Nono i don't adapt anything. I just take MASSIVE for what it is, interacting with a community made of hundreds of people. In WoW you don't do that. It's simple as that. This interaction can happen in many ways, not only RvR. I cited crafting and economy. Economy is massive.
Massive means greater system that lets you interact with a society in someway. I repeat. WoW doesn't have that.
Tell me more of this Wintergrasp thing. Because when you fight against hundreds of people, you interact with them strategically. Even tho there's only one keep to be conquered. And even if there's point to conquer it. But you must admit, if the conquest has no impact on everyone's lives, it is not very substantial.
The core question was: WOW is an mmorpg.
In every way, in every meaning of the word. From economy (Auction House with thousands of goods) to PVE content (solo, small groups, large raids) to PvP content (competition ladder based) and even a small RvR zone like WIntergrasp.
CATA will add to this a new end game leveling system at max level (Path of Titans) and it is based on a needed for all "Archeology" profession. You will need to find treasures and artifacts in the OPEN world to even start advancing in this new end game leveling system. So imagine this huge (new) CATA world.
CATA will also introduce a new guild leveling system (both in PVE and PvP) . In PvP it will be a competitive system between guilds even.
Tell me ... exactly where does this place WOW CATA ? Because it ALSO offers around 100+ dungeons, battlegrounds and Raids. I think it just offers MORE playing choices even for those wanting to ride the world...
Want a real mmorpg? Play WOW with experience turned off mode and be Pve_Pvp King at any level without a rat race.
Yep, it's pointless, because WoW is obviously not really a MMO, now.
When it came out, it could have been a MMO. It had PvP, people assumed it would have had it(a MMO IS PVP, that's what everyone simply gave for granted) as end-game and they assumed it would be open-world, everybody's mind was still not corrupted, not brainwashed by the puppeteers.
Then WoW turned extremely into anti-social PvE, and instances, and solo experience.
That's why it's not a MMO. It renounced the characteristics that make it one.
whether or not a MMO has pvp is irrelevant, LOTRO doesnt suffer for its lack, it really depends on the game, personally i think the pvp in WoW is lacklustre and boring, but, thats because i play Eve primarily, where the pvp is a fundemental part of the game, and much more tactically orientated... but, i disagree that WoW is anti social, though i do agree that it supports the solo experience far too much, like any MMO, it is the players own abilities that define how social a game is. One of the reasons why i really wonder if the Devs really are doing players a favour or not, when they allow solo play to the degree they do, of course players have a right to choose their own gamestyle, but, encouraging them to communicate and socialise should also be an important part of the game, some players do struggle to overcome these barriers, usually from shyness. SWG.. (yes that dreaded game! again..) did encourage socialisation, cantina's, medical centres, were places that players had to spend time in, at some point or other, even if it was to recover fatigue/mind wounds and not to ogle the semi naked twileks gyrating in the middle of the cantina... ... it broke the ice for some players i think.. and if nothing else you could comment on the fact that fat rodians should
A. wear more clothing.. and
B.. never ever dance..
How do you know that LOTHR doesn't suffer from it. You were never given the chance or choice in the matter. the game might be the one the took out wow if it had, had PVP in it. we will never know.
How many delicate flowers have you met in Counterstrike?
I got a case of beer and a chainsaw waiting for me at home after work.
Wintergrasp is not an instance. it is an open world Pvp zone on every realm
it is an UNLIMITED open world pvp zone where everyone that enters the zone is put in PvP mode even on PVE servers.
The Siege battle at Lake Wintergrasp has an upper limit of 240 people though.
Now every 2.5 hours there is a SIEGE battle in that zone. To particiapte in that Siege battle, you need to be enlisted.
The game asks 15 minutes BEFORE the huge Siege battle if you want to join or not (if in the zone).
So during the massive Siege fight you can STILL enter the zone IF the maximum number of players (240) is not attained.
Upon entering the open world PvP zone during such a Siege fight you are put into a Raid (6 Raids total of 40 man can participate).
AFTER the Siege battle, the zone is just an ordinary unlimited open world PvP zone again with daily/weekly quest zones and the zone owners can go to a specfic VOA Raid where the latest boss drops the latest and highest PvP gear.
That's it.
I admit that I have not played since BC.
Cool enough, they are bringing back some life to the world. Great. Then they have made an effort to make it more MMO again. I can only compliment them for that.
Hopefully they will give the world to the players as the next step. Allow the players to change the landscape, build houses etc. Then we are really beginning to talk MMO.
player will have reason to reroll so hopefully player will be seen in the world one month after that they ll all be in instance farming whatever they need to farm!
Wintergrasp is not an instance. it is an open world Pvp zone on every realm
it is an UNLIMITED open world pvp zone where everyone that enters the zone is put in PvP mode even on PVE servers.
The Siege battle at Lake Wintergrasp has an upper limit of 240 people though.
Now every 2.5 hours there is a SIEGE battle in that zone. To particiapte in that Siege battle, you need to be enlisted.
The game asks 15 minutes BEFORE the huge Siege battle if you want to join or not (if in the zone).
