Originally posted by BuZZKilgore Originally posted by Panzeh Lots and lots of people play FPSes. The death penalties in FPSes are nil. Multiplayer FPSes are almost all PvP games.
Thusly, there are a lot of people willing to PvP without harsh penalties for death. I for one, am.
Not me, when I get killed in a FPS I take the disk out, break it in two and delete the game from my HD. That way I feel the pvp has some meaning.
Real hardcore players take a hatchet to their monitor and computer when they die in an FPS. It's the only way.
Eve is open ended gameplay. Guildwars is all about PVP, (hint: it's called guild wars). WoW has it's PVP even on PVE servers. DAOC is RVR, and WAR an upcoming Mythic game is mostly about RVR. Lets talk about WAR shall we? It's going to fill a gap; that gap is the next generation of RVR / war and large scale PVP.
And you argument falls flat on it's face with WoW, a huge MMO.. is not for casual PVErs. Wow's end-game is based around HARDCORE gameplay. Hardcore Everquest raid grinding to be specific. There is nothing casual about it.
The arguably most popular MMO.. is not casual, and if it's not casual then it's not casual PVE...
Guild Wars provides casual PVE, but it heavily based around PVP.. PVP is it's backbone.
Do not pass go, do not collect $200.. you didn't win anything, and anything you think is going on is just an illusion in your head. Imo stop with the labels. Hardcore this, casual that, PVP this, PVE that.. if it's not nerf vs buff it's fanboy vs flamer, if it's not hardcore vs casual, it's pve vs pvp. It's not a freaking war man. When a game succeeds a portion of the MMO gaming community doesn't crawl under a rock; no, they are playing those games with you. All the gamers you think are you enemies are in your PUGs, in your guild, talking to you on vent.
Wow. I am really really surprised a thread like this has lasted 16+ pages so far! Perhaps more devs need to pay attention to things like this and think a little harder about PVE vs. PVP in their next game?
Originally posted by BuZZKilgore Yes that's right, we the "carebears" have defeated the so-called "hardcore pvp'ers".We didn't do it with swords and magic spells, we did it with our money! That's right, we have spoken and we don't like to be ganked and looted by some "1337 kiddie" who thinks he's tough because he's 20 lvls above you and 1 shot kills you while you're afk.We will choose when we want to pvp and when we don't, it is no longer up to you when you can kill us. We control you now and all the games you play, and upcoming games. Developers wont even make a FFA PVP game anymore. Want to know why, because we the "carebears" wont play it and there's not enough "hardcore pvp'ers" to make it a profitable game. The age of the hardcore pvp MMOs is dead and gone, I for one say " it's about time". If you are that hard up for pvp go play a FPS that really does take some skill, or Eve that's all point and click and leave us to enjoy our MMOs.
Originally posted by BuZZKilgore Originally posted by Panzeh Lots and lots of people play FPSes. The death penalties in FPSes are nil. Multiplayer FPSes are almost all PvP games.
Thusly, there are a lot of people willing to PvP without harsh penalties for death. I for one, am.
Not me, when I get killed in a FPS I take the disk out, break it in two and delete the game from my HD. That way I feel the pvp has some meaning.
Originally posted by syrec Hardly. Eve is open ended gameplay. Guildwars is all about PVP, (hint: it's called guild wars). WoW has it's PVP even on PVE servers. DAOC is RVR, and WAR an upcoming Mythic game is mostly about RVR. Lets talk about WAR shall we? It's going to fill a gap; that gap is the next generation of RVR / war and large scale PVP.
Of the games you listed, only EVE qualifies as 'hardcore' PVP. Guildwars, WOW, DAOC, and WAR are definately not 'hardcore' PVP, as none of them allow you to take another player's stuff when they die, which is what qualifies it as 'real' PVP to the 'hardcore' PVP crowd. You're backing up the OP's claim.
Originally posted by BuZZKilgore Yes that's right, we the "carebears" have defeated the so-called "hardcore pvp'ers".We didn't do it with swords and magic spells, we did it with our money! That's right, we have spoken and we don't like to be ganked and looted by some "1337 kiddie" who thinks he's tough because he's 20 lvls above you and 1 shot kills you while you're afk.We will choose when we want to pvp and when we don't, it is no longer up to you when you can kill us. We control you now and all the games you play, and upcoming games. Developers wont even make a FFA PVP game anymore. Want to know why, because we the "carebears" wont play it and there's not enough "hardcore pvp'ers" to make it a profitable game. The age of the hardcore pvp MMOs is dead and gone, I for one say " it's about time". If you are that hard up for pvp go play a FPS that really does take some skill, or Eve that's all point and click and leave us to enjoy our MMOs.
"Hi I play SWG" could be on this one....lol
(Or at least fits thats for sure.)
I do like to see them cry though... it is kinda like spouting "I am the king of the hill!" when of course nobody is trying to go up that hill.
______________________________ I usually picture the Career builder commercial with the room full of monkeys and upside down sales chart when thinking about the SOE/SWG decision making process..... SOE's John Blakely and Todd Fiala issued a warning: "Don't make our mistakes." Ref NGE Winner of the worst MMOS goes to.... the NGE and SWG..!!! http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm?loadFeature=1034&bhcp=1
The war is far froom over. recent analysis of the MMORPG market reveals that the way forward will be niche games. It is very unlikely for another break through title such as WOW. Developer who attempt are likely to lose their money. The best investment for a developer now is to spend less on a niche game with a dedicated audience and then grow their niche.
