Course you can, as long as you yourself are "competent". Not exactly the hardest subject to grasp mate. System matches you up with similarly ranked servers to keep everything relatively competitive in WvWvW. Which, of course, means you need to adapt as you are fighting them.
Idiot player will keep going into battles with the same strategy they've been using from the beginning.
Smart players will change skills/equipment as needed.
I love it how they created a supposedly undefeatable lvl of a player....
The "competent" player!! undefeatable in battle and unusurpable in romance!! the "competent" player is the man all men envy and all women want, or the woman all women envy and all men want!! the "competent" player is the bestest of the bestest, and no one can best him (or her)!!
How many times can you overlook that no one said a competent player can't be beat, what was said was you're going to have a tough go at taking down two competent players at the same time all by yourself.
Can't say I prefer one way or the other, only that the downed state reminds me of SWG's incap/DB system.
Is that because competent players never make mistakes? What I'm getting it at is that you guys have created a made up type of player who for some reason is always hard to fight against them. I'm not saying I can defeat anyone, but what I can say is that after playing wvw and spvp, no one is safe (however good they are)... playing as a team in GW2 will 99.99999% always defeat anyone playing solo (however competent they may be).
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You are probably the 10th guy telling me you won 1v2s. You people don't get it do you? let me give you an example
lets say you are a 7/10 player and fight vs two 4/10 players. Let's say you kill them in a 1v2 with or without the downed mechanic. (which is what you did in the beta. great)
lets say you are 7/10 and fight two 5/10s. With a downed mechanic you lose but without you win or kill one and manage to get away.
lets say you are 7/10 and fight two 6/10s. With a downed mechanic you lose but without you may kill one and die to the other one(or get away).
Now remember that after release you will be matched against similar skill opponents. So as a 7/10(it's an example) you will fight 6-8 / 10 players and rarely 5/10 or 9/10s which means forget winning 1v2s ever again.
What I'm saying is the downed mechanic makes it a lot harder to do well in 1v2s, 2v3s etc. I never said that it made them impossible.
otinanai123, this isn't math class. I find it amusing you are using equations to prove your point; you forget something that is crucial in GW2... the environment and combat variables. 1v2 or 2v3 battles will never be the same every single time. As I've said, you have the environment to contend with, where you fight is almost as important as to how you fight. Secondly, combat variables... how you use your skills, cooldowns, etc will influence the battle. The downed mechanic doesn't make battles harder, you make it harder by the fights you pick. If you're running around a lone in wvw or spvp then you are already doing something wrong (for the most part). The idea, the intention, the goal of GW2 pvp gameplay (wvw/spvp) is for people to play together, as a team, against other players playing together, as a team. Stats matter much less in GW2 than they do in WOW. In GW2 what will win you a battle is who you fight with, where you fight, and who you fight against (as in how many combatants)... skill is much more important in GW2 than just stats. That's why your mathematical equations don't "add up".
But they do add up. The average fight between two uneven sides will be less predictable without a downed state than with one. Let me make it math for you:
chance of outmumbered side winning an uneven fight without a downed state > chance of outnumbered side winning an uneven fight with a downed state
I'm in the "adds dimension" camp. I think as time goes on people will effectively use the skills they are given for their class rather than mashing buttons. Plus I think any mechanic that doesn't give 2 second kills makes the PvP more fun and engaging.
If I'm not mistaken you can simply continue to hit the person to a defeated state rather than have to "finish them", correct?
As a competitive PvPer i believe the down state adds alot more then it subtracts.
There's a whole new level of strategy with dealing with and alot of times, not finishing an enemy is actually the correct decision some times.
I do believe they need to enable different kinds of finishing moves, specially the chance to finish adversaries from a distance (melee distance being really fast at finishing, ranged being slower).
Originally posted by Aelious I'm in the "adds dimension" camp. I think as time goes on people will effectively use the skills they are given for their class rather than mashing buttons. Plus I think any mechanic that doesn't give 2 second kills makes the PvP more fun and engaging.
If I'm not mistaken you can simply continue to hit the person to a defeated state rather than have to "finish them", correct?
I love it when people give their opinions without having even played.
