There is a very good reason why MMOs don't use player collisions in places where you can't attack people. This was a problem that I remember from the early days of EQ. Honest to God, sometimes it seems as if the Archeage designers were determined to ignore everything that we know about MMO player behavior. From rewarding AFK behavior (and being surprised that people gamed the system) to setting up an unlimited land rush at launch (with utterly predictable results) to nurturing and encouraging risk-free griefing, they could have made simple choices that avoided huge problems. In football terms, there are multiple own goals here.
The potential to grief is part of the appeal of sandbox games. Yeah it's annoying when it happens, but that annoyance is part of the fun!
Honestly, what people are doing here is not game breaking. It would take like 10 people devoting their time to standing on your land to completely eliminate your chance to plant. If they want to that bad, well, you must've really pissed them off somehow.
It's appealing to sociopath behavior.
It's appealing to me and I don't grief. Farming and trade runs are pretty boring. It's fun to me when someone mixes it up by trying to mess with you.
Keep in mind this is not game-breaking stuff here. OP had some trouble planting some things which would've given a small profit, I wasted about 10 minutes chasing down the guy that stole my farm cart.
It's minor inconvenience for the sake of freedom and spontanious player interaction.
I'd argue it is for the OP.
It certainly does seem that way, doesn't it?
Well if being unable to plant a few crops for a short amount of time is a dreadful as they make it out to be in the OP, then yeah it could very well be game breaking for them. But honestly I doubt Archeage is the game for them anyway, if they are in fact sincerely as they portray themselves.
I'm guessing they attracted the wrath of these trolls with their victim attitude.
It's a PVP focused game. If all they want to do is plant crops in peace or work a market they'd be better off playing Sims, Second Life or Farmville.
I'm pretty sure you don't play Archeage, so let me explain that this doesn't happen very often and for good reason- a player would have to devote all of his play time to standing in one spot to block a person from planting, and they could only block that small portion of the land they're standing on.
There is a very good reason why MMOs don't use player collisions in places where you can't attack people. This was a problem that I remember from the early days of EQ. Honest to God, sometimes it seems as if the Archeage designers were determined to ignore everything that we know about MMO player behavior. From rewarding AFK behavior (and being surprised that people gamed the system) to setting up an unlimited land rush at launch (with utterly predictable results) to nurturing and encouraging risk-free griefing, they could have made simple choices that avoided huge problems. In football terms, there are multiple own goals here.
The potential to grief is part of the appeal of sandbox games. Yeah it's annoying when it happens, but that annoyance is part of the fun!
Honestly, what people are doing here is not game breaking. It would take like 10 people devoting their time to standing on your land to completely eliminate your chance to plant. If they want to that bad, well, you must've really pissed them off somehow.
It's appealing to sociopath behavior.
It's appealing to me and I don't grief. Farming and trade runs are pretty boring. It's fun to me when someone mixes it up by trying to mess with you.
Keep in mind this is not game-breaking stuff here. OP had some trouble planting some things which would've given a small profit, I wasted about 10 minutes chasing down the guy that stole my farm cart.
It's minor inconvenience for the sake of freedom and spontanious player interaction.
I'd argue it is for the OP.
It certainly does seem that way, doesn't it?
Well if being unable to plant a few crops for a short amount of time is a dreadful as they make it out to be in the OP, then yeah it could very well be game breaking for them. But honestly I doubt Archeage is the game for them anyway, if they are in fact sincerely as they portray themselves.
I'm guessing they attracted the wrath of these trolls with their victim attitude.
It's a PVP focused game. If all they want to do is plant crops in peace or work a market they'd be better off playing Sims, Second Life or Farmville.
I'm pretty sure you don't play Archeage, so let me explain that this doesn't happen very often and for good reason- a player would have to devote all of his play time to standing in one spot to block a person from planting, and they could only block that small portion of the land they're standing on.
I can't play. They have yet to fix a launch bug for me.
But these sort of things usually start off by affecting a small portion and then everyone realizes they can do it to other people and it typically spreads like wildfire.
Originally posted by MsFit I experienced Trion's utter lack of customer service practices in Rift. It's why I no longer support anything they make. Sorry it happened to you.
I have yet to find even a single gaming company that provides 100% good service. why would Trion break the trend?
But I think they are all trying and the best way to keep them trying is to keep complaining when something is wrong.
I read the OP, and a few pages of replies, and wanted to throw my opinion in there as well.
To the OP. Man, I totally feel your pain. I think you did everything right, and I commend you for not screaming at the GM and tearing him up, as he definitely deserved it. I'm sure all the liberals will say "no, he was just doing his job. There was nothing he could do. He apologized. etc." Read it again. The guy blatantly refuses to get on a personal level with the OP, and just keeps acting like a freaking robot. This is a major problem with our society today. Nobody thinks for theirselves and just follows rules and procedures for everything.
