someone suggested blocking people, you should do that if you can. Log harassment also and report it. The more you acknowledge them, and react to their behavior the more they'll mess with you.
People love to create drama when non exists. Theres also a weird psychology that people will insult others of the opposite sex if theyre attracted to them, but know the other has zero interest in them. They want to be noticed by you, they want a reaction from you even if its negative. The easiest way to do this, is to be a complete dick to you, you notice them now. Its also a much stronger reaction then say, just doing something nice for you would have. You're pissed at certain people, you know their names, and to them since they cant have you..becoming your worst enemy is just as good. You know them very well now...even the people you say dont know you at all, you probably remember certain names if theyre complete assholes to you.
block them, all of them, ignore the new challengers completey
Those who are my friends in this group, are newish friends, and do not intervene. Mostly because they are friends with the jerks also and have probably known them longer--and would rather be neutral on it. I think they feel like I can handle myself with them. Which I do. I am not the only target they go after each other too, it's just a different type of hazing with me because I'm a girl -- and a lot of it does have a sexual undertone.
I also think they are quicker to jump on me than each other because I am an easier or more obvious target. Also, if there are multiple guys in the vent, they seem to become empowered by each other. That being said, I don't need to be defended by a dude. The vent I hang out in belongs to my friends, but it's sort of a popular vent so the dicks come in there too. I stay out of the ones belonging to the obvious problem groups, I'm not dumb. It's tiring to have to be 'on' all the time, fighting off some type of attack. Having to have some witty reply to some crap they said all the time.
Originally posted by Albatroes Obvious answer is to just say you're a dude and dont interact with anyone through voice chat etc unless its game related.
No...that's easy cop out way to do it.
"This may hurt a little, but it's something you'll get used to. Relax....."
I was going to say a bunch of stuff, but now that I think about it, I do not want to be banned again.
Originally posted by laokoko "if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".
Those who are my friends in this group, are newish friends, and do not intervene. Mostly because they are friends with the jerks also and have probably known them longer--and would rather be neutral on it. I think they feel like I can handle myself with them. Which I do. I am not the only target they go after each other too, it's just a different type of hazing with me because I'm a girl -- and a lot of it does have a sexual undertone.
I also think they are quicker to jump on me than each other because I am an easier or more obvious target. Also, if there are multiple guys in the vent, they seem to become empowered by each other. That being said, I don't need to be defended by a dude. The vent I hang out in belongs to my friends, but it's sort of a popular vent so the dicks come in there too. I stay out of the ones belonging to the obvious problem groups, I'm not dumb. It's tiring to have to be 'on' all the time, fighting off some type of attack. Having to have some witty reply to some crap they said all the time.
trying to be witty and take it all in good fun might be exacerbating the problem as well. have you ever told them, in public, to shut the fuck up?
I'm gonna be the bad guy here and ask.....How and why do you show yourself as a female game player? I mean why even make the choice? My mom has been games since forever and only has had a couple of instances where a douche even contacted her. On the other hand...my ex wife went out of her way to play the girlie game card to get flirts.
I AM NOT SAYING...you did the latter....but why associate yourself as anything but a gamer?
Again...this is from the "Devil's Advocate" angle...but I have always wondered why guys play female characters and why girls feel the need to let everyone know and then feel surprised when some douche acts like he does.
Please don't take this wrong.....I am a guy and prone to eat my foot a lot.
Probably hard to avoid the "I'm a girl" when voice chatting in vent etc....
So...the whole thing stemmed from voice chat? I didn't read it that way but maybe should have.
Originally posted by jykouras....... Obviously the second I started regularly going into vent with these people is when it changed. .....
Indeed.
Originally posted by jykouras
Those who are my friends in this group, are newish friends, and do not intervene. Mostly because they are friends with the jerks also and have probably known them longer--and would rather be neutral on it. I think they feel like I can handle myself with them. Which I do. I am not the only target they go after each other too, it's just a different type of hazing with me because I'm a girl -- and a lot of it does have a sexual undertone.