Course you can, as long as you yourself are "competent". Not exactly the hardest subject to grasp mate. System matches you up with similarly ranked servers to keep everything relatively competitive in WvWvW. Which, of course, means you need to adapt as you are fighting them.
Idiot player will keep going into battles with the same strategy they've been using from the beginning.
Smart players will change skills/equipment as needed.
I love it how they created a supposedly undefeatable lvl of a player....
The "competent" player!! undefeatable in battle and unusurpable in romance!! the "competent" player is the man all men envy and all women want, or the woman all women envy and all men want!! the "competent" player is the bestest of the bestest, and no one can best him (or her)!!
How many times can you overlook that no one said a competent player can't be beat, what was said was you're going to have a tough go at taking down two competent players at the same time all by yourself.
Can't say I prefer one way or the other, only that the downed state reminds me of SWG's incap/DB system.
Is that because competent players never make mistakes? What I'm getting it at is that you guys have created a made up type of player who for some reason is always hard to fight against them. I'm not saying I can defeat anyone, but what I can say is that after playing wvw and spvp, no one is safe (however good they are)... playing as a team in GW2 will 99.99999% always defeat anyone playing solo (however competent they may be).
Finally decided I'd respond to your idiotic rambling, considering you are ignoring any actual response to the post and instead go off on some sarcastic little prod.
When I said competent, it meant not being an idiot. If you are matched up against a similarly skilled (or ranked) server, you are going to have to adapt to that fact. It means picking and choosing what fights you take depending on how many people are backing you up and the skills in your bar. It DOESN'T mean "OMG I EZ SUPAH-HEYROH" like you take it as because you have no valid response.
When I say competent, I'm not implying omnipotence, just saying don't bite off more than you can chew. So boo-hoo you can't win a 2vs1 anymore, that just means the other players are playing smarter than you. They are more co-ordinated than you. Classes have ways to handle that though. If you have skills that can separate them and you know you can take them 1 on 1? Then go and use it. Does it guarantee you'll win? No. If one is near an edge and you have a strong knockback? Take advantage of it.
And if you down one out of two in a 2vs1, don't focus on the downed man. He may be annoying, but he's not going to be able to do much. Sure he may teleport, sure he may be a warrior and stand back up, or a necro and go ghost form on you, but guess what? They are dead anyways as long as they don't get help. That warrior WILL die if he stands up with his skill, that necro will die once his life energy is wasted, and as long as you throw some occasional damage at the downed bugger, he won't be able to heal.
You just need to make sure the other person doesn't get a chance to run over and heal him, which he shouldn't anyways in such a situation.
Now go ahead, highlight every time I said "competent" in Kindergarden Yellow, and start shouting "I R COMPITENT! I R BETTR THAN SUPAHMAN!"
A fair assumption to make, especially after 3 beta events of extensive PvPing : most players seemed to completly ignore the tactics and strategy inferred and offered by the downed state. To them, it was just a tedious process, ruining the climax and satisfaction of killing someone.
I mostly played warrior during my playtime and I was offered many interesting "teamwork skills" from which I could single-handedly turn the tide of the game in our favor just by using the appropriate cc skills (stuns and knockdown to prevent them from rezzing/finishing) and reviving my teamates with shouts and banners. As soon as someone died, it became the focus point of attention, enemy trying to finish, allies trying to rez, and I felt it added a lot of interesting situations where skills and timely moves were rewarded immensely whereas ignoring such situations would have resulted in a costly team fight loss.
It adds a new depth to PvP. Its fresh and new and IMO really fun and makes many unexpected things happen. I hope they add more depth to the down system. New skills you can earn and things like that.
People who do NOT like the downed mechanic all say the same things.
They seem to be byproducts of the WoW generation of PvP - it's all about speed, "blowing somebody up" in a couple of seconds, and grinding kills trying to "have the best kill/death ratio" for bragging so that they can grind points to buy new / better gear so that they can "blow somebody up" in a GCD or two and earn more points and have a bigger ePeen with better K/D ratio's...
Which makes sense, if you are grinding points to buy more gear to grind points to buy MORE gear, you don't want anything to slow you down - combat is fast and brutal and you live/die in seconds.
