Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
Why This game will be as successful as SKYRIM and past ES games.
This discussion has been closed.
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Comments
Fridge....really? And how does that apply to either the purchase of a PC or a console to play a new game?
I got my parents to purchase a brand new PC (The Commodore 64 I think it was) just to Play the original Elite. I still do upgrade my PC when I find the next game I want to play doesn't work to my expectations. So for me (and I suspect a number of PC gamers who custome build their machines or buy exclusively to play games) there is no differnece between upgrading a PC or a Console. The only difference is the price.
So again, you are falsely representing the argument by using the cost of the console, box price and sub vs just the box price and sub of the PC. If you are going to make an arguement at least make a valid one.
OP, I honestly wish I could feel as optimistic about the long term chances of this title as you profess. I really want to see good games in circulation that leave people feeling great and expressing their love on the forums. It does happen. It happened for Skyrim amongst many other titles. It simply hasn't happened for an MMORPG in a very long time. This is for good reason as we have been served three month wonder crap for the past several years. We are not yet at liberty to write about the quality or lack thereof regarding the game itself.
Your reasoning for hope at the titles potential for success are exactly the same reasons that will lead to a cluster... bomb. They have labeled this game as an Elder Scrolls title while leaving out all the fixtures a series fan has come to appreciate and love. Worse, they made a PVP title for a PVE fan base that will be wondering what they were thinking. Sure, they will cash in on the name as the casuals jump with glee to pick it up only to find out the label was misleading. It might be a short term financial success but it will come at the cost of angering their fans and that will have ramifications for future titles created under the elder scrolls label. You can only cash that good name in once before losing it.
This is completely false.
I do not care what the forum arguments are, and how members throw miss truths around like monky poo.
I am VERY excited for ESO and am looking forward to release.
Originally posted by Arskaaa
"when players learned tacticks in dungeon/raids, its bread".
"Bad" games still sell. How many guys have closets or garages full of games they will never play again or have actually shut down?
Warhammer sold how many copies? A couple million? People will never ever play that game again. Tabula Rasa? Not as many but for a game that was as bad as that one was, closed as quickly as it did, it sold way too many. Star Trek online? That sold more copies than it should have too. SWOTOR? Sold millions, now it is totally free I didnt buy it originally, got it for free and have played maybe 12 hours of it. Age of Conan? sold millions right? Another one totally free to get into and play now.
The list can go on and on, we all now the names.
And yes many of those names were years ago, but the names that get thrown around as 'successes' are older still.
Its pretty ironic that the universally accepted 'best' MMO ever (SWG pre apocalypse) was in development before most console players were even born. But now doesnt exist, and has never been duplicated in any way shape or form. Now some of that might be subjective, but if you polled players who have been around awhile I am sure it would be the top vote getter. But that game was also a mess. I think people like to forget the problems it had early on. But it did get better, but it always had some glaring issues. So even the 'good ole days' are misremembered sometimes. But it was still the best game that most people have seen.
I am not going to keep being subjective in terms of ESO, everyone has made up their minds by now. They like it, they love it, they will pay for it, they would play it if it were free. That pretty much covers most of them. A few I suppose 'hate' it but those people are irrational and were so upset with what they thought it might be and what they got they snapped.
But no matter what you think people will buy the game. I suspect guys who claim they hate it will buy it hoping against hope and logical thought that what they saw in the betas has been completely revamped and it will be released in a form that better fits their ideal for the game.
I am still on the fence. I am not one of the guys who buys every game that comes out. I stopped that after Warhammer and AOC. Only games I have bought sine those are Fallen Earth, GW2 and RIFT. But then again what has come out in the 5 years since those big disappointments hit? The 3 I mentioned, SWOTOR, FFXIV, maybe include DC Universe in there.
If you want to put it in perspective go to the Game List tab, click it, then click the Date tab. Scroll down until you get to the first games released, first one should be Meridian 59:Evolution. Then keep scrolling down. Pay attention to the ratings. Numbers not that important but just what have ratings. Then once you hit about 2008 take notice as to what happens.
Then if you cant do it simultaneously go down the list again and look at the 'payment method' column. Youll see a pattern there as well. Now some of those arent perfectly accurate but you will still get an idea.
But there are a lot of names on that list, many represents millions upon millions of boxes sold. They also represent a lot of bad bad games, as well as games that arent bad but got 'good' too late and were old news. They also represent a lot of crying and whining on the forums.
ESO will join that list on April 4 2014, it will be very interesting looking back in a few years where it stands.
Fixed
I tried ESO beta. It failed to live up to my expectations for what a sub based mmorpg should offer, so...
I'm waiting for Skywind. A fan made game which seems WAY better than ESO:
So yeah. Box price + sub for what ESO is offering is ludicrous.
I don't think that's exactly true.
