The game itself is brokn. They wont be able to fix that before release.
But ironically they could fix this. Just make the game Buy to Play and then add a ton of stuff to the store in the first update. Then no one could complain. Except I guess (again ironically) the sub model elitists who wont play the game anymore because it has a cash shop. (which it already does.)
ZoS feeds the ego and lack of intellect with these guys by making it both. if they made the game EXACTLY the same but DIDNT harge a sub guys would be less likely to play. If they made it buy to play and offered the same exact things some people wouldnt play it.
Thats why you cant have logical arguments about this because people have no logic to begin with.
Originally posted by otacu Originally posted by baphametthat's besides the point. how many mmo's have a limited edition version of the game sold on their website with in game vanity items?
A playable race is a vantiy item?
that's besides the point, it's a part of their IE and not a cash shop item.
i fail to see the fact that they give you a playable race in their IE automatically makes it a cash shop item?
that's besides the point, it's a part of their IE and not a cash shop item.
i fail to see the fact that they give you a playable race in their IE automatically makes it a cash shop item?
where is the logic in that?
Theyre already selling the mount. The reason they arent selling the race is they get more money if people just upgrade. Plus it lets them tip toe the line but I suspect the race itself will be separated eventually once the upgrades slow down to a non factor. They have no reason to sell the race alone yet because the game hasnt released yet. By the time the first update hits it will be in there probably for a 10 or 15 dollar price tag. Even though the upgrade costs 'only' 20 bux.
Originally posted by baphametthat's besides the point. how many mmo's have a limited edition version of the game sold on their website with in game vanity items?
A playable race is a vantiy item?
that's besides the point, it's a part of their IE and not a cash shop item.
i fail to see the fact that they give you a playable race in their IE automatically makes it a cash shop item?
where is the logic in that?
You fail to see the point because you're not using logic.
So we have regular joe buying the standard edition of a P2P game and paying subs. He is supposed to have 100% of the game right? Zenimax promised he would get 100% of the game right?
Wrong. Joe has to go to the cash shop and pay EXTRA for playing a race in the game.
This is exactly how f2p cash shops works. No p2p game in history have ever made you pay to get an additional race
Originally posted by baphametthat's besides the point. how many mmo's have a limited edition version of the game sold on their website with in game vanity items?
A playable race is a vantiy item?
that's besides the point, it's a part of their IE and not a cash shop item.
i fail to see the fact that they give you a playable race in their IE automatically makes it a cash shop item?
where is the logic in that?
But it is a cash shop item. What's for sale when game launches in the cash shop? Imperial upgrade. It's just a marketing spin calling it "Imperial Upgrade". Imperial upgrade - 20 bucks. That's the exact same thing as if they worded it "Imperial race + Imperial mount + crab pet - 20 bucks. Same thing.
Lets be realistic about mmo's shall we pls...... From the 50 mmo's that launched only 1 or 2 remains sub based. The mmo's that stayed stuborn and remainded sub based closed their doors in 99% of the cases.
With that out of the way lets look at ESO:
55 euro normal edition 80 euro imperial edition Cash shop - mount for sale (after launch you will see the imperial race / gear for sale (come on dont be so naive)
The main reason people claim it goes free to play or buy to play is that all evidence is stacked against ESO. Each and every mmo with the exception of FF14 went that road, some sooner some a littlebit later.
You realy think ESO remains sub based ? i think not as it just doesnt offer the WOAHHHHHH factor. Way to many glitches and bugs and not to mention the greed from Zenimax to put away Imperials behind a collectors edition.
Most of us see the doomhammer comming from a mile away after buying tons of mmo's that goes down flat on their face within 6 months after release. ESO just isnt that jewel that it should have been. ( in my humble opinion)
it looks way to outdated on to many fronts...... The UI The animations Clunky target system where you cant even target the damn healers in a pvp game no less.
It all smells fishy and Zenimax hasnt proved anything yet. if anything they proved to me they want to cash in as fast as posible before that doomhammer hits and people wake up and see that ESO aint that special. When that moment comes subs go down and the cash shop that stands on standby will catch up the money loss from subs.