I also think they are quicker to jump on me than each other because I am an easier or more obvious target. Also, if there are multiple guys in the vent, they seem to become empowered by each other. That being said, I don't need to be defended by a dude. The vent I hang out in belongs to my friends, but it's sort of a popular vent so the dicks come in there too. I stay out of the ones belonging to the obvious problem groups, I'm not dumb. It's tiring to have to be 'on' all the time, fighting off some type of attack. Having to have some witty reply to some crap they said all the time.
It sounds like you're just the new mark and need to show your mettle and tell the drama queens off till they get bored and move on.. also if it's your friends vent there should be less issues with you being kicked etc.
Originally posted by evilized
trying to be witty and take it all in good fun might be exacerbating the problem as well. have you ever told them, in public, to shut the fuck up?
Pretty much at some point you just need to decide when enough is enough and let the chips fall where they may.
Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
Eh, those mods are the best mods I think I have ever known. But don't let that stop you!
Oh, my friend, I think this entire topic is so overblown. I have played with women/girls since the beginning of online games. This, person, is just looking for....well, yea.
Originally posted by laokoko "if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".
I didn't say you needed to be defended by a dude, haha. I said your friends should have your back if this is making you that uncomfortable. If you are saying they are just hazing you more and with sexual undertone than the other guys in the group... well yes... a lot of guys probably think they are being "cool" or are attempting to flirt with you. You could ask them to chill out on it. If they just refuse and you can't deal with it anymore, my advice would be to server change or find a new group of raiders to roll with. You can't just wish the problem away. There is no magic sentence that we can give you that will make these boys realize they are being disrespectful. However, you could try telling them that, "I want to play with you guys but sometimes when you are so mean it upsets me, can't we all just raid and get along?"
I met my wife in an MMO, and we hit it off by being decent and respectful towards one another - I know, imagine that! Then again, I am 40, we didn't meet until I was about 33, so that may or may not have had anything to do with it. I can tell you, though, that the sort of people/groups you are describing haunt all MMOs, especially once you start pushing the end-game.
I was in a couple of raiding guilds during my WoW days (which is where I met my wife also), and I learned long ago that there are some ladies out there whom are seriously good players, period. As a matter of fact, two of our regular raid group leaders were female, and one of the alternates as well; heck, my GM's girlfriend was one of the best raid healers I have ever seen.
I don't want to put too much of the onus onto you here, as I really don't know how "available" you have made yourself. It is possible the group(s) you are around are just full of idiots, in which case you should just dust them off. It is also possible there is some sort of mixed-signal thing going on, but again, I don't know you, so I don't want to point the finger at you. Back in my raiding days I, too, witnessed an extremely attractive woman in our guild who posted her photo to the guild website and was immediately beset with invites/whispers/heavy breathing, etc. So believe me, I have no illusions about the fact that most MMO players are, in fact, idiots.
If it's gotten out of hand and you want to remain with whatever game you are playing, you may indeed need to talk to a game master about possibly changing your toon name, or server, or whatever the case may be. I saw someone mention a voice filter, which is possible; you could also just abstain from talking in vent, and just using it to hear everyone else whilst typing your replies. Tell 'em you're mute or something, I dunno. At any rate, you may have simply fallen into a group of mouth-breathing losers, whom unfortunately abound in these online games. Good luck to you!
"Why would I want to loose a religion upon my people? Religions wreck from within - Empires and individuals alike! It's all the same." - God Emperor of Dune
Yeah thats the thing, I never was like "hey, im a girl". When I met this group, I met them through someone in my guild. My guild mate was helping me with something, he invited a few of his friends from this group. My guild mate frequented their vent a lot and they invited me to join it that day because we'd been hanging out for a while. That was fine. I met 3 of the dudes that day, and they were nice and became friends. Over the next few days, I went back in there because we did more stuff together, and over time, because I said this was a popular vent, it would just happen to occur that I would be in there and people I'd not met would join it too--more end game people who were old friends of the owners of this vent.
