Do you believe in a God

Aldaron · May 2005

Originally posted by dekron

I suppose it would, however, you completely missed my point. If intelligent life were to make contact with us, that would completely put the bible and any other religious text to rest. God made man, the bible does not state god made any other species. You can state, "Well, not everything is in the bible.", but that is just a major scapegoat for something that contradicts religion.
And to add, what if these aliens came and claimed, god is false, they visited before, they were performing a social experiement on man to see the effects of "religion". Now, more than likely this will never ever happen, but the point is to question what you know is the truth.

A scapegoat? bah. Hardly. The Bible stating there are extra-terrestrial beings is right there, most, (Including Christians and non-Christians alike) just chose to ignore those statements. Thus resulting in arguments like these.

And that last part of your sentence is a very good example of the effects of Satanic deception that could happen.

Adreal · May 2005

heres a simple one, you cut the sentance in half and ignroe the entire phrase, I said the pope is the highest authority of the catholic religion on Earth

Ok. Sorry about that. If I cut part of the sentence, then it's because I didn't think the rest was relevant. It seems that I may have misunderstood it.

Also, the inquisitions werent simply done by fanatic church goers, these were priests of the church. The servents of god that we are supposed to look to as inspiration on how to worship.

It would have been very deceptive. I think, though, the only ultimate authority to look to for inspiration is the will and word of God and the teachings of Christ. One today can read Scripture for themselves and determine whether or not a "priest" is following the teachings of Christ. I don't know whether or not the majority of people could have back then, but religion is still not to blame if people have misconstrued, twisted, or misinterpreted it.

Also, tell me how many people could actually read in between 1 ad to 1500 ad.

I've heard that not many could, so can you tell me?

Aldaron · May 2005

Originally posted by dekron

Another point why I cannot follow christianity. God is apparently supposed to know everything. He is supposed to everything form the beginning to the end, yet, he finds that he screws up and makes mistakes. He decides later, "Dam, it's not ok to have sex with your brother, sister, father, mother, etc., I better change that!". At first he wants sacrifices (animal) to appease him, then he decides, "Nah, I think I will make myself human and tell everyone i've got a better idea."

The only incest that happend was optional, not forced. Even at the creation of Adam and Eve.

As for your last statement, that in itself is a wholly, and completely ignorant statement to make. Showing a true since of ignorance in you when speaking of Christianity.(Take no offense by what I say. When I say ignorance, I do mean lack of knowledge. Not meant as a belittlement.)

The sacrifice of animals was the proverbial, sweeping the dirt under the rug. The dirt was still there though. It wasn't true redemption. Christ came along and became the ultimate sacrifice. Thus putting away the need of sacrifices altogether, because redemption had finally come.

Mentat · May 2005

well I'm fixin to get the ban, the buttholes at mmorpg.com have a large ... something in their rears...or at least the one who keeps deleting my posts... did I offend any of the repliers? I think not.. Hmph, you get christian moderators behind the wheel and this is what you get..

Free speech - it ain't happenin' here...

Drega · May 2005

Originally posted by Adreal

Also, tell me how many people could actually read in between 1 ad to 1500 ad.
I've heard that not many could, so can you tell me?

Not an exact number but records show that only major cities (london, rome, etc) did have a section of society was literate. But for the majority of the hamlets and villages spread throught the world, the only literate person was the priest.

Miexon · May 2005

Originally posted by Puoltry

Sure it is but the posts a couple above me pointed out the atrocoties caused by religion.Nevermind the fact that it was man who commited them.
If its ok for someone to do that then i think its ok to generalize on the 1 atheist that i do know.

You have to admit the guy is pathetic.

lol i hope your not saying that i am pathetic. I am not saying religion as a whole is wrong i just think that a the leaders of religions or highest positions of religion in the past and even present have used their power of god, allah, or anything else for the wrong ways. I am just statiing the truth and that IS what happened whether you want to believe it or not. I am not making a generalization just saying that religion has caused a lot of problems.

i think its fine if you worship anything but once you start attacking what others believe then its a power struggle. And please dont call me pathetic because of what i believe in i am not making fun of you.

methane47 · May 2005

Every single sin means punishment by death.. But this is refering to
separation from God, As in you will be denied access to heaven. But alittle bit after it says "judge not, lest you be judged" The bible repeats that but with this added on, "condemn not, lest thou be condemned and Forgive so you may be forgiven" Look at the order, if you judge, and condemn.. there is always forgiveness. Remember our God is a righteous, Just, and Merciful God.

