Obviously, if you were willing to cancel you couldn't have been having much fun anyway. The game isn't any less fun since they announced it.
This is like getting rid of your car because Ford announced they're gonna start selling it cheaper in a couple months or changing the name.
No its more like Ford announced that you can still drive your car but to play your radio you will need to give them a 1 time fee of 10 bucks. Cruse control, ya your car has it but again that will cost you a 1 time fee. At this point, people are waiting to see what kind of cash shop they will be getting. Full access with fluffy junk or will they lose features just to be micro dinged.
Obviously, if you were willing to cancel you couldn't have been having much fun anyway. The game isn't any less fun since they announced it.
This is like getting rid of your car because Ford announced they're gonna start selling it cheaper in a couple months or changing the name.
Well, there is a sort of "I'm taking my toys and going home" mentality to a lot of these things.
"I haven't gotten my way" or "I feel the rug has been pulled out from under me and I'm subjected to something I don't want/like so I'm leaving".
Sometimes it's just drama. But, sometimes one really can say "this is not what I signed up for and I will vote with my wallet/spend my time doing something that I DO want".
In truth, sub doesn't make for a better community though it might weed out people who are not entirely serious about the game. The thought being that no one who is not serious is going to continually throw away money each week. that's the idea anyway.
In truth, having a toxic community or not falls a lot on the game company and their moderators. Blizzard seemingly can afford moderators to clean up the chat channels but they don't.
If a free to play game had a lot of money from "the whales" along with those who chip in now and again then they could also seemingly clean up chat.
Since the game is buy to play (or sub) there isn't going to be that much of a f2p revolving door, I have 13 accounts because I keep forgetting my login details" sort of thing or gold sellers will have to buy (or steal if they can) accounts in order to ply their trade.
Though I'm a firm believe in the pay to play design I don't see things really going badly in any additional ways.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Obviously, if you were willing to cancel you couldn't have been having much fun anyway. The game isn't any less fun since they announced it.
This is like getting rid of your car because Ford announced they're gonna start selling it cheaper in a couple months or changing the name.
What part of "there are things that companies do that I object to on principle and won't support" is difficult to understand?
While I agree with the sentiment, we need to accept that this is a scenario in which we have no voice. Nobody is going to care if even 100% of PC players drop their sub. We are a drop in the bucket compared to the incoming console crowd. With that in mind I am going to keep subbing - there is nobody that would get the message I would be trying to send, and I would really like to keep playing.
Those things said if you get a 60 day card right now it will last you just over the transition, giving you the promised crowns. I got mine via g2a for like $22.
It shows what PvP games are really all about, and no, it's not about more realism and immersion. It's about cowards hiding behind a screen to they can bully other defenseless players without any risk of direct retaliation like there would be if they acted like asshats in "real life". -Jean-Luc_Picard
Life itself is a game. So why shouldn't your game be ruined? - justmemyselfandi
AVA has continuing major technical issues.No new features have been added in over 6 months and none are scheduled for the foreseeable future.
WHY should I pay for a game that promised a robust AVA experience then reneged on that promise and pushed group pve and console development.
If you joined for the PvP then you really may as well cancel until it goes B2P at least. ZOS did say they had several performance improvements for AVA in the 1.6 patch, but you'll have to wait until the patch notes come out to see if there is anything else.
That said, I am not sure there really is a game outside of EvE that suits the dedicated PvPer (and EvE doesn't support balanced PvP ofc). I tried focusing on pvp in a few other games - WoW, WAR, Rift, GW2 - and it always seems like the devs cannot get a good grasp of how their games are being played. I do not have any solutions mind you, just noting that issues with severe lack of pvp updates and content or bad balance updates to pvp is a pretty consistent theme among MMORPGs.
What I am trying to say, and I do not mean this to be rude, is that I am not sure there is actually anything better. I am focusing less and less on PvP these days, because when I did try to focus on it the game devs for whatever game I was playing just pissed me off.
Afreakin'men. I'm considering subbing up now because I heard that patch 1.6 was going to be in at around the end of january, where is it? I'm not resubbing NOW if it's going to take it another month or three.
regardless as far as ESO goes....if your having fun why would cancel your sub?, and if you aren't by all means do so.
I think people are considering cancelling to show their disapproval to ZOS, as they feel like they are not being heard. That said, I am not sure this will help them be heard, as it is clear that ESO is focusing hard on consoles and the upcoming payday on the console release.
