Please read my last post to TWrule, and understand there were so many ways to do it that you could even exploit unintentionally using broken class features, though the majority of it was seizing a blindspot for personal revenge. isolated cases add to the statistic, and it's nearly impossible to have "never exploited" in those months, even by accident. This is not including the PvP point march I keep bringing up, which was absolutely epidemic. it's hard to find because everyone did it in thier private instances of the border kingdoms, and even shared with the neighbors to make it easier on themselves.
The fact it was so easy to do, and it really hurt no one, made it very easy for the greater populace to actually accept it.
I'n telling you once again; "most" of the players in Tyranny have exploited in one way or another.
Ok, being the Tyranny example, I can understand where you are coming from and had I been there might be in agreement. However, my first interjection was at these, which showed nothing of the incident on tyranny:
Originally posted by GTwander
~I said that the majority reason people DO want it is to see what kind of mess they can get into, and that's a fact, jack.~
and
~False, everyone seeks that kind of advantage, especially when there is no chance of winning on your chutspah alone.~
These were said before you reference. Sorry if this what you were getting at, but without the incident spoken beforehand, I did not know how they tied except as a blanket statement.
~I said that the majority reason people DO want it is to see what kind of mess they can get into, and that's a fact, jack.~
and
~False, everyone seeks that kind of advantage, especially when there is no chance of winning on your chutspah alone.~
These were said before you reference. Sorry if this what you were getting at, but without the incident spoken beforehand, I did not know how they tied except as a blanket statement.
Yes and no.
My point on people wanting to get the ability to jump "to see what kind of mess they can get into" is a universal saying for anything unintentional. They don't even have to be exploiting a position, as much as ending up under the world because they got too curious over some place they shouldn't have gone. This is why there is just giant invisible walls boxing everything in these days, but there are soooo many places with obtuse geometry that get overlooked on every pass.
The chutspah thing relates to how people get when frustrated, best explained in the other post. Relates to any game, and that is why I later brought up AoC as a prime example. I may have a poor grasp on the word "chutspah", but i consider it to be an "indomitable spirit", which is easily broken into payback-mode once beaten enough times and slighted.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4 Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
Edit: Something important for everyone to remember is the importance of mentally disassociating people from ideas.
I don't understand what this means, if you could elaborate?
Sure - all I meant by this is that most people tend to judge/define/categorize/label others based on the sorts of ideas they might share. This leads to personal attacks and insults rather than productive discussion, or people taking a stubborn and defensive stance in the argument. "Oh, you're one of those people..." would be just such an attitude.
I was saying it's important to attack arguments and not people and realize that any rational mind can entertain even the most seemingly absurd notions without being attached to them. For example, I can tell someone about the merits of a totalitarian fascist regime being imposed in the united states - but I may not actually have the world view that would support such a idea. Even if I truly believed in something, that's just me choosing to subscribe to that idea at a particular time, which could always change. To use a poor analogy, all the ideas in the world could be a smorgasbord of food, and we choose what we want to partake of at any given time, but we are not what we eat.
TLDR: We (as humans) define our ideas, rather than being defined by them.
And yes, this has nothing to do with the original topic of the thread, but it's far more constructive in general, wouldn't you say?
~I said that the majority reason people DO want it is to see what kind of mess they can get into, and that's a fact, jack.~
and
~False, everyone seeks that kind of advantage, especially when there is no chance of winning on your chutspah alone.~
These were said before you reference. Sorry if this what you were getting at, but without the incident spoken beforehand, I did not know how they tied except as a blanket statement.
Yes and no.
My point on people wanting to get the ability to jump "to see what kind of mess they can get into" is a universal saying for anything unintentional. They don't even have to be exploiting a position, as much as ending up under the world because they got too curious over some place they shouldn't have gone. This is why there is just giant invisible walls boxing everything in these days, but there are soooo many places with obtuse geometry that get overlooked on every pass.
The chutspah thing relates to how people get when frustrated, best explained in the other post. Relates to any game, and that is why I later brought up AoC as a prime example.
Well, I understand better your view point and glad it got cleared up. I just hate ppl that generalize in attempting to bolster their 'claim'.
I, for one, don't care about not having a jump in FFXI, I'm gonna love it anyway.