GW2, however, is not about grinding anything for gear and points, it's about skill and strategy and team work and the downed system fits PERFECTLY into the way the game works/plays.
Downed state would NOT work and be fun in a WoW like MMO.
It is perfect in GW2 and quite innovative.
WoW PvP and others like it is like the people in FPS games who do not care at all if their team wins or loses the match, as long as they have the best K/D ratio.
Thankfully, GW2 sPvP is NOT made for those children err people.
Was it really necessary to bring up WoW in this thread? Was it mentioned previously? Additionally, why do you talk about things in WoW that you know very little about? Please Spock - think and do a little more research before you decide you want to post.
I like the downed mechanic in WvW and PvE. I'm not sure if it belongs in sPvP though. Then again, I'm not really big on organized PvP so I did very little sPvP through out the 3 BWEs. I just don't think that it works in a competitive setting.
the downed mechanic is awsome, it adds another level of strategy / difficulty to Pvping.
First off I am not sure if everyone knows this but know that you dont need to Finish a downed opponent with your finishing ability you can simple damage them until they are out of there downed hp bar and they die. Basicaly if you are in a large fight and you use some aoe's downed opponents will just die from the aoe its not as big a deal as some are making it.
Second being downed is fun especialy for some classes. My thief for example has a shadow step so when ppl are trying to finish me bam i shadow step out of range, then when they are trying to finish me if I last long enough my stealth ability 3 comes up and bam you faild again :P
thirdly it promotes team play, the players who res there allies while in a large say 3v3 4v4 fight can easily turn the tide in there favor by resurecting, as well as ensure victory by finishing downed oppoents.
fourthly it gives some classes amazing support skills if they willing to take these skill in there build such as a rangers pet can revive allies, a guardian elite skill can resurect allies but of course they are giving up huge damage / self preservation abilities to have these skills but team wise they could be the difference between a win and a loss..
Overall I feel the downd mechanic just adds a lot of dynamic play to the pvp its great in FPS games and it will be great in gw2 as well imo
the downed mechanic is awsome, it adds another level of strategy / difficulty to Pvping.
First off I am not sure if everyone knows this but know that you dont need to Finish a downed opponent with your finishing ability you can simple damage them until they are out of there downed hp bar and they die. Basicaly if you are in a large fight and you use some aoe's downed opponents will just die from the aoe its not as big a deal as some are making it.
Second being downed is fun especialy for some classes. My thief for example has a shadow step so when ppl are trying to finish me bam i shadow step out of range, then when they are trying to finish me if I last long enough my stealth ability 3 comes up and bam you faild again :P
thirdly it promotes team play, the players who res there allies while in a large say 3v3 4v4 fight can easily turn the tide in there favor by resurecting, as well as ensure victory by finishing downed oppoents.
fourthly it gives some classes amazing support skills if they willing to take these skill in there build such as a rangers pet can revive allies, a guardian elite skill can resurect allies but of course they are giving up huge damage / self preservation abilities to have these skills but team wise they could be the difference between a win and a loss..
Overall I feel the downd mechanic just adds a lot of dynamic play to the pvp its great in FPS games and it will be great in gw2 as well imo
I agree with this, it adds another dynamic. But I also concede that it feels like you have to kill your oponent twice specially if you are a ranged class, but I can live with that given how much it actually adds to the gameplay.
The downed mechanic is a great feature, it adds a non deterministic element to the fight. You don't know what will happen every time the fight gets to that point. Additonally its a nice way to remove the anticlimatic feeling of killing a player outright which is an element of Pacing, one of the hardest elements to implement in a PVP match.
If only the downed mechanic was removed (no other changes) then why wouldn't I beat him?
Because I'm assuming that in this case, the downed mechanic is replaced simply with more HP? That you have the exact same HP sized bar, the only difference is that for the last part of it, it isn't a hidden HP bar where you go into downed state.
There's absolutely NOTHING to keep you from killing a downed person just by smacking them around until they die. You can kite an enemy while dropping ranged stuff on the downed person until they die a horrible, humiliating, weeping death.