So during the massive Siege fight you can STILL enter the zone IF the maximum number of players (240) is not attained.
Upon entering the open world PvP zone during such a Siege fight you are put into a Raid (6 Raids total of 40 man can participate).
AFTER the Siege battle, the zone is just an ordinary unlimited open world PvP zone again with daily/weekly quest zones and the zone owners can go to a specfic VOA Raid where the latest boss drops the latest and highest PvP gear.
That's it.
I admit that I have not played since BC.
Cool enough, they are bringing back some life to the world. Great. Then they have made an effort to make it more MMO again. I can only compliment them for that.
Hopefully they will give the world to the players as the next step. Allow the players to change the landscape, build houses etc. Then we are really beginning to talk MMO.
Heh and i doubt it will ever happen. Besides, one siege/conquer doesn't make for a political system that affects everyone.
But they could make such sieges to be the only key to access some PVE dungeons, now that'd affect everyone in a massive way.
Jeepers, I have read some garbage in my time on this site, but this thread, and one of the more prolific posters in it, take the biscuit.
Is there a threshold at which one becomes cynical, played out, arrogant, ignorant and bigoted?
So according to one person a mmorpg is only a mmorpg if there are no instances and the community has no option but to work as a whole? So even the sacrosanct EvE fails here as you can play solo if you desire.
The players of WoW or any "low brow" "semi-mmo" are blind, ignorant pitiful fools? Hmmm ok.
Wintergrasp is not an instance. it is an open world Pvp zone on every realm it is an UNLIMITED open world pvp zone where everyone that enters the zone is put in PvP mode even on PVE servers. The Siege battle at Lake Wintergrasp has an upper limit of 240 people though. Now every 2.5 hours there is a SIEGE battle in that zone. To particiapte in that Siege battle, you need to be enlisted. The game asks 15 minutes BEFORE the huge Siege battle if you want to join or not (if in the zone). So during the massive Siege fight you can STILL enter the zone IF the maximum number of players (240) is not attained. Upon entering the open world PvP zone during such a Siege fight you are put into a Raid (6 Raids total of 40 man can participate). AFTER the Siege battle, the zone is just an ordinary unlimited open world PvP zone again with daily/weekly quest zones and the zone owners can go to a specfic VOA Raid where the latest boss drops the latest and highest PvP gear. That's it.
I admit that I have not played since BC. Cool enough, they are bringing back some life to the world. Great. Then they have made an effort to make it more MMO again. I can only compliment them for that. Hopefully they will give the world to the players as the next step. Allow the players to change the landscape, build houses etc. Then we are really beginning to talk MMO.
Heh and i doubt it will ever happen. Besides, one siege/conquer doesn't make for a political system that affects everyone. But they could make such sieges to be the only key to access some PVE dungeons, now that'd affect everyone in a massive way.
Uhm thats exactly what it does, only the winning side can enter the Wintergrasp dungeon that allows player to loot the best PvP items (dunno if they changed it). So basically you are renting about a game that you have zero clue about, thank your for this discussion but i can spend my time better then with ignorant fools.
Jeepers, I have read some garbage in my time on this site, but this thread, and one of the more prolific posters in it, take the biscuit.
Is there a threshold at which one becomes cynical, played out, arrogant, ignorant and bigoted?
So according to one person a mmorpg is only a mmorpg if there are no instances and the community has no option but to work as a whole? So even the sacrosanct EvE fails here as you can play solo if you desire.
The players of WoW or any "low brow" "semi-mmo" are blind, ignorant pitiful fools? Hmmm ok.
WoW IS a mmorpg.
no in my book anything goes is good on one condition:1000 player on a single map this has to be avail i dont say everywhere but lets say 5% of the game would nice!
Wintergrasp is not an instance. it is an open world Pvp zone on every realm
it is an UNLIMITED open world pvp zone where everyone that enters the zone is put in PvP mode even on PVE servers.
The Siege battle at Lake Wintergrasp has an upper limit of 240 people though.
Now every 2.5 hours there is a SIEGE battle in that zone. To particiapte in that Siege battle, you need to be enlisted.
The game asks 15 minutes BEFORE the huge Siege battle if you want to join or not (if in the zone).
So during the massive Siege fight you can STILL enter the zone IF the maximum number of players (240) is not attained.
Upon entering the open world PvP zone during such a Siege fight you are put into a Raid (6 Raids total of 40 man can participate).
AFTER the Siege battle, the zone is just an ordinary unlimited open world PvP zone again with daily/weekly quest zones and the zone owners can go to a specfic VOA Raid where the latest boss drops the latest and highest PvP gear.
That's it.
I admit that I have not played since BC.
Cool enough, they are bringing back some life to the world. Great. Then they have made an effort to make it more MMO again. I can only compliment them for that.
Hopefully they will give the world to the players as the next step. Allow the players to change the landscape, build houses etc. Then we are really beginning to talk MMO.
Heh and i doubt it will ever happen. Besides, one siege/conquer doesn't make for a political system that affects everyone.
But they could make such sieges to be the only key to access some PVE dungeons, now that'd affect everyone in a massive way.