You really have to think pray about somethings you read in the bible... Like i think HanSolo said.. you have to look at the context. This was thousands of years ago.. life was harder, and people were also alittle bit more barbarish. God said thou shalt not kill many many times in the bible...

And just take for example the people God chilled with.. God's homeboys... The people who God and Jesus very well Forgave. Punishment of death wasn't meant as something you do to anyone.. Why didn't God kill Cain? why didn't God kill David? why didn't God kill Samson, why didn't God kill Moses, why didn't God kill All these great people who were murderers. Because there is always Forgiveness. For you never know who God is going to use for Good. Why didn't God kill the man that killed Jesus? Because God is an Understanding, merciful, loving, God. In the end he want's Everyone to live with him in his heavenly mansion.

Yes bible says killing should be punished by death, but Old Testament Law also says that Men shouldn't cut their hair, and women shouldn't cut their hair, and people should not cut or scar their skin (tattoo), God said that every seven years if a debt isn't repaid consider it null and void.

But then ask yourself why Jesus came? He came to fulfill the covenents of the past... MAn i just found a killer verse on this stuff too ..... This one has me feeling really good...
6But the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, and it is founded on better promises.

Hebrews 8:6-13
7) For if there had been nothing wrong with that first covenant,
no place would have been sought for another.
8)But God found fault with the people and said[b]:
"The time is coming, declares the Lord,
when I will make a new covenant
with the house of Israel
and with the house of Judah.
9) It will not be like the covenant
I made with their forefathers
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,
because they did not remain faithful to my covenant,
and I turned away from them, declares the Lord.
10) This is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel
after that time, declares the Lord.
I will put my laws in their minds
and write them on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
11) No longer will a man teach his neighbor,
or a man his brother, saying, 'Know the Lord,'
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest.
12) For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more."
13) By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete;
and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.

I hope you understand the ideas set forth here.... And i'm sure you know that Jesus said that he was there to make a new Law... This doesn't mean that the alll the laws of the old testament are wrong... Jesus just changed them to fit the people because God found that the People of the Old testament could not follow all the laws he had set in place. So that is why it's ok to cut our hair, and ok to where pants, and Ok to do good on the sabbath. Before Jesus if you did Anything at all on the sabbath it was considered blasphemy now, Jesus changed all that.

Jesus is the Man yo...

Pimpslayer · May 2005

OMG 67 PAGES WOWOWWOW

Adreal · May 2005

Another point why I cannot follow christianity. God is apparently supposed to know everything. He is supposed to everything form the beginning to the end, yet, he finds that he screws up and makes mistakes. He decides later, "Dam, it's not ok to have sex with your brother, sister, father, mother, etc., I better change that!".

I think the only reason why it would be alright to have sex with your close relatives to begin with is because there was little sin, death, disease, and destruction in the world at first. Over time as destruction (in general) was rampant, it could only then be amplified by having sex with your close relatives which also likely have some genetic defect similar to you since they are closely related in genetics. So if it was alright at one point, then that's because there was nothing wrong with it. If it is not alright later, then that is because there is something wrong with it; that's just my take on it.

At first he wants sacrifices (animal) to appease him, then he decides, "Nah, I think I will make myself human and tell everyone i've got a better idea."

I think God promised Christ's coming to Adam and Eve so-to-speak from the relative beginning of the world. Adam and Eve likely thought that their Savior had come when they had their first baby. I think, but I'm not sure, why Christ referred to himself as the Son of Man is because of God's promise to Adam (Man) - or more specifically the "serpent" - that Man's seed would crush the serpent and that the serpent would bruise his heel or some such thing. So Christ saying that he is the Son of Man is like saying that he is this promised one that will crush the head of the serpent.

I guess you can tell I'm a fool (what's worse is if you think you aren't one).

Mentat, I think we're both in the same boat. Personally I only believe that I'm the one with the life vest. I don't consider you any more of a fool than I am.

All I can say is .. I have prayed for God to come down and talk to me like any other person would - I was hoping he'd just appear like magic but, that shit didn't happen.