Originally posted by baphametthat's besides the point. how many mmo's have a limited edition version of the game sold on their website with in game vanity items?
A playable race is a vantiy item?
that's besides the point, it's a part of their IE and not a cash shop item.
i fail to see the fact that they give you a playable race in their IE automatically makes it a cash shop item?
where is the logic in that?
But it is a cash shop item. What's for sale when game launches in the cash shop? Imperial upgrade. It's just a marketing spin calling it "Imperial Upgrade". Imperial upgrade - 20 bucks. That's the exact same thing as if they worded it "Imperial race + Imperial mount + crab pet - 20 bucks. Same thing.
Exactly. Most other MMOs with cash shops would just call it what it is. A bundle.
Has it actually even been confirmed that the ONLY way to obtain the Imperial race is by buying it?
Seems to me it's just as likely you'll earn it after you finish all 3 storylines or perhaps from PvP; who knows.
Also get used to cash shops, they're here to stay. Don't like it? Don't play. Pointless coming on forums and complaining endlessly thinking developers will somehow rush out to view your post on some forums that make up less than 0.5% of their playerbase.
Personally every cash shop in the last 5 MMOs I've played hasn't affected me in ANY way. The days of P2W are long gone from any real game, so if people wanna spend their cash on crap like skins, XP boosts and mounts; more power to them. It usually just means they quit the game quicker anyway.
Has it actually even been confirmed that the ONLY way to obtain the Imperial race is by buying it?
Seems to me it's just as likely you'll earn it after you finish all 3 storylines or perhaps from PvP; who knows.
Also get used to cash shops, they're here to stay. Don't like it? Don't play. Pointless coming on forums and complaining endlessly thinking developers will somehow rush out to view your post on some forums that make up less than 0.5% of their playerbase.
Personally every cash shop in the last 5 MMOs I've played hasn't affected me in ANY way. The days of P2W are long gone from any real game, so if people wanna spend their cash on crap like skins, XP boosts and mounts; more power to them. It usually just means they quit the game quicker anyway.
Confirmed?
As of now you get Imperial Race only if you pay more.
Getting it free after you finish the 3 storylines is wishful thinking from fanboys. The same fanboys that assured us as fact that ESO will NEVER have an ingame cash shop.
It's the opposite. Do we have confirmation that you get the imperial race after completing the 3 storylines? where do you read about this?
Considering how greedy Zenimax is i highly doubt that they will give you for free something that people paid for. They are in for the money grab
Wtf Op ? if you didn't want people to post here you should have got a mod to lock it until then others and myself can post our thoughts as we please ....
Personally every cash shop in the last 5 MMOs I've played hasn't affected me in ANY way. The days of P2W are long gone from any real game, so if people wanna spend their cash on crap like skins, XP boosts and mounts; more power to them. It usually just means they quit the game quicker anyway.
I have to agree, cash shops aren't P2W anymore and really have no effect on players. If you wanna buy a new outfit you can but it has nothing to do with gameplay so you're free to ignore it. Those who purchase XP boosts and things are often ones with less time to play but more money to spend, so it evens out in the long run - the college kids with all day to play and no cash won't need to buy that stuff to progress but it merely saves time for those that do. If it keeps people playing and doesn't affect the playerbase or gameplay, I think it's actually a positive thing.
Has it actually even been confirmed that the ONLY way to obtain the Imperial race is by buying it?
Seems to me it's just as likely you'll earn it after you finish all 3 storylines or perhaps from PvP; who knows.
Also get used to cash shops, they're here to stay. Don't like it? Don't play. Pointless coming on forums and complaining endlessly thinking developers will somehow rush out to view your post on some forums that make up less than 0.5% of their playerbase.
Personally every cash shop in the last 5 MMOs I've played hasn't affected me in ANY way. The days of P2W are long gone from any real game, so if people wanna spend their cash on crap like skins, XP boosts and mounts; more power to them. It usually just means they quit the game quicker anyway.
Confirmed?
As of now you get Imperial Race only if you pay more.