If the Jump ability was going to be used for any kind of in game feature or benefit, you'd have to have the liitle midgets jumping the same distance as the tall lanky elf posers. They probably don't want the image of their nimble cat girls being the same as the tall bulky guys and the little midget things.
I get you, but it seems it's more about you not involving people as a statistic or they might get offended, and part of me just won't walk that line. I also understand that it's very easy to misunderstand a person at first glance, but my point on stereotyping being there for a reason should still stand pretty firm. It wouldn't be a popular belief for nothing, it's a common occurance that gets catagorized - and others get unfairly paired into it.
This is then the problem I suppose, when it comes to using people as statistical figures;
People put themselves into the count first.
When I said the word "most", everybody immediately put themselves, and the people they hang around on the list first. A small circle can seem like the whole world though, and if you're not paying attention outside, you may start thinking that everyone else thinks they way you do too. They do not. A person's experience in never seeing the kind of exploitation I have in games can be a byproduct of; who they hang out with, where they hang out at, and when they do.
The right circumstances will either make you see the brunt of it, or none of it.
I always play unguilded and typically solo btw, that makes me meat.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4 Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
I get you, but it seems it's more about you not involving people as a statistic or they might get offended, and part of me just won't walk that line. I also understand that it's very easy to misunderstand a person at first glance, but my point on stereotyping being there for a reason should still stand pretty firm. It wouldn't be a popular belief for nothing, it's a common occurance that gets catagorized - and others get unfairly paired into it.
This is then the problem I suppose, when it comes to using people as statistical figures;
People put themselves into the count first.
When I said the word "most", everybody immediately put themselves, and the people they hang around on the list first. A small circle can seem like the whole world though, and if you're not paying attention outside, you may start thinking that everyone else thinks they way you do too. They do not. A person's experience in never seeing the kind of exploitation I have in games can be a byproduct of; who they hang out with, where they hang out at, and when they do.
The right circumstances will either make you see the brunt of it, or none of it.
~my point on stereotyping being there for a reason should still stand pretty firm. It wouldn't be a popular belief for nothing, it's a common occurance that gets catagorized ~
Be careful with your thinking on stereotypes, they are NOT always true and are more often than not propagated by those who wish to put them down because of their dislike and/or prejudice. Just because you fall into one of the 'stereotypes' out there does not make it any more truthful.
Thats a pathetic response to not having jump. Having better graphics doesn't do anything either...
They spend so much time improving the graphics over the old one, to make it more current and realisitic looking... and take away a basic function of all games!! realism is removed and frustration is added when they do things like this. Gears of war suffers from this for me. I love Gears, but if you could jump, not have to crouch and run at the same time and pull the camera back a little more it would be a 10/10 game instead of a 9.5/10.
They need to realise how much difference a basic a jump function can make on the feel of the game... LAZY!
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
I like how people keep putting small fences and boulders in there way as reasons for wanting jump. That's just lazy. If you've played FFXI you'd know that these objects are far away from zone lines. Hell, the only fences I can think of at the moment is in Rolanberry Fields and you can run through them. Low walls aren't a problem cause there's, more than not, an easy path through. Stop running directly at objects and they won't be in your way. In FFXI, you can see obstacles a long way away. Just turn a few degrees to either side and I bet you'll get past that oh so hard to get around rock. And if they design the areas in any way like FFXI there are a lot of large open areas to explore. No winding linear paths except for some dungeons.
And for a game with no jumping that must be so flat, you have areas like Altepa Desert, the Dunes, and the Highlands. Spiral stairs in Delkfutt. Paths that take you to lower and upper floors of dungeons. Ledges and holes in floors that let you fall to lower levels.
Thats a pathetic response to not having jump. Having better graphics doesn't do anything either...
They spend so much time improving the graphics over the old one, to make it more current and realisitic looking... and take away a basic function of all games!! realism is removed and frustration is added when they do things like this. Gears of war suffers from this for me. I love Gears, but if you could jump, not have to crouch and run at the same time and pull the camera back a little more it would be a 10/10 game instead of a 9.5/10.
They need to realise how much difference a basic a jump function can make on the feel of the game... LAZY!
Yes, because graphics is really the only thing they've improved from XI /rolls eyes.
This subject is a perfect example of people butting heads over the glass half full, half empty logic. Neither is wrong on their stance.
Though I find it very comical heartless, a person who obviously has no interest in XIV, belittle a game he knows almost nothing about because it lacks a feature he seems to need more then an addict on crystal meth. Most determined troll I've come across in awhile.
