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I love SOE
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Bleh, I'm sorry I just can't stop myself from posting this. They did not try to make EQ WoW, they tried to make it better, more advanced, they made it more advanced but not better. And calling people idiots based on their opinions is just plain wrong. Yes we disagree on some things but "If you have nothing nice to say, say nothing at all"
Oh and this is my OPINION, WoW isn't THAT great, it's too Equipment based, the people with the most bling is victorious, I like games that take skill, but that's why WoW is more casual...if you call that casual...I think it is.
fair enough, I shouldn't have called them 'idiots' , but you have to see it's not my opinion that EQ has turned into WoW, i read it from an anti SOEr that was ranting about 2 pages ago.
And with all due respect personal opinions aren't relevant in this situation, as the numbers and subscribers are what are relevant. Many people find it fun, so the words 'another wow clone' and 'not fun' in the same sentence is obsquere. Sorry for any offense my previous 'insult' may have caused.
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I think you should give people some slack. Those people aren't idiots, they are folks giving thier opinion which are very much as valid as yours. There is no right or wrong about it.
I don't listen to Madonna just because she's sold a lot of albums. I just don't like her stuff. That simple. So, I am wrong and an idiot in your eyes to state that?
I should think you are an idiot if you don't care for the greatest band that ever graced the Earth... Rush?
WoW is not my cup of tea. That doesn't mean that I think that YOU are an idiot fo enjoying it. It means that people are individuals... not little lemmings that follow the popular thing, game or crowd.
Bleh, okay this thread is utter flame now. So I may as well get in
yeah SOE screwed us with SWG, EQ, and they're working their way up in EQ2, and may just leave Vanguard alone...maybe. Either way SOE is better HELPING companies make games, and by help I mean NO updates, just do what they tell them to do and help make it work faster.
pwned??? yeah real mature there. Julio torres and john smedley are the two who pushed the nge..julio torres is now one of the lead designers on the new stars wars unleash the force, and john smedley is now president of sony online entertainment. Those are facts..but you can use your leet speak all you want.
I like to think that LA had just as much to do with the SWG crisis if not more than SOE did. Lets face it LA's track record is about as tarnished as SOE's is when it comes to games. Even George Lucas can't make up his mind on how his movies should be.
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You wouldn't understand
I wouldn't imagine boycotting the company of someone that revolutionized computing, and did a lot towards increasing the popularity of PCs around the world, probably the main reason you're sitting on yours right now. Bill gates also makes ALL his workers give a percentage of their wage to charity, and the charity work they do and money they will give when they die is incredible. Not really relevant to the post, but just because they are a monopoly doesn't make them bad. Sorry for the irrelevance.
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God, I love everything about Microsoft's console gaming but GOD they actually DID screw us over, I have had 4 3 Red Rings now and all of the repairs are free, sure I got a game here and a hard drive here, but it's *tear* crap. I love it but it's crap!
OMG! This became Console Gaming Thread. MOVE PLEASE!
I wouldn't imagine boycotting the company of someone that revolutionized computing, and did a lot towards increasing the popularity of PCs around the world, probably the main reason you're sitting on yours right now. Bill gates also makes ALL his workers give a percentage of their wage to charity, and the charity work they do and money they will give when they die is incredible. Not really relevant to the post, but just because they are a monopoly doesn't make them bad. Sorry for the irrelevance.
you're so naive, its entertaining.
Again to ronan:
Show me where they programmed it.. show me the code where those two people wrote it. You can't. You can't even name me other programmers. Your posts are useless, and you know nothing of the MMO industry other than the word vomit you've been coughing up.
http://spellborn.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page
Ugg, I am so disappointed with this generation of consoles its not even funny. Xbox is very unreliable, PS3 is just now starting to get hard hitting games, and the Wii. . .well lets just say its great for parties.
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You wouldn't understand
Ronan I find you to be a fool.
You claim SWG was a World of Warcraft clone. THINK about that for once. If SOE wanted to make a World of Warcraft clone, what would they have used to experiment? Their (at the time) mediocore fantasy based game EQ2 or their wildly popular sci fi based SWG. You would use EQ2, so if it didn't work you wouldn't lose as many subscribers. And it's the same genre.