I don't believe Daggerfall had that. Morrowind didn't have that. Oblivion did but Skyrim had a modified version where they scaled various aspects of the world to the level you were when you entered an area. But it's not the same as oblivion.
Don't know about Redguard.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
It was never meant to be more then a generic themepark MMO with other people set in a ES world though. At least I never expected more then that, nor do I feel they really promised more then that. Then again did not follow the development of it closely. They might have over promised.
mmoer. ES fan. Got into beta this weekend. 2nd time. not perfect but game is awesome. mix of DAOC+Skyrim.
dont care if its a massive success or not. somebody can become emperor in game by being badass. im going to purchase.
"The Society that separates its scholars from its warriors will have its thinking done by cowards and its fighting by fools."
Currently: Games Audio Engineer, you didn't hear what I heard, you heard what I wanted you to hear.
I agree with most of what you wrote expect that SWG was nowhere near the undisputed best MMO out there, at least for me, it was a piece of crap (the software side).
I only played it because i made good friends there and didn't want to leave them, granted the game itself and the setting was what brought me in and made all that happen but the issues in SWG where immense and i am not talking about bugs.
Since Skyrim is a Singleplayer game the developers have a completely different mindset how they will implement content into their game be it Combat/Encounters/Leveling/Graphical fidelity/Progression. One of the big features that all the ES games had that i played was the scaling of content to your level, which i really liked. I could kill a big ass Dragon in a manner of minutes if i choose too.
I don't think that's exactly true.
I don't believe Daggerfall had that. Morrowind didn't have that. Oblivion did but Skyrim had a modified version where they scaled various aspects of the world to the level you were when you entered an area. But it's not the same as oblivion.
Don't know about Redguard.
That's why i said the ES games that i played. As in i played Oblivion and Skyrim. I only tried Morrowind but couldn't play it because i had a coffee machine as PC back then when it released and neither did i play any of the prequels.
That's the reason why it WONT be successful. Most Skyrim players also played Oblivion who mostly played Marrowind. They are anti-TESO games in most ways.
Case in point, the reviews you yourself point to. Most of them with a large amount of hours logged talk about THE WORKSHOP COMMUNITY. This means MODS. Many of the others talk about the quality of the story, mention previous TES games and the absolute FREEDOM the games bring.
None of the things TESO is bringing. Not one.
Guess that's why there are threads like this on Steam, like every other TES site about how bad TESO is.
http://steamcommunity.com/discussions/forum/12/648816742886202796/#c648816742896307443
"People who tell you youre awesome are useless. No, dangerous.
They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/
hype thread.
first, excuse my english, but I felt that I had to give you my opinion on this.
I have been a big fan of the elderscrolls since the first game. Arena was nice, when daggerfall came out shit went crazy. I literally spent weeks discovering and exploring dungeons, travelling, following the main questline etc. I was SO exited when they announced Morrowind back in the days. Still this is one of my alltime favorite RPGs out there. Oblivion and Skyrim were also awesome games. And now there is TESO.
I had the honor to try it and I was not very exited after 10 hours of playtime. I am not going to bash it, since its beta and 10 hours is like nothing for a mmorpg....but still...since I have been playin MMOPRGs since the good old UO, my predicitons were right very often.
And in my guts it just feels like just another mmorpg. Not a bad one, but also not one that will play a major role for the next years. Also i do not really believe in f2p titles, but thats just me. I guess TESO will sell pretty good, many ppl are urgent to try it out...but I think it will share a fate compareable to swtor.
Yes I said it had problems, but people tend to romanticize it. But for most practical purposes the RP side anyway was the best the MMO world has seen. As in housing, crafting, trading, economy,. Cosmetics I think Lotro is the best ever. Economy some might debate but I think it was the best.
ESO could use that and expand on it. Every new game that comes out should look at hat parts of other games were great and go from there.
ESO seems to have only looked at DAOC (GW2) and copied their systems and added some changes. That is a very tiny part of a very large (or supposed to be large) game. Their own franchise is the pinnacle of actual exploration and open world. In the MMO arena I would say Vanguard tops that list now. So look at Vanguard and see how they implemented things into their MMO. Crafting, Current games Fallen Earth and original Pirates of the Burning Sea. Look at how they did things and how it worked. ESO crafting is interesting but not ideal. Housing, there is none in ESO. Rift in an open world or even in an instanced world would be the standard. SWG pretty similar as well. Trading and economy, none other than guild banks which people are going to hate because they require 'mega' guilds to be close to efficient. So ANY MMO basically would be better than what they have implemented. People can obviously trade in chat, but there isnt a trade channel either, unless they plan on adding one.
But ESO and the developers have many many examples of things they should do and things they shoudnt do in the wasteland of 'failed' games.