I don't see why people are being so deeply offended by the lack of a feature in a game.
WoW doesn't have wings on its toons, clearly its lazy because it didn't impliment flying from the get go.
Eve is lazy because they don't have ship interiors.
You can make the claim any game is lazy because of any specific reason you choose, its called a design choice.
Companies use money to pay for time spent developing these design choices, they pick and choose how they want a world to work and where they want to spend their time and effort on. Look how Age of Conan did the shielding system, and yet most people couldn't care less about it, but some would demand all games after it use a similar system. Perhaps you are in love with Aion's movement bonus where you get a bonus depending on if you are moving in combat? Perhaps you think that should be in EVERY game and the game is a de-evolution if it doesn't have it in it.
The point is that they decided. You may or may not agree with their choice. However there was a reason for them making the choice they did, and if you like that reason or not does not mater.
I don't see why people are being so deeply offended by the lack of a feature in a game.
WoW doesn't have wings on its toons, clearly its lazy because it didn't impliment flying from the get go.
Eve is lazy because they don't have ship interiors.
You can make the claim any game is lazy because of any specific reason you choose, its called a design choice.
Companies use money to pay for time spent developing these design choices, they pick and choose how they want a world to work and where they want to spend their time and effort on. Look how Age of Conan did the shielding system, and yet most people couldn't care less about it, but some would demand all games after it use a similar system. Perhaps you are in love with Aion's movement bonus where you get a bonus depending on if you are moving in combat? Perhaps you think that should be in EVERY game and the game is a de-evolution if it doesn't have it in it.
The point is that they decided. You may or may not agree with their choice. However there was a reason for them making the choice they did, and if you like that reason or not does not mater.
Perfectly put.
And before anyone says "but it's a basic function!" Ermmm, no. It's just one of many possible ones in a video game. I mean, by that logic, every MMO should then have auto attack!... >.>
Why are people making excuses for not having a jump feature? Give 'reasons' why they shouldn't.. all you've got is stuff like jumping in combat is silly? well, it could be disabled in combat.
Everyone saying its meaningless and they don't care, 'it's just an emote'.. well they might as well take every single emote and cosmetic feature, such as clothing, out of the game then.. none of it matters in the slightest.. hell, why not take out combat animations and spell effects, we can still kill stuff but seeing your arm swinging isn't really needed to kill its so let not bother eh? might as well all go back to pen and paper and MUD games...
Heres a good enough reason why we should be able to jump:
Some people like having a jump feature, they should try to make everyone happy to get more subscribers.. the feature can only have a positive effect.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Why are people making excuses for not having a jump feature? Give 'reasons' why they shouldn't.. all you've got is stuff like jumping in combat is silly? well, it could be disabled in combat.
Everyone saying its meaningless and they don't care, 'it's just an emote'.. well they might as well take every single emote and cosmetic feature, such as clothing, out of the game then.. none of it matters in the slightest.. hell, why not take out combat animations and spell effects, we can still kill stuff but seeing your arm swinging isn't really needed to kill its so let not bother eh? might as well all go back to pen and paper and MUD games...
Heres a good enough reason why we should be able to jump:
Some people like having a jump feature, they should try to make everyone happy to get more subscribers.. the feature can only have a positive effect.
A designer's job is to predict what happen with whatever is created, the testers are there to ensure it runs without crashes or bugs that interupt the flow and/or playability of the game. Their job is NOT, to ASSUME what most of their playerbase WILL do but only what they CAN do. You said that MOST would use an exploit where this is simply wrong, as you don't know your playerbase. Guessing is by no way a science, statistics can tell you that without any credentials.
Why do people keep saying things like this above, when the reality is quite different aand EASILY PROVABLE?
You know why these people found these secret areas in WAR that lead to absolutely nothing at all, or death in boxes and plungers that blow them up?
Because developers KNEW there are people who do these things: go around and try to find/exploit stuff then post it on Youtube. Even a sorry ass game like Warhammer knew people do this. There was even a developer video where Paul Barnett is sitting around talking to other devs at a table about putting bombs in boxes where people shouldn't go, just as kind of a "We told you to stay out of these areas...now you're dead" thing. (If I find that video again, I'll link it.)