SWG on the other hand is the result of a partnership of Lucasarts and SOE. So if we can conclude it wasn't SOE's idea to make a worldof warcraft clone (they would have simply used a more similar product like EQ2) We can conclude Lucasarts who only has ONE MMO (SWG) is the driving influence behind that. Let's face it, Lucasarts doesn't always make the best games. They CAN make good games, but not always. Putting a LA sticker on it does not make it gold.
And while I don't like Julio Torres. I have had the chance to talk with John Smedley. He is an extremely decent man. You might not consider it if you base it off "SOE" decisions. But if you ever get a chance to talk with him, you might be extremely surprised. John Smedley also didn't get promoted because of anything that happened with SWG. It's because he was with the company since EQ.
I wouldn't imagine boycotting the company of someone that revolutionized computing, and did a lot towards increasing the popularity of PCs around the world, probably the main reason you're sitting on yours right now. Bill gates also makes ALL his workers give a percentage of their wage to charity, and the charity work they do and money they will give when they die is incredible. Not really relevant to the post, but just because they are a monopoly doesn't make them bad. Sorry for the irrelevance.
you're so naive, its entertaining.
ok ronan32, tell me why you would boycott Microsoft, and whether you think you'd even be able to complain about SWG if Microsoft had not been around.
(btw, to give you a hint, the answer is no.)
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They are not programmer so they did not program it, they told those programmers what to program..at least i have a point, your just talking utter crap. instead of being ignorant just watch the video.
that's the problem. To have a 'long stretch of good stuff' what they really need is support, which so many of you that are living in the past simply won't give. Faith also. EQ has been going for like 9 years, surely that's a long enough stretch. I always see people on these forums saying EQ is still the best of the best. EQ2 also. VG would have twice the numbers if people weren't so hung up on the past, and would likely have twice the number of developers, twice the speed of updates and twice the content in each update.
It's a chain reaction you see. I've already established that I like VG and I will continue playing, but you are actually damaging MY experience by warning other people off. I hardly see this as fair?
Well, I suppose that's a fair point, but still, if a company acts without ethics then people deserve to know it.
But Ithink you lay too much on us. You make us too powerful. I think VG can stand on its own (or not) as a game.
I'm very vocal about some things, like I was about Oblivion. I didn't hate it, it just didn't meet my expectations as "Morrowind 2". Maybe if MW had never existed or I never played it would have meant that I would have viewed Oblivion very differently. In fact, there was a pretty huge number of MW players that felt as I did, and yet many more that thought we were crazy.
In the end though, Oblivion was a bid commercial success and was an award winning game! Does that make me wrong? No, not in my eyes. I don't care what awards it won, it did not meet my expectations.
We may be a vocal crowd, but I think it might be going a little far to imagine that people are actually making decisions based on what we say. Careful, we could get full of ourselves here any minute... lol.
I wouldn't imagine boycotting the company of someone that revolutionized computing, and did a lot towards increasing the popularity of PCs around the world, probably the main reason you're sitting on yours right now. Bill gates also makes ALL his workers give a percentage of their wage to charity, and the charity work they do and money they will give when they die is incredible. Not really relevant to the post, but just because they are a monopoly doesn't make them bad. Sorry for the irrelevance.
you're so naive, its entertaining.
ok ronan32, tell me why you would boycott Microsoft, and whether you think you'd even be able to complain about SWG if Microsoft had not been around.
(btw, to give you a hint, the answer is no.)
Ever hear of a mac?
I like to think that LA had just as much to do with the SWG crisis if not more than SOE did. Lets face it LA's track record is about as tarnished as SOE's is when it comes to games. Even George Lucas can't make up his mind on how his movies should be.
That is a nice comforting thought if you still play SOE games, except that every SOE developer that has talked publicly about the NGE has admitted that SOE dreamed up the concept and had to sell it to higher management. Lucas Arts is pretty much guilty of being upset that SOE mishandled the game since launch and approving the idiotic resolution that SOE dream up.