I have cancelled on games to show my disapproval before, but the only game I can remember this having any effect on was EvE. CCP was turning development time towards Walking in Stations and other immersion focused features, but the players wanted PvP to be the focus. The players held a very effective protest and the devs changed their minds.
As good as ZOS has been at listening to their players up until this decision, I do not think this is something that any protest can change. I also do not think that even if all the PC players dropped their sub they would be too concerned. The console release is the real cash cow.
If the game was only worth paying $15/month so that you could feel "holier than thou" for only playing subscription games, then I find that an odd reason to play any game.
If you want to pay, they will be offering you the option to do so, so you can still feel superior to the Buy to Play "scrubs". (BTW, kudos that it is B2P, not F2P, some barrier to entry IS better than none when it comes to community).
As far as the Cash Shop, they can be benevolent or malevolent. Whether or not one likes TERA Rising, they did it right. No power to be bought there, just cosmetics and convenience. That kind of cash shop should mean nothing to a subscription player that hates cash shops. The further from a truly benevolent model the store strays, the more justifiable the ire of a subscriber will be over the change in business model.
Until we know what the cash shop will look like, only those who need to pay for a Subscription only game in order to feel "superior" are effected by the announcement. All other current players just need to keep their finger's crossed for a benevolent cash shop and a commitment to maintain Buy to Play vs. F2P.
For those who passed on the game while it was subscription based, knowing this day would come, the nature of the cash shop will determine whether the game is worth revisiting or not. For both "classes" of customers, rational, informed decisions can't be made until those details are known and commitments over "lines that will not be crossed" are made by the developers.
You do realize that the small amount of income from the sub option is what will keep the servers on, right?
Profits from cash shops will not go into growing the game.
It's not about being superior, it's about being sick and tired of supporting deadbeats and cheapskates. Also, it's not fun to play with F2P players. They are always undergeared. Nobody wants to spend time or resources helping them because as soon as they hit they pay wall, they leave for another host to leech off of.
So ESO has the same model as GW2. How well is that game doing these days?
I've always spent more per month on cash shop games I enjoy than $15, so who is the cheapskate? That some people pay less or nothing at all has never bothered me, because it's always more fun to play a well populated game than a ghost land.
I do greatly prefer Buy to Play, because the initial cost of entry prevents a lot of issues seen with pure F2P games, but once someone buys the box, I could care less how much they do or don't pay.
Most cash shop games make more per player hour than subscription games, which is a big reason so many publisher are moving to that business model. The entire "cheapskate/freeloader" argument has always been a false one perpetuated by those who find some sense of entitlement from being a subscriber.
The "under-geared" argument makes zero sense, as long as the game is B2P and the cash shop is NOT Pay to Win. I've known people who have spent way too much money on the GW2 cash shop who have been under-geared, while looking good doing it. I've also known people with maxed out gear and legendary weapons who profess to have spent next to nothing on the cash shop.
The argument gains more ground if the game is F2P, but usually because of the impact on all the free farming bots on the gear curve. When you look at legit players in a game with no Pay to WIn options, gear has always been related to time and effort, not how much the player drops on the cash shop.
As to GW2, the business model still makes them a lot of money, I've seen estimates of an average of $22/month/ActivePlayer. The game's population drop has nothing to do with the business model and everything to do with horrible post launch game direction and development. The game is much better off than it would have been as a sub game and could easily be a solid expansion away from a modest rebound.
I mean do you pick a game to play or one to whine about and spread drama?
If you are playing ESO right now, that means you either enjoy it enough to pay a sub, or you are in your first free month after purchase. When it goes B2P, just keep paying the sub. Nothing changes for you. You get more XP, gold and influence along with faster research. Problem?
And don't even start the "yeah Another fanboi yada yada" because I am certinly not 100% satisifed with the game, but enough to pay for it.
Every mmo dies, eventually. Enjoy them while they last or spend the majority of it's time wearing a tinfoil hat.
Exactly. I am currently enjoying the game and will wait and see how the new system impacts my game-play and financial considerations.
From what I have read I may even save money by cancelling my regular sub and just paying for things that will improve my own enjoyment of the game. If its anything like GW2's model I will be very happy. Since that games release I have only paid minimally out of pocket to upgrade my bank and purchase some keys.
When ESO did not meet my expectations upon release I chose to not play but I kept an open mind and waited to see improvements that met my gaming needs.
After a few months of beta I honestly did not anticipate ever buying ESO. My past experiences with AO, Shadowbane, and Vanguard, to name a few challenging releases, made me very skeptical that Zenimax would be able or willing to make the changes that I personally wanted to see.