Barnett was talking about the fact that people DO go off beaten paths for one reason or another (he said he's one in the vid) and wanted Mythic devs to spend time placing boxes and objects that would blow them up if they found them by exploits like spending hours trying to jump over things they shouldn't.. or monsters at the end in caves that lead nowhere that killed you in one hit because vids like these (and the ones on the side) are made all the time by nosey people. He thought it was cool; the rest of the devs thought he was crazy and didn't need to be encouraging people to do this kind of stuff. Plus they thought it was a huge waste of manpower which that game certainly could have used.
It IS the devs job to assume what people will do with their game in every way they can so that the game ins't compromised. When they find certain things will corrupt what they are trying to do or is unnecessary, they eliminate it.
I know that probably sounded good for you to speculate what a dev's job was and then denegrate GT for claiming he knows a little about the industry. But the proof is right there in your face, friend. Just click the link.
Why are people making excuses for not having a jump feature? Give 'reasons' why they shouldn't.. all you've got is stuff like jumping in combat is silly? well, it could be disabled in combat.
Everyone saying its meaningless and they don't care, 'it's just an emote'.. well they might as well take every single emote and cosmetic feature, such as clothing, out of the game then.. none of it matters in the slightest.. hell, why not take out combat animations and spell effects, we can still kill stuff but seeing your arm swinging isn't really needed to kill its so let not bother eh? might as well all go back to pen and paper and MUD games...
Heres a good enough reason why we should be able to jump:
Some people like having a jump feature, they should try to make everyone happy to get more subscribers.. the feature can only have a positive effect.
Yes, that's a very convincing argument.
Heh.
and thats a stupid reply to my comment..
my point is that the reasons for people wanting it doesn't matter.. if they want it and giving it to them doesn't affect anyone else then I see no reason not to..
if you can't see that I was trying to say that then your a bit thick really ain't ya?
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Why are people making excuses for not having a jump feature? Give 'reasons' why they shouldn't.. all you've got is stuff like jumping in combat is silly? well, it could be disabled in combat.
Everyone saying its meaningless and they don't care, 'it's just an emote'.. well they might as well take every single emote and cosmetic feature, such as clothing, out of the game then.. none of it matters in the slightest.. hell, why not take out combat animations and spell effects, we can still kill stuff but seeing your arm swinging isn't really needed to kill its so let not bother eh? might as well all go back to pen and paper and MUD games...
Heres a good enough reason why we should be able to jump:
Some people like having a jump feature, they should try to make everyone happy to get more subscribers.. the feature can only have a positive effect.
I think the majority of the FF fan base doesn't want to watch others bunny hop all the time. Also we should be reminded that this is a Japanese game, not a western game and to them this is not something that is important. The way Japanese gamers view games are quite a bit different than western gamers...hince why shooters are not very popular over there but they are here, they just see value in different things.
I personally love the direction they are going. Jumping means nothing to me (besides watching 100 people in a MMO town constantly jump and be annoying). If they add it I really don't care, if they don't add it...I really don't care =P
EDIT: and holy crap I just noticed this thread was 45 pages, ridiculous.
Why are people making excuses for not having a jump feature? Give 'reasons' why they shouldn't.. all you've got is stuff like jumping in combat is silly? well, it could be disabled in combat.
Everyone saying its meaningless and they don't care, 'it's just an emote'.. well they might as well take every single emote and cosmetic feature, such as clothing, out of the game then.. none of it matters in the slightest.. hell, why not take out combat animations and spell effects, we can still kill stuff but seeing your arm swinging isn't really needed to kill its so let not bother eh? might as well all go back to pen and paper and MUD games...
Heres a good enough reason why we should be able to jump:
Some people like having a jump feature, they should try to make everyone happy to get more subscribers.. the feature can only have a positive effect.
Yes, that's a very convincing argument.
Heh.
and thats a stupid reply to my comment..
my point is that the reasons for people wanting it doesn't matter.. if they want it and giving it to them doesn't affect anyone else then I see no reason not to..
if you can't see that I was trying to say that then your a bit thick really ain't ya?
Actually, while you're reasoning may have merits, it serves no purpose in this spcecific scenario.
SE has never intended to have a jump feature since early development. Adding it in now would only lead to more time, money, headaches and possible uneeded delays and changes. I agree that developers should listen to their supporters, but to a certain extent. WoW did as well as it did by listening to the masses, but lost its original appeal and originality of ideas in the last couple years.