I also have a friend that I've Emailed fairly often and she never responds. When I asked her whether she was getting my Emails when I found her on MSN once she said that she had been reading them and told me that she didn't feel like Emailing me back because she wasn't "into Emails" or some such thing. I was like, "Ok..." Personally I didn't believe her. I do think that God has responded to one person and not another. People claim to hear him; I think that some of these people must be right - many are wrong. There are also some things in this life that happen that don't seem to be much of cooincidence but rather as an orchestrated act. I'll tell you about one that I had (which I still leave up for grabs for whether it was cooincidence or not since I simply don't know to tell you the truth):

I've stated this before a couple of times on these Forums just because I found it interesting. My best friend from highschool had left for Georgia and we hadn't been in contact much after that. I didn't have many friends to talk to or anything other than my close family. One day my little brother wanted me to come outside and mess around and I nearly didn't. He wanted me to come sledding on a sledding hill in town. I barely accepted his invitation so we left to go sledding and snowboarding and then I saw some people at the top of the hill when it was my turn to go snowboarding (I was going to go down on the snowboard by sitting on it which I felt relatively embarassed about). However, I shrugged off this fear since I thought it ridiculous that I should care what others thought of me, and if I wanted to just have fun, then I was going to have fun. So to prove to myself, I just walked right up to the people standing at the top of the hill and found out that my best friend was standing there and said "Hello, <notsayingmyname>."

I looked closer at him and found that it was him. My little brother knew nothing or very little of this friend of mine. He didn't orchestrate it or get any word of it beforehand. At the very least it was cooincidence. Anyway, we talked a bit and some days later he came over to my house before he moved back to Georgia. He had talked about coming up to visit me around Thanksgiving but never did since his parents were against it; they wanted to do something else.

If he speaks to me through other people it would be nice if once he could say "hey man, by the way this is God not bob... I'll be speaking through bob to you about that car loan you wanted" ya know???

I do know, and I agree.

well I'm fixin to get the ban, the buttholes at mmorpg.com have a large ... something in their rears...or at least the one who keeps deleting my posts... did I offend any of the repliers? I think not.. Hmph, you get christian moderators behind the wheel and this is what you get..

Don't start blaming it on Christians now. I have found your posts to be offensive, but I don't care too much about making a big deal out of them if what you say isn't worth speaking about - for instance, whether or not God has genetals and then going about in an excited manner to imply a belief system is false.

Adreal · May 2005

but Old Testament Law also says that Men shouldn't cut their hair, and women shouldn't cut their hair

Largely a good post. Some old laws are changed because circumstances are given to change. But I'm not sure about the above statement. I think not cutting your hair was only for a certain tribe just as a sign or some such thing; such as Samson not cutting his hair.

Aldaron · May 2005

Originally posted by methane47
Every single sin means punishment by death.. But this is refering to
separation from God, As in you will be denied access to heaven. But alittle bit after it says "judge not, lest you be judged" The bible repeats that but with this added on, "condemn not, lest thou be condemned and Forgive so you may be forgiven" Look at the order, if you judge, and condemn.. there is always forgiveness. Remember our God is a righteous, Just, and Merciful God.

It doesn't say to execute every sinner though. If you're talking about this verse...

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Yes sin is death, be it spiritual, or physical. (Hence why we die)

God is righteous, Just, and Merciful. But he is also a God of order. Hence why he gave us laws and commandments so that the people may rule themselves by.

You really have to think pray about somethings you read in the bible... Like i think HanSolo said.. you have to look at the context. This was thousands of years ago.. life was harder, and people were also alittle bit more barbarish. God said thou shalt not kill many many times in the bible...

When he said thou shalt not kill. He meant thou shalt not murder. If he meant killing period, he would of never had the Jews war with the Canaanites. God doesn't break his own rules.

And just take for example the people God chilled with.. God's homeboys... The people who God and Jesus very well Forgave. Punishment of death wasn't meant as something you do to anyone.. Why didn't God kill Cain?

Instead he just made him hated. Being an outcast and roaming the earth. Never being at rest. Not exactly a pleasant existence. Personally if I was cain I would of picked death myself...

why didn't God kill David?

