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Why are some deathly afraid of full-loot?

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  • TrollstarTrollstar Member Posts: 332
    Originally posted by csthao


    trust me, in any kind of game, if you're already rich, it doesnt take long to make money to buy the things you lost.
    This was a saying I read about in the newspaper a LONG WHILE back...
    If Bill Gates was to drop $1000.00
    The amount of time it takes for him to pick it up, he would of already made more than that $1000.00.

    Ah...I see how it works, I'll go out and buy me a bunch of gold from a farmer and then I'll have all the  cash I need to replace my stuff.

    Thanks for the great suggestion.

    Who the hell are you, and why should I care?
    Congrats! You are a victim of Trollstar!

  • ComanComan Member UncommonPosts: 2,178
    Originally posted by AshenHand


    The answer is simple...
     
    1. Multiple people, multi-boxing 9-10 naked casters.
    2. Multi-boxed casters focus firing targets.
    3. Profit.
     



     

    If you can multibox 9-10 naked casters (If you do not have quality you have to do with quantity right) and kill me then you can have my loot. You then prolly really need it harder then me :P

  • csthaocsthao Member UncommonPosts: 1,123
    Originally posted by Trollstar

    Originally posted by csthao


    trust me, in any kind of game, if you're already rich, it doesnt take long to make money to buy the things you lost.
    This was a saying I read about in the newspaper a LONG WHILE back...
    If Bill Gates was to drop $1000.00
    The amount of time it takes for him to pick it up, he would of already made more than that $1000.00.

    Ah...I see how it works, I'll go out and buy me a bunch of gold from a farmer and then I'll have all the  cash I need to replace my stuff.

    Thanks for the great suggestion.



     

    yes you go and do that...apparently you dont know how to make money in a game...

  • jy88902jy88902 Member Posts: 293
    Originally posted by csthao

    Originally posted by Trollstar

    Originally posted by csthao


    trust me, in any kind of game, if you're already rich, it doesnt take long to make money to buy the things you lost.
    This was a saying I read about in the newspaper a LONG WHILE back...
    If Bill Gates was to drop $1000.00
    The amount of time it takes for him to pick it up, he would of already made more than that $1000.00.

    Ah...I see how it works, I'll go out and buy me a bunch of gold from a farmer and then I'll have all the  cash I need to replace my stuff.

    Thanks for the great suggestion.



     

    yes you go and do that...apparently you dont know how to make money in a game...

    Ironic you should say that, because the majority of the people who buy gold are usually too busy with making money in real life to be worrying about wasting time making money in a game.

     

  • krackajapkrackajap Member Posts: 238
    Originally posted by Lord_Ixigan


    Oh yeah, guy I quoted in my post is the typical pvp'er than -thinks- they're hardcore, but aren't. They want all the pvp action with none of the time it takes to actually have meaningful pvp.
     
    Sure why have gear in a pvp mmo at all then? It should just be entirely skill based. Oh wait, they tried to do something like that with a little game called Fury. We all know how well that turned out.....which if you don't know what game I'm talking about my point is further proven.
     
    When I look at gear I don't think, 'that's going to make me look epic and win'. I think, 'Will this or will this not help me kill stuff better?' If you have some screwed up, entitled opinion when it comes to how gear should work then that's your own problem. If I see a piece of gear that will help me kill more or be killed less then I will put the effort forth to get it, that's it.
     
    Oh and if gear didn't mean much of anything and almost everything relied on skill then people wouldn't have any problem killing oh...say...a dragon. How anti-climactic would that be? A guy in rusty chainmail with a dull sword killing a dragon because he wanted that experience to be handed to him -- _that's_ one entitled guy.

    where was it said that gear didn't mean anything?

     

  • UnSubUnSub Member Posts: 252
    Originally posted by harmonica


    If, say, an average player had $100,000 in his bank/home and upon death you lose about an average of $2,000 worth of items. Would this be acceptable? Or are you still afraid of losing this? If so, why?

    That's not full loot.

    Full loot is when I steal the $2 000 off their rapidly cooling corpse, head back to their house, kick the door in, gank them while they are still unequipped, steal the other $98 000 they have, paint the wall with their entrails, douse the place in kerosene, kick the body outside, set fire to the house while teabagging the corpse and insulting their sexuality.