Jump is a feature they deemed unneccesary for the experience they have planned for us. Hard to believe, but you know, a lot of times the developers usually know what to do for the long run then the average player. Most are short, narrow minded individuals, and it's why WoW blossomed.
How'd that guy in the vid and many linked to it GET to all those places?
Oh yeah.. jumping.
I only quoted this because I dislike having huge posts with others attached. Nice post. I agree some do as you put it, go off the beaten path, and maybe you're one of them. There are also those that will brag about it and post it anywhere and everywhere.
I have no contention with any of that, but just because SOME will do it does not mean MOST will. Changes nothing about my retort.
I was not denigrating GT, just saying no one can say MOST ppl will do this or that since no one can provide absolute proof of this. I only spoke on that blanket statement, not the validity of jumping being used as an exploit.
I do know what a dev's job is, and a tester's...and also know they can't foresee everything that players will think of with the existing mechanics of any game, hence fixes and patches.
Why are people making excuses for not having a jump feature? Give 'reasons' why they shouldn't.. all you've got is stuff like jumping in combat is silly? well, it could be disabled in combat.
Everyone saying its meaningless and they don't care, 'it's just an emote'.. well they might as well take every single emote and cosmetic feature, such as clothing, out of the game then.. none of it matters in the slightest.. hell, why not take out combat animations and spell effects, we can still kill stuff but seeing your arm swinging isn't really needed to kill its so let not bother eh? might as well all go back to pen and paper and MUD games...
Heres a good enough reason why we should be able to jump:
Some people like having a jump feature, they should try to make everyone happy to get more subscribers.. the feature can only have a positive effect.
Yes, that's a very convincing argument.
Heh.
and thats a stupid reply to my comment..
my point is that the reasons for people wanting it doesn't matter.. if they want it and giving it to them doesn't affect anyone else then I see no reason not to..
if you can't see that I was trying to say that then your a bit thick really ain't ya?
But it does effect others so your point is invalid.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore) Now Playing: N/A Worst MMO: FFXIV Favorite MMO: FFXI
Why are people making excuses for not having a jump feature? Give 'reasons' why they shouldn't.. all you've got is stuff like jumping in combat is silly? well, it could be disabled in combat.
Everyone saying its meaningless and they don't care, 'it's just an emote'.. well they might as well take every single emote and cosmetic feature, such as clothing, out of the game then.. none of it matters in the slightest.. hell, why not take out combat animations and spell effects, we can still kill stuff but seeing your arm swinging isn't really needed to kill its so let not bother eh? might as well all go back to pen and paper and MUD games...
Heres a good enough reason why we should be able to jump:
Some people like having a jump feature, they should try to make everyone happy to get more subscribers.. the feature can only have a positive effect.
I think the majority of the FF fan base doesn't want to watch others bunny hop all the time. Also we should be reminded that this is a Japanese game, not a western game and to them this is not something that is important. The way Japanese gamers view games are quite a bit different than western gamers...hince why shooters are not very popular over there but they are here, they just see value in different things.
I personally love the direction they are going. Jumping means nothing to me (besides watching 100 people in a MMO town constantly jump and be annoying). If they add it I really don't care, if they don't add it...I really don't care =P
EDIT: and holy crap I just noticed this thread was 45 pages, ridiculous.
I don't mind not being able to jump either but if it makes some people happy... these 45 pages suggests there is some demand for the feature. If this was a post saying there 'was' a jump feature I doubt it would have been a very popular topic.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
Why are people making excuses for not having a jump feature? Give 'reasons' why they shouldn't.. all you've got is stuff like jumping in combat is silly? well, it could be disabled in combat.
Everyone saying its meaningless and they don't care, 'it's just an emote'.. well they might as well take every single emote and cosmetic feature, such as clothing, out of the game then.. none of it matters in the slightest.. hell, why not take out combat animations and spell effects, we can still kill stuff but seeing your arm swinging isn't really needed to kill its so let not bother eh? might as well all go back to pen and paper and MUD games...
Heres a good enough reason why we should be able to jump:
Some people like having a jump feature, they should try to make everyone happy to get more subscribers.. the feature can only have a positive effect.
