Well, I think you re looking through fanboy glasses as there is nothing in the bulk of the videos I have seen to show combat to be anymore fluid or realtime than any other MMO. I am not saying it is the same as others, just saying the visually I see the same type of guy facing left and hitting guy to right and guy facing forward through enemy hitting him and all that sort outta sync stuff.
Obviously, we cannot account for how it feels to play it, I am just remarking on how it looks.
Ok we know that combat looks the same because combat is combat so of course you are going to see a guy swing a weapon at the enemys face, combat in videogames hasnt changed for over 30 years, what they mean by revolutionary is that the way it works is different, the way you engage combat is different, and the way you use your abilities is also different. What else did you expect, wrestling around in the ground?
A man dies daily, only to be reborn in the morning, bigger, better and wiser.
-Playing AoC -Playing WoW -Retired- SWG -Retired- EVE -Retired- LotR
Computer (- Phenom 9600 Black Edition @ 2.81 Ghz (Quad Core CPU)- Gigabyte MA790FX-DS5 - 4 Gigs of PC 8500 ram (1066)- EVGA GeForce 8800 GTS PCI Express 2.0 - WD 500GB 7500RPM - Zalman CPU cooler (air cooled) - 24" Widescreen 1080P HD display).
Well, I think you re looking through fanboy glasses as there is nothing in the bulk of the videos I have seen to show combat to be anymore fluid or realtime than any other MMO. I am not saying it is the same as others, just saying the visually I see the same type of guy facing left and hitting guy to right and guy facing forward through enemy hitting him and all that sort outta sync stuff.
Obviously, we cannot account for how it feels to play it, I am just remarking on how it looks.
Of course in most ways it will be the same.
Real life. People face each other and slice each other to pieces.
Come on. The differences are in the graphics(in the tress/houses/sky). the combat sequences? They will always be the same. Slice/dice/mince. Only differences will be how you do it. And that Souleater looked awesome.
Didn't hear you reply about lag/desynch. Course. Without pvp fights, no way to comment on those. Til we see those, no way to know.
PS so in other words, quit looking at the cup half-empty with your complaints. Dammit! *winks*
True - combat is combat - but here is what bugs me 9with examples from that last video as that last one is the one that I got most discouraged seeing). consider that the big feature of the game is the real time combat, but what got me was in watching the video animation lag or whatever you want to call it in MMOs that has a guy in back of you get hit by you or lets a guy out of dagger range hit you too will be a total mess in a real time system, in a dice/hotbar system you are issuing actions so the animations being a bit off is less important as they are only representations of what has occured.
Look at how far away the bady on the left is and he has hit the hero here - he was actually off screen when he hit him with a melee weapon I snap the image a sec or so later as to show context.
This one shows the hero hitting a guy not even in front of him but behind him - he got in front of his target when a long move walked him through the target. Wow, like I can't get that kind of bad collision and bad detection in a game 5 years old.
This one shows another stupid old generation clipping with the hero half way inside the baddy - very cheap and very not next generation.
This one is bad blood 9universal agreement on that cheapy effect it seems) but also on the poor real time stuff - the guy whose blood is spewing dies and fell to the ground about 2 secs before I snapped the pic - check for yourself, it is at the end of the first fight shown. Again, just old gen cheap stuff and NOT the kind of stuff a real time combat game should be having happening so much.
Granted this pics are not the best quality, I just snapped them from the broswer but if you watch that first fight show you will see these sections of the fight any many more similar type things in ALL the video and most all of the ones I can recall seeing. What it shows is a typicall MMO out of sync animations and out of sync range/positioning and such but the system requires real time accuracy. this is a mess to me so far as I can see.
I'm no AoC fan. But it really does look like there is a guy infront of the character on that 2nd picture. Theres a health bar, and it looks like hes hiding behind a shield.
- - "What if the hokey pokey really is what it's all about?" - -
I've said it in the past but I only start to see more agreement from other people >_>
Has anyone with an "acolyte" in the sig ever said anything but "you-dunno-wtf-you-talking-about-this-game-is-awesome"?
L2takecriticism.