Having said that, I was a Guide (volunteer helper - not a GM, but we had MANY powerful ingame powers) in Everquest for a short while (I didn't care much for it) when that game was rocking over a decade ago. If I had received your ticket and could actually witness it firsthand what they were doing to not one, but multiple people, it would have been a bad day for those players!
Against the EULA or not. The bottom line is something they were doing was preventing you and your family from being able to play the game....period. There is no arguing with that. Whether breaking rules or not, the GM should have stepped in and at the very least had a conversation with the guilty party and "asked" them to stop.
There is a very good reason why MMOs don't use player collisions in places where you can't attack people. This was a problem that I remember from the early days of EQ. Honest to God, sometimes it seems as if the Archeage designers were determined to ignore everything that we know about MMO player behavior. From rewarding AFK behavior (and being surprised that people gamed the system) to setting up an unlimited land rush at launch (with utterly predictable results) to nurturing and encouraging risk-free griefing, they could have made simple choices that avoided huge problems. In football terms, there are multiple own goals here.
The potential to grief is part of the appeal of sandbox games. Yeah it's annoying when it happens, but that annoyance is part of the fun!
Honestly, what people are doing here is not game breaking. It would take like 10 people devoting their time to standing on your land to completely eliminate your chance to plant. If they want to that bad, well, you must've really pissed them off somehow.
It's appealing to sociopath behavior.
It's appealing to me and I don't grief. Farming and trade runs are pretty boring. It's fun to me when someone mixes it up by trying to mess with you.
Keep in mind this is not game-breaking stuff here. OP had some trouble planting some things which would've given a small profit, I wasted about 10 minutes chasing down the guy that stole my farm cart.
It's minor inconvenience for the sake of freedom and spontanious player interaction.
I'd argue it is for the OP.
It certainly does seem that way, doesn't it?
Well if being unable to plant a few crops for a short amount of time is a dreadful as they make it out to be in the OP, then yeah it could very well be game breaking for them. But honestly I doubt Archeage is the game for them anyway, if they are in fact sincerely as they portray themselves.
I'm guessing they attracted the wrath of these trolls with their victim attitude.
It's a PVP focused game. If all they want to do is plant crops in peace or work a market they'd be better off playing Sims, Second Life or Farmville.
I'm pretty sure you don't play Archeage, so let me explain that this doesn't happen very often and for good reason- a player would have to devote all of his play time to standing in one spot to block a person from planting, and they could only block that small portion of the land they're standing on.
I can't play. They have yet to fix a launch bug for me.
But these sort of things usually start off by affecting a small portion and then everyone realizes they can do it to other people and it typically spreads like wildfire.
Bummer about being unable to play.
People are still unlikely to do it though, just because of the minimal amount of grief it causes (unless you're the OP I guess) and the amount of effort it requires (all of your playtime).
Keep in mind it would take like 10 people to completely block an 8x8, and maybe 50 to block a 16x16.
What more likely happened is a few trolls picked up that these guys acted like victims, so they spawned a couple of carts on their land and stood on them for a few minutes to get a rise out of them. And they succeeded, obviously.
But if you can't deal with that kind of trolling, how are you going to deal with a pirate killing you and stealing the trade pack you spent 30 minutes hauling across the ocean?
Like I said, I think Archeage just isn't the game for them.
I can't believe the GM didn't even contact the offending players. Maybe they did and didn't say anything, but what a Customer Service fail this was. You should continue to pursue this ticket until you get a result that is satisfying. If Trion keeps this position they will end up in the same situation as EVE, and will have to get their lawyers activated when players start upping the ante on harassment.
Fans of this game who don't approve of this mentality should make their voices known to Trion.
Seriously you think someone's going to sue cause they couldn't plant a few roses?
No but once the griefers become bored with blocking gardening they will look for more insidious ways to harass players. EVE experienced this and finally had to step in to stop it. Given that CCP decided to act, and given that they have fostered the idea of anarchy as a cute pet, the only explanation for intervening is their legal responsibility for managing and supervising the real estate upon which the offenses occurred--and were sanctioned.
MMORPG players are often like Hobbits: They don't like Adventures
This is one of the reasons we built our farms in the pvp zone....Ironically, you don't see this that much there and if you do then you have plenty of recourse.
In safe zones it's pretty easy to use the mechanics of 'can't attack' to grief....and why many MMOs don't allow character collision.
I do have a small 8x8 in a safe zone and am always getting ran over by farm carts and donkeys while trying to plant. While annoying is not game breaking. I have yet to be ran over by a farm cart in the pvp zone.
