Why world pvp and multiple factions completely suck to me 101:
- World pvp means a more exciting world: you have to watch your back when going about your business.
Sometimes I just want to go about my business and still have the option to PvP when I want to. Constantly watching your back leads to annoying grinds trying to get done what you want to get done and greifing. PvE servers suck because they remove the entire option. PvP servers suck because it's constantly in your face.
- World pvp adds unpredictability and choices: is that guy going to gank me? Is he going to let me pass? Should I fight or run, call friends, come back later?
In other words, adds a bunch of extra time and annoyance, and a bunch of kids who think ganking is "win."
- World pvp means a more diverse world and longevity: even if you have completed all pve content an area offers, it might still be the stage for great, random battles for the rest of the time you play the game.
All of which can be done in specificied areas/regions of the game.
- World pvp allows for an endless amount of player organized content: from 1 vs. 1 tournaments or raiding your enemy's lands to skirmishes and pitched battles. With or without RP sauce.
Too bad it never does. All you get is a bunch of griefing because there is rarely an actual goal worth completing.
- In worlds without world pvp the only thing you need to worry about is the agro range of mobs: that has bored me eventually in Lotro and it will probably bore me in GW2
So worry about aggro range of the mobs, and how much of a douche the other player is going to be?
- In servers with multiple factions and world pvp your enemy will have a face: you will get to cherrish wraths and befriend those enemies which earned your respect, you get to build a reputation for yourself and you get to know the reputations of some of your enemies. This makes for a much more lively community.
All this creates is people talking crap in chat channels and epeen measuring contests.
See it's all a matter of opinion. If theactual application ever turned out how you describe, it might work. It never does. You're spouting theory and personal opinion, which not everyone will agree with. As am I.
In the end, everyone likes something different. This is NOT an apples to apples comparison, and thus, not resolution will be reached. But have fun flaming each other, and describing details of two games you have never seen or played.
Why world pvp and multiple factions completely suck to me 101:
- World pvp means a more exciting world: you have to watch your back when going about your business.
Sometimes I just want to go about my business and still have the option to PvP when I want to. Constantly watching your back leads to annoying grinds trying to get done what you want to get done and greifing. PvE servers suck because they remove the entire option. PvP servers suck because it's constantly in your face.
So while SWTOR caters for people of all walks of life with multiple factions and server choice but also areas where your enemies can't come, GW2 limits those who are in favor of world pvp to separate areas, outside of the main world. This nicely sums up my main PERSONAL gripe concerning GW2.
- World pvp adds unpredictability and choices: is that guy going to gank me? Is he going to let me pass? Should I fight or run, call friends, come back later?
In other words, adds a bunch of extra time and annoyance, and a bunch of kids who think ganking is "win."
That is just your prejudice and disregards the "unpredictability and choice" point.To me it is a great thing that you never really know what is going to happen when you go out in the world. And there being more than npc's to worry about. I can understand that some people don't want to deal with unpredictability like that though. It can be rough at times and things don't always go your way (a little like real life, in fact).
- World pvp means a more diverse world and longevity: even if you have completed all pve content an area offers, it might still be the stage for great, random battles for the rest of the time you play the game.
All of which can be done in specificied areas/regions of the game.
For world pvp fans like me "PVP only in the designated areas!" becomes terribly stale and handholdish, eventually while taking away so much of an endless potential of content from large parts of the gameworld which you might never see again apart from helping a few friends out or while leveling an alt.
I even had that in WAR where the RVR areas were huge. It ended up feeling very artificial to me. In WOW on pvp servers, hundreds of people had a blast going back to zones like STV, Bad Lands, Hillsbrad Foothills or Westfall for large pitched battles and skirmishing with the enemy: they still had a use, even at max level.
- World pvp allows for an endless amount of player organized content: from 1 vs. 1 tournaments or raiding your enemy's lands to skirmishes and pitched battles. With or without RP sauce.
Too bad it never does. All you get is a bunch of griefing because there is rarely an actual goal worth completing.
Cool thing is that players themselves can set goals and incentives and organize pvp events. At least I always played on servers with a lot of 'organizers' and did my best helping them out. I'm sorry that you didn't experience what I have: an STV arena completely filled with players from both sides under a rare ceasefire, enjoying a huge player organized 1 vs. 1 tournament for example, or raiding Ogrimmar and killing Thrall at prime time on a horde dominated server with 200 people coming in from Ashenvale.And loads of piched battles all over the world. And that's just WOW. I could go on for hours about "world pvp" in EVE but that is a dinstinctly other kind of game.
- In worlds without world pvp the only thing you need to worry about is the agro range of mobs: that has bored me eventually in Lotro and it will probably bore me in GW2
So worry about aggro range of the mobs, and how much of a douche the other player is going to be?
"Worry" was meant to be ironic. Agro range is just a game mechanic which you have to take in account now and then. If it's the only thing to 'worry' about, it makes for a stale and predictable world once you've been around and know the content which it has to offer. But the excitement of the fact that there CAN be other players out there, with actual brains, doing their best in trying to kill you and your friends, makes for a much more exciting world: it demands much more skill to be succesful or stay alive: assesing situations quickly, outwitting your oponents, use of the terain to your advantage, etc, etc. Fighting npc's will never be as exciting as fighting players to me.