WTB Shadowbane 2
AmazingAveryAge of Conan AdvocateMemberUncommonPosts: 7,188
Originally posted by peenk
AoC is very overhyped. I've said it in the past but I only start to see more agreement from other people >_> Has anyone with an "acolyte" in the sig ever said anything but "you-dunno-wtf-you-talking-about-this-game-is-awesome"? L2takecriticism.
You know I think its great you have an opinion and Mr Smith has one too. I guess for me just watching the footage from what Mr Smith posted seemed pretty good to me, its not perfect but its not far either. I think that some people have to realise that its still Beta and your judging the game on an unfinished product. The footage is good but still needs some work, I, personally and not a fan of the extreme blood splashes. However, I do have the capacity to voice my concern and have done so, on the official boards and on IRC. As for the animations, I think the E3 footage was the best we have seen so far, but the detection from a melee weapon hitting an opponent does need tighting up a bit, but as said before this is Beta still.
Just to point out Peenk, in the last 6 months its still only the same old people, with the same "AoC is very overhyped" thinking that continue to post here. Except people attack the company more, attack the devs, attack the financial accounts of the company - you get the idea.
Peenk, wasn't it you who once said:
"If you know anything about Shadowbane then you know it was very buggy, but I'd still come back to it and never touch another mmo (except SB2, of course) if only the population was high enough for PvP to work. So, no, my standards when it comes to MMO, are not high at all(as opposed to FPS )."
Now, how come you can't give AoC a chance until it comes out? If the game is looking buggy to you and things aren't right, then by all means give the people making it a chance especially if you have played Shadowbane...?
"I just want to see actual high definition gameplay videos where I can clearly see game being played for 30+ minutes(at least 5 would be good, like that trailer of Tabula Rasa posted here a while ago). It will not mean "auto-impressed" for me but at least I will be able to get more information than some fly-bys over some hills/jungle/gate. Once again, I'm NOT saying that the game sucks or that it will be a flop but that the all the footage so far has not been as revealing as I want it to be"
Well let me just say I totally fricken agree with you on the second quote, ok. I don't think I am going to see 30+ mins being played from a game in Beta, think the only way is if I play it for myself in Beta or buy the product. I totally agree that more information should be given out on the most important long term elements of AoC - like Crafting and Seiging for example, but I will say I personally am quite a patient person.
Now im sorry I quoted you from a while back from one of your posts you made but I felt it was kinda relevent as we have moved forward in time with the game development. And I found something you said that I missed that I agree with !
In all the games I've been in Beta, the last things that were done before release was the tightening up of animations. I expect the same from the AoC developers, because you have (not anyone in particular) to be real dumb if you think that the gameplay for melee with play exactly like that. - talking about weapon swing detection here.
Oh Peenk I quoted you in blue - just because I know you prefer it
Its taken from a game i dont really want to play. I belive you have to control a army of mobs or something and the sheer thought alone makes me gasp. AoC seems to have better inverioment, better lore, better design and better stationary graphic. Why cant they get the most important thing, in this realtime combat game, right?
What put me off AOC PvP is the obvious lag in the demonstration videos. Whats worse about it is that such videos are usually poilished up to look good yet for some reason they couldnt get rid of the lag spikes . Another thing is the colours sometimes i find it hard to differentuate between the Avatar and the ground. That can b fixed tho im sure in Beta it will just need some better lighting and maybee slightly different Avatar textures.
The points previous posters amde such as bad clipping etc are also eliments that make AOC seem unpolished. So because of the bad impression it made to me ill probably avoid AOC at first till i see how things go say 6 months after release. I did exactly the same for vanguard and it seems my waiting 6 months was justified, so till 6 months after release ill avoid AOC.
"Kill one man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god." -- Jean Rostand
Weapons go through friendlies all the time in AoC without damaging them. And damage seems to get applied alot without the weapon going through anything, alot.
Look, the pictures are fuzzy because I snapped them from a browser - but if you watch the video you can see what I am talking about for yoruself. Is it terrible or the worst thing in MMOs ever - of course not, it is actually quite typical. but that is the thing, this game has been hyped as oh so next generation adn real time and revolutionary when, in fact, the videos show these types of things to be quite typical.
