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Unethical behavior...

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  • HerculesSASHerculesSAS Member Posts: 1,272

    Originally posted by funkmastaD

    In all earnestness, when did you email/call SV about this issue?  I'm guessing you did more than just make threads about it... did you email the CEO, or who?    As an SV fanboy I'd like to see this issue put to rest just like you, don't think of this as trolling.

    More than a few people have emailed the support email with no response at all. It doesn't affect me, as my credit card will automatically block any transactions coming from SV so if they decide to charge me, they will simply get a penalty anyway. But for friends I know who have been deployed to the military, this is a really crap deal for them while they are out serving their country and getting robbed by a bunch of unethical people like Star Vault.

  • ToferioToferio Member UncommonPosts: 1,411

    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

     

    I think I will jump the wagon and send them an email too. An error or not, but deleting the threads asking about it is outragerous.

  • HerculesSASHerculesSAS Member Posts: 1,272

    Originally posted by Toferio

    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

     

    I think I will jump the wagon and send them an email too. An error or not, but deleting the threads asking about it is outragerous.

    I encourage others to do the same -- people have asked nicely, asked repetitively, and now they are not only ignoring it, they are deleting things. It's apalling. And it speaks to their ethics in how they conduct their business. And people need to know about it before they are taken advantage of. I've tried to get in contact with my friend who was in the military but he's not one to check his email often, and I fear they will rob a friend whose only fault is that he went to war.

     

    It's ridiculous and shameful.

  • ToferioToferio Member UncommonPosts: 1,411

    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

    Originally posted by Toferio


    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

     

    I think I will jump the wagon and send them an email too. An error or not, but deleting the threads asking about it is outragerous.

    I encourage others to do the same -- people have asked nicely, asked repetitively, and now they are not only ignoring it, they are deleting things. It's apalling. And it speaks to their ethics in how they conduct their business. And people need to know about it before they are taken advantage of. I've tried to get in contact with my friend who was in the military but he's not one to check his email often, and I fear they will rob a friend whose only fault is that he went to war.

     

    It's ridiculous and shameful.

    Make an account and ask them on forum about what you can do about situation where he gets charged for something he never agreed to. I would like to see them closing down such a thread..

  • HerculesSASHerculesSAS Member Posts: 1,272

    Originally posted by Toferio

    Originally posted by HerculesSAS


    Originally posted by Toferio


    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

     

    I think I will jump the wagon and send them an email too. An error or not, but deleting the threads asking about it is outragerous.

    I encourage others to do the same -- people have asked nicely, asked repetitively, and now they are not only ignoring it, they are deleting things. It's apalling. And it speaks to their ethics in how they conduct their business. And people need to know about it before they are taken advantage of. I've tried to get in contact with my friend who was in the military but he's not one to check his email often, and I fear they will rob a friend whose only fault is that he went to war.

     

    It's ridiculous and shameful.

    Make an account and ask them on forum about what you can do about situation where he gets charged for something he never agreed to. I would like to see them closing down such a thread..

    I posted a link a few posts up that was deleted almost immediately, just bringing attention to the fact that people are getting auto-subbed without their consent. It was only up for a few hours, and it's already gone. The intent on SV's part is loud and clear now.

  • ToferioToferio Member UncommonPosts: 1,411

    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

    Originally posted by Toferio


    Originally posted by HerculesSAS


    Originally posted by Toferio


    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

     

    I think I will jump the wagon and send them an email too. An error or not, but deleting the threads asking about it is outragerous.

    I encourage others to do the same -- people have asked nicely, asked repetitively, and now they are not only ignoring it, they are deleting things. It's apalling. And it speaks to their ethics in how they conduct their business. And people need to know about it before they are taken advantage of. I've tried to get in contact with my friend who was in the military but he's not one to check his email often, and I fear they will rob a friend whose only fault is that he went to war.

     

    It's ridiculous and shameful.

    Make an account and ask them on forum about what you can do about situation where he gets charged for something he never agreed to. I would like to see them closing down such a thread..

    I posted a link a few posts up that was deleted almost immediately, just bringing attention to the fact that people are getting auto-subbed without their consent. It was only up for a few hours, and it's already gone. The intent on SV's part is loud and clear now.

    Try the way I said, aka asking for help for a friend, I am curious about their actions in that case..

  • HerculesSASHerculesSAS Member Posts: 1,272

    Originally posted by Toferio

    Originally posted by HerculesSAS


    Originally posted by Toferio


    Originally posted by HerculesSAS


    Originally posted by Toferio


    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

     

    I think I will jump the wagon and send them an email too. An error or not, but deleting the threads asking about it is outragerous.

    I encourage others to do the same -- people have asked nicely, asked repetitively, and now they are not only ignoring it, they are deleting things. It's apalling. And it speaks to their ethics in how they conduct their business. And people need to know about it before they are taken advantage of. I've tried to get in contact with my friend who was in the military but he's not one to check his email often, and I fear they will rob a friend whose only fault is that he went to war.

     

    It's ridiculous and shameful.