Griefers usually only grief if they can do so in a safe way....it's why one of the most dangerous areas is right around the gold traders with their guards.
Like I said, I think Archeage just isn't the game for them.
...I guess you are a type of person that will repeat this mantra until the game lose all the players and the game is shut down.
You are missing the point here.
No I get the point, I think you guys are making a mountain out of a molehill.
If someone is going to quit because they couldn't plant half their crops for 15 minutes because a couple people wanted to be trolls and they couldn't deal with them effectively, they're going to quit for any number of legitimate gameplay reasons (like a gang of pirates stealing your fishing boat and all the fish you spent hours fishing up).
I'm being sincere here and I don't have anything against people that would have a serious issue with what happened in the OP. I just really don't think even the legitimate gameplay aspects of Archeage would suit such a person.
Bottomline: if you don't want people having the ability to interfere with your gameplay, Archeage isn't the game for you.
Originally posted by holdenhamlet Bottomline: if you don't want people having the ability to interfere with your gameplay, Archeage isn't the game for you.
Like I said, I think Archeage just isn't the game for them.
...I guess you are a type of person that will repeat this mantra until the game lose all the players and the game is shut down.
You are missing the point here.
No I get the point, I think you guys are making a mountain out of a molehill.
If someone is going to quit because they couldn't plant half their crops for 15 minutes because a couple people wanted to be trolls and they couldn't deal with them effectively, they're going to quit for any number of legitimate gameplay reasons (like a gang of pirates stealing your fishing boat and all the fish you spent hours fishing up).
I'm being sincere here and I don't have anything against people that would have a serious issue with what happened in the OP. I just really don't think even the legitimate gameplay aspects of Archeage would suit such a person.
Bottomline: if you don't want people having the ability to interfere with your gameplay, Archeage isn't the game for you.
EXCEPT FOR ONE ISSUE:
THE OP WAS NOT HARASSED FOR FIFTEEN MINUTES. THEY WERE HARASSED FOR -SIX- HOURS.
You forget, this is a HUMAN being. A HUMAN BEING. A LIVING PERSON. If this happened to me, in reality, I would be burying you in my back yard. A game mechanic is NO excuse to treat players this way. I disdain this just as much as I disdain the Eve player that took a Marine to a near-psychotic break.
Screw anyone and EVERYONE who believes they have the right to treat people like shit over the internet because of of anonymity. If you are brave enough to give me your full contact information AND continue to act like that, we'll see what happens.
After reading everyone's comment and seriously considering the contrast between reality and this game and the OP's problem, my conclusion is that his game was created forGriefers.
I know! No surprise.
This game gives everyone the freedom to be what they want to be and do what they want to do. That WILL come with it's consequences. Every sandbox, I can recall, has some form of douchebaggery. Guess what? That's apparently ok because in the real world, it's the same way.
I mean, if you think about it, AA has
a jail system ( first major clue).
(side note, if you play AA and look at the Trial chat.. people WANT to go to jail. They'll insult the jury just to guarantee their guilty verdict. Hopefully not all servers are that bad..anyways)
a pirate System ( open sea pvp).
Stealing.
There are other "clues" that this game was meant to allow the worst in people to play this game. So, not that i'm against the OP and I can only sympathize with you but unfortunately in your case, the best way to deal with players in this game is either retaliation or ignore the player and log off. Eventually he'll leave you and your family alone (Which I would not do. Those players deserve to be punished). You could also try reasoning with the player and find a reason for their behavior and resolve the problem diplomatically. Maybe even create an alliance with other players in that way.
Regardless if the TOA or EULA.. states that he can pursue legal actions for someone interfering with his enjoyment of the game by exploiting a feature in the game. That's going a little too far. It's unnecessary. If anything the player/s that does this action should be the one being sought after legally. He is the one that is griefing you.
Like I said, I think Archeage just isn't the game for them.
...I guess you are a type of person that will repeat this mantra until the game lose all the players and the game is shut down.
You are missing the point here.
No I get the point, I think you guys are making a mountain out of a molehill.
If someone is going to quit because they couldn't plant half their crops for 15 minutes because a couple people wanted to be trolls and they couldn't deal with them effectively, they're going to quit for any number of legitimate gameplay reasons (like a gang of pirates stealing your fishing boat and all the fish you spent hours fishing up).
I'm being sincere here and I don't have anything against people that would have a serious issue with what happened in the OP. I just really don't think even the legitimate gameplay aspects of Archeage would suit such a person.
Bottomline: if you don't want people having the ability to interfere with your gameplay, Archeage isn't the game for you.
EXCEPT FOR ONE ISSUE:
THE OP WAS NOT HARASSED FOR FIFTEEN MINUTES. THEY WERE HARASSED FOR -SIX- HOURS.