I also think some people are forgetting that with the real time combo combat that these animation lags and other typical MMO combat out of sync issues will have a HUGE, HUGE detrimental effect on combat because like in an FPS you are reacting in real time - so if animations and such are out of sync, if ranges don't show properly in real time, if enemies off screen can hit in melee range and those sorts of issues then the real time combat model breaks down miserably whereas in a typical turn based combat model the issue is just one of aesthetics.
Weapons go through friendlies all the time in AoC without damaging them. And damage seems to get applied alot without the weapon going through anything, alot.
Look, the pictures are fuzzy because I snapped them from a browser - but if you watch the video you can see what I am talking about for yoruself. Is it terrible or the worst thing in MMOs ever - of course not, it is actually quite typical. but that is the thing, this game has been hyped as oh so next generation adn real time and revolutionary when, in fact, the videos show these types of things to be quite typical.
I also think some people are forgetting that with the real time combo combat that these animation lags and other typical MMO combat out of sync issues will have a HUGE, HUGE detrimental effect on combat because like in an FPS you are reacting in real time - so if animations and such are out of sync, if ranges don't show properly in real time, if enemies off screen can hit in melee range and those sorts of issues then the real time combat model breaks down miserably whereas in a typical turn based combat model the issue is just one of aesthetics.
I don't find that any different then WOW. In WOW if you use FEAR, Or STUN or Anything that you need to time right, which you SHOULD if you want to be a good PvP'er specialy Rogues/Warriors/Mages Timming is extremely important. If you lag and your stun wore off then most of the time your screwed. COmbo's being part of the game is new, but MAKING Combo's isn't Who here played UO? ANyone can tell you that back in the day, if you fought a mage you saw, Vas An Ort, Corp Por. Which was Explosion, then Energy Bolt. That was the typical combination, then after Poisen became useful, it was added to the end of that making it a 3 spell combo that MOST Mages used. Combo's arn't totaly unhead of, but this is the first time a game is actualy making it part of the game. Kind of smart if you ask me.
I don't find that any different then WOW. ... Combo's arn't totaly unhead of, but this is the first time a game is actualy making it part of the game. Kind of smart if you ask me.
I know it isn't much different than other MMOs - that to me is what is disappointing.
As for combos and such - just try this to get what I am saying - go watch one of these fighting games that the DEVs of AoC are allways referencing to describe the real time combat they have strived for. Do you see the same kind of things there? No, not at all because the gaems wouldn't work properly if you had these things happening. An FPS is the same way - animations must be accurate in order to give you correct information from which to take the real time action.
Look, I am not saying it think AoC combat sucks, not saying I think the game sucks - I just find these videos to be quite typical of what I would expect from MMO combat and given how much they have hyped all this next gen, real time, revolutionary combat dynamic it seems to be the same old thing.
AOC combat is done in real time. Yup, that means no more cartoony superfast combos with pinball like numbers flying in the air that so many are used to seeing in other mmo games. I really hate the comparison of AOC to Warhammer because War is nothing more than an upgraded pvp version of WoW. So if War gets more members than AOC who cares. AOC is beeing marketed as a game for grown ups.
It is simple, if you are tired of cartoony mmo games then AOC is probably the game for you. AOC will have more in-depth pvp then most mmo games of today and ones who are coming out soon anyway and the pve in AOC will be fun as well.
So how is it you and others can flame people for critiquing based on only seeing the videos (all we have to go on and comment on at this point) but it is OK to defend it when you haven't played either? Point being, an opinion based on what is shown to date is valid whether it is pro or con in regards to what it says about the game to come.
So far - it is perfectly fair to characterize the combat videos as laggy, unsynchronized, and the much hyped gore looks like something made by an untalented teenager (at least the spiting blood does).
What I'm saying is quite simple. Don't doom the game based from videoes. Saying "the combat in AoC looks unfinished and bad judging from the videoes" is fine, but when you say "GAME SUCKS, NO DISCUSSION"(or something similiar) it's wrong.
I didn't say the game sux, I said it looks typical of other MMOs and I see allot of problems with the things I pointed out. IN fact, I find it hard to see how anyone can watch those videos and see anything that looks like what they say the game is - yes graphics are nice but I am talking about the combat mechanics and so far what has been shown looks nothing more advanced or better than anything I have seen in MMOs allready with poorly synced animations, out of position hits and such, and really cheesy blood effects.
