You call yourself a competitive gamer and then you whine about the fact that newer players will be able to compete with you. Do you truly not see the irony in that?
Ka-POW!
Here we are. Art imitating life. People less likely to succed and less likely to put forth effort towards accomplishments have demonstrated time and time again in society that they are entitled to what others have accomplished, but without similar effort, yet an expectation.
Where once DF may have been a competitive outlet where players earn their competitive edge through game-play resources, time and effort, leading to progressively more growth and edge, are now observing welfare gaming.
It doesn't make sense that you would come into a pvp game and grind out months to get to pvp. I'll just pick up something that has instant pvp and go on about my business.
just as a point of reference what game does that?
EvE is not that way, Fallen Earth is not that way (although its pretty weak as a PvP game anyway)
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
BTW since when DF is a competitive game ? I have to see yet few weeks old char beating one of the vets. Counter Strike is competitve game, even Starcraft. Competitve gaming is about player skill, not how many more thousands of trolls you have killled. I have to see yet a MMORPG game which actually is a competitve pvp game.
again competiion depends on the game. People compete in work, sports, table top games, eltronic games etc. the 'game of compeition' always depends on the agreed ruleset.
ALL RPG's not just this one but ALL of them are not the compettive type of game you are describing but they are compettive. He who gets home and rallies his troops together. organizes a good tactical advance, puts in the hours for skill progression is competing.
In RPG the keyboard and mouse is more of an instrument to play the game, not the game itself.
The combat system begs to differ lol. This is part of the problem, if you want traditional RPG'rs then you will have to change the combat system because mainly what DFO has attracted is competitive players looking forward to the player skill aspect and making them grind months on end discourages them.
So basically DFO is discouraging both currently lol. Unless AV wants to completely change the combat system to get the RPG'rs in that want it to be about toon skill they will need to lessen the grind like they are doing and focus more on player skill.
Again this is one of those "You can't have it both ways" kind of things.
ok lets play this out to its logical end for a moment. First lets start i want to state for the record:
none of the RPG's are 100% twitch based so if this game was to be that it would be the first.
Phase 1, the more you make the skill progression narrow or as a barrier to the game rather then the game itself the more people will ask the very valid question of 'why have skills at all?' if everyone just see's skill as a long turorial why not just get rid of it completely?
Phase 2: the game now has no skill in real terms. It might have skills up if it takes a weekend to max it its really not a skill system that is honestly part of the game. Then what you have is Fantasy based Halo with a large map.
Is that what you are advocating?
Lets be honest here.... the PvE is not a lot of fun, people play for the PvP and the conquest. Everyone can be a crafter as well as anything else they want so the economy has never been good and there isn't any true safe place for crafters to do there business so people don't play for this either, they play for the PvP.
How many traditional RPG'rs do you know that are looking for a PvP MMO where they need to manually fight and aim and that has Full Loot and FFA PvP?
PvP'rs are the ones that have been and are looking at DFO. If people want an RPG MMO then they are already looking elsewhere.
Now you can keep the RPG element but lessen the gap between Vet and Newb and remove at least some of the grind and attract more PvP players and some players that are looking for a grittier kind of RPG or keep things the way they are and continue to tank and eventually shut down.
Phase 1: Keep things the way they were and continue losing players and gaining few if any.
Phase 2: Shutdown the servers.
Is that what you are advocating?
I'm fine with new players needing a month or so to get to a good competitive level, but I do want them to be able to hold there own against lesser skilled (Player Skill wise) vets.
You call yourself a competitive gamer and then you whine about the fact that newer players will be able to compete with you. Do you truly not see the irony in that?
Ka-POW!
Here we are. Art imitating life. People less likely to succed and less likely to put forth effort towards accomplishments have demonstrated time and time again in society that they are entitled to what others have accomplished, but without similar effort, yet an expectation.
Where once DF may have been a competitive outlet where players earn their competitive edge through game-play resources, time and effort, leading to progressively more growth and edge, are now observing welfare gaming.
QFT again since you guys missed it apparently.
With the games focus being PvP, taking many months to get to a competitive level isn't reasonable and will drive most away as it has been.
Since you missed this I felt let resaying it in a shorter more comprehensive way for you.