Uhm thats exactly what it does, only the winning side can enter the Wintergrasp dungeon that allows player to loot the best PvP items (dunno if they changed it).
So basically you are renting about a game that you have zero clue about, thank your for this discussion but i can spend my time better then with ignorant fools.
dont worry a lot of poster here know what they are talking about !
Originally posted by drbaltazar Originally posted by nikoliath Jeepers, I have read some garbage in my time on this site, but this thread, and one of the more prolific posters in it, take the biscuit. Is there a threshold at which one becomes cynical, played out, arrogant, ignorant and bigoted? So according to one person a mmorpg is only a mmorpg if there are no instances and the community has no option but to work as a whole? So even the sacrosanct EvE fails here as you can play solo if you desire. The players of WoW or any "low brow" "semi-mmo" are blind, ignorant pitiful fools? Hmmm ok. WoW IS a mmorpg.
no in my book anything goes is good on one condition:1000 player on a single map this has to be avail i dont say everywhere but lets say 5% of the game would nice!
Happened in WoW when they opened AnQuirai (spelled it wrong, i guess) but believe me when i say it wasn't pleasant. I don't know many MMO's that actually support so many player in a close distance to each other doing stuff like fighting each other without a massive decrease of fun because it becomes unplayable.
try aika!you will be pleasantly surprised!they advertise 1000 vs 1000 that i havent seen but i did see 1000 on one map very close together i heard some lagged i didnt!today i wonder if there is enough player for 1 nation havent been there since 7 of april when they announced ipblock and a big chunk of player left!
try aika!you will be pleasantly surprised!they advertise 1000 vs 1000 that i havent seen but i did see 1000 on one map very close together i heard some lagged i didnt!today i wonder if there is enough player for 1 nation havent been there since 7 of april when they announced ipblock and a big chunk of player left!
Aika is NA only, and as the global Aika is still apparently offline.. .. tbh, 1000 v 1000 in aika is, probably a missprint.. i dont know of any game that can handle those kinds of numbers in the same area. even planetside could only handle about 4 or 500 or so total. not sure how that relates to whether or not WoW is an MMO though
WoW's graphics are so outdated now its not even funny, and in relation to it being an MMORPG as much as i dont like it i would have to say it still ranks up there as one. If it wasnt considered one than half the games made since its release wouldnt be either.
I described the Siege battle of Wintergasp above and I did mention that it was not the "ulitmate" for me.
Why ? because of the dozens of time I battled with those 200 others on prime time, I think that even 240 people is way too much to have tactical and strategical fun.
The more pleasant battles at Wintergrasp were those where we raided (as Fortress defenders) the 3 southern attacking towers with a small force and that resulted in small battles of around 5-5 or 10-10 at the southern part of the map.
Far more tactical and strategical than with those massive "zerg fests" of a few hundred people in a Fortress courtyard.
Now the first few times such a Siege battles is really looking awesome and impressive (animated fallen walls, canons, tanks, artillery etc...) , but after a certain amount of times it makes you feel "small and rather meaningless" even if you form 40 man Raiding groups.
So 1000 against 1000 is even more meaningless to me( just personal prefenence btw).
Edit: I am standing in the fortress right now btw and within 30 minutes the battle begins (I was attacked IN the fortress as I typed this by a rogue - could shield) ). There will be a new world zone in CATA btw with more features (to enhance the skirmishes of open world pvp between the 2.5 hours Siege battles)...
Want a real mmorpg? Play WOW with experience turned off mode and be Pve_Pvp King at any level without a rat race.
WoW's graphics are so outdated now its not even funny, and in relation to it being an MMORPG as much as i dont like it i would have to say it still ranks up there as one. If it wasnt considered one than half the games made since its release wouldnt be either.
Heh that's exactly my point. Since the release of WoW there's basically only WoW-clones.
WoW's graphics are so outdated now its not even funny, and in relation to it being an MMORPG as much as i dont like it i would have to say it still ranks up there as one. If it wasnt considered one than half the games made since its release wouldnt be either.
That is one of the things i would like to see improved.. by a lot.. hopefully the graphics update in cataclysm will address some of these issues.. though im not really expecting that much graphically, game wise though, it will probably be awesome...
totally agree though if you dont class WoW as an MMO, then there probably arent any other games that can be called MMO's not even Eve.. last night i saw there were 1200 people in Jita.. and it lagged like a .... ... well it was prime time so i guess you can expect a lot of people to be there.. though used to be there was only 500 or so... Eve needs more trade hubs!
Wintergrasp is not an instance. it is an open world Pvp zone on every realm
it is an UNLIMITED open world pvp zone where everyone that enters the zone is put in PvP mode even on PVE servers.
The Siege battle at Lake Wintergrasp has an upper limit of 240 people though.
Now every 2.5 hours there is a SIEGE battle in that zone. To particiapte in that Siege battle, you need to be enlisted.
The game asks 15 minutes BEFORE the huge Siege battle if you want to join or not (if in the zone).
So during the massive Siege fight you can STILL enter the zone IF the maximum number of players (240) is not attained.
