becomes tiresome either way because they just don't care about it. But if they like and enjoy monopoly then they care enough to play well and if they lose, no harm no foul.
And let's put it this way,I've never heard of anyone winning in monopoly so they could hurt their opponent's ego.
Some just aren't wired for that sense of accomplishment.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo