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EQ vs. WoW after 6 years on the market
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The hardest thing about any raid is the ability to follow simple instructions. If you tell twenty five people to run left, 2 or 3 will run right.
Well shave my back and call me an elf! -- Oghren
I agree. My memories of EQ seem to hinge around a bunch of loser nerds in a graphical chatroom waiting around to engage in tedious combat with poorly-designed little monsters. If it wasn't for WoW I'd probably continued to avoid MMOs in general, not because of some perceived difficulty of the games (since by nature no MMO is 'HARD'), but so I wouldn't be forced to associate with people like the douchebags in this thread. Good god, it's like reading post after post made by the Comic Book Guy from the Simpsons.
Funball, have you ever seen the move The Sasquatch Gang? If you haven't, watch it then tell me who Zerk Wilder reminds you of.
Questions: What was your arena rating? How many hardmodes did you accomplish? An epic = nothing is its a crappy epic. Give us your armory and get online for me to verify that you have indeed "mastered" WoW.
I never said I mastered anything, not sure where you're getting that. PVP is boring to me for the most part, I did enjoy Wintergrasp, but that's all.
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Quel'dorei&n=Iadien
I quit right before the most recent major update.
So you chose not do to any of the challenging content and then complain that the games not challenging? well, wtf did you expect?
EDIT: actually having looked at your character more, you actually haven't done ANYTHING. Sorry, but your opinion on the matter is meaningless as you have no real experience in WoW.
You certainly have a hardon for WoW, don't you? The fact that I did that with very little play time says a lot for the difficulty. I can't imagine you've raided in any other game, with the way you defend WoW. I know several people who raid in WoW, and every single one of them says raiding is easier than EQ.
Actually I started out in EQ. EQ wasn't harder, it's different and requires more time. But that doesn't mean that it's harder to play.
"World of Warcraft is the perfect implementation of this genre." - Hilmar Petursson. CEO of CCP.
Ive always thought EQ2 graphics much better than WOW.In fac t WOW graphics were dated when it released. As for performance my PC isnt anywhere near state of the art but again, EQ2 has always ran fine for me although I could see how it might not perform to well on the average WOW machine.
Wows graphics engine utilizes multi core processors and video cards. EQ2 pushes almost everything on 1 core which causes the game to run like crap. Even the devs admit how bad the engine is and how hard it would be to fix it. Wows graphic engine is actually more advanced than EQ2 in that regard, but the art direction is different. A confusion many people make. More polygons doesn't mean something is more advanced (or better).
Wow is revered for delivering great art direction and a vibrant living world. EQ2 has often been associated with having a bland world that lacks a soul and plagued with performance problems. It has been over 4 years since the promised skeletal revamp to fix the animations and 5 years since the promised fix to the playdoh hair. Nothing I would really ever call advanced.
However, once in a while EQ2 manages to take some decent screenshots. To bad the game doesn't deliver that.
Ive always thought EQ2 graphics much better than WOW.In fac t WOW graphics were dated when it released. As for performance my PC isnt anywhere near state of the art but again, EQ2 has always ran fine for me although I could see how it might not perform to well on the average WOW machine.
Wows graphics engine utilizes multi core processors and video cards. EQ2 pushes almost everything on 1 core which causes the game to run like crap. Even the devs admit how bad the engine is and how hard it would be to fix it. Wows graphic engine is actually more advanced than EQ2 in that regard, but the art direction is different. A confusion many people make. More polygons doesn't mean something is more advanced (or better).
Wow is revered for delivering great art direction and a vibrant living world. EQ2 has often been associated with having a bland world that lacks a soul and plagued with performance problems. It has been over 4 years since the promised skeletal revamp to fix the animations and 5 years since the promised fix to the playdoh hair. Nothing I would really ever call advanced.
However, once in a while EQ2 manages to take some decent screenshots. To bad the game doesn't deliver that.
To paraphrase something you often say: just because something has more polygons doesn't mean it is better.
Why would anyone feel they need multi core and multiple graphics cards to run WOW smoothly? Again, my machine runs EQ2 quite well. Sorry your having problems running it.
Funny, I've always thought EQ2 graphics were just different from WoW's.
You say "In fact" when you should be saying "In my opinion".
"dated" is a subjective term. A game could be using a state of the art GFX engine and still look "dated" because of the art direction.
------- END TRANSMISSION
Funny, I've always thought EQ2 graphics were just different from WoW's.
You say "In fact" when you should be saying "In my opinion".