I know it isn't much different than other MMOs - that to me is what is disappointing. Look, I am not saying it think AoC combat sucks, not saying I think the game sucks - I just find these videos to be quite typical of what I would expect from MMO combat and given how much they have hyped all this next gen, real time, revolutionary combat dynamic it seems to be the same old thing.
I do so much agree with this Agent that its frightening; clone or suchs?
AoC does look promising and good. It looks like a game i want to try out. But ive been going from a state where i showed footage to all my friends, saying :"ouch, check this wow killer", to a point where i rather would forget the newest combat footages. Thats how hype works btw, and i guess it would have been wise to lay out the less apealing parts of the game from start. What i think could be done, would be slowing down the combat, thus making physics less buggy and random.
Another thing ive been wondering about is, what was this games core idea? I mean did Funcom had a brilliant combat engine and was looking for a game which could fit this. Or did they get the Conan license and then said ; this game have to be revoloutionary in any sence? Last thing would prolly be quite dangerous. If the game is somewhat build up upon new revoloutinary combatstyle then you need to get this right, or, not just right; better then right, something you would pull out as a example every time the talk fall on how mmorpg combat should be. And i had high hopes that my neighbours up north would come up with something realy exciting:)
Pro/win: Swing at ur opponent, jump back, cirkling, swing again, jump back , attack and use combo, jump back and watch enemy fall to the ground.
Not so win: Randomly swing, swing ,swing, swing, release combo, stand inside a mob and attack next mob.......
good arguments from everyone, but dont forget...that its not quit in beta yet. and even when an MMO comes out, it can take 2-3 months before players are more happy/satisfied with it
I'm really hoping AoC is as good as the hype, I really need a replacement for WoW which I'm quickly getting fed up with (the coming addon doesn't impress me at all, more of the same old crap as before).
The only game you can compare AoC's combat with (in a released game) is probably DDO, so I think it will play out something similar to that.
I didn't say the game sux, I said it looks typical of other MMOs and I see allot of problems with the things I pointed out. IN fact, I find it hard to see how anyone can watch those videos and see anything that looks like what they say the game is - yes graphics are nice but I am talking about the combat mechanics and so far what has been shown looks nothing more advanced or better than anything I have seen in MMOs allready with poorly synced animations, out of position hits and such, and really cheesy blood effects.
I'm really hoping AoC is as good as the hype, I really need a replacement for WoW which I'm quickly getting fed up with (the coming addon doesn't impress me at all, more of the same old crap as before). The only game you can compare AoC's combat with (in a released game) is probably DDO, so I think it will play out something similar to that.
I know exactly how u feel. I have it the same way, and i need a challening combat style, i need less comic LoreLight. And theres no time as the present when it comes to launch WoW killers/competetion. WoW is starting to get some years on its back and especially the graphics, combat , charcustomization and pvp are areas where its possible to do a better job. But if the next 2-3 years dont present a game which does exaclty that, you will just se Blizzard throw 1billion dollars and hundreds of the best coders, designers and artist after Starcraft online or Diablo3 or something similar. And then it will become very, very hard to break the monopole....
My point is I hope the combat actions look and feel more "connected" to other players/mobs when release time comes. There's a lot I like about this game, but I want my combat actions to make an impact on the thing I'm figthing. Copious amounts of bloodspray and scrolling numbers aren't doing it for me.
Okay folks, time to see whats wrong with AoC THIS week....
Yet another doomsday thread. Oh my God! Oh my God! Combat looks half assed in videos. I mean, really, look the spear isnt hitting the neck its hitting the entire body!
I agree that the swings dont look like theyre making any real contact. Hey guys, guess what? Developers cant make precise combat like that cause it will further LAG THE GAME. AoC has real time combat with a combination system that will make the game different, not on the fact that you can strike in precise locations. Every MMO has had this problem, the MMO I have seen that had precise combat was Asheron's Call with the high-medium-low system (but the animations didnt connect either). They have character reactions when youre hitting them, theres collision detection, so quite frankly Funcom managed to pull real time combat off in an MMO while sacrificing some graphical add ons.
Take a look at any MMO and you'll see theres not much going on in the "combat connection" department. AoC is focusing more on gameplay than graphics - and Im happy its that way.