I think the majority of the FF fan base doesn't want to watch others bunny hop all the time. Also we should be reminded that this is a Japanese game, not a western game and to them this is not something that is important. The way Japanese gamers view games are quite a bit different than western gamers...hince why shooters are not very popular over there but they are here, they just see value in different things.
I personally love the direction they are going. Jumping means nothing to me (besides watching 100 people in a MMO town constantly jump and be annoying). If they add it I really don't care, if they don't add it...I really don't care =P
EDIT: and holy crap I just noticed this thread was 45 pages, ridiculous.
I don't mind not being able to jump either but if it makes some people happy... these 45 pages suggests there is some demand for the feature. If this was a post saying there 'was' a jump feature I doubt it would have been a very popular topic.
A good chunk of those pages were by very few individuals butting heads. Not denying a lot of people are a bit dismayed to find out there's not jump (a few personal friends of mine are some), but it's not a make or break decision for them. Anyone giving up an entire game just because it lacks one trivial feature is nothing more then a short sighted individual, whom most of us would probably not want to assossciate with in game anyways. So good riddance.
I don't mind not being able to jump either but if it makes some people happy... these 45 pages suggests there is some demand for the feature. If this was a post saying there 'was' a jump feature I doubt it would have been a very popular topic.
I'd wager if many of these posts, like mine, which should've stayed on topic, we'd have half as many pages.
Comments
Ok, being the Tyranny example, I can understand where you are coming from and had I been there might be in agreement. However, my first interjection was at these, which showed nothing of the incident on tyranny:
These were said before you reference. Sorry if this what you were getting at, but without the incident spoken beforehand, I did not know how they tied except as a blanket statement.
@GTWander
It's cool man, it's just funny at this point.
You are preaching to the choir with me btw, jumping has no place in this game and would be terrible.
Yes and no.
My point on people wanting to get the ability to jump "to see what kind of mess they can get into" is a universal saying for anything unintentional. They don't even have to be exploiting a position, as much as ending up under the world because they got too curious over some place they shouldn't have gone. This is why there is just giant invisible walls boxing everything in these days, but there are soooo many places with obtuse geometry that get overlooked on every pass.
The chutspah thing relates to how people get when frustrated, best explained in the other post. Relates to any game, and that is why I later brought up AoC as a prime example. I may have a poor grasp on the word "chutspah", but i consider it to be an "indomitable spirit", which is easily broken into payback-mode once beaten enough times and slighted.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
Sure - all I meant by this is that most people tend to judge/define/categorize/label others based on the sorts of ideas they might share. This leads to personal attacks and insults rather than productive discussion, or people taking a stubborn and defensive stance in the argument. "Oh, you're one of those people..." would be just such an attitude.
I was saying it's important to attack arguments and not people and realize that any rational mind can entertain even the most seemingly absurd notions without being attached to them. For example, I can tell someone about the merits of a totalitarian fascist regime being imposed in the united states - but I may not actually have the world view that would support such a idea. Even if I truly believed in something, that's just me choosing to subscribe to that idea at a particular time, which could always change. To use a poor analogy, all the ideas in the world could be a smorgasbord of food, and we choose what we want to partake of at any given time, but we are not what we eat.
TLDR: We (as humans) define our ideas, rather than being defined by them.
And yes, this has nothing to do with the original topic of the thread, but it's far more constructive in general, wouldn't you say?
Well, I understand better your view point and glad it got cleared up. I just hate ppl that generalize in attempting to bolster their 'claim'.
I, for one, don't care about not having a jump in FFXI, I'm gonna love it
anyway.
If the Jump ability was going to be used for any kind of in game feature or benefit, you'd have to have the liitle midgets jumping the same distance as the tall lanky elf posers. They probably don't want the image of their nimble cat girls being the same as the tall bulky guys and the little midget things.
@twrule
I get you, but it seems it's more about you not involving people as a statistic or they might get offended, and part of me just won't walk that line. I also understand that it's very easy to misunderstand a person at first glance, but my point on stereotyping being there for a reason should still stand pretty firm. It wouldn't be a popular belief for nothing, it's a common occurance that gets catagorized - and others get unfairly paired into it.
This is then the problem I suppose, when it comes to using people as statistical figures;
People put themselves into the count first.
When I said the word "most", everybody immediately put themselves, and the people they hang around on the list first. A small circle can seem like the whole world though, and if you're not paying attention outside, you may start thinking that everyone else thinks they way you do too. They do not. A person's experience in never seeing the kind of exploitation I have in games can be a byproduct of; who they hang out with, where they hang out at, and when they do.