Though in most games I've played on pvp servers, you won't be ganked non-stop wherever you go; but there is always the risk though. And that adds excitement all on its own.
- In servers with multiple factions and world pvp your enemy will have a face: you will get to cherrish wraths and befriend those enemies which earned your respect, you get to build a reputation for yourself and you get to know the reputations of some of your enemies. This makes for a much more lively community.
All this creates is people talking crap in chat channels and epeen measuring contests.
Bad excuse to step over the 'lively community were friends and enemies will have a face' aspect. There will be people talking crap and epeen measuring contests anyway, regardless of server type. But as far as I know Swtor doesn't allow for cross faction communication. Maybe when standing face to face in /say though. But that should limit it. Chat on pvp servers is more likely to feature lines like:
"There are two Sith guys ganking us at the yada yada entrance"
"On my way. What level are they?"
i.e. People helping eachother out to deal with a mutual player enemy.
See it's all a matter of opinion. If theactual application ever turned out how you describe, it might work. It never does. You're spouting theory and personal opinion, which not everyone will agree with. As am I.
I never said it was anything else than my personal opinion and preferences. But saying that it never works out like that is a lie, unless you have extensive pvp server experience, liked it, and tried to make the most of it.
In the end, everyone likes something different.
Sure. I only described what I like and why.
This is NOT an apples to apples comparison, and thus, not resolution will be reached.
True. It looks like they are distinctly other kind of games.
But have fun flaming each other, and describing details of two games you have never seen or played.
That was a nasty pot shot. But yeah, we will have fun.
There is nothing limiting regarding GW2 Mysts (WvWvW).
Except for world pvp being limited to designated area's and banned from the main world. So yeah, the limiting regards the main gameworld itself rather than the mists.
If there is one mechanic SWTOR fans should not be boasting about, its the pvp.
At least in SWTOR you have a choice whether you want pvp in your cup of gameworld or not. Many players do, many players don't. In GW2 you have no choice. It's a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.Take it or leave it.
We don't know anything about SWTOR's implementation of its world pvp system yet but WHAT we know is looking pretty damn good to me.
Also did I mention that SWTOR will have both pve and pvp servers and GW2 limits its "world pvp" to areas outside of the main world? I think I did.
Can't we all just be glad that there will be several high quality mmo's on the market which will be different from each other so players can choose. Some will like SWTOR, some will like GW2, some will like both and some will like neither and that's perfectly fine.
There is nothing limiting regarding GW2 Mysts (WvWvW).
Except for world pvp being limited to designated area's and banned from the main world. So yeah, the limiting regards the main gameworld itself rather than the mists.
If there is one mechanic SWTOR fans should not be boasting about, its the pvp.
At least in SWTOR you have a choice whether you want pvp in your cup of gameworld or not. Many players do, many players don't. In GW2 you have no choice. It's a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.Take it or leave it.
We don't know anything about SWTOR's implementation of its world pvp system yet but WHAT we know is looking pretty damn good to me.
Also did I mention that SWTOR will have both pve and pvp servers and GW2 limits its "world pvp" to areas outside of the main world? I think I did.
There are even People out there who still play Age of Conan, including me, because there is no real alternative, if you adore the setting.
Same thing goes for SWTOR - all those real SW fans will never swap to another MMO and be that satisfied as they are/will be in SWTOR. Only the people who do constant MMO-hopping (game got bored etcbla) will.
So don't panic. GW2 is something completely different. And ofc people will leave SWTOR for it. But I'm pretty sure many people will stay.
There is nothing limiting regarding GW2 Mysts (WvWvW).
Except for world pvp being limited to designated area's and banned from the main world. So yeah, the limiting regards the main gameworld itself rather than the mists.
If there is one mechanic SWTOR fans should not be boasting about, its the pvp.
At least in SWTOR you have a choice whether you want pvp in your cup of gameworld or not. Many players do, many players don't. In GW2 you have no choice. It's a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.Take it or leave it.
We don't know anything about SWTOR's implementation of its world pvp system yet but WHAT we know is looking pretty damn good to me.
Also did I mention that SWTOR will have both pve and pvp servers and GW2 limits its "world pvp" to areas outside of the main world? I think I did.
By that reasoning, then Dark Age of Camelot was a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.
Yet, still considered to be the best pvp to date. Played DAOC by chance?
Does SWTOR have three playable factions, "similar" to GW2 3 server Myst matchups? No? Sounds limiting to me.
SWTOR fans can brag about anything else, but bringing up pvp is like pointing out your achiles heel.
There is nothing limiting regarding GW2 Mysts (WvWvW).
Except for world pvp being limited to designated area's and banned from the main world. So yeah, the limiting regards the main gameworld itself rather than the mists.
If there is one mechanic SWTOR fans should not be boasting about, its the pvp.
At least in SWTOR you have a choice whether you want pvp in your cup of gameworld or not. Many players do, many players don't. In GW2 you have no choice. It's a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.Take it or leave it.