    Make an account and ask them on forum about what you can do about situation where he gets charged for something he never agreed to. I would like to see them closing down such a thread..

    I posted a link a few posts up that was deleted almost immediately, just bringing attention to the fact that people are getting auto-subbed without their consent. It was only up for a few hours, and it's already gone. The intent on SV's part is loud and clear now.

    Try the way I said, aka asking for help for a friend, I am curious about their actions in that case..

    I think they will figure out quite quickly it's me, and say that I'm trying to troll. You are free to ask if you have an account however, as I do not.

  • ToferioToferio Member UncommonPosts: 1,411

    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

    Originally posted by Toferio


    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

    Try the way I said, aka asking for help for a friend, I am curious about their actions in that case..

    I think they will figure out quite quickly it's me, and say that I'm trying to troll. You are free to ask if you have an account however, as I do not.

    I will ask a friend to do it, since I am really curious if there any solution available for your friend, it aint trolling at all.

  • funkmastaDfunkmastaD Member UncommonPosts: 647

    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

    Originally posted by funkmastaD

    In all earnestness, when did you email/call SV about this issue?  I'm guessing you did more than just make threads about it... did you email the CEO, or who?    As an SV fanboy I'd like to see this issue put to rest just like you, don't think of this as trolling.

    More than a few people have emailed the support email with no response at all. It doesn't affect me, as my credit card will automatically block any transactions coming from SV so if they decide to charge me, they will simply get a penalty anyway. But for friends I know who have been deployed to the military, this is a really crap deal for them while they are out serving their country and getting robbed by a bunch of unethical people like Star Vault.

    So you don't have the time to email SV yourself, but you have the time to do this. 

    Good luck though. (edit:  I mean that seriously)

  • HerculesSASHerculesSAS Member Posts: 1,272

    Originally posted by funkmastaD

    Originally posted by HerculesSAS


    Originally posted by funkmastaD

    In all earnestness, when did you email/call SV about this issue?  I'm guessing you did more than just make threads about it... did you email the CEO, or who?    As an SV fanboy I'd like to see this issue put to rest just like you, don't think of this as trolling.

    More than a few people have emailed the support email with no response at all. It doesn't affect me, as my credit card will automatically block any transactions coming from SV so if they decide to charge me, they will simply get a penalty anyway. But for friends I know who have been deployed to the military, this is a really crap deal for them while they are out serving their country and getting robbed by a bunch of unethical people like Star Vault.

    So you don't have the time to email SV yourself, but you have the time to do this. 

    Good luck though. (edit:  I mean that seriously)

    If I email SV they can dismiss me as a troll because that's what the community has dressed me up as. I am saying that legitimate posts about this have already been deleted from people who have no other gripes about the game. The fact that I am vocal makes my emails pointless, but if you want to email them yourself -- you'll find that I am not lying to you.

  • funkmastaDfunkmastaD Member UncommonPosts: 647

    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

    Originally posted by funkmastaD


    Originally posted by HerculesSAS


    Originally posted by funkmastaD

    In all earnestness, when did you email/call SV about this issue?  I'm guessing you did more than just make threads about it... did you email the CEO, or who?    As an SV fanboy I'd like to see this issue put to rest just like you, don't think of this as trolling.

    More than a few people have emailed the support email with no response at all. It doesn't affect me, as my credit card will automatically block any transactions coming from SV so if they decide to charge me, they will simply get a penalty anyway. But for friends I know who have been deployed to the military, this is a really crap deal for them while they are out serving their country and getting robbed by a bunch of unethical people like Star Vault.

    So you don't have the time to email SV yourself, but you have the time to do this. 

    Good luck though. (edit:  I mean that seriously)

    If I email SV they can dismiss me as a troll because that's what the community has dressed me up as. I am saying that legitimate posts about this have already been deleted from people who have no other gripes about the game. The fact that I am vocal makes my emails pointless, but if you want to email them yourself -- you'll find that I am not lying to you.

    Here's my honest opinion:  You are not approaching this as a person who wants to see an issue resolved; you're approaching this as a person who wants to stir up trouble.  You were branded a troll before any of this started if I understand correctly - perhaps this was unfair, but seeing at how you act on THESE forums, I can see how someone would form that opinion.  You create a series of threads on the forum calling SV crooks and frauds instead of emailing the company directly.  You launch a campaign against the company in these forums, criticizing the game in every thread, in every post you make.

    Keep in mind I found a 'auto-subscribe' thread on my first search attempt (and that forum's search button has never served me well).  There's a few more out there too iirc, it's not like the matter is being wiped from the MO forums.  That being said, I will try to email them, since IF the situation is as you described and people DO start getting charged (which, keep in mind, has not happened yet) then it'd be bad for everyone.

  • HerculesSASHerculesSAS Member Posts: 1,272

    Originally posted by funkmastaD

    Originally posted by HerculesSAS


    Originally posted by funkmastaD


    Originally posted by HerculesSAS


    Originally posted by funkmastaD

    In all earnestness, when did you email/call SV about this issue?  I'm guessing you did more than just make threads about it... did you email the CEO, or who?    As an SV fanboy I'd like to see this issue put to rest just like you, don't think of this as trolling.