The downed mechanic isn't a second life, it's really technically a whole life but the latter 1/10th or so of it has been divided into a type where you're really weak and a lot easier to kill.
If you can't kill a crippled, almost useless person while their buddy is there, what makes you think you could kill them if they were working at 100% efficiency just with 10% of their life left?
If only the downed mechanic was removed (no other changes) then why wouldn't I beat him?
Because I'm assuming that in this case, the downed mechanic is replaced simply with more HP? That you have the exact same HP sized bar, the only difference is that for the last part of it, it isn't a hidden HP bar where you go into downed state.
There's absolutely NOTHING to keep you from killing a downed person just by smacking them around until they die. You can kite an enemy while dropping ranged stuff on the downed person until they die a horrible, humiliating, weeping death.
The downed mechanic isn't a second life, it's really technically a whole life but the latter 1/10th or so of it has been divided into a type where you're really weak and a lot easier to kill.
If you can't kill a crippled, almost useless person while their buddy is there, what makes you think you could kill them if they were working at 100% efficiency just with 10% of their life left?
and again i ask you why would they up the hp if the game is well balanced already? you haven't given any reason for this.
btw isn't 2 people dpsing and ccing you a good reason for you?
and again i ask you why would they up the hp if the game is well balanced already? you haven't given any reason for this.
btw isn't 2 people dpsing and ccing you a good reason for you?
The game is balanced around people having a downed state. There is nothing INHERENT about the downed state that makes it harder for you to kill two people. If there was no downed state, there would simply be more HP instead. It's not like downed state is tacked on in a complete vacuum.
You can kill a downed person the same as you can a normal person. I fail to see why downed state trips you up so horribly. Is it the mercy reflex? When you see people fall over, are you like 'Oh shit, he tripped, I should probably call 911', and forget to finish killing them?
If 2 people can dps and cc you while one is downed, they can dps and cc you while both are still alive. You have failed to give any sort of acceptable argument as to what makes downed state harder than if the person was still alive normally and running around, just with that percentage of health left before dying.
You're just making a comment without explaining HOW downed state is so much harder to kill people than if they just had people with more HP in the first place?
I think your problem might not be with downed state, but with larger health bars, and you're confused. If your argument was 'If people had smaller health bars they'd be easier to burst down', that would be an argument I could understand better (Though I'd still disagree with you that easily burst down people is the best possible design and that any variation is unacceptable.).
and again i ask you why would they up the hp if the game is well balanced already? you haven't given any reason for this.
btw isn't 2 people dpsing and ccing you a good reason for you?
The game is balanced around people having a downed state. There is nothing INHERENT about the downed state that makes it harder for you to kill two people. If there was no downed state, there would simply be more HP instead. It's not like downed state is tacked on in a complete vacuum.
You can kill a downed person the same as you can a normal person. I fail to see why downed state trips you up so horribly. Is it the mercy reflex? When you see people fall over, are you like 'Oh shit, he tripped, I should probably call 911', and forget to finish killing them?
You forget one important thing: if the downed state was removed and they upped the hp I too would gain the same amount of hp which means (in most cases) I would kill him and be left with about the same amount of hp (it would just take a bit longer).
You forget one important thing: if the downed state was removed and they upped the hp I too would gain the same amount of hp which means (in most cases) I would kill him and be left with about the same amount of hp (it would just take a bit longer).
... but you have a downed state. There's nothing uneven about this?
Or is your complaint that you generally win by a very slim margin (Less than 5% or so), and so every single fight you'd end up with both of you in the downed state, where you're less likely to win?
Because honestly, as long as you stay on your feet, I don't see the problem. Even if you go into downed state AFTER they do, you should be able to finish them off and pop up fairly soon after, unless you go into downed state nearly simultaneously.
Either way, that just means you need a slightly larger (5% or so) margin of victory to beat two foes. Hardly insurmountable.
I think your problem might not be with downed state, but with larger health bars, and you're confused. If your argument was 'If people had smaller health bars they'd be easier to burst down', that would be an argument I could understand better (Though I'd still disagree with you that easily burst down people is the best possible design and that any variation is unacceptable.).