We don't know anything about SWTOR's implementation of its world pvp system yet but WHAT we know is looking pretty damn good to me.
Also did I mention that SWTOR will have both pve and pvp servers and GW2 limits its "world pvp" to areas outside of the main world? I think I did.
I wonder why you Darkpony always have such a problem with GW2's lack of an open-world PvP option, when you should know that sticking open-world PvP in GW2's gameworld would completely ruin the experience ANet have built. No matter what rulesets they would go for; actually allowing players to kill each other in a world specific designed for player co-operation, would spell for disaster. You can only just imagine the chaos in those 50+ player dynamic events. You may find it fun, but I'll find it bad game design.
Which is why ANet have designed a large open area, specifically for allowing players to kill each other whilst completing objectives. The Mist is meant to be a homage to DAoC while also helping to strengthen the community and turning the gameworld into a complete FFA gankfest won't do that (Asura v Charr v Human v Norn v Sylvari... yeah that would work (¬_¬) ).
BTW... I never really saw PvP in MMOs like SW:TOR, Rift, WoW, etc. as much of a positive because more often that victory is determined by: gear, level, class and not skill. This is why I'll always prefer PvP in RTS, FPS, Racing and Fighting games; though I'm hoping that Guild Wars 2 and it's skill-based PvP will change that.
There is nothing limiting regarding GW2 Mysts (WvWvW).
Except for world pvp being limited to designated area's and banned from the main world. So yeah, the limiting regards the main gameworld itself rather than the mists.
If there is one mechanic SWTOR fans should not be boasting about, its the pvp.
At least in SWTOR you have a choice whether you want pvp in your cup of gameworld or not. Many players do, many players don't. In GW2 you have no choice. It's a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.Take it or leave it.
We don't know anything about SWTOR's implementation of its world pvp system yet but WHAT we know is looking pretty damn good to me.
Also did I mention that SWTOR will have both pve and pvp servers and GW2 limits its "world pvp" to areas outside of the main world? I think I did.
By that reasoning, then Dark Age of Camelot was a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.
Yet, still considered to be the best pvp to date. Played DAOC by chance?
Does SWTOR have three playable factions, "similar" to GW2 3 server Myst matchups? No? Sounds limiting to me.
SWTOR fans can brag about anything else, but bringing up pvp is like pointing out your achiles heel.
Good to know you got to play SWTOR, because the only feature they announced till now are the warzones. Btw FYI there were already hints at some kind of RvR or similar PvP to DaoC.
There is nothing limiting regarding GW2 Mysts (WvWvW).
Except for world pvp being limited to designated area's and banned from the main world. So yeah, the limiting regards the main gameworld itself rather than the mists.
If there is one mechanic SWTOR fans should not be boasting about, its the pvp.
At least in SWTOR you have a choice whether you want pvp in your cup of gameworld or not. Many players do, many players don't. In GW2 you have no choice. It's a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.Take it or leave it.
We don't know anything about SWTOR's implementation of its world pvp system yet but WHAT we know is looking pretty damn good to me.
Also did I mention that SWTOR will have both pve and pvp servers and GW2 limits its "world pvp" to areas outside of the main world? I think I did.
By that reasoning, then Dark Age of Camelot was a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.
Yet, still considered to be the best pvp to date. Played DAOC by chance?
Does SWTOR have three playable factions, "similar" to GW2 3 server Myst matchups? No? Sounds limiting to me.
SWTOR fans can brag about anything else, but bringing up pvp is like pointing out your achiles heel.
Good to know you got to play SWTOR, because the only feature they announced till now are the warzones. Btw FYI there were already hints at some kind of RvR or similar PvP to DaoC.
unless it involves 100+ players fighting (for whatever reason) then its hardly going to be all that competitive.. so far the info out is that its going to be instances that involve very limited numbers of players.. no matter how you look at it.. pvp is not something that SWTOR will be handling all that well, if anything.. it will draw more comparisons to the pvp in WoW.. with good reason.. and thats not a good thing.. as has already mentioned.. pvp in SWTOR may be its achilles heel.. but its not the only one.. there is the browser based space combat too after all.. (and yes i do know its not really a browser game.. but if they treat the space combat as if its some kind of flash based minigame then it might just as well be....) .. in a way it is also a shame that Bioware is stuck in the same rut that SOE got into with SWG.. in that their only utilising two of the factions.. although SWG allowed you to be neither Imperial or Rebel.. its handling of 'neutrals' was laughable.. i had hoped that in this at least.. there would be some kind of movement.. though given that the game is storyline driven.. perhaps that was just something they werent capable of developing.
By that reasoning, then Dark Age of Camelot was a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.
Yet, still considered to be the best pvp to date. Played DAOC by chance?
Does SWTOR have three playable factions, "similar" to GW2 3 server Myst matchups? No? Sounds limiting to me.
SWTOR fans can brag about anything else, but bringing up pvp is like pointing out your achiles heel.