"dated" is a subjective term. A game could be using a state of the art GFX engine and still look "dated" because of the art direction.
Ok just to keep everyone happy, IMO WOW graphics looked dated when the game released and the cartoon look of the game only gets worse in comparison to other games as time goes by. I guess it could be said a steak is just different than a hamburger as well considering they are both meat.
the fact that you use you brain a lot more in eq then wow is a big yes for me
but the fact it isnt avail every where
hurt all sony title =
The first miles are harder. The first steps, harder. Doing it 5-6 years before make this impossible to compare.
EQ was a grand masterpiece, it open a new gaming style.
WoW is a refinement of this masterpiece, WoW is an EQ clone redone and reshaped. Anything WoW earns/achieve is a glorification of EQ.
You are comparing Christianity(WoW) vs Judaism (EQ).
I stop playing EQ in 2003, after more than 1 year of my life spent in-game. I know the game better than most designers of any MMO, or anyone working at SoE. If it is possible to love a game, I did love it, at a time. But, love and hatred are very close emotions and, when I close the door, it was for good.
I play WoW for less than 24 hours, discarding it, and anytime I see anything about this game (guess how many of my friends play it, even if I don't play it, I can't be oblivious to the game). In my eyes, WoW did developp the last steps, but they didn't build the foundation, they barely took those from EQ, noticeably hiring former players. WoW might have done many things right, but they obliviously didn't do everything right, nor even a majority of things right. They merely improve what already exist and make it better. This is a good job, but by no way meaning they are all knowing, or that everything they do is right...think of it, I rather play Mafia War or Castle Age on Facebook than their MMO, as these devs understand SOME things better (not everything either).
See, progression does matter, and MMOs devs are underestimating the importance of a logical progression which ALWAYS could be further developp by doing things YOU like, rather than things devs try to impose.
Multiplayers is definitely the way of the future, but does it have to be massive? Perhaps, perhaps not. It doesn't have to rule the gameplay however, solo and grouping are definitely the 2 main gameplay of any serious MMOs and rewarding peoples from other gameplays at their expanse is a mistake (no matter if you reward Raiders, PvPers, Republicans or whatever fit your boat). There are other gameplay which are popular of course, but in MMOs, I fail to see any gameplay remotedly as popular as solo or grouping, and nobody serious would even argue on this point, this is how most players play their MMOs.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
BURN THE HERETICS! CRUSADE! CRUSADE!
lol
Sorry, I just had to...
"World of Warcraft is the perfect implementation of this genre." - Hilmar Petursson. CEO of CCP.
I'm asking the same question.
I see this as just another poorly worded "WoW is better than EQ, lets marginalize EQ with kick the dog tactics". The more important question should be, why is WoW the perceived measure of all other MMO's? Both games to me have different appeal. WoW vs EQ could easily be seen as Ford vs Chevy, McDonalds vs Burger King, Blonds vs Brunets, the list goes on. Its good to have options and just because 10 million play a game hardly suggest that the game is substantive, meaningful or fulfilling to people's gaming interest.
Perhaps some people need 10 million subscribers to validate their choice because they have the inability to come to their own conclusion. Perhaps EQ players aren't affected by this superficial ideology. There are millions of people that like Hanna Montana, I wonder if the OP is adjusting his music collection accordingly?
The Old Timers Guild
Laid back, not so serious, no drama.
All about the fun!
www.oldtimersguild.com
An opinion should be the result of thought, not a substitute for it. - Jef Mallett
The biggest difference between EQ and WoW is that the EQ franchise is on the decline.
The World of Warcraft franchise is just beginning.
Well shave my back and call me an elf! -- Oghren
WOW's revenu is made of subscriptions (like EQ's earnings).
Long term subscriptions means ... people that want to pay 180 dollars a year to play it for any length of time.
That's something different than just "sales" of products or being "popular".
Subscriptions PAID by people are HARD FACTS of players wanting to invest LARGE sums of money just to play and keep playing a video game.
That's why you see a difference as large as this, because simply .... 95% of the people want to pay for WOW instead of EQ series or some other series.
Nothing more but nothing less either.
So Hanna Montana is NOT asking to pay 180 dollars a year just to hear her songs.
WOW is...
The premise of my message is distinguishing between hype and substance.
The Old Timers Guild
Laid back, not so serious, no drama.
All about the fun!
www.oldtimersguild.com
An opinion should be the result of thought, not a substitute for it. - Jef Mallett
Not only do you overvalue the difficulty of everquest compared to other mmos, you do not understand why EQ titles are not available at stores.