This is where some headbutting started. We did some endgame content a few weekends in a row--content that was old for them, but newish for me and I benefited from their explanations over voice. I felt comfortable enough with my friends to be in this vent with the other people in the group, half of which I did not know well. The people I did not know well would get a bit intrusive with me because I was the only girl in there, I'd shut them down and refuse to answer their questions. They didn't like that, they amped up the jerk a bit. I defended myself again, while getting in few jabs of my own. They really didn't like that so they started with the heavy blows then.
I no longer hang out in the vent when those particular people are in it, but the damage is done, they know me now and they target me. I continue to shut them down when they start crap, but because I seem to fight them back, they persist. I have been advised by my friends that blacklisting will not stop the crap they say because that's just how they are and honestly if people are talking about me, I'd rather see it and know about it than hide from it. I think at least some of it might just be novelty though because I've only known these dudes maybe 6 weeks.
I didn't say you needed to be defended by a dude, haha. I said your friends should have your back if this is making you that uncomfortable. If you are saying they are just hazing you more and with sexual undertone than the other guys in the group... well yes... a lot of guys probably think they are being "cool" or are attempting to flirt with you. You could ask them to chill out on it. If they just refuse and you can't deal with it anymore, my advice would be to server change or find a new group of raiders to roll with. You can't just wish the problem away. There is no magic sentence that we can give you that will make these boys realize they are being disrespectful. However, you could try telling them that, "I want to play with you guys but sometimes when you are so mean it upsets me, can't we all just raid and get along?"
They will either go for it, or they won't.
Sounds like good advice to me.
Also, as a woman gamer I've learned that I enjoy gaming situations much more where I'm not a token woman. The vibe is just so much more comfortable when you're not the only one or one of the very few ladies around. I try not to join guilds until I find out how many women they have because when you are the only one you inevitably get unwanted attention one way or another.
Attention? Sure. All OPs are. That's why I'm here too.
I am Woman, HEAR ME ROAR!!!!
Originally posted by laokoko "if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".
Sorry to hear that. The less we focus on them the less they will focus on us. Which is why I press anyone afraid of them to not be so we can get that unwanted attention away from the discussion.
Yeah thats the thing, I never was like "hey, im a girl". When I met this group, I met them through someone in my guild. My guild mate was helping me with something, he invited a few of his friends from this group. My guild mate frequented their vent a lot and they invited me to join it that day because we'd been hanging out for a while. That was fine. I met 3 of the dudes that day, and they were nice and became friends. Over the next few days, I went back in there because we did more stuff together, and over time, because I said this was a popular vent, it would just happen to occur that I would be in there and people I'd not met would join it too--more end game people who were old friends of the owners of this vent.
This is where some headbutting started. We did some endgame content a few weekends in a row--content that was old for them, but newish for me and I benefited from their explanations over voice. I felt comfortable enough with my friends to be in this vent with the other people in the group, half of which I did not know well. The people I did not know well would get a bit intrusive with me because I was the only girl in there, I'd shut them down and refuse to answer their questions. They didn't like that, they amped up the jerk a bit. I defended myself again, while getting in few jabs of my own. They really didn't like that so they started with the heavy blows then.
I no longer hang out in the vent when those particular people are in it, but the damage is done, they know me now and they target me. I continue to shut them down when they start crap, but because I seem to fight them back, they persist. I have been advised by my friends that blacklisting will not stop the crap they say because that's just how they are and honestly if people are talking about me, I'd rather see it and know about it than hide from it. I think at least some of it might just be novelty though because I've only known these dudes maybe 6 weeks.
Sounds like its time to find a new guild with more mature people.
I'm going to be honest OP because it's the kind of person i am. You're as much to blame for your issues as the douchebags that bother you. I'm not saying they have any right to act like you say they do but you allow them to do so without seizing control of the situation. You cannot lay low and allow something uncomfortable like that to continue.
I have a female friend a bit older than you that plays MMO's, and she has the best way I've ever seen of handling situations like the ones you mention. She's up front the second someone tries to pull any sort of shit about her being a girl. She tells them she's not here to fuck/cyber any of them so they need to get over it and grow the fuck up. She's here to play games with friends and have a good time, not put up with high school shit.