What it boils down to... players don't want to spend 6 months or more grinding to get to the fun and they don't want to pay for the right to do so lol. Hence why the game has been losing subs a lot faster than it's gaining subs. Granted some do... but hopefully the fact that AV is making changes that appeal to those that don't you will understand you are in the minority.
It doesn't make sense that you would come into a pvp game and grind out months to get to pvp. I'll just pick up something that has instant pvp and go on about my business.
just as a point of reference what game does that?
EvE is not that way, Fallen Earth is not that way (although its pretty weak as a PvP game anyway)
In EvE you can hop into PvP and take part in PvP relatively quick and yes even against some vets. The difference between newb and vet isn't anywhere near as vast as the gap between them in DFO.
Lets be honest here.... the PvE is not a lot of fun, people play for the PvP and the conquest. Everyone can be a crafter as well as anything else they want so the economy has never been good and there isn't any true safe place for crafters to do there business so people don't play for this either, they play for the PvP.
How many traditional RPG'rs do you know that are looking for a PvP MMO where they need to manually fight and aim and that has Full Loot and FFA PvP?
PvP'rs are the ones that have been and are looking at DFO. If people want an RPG MMO then they are already looking elsewhere.
Now you can keep the RPG element but lessen the gap between Vet and Newb and remove at least some of the grind and attract more PvP players and some players that are looking for a grittier kind of RPG or keep things the way they are and continue to tank and eventually shut down.
Phase 1: Keep things the way they were and continue losing players and gaining few if any.
Phase 2: Shutdown the servers.
Is that what you are advocating?
I'm fine with new players needing a month or so to get to a good competitive level, but I do want them to be able to hold there own against lesser skilled (Player Skill wise) vets.
First of as someone who plays PvE mostly in this game I think the PvE is better by far than any other MMO I have played. its actually very good by comparision.
second, all MMO's have bad crafting economies that is an economic system that rarelt ever works well, although many have told me SWG it works well.
third off, we can talk about what I am advocating but I am still trying to understand if you are adovcating a fantasy based Halo which again I think is actually a good idea, its just not a game i personally would play.
Now, what am I advocating? I am advocating a RPG RTS with FPS elements. Your empire builders love progression and building of power, you can not satisfy those players with a system that is easily equal for all people regardles of what you do. In fact, I would go as far as to say you cant have RTS at all without progression based approaches.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
It doesn't make sense that you would come into a pvp game and grind out months to get to pvp. I'll just pick up something that has instant pvp and go on about my business.
just as a point of reference what game does that?
EvE is not that way, Fallen Earth is not that way (although its pretty weak as a PvP game anyway)
In EvE you can hop into PvP and take part in PvP relatively quick and yes even against some vets. The difference between newb and vet isn't anywhere near as vast as the gap between them in DFO.
In DF you can get supplied with r70s melee weapons + bows, infernal armors, + get buffed to vet level stats, right off the bat. You can spend a few hours raising your melee/bow skills to improve their damage a few points too.
It doesn't make sense that you would come into a pvp game and grind out months to get to pvp. I'll just pick up something that has instant pvp and go on about my business.
just as a point of reference what game does that?
EvE is not that way, Fallen Earth is not that way (although its pretty weak as a PvP game anyway)
It was advertised as a PvP game...
Correct?
It was suppose to be the hardcore PvP game right?
It is more like the hardcore PvE game...
I don't play MMO's for PvP to tell you the truth. The reason why is because what you just stated!!! Well I do, but going in I know that the game is largely NOT based on skill.
Oh yea, and you mentioned something about turn it into Street Fighter.
Is the OP pissed that people are atually competative now and they can't run around blowing through people or groups of people or that AV made it easier to be competative?
I know what he said but it sure sounds like he's pissed about not being able to roll through people without any real chance of dying.
P.S. "hardcore" tears taste so much better than carebear tears.
I played Street Fighter for years and still do sometimes!!!
So your argument that people wouldn't stick around because of progression, well is just WRONG!!!
BTW, those type games do have their own progression. The progression is you getting better at those moves in order to counter other people and to come up with combos that maximize damage and minimize risk.
With the games focus being PvP, taking many months to get to a competitive level isn't reasonable and will drive most away as it has been.
Since you missed this I felt let resaying it in a shorter more comprehensive way for you.