You forget, this is a HUMAN being. A HUMAN BEING. A LIVING PERSON. If this happened to me, in reality, I would be burying you in my back yard. A game mechanic is NO excuse to treat players this way. I disdain this just as much as I disdain the Eve player that took a Marine to a near-psychotic break.
Screw anyone and EVERYONE who believes they have the right to treat people shit over the internet because of of anonymity. If you are brave enough to give me your full contact information AND continue to act like that, we'll see what happens.
Yeah and for someone to devote all their game-time to trolling these 2 for 6 hours, they must've been paying them off bigtime in tears.
Also, the OP apparently used no method available to fight this behavior.
The best being "just walk away".
But if you want to fight them, like I said you can pull a cart with a harpoon clipper. You can check an option to auto-decline invites so you don't get spammed with them.
Engaging with trolls is generally a bad idea, though, because it just feeds the drama they're looking for. If the OP would've just left for 10 minutes and did something else, these trolls would've found something else to do.
Like I said, I think Archeage just isn't the game for them.
...I guess you are a type of person that will repeat this mantra until the game lose all the players and the game is shut down.
You are missing the point here.
No I get the point, I think you guys are making a mountain out of a molehill.
If someone is going to quit because they couldn't plant half their crops for 15 minutes because a couple people wanted to be trolls and they couldn't deal with them effectively, they're going to quit for any number of legitimate gameplay reasons (like a gang of pirates stealing your fishing boat and all the fish you spent hours fishing up).
I'm being sincere here and I don't have anything against people that would have a serious issue with what happened in the OP. I just really don't think even the legitimate gameplay aspects of Archeage would suit such a person.
Bottomline: if you don't want people having the ability to interfere with your gameplay, Archeage isn't the game for you.
EXCEPT FOR ONE ISSUE:
THE OP WAS NOT HARASSED FOR FIFTEEN MINUTES. THEY WERE HARASSED FOR -SIX- HOURS.
You forget, this is a HUMAN being. A HUMAN BEING. A LIVING PERSON. If this happened to me, in reality, I would be burying you in my back yard. A game mechanic is NO excuse to treat players this way. I disdain this just as much as I disdain the Eve player that took a Marine to a near-psychotic break.
Screw anyone and EVERYONE who believes they have the right to treat people shit over the internet because of of anonymity. If you are brave enough to give me your full contact information AND continue to act like that, we'll see what happens.
Yeah and for someone to devote all their game-time to trolling these 2 for 6 hours, they must've been paying them off bigtime in tears.
Also, the OP apparently used no method available to fight this behavior.
The best being "just walk away".
But if you want to fight them, like I said you can pull a cart with a harpoon clipper. You can check to auto-decline invites so you don't get spammed with them.
What bothers me most is the way the GM responds,it sounds like an outside source and not someone directly working for Trion.
You can NEVER deal with GM`s that use que card responses,they most likely know nothing of the game and just look at their que card for ways to respond.
I had harassment once during my FFXI days and it was dealt with ,although i also waited a long time,perhaps an hour.I have actually never seen a EULA that does not state you cannot harass other players ,however in a pvp game that is sort of the lame goal to harass others.
NO phone support,lol obviously not Trion so good luck playing a game run so poorly.
Really too bad,so many want or wanted to like this game but i have seen nothing but negativity caused solely by the way Trion has handled this game.
Bottom line is players should ALWAYS feel happy and comfortable playing a video game,it should NEVER come down to calling a GM.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
So sad that Trion, once known for their superb public relations and customer service, has become just like any other faceless corporation out there.
Totally agree with this was gonna check out the Rift expansion coming and probably still will because I'm that bored, but this definitely is not the level of customer service I expected out of somebody like Trion. Who do they think they are, Nexon?
This game has been a cash grab from day 1, i dont know why anyone would be shocked by the GM's lack of support. They know what they are doing, they are just sucking as much money out of people as they can before this turd implodes on itself. I know from day one what trion was up too with their 150 dollar founder packs to beta and alpha test this turd.
Trion doesnt care about you and your familys ingame hardships all they care about is you ponying up money to buy more labor potions and cosmetic junk with their ingame store
Gotta love how some fanatics of this game defend the unacceptable... at least it took 15 posts before the first virtual tough guy showed up, that's not so bad for these forums.
Originally posted by Kyleran
2nd, one of the best ways to solve this sort of problem is to ignore, go off and leave for a bit, do something else, usually the other people will tire of the action if they know it really doesn't provoke a response.
That won't remove the cart and other crap the douchebags dropped on their farms. That's the main problem I see here, the land owner should be able to control ANYTHING dropped on HIS land, including removing, destroying or even picking up items others have dropped and make them his own.