Your mileage may vary as you don't seem to like to be up front and honest about your situation to the people making you uncomfortable. You need to stop being the victim, regardless of your sex, and tell it like it is. If they don't like it, then they're not your friends and definitely not worth spending and time or energy around. If the ones that are your friends don't understand and don't have your back, then you have all the answers you need regarding them as well.
My sister went through something very similar back in the old days when we played DAoC and voicechat first became widely used. So this is not a new phenomenon. Unfortunately one of the constants of online gaming are immature idiots.
Calmy confront those guys. Call them out on their behavior and tell them to change it and how immature and rude they are. Most of them will tuck in their tiny tail and not bother you again.
That's definitely the law of things, but not everyone handles every situation the same. I would actually consider that extremely lewd to come out and say you're not here to cyber because what if some of those people weren't looking for that? I guess it doesn't matter. All that matters to some is dominating the situation instead of letting others handle it.
I actually handle things very differently by letting others believe their have control of the situation. I guess that makes me appear to be weak, but I end up being the stronger for it.
I'm sorry OP but I'm going to have to go against the grain here and say that what you are experiencing is just normal MMORPG interaction amongst players.
These players are not particular hostile to you because you're a woman. These people treat you such because you tooted your horn about how "good" you are at the game. Now you gave them free reign to nitpick your game play and naturally they will.
All the great players I have played with male or female never been harassed about their play other than in jest. Infact great players never need to say that they are good, or call label themselves anything. All they do is put forth their accolades and let it speak for themselves.
So I'm sorry that you got harassed but its not because you're a woman. Its because you claimed to be something that you are not and got called out for it.
Bottom line : You're an adult, you don't have to interact with anyone you don't want to. Just step away and find a better group of people. However if this is a reoccurring thing, then we have to go to the old saying " "If you run into an asshole in the morning, you ran into an asshole. If you run into assholes all day, you're the asshole." - Raylen Givens"
Its because you claimed to be something that you are not and got called out for it.
Originally posted by laokoko "if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".
Comments
someone suggested blocking people, you should do that if you can. Log harassment also and report it. The more you acknowledge them, and react to their behavior the more they'll mess with you.
People love to create drama when non exists. Theres also a weird psychology that people will insult others of the opposite sex if theyre attracted to them, but know the other has zero interest in them. They want to be noticed by you, they want a reaction from you even if its negative. The easiest way to do this, is to be a complete dick to you, you notice them now. Its also a much stronger reaction then say, just doing something nice for you would have. You're pissed at certain people, you know their names, and to them since they cant have you..becoming your worst enemy is just as good. You know them very well now...even the people you say dont know you at all, you probably remember certain names if theyre complete assholes to you.
block them, all of them, ignore the new challengers completey
Those who are my friends in this group, are newish friends, and do not intervene. Mostly because they are friends with the jerks also and have probably known them longer--and would rather be neutral on it. I think they feel like I can handle myself with them. Which I do. I am not the only target they go after each other too, it's just a different type of hazing with me because I'm a girl -- and a lot of it does have a sexual undertone.
I also think they are quicker to jump on me than each other because I am an easier or more obvious target. Also, if there are multiple guys in the vent, they seem to become empowered by each other. That being said, I don't need to be defended by a dude. The vent I hang out in belongs to my friends, but it's sort of a popular vent so the dicks come in there too. I stay out of the ones belonging to the obvious problem groups, I'm not dumb. It's tiring to have to be 'on' all the time, fighting off some type of attack. Having to have some witty reply to some crap they said all the time.
No...that's easy cop out way to do it.
"This may hurt a little, but it's something you'll get used to. Relax....."
Originally posted by laokoko
"if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".
@stawhat0981
Eh, those mods are the best mods I think I have ever known. But don't let that stop you!
trying to be witty and take it all in good fun might be exacerbating the problem as well. have you ever told them, in public, to shut the fuck up?
/gquit
Use "Block" Function.