EQ titles are not stocked in stores as a RESULT of them not selling well. Retailers love to reorder items that customers love to buy. They stop ordering items that stop selling.
What do you think makes EQ require so much more brain power than the next mmo? Hitting the fireball key isn't exactly rocket science.
Not only do you overvalue the difficulty of everquest compared to other mmos, you do not understand why EQ titles are not available at stores.
EQ titles are not stocked in stores as a RESULT of them not selling well. Retailers love to reorder items that customers love to buy. They stop ordering items that stop selling.
What do you think makes EQ require so much more brain power than the next mmo? Hitting the fireball key isn't exactly rocket science.
Best Buy has the "complete EQ2" package, base game and all xpacs to date. Saw them there just saturday. Try again.
Everquest..... not Everquest 2.
However the EQ2 games will be discounted, moved to the bottom of value section and/or removed in a few months as normal.
Oh I thought EQ "titles" meant more than one. My mistake.......
Edit: How much do you think they will discount them? Might get a few and sell on ebay.
IQ of your average EQ player. ^^
Barrans chat.
We can always argue.
Just what exactly do you mean by "dumbed down" .. ?
Removed XP loss?
Removed grouping requirement?
Reduced downtime?
I'm interested, because I often see this opinion repeated parrot-fashion by people who assume that "challenge" equates to ones ability to withstand mind-numbing boredom.
Wasn't there a classic patch that decreased the ammount needed to level by 15% - thats huge! And at the same time increased the xp you get from quests. Heroics demoted to normal for same rewards, dungeons made easier. Can't you now change talents on the fly?
Challenging : Calling for full use of one's abilities or resources in a difficult but stimulating effort
Sorry got none of that from WOW. Maybe for the below average player the games fine....
Core i5 13600KF, BeQuiet Pure Loop FX 360, 32gb DDR5-6000 XPG, WD SN850 NVMe ,PNY 3090 XLR8, Asus Prime Z790-A, Lian-Li O11 PCMR case (limited ed 1045/2000), 32" LG Ultragear 4k Monitor, Logitech G560 LightSync Sound, Razer Deathadder V2 and Razer Blackwidow V3 Keyboard
ERA is correct. MMORPG starting to come out in mid 90's...Asheron's Call is very successful at that time of year where no WoW, and all other games is around that close. I'm pretty sure if they make another game like AC with graphic updated. Will slam WoW back down cuz AC is true lord of MMORPG!
Kain_Dale
Maple Story claims 10 million subscribers in North America but the number of concurrent players is 70,000.
So, you can hate on WoW all you want but theres no reason to lie.
I'm sure F2P games have more players than WoW does, especially in Asian countries. So does gamer population size matter?
And I doubt the concurrent number of WoW players is 11 million. Even if it was, it's because of welfare epics, and easy-mode content. Why do numbers matter? So numbers do not matter, if it is WoW. Or because that number happens not to favour your intended conclusion?
EQ was the best MMORPG ever released measured in what standard? Your standard?, and I don't recall there being a huge population back then Was that not supposed to be a measurement of how limited the success EQ managed to be? Simply put they cannot open up a million size market, WoW can and did. Oh of course, numbers in favour or WoW does not matter, any other numbers do if you like it.. But then again EQ didn't cater to stupid players who whined whenever they wiped to NPCs or died from players Oh yeah, EQ cater to stupid players of another kind, those that spend hours shouting in zone in hoping for a vacancy in any camp, stupid players who sit looking at their spellbook, pretending to enjoy meditation in the game mechanics, stupid players who enjoy camping an empty boss spot for 48 hours to grab the rare boss for the priest epic mace reward.. "Oh I got PKED wahh Griefer /petition" Kind of people playing WoW are the kind I wouldn't want in the same game, because they'd try to dumb it down to their level always. Just like they ruined BWL AQ and Naxx40 because they sucked and could not get through Molten Core. Constant PVE nerfs for the stupid players Oh and do you realise that the 12million or whatever million WoW players also do not like the presence of you badmouthing little boy, who simply is unable to respect the views and enjoyments of others? It must be a big deal for you to pretend you do not enjoy being with them where the fact is, no one really care who you are? Who are you?
The 90% played a game to wind down, they do not need to seek challenge during the odd hours after a challening life, they already have achievement in real life.
The few who need a "real" MMO to fill the void of challenge and achievement, are those who cannot meet challenge in real life and failed to obtain the necessary achievement living as a real person.