I think these doomsday threads are kind of turning into the teacher in Charley Brown, Im starting to skip over them and theyre having this "wahh" sound to them.
MMO players are like spoiled children. They want everything, mine mine everything or nothing!
how'd you get "doomsday" from this thread? As I see if, people in this thread actually like a lot of what they're seeing, they just have a concern about a specific aspect of the combat system.
Comments
Well, I think you re looking through fanboy glasses as there is nothing in the bulk of the videos I have seen to show combat to be anymore fluid or realtime than any other MMO. I am not saying it is the same as others, just saying the visually I see the same type of guy facing left and hitting guy to right and guy facing forward through enemy hitting him and all that sort outta sync stuff.
Obviously, we cannot account for how it feels to play it, I am just remarking on how it looks.
--------------------------------
Achiever 60.00%, Socializer 53.00%, Killer 47.00%, Explorer 40.00%
Intel Core i7 Quad, Intel X58 SLi, 6G Corsair XMS DDR3, Intel X-25 SSD, 3 WD Velociraptor SATA SuperTrak SAS EX8650 Array, OCZ 1250W PS, GTX 295, xFi, 32" 1080p LCD
Ok we know that combat looks the same because combat is combat so of course you are going to see a guy swing a weapon at the enemys face, combat in videogames hasnt changed for over 30 years, what they mean by revolutionary is that the way it works is different, the way you engage combat is different, and the way you use your abilities is also different. What else did you expect, wrestling around in the ground?
A man dies daily, only to be reborn in the morning, bigger, better and wiser.
-Playing AoC
-Playing WoW
-Retired- SWG
-Retired- EVE
-Retired- LotR
Computer (- Phenom 9600 Black Edition @ 2.81 Ghz (Quad Core CPU)- Gigabyte MA790FX-DS5 - 4 Gigs of PC 8500 ram (1066)- EVGA GeForce 8800 GTS PCI Express 2.0 - WD 500GB 7500RPM - Zalman CPU cooler (air cooled)
- 24" Widescreen 1080P HD display).
Of course in most ways it will be the same.
Real life. People face each other and slice each other to pieces.
Come on. The differences are in the graphics(in the tress/houses/sky). the combat sequences? They will always be the same. Slice/dice/mince. Only differences will be how you do it. And that Souleater looked awesome.
Didn't hear you reply about lag/desynch. Course. Without pvp fights, no way to comment on those. Til we see those, no way to know.
PS so in other words, quit looking at the cup half-empty with your complaints. Dammit! *winks*
True - combat is combat - but here is what bugs me 9with examples from that last video as that last one is the one that I got most discouraged seeing). consider that the big feature of the game is the real time combat, but what got me was in watching the video animation lag or whatever you want to call it in MMOs that has a guy in back of you get hit by you or lets a guy out of dagger range hit you too will be a total mess in a real time system, in a dice/hotbar system you are issuing actions so the animations being a bit off is less important as they are only representations of what has occured.
Look at how far away the bady on the left is and he has hit the hero here - he was actually off screen when he hit him with a melee weapon I snap the image a sec or so later as to show context.
This one shows the hero hitting a guy not even in front of him but behind him - he got in front of his target when a long move walked him through the target. Wow, like I can't get that kind of bad collision and bad detection in a game 5 years old.
This one shows another stupid old generation clipping with the hero half way inside the baddy - very cheap and very not next generation.
This one is bad blood 9universal agreement on that cheapy effect it seems) but also on the poor real time stuff - the guy whose blood is spewing dies and fell to the ground about 2 secs before I snapped the pic - check for yourself, it is at the end of the first fight shown. Again, just old gen cheap stuff and NOT the kind of stuff a real time combat game should be having happening so much.
Granted this pics are not the best quality, I just snapped them from the broswer but if you watch that first fight show you will see these sections of the fight any many more similar type things in ALL the video and most all of the ones I can recall seeing. What it shows is a typicall MMO out of sync animations and out of sync range/positioning and such but the system requires real time accuracy. this is a mess to me so far as I can see.