The problem here is both a CS problem (that GM should definitely have done something) and also a problem of poor design and programming. The whole property system is poorly designed anyway.
Not sure what you are implying, I just asked the OP to show where these actions actually violated the TOS, I couldn't really locate it in the documentation I read through. If its not covered in there, the customer service team can't do much for it, except perhaps escalation.
I realize most players today have not played many MMORPG's where griefing is acceptable, in earlier times this was quite common and even today EVE which I play extensively is rife with it.
As such, there's some very important ground rules in EVE that apply well here.
Don't draw attention to yourself. Stay under the radar of the griefers, don't talk in local chats, don't react to harassment attempts, ignore their actions, don't react, never whine, never respond. Move away from the point of harassment and do something else until they tire of the game and move to another victim.
BTW carts and vehicles are expensive, even griefers won't have an unlimited supply, eventually they'll pick them up to drop on someone else's property.
BTW, the griefers may be doing this to try and drive the OP and his family off their land so the griefers can claim it, if so, this is actually a form of emergent game play and likely the only way you can try to force someone off land in the safe zones, and might actually be a supported mechanic by XLGames.
Amusing how to answer this, I only have to quote myself:
Originally posted by Jean-Luc_Picard
Gotta love how some fanatics of this game defend the unacceptable... at least it took 15 posts before the first virtual tough guy showed up, that's not so bad for these forums.
There's no griefing when the victim can fight back. You can't remove the carts on your land. You are SCREWED, you can do NOTHING. Nobody gives a shit about your price or supply arguments, the damage is done.
Of course the griefers are trying to get the land. And it would be ok in such a game if the victims could fight back. But they can't in this specific situations. That's just wrong.
And if "emergent gameplay" means "griefing and reaping other players of their progressions without them being able to fight back", then if you don't know what's wrong with that, you're part of the problem why there aren't more sandbox MMORPGs on the market right now.
First off, I'm pretty sure you can spawn a harpoon clipper and pull a cart off the land.
Secondly, and more importantly, this progression you're talking about. You mean the 10 copper they were out in the amount of time they couldn't plant 5 crops?
Where do you draw the line. How about if someone stands in your way and prevents you from moving in a straight line. How much is that "progression" worth, if time is money and it took some time to move around him?
See, I draw the line at "is it a big deal". Sorry but this isn't a big deal, and the OP made it more so by staying there FOR 6 HOURS while these guys were trolling them.
There is a very good reason why MMOs don't use player collisions in places where you can't attack people. This was a problem that I remember from the early days of EQ. Honest to God, sometimes it seems as if the Archeage designers were determined to ignore everything that we know about MMO player behavior. From rewarding AFK behavior (and being surprised that people gamed the system) to setting up an unlimited land rush at launch (with utterly predictable results) to nurturing and encouraging risk-free griefing, they could have made simple choices that avoided huge problems. In football terms, there are multiple own goals here.
The potential to grief is part of the appeal of sandbox games. Yeah it's annoying when it happens, but that annoyance is part of the fun!
Honestly, what people are doing here is not game breaking. It would take like 10 people devoting their time to standing on your land to completely eliminate your chance to plant. If they want to that bad, well, you must've really pissed them off somehow.
It's appealing to sociopath behavior.
It's appealing to me and I don't grief. Farming and trade runs are pretty boring. It's fun to me when someone mixes it up by trying to mess with you.
Keep in mind this is not game-breaking stuff here. OP had some trouble planting some things which would've given a small profit, I wasted about 10 minutes chasing down the guy that stole my farm cart.
It's minor inconvenience for the sake of freedom and spontanious player interaction.
I'd argue it is for the OP.
It certainly does seem that way, doesn't it?
Well if being unable to plant a few crops for a short amount of time is a dreadful as they make it out to be in the OP, then yeah it could very well be game breaking for them. But honestly I doubt Archeage is the game for them anyway, if they are in fact sincerely as they portray themselves.
I'm guessing they attracted the wrath of these trolls with their victim attitude.
It's a PVP focused game. If all they want to do is plant crops in peace or work a market they'd be better off playing Sims, Second Life or Farmville.
I'm pretty sure you don't play Archeage, so let me explain that this doesn't happen very often and for good reason- a player would have to devote all of his play time to standing in one spot to block a person from planting, and they could only block that small portion of the land they're standing on.
I can't play. They have yet to fix a launch bug for me.
But these sort of things usually start off by affecting a small portion and then everyone realizes they can do it to other people and it typically spreads like wildfire.
Bummer about being unable to play.
People are still unlikely to do it though, just because of the minimal amount of grief it causes (unless you're the OP I guess) and the amount of effort it requires (all of your playtime).
Keep in mind it would take like 10 people to completely block an 8x8, and maybe 50 to block a 16x16.