I am not one to commiserate about bad gaming experiences. I would much rather hope that a developer makes or improves upon a game so I can enjoy it rather than expound upon their failings or wish their demise. More so, I never begrudge anyone else's enjoyment. We all have our own gaming dynamics and expectations.
In ESO I have found a game that I am currently enjoying and a developer that seems genuinely motivated to improve upon their game in very material ways. I personally give Zenimax a lot of credit for all the positive changes they have made in a very short time and for providing me some great entertainment. Until this changes they can expect my sub or cash shop purchases.
Del Cabon A US Army ('Just Cause') Vet and MMORPG Native formerly of Trinsic, Norath and Dereth. Currently playing LOTRO.
Comments
No its more like Ford announced that you can still drive your car but to play your radio you will need to give them a 1 time fee of 10 bucks. Cruse control, ya your car has it but again that will cost you a 1 time fee. At this point, people are waiting to see what kind of cash shop they will be getting. Full access with fluffy junk or will they lose features just to be micro dinged.
Well, there is a sort of "I'm taking my toys and going home" mentality to a lot of these things.
"I haven't gotten my way" or "I feel the rug has been pulled out from under me and I'm subjected to something I don't want/like so I'm leaving".
Sometimes it's just drama. But, sometimes one really can say "this is not what I signed up for and I will vote with my wallet/spend my time doing something that I DO want".
In truth, sub doesn't make for a better community though it might weed out people who are not entirely serious about the game. The thought being that no one who is not serious is going to continually throw away money each week. that's the idea anyway.
In truth, having a toxic community or not falls a lot on the game company and their moderators. Blizzard seemingly can afford moderators to clean up the chat channels but they don't.
If a free to play game had a lot of money from "the whales" along with those who chip in now and again then they could also seemingly clean up chat.
Since the game is buy to play (or sub) there isn't going to be that much of a f2p revolving door, I have 13 accounts because I keep forgetting my login details" sort of thing or gold sellers will have to buy (or steal if they can) accounts in order to ply their trade.
Though I'm a firm believe in the pay to play design I don't see things really going badly in any additional ways.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Where exactly did you pull your numbers from?
Because according to this its not even in the top 10 for 2014 and number ten pulled in 114 million...
http://venturebeat.com/2014/10/23/the-10-highest-grossing-online-pc-games-in-2014-hearthstone-dota-2-cant-compete-with-league-of-legends/
And if you their quarterly reports in q4 13GW2 only made 32 million, so in the other 3 quarters you want us to believe they made almost 270 Million?
http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2014-02-14-guild-wars-2-in-steep-decline-in-weak-q4-for-ncsoft
What part of "there are things that companies do that I object to on principle and won't support" is difficult to understand?
While I agree with the sentiment, we need to accept that this is a scenario in which we have no voice. Nobody is going to care if even 100% of PC players drop their sub. We are a drop in the bucket compared to the incoming console crowd. With that in mind I am going to keep subbing - there is nobody that would get the message I would be trying to send, and I would really like to keep playing.
Those things said if you get a 60 day card right now it will last you just over the transition, giving you the promised crowns. I got mine via g2a for like $22.
Hmm.. Think I confused it with another MMO.
My bad.
It did well in 2013 though; well over 200 million. It sold 3.5Mllion by Aug/2013.
http://www.vg247.com/2013/08/28/guild-wars-2-turns-one-has-shifted-3-5-million-copies/
It shows what PvP games are really all about, and no, it's not about more realism and immersion. It's about cowards hiding behind a screen to they can bully other defenseless players without any risk of direct retaliation like there would be if they acted like asshats in "real life". -Jean-Luc_Picard
Life itself is a game. So why shouldn't your game be ruined? - justmemyselfandi
Oh I'm not saying its doing bad, the numbers looked high so I just checked for myself and thought Id share.
I'm cancelling my subscription....again.
AVA has continuing major technical issues.No new features have been added in over 6 months and none are scheduled for the foreseeable future.
WHY should I pay for a game that promised a robust AVA experience then reneged on that promise and pushed group pve and console development.
If you joined for the PvP then you really may as well cancel until it goes B2P at least. ZOS did say they had several performance improvements for AVA in the 1.6 patch, but you'll have to wait until the patch notes come out to see if there is anything else.