So its better to have only one PvP option rather than three( SWTOR will have cotested zones Warzones and world PvP)?
not only that, but GW2's WvWvW completely breaks immersion... it's some fantasticle battles against people in some paralel universe? Battles not related to "Story" at all, simply a mini game so you can do a little pvp... yah, not very impressed.
By that reasoning, then Dark Age of Camelot was a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.
Yet, still considered to be the best pvp to date. Played DAOC by chance?
Does SWTOR have three playable factions, "similar" to GW2 3 server Myst matchups? No? Sounds limiting to me.
SWTOR fans can brag about anything else, but bringing up pvp is like pointing out your achiles heel.
So its better to have only one PvP option rather than three( SWTOR will have cotested zones Warzones and world PvP)?
not only that, but GW2's WvWvW completely breaks immersion... it's some fantasticle battles against people in some paralel universe? Battles not related to "Story" at all, simply a mini game so you can do a little pvp... yah, not very impressed.
What THEEEEEEEE....
I have not seen a game where PVP is tied in with the story.
By that reasoning, then Dark Age of Camelot was a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.
Yet, still considered to be the best pvp to date. Played DAOC by chance?
Does SWTOR have three playable factions, "similar" to GW2 3 server Myst matchups? No? Sounds limiting to me.
SWTOR fans can brag about anything else, but bringing up pvp is like pointing out your achiles heel.
So its better to have only one PvP option rather than three( SWTOR will have cotested zones Warzones and world PvP)?
not only that, but GW2's WvWvW completely breaks immersion... it's some fantasticle battles against people in some paralel universe? Battles not related to "Story" at all, simply a mini game so you can do a little pvp... yah, not very impressed.
What THEEEEEEEE....
I have not seen a game where PVP is tied in with the story.
MUST... NOT.... MENTION THAT.... TOR PVP TIES INTO STORY!
Also of the ofther MMOs I have played extesively,EvE,EQ2,WoW, and a bit of GW. WoW PvP did tie into the story if you bothered to look it up.
By that reasoning, then Dark Age of Camelot was a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.
Yet, still considered to be the best pvp to date. Played DAOC by chance?
Does SWTOR have three playable factions, "similar" to GW2 3 server Myst matchups? No? Sounds limiting to me.
SWTOR fans can brag about anything else, but bringing up pvp is like pointing out your achiles heel.
So its better to have only one PvP option rather than three( SWTOR will have cotested zones Warzones and world PvP)?
not only that, but GW2's WvWvW completely breaks immersion... it's some fantasticle battles against people in some paralel universe? Battles not related to "Story" at all, simply a mini game so you can do a little pvp... yah, not very impressed.
What THEEEEEEEE....
I have not seen a game where PVP is tied in with the story.
MUST... NOT.... MENTION THAT.... TOR PVP TIES INTO STORY!
Also of the ofther MMOs I have played extesively,EvE,EQ2,WoW, and a bit of GW. WoW PvP did tie into the story if you bothered to look it up.
Although it didn't affect the story at all, or the game world, or anything else actually... except for perhaps, your Arena rating and Honour count.
By that reasoning, then Dark Age of Camelot was a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.
Yet, still considered to be the best pvp to date. Played DAOC by chance?
Does SWTOR have three playable factions, "similar" to GW2 3 server Myst matchups? No? Sounds limiting to me.
SWTOR fans can brag about anything else, but bringing up pvp is like pointing out your achiles heel.
So its better to have only one PvP option rather than three( SWTOR will have cotested zones Warzones and world PvP)?
not only that, but GW2's WvWvW completely breaks immersion... it's some fantasticle battles against people in some paralel universe? Battles not related to "Story" at all, simply a mini game so you can do a little pvp... yah, not very impressed.
What THEEEEEEEE....
I have not seen a game where PVP is tied in with the story.
I think WAR is the only one.... but we know how that turned out.
By that reasoning, then Dark Age of Camelot was a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.
Yet, still considered to be the best pvp to date. Played DAOC by chance?
Does SWTOR have three playable factions, "similar" to GW2 3 server Myst matchups? No? Sounds limiting to me.
SWTOR fans can brag about anything else, but bringing up pvp is like pointing out your achiles heel.
So its better to have only one PvP option rather than three( SWTOR will have cotested zones Warzones and world PvP)?
not only that, but GW2's WvWvW completely breaks immersion... it's some fantasticle battles against people in some paralel universe? Battles not related to "Story" at all, simply a mini game so you can do a little pvp... yah, not very impressed.
What THEEEEEEEE....
I have not seen a game where PVP is tied in with the story.
MUST... NOT.... MENTION THAT.... TOR PVP TIES INTO STORY!
Also of the ofther MMOs I have played extesively,EvE,EQ2,WoW, and a bit of GW. WoW PvP did tie into the story if you bothered to look it up.
Although it didn't affect the story at all, or the game world, or anything else actually... except for perhaps, your Arena rating and Honour count.
As opposed to GW2 pvp having affecting the game world? Honest question, because from what I red there's no affecting there either.
By that reasoning, then Dark Age of Camelot was a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.
Yet, still considered to be the best pvp to date. Played DAOC by chance?
Does SWTOR have three playable factions, "similar" to GW2 3 server Myst matchups? No? Sounds limiting to me.