What more likely happened is a few trolls picked up that these guys acted like victims, so they spawned a couple of carts on their land and stood on them for a few minutes to get a rise out of them. And they succeeded, obviously.
But if you can't deal with that kind of trolling, how are you going to deal with a pirate killing you and stealing the trade pack you spent 30 minutes hauling across the ocean?
Like I said, I think Archeage just isn't the game for them.
Totally. And judging from their tech support it doesn't seem I will ever be able to at this point.
Originally posted by holdenhamletOriginally posted by Gdemami Originally posted by holdenhamletBottomline: if you don't want people having the ability to interfere with your gameplay, Archeage isn't the game for you.
...yep, you obviously do not get the point What is the point then enlighten me.
Despite how much I dislike the term "niche"...
EVE is a niche game. The design of the game is vastly different, setting it apart from mainstream titles - it is a niche game. However, it still has got substantial and long growing player base and telling their customers "EVE Online isn't the game for you" isn't how they achieved their success.
The game was evolving, constantly changing and adapting to persuade more and more customers that the game IS for them!
Games with low population are not niche, they are failed games and telling the customers "It isn't the game for you" is most secure and fasted way how to lose your players.
Now to your bottom line. How many more people do you think the the game gain with allowance of griefing?
Wouldn't be much smarter for the business to step in and think over what is allowed and accepted behavior? Wouldn't be much smarter for the business to make as many people comfortable playing the game as you can?
Isn't you way of thinking actually going the opposite direction?
Now back to EVE Online briefly, the game was going through the same issues long, long ago and devs were smart. They continuously tweaked the rules and mechanics, developed new content, all to provide enough room for largest playerbase possible. And it worked out truly well.
That is the point that decides whether the game will follow the direction of EVE Online or the way of games like Darkfall...the ways of dodo.
After reading everyone's comment and seriously considering the contrast between reality and this game and the OP's problem, my conclusion is that his game was created forGriefers.
I know! No surprise.
This game gives everyone the freedom to be what they want to be and do what they want to do. That WILL come with it's consequences. Every sandbox, I can recall, has some form of douchebaggery. Guess what? That's apparently ok because in the real world, it's the same way.
I mean, if you think about it, AA has
a jail system ( first major clue).
(side note, if you play AA and look at the Trial chat.. people WANT to go to jail. They'll insult the jury just to guarantee their guilty verdict. Hopefully not all servers are that bad..anyways)
a pirate System ( open sea pvp).
Stealing.
There are other "clues" that this game was meant to allow the worst in people to play this game. So, not that i'm against the OP and I can only sympathize with you but unfortunately in your case, the best way to deal with players in this game is either retaliation or ignore the player and log off. Eventually he'll leave you and your family alone (Which I would not do. Those players deserve to be punished). You could also try reasoning with the player and find a reason for their behavior and resolve the problem diplomatically. Maybe even create an alliance with other players in that way.
Regardless if the TOA or EULA.. states that he can pursue legal actions for someone interfering with his enjoyment of the game by exploiting a feature in the game. That's going a little too far. It's unnecessary. If anything the player/s that does this action should be the one being sought after legally. He is the one that is griefing you.
...my 2 cents
It's similar to what happened with Rust. Griefing (and the allowing of it) literally killed servers. FacePunch tried to implement patches to fix it, but in the end the only solution was an active GM to undo it. Even then it was an uphill battle.
Comments
It certainly does seem that way, doesn't it?
Well if being unable to plant a few crops for a short amount of time is a dreadful as they make it out to be in the OP, then yeah it could very well be game breaking for them. But honestly I doubt Archeage is the game for them anyway, if they are in fact sincerely as they portray themselves.
I'm guessing they attracted the wrath of these trolls with their victim attitude.
It's a PVP focused game. If all they want to do is plant crops in peace or work a market they'd be better off playing Sims, Second Life or Farmville.
I'm pretty sure you don't play Archeage, so let me explain that this doesn't happen very often and for good reason- a player would have to devote all of his play time to standing in one spot to block a person from planting, and they could only block that small portion of the land they're standing on.
I can't play. They have yet to fix a launch bug for me.
But these sort of things usually start off by affecting a small portion and then everyone realizes they can do it to other people and it typically spreads like wildfire.
I have yet to find even a single gaming company that provides 100% good service. why would Trion break the trend?
But I think they are all trying and the best way to keep them trying is to keep complaining when something is wrong.
I read the OP, and a few pages of replies, and wanted to throw my opinion in there as well.
To the OP. Man, I totally feel your pain. I think you did everything right, and I commend you for not screaming at the GM and tearing him up, as he definitely deserved it. I'm sure all the liberals will say "no, he was just doing his job. There was nothing he could do. He apologized. etc." Read it again. The guy blatantly refuses to get on a personal level with the OP, and just keeps acting like a freaking robot. This is a major problem with our society today. Nobody thinks for theirselves and just follows rules and procedures for everything.