That said, I am not sure there really is a game outside of EvE that suits the dedicated PvPer (and EvE doesn't support balanced PvP ofc). I tried focusing on pvp in a few other games - WoW, WAR, Rift, GW2 - and it always seems like the devs cannot get a good grasp of how their games are being played. I do not have any solutions mind you, just noting that issues with severe lack of pvp updates and content or bad balance updates to pvp is a pretty consistent theme among MMORPGs.
What I am trying to say, and I do not mean this to be rude, is that I am not sure there is actually anything better. I am focusing less and less on PvP these days, because when I did try to focus on it the game devs for whatever game I was playing just pissed me off.
Afreakin'men. I'm considering subbing up now because I heard that patch 1.6 was going to be in at around the end of january, where is it? I'm not resubbing NOW if it's going to take it another month or three.
you both realize that nc soft publishes there financial reports to the public right. http://global.ncsoft.com/global/ir/quarterly.aspx
no need to make up numbers or use secondary sites
regardless as far as ESO goes....if your having fun why would cancel your sub?, and if you aren't by all means do so.
I think people are considering cancelling to show their disapproval to ZOS, as they feel like they are not being heard. That said, I am not sure this will help them be heard, as it is clear that ESO is focusing hard on consoles and the upcoming payday on the console release.
I have cancelled on games to show my disapproval before, but the only game I can remember this having any effect on was EvE. CCP was turning development time towards Walking in Stations and other immersion focused features, but the players wanted PvP to be the focus. The players held a very effective protest and the devs changed their minds.
As good as ZOS has been at listening to their players up until this decision, I do not think this is something that any protest can change. I also do not think that even if all the PC players dropped their sub they would be too concerned. The console release is the real cash cow.
I've always spent more per month on cash shop games I enjoy than $15, so who is the cheapskate? That some people pay less or nothing at all has never bothered me, because it's always more fun to play a well populated game than a ghost land.
I do greatly prefer Buy to Play, because the initial cost of entry prevents a lot of issues seen with pure F2P games, but once someone buys the box, I could care less how much they do or don't pay.
Most cash shop games make more per player hour than subscription games, which is a big reason so many publisher are moving to that business model. The entire "cheapskate/freeloader" argument has always been a false one perpetuated by those who find some sense of entitlement from being a subscriber.
The "under-geared" argument makes zero sense, as long as the game is B2P and the cash shop is NOT Pay to Win. I've known people who have spent way too much money on the GW2 cash shop who have been under-geared, while looking good doing it. I've also known people with maxed out gear and legendary weapons who profess to have spent next to nothing on the cash shop.
The argument gains more ground if the game is F2P, but usually because of the impact on all the free farming bots on the gear curve. When you look at legit players in a game with no Pay to WIn options, gear has always been related to time and effort, not how much the player drops on the cash shop.
As to GW2, the business model still makes them a lot of money, I've seen estimates of an average of $22/month/ActivePlayer. The game's population drop has nothing to do with the business model and everything to do with horrible post launch game direction and development. The game is much better off than it would have been as a sub game and could easily be a solid expansion away from a modest rebound.
Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated
i am going to play SWTOR too.
TESO is to boring and slow. i feel tired all time playing it and probaly the day when i fall from my chair while playing isnt far...
Exactly. I am currently enjoying the game and will wait and see how the new system impacts my game-play and financial considerations.
From what I have read I may even save money by cancelling my regular sub and just paying for things that will improve my own enjoyment of the game. If its anything like GW2's model I will be very happy. Since that games release I have only paid minimally out of pocket to upgrade my bank and purchase some keys.
When ESO did not meet my expectations upon release I chose to not play but I kept an open mind and waited to see improvements that met my gaming needs.
After a few months of beta I honestly did not anticipate ever buying ESO. My past experiences with AO, Shadowbane, and Vanguard, to name a few challenging releases, made me very skeptical that Zenimax would be able or willing to make the changes that I personally wanted to see.
I am not one to commiserate about bad gaming experiences. I would much rather hope that a developer makes or improves upon a game so I can enjoy it rather than expound upon their failings or wish their demise. More so, I never begrudge anyone else's enjoyment. We all have our own gaming dynamics and expectations.
In ESO I have found a game that I am currently enjoying and a developer that seems genuinely motivated to improve upon their game in very material ways. I personally give Zenimax a lot of credit for all the positive changes they have made in a very short time and for providing me some great entertainment. Until this changes they can expect my sub or cash shop purchases.
Del Cabon
A US Army ('Just Cause') Vet and MMORPG Native formerly of Trinsic, Norath and Dereth. Currently playing LOTRO.