SWTOR fans can brag about anything else, but bringing up pvp is like pointing out your achiles heel.
So its better to have only one PvP option rather than three( SWTOR will have cotested zones Warzones and world PvP)?
not only that, but GW2's WvWvW completely breaks immersion... it's some fantasticle battles against people in some paralel universe? Battles not related to "Story" at all, simply a mini game so you can do a little pvp... yah, not very impressed.
What THEEEEEEEE....
I have not seen a game where PVP is tied in with the story.
MUST... NOT.... MENTION THAT.... TOR PVP TIES INTO STORY!
Also of the ofther MMOs I have played extesively,EvE,EQ2,WoW, and a bit of GW. WoW PvP did tie into the story if you bothered to look it up.
Although it didn't affect the story at all, or the game world, or anything else actually... except for perhaps, your Arena rating and Honour count.
As opposed to GW2 pvp having affecting the game world? Honest question, because from what I red there's no affecting there either.
Sort of, but is PvP only "immersive" or "interesting" when explained by lore, even though the only connection between PvP and the lore is some kind of war, which isn't really that much of a war?
By that reasoning, then Dark Age of Camelot was a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.
Yet, still considered to be the best pvp to date. Played DAOC by chance?
Does SWTOR have three playable factions, "similar" to GW2 3 server Myst matchups? No? Sounds limiting to me.
SWTOR fans can brag about anything else, but bringing up pvp is like pointing out your achiles heel.
So its better to have only one PvP option rather than three( SWTOR will have cotested zones Warzones and world PvP)?
not only that, but GW2's WvWvW completely breaks immersion... it's some fantasticle battles against people in some paralel universe? Battles not related to "Story" at all, simply a mini game so you can do a little pvp... yah, not very impressed.
What THEEEEEEEE....
I have not seen a game where PVP is tied in with the story.
MUST... NOT.... MENTION THAT.... TOR PVP TIES INTO STORY!
Also of the ofther MMOs I have played extesively,EvE,EQ2,WoW, and a bit of GW. WoW PvP did tie into the story if you bothered to look it up.
Although it didn't affect the story at all, or the game world, or anything else actually... except for perhaps, your Arena rating and Honour count.
As opposed to GW2 pvp having affecting the game world? Honest question, because from what I red there's no affecting there either.
No, but is PvP only "immersive" or "interesting" when explained by lore, even though the only connection between PvP and the lore is some kind of war, which isn't really that much of a war.
More immersive, maybe. For the interesting part, pvp is interesting to me if I find its implementation fun.
By that reasoning, then Dark Age of Camelot was a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.
Yet, still considered to be the best pvp to date. Played DAOC by chance?
Does SWTOR have three playable factions, "similar" to GW2 3 server Myst matchups? No? Sounds limiting to me.
SWTOR fans can brag about anything else, but bringing up pvp is like pointing out your achiles heel.
So its better to have only one PvP option rather than three( SWTOR will have cotested zones Warzones and world PvP)?
not only that, but GW2's WvWvW completely breaks immersion... it's some fantasticle battles against people in some paralel universe? Battles not related to "Story" at all, simply a mini game so you can do a little pvp... yah, not very impressed.
What THEEEEEEEE....
I have not seen a game where PVP is tied in with the story.
MUST... NOT.... MENTION THAT.... TOR PVP TIES INTO STORY!
Also of the ofther MMOs I have played extesively,EvE,EQ2,WoW, and a bit of GW. WoW PvP did tie into the story if you bothered to look it up.
in Wow, at least it made sense why the Alliance were fighting Horde in PvP... most games work that way...
But these magical "realms" where we fight for no other reason bu t to fight... might as well be mini-games, or lame arena battles.
There is nothing limiting regarding GW2 Mysts (WvWvW).
Except for world pvp being limited to designated area's and banned from the main world. So yeah, the limiting regards the main gameworld itself rather than the mists.
If there is one mechanic SWTOR fans should not be boasting about, its the pvp.
At least in SWTOR you have a choice whether you want pvp in your cup of gameworld or not. Many players do, many players don't. In GW2 you have no choice. It's a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.Take it or leave it.
We don't know anything about SWTOR's implementation of its world pvp system yet but WHAT we know is looking pretty damn good to me.
Also did I mention that SWTOR will have both pve and pvp servers and GW2 limits its "world pvp" to areas outside of the main world? I think I did.
Does TOR's open world PvP have objectives such as keeps, villages or mines that guilds can take over and mark as their territory? So far TOR's open world PvP looks like all open world PvP so far, random fights that happen when players finally find someone to kill. GW2 players are guarenteed a fight (a major upside of dedicated PvP areas IMO) and have meaningful objectives for them to fight for.
Right now i'm not sure how PvP will work as they haven't touched on it a lot but it does seem interesting to me, at least on par with other MMOs if not a step up.
Granted you have war zones (battle grounds if you want a recognizable term), which the one was stated as 8 vs 8. While thats a small number i'm not sure numbers in and of themselves say wether the pvp will be fun and tatical. It's the way how they go about it that is more important then how many people you can cram into a single place. But thats just the warzones.