Just like any other game coming out also has the same examples to use.
it isnt rocket science. Unless you reinvent something or put a totally new mechanic into a game then use what has worked in the past. Its amazing so many developers dont get it,and when they finally do its far to late to get peopel back.
stop with comparing ESO & TES,they are two different game genre in same world,maybe they are different worlds in same universe
noticed many new TES fans are played only Skyrim,it is great game but worst in TES serial.Go play Morowind & Oblivion.
Ok, I pay $115 a month for internet alone, you think $15 dollars is a lot of money, as a kid I could collect that in cans to cash in less then an hour....
It bugs me to see this next gen of gamers want everything free, when I was a kid, my parents were poor and dint buy me anything. I wanted a Nintendo so bad, the whole summer I worked in a cornfield detasseling corn. (hard work for a 12 year old) but I did it, and I got my Nintendo, and two games to show for my work.
Even if you make 800 a month take home these days, 15 of that amount of money for your entertainment isn't a lot. In fact, its cheaper then most hobbies people have.
Lets look at hobbies per a month and how much the cost...
I-phone, $50 sub a month. Don't own it
Alcohol $50 a week. I don't drink
Cigarettes. $50 a week. I don't smoke.
Bowling three games. $20. I don't bowl very often.
Driving around town (cruising). $3.73/gallon = 4 gallons... that wont even get you more then 60 miles. I only drive to stores.
Candy bars and snacks. 3-4 bags of doritos a month. I don't eat.
Hope this gives you a better picture of how much ONLY $15 dollars is. If you work you can afford it. If you want everything free, you cant afford it. I personaly would never ask someone to provide a service to me for free in the real world, because the world doesn't work like that, I say thankyou to the people who give me service because they worked to earn it, ESO team works to provide 100+ hours of entertainment a month for me, I think I can afford $15 dollars for them to give me entertainment that's cheaper then most of peoples addictions and hobbys.
I see TESO successful only if they fire most of their developers and hire some of most talented moders out there. And promise a second revamp release after 6 months. Only this sway I see ESO a long term MMO. Better character better animations better armors not armors that looks like growing or stoked to player.
Trust me if you give this row client to moders they will do great job. It's a fact !! in Skyrim they proved their talent.
Zenimax should definitely think about hiring a group of them and start revamping content .
Still most probably I will buy the game with hope that Zenimax will listen to gamers which some have 10 20 years of gaming background.
Couldn't agree more. Kids, even grown ups are so spoiled nowdays
Ok, I pay $300 a month for internet alone, you think $15 dollars is a lot of money? Well, yeah....because I pay so much for the internet.
Seriously though. I feel the same way about $15 now as I did when I was 7. its $15 and I better be getting $15 worth for my $15 or I just threw $15 away on something not worth.....$15.
That's the difference between someone that is going to be able to retire before retirement age and someone that's going to work until the day they die. By continually pissing away small amounts of money. Now no doubt you will come back with, that's only $180 a year. Yes, for this topic. If you piss away $15 so easily on a business model built on BS to sucker you out of money, odds are you are doing it for a lot of other things too................like, $115 a month for internet..............lol.
"People who tell you youre awesome are useless. No, dangerous.
They are worse than useless because you want to believe them. They will defend you against critiques that are valid. They will seduce you into believing you are done learning, or into thinking that your work is better than it actually is." ~Raph Koster
http://www.raphkoster.com/2013/10/14/on-getting-criticism/
I agree. No matter how much money you have, or don't have, a smart person seeks out value. I have a lot more money now than I did as a kid, but I still want value for money.
A great list of free games (mostly MMORPGs): http://www.mytop10games.com/
$15/month lets put this in some prospective for those who say it's a lot of Monty for an mmo.
Lets just oust say you play 10 hrs a week. That's 40 hr a month. That equals to about $0.37 per hour of entertainment. Where else can you get a better bang for your buck when it comes to entertainment?
This complaint is pathetic and sad pay the $0.37/hr don't play and move on it's that simple. If this is a deal breaker for some then they probably just want to get into the game for free so they can troll.
They are not the same, but have many many similarities.
Biggest difference is of course, that one game is singleplayer and the other is an online game.
More of the inane "15 bux isnt that much' bullshit.
Youre right 15 bux might not be a lot at least in developed countries. BUT when you have some many other things that can be compared that are free why spend money on it? Because its new?
But then again thats the beauty of a sub based game people will pay 15 bucks until they dont think it is worth it.
I am very interested to see how their pricing model goes. if they offer some 'prerelease/preorder specials' like if you buy 3 months on top of your free month you pay only 24.99 for it. Or if you buy 6 months on top of the free month you pay 39.99. So basically a hundred bucks gets you the basic game and 7 months of play time. IMO that might buy them some time with a lot of stuff, give them a cash boost to help with content releases and also lock people into the game longer than they normally might lock themselves in for.
I might even take them up on it. I doubt they do it, at least at that sort of a discount. But I am interested to see what happens. The next subsequent beta reactions I am sure will play a part in any decisions they make.