Upon entering the open world PvP zone during such a Siege fight you are put into a Raid (6 Raids total of 40 man can participate).
AFTER the Siege battle, the zone is just an ordinary unlimited open world PvP zone again with daily/weekly quest zones and the zone owners can go to a specfic VOA Raid where the latest boss drops the latest and highest PvP gear.
That's it.
I admit that I have not played since BC.
Cool enough, they are bringing back some life to the world. Great. Then they have made an effort to make it more MMO again. I can only compliment them for that.
Hopefully they will give the world to the players as the next step. Allow the players to change the landscape, build houses etc. Then we are really beginning to talk MMO.
Heh and i doubt it will ever happen. Besides, one siege/conquer doesn't make for a political system that affects everyone.
But they could make such sieges to be the only key to access some PVE dungeons, now that'd affect everyone in a massive way.
Uhm thats exactly what it does, only the winning side can enter the Wintergrasp dungeon that allows player to loot the best PvP items (dunno if they changed it).
So basically you are renting about a game that you have zero clue about, thank your for this discussion but i can spend my time better then with ignorant fools.
First of all i already openly admitted from the first post about it that i didn't know about this Wintergrasp thing.
You sound like an angry rotten beast or vulture who's waiting for the right moment to assail its prey and give all its rage at it.
And second of all one faint sparkle of massivity doesn't make for a working political system that affects the whole community, such system should be way more diffused. But it's something, at least, to massivity
IT does nothing but let you imagine how a truly massively multiplayer game would work.
Why do people here still bother even making posts about why they think WoW sucks, we all get it and posting here is a waste of time.
Half the people hate WoW here and the other like it. Its time to get over it and move on. I played it for 2 years, realized it wasn't my cup of tea and I moved on. I have my reservations about it, but we can't blame WoW for the crap games that all the other development companies have released. The market has changed, us old gamer farts need to get over it, assimilate or move on back to SPG like i did. Or hell, don't play games at all anymore, go read some books or get some exercise.
Wintergrasp is not an instance. it is an open world Pvp zone on every realm it is an UNLIMITED open world pvp zone where everyone that enters the zone is put in PvP mode even on PVE servers. The Siege battle at Lake Wintergrasp has an upper limit of 240 people though. Now every 2.5 hours there is a SIEGE battle in that zone. To particiapte in that Siege battle, you need to be enlisted. The game asks 15 minutes BEFORE the huge Siege battle if you want to join or not (if in the zone). So during the massive Siege fight you can STILL enter the zone IF the maximum number of players (240) is not attained. Upon entering the open world PvP zone during such a Siege fight you are put into a Raid (6 Raids total of 40 man can participate). AFTER the Siege battle, the zone is just an ordinary unlimited open world PvP zone again with daily/weekly quest zones and the zone owners can go to a specfic VOA Raid where the latest boss drops the latest and highest PvP gear. That's it.
I admit that I have not played since BC. Cool enough, they are bringing back some life to the world. Great. Then they have made an effort to make it more MMO again. I can only compliment them for that. Hopefully they will give the world to the players as the next step. Allow the players to change the landscape, build houses etc. Then we are really beginning to talk MMO.
Heh and i doubt it will ever happen. Besides, one siege/conquer doesn't make for a political system that affects everyone. But they could make such sieges to be the only key to access some PVE dungeons, now that'd affect everyone in a massive way.
Uhm thats exactly what it does, only the winning side can enter the Wintergrasp dungeon that allows player to loot the best PvP items (dunno if they changed it). So basically you are renting about a game that you have zero clue about, thank your for this discussion but i can spend my time better then with ignorant fools.
First of all i already openly admitted from the first post about it that i didn't know about this Wintergrasp thing. You sound like an angry rotten beast or vulture who's waiting for the right moment to assail its prey and give all its rage at it. And second of all one faint sparkle of massivity doesn't make for a working system that affects the whole community, such system should be way more diffused. But it's something, at least, to massivity.
I just showed you in couple of posts that you are rather ignorant. You basically give out hear says from many posters who simply hate WoW for whatever reason they can make up but you actually never took some real time to investigate things for yourself, or you wouldn't start renting about stuff that you have no clue about.
I didn't play WoW for 3-4 years now but i keep myself informed, thats what people should do in a discussion, have a clue what they are talking about.
Wintergrasp is not an instance. it is an open world Pvp zone on every realm
it is an UNLIMITED open world pvp zone where everyone that enters the zone is put in PvP mode even on PVE servers.
The Siege battle at Lake Wintergrasp has an upper limit of 240 people though.
Now every 2.5 hours there is a SIEGE battle in that zone. To particiapte in that Siege battle, you need to be enlisted.
The game asks 15 minutes BEFORE the huge Siege battle if you want to join or not (if in the zone).
So during the massive Siege fight you can STILL enter the zone IF the maximum number of players (240) is not attained.
Upon entering the open world PvP zone during such a Siege fight you are put into a Raid (6 Raids total of 40 man can participate).
AFTER the Siege battle, the zone is just an ordinary unlimited open world PvP zone again with daily/weekly quest zones and the zone owners can go to a specfic VOA Raid where the latest boss drops the latest and highest PvP gear.