The right circumstances will either make you see the brunt of it, or none of it.
I always play unguilded and typically solo btw, that makes me meat.
Writer / Musician / Game Designer
Now Playing: Skyrim, Wurm Online, Tropico 4
Waiting On: GW2, TSW, Archeage, The Rapture
~my point on stereotyping being there for a reason should still stand pretty firm. It wouldn't be a popular belief for nothing, it's a common occurance that gets catagorized ~
Be careful with your thinking on stereotypes, they are NOT always true and are more often than not propagated by those who wish to put them down because of their dislike and/or prejudice. Just because you fall into one of the 'stereotypes' out there does not make it any more truthful.
Thats a pathetic response to not having jump. Having better graphics doesn't do anything either...
They spend so much time improving the graphics over the old one, to make it more current and realisitic looking... and take away a basic function of all games!! realism is removed and frustration is added when they do things like this. Gears of war suffers from this for me. I love Gears, but if you could jump, not have to crouch and run at the same time and pull the camera back a little more it would be a 10/10 game instead of a 9.5/10.
They need to realise how much difference a basic a jump function can make on the feel of the game... LAZY!
I like how people keep putting small fences and boulders in there way as reasons for wanting jump. That's just lazy. If you've played FFXI you'd know that these objects are far away from zone lines. Hell, the only fences I can think of at the moment is in Rolanberry Fields and you can run through them. Low walls aren't a problem cause there's, more than not, an easy path through. Stop running directly at objects and they won't be in your way. In FFXI, you can see obstacles a long way away. Just turn a few degrees to either side and I bet you'll get past that oh so hard to get around rock. And if they design the areas in any way like FFXI there are a lot of large open areas to explore. No winding linear paths except for some dungeons.
And for a game with no jumping that must be so flat, you have areas like Altepa Desert, the Dunes, and the Highlands. Spiral stairs in Delkfutt. Paths that take you to lower and upper floors of dungeons. Ledges and holes in floors that let you fall to lower levels.
Yes, because graphics is really the only thing they've improved from XI /rolls eyes.
This subject is a perfect example of people butting heads over the glass half full, half empty logic. Neither is wrong on their stance.
Though I find it very comical heartless, a person who obviously has no interest in XIV, belittle a game he knows almost nothing about because it lacks a feature he seems to need more then an addict on crystal meth. Most determined troll I've come across in awhile.
I don't see why people are being so deeply offended by the lack of a feature in a game.
WoW doesn't have wings on its toons, clearly its lazy because it didn't impliment flying from the get go.
Eve is lazy because they don't have ship interiors.
You can make the claim any game is lazy because of any specific reason you choose, its called a design choice.
Companies use money to pay for time spent developing these design choices, they pick and choose how they want a world to work and where they want to spend their time and effort on. Look how Age of Conan did the shielding system, and yet most people couldn't care less about it, but some would demand all games after it use a similar system. Perhaps you are in love with Aion's movement bonus where you get a bonus depending on if you are moving in combat? Perhaps you think that should be in EVERY game and the game is a de-evolution if it doesn't have it in it.
The point is that they decided. You may or may not agree with their choice. However there was a reason for them making the choice they did, and if you like that reason or not does not mater.
Perfectly put.
And before anyone says "but it's a basic function!" Ermmm, no. It's just one of many possible ones in a video game. I mean, by that logic, every MMO should then have auto attack!... >.>
Why are people making excuses for not having a jump feature? Give 'reasons' why they shouldn't.. all you've got is stuff like jumping in combat is silly? well, it could be disabled in combat.
Everyone saying its meaningless and they don't care, 'it's just an emote'.. well they might as well take every single emote and cosmetic feature, such as clothing, out of the game then.. none of it matters in the slightest.. hell, why not take out combat animations and spell effects, we can still kill stuff but seeing your arm swinging isn't really needed to kill its so let not bother eh? might as well all go back to pen and paper and MUD games...
Heres a good enough reason why we should be able to jump:
Some people like having a jump feature, they should try to make everyone happy to get more subscribers.. the feature can only have a positive effect.
Yes, that's a very convincing argument.
Heh.
Why do people keep saying things like this above, when the reality is quite different aand EASILY PROVABLE?