What it boils down to... players don't want to spend 6 months or more grinding to get to the fun and they don't want to pay for the right to do so lol. Hence why the game has been losing subs a lot faster than it's gaining subs. Granted some do... but hopefully the fact that AV is making changes that appeal to those that don't you will understand you are in the minority.
maybe your right. basic pvp doesnt appeal to me as much so maybe I do have a block I admit. I like darkall becuase of the empire building aspects, what I see as great PvE and an amazing world. I am not micro competitve. I am macro compettive though (empire building).
I just dont like Counter Strike games for the long run of entertainment more of a diversion.
But yes, I can see if a person is excited about PvP combat that starting the game out can be frustrating. WHICH is why I am a strong supporter of someone creating a game that is more like maybe Guild Wars. I know AV might have given people an impression that it was, it was not however the impression I had from reading the extended game description. What I saw in the game descrption was empire building but that could be becuase that is what I was intrested in.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Lets be honest here.... the PvE is not a lot of fun, people play for the PvP and the conquest. Everyone can be a crafter as well as anything else they want so the economy has never been good and there isn't any true safe place for crafters to do there business so people don't play for this either, they play for the PvP.
How many traditional RPG'rs do you know that are looking for a PvP MMO where they need to manually fight and aim and that has Full Loot and FFA PvP?
PvP'rs are the ones that have been and are looking at DFO. If people want an RPG MMO then they are already looking elsewhere.
Now you can keep the RPG element but lessen the gap between Vet and Newb and remove at least some of the grind and attract more PvP players and some players that are looking for a grittier kind of RPG or keep things the way they are and continue to tank and eventually shut down.
Phase 1: Keep things the way they were and continue losing players and gaining few if any.
Phase 2: Shutdown the servers.
Is that what you are advocating?
I'm fine with new players needing a month or so to get to a good competitive level, but I do want them to be able to hold there own against lesser skilled (Player Skill wise) vets.
First of as someone who plays PvE mostly in this game I think the PvE is better by far than any other MMO I have played. its actually very good by comparision.
second, all MMO's have bad crafting economies that is an economic system that rarelt ever works well, although many have told me SWG it works well.
third off, we can talk about what I am advocating but I am still trying to understand if you are adovcating a fantasy based Halo which again I think is actually a good idea, its just not a game i personally would play.
Now, what am I advocating? I am advocating a RPG RTS with FPS elements. Your empire builders love progression and building of power, you can not satisfy those players with a system that is easily equal for all people regardles of what you do. In fact, I would go as far as to say you cant have RTS at all without progression based approaches.
Yeah.... mobs standing there while you shoot them in the head since your out of reach, gobs that run in circles while you kill them, Trolls that chase you as you shoot them until you get out of there spawn area and turn back while you chase them and continue to kill them until they get back to there spawn point and walk for a few seconds until they realize they are being attacked and decide to turn around and chase you again while you repeat this till they are dead. Sorry lol, DFO PvE for me is one of the worste, it's only redeeming factor is the combat system.
And I am advocating less of a gap between vet and new player, I want competition. You can keep the RPG elements just don't make them so in your face and don't let them dictate the outcome of every battle.
I am also advocating a bit less grind because it's completely asinine to expect players to pay to play and grind for 6 months to get to the fun part of the game.
Bottom line is like I said before, the game as it was wasn't doing well at all or by any standards. So the whole discussion is fairly moot. You either want the game to continue to decline until it dies or you are looking for changes that will bring players in.
sean, its useless debating with these fools that don't know WTH they are talking about. They clearly don't have the mental capacity to argue with you in any logical way. They will say the sky is black and make mountains out of molehills.
Yeah.... mobs standing there while you shoot them in the head since your out of reach, gobs that run in circles while you kill them, Trolls that chase you as you shoot them until you get out of there spawn area and turn back while you chase them and continue to kill them until they get back to there spawn point and walk for a few seconds until they realize they are being attacked and decide to turn around and chase you again while you repeat this till they are dead. Sorry lol, DFO PvE for me is one of the worste, it's only redeeming factor is the combat system.
And I am advocating less of a gap between vet and new player, I want competition. You can keep the RPG elements just don't make them so in your face and don't let them dictate the outcome of every battle.
I am also advocating a bit less grind because it's completely asinine to expect players to pay to play and grind for 6 months to get to the fun part of the game.