That's it.
I admit that I have not played since BC.
Cool enough, they are bringing back some life to the world. Great. Then they have made an effort to make it more MMO again. I can only compliment them for that.
Hopefully they will give the world to the players as the next step. Allow the players to change the landscape, build houses etc. Then we are really beginning to talk MMO.
Heh and i doubt it will ever happen. Besides, one siege/conquer doesn't make for a political system that affects everyone.
But they could make such sieges to be the only key to access some PVE dungeons, now that'd affect everyone in a massive way.
Uhm thats exactly what it does, only the winning side can enter the Wintergrasp dungeon that allows player to loot the best PvP items (dunno if they changed it).
So basically you are renting about a game that you have zero clue about, thank your for this discussion but i can spend my time better then with ignorant fools.
First of all i already openly admitted from the first post about it that i didn't know about this Wintergrasp thing.
You sound like an angry rotten beast or vulture who's waiting for the right moment to assail its prey and give all its rage at it.
And second of all one faint sparkle of massivity doesn't make for a working system that affects the whole community, such system should be way more diffused. But it's something, at least, to massivity.
I just showed you in couple of posts that you are rather ignorant. You basically give out hear says from many posters who simply hate WoW for whatever reason they can make up but you actually never took some real time to investigate things for yourself, or you wouldn't start renting about stuff that you have no clue about.
I didn't play WoW for 3-4 years now but i keep myself informed, thats what people should do in a discussion, have a clue what they are talking about.
Heh your assailing me at my weak spot makes you a hyena.
I already said i didn't know about this Wintergrasp thing, i already said i played 1 year the VANILLA version.
So please accept the fact that i didn't know about Wintergrasp, accept my ADMITTING IT, and stop gnawing at my weak spot to discredit me.
MOVE ON.
Wintergrasp siege doesn't make WoW more of a MMO. It's a GLINT of massivity in a world of selfish players who keep by themselves. It does nothing but let you see what a truly massively multiplayer game would be.
Originally posted by Gylfi Originally posted by -aLpHa-
Originally posted by Gylfi
Originally posted by -aLpHa-
Originally posted by Gylfi
Originally posted by Rasputin
Originally posted by camp11111
Wintergrasp is not an instance. it is an open world Pvp zone on every realm it is an UNLIMITED open world pvp zone where everyone that enters the zone is put in PvP mode even on PVE servers. The Siege battle at Lake Wintergrasp has an upper limit of 240 people though. Now every 2.5 hours there is a SIEGE battle in that zone. To particiapte in that Siege battle, you need to be enlisted. The game asks 15 minutes BEFORE the huge Siege battle if you want to join or not (if in the zone). So during the massive Siege fight you can STILL enter the zone IF the maximum number of players (240) is not attained. Upon entering the open world PvP zone during such a Siege fight you are put into a Raid (6 Raids total of 40 man can participate). AFTER the Siege battle, the zone is just an ordinary unlimited open world PvP zone again with daily/weekly quest zones and the zone owners can go to a specfic VOA Raid where the latest boss drops the latest and highest PvP gear. That's it.
I admit that I have not played since BC. Cool enough, they are bringing back some life to the world. Great. Then they have made an effort to make it more MMO again. I can only compliment them for that. Hopefully they will give the world to the players as the next step. Allow the players to change the landscape, build houses etc. Then we are really beginning to talk MMO.
Heh and i doubt it will ever happen. Besides, one siege/conquer doesn't make for a political system that affects everyone. But they could make such sieges to be the only key to access some PVE dungeons, now that'd affect everyone in a massive way.
Uhm thats exactly what it does, only the winning side can enter the Wintergrasp dungeon that allows player to loot the best PvP items (dunno if they changed it). So basically you are renting about a game that you have zero clue about, thank your for this discussion but i can spend my time better then with ignorant fools.
First of all i already openly admitted from the first post about it that i didn't know about this Wintergrasp thing. You sound like an angry rotten beast or vulture who's waiting for the right moment to assail its prey and give all its rage at it. And second of all one faint sparkle of massivity doesn't make for a working system that affects the whole community, such system should be way more diffused. But it's something, at least, to massivity.
I just showed you in couple of posts that you are rather ignorant. You basically give out hear says from many posters who simply hate WoW for whatever reason they can make up but you actually never took some real time to investigate things for yourself, or you wouldn't start renting about stuff that you have no clue about. I didn't play WoW for 3-4 years now but i keep myself informed, thats what people should do in a discussion, have a clue what they are talking about. Heh your assailing me at my weak spot makes you a hyena. I already said i didn't know about this Wintergrasp thing, i already said i played 1 year the VANILLA version. So please accept the fact that i didn't know about Wintergrasp, accept my ADMITTING IT, and stop gnawing at my weak spot to discredit me. MOVE ON. Wintergrasp siege doesn't make WoW more of a MMO. It's a GLINT of massivity in a world of selfish players who keep by themselves. It does nothing but let you see what a truly massively multiplayer game would be.