--------------------------------
Achiever 60.00%, Socializer 53.00%, Killer 47.00%, Explorer 40.00%
Intel Core i7 Quad, Intel X58 SLi, 6G Corsair XMS DDR3, Intel X-25 SSD, 3 WD Velociraptor SATA SuperTrak SAS EX8650 Array, OCZ 1250W PS, GTX 295, xFi, 32" 1080p LCD
yea, i watched the trailors and the fighting seemed slow. however, it isnt even in beta yet...so...
I'm no AoC fan. But it really does look like there is a guy infront of the character on that 2nd picture. Theres a health bar, and it looks like hes hiding behind a shield.
- - "What if the hokey pokey really is what it's all about?" - -
AoC is very overhyped.
I've said it in the past but I only start to see more agreement from other people >_>
Has anyone with an "acolyte" in the sig ever said anything but "you-dunno-wtf-you-talking-about-this-game-is-awesome"?
L2takecriticism.
WTB Shadowbane 2
Just to point out Peenk, in the last 6 months its still only the same old people, with the same "AoC is very overhyped" thinking that continue to post here. Except people attack the company more, attack the devs, attack the financial accounts of the company - you get the idea.
Peenk, wasn't it you who once said:
"If you know anything about Shadowbane then you know it was very buggy, but I'd still come back to it and never touch another mmo (except SB2, of course) if only the population was high enough for PvP to work. So, no, my standards when it comes to MMO, are not high at all(as opposed to FPS
)."
Now, how come you can't give AoC a chance until it comes out? If the game is looking buggy to you and things aren't right, then by all means give the people making it a chance especially if you have played Shadowbane...?
"I just want to see actual high definition gameplay videos where I can clearly see game being played for 30+ minutes(at least 5 would be good, like that trailer of Tabula Rasa posted here a while ago). It will not mean "auto-impressed" for me but at least I will be able to get more information than some fly-bys over some hills/jungle/gate. Once again, I'm NOT saying that the game sucks or that it will be a flop but that the all the footage so far has not been as revealing as I want it to be"
Well let me just say I totally fricken agree with you on the second quote, ok. I don't think I am going to see 30+ mins being played from a game in Beta, think the only way is if I play it for myself in Beta or buy the product. I totally agree that more information should be given out on the most important long term elements of AoC - like Crafting and Seiging for example, but I will say I personally am quite a patient person.
Now im sorry I quoted you from a while back from one of your posts you made but I felt it was kinda relevent as we have moved forward in time with the game development. And I found something you said that I missed that I agree with !
In all the games I've been in Beta, the last things that were done before release was the tightening up of animations. I expect the same from the AoC developers, because you have (not anyone in particular) to be real dumb if you think that the gameplay for melee with play exactly like that. - talking about weapon swing detection here.
Oh Peenk I quoted you in blue - just because I know you prefer it
Oh btw. Heres some of the stuff i miss in the "sofar" footage from AoC; Physics when its absolutely best. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Psx8Sk02MiU&mode=related&search=
Its taken from a game i dont really want to play. I belive you have to control a army of mobs or something and the sheer thought alone makes me gasp. AoC seems to have better inverioment, better lore, better design and better stationary graphic. Why cant they get the most important thing, in this realtime combat game, right?
What put me off AOC PvP is the obvious lag in the demonstration videos. Whats worse about it is that such videos are usually poilished up to look good yet for some reason they couldnt get rid of the lag spikes
. Another thing is the colours sometimes i find it hard to differentuate between the Avatar and the ground. That can b fixed tho im sure in Beta it will just need some better lighting and maybee slightly different Avatar textures.
The points previous posters amde such as bad clipping etc are also eliments that make AOC seem unpolished. So because of the bad impression it made to me ill probably avoid AOC at first till i see how things go say 6 months after release. I did exactly the same for vanguard and it seems my waiting 6 months was justified, so till 6 months after release ill avoid AOC.
"Kill one man, and you are a murderer. Kill millions of men, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god."
-- Jean Rostand
Weapons go through friendlies all the time in AoC without damaging them. And damage seems to get applied alot without the weapon going through anything, alot.
Look, the pictures are fuzzy because I snapped them from a browser - but if you watch the video you can see what I am talking about for yoruself. Is it terrible or the worst thing in MMOs ever - of course not, it is actually quite typical. but that is the thing, this game has been hyped as oh so next generation adn real time and revolutionary when, in fact, the videos show these types of things to be quite typical.