Instead the seed of David were in turmoil. Being filled with incest, rape, murder. Again. It would of been better if death was just served instead.

why didn't God kill Samson,

Samson did die though...Maybe more suicidally then anything else. But he got his eyes plucked out, and crushed by the collapse of the temple/arena.

why didn't God kill Moses,

He went from a Prince to a lowly outlaw. Having to flee Egypt, staying in the middle of nowhere for something like what...40 years? Then later having to travel in the wilderness for another 40? (Which I spose that was caused by something else entirely)

But moses didn't exactly get off easy.

why didn't God kill All these great people who were murderers. Because there is always Forgiveness.

Just because there is forgiveness doesn't mean they get out unscathed. God can punish someone much worse then in death, and much more intricately.

We on the other hand, do not have that power. So instead we do what we can, and we execute them.

For you never know who God is going to use for Good. Why didn't God kill the man that killed Jesus? Because God is an Understanding, merciful, loving, God. In the end he want's Everyone to live with him in his heavenly mansion.

Because if God struck everyone down with lightning that did wrong, we'd all be dead. It's called freewill. God doesn't keep us on a leash and shocks us everytime we get out of line.

And yes, God does wish that everyone would come to repentence. Sadly, that doesn't always happen.

Yes bible says killing should be punished by death, but Old Testament Law also says that Men shouldn't cut their hair, and women shouldn't cut their hair, and people should not cut or scar their skin (tattoo), God said that every seven years if a debt isn't repaid consider it null and void.

Matthew 5:17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

But then ask yourself why Jesus came? He came to fulfill the covenents of the past... MAn i just found a killer verse on this stuff too ..... This one has me feeling really good...
6But the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, and it is founded on better promises.

Hebrews 8:6-13
7) For if there had been nothing wrong with that first covenant,
no place would have been sought for another.
8)But God found fault with the people and said[b]:
"The time is coming, declares the Lord,
when I will make a new covenant
with the house of Israel
and with the house of Judah.
9) It will not be like the covenant
I made with their forefathers
when I took them by the hand
to lead them out of Egypt,
because they did not remain faithful to my covenant,
and I turned away from them, declares the Lord.
10) This is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel
after that time, declares the Lord.
I will put my laws in their minds
and write them on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
11) No longer will a man teach his neighbor,
or a man his brother, saying, 'Know the Lord,'
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest.
12) For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more."
13) By calling this covenant "new," he has made the first one obsolete;
and what is obsolete and aging will soon disappear.

By my interepretation, that's talking about things to come. Reason I say that is, look at verse 11.

I hope you understand the ideas set forth here.... And i'm sure you know that Jesus said that he was there to make a new Law... This doesn't mean that the alll the laws of the old testament are wrong... Jesus just changed them to fit the people because God found that the People of the Old testament could not follow all the laws he had set in place. So that is why it's ok to cut our hair, and ok to where pants, and Ok to do good on the sabbath. Before Jesus if you did Anything at all on the sabbath it was considered blasphemy now, Jesus changed all that.

Jesus is the Man yo...

Wait...You're confusing me. Cut our hair? Wear pants?

To my knowledge they didn't even have pants back in most of the old testament. Could you give me verses speaking of what you're talking about?

In fact, about not cutting your hair, 1 Corinthians 11:14 Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?

Though yes, this is in the new testament. Many of the people were still following old jewish tradition. So I'm not sure what you mean by it unlawful to cut your hair. The only thing I can think of is that it was shameful for a man to cut his beard, because it was a thing of honor.

As for the sabbath. It should still be honored. What Jesus mainly had a beef with the Pharisee's about it was, that the Pharisee's let themselves be controlled by it. Correct me if i'm wrong. But I believe Christ said something along the lines of, the sabbath (or maybe laws in general, i'm not sure) was created for man. Not man for the sabbath. Or at least something along those lines.

methane47 · May 2005

Leviticus 19
27 You shall not shave around the sides of your head, nor shall you disfigure the edges of your beard.
28 You shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor tattoo any marks on you: I am the LORD.

Or here is another Crazy law of the Old Testament.

Leviticus 10:6
Then Moses said to Aaron and his sons Eleazar and Ithamar, "Do not let your hair become unkempt, [ Or Do not uncover your heads ] and do not tear your clothes, or you will die and the LORD will be angry with the whole community. But your relatives, all the house of Israel, may mourn for those the LORD has destroyed by fire.