You can't compare the 90% to whatever others, they seek different things from a game.
And, I wonder what real challenge there is or real achievements you have from a game, games other than WoW. A power outage, and all your achievement vanishes. The MMO operator pulls the plug and your lifetime achievement goes down the drain.
I remember the days SoE pulled the plug literally on SWG, many of us just /cancel and move on, forgetting the game, with only sweet memories for occasionally grill side chats. The few who need SWG to enjoy challenge has been spamming forums denouncing SoE since.
When EQ1 first came out ALOT less people had computers.. And even the ones that did have computers for the most part were not able to really run EQ1 at that time. I know i had to buy a new computer to play it myself. Also Broadband connections were in their infancy. Information about new games was nothing like it is today or even back when WOW released. Another fact is that EQ1 had almost no I repeat no commercial Advertising (even to this day). Most people heard of it thru word of mouth thru friends. Or happened just to see a copy in a game store and wonder what ti would be like. Last fact. Everquest. The game was not buit off a popular franchise like WOW was.
WOW had everything going for it when it came out. MMOs were really just first catching on Ya they had some decent years with games like EQ1 DAoC and AC to name a few. But The MMO explosion was really just starting in ernest. Not to mention WOW was warcraft a name which already had hundreds of thousands if not millions of fans. That alone drew in hundreds of thousand subscriptions. Not to mention WOW did one thing that for some reason SOE just cant seem to understand. They advertised. My girlfriend owns a business and let me tell this advertising thing. It brings in revenue.
We can all agree here I believe that when WOW released it was actually alot more like EQ1 than it is today. Yes the penalties and time investment were not as harsh or big as EQ1 but Still alot of the content was more challenging. Took more time to complete to more organization (call it logistics if you will). Building strategy for a larger force is always more challenging. In real life or in a game.
Its truly impossible to measure which game was more successful due to the time periods and all the factors that were involved. I will say Blizzard ran a better business model that coupled with the fact that MMOs were really just catching on and their advertising makes all the difference.
WOW has been dumbed down though. Look I enjoyed WOW for 2 years. However looking back I have more fond memories of EQ1 than I do of WOW... I also played it for longer.. More people were introduced to WOW than EQ1. ANd people usually make their comparisons if they actually enjoyed something off their first experiences. ALOT more people are going to to base those comparisons off WOW than EQ1. Because of all the factors listed above. If their experiences were bad they probably didnt stick with the MMO genre at all. I know I have friends that are like that.
Well Daff, the line above is why so much EQ2 posters want to have a fight in our WOW forums.
Apparently they can feel the final glide.
And like always, WOW is blamed for the downfall of the MMO games.
Just as if Blzzard can do anything about half hearted and badly designed/under developped X game (fill in the X with any other fantasy mmorp of your choice).
Get over it: the paying customers of paid subscriptions always tell the truth.
99% of MMORPG's were a mess in polishment and design before and after WOW - if being compared to other gaming genres.
How about a FPS where you would crash, have a blue screen or fall dead after every second encounter....
.... or you would need DAYS just to find a group to game in a Battlemap.
And then they wonder why those games have no subs.... (talking general here).
When I saw the statement that you do not see EQ titles in stores I felt the need to correct the " mistake" because when misinformation gets repeated enough it can become misconstrued as fact. I mean look at all the year old WOW sub numbers that get thrown around as fact when in truth, you or none of the other Blizz boys know what the current sub numbers are because for some reason Blizz isnt publishing any. With your huge library of "facts" that you copy and paste relentlessly I would hate for you to spread any untruths so I corrected the statement made by your first officer for the sake of your own good as well as the general public. No need to thank me Zorn just let me know as soon as the current sub numbers of your baby are released as I am really curious. For the record Zorn, EQ 2, LOTRO or your WOW are just games, you might want to try and explore that fact sometime.
Funny; you state a definition of the word that directly contradicts yourself.
Yes, WoW reduced the time needed to level.
Yes, WoW increased the quest XP, further reducing the time needed to level.
No, low tier normal mode dungeons didn't get epic drops.
Yes, upper tier normal mode dungeons did get epic drops.
Dungeons have been buffed/nerfed since the dawn of time in every MMO.
Yes, you can now have two talent sets to provide more individual flexibility.
Less time requirements, more flexibility .. that doesn't decrease "challenge".
And yeah, the perceived superiority complex? .. not fooling anyone, "professor".
Playing: EVE, Final Fantasy 13, Uncharted 2, Need for Speed: Shift