Getting it free after you finish the 3 storylines is wishful thinking from fanboys. The same fanboys that assured us as fact that ESO will NEVER have an ingame cash shop.
It's the opposite. Do we have confirmation that you get the imperial race after completing the 3 storylines? where do you read about this?
Considering how greedy Zenimax is i highly doubt that they will give you for free something that people paid for. They are in for the money grab
Zenimax does not come off as greedy to me at all. Go play a F2P game and you'll see what greedy really means. As for the Imperial Race, based on what other games have done I suspect they'll let everyone play it for free a few months after launch. It's being used right now as a special Collector's Edition bonus to get people to buy something more than the standard edition. Giving people unique things in CE's is what CE's are for but once the launch hype has died down they'll probably just make it a normal race. Things like this are never gated forever.
Has it actually even been confirmed that the ONLY way to obtain the Imperial race is by buying it?
Seems to me it's just as likely you'll earn it after you finish all 3 storylines or perhaps from PvP; who knows.
Also get used to cash shops, they're here to stay. Don't like it? Don't play. Pointless coming on forums and complaining endlessly thinking developers will somehow rush out to view your post on some forums that make up less than 0.5% of their playerbase.
Personally every cash shop in the last 5 MMOs I've played hasn't affected me in ANY way. The days of P2W are long gone from any real game, so if people wanna spend their cash on crap like skins, XP boosts and mounts; more power to them. It usually just means they quit the game quicker anyway.
Confirmed?
As of now you get Imperial Race only if you pay more.
Getting it free after you finish the 3 storylines is wishful thinking from fanboys. The same fanboys that assured us as fact that ESO will NEVER have an ingame cash shop.
It's the opposite. Do we have confirmation that you get the imperial race after completing the 3 storylines? where do you read about this?
Considering how greedy Zenimax is i highly doubt that they will give you for free something that people paid for. They are in for the money grab
Zenimax does not come off as greedy to me at all. Go play a F2P game and you'll see what greedy really means. As for the Imperial Race, based on what other games have done I suspect they'll let everyone play it for free a few months after launch. It's being used right now as a special Collector's Edition bonus to get people to buy something more than the standard edition. Giving people unique things in CE's is what CE's are for but once the launch hype has died down they'll probably just make it a normal race. Things like this are never gated forever.
I wouldn't count on that. I can tell you now if I played $20 for a horse and race and then few months later they gave it to everyone for free I would be pretty pissed.
You say things like this are never gated forever but do you have any examples? Usually collectors editions awards are always exclusive.
no cash shop but $15 a month. as a very casual gamer - maybe 1 hour every couple of nights, and 4-5 hours on weekends, this game needs to be really awesome to justify the costs. Personally I'd rather have a cash shop.
All I'm going to say, is that I remember when RIFT had an Ashes of History or something CE edition on the website that you could upgrade your account to. Included in game goodies, a mount, way back near launch.
I didn't see the forums flooded with cries of "cash shop!" then.
Sounds to me, like people taking their disgruntled feelings over the Imperials out on other things, than anything else. You know what I call the ability to purchase the benefits of the CE after the fact? Same thing I did then. An upgrade.
Yeah I don't trust that the game won't go F2P shortly after launch.
Look at TERA, I purchased collectors edition paid over $100 for a game that I didn't even play for 8 hours before saying im done because of the UI Font Size bug on smaller monitors.
On top of this I was told that the game would not be pay 2 enjoy or other words charge for cosmetic items but shortly after game Goes F2P and here we go Cash Shop Pay 2 Enjoy.
I think the same thing is going to happen with ESO players will play it for a month or two if that then they will be like This game sucks, now I could be wrong but based on my Beta experience with the game the game is bad lacked all the content I would want to see in a 2014 MMO Release, and locked character classes rather than going sand-box based allowing players to develop their own unique race story line & play all classes on a single character.
you are forgeting that most people SOLD cash shop items on the market >>. i sold outfits that i knew people wanted and it was not overly priced as well. 8k for an outfit that cost around 9 bucks. ATLEAST tera made them trabeable. most mmos bind them once you but. and i dont see ESO going that way seeing how it has its OWN unique style that we have come to expect from an ES title.