As for the 100 on 100 option that can most certainly happen on the PvP server where tons of people can attack each other at will. As well as certain areas in the world that are open to pvp
Again it may look cool to to just throw a lot of people together but that doesn't mean the pvp is well implemented, but lets see if they make PvP interesting, as in the mechanics they used make PvP more then just throw a ton of people together and see who ends up on top.
Okay so first off we know some classes have the ability to hide behind cover and create their own cover. So that in and of itself means that your going to have to decide where to hide and where to stand as you may not always be able to just run up to the person and zerg em.
We know there is a ton of crowd control abilities from knockbacks to stuns, btw the knockback is an actual knockback (you get thrown a ways, not just knocked to the ground)
However we also know recently theres a bar that fills up each time you get CCed so that makes you have to think more carefully about what you put on that person, you can't just perma stun lock that tank. Sooner or later he'll become resistant to it and then you have to seriously rechange your tatics. Not that a good pvp hasn't thought of that already before they entered the fight.
PvP tends to hinge on a few things, first off it's balance, are there more people on one side then the other, so far the dev said it's pretty even, but thats beta testing and we can't see that for ourselves first hand
Second is player gear, is one more geared up then the other. This usually isn't a problem but it can tip the scales a little.
Thirdly is one side more organized then the other. This can affect things but nothing a good leader can't work out.
As for is pvp thought about or left as a side thing. They recruited mythic and one of the guys worked on shadowbane. Plus there are a slew of features that seem to direct right towards PvP
First off you get gear that works directly with PvP
Second you gain xp for doing PvP
Thridly some planets will have contested areas where both factions will fight for control
and Fourthly, every Advanced Class has at least one spec that has its place in competitive PvP.
Just some things there, there is also open world pvp
Quote: There will be "Open World PvP" in terms of meeting members of other factions on planets as Tatooine being able to decide if you want to attack them or not. -SWTOR-Station
Confirmed by Greg Zeschuk that there will be Open World PvP in appropriate areas within TOR - Interview
and i'm just throwing this last one in because something was mentioned about story or what have you so here it goes
Quote from Gabe Amatangelo: They wanted Warzones to fit in with the story element of the game. When they looked at PvP, they decided that banners, flags and points were "too game-y. - Darth Hater
I would highly suggest people take a look at the link in my sig for the information, i think it's highly useful as it appears just from looking at it they have made some efforts to make pvp more interesting then in other games. There are contested areas, classes that work really well in pvp, situational abilities, crowd control resistances, things like that.
Notice also they haven't really touched on how a lot of the pvp works yet, so there may be some interesting things we haven't seen before. As for their only being two sides, i suppose that could be a problem if implemented poorly but thats the case with 3 side games to, I've seen it happen where you have one all powerful side and the other 3 just get smashed to pieces. Again it's balance and implemtations rather then just how many sides there are. as for this being a major flaw...i'm not seeing it, they seem to give you rewards, thought out player options, giving you many ways of doing pvp and even tried to link it into the story. We will see if they've got their stuff or not when it comes out.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
There is nothing limiting regarding GW2 Mysts (WvWvW).
Except for world pvp being limited to designated area's and banned from the main world. So yeah, the limiting regards the main gameworld itself rather than the mists.
If there is one mechanic SWTOR fans should not be boasting about, its the pvp.
At least in SWTOR you have a choice whether you want pvp in your cup of gameworld or not. Many players do, many players don't. In GW2 you have no choice. It's a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.Take it or leave it.
We don't know anything about SWTOR's implementation of its world pvp system yet but WHAT we know is looking pretty damn good to me.
Also did I mention that SWTOR will have both pve and pvp servers and GW2 limits its "world pvp" to areas outside of the main world? I think I did.
Does TOR's open world PvP have objectives such as keeps, villages or mines that guilds can take over and mark as their territory? So far TOR's open world PvP looks like all open world PvP so far, random fights that happen when players finally find someone to kill. GW2 players are guarenteed a fight (a major upside of dedicated PvP areas IMO) and have meaningful objectives for them to fight for.
Not sure about keeps or buildings but there is this
Some planets will have contested areas where both factions will fight for control - Darth Hater
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
Comments
Why world pvp and multiple factions completely suck to me 101:
- World pvp means a more exciting world: you have to watch your back when going about your business.
Sometimes I just want to go about my business and still have the option to PvP when I want to. Constantly watching your back leads to annoying grinds trying to get done what you want to get done and greifing. PvE servers suck because they remove the entire option. PvP servers suck because it's constantly in your face.
- World pvp adds unpredictability and choices: is that guy going to gank me? Is he going to let me pass? Should I fight or run, call friends, come back later?
In other words, adds a bunch of extra time and annoyance, and a bunch of kids who think ganking is "win."
- World pvp means a more diverse world and longevity: even if you have completed all pve content an area offers, it might still be the stage for great, random battles for the rest of the time you play the game.
All of which can be done in specificied areas/regions of the game.
- World pvp allows for an endless amount of player organized content: from 1 vs. 1 tournaments or raiding your enemy's lands to skirmishes and pitched battles. With or without RP sauce.