Having said that, I was a Guide (volunteer helper - not a GM, but we had MANY powerful ingame powers) in Everquest for a short while (I didn't care much for it) when that game was rocking over a decade ago. If I had received your ticket and could actually witness it firsthand what they were doing to not one, but multiple people, it would have been a bad day for those players!
Against the EULA or not. The bottom line is something they were doing was preventing you and your family from being able to play the game....period. There is no arguing with that. Whether breaking rules or not, the GM should have stepped in and at the very least had a conversation with the guilty party and "asked" them to stop.
I hope everything works out for ya OP.
Bummer about being unable to play.
People are still unlikely to do it though, just because of the minimal amount of grief it causes (unless you're the OP I guess) and the amount of effort it requires (all of your playtime).
Keep in mind it would take like 10 people to completely block an 8x8, and maybe 50 to block a 16x16.
What more likely happened is a few trolls picked up that these guys acted like victims, so they spawned a couple of carts on their land and stood on them for a few minutes to get a rise out of them. And they succeeded, obviously.
But if you can't deal with that kind of trolling, how are you going to deal with a pirate killing you and stealing the trade pack you spent 30 minutes hauling across the ocean?
Like I said, I think Archeage just isn't the game for them.
...I guess you are a type of person that will repeat this mantra until the game lose all the players and the game is shut down.
You are missing the point here.
No but once the griefers become bored with blocking gardening they will look for more insidious ways to harass players. EVE experienced this and finally had to step in to stop it. Given that CCP decided to act, and given that they have fostered the idea of anarchy as a cute pet, the only explanation for intervening is their legal responsibility for managing and supervising the real estate upon which the offenses occurred--and were sanctioned.
This is one of the reasons we built our farms in the pvp zone....Ironically, you don't see this that much there and if you do then you have plenty of recourse.
In safe zones it's pretty easy to use the mechanics of 'can't attack' to grief....and why many MMOs don't allow character collision.
I do have a small 8x8 in a safe zone and am always getting ran over by farm carts and donkeys while trying to plant. While annoying is not game breaking. I have yet to be ran over by a farm cart in the pvp zone.
Griefers usually only grief if they can do so in a safe way....it's why one of the most dangerous areas is right around the gold traders with their guards.
Palazious <The Vindicators> Darkfall
Palazious r40, rr45 SW War
Palazious 50 Pirate PoTBS
Palazious 35 Sorcerer Vanguard
Palazious 75 wizard EQ
Paladori 50 Champion LOTRO
Poppa Reaver bugged at rank15
No I get the point, I think you guys are making a mountain out of a molehill.
If someone is going to quit because they couldn't plant half their crops for 15 minutes because a couple people wanted to be trolls and they couldn't deal with them effectively, they're going to quit for any number of legitimate gameplay reasons (like a gang of pirates stealing your fishing boat and all the fish you spent hours fishing up).
I'm being sincere here and I don't have anything against people that would have a serious issue with what happened in the OP. I just really don't think even the legitimate gameplay aspects of Archeage would suit such a person.
Bottomline: if you don't want people having the ability to interfere with your gameplay, Archeage isn't the game for you.
...yep, you obviously do not get the point
EXCEPT FOR ONE ISSUE:
THE OP WAS NOT HARASSED FOR FIFTEEN MINUTES. THEY WERE HARASSED FOR -SIX- HOURS.
You forget, this is a HUMAN being. A HUMAN BEING. A LIVING PERSON. If this happened to me, in reality, I would be burying you in my back yard. A game mechanic is NO excuse to treat players this way. I disdain this just as much as I disdain the Eve player that took a Marine to a near-psychotic break.
Screw anyone and EVERYONE who believes they have the right to treat people like shit over the internet because of of anonymity. If you are brave enough to give me your full contact information AND continue to act like that, we'll see what happens.
RAWR
What is the point then enlighten me.
After reading everyone's comment and seriously considering the contrast between reality and this game and the OP's problem, my conclusion is that his game was created for Griefers.
I know! No surprise.
This game gives everyone the freedom to be what they want to be and do what they want to do. That WILL come with it's consequences. Every sandbox, I can recall, has some form of douchebaggery. Guess what? That's apparently ok because in the real world, it's the same way.
I mean, if you think about it, AA has
a jail system ( first major clue).
(side note, if you play AA and look at the Trial chat.. people WANT to go to jail. They'll insult the jury just to guarantee their guilty verdict. Hopefully not all servers are that bad..anyways)
a pirate System ( open sea pvp).
Stealing.