Bottom line is like I said before, the game as it was wasn't doing well at all or by any standards. So the whole discussion is fairly moot. You either want the game to continue to decline until it dies or you are looking for changes that will bring players in.
compared to what game? look again I said compared to other MMO's in other MMO's PvE moves around even less. AND on top of it they are not target based more tab based. So again I stress, compared to other MMO's.
anyway, time for me to leave the computer real life calls atm.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Cya gl finding a game. I could suggest you several asia grinders where you can invest time, but then again you would play with asian who invest aswell a lot of time in grinding and that would mean aswell competition. Darn it seems you have to start playing single player games. And again Bye. I guess no one will miss these carebears who are afraid of competition
You call yourself a competitive gamer and then you whine about the fact that newer players will be able to compete with you. Do you truly not see the irony in that?
Ka-POW!
Here we are. Art imitating life. People less likely to succed and less likely to put forth effort towards accomplishments have demonstrated time and time again in society that they are entitled to what others have accomplished, but without similar effort, yet an expectation.
Where once DF may have been a competitive outlet where players earn their competitive edge through game-play resources, time and effort, leading to progressively more growth and edge, are now observing welfare gaming.
you got it twisted. you're actual skills (not "skills") should be what makes or breaks you.
IN WELFARE GAMING, you can get free handout wins just by putting enough time/grind into the game in order for your character to be more powerful regardless of any real skills you put into it your gameplay.
Yeah.... mobs standing there while you shoot them in the head since your out of reach, gobs that run in circles while you kill them, Trolls that chase you as you shoot them until you get out of there spawn area and turn back while you chase them and continue to kill them until they get back to there spawn point and walk for a few seconds until they realize they are being attacked and decide to turn around and chase you again while you repeat this till they are dead. Sorry lol, DFO PvE for me is one of the worste, it's only redeeming factor is the combat system.
And I am advocating less of a gap between vet and new player, I want competition. You can keep the RPG elements just don't make them so in your face and don't let them dictate the outcome of every battle.
I am also advocating a bit less grind because it's completely asinine to expect players to pay to play and grind for 6 months to get to the fun part of the game.
Bottom line is like I said before, the game as it was wasn't doing well at all or by any standards. So the whole discussion is fairly moot. You either want the game to continue to decline until it dies or you are looking for changes that will bring players in.
compared to what game? look again I said compared to other MMO's in other MMO's PvE moves around even less. AND on top of it they are not target based more tab based. So again I stress, compared to other MMO's.
anyway, time for me to leave the computer real life calls atm.
WAR you can get in from lvl 1 or 2 and actually do something...
Mentioned before was Shadowbane. It took little to no time to max your character. It had many other flaws, but that definately wasn't one of them.
I will say this. DFO has the mechanics to be a much better PvP MMO than either of these, or any that have come before it. The problem is, the grind and the difference in power between a noob and a vet. We are not talking about SKILL!!! We are talking about the artificial increases for time played!
If you are a vet, shouldn't you already have the skill to defeat someone new to the game without the extra stats and buffs to your char?
The only way progression works in a PvP game is for it to be very fast or either for there to be other artificial barriers such as level restrictions(example WAR). I am talking about artifical, such as stats and more abilities.
Because stats and abilities are already part of the game, the game CAN NOT BE truely skill based. Because there are other factors that determine the outcome than JUST YOUR SKILL.
JUST YOUR SKILL = WHAT REAL PvPer's WANT!!!
So the only way that DFO can truely come close to a real skill based game is to make it easy for everyone to max their stats and abilities.
Anytime you add other factors into the game besides player skill, you have already started moving away from what a true PvPer wants.
This patch is awesome. Combat has never been better other than the whole rays issue which is a very quick fix. This has turned darkfall back in to the skill twitch based game we were all looking for. Am I upset that I grinded magic for hours? Yes, but the game is waaaay better today than it has been in months.
need more posts from these outsiders who don't know WTH they are talking about.
People dont have to play the game to know that you watn ezmode kills.
And some of us that do have already asked for his gear as he departs...
not quitting, just keeping my eyes out for a game I would enjoy more. I don't enjoy games where they change the game to allow the bad players beat the best simply because there was more than one of them.
You wont find an other one with full loot. Mortal online have no grind at all. Other upcoming mmorpg's with full loot wont have grind. The only game with full loot that have grind is Eve online, but the question is, do you like playing in space?