My problem is that the game is slower and promotes zerging and turtling and playing defensively. I wouldn't care if the downed state was implemented correctly
You forget one important thing: if the downed state was removed and they upped the hp I too would gain the same amount of hp which means (in most cases) I would kill him and be left with about the same amount of hp (it would just take a bit longer).
... but you have a downed state. There's nothing uneven about this?
Or is your complaint that you generally win by a very slim margin (Less than 5% or so), and so every single fight you'd end up with both of you in the downed state, where you're less likely to win?
Because honestly, as long as you stay on your feet, I don't see the problem. Even if you go into downed state AFTER they do, you should be able to finish them off and pop up fairly soon after, unless you go into downed state nearly simultaneously.
Either way, that just means you need a slightly larger (5% or so) margin of victory to beat two foes. Hardly insurmountable.
are you serious, man? I have a downed state? really? me solo and downed against 2? you're trolling me aren't you?
My problem is that the game is slower and promotes zerging and turtling and playing defensively. I wouldn't care if the downed state was implemented correctly
Right, that's a problem with larger health bars, not with the downed state. You feel it takes too long to kill people.
Also, I think it's a little early for anybody to cast final judgement on what balance will be like...
... but in sPvP at least, playing offensively works out pretty darn well.
Also, I've never totally understood the zerging complaint.
The thing about numbers is that superior numbers IS an advantage. In many cases, it should win. It's superior numbers. ALl other things being equal, superior numbers will always win out. That's not a function of the downed state either.
I can't think of a single game that allows large (but variable) amounts of units/people where having more people than the other person can NOT be used as an advantage.
people rarelly fight back,check smite ,they re down whatever plenty of time to comeback!nope they dont ,they rage quit or just go farm the crips (playing hide and seak with the foe)so they loose faster or they call for a vote to quit (this one i hate)
My problem is that the game is slower and promotes zerging and turtling and playing defensively. I wouldn't care if the downed state was implemented correctly
Right, that's a problem with larger health bars, not with the downed state. You feel it takes too long to kill people.
Also, I think it's a little early for anybody to cast final judgement on what balance will be like...
... but in sPvP at least, playing offensively works out pretty darn well.
Also, I've never totally understood the zerging complaint.
The thing about numbers is that superior numbers IS an advantage. In many cases, it should win. It's superior numbers. ALl other things being equal, superior numbers will always win out. That's not a function of the downed state either.
I can't think of a single game that allows large (but variable) amounts of units/people where having more people than the other person can NOT be used as an advantage.
Again you don't get it. My main problem is that I have to do damage which equals 200% of their hp to kill one and 100% more to kill the other which equals 300% (compared to 200% in other games) while they both are dpsing me for 2/3 of the battle (compared to both dpsing me for 1/2 of the battle in other games). On the other hand they only have to do damage that equals to 100% of my hp which is exactly like other games. See now how gw2 promotes zerging?
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Is that because competent players never make mistakes? What I'm getting it at is that you guys have created a made up type of player who for some reason is always hard to fight against them. I'm not saying I can defeat anyone, but what I can say is that after playing wvw and spvp, no one is safe (however good they are)... playing as a team in GW2 will 99.99999% always defeat anyone playing solo (however competent they may be).
I see the value and innovation in the downed system but personally I dont like it much.
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But they do add up. The average fight between two uneven sides will be less predictable without a downed state than with one. Let me make it math for you:
chance of outmumbered side winning an uneven fight without a downed state > chance of outnumbered side winning an uneven fight with a downed state
my review of GW2
If I'm not mistaken you can simply continue to hit the person to a defeated state rather than have to "finish them", correct?
As a competitive PvPer i believe the down state adds alot more then it subtracts.
There's a whole new level of strategy with dealing with and alot of times, not finishing an enemy is actually the correct decision some times.
I do believe they need to enable different kinds of finishing moves, specially the chance to finish adversaries from a distance (melee distance being really fast at finishing, ranged being slower).
Correct.
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my review of GW2
Finally decided I'd respond to your idiotic rambling, considering you are ignoring any actual response to the post and instead go off on some sarcastic little prod.