I also think some people are forgetting that with the real time combo combat that these animation lags and other typical MMO combat out of sync issues will have a HUGE, HUGE detrimental effect on combat because like in an FPS you are reacting in real time - so if animations and such are out of sync, if ranges don't show properly in real time, if enemies off screen can hit in melee range and those sorts of issues then the real time combat model breaks down miserably whereas in a typical turn based combat model the issue is just one of aesthetics.
--------------------------------
Achiever 60.00%, Socializer 53.00%, Killer 47.00%, Explorer 40.00%
Intel Core i7 Quad, Intel X58 SLi, 6G Corsair XMS DDR3, Intel X-25 SSD, 3 WD Velociraptor SATA SuperTrak SAS EX8650 Array, OCZ 1250W PS, GTX 295, xFi, 32" 1080p LCD
I don't find that any different then WOW. In WOW if you use FEAR, Or STUN or Anything that you need to time right, which you SHOULD if you want to be a good PvP'er specialy Rogues/Warriors/Mages Timming is extremely important. If you lag and your stun wore off then most of the time your screwed. COmbo's being part of the game is new, but MAKING Combo's isn't Who here played UO? ANyone can tell you that back in the day, if you fought a mage you saw, Vas An Ort, Corp Por. Which was Explosion, then Energy Bolt. That was the typical combination, then after Poisen became useful, it was added to the end of that making it a 3 spell combo that MOST Mages used. Combo's arn't totaly unhead of, but this is the first time a game is actualy making it part of the game. Kind of smart if you ask me.
I know it isn't much different than other MMOs - that to me is what is disappointing.
As for combos and such - just try this to get what I am saying - go watch one of these fighting games that the DEVs of AoC are allways referencing to describe the real time combat they have strived for. Do you see the same kind of things there? No, not at all because the gaems wouldn't work properly if you had these things happening. An FPS is the same way - animations must be accurate in order to give you correct information from which to take the real time action.
Look, I am not saying it think AoC combat sucks, not saying I think the game sucks - I just find these videos to be quite typical of what I would expect from MMO combat and given how much they have hyped all this next gen, real time, revolutionary combat dynamic it seems to be the same old thing.
--------------------------------
Achiever 60.00%, Socializer 53.00%, Killer 47.00%, Explorer 40.00%
Intel Core i7 Quad, Intel X58 SLi, 6G Corsair XMS DDR3, Intel X-25 SSD, 3 WD Velociraptor SATA SuperTrak SAS EX8650 Array, OCZ 1250W PS, GTX 295, xFi, 32" 1080p LCD
AOC combat is done in real time. Yup, that means no more cartoony superfast combos with pinball like numbers flying in the air that so many are used to seeing in other mmo games. I really hate the comparison of AOC to Warhammer because War is nothing more than an upgraded pvp version of WoW. So if War gets more members than AOC who cares. AOC is beeing marketed as a game for grown ups.
It is simple, if you are tired of cartoony mmo games then AOC is probably the game for you. AOC will have more in-depth pvp then most mmo games of today and ones who are coming out soon anyway and the pve in AOC will be fun as well.
So how is it you and others can flame people for critiquing based on only seeing the videos (all we have to go on and comment on at this point) but it is OK to defend it when you haven't played either? Point being, an opinion based on what is shown to date is valid whether it is pro or con in regards to what it says about the game to come.
So far - it is perfectly fair to characterize the combat videos as laggy, unsynchronized, and the much hyped gore looks like something made by an untalented teenager (at least the spiting blood does).
What I'm saying is quite simple. Don't doom the game based from videoes. Saying "the combat in AoC looks unfinished and bad judging from the videoes" is fine, but when you say "GAME SUCKS, NO DISCUSSION"(or something similiar) it's wrong.
I didn't say the game sux, I said it looks typical of other MMOs and I see allot of problems with the things I pointed out. IN fact, I find it hard to see how anyone can watch those videos and see anything that looks like what they say the game is - yes graphics are nice but I am talking about the combat mechanics and so far what has been shown looks nothing more advanced or better than anything I have seen in MMOs allready with poorly synced animations, out of position hits and such, and really cheesy blood effects.