EDIT: On your comment about ppl using steroids to have instant gratification, without steroids, human would have a type of cap too you know? Look at the UFC fighters, those who dont take stereoids. The only reason they win is because of their technic. I know that because fighters who dont take steroids and still work out a lot dont have big mucles at all. Some of them are sitll really fat
So darkfall without steroids = cap. Darkfall with steroids = no cap. Its the other way around man.
WAR you can get in from lvl 1 or 2 and actually do something...
Mentioned before was Shadowbane. It took little to no time to max your character. It had many other flaws, but that definately wasn't one of them.
I will say this. DFO has the mechanics to be a much better PvP MMO than either of these, or any that have come before it. The problem is, the grind and the difference in power between a noob and a vet. We are not talking about SKILL!!! We are talking about the artificial increases for time played!
If you are a vet, shouldn't you already have the skill to defeat someone new to the game without the extra stats and buffs to your char?
The only way progression works in a PvP game is for it to be very fast or either for there to be other artificial barriers such as level restrictions(example WAR). I am talking about artifical, such as stats and more abilities.
Because stats and abilities are already part of the game, the game CAN NOT BE truely skill based. Because there are other factors that determine the outcome than JUST YOUR SKILL.
JUST YOUR SKILL = WHAT REAL PvPer's WANT!!!
So the only way that DFO can truely come close to a real skill based game is to make it easy for everyone to max their stats and abilities.
Anytime you add other factors into the game besides player skill, you have already started moving away from what a true PvPer wants.
I asked you what MMO game has better PvE. your answer was WAR and shadow BECUASE its easier and faster to level up.
Sorry but that does not mean better to me.
I find DF PvE better becuase its more challenging and 'realistic' than other MMOs. Now, be extreemly careful in reading what I am saying, 'compared to other MMO's' is a very important part of what I am saying
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
You call yourself a competitive gamer and then you whine about the fact that newer players will be able to compete with you. Do you truly not see the irony in that?
Ka-POW!
Here we are. Art imitating life. People less likely to succed and less likely to put forth effort towards accomplishments have demonstrated time and time again in society that they are entitled to what others have accomplished, but without similar effort, yet an expectation.
Where once DF may have been a competitive outlet where players earn their competitive edge through game-play resources, time and effort, leading to progressively more growth and edge, are now observing welfare gaming.
There are few people less likely to succeed at life, than those who spend 16 hours a day grinding a video game to pwn noobs.
That's not art imitating life. That's non-life(16 hours a day playing a game) playing virtual life("building up swimming skill").
its not about 1v1 its about not losing just b/c you are outnumbered by 1.
take things to extremes more.
Thats where player skill comes in quit relying on some artificial advantage.
having your target block while his buddy shoots you in the back isn't an artificial advantage.
next moronic statement from someone who doesn't understand the game pls.
That's true. THEY aren't using an artificial advantage. But anybody who can stand toe to toe in that situation and trade blows for the eventual win is using ARTIFICIAL advantages.
The OP is QQing because he can no longer totally trounce not one but two new players that have to play MONTHS to even attempt to be on the same competative level?
Sounds like a flawed game from the start. Hardcore or not, the game wont last if a newbie joins and has to wait months before even trying to be an added value to combat in PvP.
It doesn't make much business sense and it doesn't help the game to have such a disparity in power where one vet can easily take out two beginner to intermediate players. Now you have to pull some tricks.
In fact, I'd wager there are some vets out there talented enough to take 2v1 of other vets equal in character level(skillpoints and time played levelwise).
Comments
QFT again since you guys missed it apparently.
currently playing: Darkfall, EVE, SC2
just as a point of reference what game does that?
EvE is not that way, Fallen Earth is not that way (although its pretty weak as a PvP game anyway)
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Lets be honest here.... the PvE is not a lot of fun, people play for the PvP and the conquest. Everyone can be a crafter as well as anything else they want so the economy has never been good and there isn't any true safe place for crafters to do there business so people don't play for this either, they play for the PvP.
How many traditional RPG'rs do you know that are looking for a PvP MMO where they need to manually fight and aim and that has Full Loot and FFA PvP?
PvP'rs are the ones that have been and are looking at DFO. If people want an RPG MMO then they are already looking elsewhere.
Now you can keep the RPG element but lessen the gap between Vet and Newb and remove at least some of the grind and attract more PvP players and some players that are looking for a grittier kind of RPG or keep things the way they are and continue to tank and eventually shut down.