THis is likely to be the most profitabe way forward.
In other words this favors the small studios such as CCP and The guys behind CONAN
Wow this thread is so popular that people are making spin-offs of it.
Let's get real here, if a dev team created a full out free-for-all PVP MMO, with absalutely no safe zones or restrictions allowing pk's anywhere at anytime it wouldn't last very long. The players would complain "warriors are overpowered", the warriors would say "mages are overpowered" ect..ect.. The noobs would get tired of being ganked, the small guild would be tired of the large guilds camping all the good spots. It wouldn't be long before people would be leaving in droves.
The devs would start getting worried because they are losing customers, then they start nerfinf the warriors, they start making the noob zones non-pvp areas. This is why a hardcore FFA PVP MMO will never make it these days. Sorry pvp'ers but you know it's the truth.
Originally posted by FreddyNoNose Originally posted by BuZZKilgore Wow this thread is so popular that people are making spin-offs of it.
I pitty you and your low self-esteem. Hi Freddy, welcome to the forums. There's no need to pitty me because I can assure you that all is good in my life. What I post on these boards has nothing to do with my life or "self esteem". I would ask your opinion on the pvp issue but I can see from reading your posts that you aren't even playing anything at this time. So move along nubby.
Comments
Real hardcore players take a hatchet to their monitor and computer when they die in an FPS. It's the only way.
Eve is open ended gameplay. Guildwars is all about PVP, (hint: it's called guild wars). WoW has it's PVP even on PVE servers. DAOC is RVR, and WAR an upcoming Mythic game is mostly about RVR. Lets talk about WAR shall we? It's going to fill a gap; that gap is the next generation of RVR / war and large scale PVP.
And you argument falls flat on it's face with WoW, a huge MMO.. is not for casual PVErs. Wow's end-game is based around HARDCORE gameplay. Hardcore Everquest raid grinding to be specific. There is nothing casual about it.
The arguably most popular MMO.. is not casual, and if it's not casual then it's not casual PVE...
Guild Wars provides casual PVE, but it heavily based around PVP.. PVP is it's backbone.
Do not pass go, do not collect $200.. you didn't win anything, and anything you think is going on is just an illusion in your head. Imo stop with the labels. Hardcore this, casual that, PVP this, PVE that.. if it's not nerf vs buff it's fanboy vs flamer, if it's not hardcore vs casual, it's pve vs pvp. It's not a freaking war man. When a game succeeds a portion of the MMO gaming community doesn't crawl under a rock; no, they are playing those games with you. All the gamers you think are you enemies are in your PUGs, in your guild, talking to you on vent.
Get a clue man!
D.
So many games, so little time!
BOOM! HEADSHOT!
Of the games you listed, only EVE qualifies as 'hardcore' PVP. Guildwars, WOW, DAOC, and WAR are definately not 'hardcore' PVP, as none of them allow you to take another player's stuff when they die, which is what qualifies it as 'real' PVP to the 'hardcore' PVP crowd. You're backing up the OP's claim.
"Hi I play SWG" could be on this one....lol
(Or at least fits thats for sure.)
I do like to see them cry though... it is kinda like spouting "I am the king of the hill!" when of course nobody is trying to go up that hill.
______________________________
I usually picture the Career builder commercial with the room full of monkeys and upside down sales chart when thinking about the SOE/SWG decision making process.....
SOE's John Blakely and Todd Fiala issued a warning: "Don't make our mistakes." Ref NGE
Winner of the worst MMOS goes to.... the NGE and SWG..!!! http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm?loadFeature=1034&bhcp=1
The war is far froom over. recent analysis of the MMORPG market reveals that the way forward will be niche games. It is very unlikely for another break through title such as WOW. Developer who attempt are likely to lose their money. The best investment for a developer now is to spend less on a niche game with a dedicated audience and then grow their niche.
THis is likely to be the most profitabe way forward.
In other words this favors the small studios such as CCP and The guys behind CONAN
over say SIGIL/SOE and EA/Mythic.
Let's get real here, if a dev team created a full out free-for-all PVP MMO, with absalutely no safe zones or restrictions allowing pk's anywhere at anytime it wouldn't last very long. The players would complain "warriors are overpowered", the warriors would say "mages are overpowered" ect..ect.. The noobs would get tired of being ganked, the small guild would be tired of the large guilds camping all the good spots. It wouldn't be long before people would be leaving in droves.
The devs would start getting worried because they are losing customers, then they start nerfinf the warriors, they start making the noob zones non-pvp areas. This is why a hardcore FFA PVP MMO will never make it these days. Sorry pvp'ers but you know it's the truth.
Hi Freddy, welcome to the forums. There's no need to pitty me because I can assure you that all is good in my life. What I post on these boards has nothing to do with my life or "self esteem". I would ask your opinion on the pvp issue but I can see from reading your posts that you aren't even playing anything at this time. So move along nubby.