When I said competent, it meant not being an idiot. If you are matched up against a similarly skilled (or ranked) server, you are going to have to adapt to that fact. It means picking and choosing what fights you take depending on how many people are backing you up and the skills in your bar. It DOESN'T mean "OMG I EZ SUPAH-HEYROH" like you take it as because you have no valid response.
When I say competent, I'm not implying omnipotence, just saying don't bite off more than you can chew. So boo-hoo you can't win a 2vs1 anymore, that just means the other players are playing smarter than you. They are more co-ordinated than you. Classes have ways to handle that though. If you have skills that can separate them and you know you can take them 1 on 1? Then go and use it. Does it guarantee you'll win? No. If one is near an edge and you have a strong knockback? Take advantage of it.
And if you down one out of two in a 2vs1, don't focus on the downed man. He may be annoying, but he's not going to be able to do much. Sure he may teleport, sure he may be a warrior and stand back up, or a necro and go ghost form on you, but guess what? They are dead anyways as long as they don't get help. That warrior WILL die if he stands up with his skill, that necro will die once his life energy is wasted, and as long as you throw some occasional damage at the downed bugger, he won't be able to heal.
You just need to make sure the other person doesn't get a chance to run over and heal him, which he shouldn't anyways in such a situation.
Now go ahead, highlight every time I said "competent" in Kindergarden Yellow, and start shouting "I R COMPITENT! I R BETTR THAN SUPAHMAN!"
A fair assumption to make, especially after 3 beta events of extensive PvPing : most players seemed to completly ignore the tactics and strategy inferred and offered by the downed state. To them, it was just a tedious process, ruining the climax and satisfaction of killing someone.
I mostly played warrior during my playtime and I was offered many interesting "teamwork skills" from which I could single-handedly turn the tide of the game in our favor just by using the appropriate cc skills (stuns and knockdown to prevent them from rezzing/finishing) and reviving my teamates with shouts and banners. As soon as someone died, it became the focus point of attention, enemy trying to finish, allies trying to rez, and I felt it added a lot of interesting situations where skills and timely moves were rewarded immensely whereas ignoring such situations would have resulted in a costly team fight loss.
It adds a new depth to PvP. Its fresh and new and IMO really fun and makes many unexpected things happen. I hope they add more depth to the down system. New skills you can earn and things like that.
Was it really necessary to bring up WoW in this thread? Was it mentioned previously? Additionally, why do you talk about things in WoW that you know very little about? Please Spock - think and do a little more research before you decide you want to post.
I like the downed mechanic in WvW and PvE. I'm not sure if it belongs in sPvP though. Then again, I'm not really big on organized PvP so I did very little sPvP through out the 3 BWEs. I just don't think that it works in a competitive setting.
the downed mechanic is awsome, it adds another level of strategy / difficulty to Pvping.
First off I am not sure if everyone knows this but know that you dont need to Finish a downed opponent with your finishing ability you can simple damage them until they are out of there downed hp bar and they die. Basicaly if you are in a large fight and you use some aoe's downed opponents will just die from the aoe its not as big a deal as some are making it.
Second being downed is fun especialy for some classes. My thief for example has a shadow step so when ppl are trying to finish me bam i shadow step out of range, then when they are trying to finish me if I last long enough my stealth ability 3 comes up and bam you faild again :P
thirdly it promotes team play, the players who res there allies while in a large say 3v3 4v4 fight can easily turn the tide in there favor by resurecting, as well as ensure victory by finishing downed oppoents.
fourthly it gives some classes amazing support skills if they willing to take these skill in there build such as a rangers pet can revive allies, a guardian elite skill can resurect allies but of course they are giving up huge damage / self preservation abilities to have these skills but team wise they could be the difference between a win and a loss..
Overall I feel the downd mechanic just adds a lot of dynamic play to the pvp its great in FPS games and it will be great in gw2 as well imo
I agree with this, it adds another dynamic. But I also concede that it feels like you have to kill your oponent twice specially if you are a ranged class, but I can live with that given how much it actually adds to the gameplay.
The downed mechanic is a great feature, it adds a non deterministic element to the fight. You don't know what will happen every time the fight gets to that point. Additonally its a nice way to remove the anticlimatic feeling of killing a player outright which is an element of Pacing, one of the hardest elements to implement in a PVP match.