Phase 1: Keep things the way they were and continue losing players and gaining few if any.
Phase 2: Shutdown the servers.
Is that what you are advocating?
I'm fine with new players needing a month or so to get to a good competitive level, but I do want them to be able to hold there own against lesser skilled (Player Skill wise) vets.
With the games focus being PvP, taking many months to get to a competitive level isn't reasonable and will drive most away as it has been.
Since you missed this I felt let resaying it in a shorter more comprehensive way for you.
What it boils down to... players don't want to spend 6 months or more grinding to get to the fun and they don't want to pay for the right to do so lol. Hence why the game has been losing subs a lot faster than it's gaining subs. Granted some do... but hopefully the fact that AV is making changes that appeal to those that don't you will understand you are in the minority.
In EvE you can hop into PvP and take part in PvP relatively quick and yes even against some vets. The difference between newb and vet isn't anywhere near as vast as the gap between them in DFO.
First of as someone who plays PvE mostly in this game I think the PvE is better by far than any other MMO I have played. its actually very good by comparision.
second, all MMO's have bad crafting economies that is an economic system that rarelt ever works well, although many have told me SWG it works well.
third off, we can talk about what I am advocating but I am still trying to understand if you are adovcating a fantasy based Halo which again I think is actually a good idea, its just not a game i personally would play.
Now, what am I advocating? I am advocating a RPG RTS with FPS elements. Your empire builders love progression and building of power, you can not satisfy those players with a system that is easily equal for all people regardles of what you do. In fact, I would go as far as to say you cant have RTS at all without progression based approaches.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
In DF you can get supplied with r70s melee weapons + bows, infernal armors, + get buffed to vet level stats, right off the bat. You can spend a few hours raising your melee/bow skills to improve their damage a few points too.
It was advertised as a PvP game...
Correct?
It was suppose to be the hardcore PvP game right?
It is more like the hardcore PvE game...
I don't play MMO's for PvP to tell you the truth. The reason why is because what you just stated!!! Well I do, but going in I know that the game is largely NOT based on skill.
Oh yea, and you mentioned something about turn it into Street Fighter.
That would be awesome!!!
Is the OP pissed that people are atually competative now and they can't run around blowing through people or groups of people or that AV made it easier to be competative?
I know what he said but it sure sounds like he's pissed about not being able to roll through people without any real chance of dying.
P.S. "hardcore" tears taste so much better than carebear tears.
One other thing...
I played Street Fighter for years and still do sometimes!!!
So your argument that people wouldn't stick around because of progression, well is just WRONG!!!
BTW, those type games do have their own progression. The progression is you getting better at those moves in order to counter other people and to come up with combos that maximize damage and minimize risk.
maybe your right. basic pvp doesnt appeal to me as much so maybe I do have a block I admit. I like darkall becuase of the empire building aspects, what I see as great PvE and an amazing world. I am not micro competitve. I am macro compettive though (empire building).
I just dont like Counter Strike games for the long run of entertainment more of a diversion.
But yes, I can see if a person is excited about PvP combat that starting the game out can be frustrating. WHICH is why I am a strong supporter of someone creating a game that is more like maybe Guild Wars. I know AV might have given people an impression that it was, it was not however the impression I had from reading the extended game description. What I saw in the game descrption was empire building but that could be becuase that is what I was intrested in.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
Please do not respond to me
Yeah.... mobs standing there while you shoot them in the head since your out of reach, gobs that run in circles while you kill them, Trolls that chase you as you shoot them until you get out of there spawn area and turn back while you chase them and continue to kill them until they get back to there spawn point and walk for a few seconds until they realize they are being attacked and decide to turn around and chase you again while you repeat this till they are dead. Sorry lol, DFO PvE for me is one of the worste, it's only redeeming factor is the combat system.
And I am advocating less of a gap between vet and new player, I want competition. You can keep the RPG elements just don't make them so in your face and don't let them dictate the outcome of every battle.
I am also advocating a bit less grind because it's completely asinine to expect players to pay to play and grind for 6 months to get to the fun part of the game.