I wouldn't imagine boycotting the company of someone that revolutionized computing, and did a lot towards increasing the popularity of PCs around the world, probably the main reason you're sitting on yours right now. Bill gates also makes ALL his workers give a percentage of their wage to charity, and the charity work they do and money they will give when they die is incredible. Not really relevant to the post, but just because they are a monopoly doesn't make them bad. Sorry for the irrelevance.
you're so naive, its entertaining.
ok ronan32, tell me why you would boycott Microsoft, and whether you think you'd even be able to complain about SWG if Microsoft had not been around.
(btw, to give you a hint, the answer is no.)
Ever hear of a mac?
More than likely Mac would have taken over, however, there very well could have been another person programming an OS in his basement that would have been the new Microsoft. It is impossible to know. Just like saying if the wheel was not invented when it was would we still have cars?
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You wouldn't understand
To ronan:
I have worked in the MMO industry for almost 2 years. You are the one who is ignorant. You have no idea what the system is or how it works. It works similar to a factory with everyone on different projects, helping each other. A couple people watch over but do not actively help, or even sort orders. Just because you have random youtube videos does not make it right. As I said before YOU PERSONALLY do not know what happened, you are just repeating utter crap from other people. Your posts are useless. Stop spitting out word vomit.
I'm going grocery shopping.. so won't be back and my threads will be covered by 10 pages... so to everyone fair well.
(Hopefully ronan can learn that he isn't right because he is repeating what some random person said in a blog, rather than knowing facts for himself)
http://spellborn.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page
that's the problem. To have a 'long stretch of good stuff' what they really need is support, which so many of you that are living in the past simply won't give. Faith also. EQ has been going for like 9 years, surely that's a long enough stretch. I always see people on these forums saying EQ is still the best of the best. EQ2 also. VG would have twice the numbers if people weren't so hung up on the past, and would likely have twice the number of developers, twice the speed of updates and twice the content in each update.
It's a chain reaction you see. I've already established that I like VG and I will continue playing, but you are actually damaging MY experience by warning other people off. I hardly see this as fair?
Well, I suppose that's a fair point, but still, if a company acts without ethics then people deserve to know it.
But Ithink you lay too much on us. You make us too powerful. I think VG can stand on its own (or not) as a game.
I'm very vocal about some things, like I was about Oblivion. I didn't hate it, it just didn't meet my expectations as "Morrowind 2". Maybe if MW had never existed or I never played it would have meant that I would have viewed Oblivion very differently. In fact, there was a pretty huge number of MW players that felt as I did, and yet many more that thought we were crazy.
In the end though, Oblivion was a bid commercial success and was an award winning game! Does that make me wrong? No, not in my eyes. I don't care what awards it won, it did not meet my expectations.
We may be a vocal crowd, but I think it might be going a little far to imagine that people are actually making decisions based on what we say. Careful, we could get full of ourselves here any minute... lol.
Maybe I am giving you too much power, but you won't deny that your goal is to sway people from SOE games (i've seen numerous posts comfirming this to be true) , and if that works for even one person I think it is unfair and selfish. Sorry but Vanguard shows no sign of failing any time soon, it is growing and bettering itself, so warning players not to play it because of the remote possibility they could mess it up is just outragous, for the person you have warned (as they won't get to judge for themselves) , and me, as I will never get to play with that person. You may think that to be silly, but it is just what I think.
But yeah, you do have a lot of influence, if I'm reading reviews and I suddenly see 'STAY AWAY, THEY WILL MESS IT UP' etc etc, I will instantly get a stone dropped in my stomach, and temporarily be put off until I get to the bottom of it.
A lot of people work like this, they (and me) need to be reassured of a game before they try it, and one bit of negative feedback can make all the difference and outweight 10 positive comments.
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I'm going to have to agree with Da1e to some degree here. Actually I have read for the past 2 years, at least in these forums, how much people "hate" SoE. They are angry at SoE made some "stupid" decisions along the way. Good golly Ms Molly look what SoE did to SWG..OMG...I can't sleep at night now and my dog has stopped barking, my clock runs backwards now... my girlfriend has stopped calling me, my mom's apple pie has no taste! Oh look what SoE has done to my life because of what they've done to SWG! I "HATE" SoE! HATE? Really now? You readers "hate" a gaming development company and everyone associated with it including their families, the towns they live/lived in, the earth they trod upon, and even the air they breath? Would you "haters" give up your personal freedom by acting out your hatred with some sort of homicide against anyone from SoE because they ruined your favorite sci-fi game of all times? Is this the attitude of "mature" gamers. or spoiled brats?