I am not sure if you played ESO beta, but like almost all my guilds /clan members tried the game to be honest I played one Beta test, my character was wiped, reported every bug I found, and after that I didn't bother to play again the game is boring as hell I can compared ESO to Rift / Guild Wars 2, because that is what ESO feels like to me.
Sure its got different mechanics/classes and alliance system, but they didn't develop it properly the game needed to be designed around a sand-box based game where players are free to make their own choices, I let the developers know my feed-back there but of course chances of them changing all this before release of the game is almost unlikely, which is why im not buying ESO because I think the game is going to Fail, I think that a game like Star Citizen will be successful however.
Yes Tera might allow players to trade items, but I don't like cash shops at all, I like games where I can play a flat monthly fee, go see a barber-shop any time I want to change my appearance in a game and change it any time I please. When I play a game like Tera where I have to pay for a item just to change my appearance, or a game like Vindictus with so many restrictions even for a paying customer, or even Perfect Worlds games I don't even bother paying a dime after looking at their cash shop I take one look and say I am done with this game especially when it comes to PWI for example and the way they run their cash shop. Also I would rather have a Cash Shop, that allows me to buy the item and claim it for all my characters not a single character only, and not having to send items in mail to other characters on my account.
Another company similar to PWI is NCsoft I absolutely hate them Aion for example I could stand to play their game if they gave me a $15 flat rate unlimited item housing/customization, and allowed me to use the barber-shop in the game any time I please without paying $10 for a ticket I would subscribe to the game even pay $20 a month for the game + cash shop cosmetic items, but because of their Greed I am not interested in the game at all.
So when it comes down to it, I think ESO will start out as a Pay 2 Play game, but over time based on Beta, unless the developers change the actual game and make major changes before release or after release I think the initial sales of the game will be high, but after 30 days players I think will finally hit level cap and start to get bored of the game unless changes come to the game.
It will likely start out with adding cosmetic items for sale in the market, or expansion packs and such, and then after that it will likely go full F2P once the game fails or F2P up to a certain level or such.
I understand new MMO players might like ESO with the way it is, but as a 8+ year MMO player I absolutely tell you that in the last beta's I played ESO feels like every other MMO that I have played, and this is exactly why I think it will go F2P down the road.
I took a look on You-Tube at the Elder Scrolls, game-play videos, and I have played Skyrim, to me the game doesn't look or feel like those games it feels very tab-targeting, and class/alliance locked not something I like.
General opinion of people that played the latest beta tests disagrees with you... The PvE is immersive, the dungeons are challenging and fun and PvP rocks big time...
on top of that, it will be the first big MMO on the new consoles... DCUO never was a true MMO world experience, ( however it was kind of fun )
I would not normally post such a long wall of script nor quote one...however, every time I see one of Lord.Bachus spam threads it smells of SHILL. Enjoy the over coming surge of the tide called F2P because it will happen.
The OP link just confirms the cash shop disguised as "account services". Examples that already exist in ESO:
* Upgrade your account with a Palomino horse for X dollars! Check.
* Upgrade your account to be able to play X race in both factions for X dollars! Check.
Possible upcoming "account services":
* Upgrade your account with an end tier PvP weapon for X dollars!
* Upgrade your account with a pack of potions that give you +10% damage for X dollars!
There's no difference, and it doesn't matter how you call it. Account services, or sweet sunberries. A cash shop is a cash shop.
My opinion is my own. I respect all other opinions and views equally, but keep in mind that my opinion will always be the best for me. That's why it's my opinion.
Going to be nice ride without f2p p2win crowd ,while it lasts and i hope it will last long :>
See you in 6-12 months!
Actually you won't .......see it's worth $15 a month not to have to play with the F2P crowd and like Lotro and Swtor when a game goes F2P folks that are enjoyable company have already left for greener pastures .