If you really played 1 year in Vanilla then you can't tell me there was nothing going on prior to the BG patch, especially in Tarrens Mill. There was a allot of PvP on my server, even if it lagged like hell, it was there.
Most Humans are selfish and a have a group dynamic, it's fairly common and has nothing to do with WoW in general. You stick with people you like and are familiar with, whats the problem with that? Do you go out and make more friends on every corner? No friendships need to be nurtured, being familiar with someone doesn't make him your friend.
WoW is persistantly online world and theorically there's hundreds of people simultaneously. It's an MMO.
But here's the paradox:
1) - you never play with people during quests, because level-progression is a solitary experience. And you play with 10 people during raids and they're your real-life buddies.
2) - You never even play in the openworld because many of the features are infact in an instanced separated server. Making it seem like the open-world is actually a LOBBY, like in Counterstrike or Quake3.
In WoW you don't HAVE to socialize with strangers, with "community", you are invited to be anti-social and isolate yourself with real-life friends. This is why WoW is not REALLY a MMO.
#1 is completely wrong in current WOW. Grouping can make up the majority of your game time, and be a fast efficient way of leveling as a tank or healer (it can make up a significant chunk of your time as a DPSer, but you'll probably spend the majority of your time questing between group queues.)
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
Wintergrasp is not an instance. it is an open world Pvp zone on every realm
it is an UNLIMITED open world pvp zone where everyone that enters the zone is put in PvP mode even on PVE servers.
The Siege battle at Lake Wintergrasp has an upper limit of 240 people though.
Now every 2.5 hours there is a SIEGE battle in that zone. To particiapte in that Siege battle, you need to be enlisted.
The game asks 15 minutes BEFORE the huge Siege battle if you want to join or not (if in the zone).
So during the massive Siege fight you can STILL enter the zone IF the maximum number of players (240) is not attained.
Upon entering the open world PvP zone during such a Siege fight you are put into a Raid (6 Raids total of 40 man can participate).
AFTER the Siege battle, the zone is just an ordinary unlimited open world PvP zone again with daily/weekly quest zones and the zone owners can go to a specfic VOA Raid where the latest boss drops the latest and highest PvP gear.
That's it.
I admit that I have not played since BC.
Cool enough, they are bringing back some life to the world. Great. Then they have made an effort to make it more MMO again. I can only compliment them for that.
Hopefully they will give the world to the players as the next step. Allow the players to change the landscape, build houses etc. Then we are really beginning to talk MMO.
Heh and i doubt it will ever happen. Besides, one siege/conquer doesn't make for a political system that affects everyone.
But they could make such sieges to be the only key to access some PVE dungeons, now that'd affect everyone in a massive way.
Uhm thats exactly what it does, only the winning side can enter the Wintergrasp dungeon that allows player to loot the best PvP items (dunno if they changed it).
So basically you are renting about a game that you have zero clue about, thank your for this discussion but i can spend my time better then with ignorant fools.
First of all i already openly admitted from the first post about it that i didn't know about this Wintergrasp thing.
You sound like an angry rotten beast or vulture who's waiting for the right moment to assail its prey and give all its rage at it.
And second of all one faint sparkle of massivity doesn't make for a working system that affects the whole community, such system should be way more diffused. But it's something, at least, to massivity.
I just showed you in couple of posts that you are rather ignorant. You basically give out hear says from many posters who simply hate WoW for whatever reason they can make up but you actually never took some real time to investigate things for yourself, or you wouldn't start renting about stuff that you have no clue about.
I didn't play WoW for 3-4 years now but i keep myself informed, thats what people should do in a discussion, have a clue what they are talking about.
Heh your assailing me at my weak spot makes you a hyena.
I already said i didn't know about this Wintergrasp thing, i already said i played 1 year the VANILLA version.
So please accept the fact that i didn't know about Wintergrasp, accept my ADMITTING IT, and stop gnawing at my weak spot to discredit me.
MOVE ON.
Wintergrasp siege doesn't make WoW more of a MMO. It's a GLINT of massivity in a world of selfish players who keep by themselves. It does nothing but let you see what a truly massively multiplayer game would be.
If you really played 1 year in Vanilla then you can't tell me there was nothing going on prior to the BG patch, especially in Tarrens Mill. There was a allot of PvP on my server, even if it lagged like hell, it was there.
Most Humans are selfish and a have a group dynamic, it's fairly common and has nothing to do with WoW in general. You stick with people you like and are familiar with, whats the problem with that? Do you go out and make more friends on every corner? No friendships need to be nurtured, being familiar with someone doesn't make him your friend.
I feel sorry for you, if you have not tried better than WoW. And then I will also forgive you your ignorance. If you had tried something else than the EQ model, you would know what we were talking about.
Comments
The core question was: WOW is an mmorpg.
In every way, in every meaning of the word. From economy (Auction House with thousands of goods) to PVE content (solo, small groups, large raids) to PvP content (competition ladder based) and even a small RvR zone like WIntergrasp.
CATA will add to this a new end game leveling system at max level (Path of Titans) and it is based on a needed for all "Archeology" profession. You will need to find treasures and artifacts in the OPEN world to even start advancing in this new end game leveling system. So imagine this huge (new) CATA world.