    Full loot is not stealing what they have on them, it's being able to steal everything they have down the their very enjoyment of the game. If you rob someone of their enjoyment to play, then you loot the only thing that is truly worth taking.

    THAT'S full loot.

    Attractive, no?

  • GnomadGnomad Member Posts: 377
    Originally posted by UnSub

    Originally posted by harmonica


    If, say, an average player had $100,000 in his bank/home and upon death you lose about an average of $2,000 worth of items. Would this be acceptable? Or are you still afraid of losing this? If so, why?

    That's not full loot.

    Full loot is when I steal the $2 000 off their rapidly cooling corpse, head back to their house, kick the door in, gank them while they are still unequipped, steal the other $98 000 they have, paint the wall with their entrails, douse the place in kerosene, kick the body outside, set fire to the house while teabagging the corpse and insulting their sexuality.

    Full loot is not stealing what they have on them, it's being able to steal everything they have down the their very enjoyment of the game. If you rob someone of their enjoyment to play, then you loot the only thing that is truly worth taking.

    THAT'S full loot.

    Attractive, no?



     

    ROFLMAO...that sounds like a description from a true PvP player not one of these Johnny come lately carebear wanna be PvPers.

    Spent some time in some real PvP games have you?

  • UnSubUnSub Member Posts: 252

    Unfortunately I was never able to play early UO, but I know the stories very, very well. Too many players see themselves as the wolves of PvP, but the reality is that full loot and full PvP means you will meet people nastier and more focused than you, who know the game better than you and who will, if they put their mind to it, make you suffer until you log out in frustration.

    I did play Shadowbane Asia though. :-)

  • csthaocsthao Member UncommonPosts: 1,123
    Originally posted by jy88902

    Originally posted by csthao

    Originally posted by Trollstar

    Originally posted by csthao


    trust me, in any kind of game, if you're already rich, it doesnt take long to make money to buy the things you lost.
    This was a saying I read about in the newspaper a LONG WHILE back...
    If Bill Gates was to drop $1000.00
    The amount of time it takes for him to pick it up, he would of already made more than that $1000.00.

    Ah...I see how it works, I'll go out and buy me a bunch of gold from a farmer and then I'll have all the  cash I need to replace my stuff.

    Thanks for the great suggestion.



     

    yes you go and do that...apparently you dont know how to make money in a game...

    Ironic you should say that, because the majority of the people who buy gold are usually too busy with making money in real life to be worrying about wasting time making money in a game.

     



     

    And you're assuming that people cant do both? If you cant seperate game time with real life time, then it's not my problem.  So sad.

  • BladinBladin Member UncommonPosts: 1,089
    Originally posted by Tuck2000

    Originally posted by Salvatoris

    Originally posted by SirLorn


      Because acquiring "shiny baubbles" doesn't have to be what it is all about, all the time.   Accomplishment doesn't have to be about having your Guild all "Ztwel Thap content" geared so you can go now and take on "Phat Lewtz recquired content". 
      You all seem to either not be aware, or just don't get it because you have never experienced a game with this dynamic, the ganker's as it were, is a possible career path.  A difficult one at that, so aye you will have clans of like mindsets (i.e. gankers) but it is only going to add to the feel of the real world setting with real world consequences that much more.   You all have obviouslly never played a game that was so emmersive that it sucked you in and you get so pumped up, whether it is paranoia or excitment, or whatever and it is thrilling, adds SO much to your interaction, one with a gift with words might describge it, but it is best left to be experienced.
      I think those that have, or those that have had the experience suffeciently described to them that they wish to also experience it, are the ones really looking forward to and hoping this game delivers, those that think that game plays dynamics are going to allow them another happy fun gankfest time are also, but are going to be suprised that it's not going to be easy.  
      MMOs today have little to NO risk what so ever, and it is teh suck, I mean there is no consequence for losing because so many people want it handed to them on a silver platter with gold trimmings.  Agreed it will be niche, but DUH, the PvP part of the MMO community is already a SMALL piece of the pie to begin with.  This game is for those that want to one, bring back something lost, some real challenge, some skill, and some excitement back into their entertainment gaming buck. 
     The argument is mute really.....all you folks that don't like it, or don't agree, or don't get it, I invite you to just try it (if it does release and delivers said features) and then make your call......you might just find that you have been secluded or had blinders on about what all MMORPGs are "suppose" to be about. 
      If you still don't like it then for the same reasons you stated, then get a freinemy to buy the accnt and game off your hands......./chuckle, or hell one of  the opponents you faced......rofl



     

    FYI, some of us DO "get it", and just think it's a terrible concept.  I'm not just talking about MMOs, but RPGs in general.  They are games about progression, the more carrots they have to dangle in front of you, the more incentive you have to progress.  No RPG I have ever played was solely about gear, but it is an important part of the games that I am not willing do do without.  Like another poster already mentioned, If I just wanted skill progression with no gear, I could play any number of FPS games on the market, and enjoy the combat more.