I'm telling you the laws of the land in the Old Testament were Rough... I dont think it IS possible to follow them all... without living in solitude maybe...

EDIT: In response to aldaron's post.. Well I guess that dang the Lord is going to kill anyone wearing torn Jeans... In your post above.. you said that God didn't kill those people because he gave them other punishments.. The same should be applied to our life... Instead of killing someone we should punish them in another manner. You cannot say that since we cannot punish people as bad as God can then we should just kill them... Because if it's too hard to find a suitable punishment we should ask God's help and support.

Yoottos'Horg · May 2005

I only believe in God when I think I'm about to die...and I haven't had any of those experiences yet. ::::20::

Classicstar · May 2005

If peeps wanne believe fine by me, but dont force it on me becouse i dont give damn about any supreme being god ,allah or whatever.

Bunch of loser if they excist but they dont so whole bible or koran they can flush through toilet its bunch of bullshit story that have make alot of peeps complete morons.

Brought alot misery to world:(

Better dont believe in any god or what ever religion its only making this world unpleasant.

Have respect for nature your fellow humans animals live in peace harmony and love and this planet is ok to live on .

But now its one big rock of shit.

Evil here on this planet is God, allah whatever power hunger idiot is called ,money and humans:P

Adreal · May 2005

Then Moses said to Aaron and his sons Eleazar and Ithamar

My translation reads, "Then Moses said to Aaron and his sons Eleazar and Ithamar, 'Do not mourn by letting your hair hang loose or by tearing your clothes. If you do, you will die, and the Lord will be angry with the whole community of Israel. However, the rest of the Israelites, your relatives, may mourn for Nadab and Abihu, whom the Lord has destroyed by fire."

This is speaking about one specific instance. It's not a law for the rest of all time or even an old law. It was simply what Moses said on this occasion and even then there is a Law of Moses too, but that Law was found in error by Christ.

Nadab and Abihu sinned against God by disobeying him and burning a different type of incense before him (so it says). As I've already said, this is God's creation. He can do whatever he wants with us because he has created us. I've also said that God's idea of morality is not graded on a scale - if you do wrong, then you are in error and are not perfect. And if your life brings more pain, doubt, or destruction than love, faith, and peace, then your life is effectively worthless. If you are to come to know (know him as men knew their wives when they were married in a manner of speaking - I mean, really know him) God, then you must be righteous and absolutely perfect in his eyes. Many people were made righteous in God's eyes by their faith in God. Today we are made righteous before God in having faith in the resurrection and then we are saved by accepting God as Lord.

Leviticus 19:28 on mine says, "Never cut your bodies in mourning for the dead or mark your skin with tattoos, for I am the Lord." The way you or your translation stated it seemed to me that it meant that you can't engrave your skin with decorations for the dead or some such thing. Anyway, just wanted to get those points cleared up.

Adreal · May 2005

Bunch of loser if they excist but they dont so whole bible or koran they can flush through toilet its bunch of bullshit story that have make alot of peeps complete morons... Have respect for nature your fellow humans animals live in peace harmony and love and this planet is ok to live on .

Yes, we should have respect for others and live in peace and harmony and love one another, but your method of going about explaining it proves to me that you're (this time) only part of the problem - not the solution.

Classicstar · May 2005

lol what problem:P

I have never in my life try convince anybody to be non believer lol just discus what my opinion is nothing more ,and i dont go out door with gun and kill people if they not wanne believe what i think is right:P

You feel offended and say im the problem thats a dumb statement lol.

I have never kill anybody in my life i respec nature i dont eat meat or fish or whatever animal i say all humans black white yellow are equal so where is problem then hahahaha.

Adreal · May 2005

You feel offended and say im the problem thats a dumb statement lol.I have never kill anybody in my life i respec nature i dont eat meat or fish or whatever animal i say all humans black white yellow are equal so where is problem then hahahaha.

Some wounds go deeper than the wound of a sword. Just because you haven't killed anyone physically doesn't mean you haven't spoken ill of someone enough to make them want to kill themselves. I'm not saying that I want to kill myself right now (lol), I'm just trying to get a point across. Much evil comes from premeditated thoughts and the tongue, the Bible states I believe, can wound just as readily as the sword.