There are other "clues" that this game was meant to allow the worst in people to play this game. So, not that i'm against the OP and I can only sympathize with you but unfortunately in your case, the best way to deal with players in this game is either retaliation or ignore the player and log off. Eventually he'll leave you and your family alone (Which I would not do. Those players deserve to be punished). You could also try reasoning with the player and find a reason for their behavior and resolve the problem diplomatically. Maybe even create an alliance with other players in that way.
Regardless if the TOA or EULA.. states that he can pursue legal actions for someone interfering with his enjoyment of the game by exploiting a feature in the game. That's going a little too far. It's unnecessary. If anything the player/s that does this action should be the one being sought after legally. He is the one that is griefing you.
...my 2 cents
Yeah and for someone to devote all their game-time to trolling these 2 for 6 hours, they must've been paying them off bigtime in tears.
Also, the OP apparently used no method available to fight this behavior.
The best being "just walk away".
But if you want to fight them, like I said you can pull a cart with a harpoon clipper. You can check an option to auto-decline invites so you don't get spammed with them.
Engaging with trolls is generally a bad idea, though, because it just feeds the drama they're looking for. If the OP would've just left for 10 minutes and did something else, these trolls would've found something else to do.
Pathetic humans will stay pathetic.
RAWR
What bothers me most is the way the GM responds,it sounds like an outside source and not someone directly working for Trion.
You can NEVER deal with GM`s that use que card responses,they most likely know nothing of the game and just look at their que card for ways to respond.
I had harassment once during my FFXI days and it was dealt with ,although i also waited a long time,perhaps an hour.I have actually never seen a EULA that does not state you cannot harass other players ,however in a pvp game that is sort of the lame goal to harass others.
NO phone support,lol obviously not Trion so good luck playing a game run so poorly.
Really too bad,so many want or wanted to like this game but i have seen nothing but negativity caused solely by the way Trion has handled this game.
Bottom line is players should ALWAYS feel happy and comfortable playing a video game,it should NEVER come down to calling a GM.
Never forget 3 mile Island and never trust a government official or company spokesman.
Totally agree with this was gonna check out the Rift expansion coming and probably still will because I'm that bored, but this definitely is not the level of customer service I expected out of somebody like Trion. Who do they think they are, Nexon?
This game has been a cash grab from day 1, i dont know why anyone would be shocked by the GM's lack of support. They know what they are doing, they are just sucking as much money out of people as they can before this turd implodes on itself. I know from day one what trion was up too with their 150 dollar founder packs to beta and alpha test this turd.
Trion doesnt care about you and your familys ingame hardships all they care about is you ponying up money to buy more labor potions and cosmetic junk with their ingame store
Aloha Mr Hand !
Let this be a lesson to you.
If you talk a ton of shit because you think you are secure in the safe zones and nobody can effect you, you're wrong.
First off, I'm pretty sure you can spawn a harpoon clipper and pull a cart off the land.
Secondly, and more importantly, this progression you're talking about. You mean the 10 copper they were out in the amount of time they couldn't plant 5 crops?
Where do you draw the line. How about if someone stands in your way and prevents you from moving in a straight line. How much is that "progression" worth, if time is money and it took some time to move around him?
See, I draw the line at "is it a big deal". Sorry but this isn't a big deal, and the OP made it more so by staying there FOR 6 HOURS while these guys were trolling them.
Totally. And judging from their tech support it doesn't seem I will ever be able to at this point.
What is the point then enlighten me.
Despite how much I dislike the term "niche"...
EVE is a niche game. The design of the game is vastly different, setting it apart from mainstream titles - it is a niche game. However, it still has got substantial and long growing player base and telling their customers "EVE Online isn't the game for you" isn't how they achieved their success.
The game was evolving, constantly changing and adapting to persuade more and more customers that the game IS for them!
Games with low population are not niche, they are failed games and telling the customers "It isn't the game for you" is most secure and fasted way how to lose your players.
Now to your bottom line. How many more people do you think the the game gain with allowance of griefing?
Wouldn't be much smarter for the business to step in and think over what is allowed and accepted behavior?
Wouldn't be much smarter for the business to make as many people comfortable playing the game as you can?
Isn't you way of thinking actually going the opposite direction?
Now back to EVE Online briefly, the game was going through the same issues long, long ago and devs were smart. They continuously tweaked the rules and mechanics, developed new content, all to provide enough room for largest playerbase possible. And it worked out truly well.
That is the point that decides whether the game will follow the direction of EVE Online or the way of games like Darkfall...the ways of dodo.
It's similar to what happened with Rust. Griefing (and the allowing of it) literally killed servers. FacePunch tried to implement patches to fix it, but in the end the only solution was an active GM to undo it. Even then it was an uphill battle.