    I hate to harp on this point, but the full loot thing is only one of many many reasons why I believe this game is doomed to fail... it's not even in the top 5, IMO. 

    I see your point which would not make this game for you by your line of thought. But have you considered the other aspect of joining or creating a clan with a specific goal be it pirating or territory domination. This world is supposed to be designed to be harsh so banding with a group will make it less harsh.

    Will uber guilds take over maybe but racial alignments will make that a bit troublesome. Don't want to be part of a major organization then make a thief’s guild or forma secret society or let them take over and start a rebellion. It really is going to be a game that is going to take some effort to measure success and that will be done on an individual basis. I hope there are enough players that have open minds enough to try and build something in the game as is the intent.



     

     

     

    What's the point of that?  you get territory.  For what reason?  Just to say you got it?  So you can get more resources?  To do what?  Fight again?  What's the point in that cycle?

    There isn't one.

    EVE is a example of a game where people are always on the same treadmill with never realizing it, earn ISK, spend it, earn more.  Rinse and repeat, that's the entire game.  There is nothing else in there everything you do is to only gain more ISK or a way to spend it(pvp loss for example).  You do this over and over and over.

    Racial alignments?  Who cares.  What difference does it make to me, besides the fact that i get ganked more.  What is being part of a big organization?  I run in larger groups to do the same things i did solo, only instead of running from gankers, i have become one?

    A rebellion? Against what?  Taking over some non important land, for no reason other than to increase my gains? or perhaps change our guilds time of play due to a inflexible older leader?

     

    What is success in this game?  There isn't any.  You control areas which are worthless in the grand scheme of things, even from the time you control them.  Then proceed a repeated grind to keep it up.

     

    What is full looting in darkfall?

    Fight.  Die.  Regear.

    Fight.  Die.  Regear.

     

    The excitement may be okay for the... week that you're new to the game.  But what then?  Is it still going to be exciting, replacing the same gear over and over?

    image

  • lifesbrinklifesbrink Member UncommonPosts: 553
    Originally posted by Bladin
     
    What's the point of that?  you get territory.  For what reason?  Just to say you got it?  So you can get more resources?  To do what?  Fight again?  What's the point in that cycle?
    There isn't one.
    EVE is a example of a game where people are always on the same treadmill with never realizing it, earn ISK, spend it, earn more.  Rinse and repeat, that's the entire game.  There is nothing else in there everything you do is to only gain more ISK or a way to spend it(pvp loss for example).  You do this over and over and over.
    Racial alignments?  Who cares.  What difference does it make to me, besides the fact that i get ganked more.  What is being part of a big organization?  I run in larger groups to do the same things i did solo, only instead of running from gankers, i have become one?
    A rebellion? Against what?  Taking over some non important land, for no reason other than to increase my gains? or perhaps change our guilds time of play due to a inflexible older leader?
     
    What is success in this game?  There isn't any.  You control areas which are worthless in the grand scheme of things, even from the time you control them.  Then proceed a repeated grind to keep it up.
     
    What is full looting in darkfall?
    Fight.  Die.  Regear.
    Fight.  Die.  Regear.
     
    The excitement may be okay for the... week that you're new to the game.  But what then?  Is it still going to be exciting, replacing the same gear over and over?



     

    Bladin, I thnk you are one of the few that have touched on one of the most important aspects of not only Darkfalls issue, but also all MMO's.

    In the real world, we have consequences for the issues we have.  In a virtual world, those consequences are always dull.  Because of this, the rewards never really matter, because in the end, what is the point?

    Games need to start having a point.

    My blog is a continuing story of what MMO's should be like.