Alcanan · May 2005

Adreal's Statement "My translation reads" hits the nail right on the head why people have problems understanding some of the bible's messages. Some of them have different passages written in different ways depending on the language there in. Not all of the original meanings have survived over the years due to translations and edits...Look at the dead sea's scrolls bible very different...check your book store it's out there a good read

Aldaron · May 2005

Originally posted by methane47

Leviticus 19
27 You shall not shave around the sides of your head, nor shall you disfigure the edges of your beard.
28 You shall not make any cuttings in your flesh for the dead, nor tattoo any marks on you: I am the LORD.
Or here is another Crazy law of the Old Testament.
Leviticus 10:6
Then Moses said to Aaron and his sons Eleazar and Ithamar, "Do not let your hair become unkempt, [ Or Do not uncover your heads ] and do not tear your clothes, or you will die and the LORD will be angry with the whole community. But your relatives, all the house of Israel, may mourn for those the LORD has destroyed by fire.
I'm telling you the laws of the land in the Old Testament were Rough... I dont think it IS possible to follow them all... without living in solitude maybe...
EDIT: In response to aldaron's post.. Well I guess that dang the Lord is going to kill anyone wearing torn Jeans... In your post above.. you said that God didn't kill those people because he gave them other punishments.. The same should be applied to our life... Instead of killing someone we should punish them in another manner. You cannot say that since we cannot punish people as bad as God can then we should just kill them... Because if it's too hard to find a suitable punishment we should ask God's help and support.

Adreal explained Lev 10:6.

As for 19:27-28. I'm not sure how this is explaining your opponency to things like execution and capital punishment.

Lev 19:27. I really can't explain. Although I can think that it possibly had some symbolism attached to it. It could of been making a certain "statement". Such as tearing your clothes, and putting ash on top of your head makes a statement that your mourning.

There is always a reasoning behind things in the Bible. You just gotta look deeper then face value.

As for verse 28. That's sort of explanatory. It's said your body is the temple of God. And cutting your flesh is something akin to defacing a temple.

methane47 · May 2005

Originally posted by Adreal

Nadab and Abihu sinned against God by disobeying him and burning a different type of incense before him (so it says). As I've already said, this is God's creation. He can do whatever he wants with us because he has created us. I've also said that God's idea of morality is not graded on a scale - if you do wrong, then you are in error and are not perfect. And if your life brings more pain, doubt, or destruction than love, faith, and peace, then your life is effectively worthless. If you are to come to know (know him as men knew their wives when they were married in a manner of speaking - I mean, really know him) God, then you must be righteous and absolutely perfect in his eyes. Many people were made righteous in God's eyes by their faith in God. Today we are made righteous before God in having faith in the resurrection and then we are saved by accepting God as Lord.
Leviticus 19:28 on mine says, "Never cut your bodies in mourning for the dead or mark your skin with tattoos, for I am the Lord." The way you or your translation stated it seemed to me that it meant that you can't engrave your skin with decorations for the dead or some such thing. Anyway, just wanted to get those points cleared up.

You left a Little TidBit About Nadab and Abihu, While they were burning the wrong incense..
Leviticus 10:2 And fire came out from the presence of the LORD and consumed them,
and they died before the LORD.

And in leviticus 19:28 it says never cut your bodies in mourning for the dead .... So he was saying you're not supposed to cut your skin or carve your skin in mourning the death of others, Or tattoo your skin period...

What i'm trying to show here is that The laws given in those days were very very strict.. Including the law that said to kill people that murder. Because there is ALWAYS a chance to repent. A life isn't lost till it's in Hell. Everyone has the same opportunity whether the only sin you have committed is lieing or you've dont them all.. Everyone has the same opportunity to join him in the afterlife. So you should never cut someone's life short. If you want to follow the law of the Old Testament by killing someone who has committed murder than you also must follow the other laws put forward. Like in leviticus 19:27 Not shaving your hair. OR also you can't wear Clothes of Two different fabrics and Remember God said that Only the person taking Revenge can Kill the Murdered... BUT in Leviticus 19:18 it says "You shall not take vengeance, nor bear any grudge against the children of your people, but you shall love your neighbor as yourself: I am the LORD." So you would be sinning.. and in doing so Condemming yourself unto death.
I can't bring myself to think that God, Jesus wants me to Kill one of his children that he sent himself down to earth to edure 33 years of hardship to die for us.. And then to steal the opportunity that God gave that human by killing them before their time..