Problem solved.
Looking forward to: Crowfall / Lost Ark / Black Desert Mobile
Indeed.
It sounds like you're just the new mark and need to show your mettle and tell the drama queens off till they get bored and move on.. also if it's your friends vent there should be less issues with you being kicked etc.
Pretty much at some point you just need to decide when enough is enough and let the chips fall where they may.
Brenics ~ Just to point out I do believe Chris Roberts is going down as the man who cheated backers and took down crowdfunding for gaming.
Have fun with that.... MR '14
"This may hurt a little, but it's something you'll get used to. Relax....."
Oh, my friend, I think this entire topic is so overblown. I have played with women/girls since the beginning of online games. This, person, is just looking for....well, yea.
Originally posted by laokoko
"if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".
I didn't say you needed to be defended by a dude, haha. I said your friends should have your back if this is making you that uncomfortable. If you are saying they are just hazing you more and with sexual undertone than the other guys in the group... well yes... a lot of guys probably think they are being "cool" or are attempting to flirt with you. You could ask them to chill out on it. If they just refuse and you can't deal with it anymore, my advice would be to server change or find a new group of raiders to roll with. You can't just wish the problem away. There is no magic sentence that we can give you that will make these boys realize they are being disrespectful. However, you could try telling them that, "I want to play with you guys but sometimes when you are so mean it upsets me, can't we all just raid and get along?"
They will either go for it, or they won't.
i've been banned from this forum so many times i don't care anymore.
i think everyone reaches that point here one way or another, eventually.
I met my wife in an MMO, and we hit it off by being decent and respectful towards one another - I know, imagine that! Then again, I am 40, we didn't meet until I was about 33, so that may or may not have had anything to do with it. I can tell you, though, that the sort of people/groups you are describing haunt all MMOs, especially once you start pushing the end-game.
I was in a couple of raiding guilds during my WoW days (which is where I met my wife also), and I learned long ago that there are some ladies out there whom are seriously good players, period. As a matter of fact, two of our regular raid group leaders were female, and one of the alternates as well; heck, my GM's girlfriend was one of the best raid healers I have ever seen.
I don't want to put too much of the onus onto you here, as I really don't know how "available" you have made yourself. It is possible the group(s) you are around are just full of idiots, in which case you should just dust them off. It is also possible there is some sort of mixed-signal thing going on, but again, I don't know you, so I don't want to point the finger at you. Back in my raiding days I, too, witnessed an extremely attractive woman in our guild who posted her photo to the guild website and was immediately beset with invites/whispers/heavy breathing, etc. So believe me, I have no illusions about the fact that most MMO players are, in fact, idiots.
If it's gotten out of hand and you want to remain with whatever game you are playing, you may indeed need to talk to a game master about possibly changing your toon name, or server, or whatever the case may be. I saw someone mention a voice filter, which is possible; you could also just abstain from talking in vent, and just using it to hear everyone else whilst typing your replies. Tell 'em you're mute or something, I dunno. At any rate, you may have simply fallen into a group of mouth-breathing losers, whom unfortunately abound in these online games. Good luck to you!
"Why would I want to loose a religion upon my people? Religions wreck from within - Empires and individuals alike! It's all the same." - God Emperor of Dune
Yeah thats the thing, I never was like "hey, im a girl". When I met this group, I met them through someone in my guild. My guild mate was helping me with something, he invited a few of his friends from this group. My guild mate frequented their vent a lot and they invited me to join it that day because we'd been hanging out for a while. That was fine. I met 3 of the dudes that day, and they were nice and became friends. Over the next few days, I went back in there because we did more stuff together, and over time, because I said this was a popular vent, it would just happen to occur that I would be in there and people I'd not met would join it too--more end game people who were old friends of the owners of this vent.
This is where some headbutting started. We did some endgame content a few weekends in a row--content that was old for them, but newish for me and I benefited from their explanations over voice. I felt comfortable enough with my friends to be in this vent with the other people in the group, half of which I did not know well. The people I did not know well would get a bit intrusive with me because I was the only girl in there, I'd shut them down and refuse to answer their questions. They didn't like that, they amped up the jerk a bit. I defended myself again, while getting in few jabs of my own. They really didn't like that so they started with the heavy blows then.