  • GemmaGemma Member UncommonPosts: 337

    If anyone is afraid of full-loot, then they shouldn't play this game. Simple as that.  There are other games out there, and it makes no sense to whine about it.

  • The only way I can see full loot not turning DFO into anything other than a griefers paradise is if:

    1) They have strict weight limits such that you can't carry much more than your gear plus one or two "heavy" items (such as a vest or large weapon).  That way you have your pick of the other guy's stuff, but not without dropping something of your own.

    2) They don't implement item destruction.  You can either take an item (and suffer the weight constrictions) or toss it on the ground to be picked up by someone else.  Although you should be able to break items down into simple components so they can be reused for crafting, but again, you take on the burden of the weight.

     

  • fyerwallfyerwall Member UncommonPosts: 3,240
    Originally posted by Sixpax


    The only way I can see full loot not turning DFO into anything other than a griefers paradise is if:
    1) They have strict weight limits such that you can't carry much more than your gear plus one or two "heavy" items (such as a vest or large weapon).  That way you have your pick of the other guy's stuff, but not without dropping something of your own.
    2) They don't implement item destruction.  You can either take an item (and suffer the weight constrictions) or toss it on the ground to be picked up by someone else.  Although you should be able to break items down into simple components so they can be reused for crafting, but again, you take on the burden of the weight.
     



     

    I do believe they have an encumberance system in game as they did in UO where items have weight and you only have the ability (based on str/stam) to carry so much weight before you become a lead duck in a pond surrounded by hunters.

    There are 3 types of people in the world.
    1.) Those who make things happen
    2.) Those who watch things happen
    3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"


  • dirtyklingondirtyklingon Member Posts: 158

    full loot is for pussies. i want perma death.

    KERPLAH!

  • IchbenIchben Member UncommonPosts: 296
    Originally posted by yllis


    I keep seeing people talk about skill and the rush of a good fight.
    Hurray…. but your not really going to see that often.
    People by nature want the least risk for the greatest reward.
    What will not happen: You and another player come nose to nose, you are both at full heath and get into a thrilling PvP fight where the winner takes his reward and goes on his way the better man.
    What will happen: You are in a fight and another player sees you first, waits until you and the MOB are almost dead, then they rush in kill you both and take everything and run off.
    What will not happen : You and another have a thrilling neck to neck fight, one of you wins and the other gears up and comes back for another try to redeem his name and regain the loot.
    What will happen: You and another have a thrilling neck to neck fight, and he comes back with 4-6 friends who kill you and teabag you while calling you names and saying they had intercourse with your mother.
    What will not happen: Two guilds who are rivals have a long standing beef with each other. They have many fun wars with each other in a epic tale of PvP clan wars.
    What will happen: Bigger guilds will pick on smaller guilds harassing them while they ignore any real challenge.

     
     
    Granted there WILL be an occasional thrilling fight, and there WILL be cool players and guilds. But it will be the exception and not the norm.

     

    I have been teabagged before and let me tell you it is not something you want to experience. Later that day they found my mother and told her to get on her knees, they told her they wanted to have intercourse, they told her they wanted to have sex. When they unzipped their wallets and showed them their "hands" she lost it. She took a pocket knife from her pocket and proceeded to slash the "hands" of her attackers. There was blood, there were screams and there was pain. The boys ran away, holding their hands crying to their momma's and daddy's to fix their "hands." It was no use, my momma had done her work, their hands were no more, they were no longer "men" to say the least.

    I went home to see my momma and told her what had happen. She gave me a hug and told me everything was going to be alright sweet heart, everything was going to be just fine. "I took care of them boys for ya baby, I made them boys squeal child, I made the little bastards squeal for their momma's HA-HAA" momma said.

    "I love you momma" I said. "I love you to child" she replied. We went inside together as mother and child. Mother and friend.

    Ichben Einberliner

     

     

    facebook.com/Ichben.Einberliner

  • KingCarebearKingCarebear Member UncommonPosts: 103
    Originally posted by dirtyklingon


    full loot is for pussies. i want perma death.

     

    Trust me my son, you don't want perma death. You don't want it at all....

    KingCarebear

  • ComuniqueComunique Member Posts: 18
    Originally posted by dirtyklingon


    full loot is for pussies. i want perma death.

     

    Saying you want perma death means you have little experience with MMO's.