Example of people going off beaten paths, then posting/bragging about it
You know why these people found these secret areas in WAR that lead to absolutely nothing at all, or death in boxes and plungers that blow them up?
Because developers KNEW there are people who do these things: go around and try to find/exploit stuff then post it on Youtube. Even a sorry ass game like Warhammer knew people do this. There was even a developer video where Paul Barnett is sitting around talking to other devs at a table about putting bombs in boxes where people shouldn't go, just as kind of a "We told you to stay out of these areas...now you're dead" thing. (If I find that video again, I'll link it.)
Barnett was talking about the fact that people DO go off beaten paths for one reason or another (he said he's one in the vid) and wanted Mythic devs to spend time placing boxes and objects that would blow them up if they found them by exploits like spending hours trying to jump over things they shouldn't.. or monsters at the end in caves that lead nowhere that killed you in one hit because vids like these (and the ones on the side) are made all the time by nosey people. He thought it was cool; the rest of the devs thought he was crazy and didn't need to be encouraging people to do this kind of stuff. Plus they thought it was a huge waste of manpower which that game certainly could have used.
It IS the devs job to assume what people will do with their game in every way they can so that the game ins't compromised. When they find certain things will corrupt what they are trying to do or is unnecessary, they eliminate it.
I know that probably sounded good for you to speculate what a dev's job was and then denegrate GT for claiming he knows a little about the industry. But the proof is right there in your face, friend. Just click the link.
"TO MICHAEL!"
..and btw:
How'd that guy in the vid and many linked to it GET to all those places?
Oh yeah.. jumping.
"TO MICHAEL!"
and thats a stupid reply to my comment..
my point is that the reasons for people wanting it doesn't matter.. if they want it and giving it to them doesn't affect anyone else then I see no reason not to..
if you can't see that I was trying to say that then your a bit thick really ain't ya?
I think the majority of the FF fan base doesn't want to watch others bunny hop all the time. Also we should be reminded that this is a Japanese game, not a western game and to them this is not something that is important. The way Japanese gamers view games are quite a bit different than western gamers...hince why shooters are not very popular over there but they are here, they just see value in different things.
I personally love the direction they are going. Jumping means nothing to me (besides watching 100 people in a MMO town constantly jump and be annoying). If they add it I really don't care, if they don't add it...I really don't care =P
EDIT: and holy crap I just noticed this thread was 45 pages, ridiculous.
Actually, while you're reasoning may have merits, it serves no purpose in this spcecific scenario.
SE has never intended to have a jump feature since early development. Adding it in now would only lead to more time, money, headaches and possible uneeded delays and changes. I agree that developers should listen to their supporters, but to a certain extent. WoW did as well as it did by listening to the masses, but lost its original appeal and originality of ideas in the last couple years.
Jump is a feature they deemed unneccesary for the experience they have planned for us. Hard to believe, but you know, a lot of times the developers usually know what to do for the long run then the average player. Most are short, narrow minded individuals, and it's why WoW blossomed.
Deal with it.
I only quoted this because I dislike having huge posts with others attached. Nice post. I agree some do as you put it, go off the beaten path, and maybe you're one of them. There are also those that will brag about it and post it anywhere and everywhere.
I have no contention with any of that, but just because SOME will do it does not mean MOST will. Changes nothing about my retort.
I was not denigrating GT, just saying no one can say MOST ppl will do this or that since no one can provide absolute proof of this. I only spoke on that blanket statement, not the validity of jumping being used as an exploit.
I do know what a dev's job is, and a tester's...and also know they can't foresee everything that players will think of with the existing mechanics of any game, hence fixes and patches.
But it does effect others so your point is invalid.
Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI
I don't mind not being able to jump either but if it makes some people happy... these 45 pages suggests there is some demand for the feature. If this was a post saying there 'was' a jump feature I doubt it would have been a very popular topic.
A good chunk of those pages were by very few individuals butting heads. Not denying a lot of people are a bit dismayed to find out there's not jump (a few personal friends of mine are some), but it's not a make or break decision for them. Anyone giving up an entire game just because it lacks one trivial feature is nothing more then a short sighted individual, whom most of us would probably not want to assossciate with in game anyways. So good riddance.
I'd wager if many of these posts, like mine, which should've stayed on topic, we'd have half as many pages.