Originally posted by Legere no cash shop but $15 a month. as a very casual gamer - maybe 1 hour every couple of nights, and 4-5 hours on weekends, this game needs to be really awesome to justify the costs. Personally I'd rather have a cash shop.
So let me get this straight you think paying $15 dollars a month for a minimum of 40 hrs per month of play time is a bad deal?Dam that's about $o.38 cents a hour for entertainment that can't be too hard to justify
Comments
The game itself is brokn. They wont be able to fix that before release.
But ironically they could fix this. Just make the game Buy to Play and then add a ton of stuff to the store in the first update. Then no one could complain. Except I guess (again ironically) the sub model elitists who wont play the game anymore because it has a cash shop. (which it already does.)
ZoS feeds the ego and lack of intellect with these guys by making it both. if they made the game EXACTLY the same but DIDNT harge a sub guys would be less likely to play. If they made it buy to play and offered the same exact things some people wouldnt play it.
Thats why you cant have logical arguments about this because people have no logic to begin with.
A playable race is a vantiy item?
i believe in the spirit of Santa - does that count ?
EQ2 fan sites
that's besides the point, it's a part of their IE and not a cash shop item.
i fail to see the fact that they give you a playable race in their IE automatically makes it a cash shop item?
where is the logic in that?
Theyre already selling the mount. The reason they arent selling the race is they get more money if people just upgrade. Plus it lets them tip toe the line but I suspect the race itself will be separated eventually once the upgrades slow down to a non factor. They have no reason to sell the race alone yet because the game hasnt released yet. By the time the first update hits it will be in there probably for a 10 or 15 dollar price tag. Even though the upgrade costs 'only' 20 bux.
You fail to see the point because you're not using logic.
So we have regular joe buying the standard edition of a P2P game and paying subs. He is supposed to have 100% of the game right? Zenimax promised he would get 100% of the game right?
Wrong. Joe has to go to the cash shop and pay EXTRA for playing a race in the game.
This is exactly how f2p cash shops works. No p2p game in history have ever made you pay to get an additional race
But it is a cash shop item. What's for sale when game launches in the cash shop? Imperial upgrade. It's just a marketing spin calling it "Imperial Upgrade". Imperial upgrade - 20 bucks. That's the exact same thing as if they worded it "Imperial race + Imperial mount + crab pet - 20 bucks. Same thing.
Lets be realistic about mmo's shall we pls......
From the 50 mmo's that launched only 1 or 2 remains sub based.
The mmo's that stayed stuborn and remainded sub based closed their doors in 99% of the cases.
With that out of the way lets look at ESO:
55 euro normal edition
80 euro imperial edition
Cash shop - mount for sale
(after launch you will see the imperial race / gear for sale (come on dont be so naive)
The main reason people claim it goes free to play or buy to play is that all evidence is stacked against ESO.
Each and every mmo with the exception of FF14 went that road, some sooner some a littlebit later.
You realy think ESO remains sub based ? i think not as it just doesnt offer the WOAHHHHHH factor.
Way to many glitches and bugs and not to mention the greed from Zenimax to put away Imperials behind a collectors edition.
Most of us see the doomhammer comming from a mile away after buying tons of mmo's that goes down flat on their face within 6 months after release.
ESO just isnt that jewel that it should have been. ( in my humble opinion)
it looks way to outdated on to many fronts......
The UI
The animations
Clunky target system where you cant even target the damn healers in a pvp game no less.
It all smells fishy and Zenimax hasnt proved anything yet.
if anything they proved to me they want to cash in as fast as posible before that doomhammer hits and people wake up and see that ESO aint that special.
When that moment comes subs go down and the cash shop that stands on standby will catch up the money loss from subs.
Wake up people this aint rocket science.
Exactly. Most other MMOs with cash shops would just call it what it is. A bundle.
"If I offended you, you needed it" -Corey Taylor
Has it actually even been confirmed that the ONLY way to obtain the Imperial race is by buying it?
Seems to me it's just as likely you'll earn it after you finish all 3 storylines or perhaps from PvP; who knows.
Also get used to cash shops, they're here to stay. Don't like it? Don't play. Pointless coming on forums and complaining endlessly thinking developers will somehow rush out to view your post on some forums that make up less than 0.5% of their playerbase.