Too bad it never does. All you get is a bunch of griefing because there is rarely an actual goal worth completing.
- In worlds without world pvp the only thing you need to worry about is the agro range of mobs: that has bored me eventually in Lotro and it will probably bore me in GW2
So worry about aggro range of the mobs, and how much of a douche the other player is going to be?
- In servers with multiple factions and world pvp your enemy will have a face: you will get to cherrish wraths and befriend those enemies which earned your respect, you get to build a reputation for yourself and you get to know the reputations of some of your enemies. This makes for a much more lively community.
All this creates is people talking crap in chat channels and epeen measuring contests.
See it's all a matter of opinion. If theactual application ever turned out how you describe, it might work. It never does. You're spouting theory and personal opinion, which not everyone will agree with. As am I.
In the end, everyone likes something different. This is NOT an apples to apples comparison, and thus, not resolution will be reached. But have fun flaming each other, and describing details of two games you have never seen or played.
My brand new bloggity blog.
There is nothing limiting regarding GW2 Mysts (WvWvW).
If there is one mechanic SWTOR fans should not be boasting about, its the pvp.
My brand new bloggity blog.
Can't we all just be glad that there will be several high quality mmo's on the market which will be different from each other so players can choose. Some will like SWTOR, some will like GW2, some will like both and some will like neither and that's perfectly fine.
Really! That's very interesting to know.
Why do you Guys always think in such pattern?
There are even People out there who still play Age of Conan, including me, because there is no real alternative, if you adore the setting.
Same thing goes for SWTOR - all those real SW fans will never swap to another MMO and be that satisfied as they are/will be in SWTOR. Only the people who do constant MMO-hopping (game got bored etcbla) will.
So don't panic. GW2 is something completely different. And ofc people will leave SWTOR for it. But I'm pretty sure many people will stay.
Cheers. Happy Easter
By that reasoning, then Dark Age of Camelot was a pvp'less main gameworld with pvp as a side dish.
Yet, still considered to be the best pvp to date. Played DAOC by chance?
Does SWTOR have three playable factions, "similar" to GW2 3 server Myst matchups? No? Sounds limiting to me.
SWTOR fans can brag about anything else, but bringing up pvp is like pointing out your achiles heel.
I wonder why you Darkpony always have such a problem with GW2's lack of an open-world PvP option, when you should know that sticking open-world PvP in GW2's gameworld would completely ruin the experience ANet have built. No matter what rulesets they would go for; actually allowing players to kill each other in a world specific designed for player co-operation, would spell for disaster. You can only just imagine the chaos in those 50+ player dynamic events. You may find it fun, but I'll find it bad game design.
Which is why ANet have designed a large open area, specifically for allowing players to kill each other whilst completing objectives. The Mist is meant to be a homage to DAoC while also helping to strengthen the community and turning the gameworld into a complete FFA gankfest won't do that (Asura v Charr v Human v Norn v Sylvari... yeah that would work (¬_¬) ).
BTW... I never really saw PvP in MMOs like SW:TOR, Rift, WoW, etc. as much of a positive because more often that victory is determined by: gear, level, class and not skill. This is why I'll always prefer PvP in RTS, FPS, Racing and Fighting games; though I'm hoping that Guild Wars 2 and it's skill-based PvP will change that.
Good to know you got to play SWTOR, because the only feature they announced till now are the warzones. Btw FYI there were already hints at some kind of RvR or similar PvP to DaoC.
unless it involves 100+ players fighting (for whatever reason) then its hardly going to be all that competitive.. so far the info out is that its going to be instances that involve very limited numbers of players.. no matter how you look at it.. pvp is not something that SWTOR will be handling all that well, if anything.. it will draw more comparisons to the pvp in WoW.. with good reason.. and thats not a good thing.. as has already mentioned.. pvp in SWTOR may be its achilles heel.. but its not the only one.. there is the browser based space combat too after all.. (and yes i do know its not really a browser game.. but if they treat the space combat as if its some kind of flash based minigame then it might just as well be....) .. in a way it is also a shame that Bioware is stuck in the same rut that SOE got into with SWG.. in that their only utilising two of the factions.. although SWG allowed you to be neither Imperial or Rebel.. its handling of 'neutrals' was laughable.. i had hoped that in this at least.. there would be some kind of movement.. though given that the game is storyline driven.. perhaps that was just something they werent capable of developing.
So its better to have only one PvP option rather than three( SWTOR will have cotested zones Warzones and world PvP)?
I don't care about innovation I care about fun.
not only that, but GW2's WvWvW completely breaks immersion... it's some fantasticle battles against people in some paralel universe? Battles not related to "Story" at all, simply a mini game so you can do a little pvp... yah, not very impressed.
What THEEEEEEEE....
I have not seen a game where PVP is tied in with the story.
Guild Wars 2's 50 minutes game play video:
http://n4g.com/news/592585/guild-wars-2-50-minutes-of-pure-gameplay
Everything We Know about GW2:
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/287180/page/1
MUST... NOT.... MENTION THAT.... TOR PVP TIES INTO STORY!