    With the amount of client and server crashes, bugs, exploits, glitches, hacks, lag, etc means no one would make it passed a couple levels and very few if any would play on those types of servers.

  • Gaurdian2Gaurdian2 Member Posts: 16

    Because is it unconventional and has never been done well enough to garner a massive following.

    Actually, Eve does this extremely well. If this game was based on characters and not ships, it would have destroyed the MMO scene (in a good way).

  • SXRchosen1SXRchosen1 Member Posts: 179

    Armor is not going to effect stats (only run speed), so why is everyone so fearfull of full-loot???

    You can always go kill some lowbie, or some guy that just finished a mob and is at low HP and get all your shit back, simple.

    image
    http://acominos.evony.com <- if your bored at work :)

  • Gaurdian2Gaurdian2 Member Posts: 16

    Perma death would actually be fun if it wasnt the entire game. Say, once you get a char to Max level, you get to make a Perma death Alt(s). This Alt would maybe, say, Gain xp twice or four times as fast, and have like a double or triple chance of the better item drops, but make everything soulbound. This would make this a "for fun" only char, which you could not whore gold with, and also a way to try other classes and not be the bottom of the barrel, with providing a nice amount of satisfaction for killing, but it doesnt take too much away when you die.  It still hurts, obviously, but not hurt like you lost a bazillion hours of leveling.

     

    just an idea

  • daarcodaarco Member UncommonPosts: 4,276

    I also wonder why full loot is "dangerous" for some people?

    It will be a good way to stop caring about your gear. Many PvE MMOs have leared player that the gear is everything.......throw that mentality away and free your minds. You can relax and try and loot others instead.

  • SXRchosen1SXRchosen1 Member Posts: 179
    Originally posted by Gaurdian2


    Perma death would actually be fun if it wasnt the entire game. Say, once you get a char to Max level, you get to make a Perma death Alt(s). This Alt would maybe, say, Gain xp twice or four times as fast, and have like a double or triple chance of the better item drops, but make everything soulbound. This would make this a "for fun" only char, which you could not whore gold with, and also a way to try other classes and not be the bottom of the barrel, with providing a nice amount of satisfaction for killing, but it doesnt take too much away when you die.  It still hurts, obviously, but not hurt like you lost a bazillion hours of leveling.
     
    just an idea



     

    Wow, thats a damn good idea imo

    +1

    image
    http://acominos.evony.com <- if your bored at work :)

  • daarcodaarco Member UncommonPosts: 4,276
    Originally posted by SXRchosen1

    Originally posted by Gaurdian2


    Perma death would actually be fun if it wasnt the entire game. Say, once you get a char to Max level, you get to make a Perma death Alt(s). This Alt would maybe, say, Gain xp twice or four times as fast, and have like a double or triple chance of the better item drops, but make everything soulbound. This would make this a "for fun" only char, which you could not whore gold with, and also a way to try other classes and not be the bottom of the barrel, with providing a nice amount of satisfaction for killing, but it doesnt take too much away when you die.  It still hurts, obviously, but not hurt like you lost a bazillion hours of leveling.
     
    just an idea



     

    Wow, thats a damn good idea imo

    +1



     

     

    But what would you have that character for? Just for fun? Why not get a max leveled character with best gear?

  • fyerwallfyerwall Member UncommonPosts: 3,240
    Originally posted by daarco

    Originally posted by SXRchosen1

    Originally posted by Gaurdian2


    Perma death would actually be fun if it wasnt the entire game. Say, once you get a char to Max level, you get to make a Perma death Alt(s). This Alt would maybe, say, Gain xp twice or four times as fast, and have like a double or triple chance of the better item drops, but make everything soulbound. This would make this a "for fun" only char, which you could not whore gold with, and also a way to try other classes and not be the bottom of the barrel, with providing a nice amount of satisfaction for killing, but it doesnt take too much away when you die.  It still hurts, obviously, but not hurt like you lost a bazillion hours of leveling.
     
    just an idea



     

    Wow, thats a damn good idea imo

    +1



     

     

    But what would you have that character for? Just for fun? Why not get a max leveled character with best gear?



     

    Think it would be for the added challenge of seeing how far you could get before dying.

    There are 3 types of people in the world.
    1.) Those who make things happen
    2.) Those who watch things happen
    3.) And those who wonder "What the %#*& just happened?!"


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