Personally every cash shop in the last 5 MMOs I've played hasn't affected me in ANY way. The days of P2W are long gone from any real game, so if people wanna spend their cash on crap like skins, XP boosts and mounts; more power to them. It usually just means they quit the game quicker anyway.
Confirmed?
As of now you get Imperial Race only if you pay more.
Getting it free after you finish the 3 storylines is wishful thinking from fanboys. The same fanboys that assured us as fact that ESO will NEVER have an ingame cash shop.
It's the opposite. Do we have confirmation that you get the imperial race after completing the 3 storylines? where do you read about this?
Considering how greedy Zenimax is i highly doubt that they will give you for free something that people paid for. They are in for the money grab
Witty & Wicked
I have to agree, cash shops aren't P2W anymore and really have no effect on players. If you wanna buy a new outfit you can but it has nothing to do with gameplay so you're free to ignore it. Those who purchase XP boosts and things are often ones with less time to play but more money to spend, so it evens out in the long run - the college kids with all day to play and no cash won't need to buy that stuff to progress but it merely saves time for those that do. If it keeps people playing and doesn't affect the playerbase or gameplay, I think it's actually a positive thing.
Zenimax does not come off as greedy to me at all. Go play a F2P game and you'll see what greedy really means. As for the Imperial Race, based on what other games have done I suspect they'll let everyone play it for free a few months after launch. It's being used right now as a special Collector's Edition bonus to get people to buy something more than the standard edition. Giving people unique things in CE's is what CE's are for but once the launch hype has died down they'll probably just make it a normal race. Things like this are never gated forever.
People hating on subs I can understand but this is how MMO traditionally made their money.
Btw WOW is still charging a monthly sub and they seem to be doing okay.
Mission in life: Vanquish all MMORPG.com trolls - especially TESO, WOW and GW2 trolls.
I wouldn't count on that. I can tell you now if I played $20 for a horse and race and then few months later they gave it to everyone for free I would be pretty pissed.
You say things like this are never gated forever but do you have any examples? Usually collectors editions awards are always exclusive.
All I'm going to say, is that I remember when RIFT had an Ashes of History or something CE edition on the website that you could upgrade your account to. Included in game goodies, a mount, way back near launch.
I didn't see the forums flooded with cries of "cash shop!" then.
Sounds to me, like people taking their disgruntled feelings over the Imperials out on other things, than anything else. You know what I call the ability to purchase the benefits of the CE after the fact? Same thing I did then. An upgrade.
You may now carry on.
This, give it a couple of years, I would be shocked if it wasn't f2p with cash shop in game at that point.
I would not normally post such a long wall of script nor quote one...however, every time I see one of Lord.Bachus spam threads it smells of SHILL. Enjoy the over coming surge of the tide called F2P because it will happen.
See you in 6-12 months!
The OP link just confirms the cash shop disguised as "account services". Examples that already exist in ESO:
* Upgrade your account with a Palomino horse for X dollars! Check.
* Upgrade your account to be able to play X race in both factions for X dollars! Check.
Possible upcoming "account services":
* Upgrade your account with an end tier PvP weapon for X dollars!
* Upgrade your account with a pack of potions that give you +10% damage for X dollars!
There's no difference, and it doesn't matter how you call it. Account services, or sweet sunberries. A cash shop is a cash shop.
My opinion is my own. I respect all other opinions and views equally, but keep in mind that my opinion will always be the best for me. That's why it's my opinion.
Oh just because the developers said something then that is somehow a fact??
Either you are really naive or you haven't been playing games for long, if you believe everything a developer says as fact.
My gaming blog
Actually you won't .......see it's worth $15 a month not to have to play with the F2P crowd and like Lotro and Swtor when a game goes F2P folks that are enjoyable company have already left for greener pastures .
So let me get this straight you think paying $15 dollars a month for a minimum of 40 hrs per month of play time is a bad deal?Dam that's about $o.38 cents a hour for entertainment that can't be too hard to justify