CATA will also introduce a new guild leveling system (both in PVE and PvP) . In PvP it will be a competitive system between guilds even.
Tell me ... exactly where does this place WOW CATA ? Because it ALSO offers around 100+ dungeons, battlegrounds and Raids. I think it just offers MORE playing choices even for those wanting to ride the world...
Want a real mmorpg? Play WOW with experience turned off mode and be Pve_Pvp King at any level without a rat race.
How do you know that LOTHR doesn't suffer from it. You were never given the chance or choice in the matter. the game might be the one the took out wow if it had, had PVP in it. we will never know.
How many delicate flowers have you met in Counterstrike?
I got a case of beer and a chainsaw waiting for me at home after work.
player will have reason to reroll so hopefully player will be seen in the world one month after that they ll all be in instance farming whatever they need to farm!
Heh and i doubt it will ever happen. Besides, one siege/conquer doesn't make for a political system that affects everyone.
But they could make such sieges to be the only key to access some PVE dungeons, now that'd affect everyone in a massive way.
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Jeepers, I have read some garbage in my time on this site, but this thread, and one of the more prolific posters in it, take the biscuit.
Is there a threshold at which one becomes cynical, played out, arrogant, ignorant and bigoted?
So according to one person a mmorpg is only a mmorpg if there are no instances and the community has no option but to work as a whole? So even the sacrosanct EvE fails here as you can play solo if you desire.
The players of WoW or any "low brow" "semi-mmo" are blind, ignorant pitiful fools? Hmmm ok.
WoW IS a mmorpg.
Uhm thats exactly what it does, only the winning side can enter the Wintergrasp dungeon that allows player to loot the best PvP items (dunno if they changed it).
So basically you are renting about a game that you have zero clue about, thank your for this discussion but i can spend my time better then with ignorant fools.
no in my book anything goes is good on one condition:1000 player on a single map this has to be avail i dont say everywhere but lets say 5% of the game would nice!
dont worry a lot of poster here know what they are talking about !
Happened in WoW when they opened AnQuirai (spelled it wrong, i guess) but believe me when i say it wasn't pleasant. I don't know many MMO's that actually support so many player in a close distance to each other doing stuff like fighting each other without a massive decrease of fun because it becomes unplayable.
try aika!you will be pleasantly surprised!they advertise 1000 vs 1000 that i havent seen but i did see 1000 on one map very close together i heard some lagged i didnt!today i wonder if there is enough player for 1 nation havent been there since 7 of april when they announced ipblock and a big chunk of player left!
Aika is NA only, and as the global Aika is still apparently offline.. .. tbh, 1000 v 1000 in aika is, probably a missprint.. i dont know of any game that can handle those kinds of numbers in the same area. even planetside could only handle about 4 or 500 or so total. not sure how that relates to whether or not WoW is an MMO though
WoW's graphics are so outdated now its not even funny, and in relation to it being an MMORPG as much as i dont like it i would have to say it still ranks up there as one. If it wasnt considered one than half the games made since its release wouldnt be either.
I described the Siege battle of Wintergasp above and I did mention that it was not the "ulitmate" for me.
Why ? because of the dozens of time I battled with those 200 others on prime time, I think that even 240 people is way too much to have tactical and strategical fun.
The more pleasant battles at Wintergrasp were those where we raided (as Fortress defenders) the 3 southern attacking towers with a small force and that resulted in small battles of around 5-5 or 10-10 at the southern part of the map.
Far more tactical and strategical than with those massive "zerg fests" of a few hundred people in a Fortress courtyard.
Now the first few times such a Siege battles is really looking awesome and impressive (animated fallen walls, canons, tanks, artillery etc...) , but after a certain amount of times it makes you feel "small and rather meaningless" even if you form 40 man Raiding groups.
So 1000 against 1000 is even more meaningless to me( just personal prefenence btw).
Edit: I am standing in the fortress right now btw and within 30 minutes the battle begins (I was attacked IN the fortress as I typed this by a rogue - could shield)
). There will be a new world zone in CATA btw with more features (to enhance the skirmishes of open world pvp between the 2.5 hours Siege battles)...
Want a real mmorpg? Play WOW with experience turned off mode and be Pve_Pvp King at any level without a rat race.
Heh that's exactly my point. Since the release of WoW there's basically only WoW-clones.
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That is one of the things i would like to see improved.. by a lot.. hopefully the graphics update in cataclysm will address some of these issues.. though im not really expecting that much graphically, game wise though, it will probably be awesome...
totally agree though if you dont class WoW as an MMO, then there probably arent any other games that can be called MMO's not even Eve.. last night i saw there were 1200 people in Jita.. and it lagged like a .... ... well it was prime time so i guess you can expect a lot of people to be there.. though used to be there was only 500 or so... Eve needs more trade hubs!
First of all i already openly admitted from the first post about it that i didn't know about this Wintergrasp thing.
You sound like an angry rotten beast or vulture who's waiting for the right moment to assail its prey and give all its rage at it.