BTW i quoted my verses from the New International Version, But the New King James says almost exactly the same thing....

Adreal · May 2005

As for the list of supposed contradictions that Firemagic had provided earlier in this thread about the Bible:

PSA 145:9 The LORD is good to all: and his tender mercies are over all his works.

JER 13:14 And I will dash them one against another, even the fathers and the sons together, saith the LORD: I will not pity, nor spare, nor have mercy, but destroy them.

Did I already mention that someone can say something in the Bible - say, a character says that the Lord is evil or stupid or blasphemes God - but that doesn't mean that what they're saying is right? The Bible is a number of things; one of these things is a History book. It records sayings. Just because someone says that "this is the way it is" doesn't mean that God is now wrong in saying otherwise.

Besides, the verses above should be read in their context as well. My Bible states:

PSA 145:8-9: The Lord is kind and merciful, slow to get angry, full of unfailing love. The Lord is good to everyone. He showers compassion on all his creation.

The Lord does shower his compassion on all his creation if he "brings his rain on both the just and the unjust." Of course that verse, too, is speaking figuratively. Use common sense. God created Man and I don't believe he will take away any part of his creation from the wicked unless it is necessary. The wicked enjoy the fruits of this life just as readily as the righteous do. But the way the wicked live their lives is different and can result in a poorer grade of life than the lives of the righteous, given the same circumstances.

JER 13:11-14: As a belt clings to a person's waist, so I created Judah and Israel to cling to me," says the Lord. "They were to be my people, my pride, my glory - an honor to my name. But they would not listen to me. "So tell them, 'The Lord, the God of Israel, says: All your wineskins will be full of wine.' And they will reply, 'Of course, you don't need to tell us how prosperous we will be!' Then tell them, 'No, this is what the Lord means: I will make everyone in this land so confused that they will seem drunk - from the king sitting on David's throne and from the priests and the prophets, right on down to the common people. I will smash them one against the other, even parents against children, says the Lord. I will not let my pity or mercy or compassion keep me from destroying them.'"

The above is stated when Judah and Israel have been given plenty of chances to turn back to God, but God "will not strive with Man forever" and so his judgement finally comes. In Psalms it states that the Lord is slow to get angry. I believe this currently. But when his anger comes and people refuse to heed it, then his judgement also follows. This is not a contradiction at all.

Adreal · May 2005

What i'm trying to show here is that The laws given in those days were very very strict..

And that doesn't mean that every law is morally right, though it may be worthy of being considered. Personally, I think the Ten Commandments were fine enough as a template from God to run your life.

Classicstar · May 2005

Lol if you cant take my critisise believers then sorry for you i and many others have listend alot of bullshit from believers or see what happen in this world coused by christians or moslims or jews, or whatever they called.

I wish peeps where not that dumb eye for eye tooth for a tooth it will never end or be a solution to piece guns.

With believe in this in israel both jews and palastines are evil or to dumb to see they wrong and that is not only place in world where peeps who believe, think they can bring solution to problem like that .

If you wanne believe fine by me but keep it for your self and peeps freely not force also wanne believe.

But in real thast not the case alot of christans moslims wanne force there believes on non believers like me lol and if i was in wrong country i would be dead by now:P

So again what your comments where on my saying are wrong again lol.

LOVE AND PIECE only way to have a wonderfull world and most i dont say all but chritians moslims jews are not loving carering people accepting other then only there own.

Ive been for 6months in israel and most people both sides are sick in there heads becouse of brainswash from birth.

Yeh i know my english is not very good so i cant explain well what i mean or wanne tell ,sorry for that hehe.

methane47 · May 2005

Originally posted by Adreal
What i'm trying to show here is that The laws given in those days were very very strict..
And that doesn't mean that every law is morally right, though it may be worthy of being considered. Personally, I think the Ten Commandments were fine enough as a template from God to run your life.

So Do I.. I think that the ten commandments are the basis for what everyone believes is morally right and wrong. This is why i think that Killing another person is wrong... no matter the circumstances.. I dont have, neither should anyone have the right for killing Anyone else. Death is a consequence of Sin. And I am not free of sin... So i will not be the one to cast judgment or through the first stone.. Only one man is free of sin.. And has that right to cast judgment.

I couldn't agree with you more.

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