Truly, I do believe you see my point? Or, don't you? Rather absurd to hold a grudge against an entire group of people simply because of the decisions of a handful of people over one game, don't you think? Or, do your march to same cadence as the few knuckleheads that started this tirade so many years ago?
Alright, then for my benefit, as it seems I just don't understand the emotional ties here to an MMO. Let's start with SWG. Someone please link to me EXACTLY what the hell SoE did to their precious game that people "hate" them so much? Additionally, let's find some numbers here that demonstrate that these decisions that the developers of SoE made over this game truly stunk it up so bad that people left in droves. Please, show me some evidence that SWG is so bad now that NO ONE plays this MMO any more. Finally, can someone chronicle for me proof that SoE absolutely 100% doesn't give a caretaker's hoot about their customers.
Now, after you find these "truths" we hold so dear, would you also be so kind as to point out EXACTLY what decisions were classified and considered as "stupid" ones? I am assuming that these decisions were so bad that they DIRECTLY affected the lives of hundreds upon hundreds of devoted SoE gamers worldwide. Since we are dealing with numbers here and numbers DON"T LIE, please link to me the graphical evidence that these decisions were "stupid". So, "stupid", in fact, that SoE lost so many subscriptions that millions of dollars were lost? And to further chronicle SoE's alleged apathy toward the average customer that they, in fact, swallowed these monetary losses due to the "stupid" decisions, whatever they may be. Please endulge my curiosity and find me hard copy of these and then maybe I can start to fathom your "hatred" towards an entire corporation and all the people associated with it.
You know, this will go on and on won't it? Some people just love to use and abuse the word "hate" on these forums. Truly ladies and gentlemen use a different word rather than "hate". There is plenty of real life hate out there and too many lives are actually affected adversely because of it. maybe it's time to give this "I HATE SoE" business a rest.
All I want is the truth
Just gimme some truth
John Lennon
you go buy a mac then. It was, and always will be miles behind PCs on the games department. It had a much slower start, so even without microsoft, it still wouldn't be up to par to modern games for another few years. Ofcourse this is just speculation, but I think it's a safe bet.
If you have seen the recent releases for mac, you would understand.
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Okay, please dont Quote stuff that has long quotes, big time no no. Also that means you dont deserve to be a true gamer, real gamers try to do as much research and find as much info about the game as possible, I dont just read one comment and say oh God, this really sucks, I just read a comment from some random guy. Yes you may not have that much time to do some research but then...why are you playing a PC game? Console gaming dosent take hours of grinding and questing for it to be fun.
you go buy a mac then. It was, and always will be miles behind PCs on the games department. It had a much slower start, so even without microsoft, it still wouldn't be up to par to modern games for another few years. Ofcourse this is just speculation, but I think it's a safe bet.
If you have seen the recent releases for mac, you would understand.
well i'm a graphic designer and a mac is far superior in that aspect compared to a pc.
Bah, I'm a hippocrite, I quoted a long comment, anyways I have to agree with you on some degree. I do not hate the company I just dont like what they do. I do not hate the people, I just dont like what they will do. I DO of course hate the games. Most people just use hate because they do not use a simpler word to simplify what they really mean. I of course dont go hating the company for years so much that it takes time away from my life. No, I just stay away from them. I play every other game till some game corrupts the people within and makes them 'hated'
Ok Delore what exactly is it that SoE does that you do not care for? I am really very curious as it has been a very long time since I have seen a "haters" reasons that carried any weight with me. Sounds to me like lip service.
Yeah basically, I suppose if there is something that pisses you off about they a gaming company does business you should stay away and in that I respect you. But, I find it very difficult to respect or fathom anyone with some sort of empty greivence towards a gaming company.
All I want is the truth
Just gimme some truth
John Lennon