--------------------------------
Achiever 60.00%, Socializer 53.00%, Killer 47.00%, Explorer 40.00%
Intel Core i7 Quad, Intel X58 SLi, 6G Corsair XMS DDR3, Intel X-25 SSD, 3 WD Velociraptor SATA SuperTrak SAS EX8650 Array, OCZ 1250W PS, GTX 295, xFi, 32" 1080p LCD
I do so much agree with this Agent that its frightening; clone or suchs?
AoC does look promising and good. It looks like a game i want to try out. But ive been going from a state where i showed footage to all my friends, saying :"ouch, check this wow killer", to a point where i rather would forget the newest combat footages. Thats how hype works btw, and i guess it would have been wise to lay out the less apealing parts of the game from start. What i think could be done, would be slowing down the combat, thus making physics less buggy and random.
Another thing ive been wondering about is, what was this games core idea? I mean did Funcom had a brilliant combat engine and was looking for a game which could fit this. Or did they get the Conan license and then said ; this game have to be revoloutionary in any sence? Last thing would prolly be quite dangerous. If the game is somewhat build up upon new revoloutinary combatstyle then you need to get this right, or, not just right; better then right, something you would pull out as a example every time the talk fall on how mmorpg combat should be. And i had high hopes that my neighbours up north would come up with something realy exciting:)
Pro/win: Swing at ur opponent, jump back, cirkling, swing again, jump back , attack and use combo, jump back and watch enemy fall to the ground.
Not so win: Randomly swing, swing ,swing, swing, release combo, stand inside a mob and attack next mob.......
good arguments from everyone, but dont forget...that its not quit in beta yet. and even when an MMO comes out, it can take 2-3 months before players are more happy/satisfied with it
I'm really hoping AoC is as good as the hype, I really need a replacement for WoW which I'm quickly getting fed up with (the coming addon doesn't impress me at all, more of the same old crap as before).
The only game you can compare AoC's combat with (in a released game) is probably DDO, so I think it will play out something similar to that.
exactly
I know exactly how u feel. I have it the same way, and i need a challening combat style, i need less comic LoreLight. And theres no time as the present when it comes to launch WoW killers/competetion. WoW is starting to get some years on its back and especially the graphics, combat , charcustomization and pvp are areas where its possible to do a better job. But if the next 2-3 years dont present a game which does exaclty that, you will just se Blizzard throw 1billion dollars and hundreds of the best coders, designers and artist after Starcraft online or Diablo3 or something similar. And then it will become very, very hard to break the monopole....
This is what AoC combat looks like to me. The only difference is that there's an actual collision at the end.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=3YMVzh8jABE
kidding obviously.
My point is I hope the combat actions look and feel more "connected" to other players/mobs when release time comes. There's a lot I like about this game, but I want my combat actions to make an impact on the thing I'm figthing. Copious amounts of bloodspray and scrolling numbers aren't doing it for me.
Okay folks, time to see whats wrong with AoC THIS week....
Yet another doomsday thread. Oh my God! Oh my God! Combat looks half assed in videos. I mean, really, look the spear isnt hitting the neck its hitting the entire body!
I agree that the swings dont look like theyre making any real contact. Hey guys, guess what? Developers cant make precise combat like that cause it will further LAG THE GAME. AoC has real time combat with a combination system that will make the game different, not on the fact that you can strike in precise locations. Every MMO has had this problem, the MMO I have seen that had precise combat was Asheron's Call with the high-medium-low system (but the animations didnt connect either). They have character reactions when youre hitting them, theres collision detection, so quite frankly Funcom managed to pull real time combat off in an MMO while sacrificing some graphical add ons.
Take a look at any MMO and you'll see theres not much going on in the "combat connection" department. AoC is focusing more on gameplay than graphics - and Im happy its that way.
I think these doomsday threads are kind of turning into the teacher in Charley Brown, Im starting to skip over them and theyre having this "wahh" sound to them.
MMO players are like spoiled children. They want everything, mine mine everything or nothing!
how'd you get "doomsday" from this thread? As I see if, people in this thread actually like a lot of what they're seeing, they just have a concern about a specific aspect of the combat system.