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Because I'm assuming that in this case, the downed mechanic is replaced simply with more HP? That you have the exact same HP sized bar, the only difference is that for the last part of it, it isn't a hidden HP bar where you go into downed state.
There's absolutely NOTHING to keep you from killing a downed person just by smacking them around until they die. You can kite an enemy while dropping ranged stuff on the downed person until they die a horrible, humiliating, weeping death.
The downed mechanic isn't a second life, it's really technically a whole life but the latter 1/10th or so of it has been divided into a type where you're really weak and a lot easier to kill.
If you can't kill a crippled, almost useless person while their buddy is there, what makes you think you could kill them if they were working at 100% efficiency just with 10% of their life left?
and again i ask you why would they up the hp if the game is well balanced already? you haven't given any reason for this.
btw isn't 2 people dpsing and ccing you a good reason for you?
my review of GW2
The game is balanced around people having a downed state. There is nothing INHERENT about the downed state that makes it harder for you to kill two people. If there was no downed state, there would simply be more HP instead. It's not like downed state is tacked on in a complete vacuum.
You can kill a downed person the same as you can a normal person. I fail to see why downed state trips you up so horribly. Is it the mercy reflex? When you see people fall over, are you like 'Oh shit, he tripped, I should probably call 911', and forget to finish killing them?
If 2 people can dps and cc you while one is downed, they can dps and cc you while both are still alive. You have failed to give any sort of acceptable argument as to what makes downed state harder than if the person was still alive normally and running around, just with that percentage of health left before dying.
You're just making a comment without explaining HOW downed state is so much harder to kill people than if they just had people with more HP in the first place?
I think your problem might not be with downed state, but with larger health bars, and you're confused. If your argument was 'If people had smaller health bars they'd be easier to burst down', that would be an argument I could understand better (Though I'd still disagree with you that easily burst down people is the best possible design and that any variation is unacceptable.).
You forget one important thing: if the downed state was removed and they upped the hp I too would gain the same amount of hp which means (in most cases) I would kill him and be left with about the same amount of hp (it would just take a bit longer).
my review of GW2
... but you have a downed state. There's nothing uneven about this?
Or is your complaint that you generally win by a very slim margin (Less than 5% or so), and so every single fight you'd end up with both of you in the downed state, where you're less likely to win?
Because honestly, as long as you stay on your feet, I don't see the problem. Even if you go into downed state AFTER they do, you should be able to finish them off and pop up fairly soon after, unless you go into downed state nearly simultaneously.
Either way, that just means you need a slightly larger (5% or so) margin of victory to beat two foes. Hardly insurmountable.
My problem is that the game is slower and promotes zerging and turtling and playing defensively. I wouldn't care if the downed state was implemented correctly
my review of GW2
are you serious, man? I have a downed state? really? me solo and downed against 2? you're trolling me aren't you?
my review of GW2
Right, that's a problem with larger health bars, not with the downed state. You feel it takes too long to kill people.
Also, I think it's a little early for anybody to cast final judgement on what balance will be like...
... but in sPvP at least, playing offensively works out pretty darn well.
Also, I've never totally understood the zerging complaint.
The thing about numbers is that superior numbers IS an advantage. In many cases, it should win. It's superior numbers. ALl other things being equal, superior numbers will always win out. That's not a function of the downed state either.
I can't think of a single game that allows large (but variable) amounts of units/people where having more people than the other person can NOT be used as an advantage.
people rarelly fight back,check smite ,they re down whatever plenty of time to comeback!nope they dont ,they rage quit or just go farm the crips (playing hide and seak with the foe)so they loose faster or they call for a vote to quit (this one i hate)
Again you don't get it. My main problem is that I have to do damage which equals 200% of their hp to kill one and 100% more to kill the other which equals 300% (compared to 200% in other games) while they both are dpsing me for 2/3 of the battle (compared to both dpsing me for 1/2 of the battle in other games). On the other hand they only have to do damage that equals to 100% of my hp which is exactly like other games. See now how gw2 promotes zerging?
my review of GW2