And second of all one faint sparkle of massivity doesn't make for a working political system that affects the whole community, such system should be way more diffused. But it's something, at least, to massivity
IT does nothing but let you imagine how a truly massively multiplayer game would work.
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Why do people here still bother even making posts about why they think WoW sucks, we all get it and posting here is a waste of time.
Half the people hate WoW here and the other like it. Its time to get over it and move on. I played it for 2 years, realized it wasn't my cup of tea and I moved on. I have my reservations about it, but we can't blame WoW for the crap games that all the other development companies have released. The market has changed, us old gamer farts need to get over it, assimilate or move on back to SPG like i did. Or hell, don't play games at all anymore, go read some books or get some exercise.
I just showed you in couple of posts that you are rather ignorant. You basically give out hear says from many posters who simply hate WoW for whatever reason they can make up but you actually never took some real time to investigate things for yourself, or you wouldn't start renting about stuff that you have no clue about.
I didn't play WoW for 3-4 years now but i keep myself informed, thats what people should do in a discussion, have a clue what they are talking about.
I just found out someone moved this topic to WoW forum.
That's crazy, how can we discuss among nutjob/fans? How can they expect them to be unbiased?
Besides, this feels like trolling in their nest.
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Heh your assailing me at my weak spot makes you a hyena.
I already said i didn't know about this Wintergrasp thing, i already said i played 1 year the VANILLA version.
So please accept the fact that i didn't know about Wintergrasp, accept my ADMITTING IT, and stop gnawing at my weak spot to discredit me.
MOVE ON.
Wintergrasp siege doesn't make WoW more of a MMO. It's a GLINT of massivity in a world of selfish players who keep by themselves. It does nothing but let you see what a truly massively multiplayer game would be.
the best blog of the net
I admit that I have not played since BC.
Cool enough, they are bringing back some life to the world. Great. Then they have made an effort to make it more MMO again. I can only compliment them for that.
Hopefully they will give the world to the players as the next step. Allow the players to change the landscape, build houses etc. Then we are really beginning to talk MMO.
Heh and i doubt it will ever happen. Besides, one siege/conquer doesn't make for a political system that affects everyone.
But they could make such sieges to be the only key to access some PVE dungeons, now that'd affect everyone in a massive way.
Uhm thats exactly what it does, only the winning side can enter the Wintergrasp dungeon that allows player to loot the best PvP items (dunno if they changed it).
So basically you are renting about a game that you have zero clue about, thank your for this discussion but i can spend my time better then with ignorant fools.
First of all i already openly admitted from the first post about it that i didn't know about this Wintergrasp thing.
You sound like an angry rotten beast or vulture who's waiting for the right moment to assail its prey and give all its rage at it.
And second of all one faint sparkle of massivity doesn't make for a working system that affects the whole community, such system should be way more diffused. But it's something, at least, to massivity.
I just showed you in couple of posts that you are rather ignorant. You basically give out hear says from many posters who simply hate WoW for whatever reason they can make up but you actually never took some real time to investigate things for yourself, or you wouldn't start renting about stuff that you have no clue about.
I didn't play WoW for 3-4 years now but i keep myself informed, thats what people should do in a discussion, have a clue what they are talking about.
Heh your assailing me at my weak spot makes you a hyena.
I already said i didn't know about this Wintergrasp thing, i already said i played 1 year the VANILLA version.
So please accept the fact that i didn't know about Wintergrasp, accept my ADMITTING IT, and stop gnawing at my weak spot to discredit me.
MOVE ON.
Wintergrasp siege doesn't make WoW more of a MMO. It's a GLINT of massivity in a world of selfish players who keep by themselves. It does nothing but let you see what a truly massively multiplayer game would be.
If you really played 1 year in Vanilla then you can't tell me there was nothing going on prior to the BG patch, especially in Tarrens Mill. There was a allot of PvP on my server, even if it lagged like hell, it was there.
Most Humans are selfish and a have a group dynamic, it's fairly common and has nothing to do with WoW in general. You stick with people you like and are familiar with, whats the problem with that? Do you go out and make more friends on every corner? No friendships need to be nurtured, being familiar with someone doesn't make him your friend.
#1 is completely wrong in current WOW. Grouping can make up the majority of your game time, and be a fast efficient way of leveling as a tank or healer (it can make up a significant chunk of your time as a DPSer, but you'll probably spend the majority of your time questing between group queues.)
"What is truly revealing is his implication that believing something to be true is the same as it being true. [continue]" -John Oliver
I feel sorry for you, if you have not tried better than WoW. And then I will also forgive you your ignorance. If you had tried something else than the EQ model, you would know what we were talking about.
Yes it's an MMO but it plays more like a single player game now.
WoW is an MMORPG!
M is for massive which WoW is, very little loading screens.
M is for multiplayer, I know I can group with my friends good sir.
O is for online, yes I need an internet connection to play!
R is for role, everyone in WoW has a role, be it raider, RPer or PvPer.
P is for playing, I assure you, everyone and their mother is playing WoW.
G is for game, if you do not think it is a game, what are you smoking?
And that is why it is an MMORPG.
It is my opinion, that your opinion is incorrect.