I no longer hang out in the vent when those particular people are in it, but the damage is done, they know me now and they target me. I continue to shut them down when they start crap, but because I seem to fight them back, they persist. I have been advised by my friends that blacklisting will not stop the crap they say because that's just how they are and honestly if people are talking about me, I'd rather see it and know about it than hide from it. I think at least some of it might just be novelty though because I've only known these dudes maybe 6 weeks.
@stawhat0981
Attention? Sure. All OPs are. That's why I'm here too.
Sounds like good advice to me.
Also, as a woman gamer I've learned that I enjoy gaming situations much more where I'm not a token woman. The vibe is just so much more comfortable when you're not the only one or one of the very few ladies around. I try not to join guilds until I find out how many women they have because when you are the only one you inevitably get unwanted attention one way or another.
I am Woman, HEAR ME ROAR!!!!
Originally posted by laokoko
"if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".
@evilized
Sorry to hear that. The less we focus on them the less they will focus on us. Which is why I press anyone afraid of them to not be so we can get that unwanted attention away from the discussion.
Sounds like its time to find a new guild with more mature people.
I'm going to be honest OP because it's the kind of person i am. You're as much to blame for your issues as the douchebags that bother you. I'm not saying they have any right to act like you say they do but you allow them to do so without seizing control of the situation. You cannot lay low and allow something uncomfortable like that to continue.
I have a female friend a bit older than you that plays MMO's, and she has the best way I've ever seen of handling situations like the ones you mention. She's up front the second someone tries to pull any sort of shit about her being a girl. She tells them she's not here to fuck/cyber any of them so they need to get over it and grow the fuck up. She's here to play games with friends and have a good time, not put up with high school shit.
Your mileage may vary as you don't seem to like to be up front and honest about your situation to the people making you uncomfortable. You need to stop being the victim, regardless of your sex, and tell it like it is. If they don't like it, then they're not your friends and definitely not worth spending and time or energy around. If the ones that are your friends don't understand and don't have your back, then you have all the answers you need regarding them as well.
My sister went through something very similar back in the old days when we played DAoC and voicechat first became widely used. So this is not a new phenomenon. Unfortunately one of the constants of online gaming are immature idiots.
Calmy confront those guys. Call them out on their behavior and tell them to change it and how immature and rude they are. Most of them will tuck in their tiny tail and not bother you again.
@Alders
That's definitely the law of things, but not everyone handles every situation the same. I would actually consider that extremely lewd to come out and say you're not here to cyber because what if some of those people weren't looking for that? I guess it doesn't matter. All that matters to some is dominating the situation instead of letting others handle it.
I actually handle things very differently by letting others believe their have control of the situation. I guess that makes me appear to be weak, but I end up being the stronger for it.
https://foraslanandvolstate.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/obi-wan_death.jpg
I'm sorry OP but I'm going to have to go against the grain here and say that what you are experiencing is just normal MMORPG interaction amongst players.
These players are not particular hostile to you because you're a woman. These people treat you such because you tooted your horn about how "good" you are at the game. Now you gave them free reign to nitpick your game play and naturally they will.
All the great players I have played with male or female never been harassed about their play other than in jest. Infact great players never need to say that they are good, or call label themselves anything. All they do is put forth their accolades and let it speak for themselves.
So I'm sorry that you got harassed but its not because you're a woman. Its because you claimed to be something that you are not and got called out for it.
Bottom line : You're an adult, you don't have to interact with anyone you don't want to. Just step away and find a better group of people. However if this is a reoccurring thing, then we have to go to the old saying " "If you run into an asshole in the morning, you ran into an asshole. If you run into assholes all day, you're the asshole." - Raylen Givens"
Originally posted by laokoko
"if you want to be a game designer, you should sell your house and fund your game. Since if you won't even fund your own game, no one will".