Bottom line is like I said before, the game as it was wasn't doing well at all or by any standards. So the whole discussion is fairly moot. You either want the game to continue to decline until it dies or you are looking for changes that will bring players in.
sean, its useless debating with these fools that don't know WTH they are talking about. They clearly don't have the mental capacity to argue with you in any logical way. They will say the sky is black and make mountains out of molehills.
currently playing: Darkfall, EVE, SC2
compared to what game? look again I said compared to other MMO's in other MMO's PvE moves around even less. AND on top of it they are not target based more tab based. So again I stress, compared to other MMO's.
anyway, time for me to leave the computer real life calls atm.
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
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This OP seems to me like a person with serious problems. And the patch from AV is the least one
Yeah patch is partially fine, but magic buff was it needed?
@OP
Cya gl finding a game. I could suggest you several asia grinders where you can invest time, but then again you would play with asian who invest aswell a lot of time in grinding and that would mean aswell competition. Darn it seems you have to start playing single player games. And again Bye. I guess no one will miss these carebears who are afraid of competition
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you got it twisted. you're actual skills (not "skills") should be what makes or breaks you.
IN WELFARE GAMING, you can get free handout wins just by putting enough time/grind into the game in order for your character to be more powerful regardless of any real skills you put into it your gameplay.
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Corpus Callosum
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SO.... When does this change actually occur?!
WAR you can get in from lvl 1 or 2 and actually do something...
Mentioned before was Shadowbane. It took little to no time to max your character. It had many other flaws, but that definately wasn't one of them.
I will say this. DFO has the mechanics to be a much better PvP MMO than either of these, or any that have come before it. The problem is, the grind and the difference in power between a noob and a vet. We are not talking about SKILL!!! We are talking about the artificial increases for time played!
If you are a vet, shouldn't you already have the skill to defeat someone new to the game without the extra stats and buffs to your char?
The only way progression works in a PvP game is for it to be very fast or either for there to be other artificial barriers such as level restrictions(example WAR). I am talking about artifical, such as stats and more abilities.
Because stats and abilities are already part of the game, the game CAN NOT BE truely skill based. Because there are other factors that determine the outcome than JUST YOUR SKILL.
JUST YOUR SKILL = WHAT REAL PvPer's WANT!!!
So the only way that DFO can truely come close to a real skill based game is to make it easy for everyone to max their stats and abilities.
Anytime you add other factors into the game besides player skill, you have already started moving away from what a true PvPer wants.
This patch is awesome. Combat has never been better other than the whole rays issue which is a very quick fix. This has turned darkfall back in to the skill twitch based game we were all looking for. Am I upset that I grinded magic for hours? Yes, but the game is waaaay better today than it has been in months.
You wont find an other one with full loot. Mortal online have no grind at all. Other upcoming mmorpg's with full loot wont have grind. The only game with full loot that have grind is Eve online, but the question is, do you like playing in space?
EDIT: On your comment about ppl using steroids to have instant gratification, without steroids, human would have a type of cap too you know? Look at the UFC fighters, those who dont take stereoids. The only reason they win is because of their technic. I know that because fighters who dont take steroids and still work out a lot dont have big mucles at all. Some of them are sitll really fat
So darkfall without steroids = cap. Darkfall with steroids = no cap. Its the other way around man.
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I asked you what MMO game has better PvE. your answer was WAR and shadow BECUASE its easier and faster to level up.
Sorry but that does not mean better to me.
I find DF PvE better becuase its more challenging and 'realistic' than other MMOs. Now, be extreemly careful in reading what I am saying, 'compared to other MMO's' is a very important part of what I am saying
Please do not respond to me, even if I ask you a question, its rhetorical.
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There are few people less likely to succeed at life, than those who spend 16 hours a day grinding a video game to pwn noobs.
That's not art imitating life. That's non-life(16 hours a day playing a game) playing virtual life("building up swimming skill").
That's true. THEY aren't using an artificial advantage. But anybody who can stand toe to toe in that situation and trade blows for the eventual win is using ARTIFICIAL advantages.
Wait a second...
The OP is QQing because he can no longer totally trounce not one but two new players that have to play MONTHS to even attempt to be on the same competative level?
Sounds like a flawed game from the start. Hardcore or not, the game wont last if a newbie joins and has to wait months before even trying to be an added value to combat in PvP.
It doesn't make much business sense and it doesn't help the game to have such a disparity in power where one vet can easily take out two beginner to intermediate players. Now you have to pull some tricks.
In fact, I'd wager there are some vets out there talented enough to take 2v1 of other vets equal in character level(skillpoints and time played levelwise).