Also of the ofther MMOs I have played extesively,EvE,EQ2,WoW, and a bit of GW. WoW PvP did tie into the story if you bothered to look it up.
I don't care about innovation I care about fun.
Although it didn't affect the story at all, or the game world, or anything else actually... except for perhaps, your Arena rating and Honour count.
I think WAR is the only one.... but we know how that turned out.
My theme song.
I would not give a toss about either of them if they would just come with the EQ3 baby
As opposed to GW2 pvp having affecting the game world? Honest question, because from what I red there's no affecting there either.
Sort of, but is PvP only "immersive" or "interesting" when explained by lore, even though the only connection between PvP and the lore is some kind of war, which isn't really that much of a war?
How about a lore explanation for WvW-PvP?
More immersive, maybe. For the interesting part, pvp is interesting to me if I find its implementation fun.
in Wow, at least it made sense why the Alliance were fighting Horde in PvP... most games work that way...
But these magical "realms" where we fight for no other reason bu t to fight... might as well be mini-games, or lame arena battles.
Does TOR's open world PvP have objectives such as keeps, villages or mines that guilds can take over and mark as their territory? So far TOR's open world PvP looks like all open world PvP so far, random fights that happen when players finally find someone to kill. GW2 players are guarenteed a fight (a major upside of dedicated PvP areas IMO) and have meaningful objectives for them to fight for.
Right now i'm not sure how PvP will work as they haven't touched on it a lot but it does seem interesting to me, at least on par with other MMOs if not a step up.
Granted you have war zones (battle grounds if you want a recognizable term), which the one was stated as 8 vs 8. While thats a small number i'm not sure numbers in and of themselves say wether the pvp will be fun and tatical. It's the way how they go about it that is more important then how many people you can cram into a single place. But thats just the warzones.
As for the 100 on 100 option that can most certainly happen on the PvP server where tons of people can attack each other at will. As well as certain areas in the world that are open to pvp
Again it may look cool to to just throw a lot of people together but that doesn't mean the pvp is well implemented, but lets see if they make PvP interesting, as in the mechanics they used make PvP more then just throw a ton of people together and see who ends up on top.
Okay so first off we know some classes have the ability to hide behind cover and create their own cover. So that in and of itself means that your going to have to decide where to hide and where to stand as you may not always be able to just run up to the person and zerg em.
We know there is a ton of crowd control abilities from knockbacks to stuns, btw the knockback is an actual knockback (you get thrown a ways, not just knocked to the ground)
However we also know recently theres a bar that fills up each time you get CCed so that makes you have to think more carefully about what you put on that person, you can't just perma stun lock that tank. Sooner or later he'll become resistant to it and then you have to seriously rechange your tatics. Not that a good pvp hasn't thought of that already before they entered the fight.
PvP tends to hinge on a few things, first off it's balance, are there more people on one side then the other, so far the dev said it's pretty even, but thats beta testing and we can't see that for ourselves first hand
Second is player gear, is one more geared up then the other. This usually isn't a problem but it can tip the scales a little.
Thirdly is one side more organized then the other. This can affect things but nothing a good leader can't work out.
As for is pvp thought about or left as a side thing. They recruited mythic and one of the guys worked on shadowbane. Plus there are a slew of features that seem to direct right towards PvP
First off you get gear that works directly with PvP
Second you gain xp for doing PvP
Thridly some planets will have contested areas where both factions will fight for control
and Fourthly, every Advanced Class has at least one spec that has its place in competitive PvP.
Just some things there, there is also open world pvp
Quote: There will be "Open World PvP" in terms of meeting members of other factions on planets as Tatooine being able to decide if you want to attack them or not. -SWTOR-Station
Confirmed by Greg Zeschuk that there will be Open World PvP in appropriate areas within TOR - Interviewand i'm just throwing this last one in because something was mentioned about story or what have you so here it goes
Quote from Gabe Amatangelo: They wanted Warzones to fit in with the story element of the game. When they looked at PvP, they decided that banners, flags and points were "too game-y. - Darth HaterI would highly suggest people take a look at the link in my sig for the information, i think it's highly useful as it appears just from looking at it they have made some efforts to make pvp more interesting then in other games. There are contested areas, classes that work really well in pvp, situational abilities, crowd control resistances, things like that.
Notice also they haven't really touched on how a lot of the pvp works yet, so there may be some interesting things we haven't seen before. As for their only being two sides, i suppose that could be a problem if implemented poorly but thats the case with 3 side games to, I've seen it happen where you have one all powerful side and the other 3 just get smashed to pieces. Again it's balance and implemtations rather then just how many sides there are. as for this being a major flaw...i'm not seeing it, they seem to give you rewards, thought out player options, giving you many ways of doing pvp and even tried to link it into the story. We will see if they've got their stuff or not when it comes out.
Help me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.
Not sure about keeps or buildings but there is this
Some planets will have contested areas where both factions will fight for control - Darth HaterHelp me Bioware, you're my only hope.
Is ToR going to be good? Dude it's Bioware making a freaking star wars game, all signs point to awesome. -G4tv MMo report.