    More than a few people have emailed the support email with no response at all. It doesn't affect me, as my credit card will automatically block any transactions coming from SV so if they decide to charge me, they will simply get a penalty anyway. But for friends I know who have been deployed to the military, this is a really crap deal for them while they are out serving their country and getting robbed by a bunch of unethical people like Star Vault.

    So you don't have the time to email SV yourself, but you have the time to do this. 

    Good luck though. (edit:  I mean that seriously)

    If I email SV they can dismiss me as a troll because that's what the community has dressed me up as. I am saying that legitimate posts about this have already been deleted from people who have no other gripes about the game. The fact that I am vocal makes my emails pointless, but if you want to email them yourself -- you'll find that I am not lying to you.

    Here's my honest opinion:  You are not approaching this as a person who wants to see an issue resolved; you're approaching this as a person who wants to stir up trouble.  You were branded a troll before any of this started if I understand correctly - perhaps this was unfair, but seeing at how you act on THESE forums, I can see how someone would form that opinion.  You create a series of threads on the forum calling SV crooks and frauds instead of emailing the company directly.  You launch a campaign against the company in these forums, criticizing the game in every thread, in every post you make.

    Keep in mind I found a 'auto-subscribe' thread on my first search attempt (and that forum's search button has never served me well).  There's a few more out there too iirc, it's not like the matter is being wiped from the MO forums.  That being said, I will try to email them, since IF the situation is as you described and people DO start getting charged (which, keep in mind, has not happened yet) then it'd be bad for everyone.

    The issue doesn't exist for me -- for me to email is pointless because I've had my card blocked to anything SV tries to do. The fact I dislike the game is irrelevant -- I actually wanted to like it, until I found out what they were doing and how they were doing it. Coming from a professional background where I have some knowledge of development, standards, SDLC and how to build an 'enterprise' system yes, I suppose that the method that SV employs is what I find mediocre. But that isn't the issue, is it?

     

    I'm calling people to attention about SV's business practices. This isn't about ME. It's about 13,000 people who preordered, many of whom are going to get billed for something they never thought they would get billed for. Some of them of course, may want to get billed, and I have no issue with that. But what of the people that don't, and don't know they are going to get billed? I mention only a friend of mine who was deployed to Afghanistan as a single instance, but I'm sure there are many, many more like that.

     

    As for your auto-subscribe link, please post the link here. Every other thread has been closed and fallen off the face of the forums, and the rest have been deleted. If SV is deleting them because there are duplicates, then please point us to the ones that we can participate in so that the question may be laid to rest. If none of them are open, and they are being deleted anyway -- then it speaks more to SV's intent than my own, doesn't it? And by the way, I *am* trying to stir up concern about this -- if that leads to trouble SV it's their own fault for engaging in this type of behavior. Don't blame it on me because I'm simply calling them out on it.

  • HerculesSASHerculesSAS Member Posts: 1,272
  • funkmastaDfunkmastaD Member UncommonPosts: 647

    That was not the thread I was talking about, but the other one was also locked; just not deleted like I interpretted you as saying.

     

    But, every time I disagree with you I get mod-warned that I'm trolling, so I'm gonna timidly bow out now...

  • Slapshot1188Slapshot1188 Member LegendaryPosts: 17,714

    Game has officially launched without an answer from StarVault.

     

    The latest response on the official forums is that once again they will "see" if they can get an answer..:

     

     


    Unread Today, 04:57

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    I will see if I can get any news about this


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  • funkmastaDfunkmastaD Member UncommonPosts: 647

    Heads Up:

      Star Vault has sent out newsletters to pre-orders telling them about the auto-subscription.  Here's what  I got:

     




    Mortal Online Newsletter

     

      Auto-subscription Today Mortal Online goes live! 

    You are receiving this email because of your Mortal Online pre-order purchase. The initial free month you received with your game purchase begins today, and regular billing will begin one month from today.

    If you do not wish to auto-subscribe, please log into your account [Link Removed] and cancel the option.

    We also want to formally inform you about the new TOS, the Naming Policy, the EULA and the Reimbursement Policy.

    All of which can be found on mortalonline.com.



  • HeretiqueHeretique Member RarePosts: 1,536


    Originally posted by funkmastaD
    Heads Up:
      Star Vault has sent out newsletters to pre-orders telling them about Auto-Subscription.  Here's what  I got:
     


    Mortal Online Newsletter
     
      Auto-subscription Today Mortal Online goes live! 
    You are receiving this email because of your Mortal Online pre-order purchase. The initial free month you received with your game purchase begins today, and regular billing will begin one month from today.
    If you do not wish to auto-subscribe, please log into your account [Link Removed] and cancel the option.
    We also want to formally inform you about the new TOS, the Naming Policy, the EULA and the Reimbursement Policy.
    All of which can be found on mortalonline.com.

     

    Well they finally saw all the ruckus, better to have had this sooner but better to have it than not at all.

  • funkmastaDfunkmastaD Member UncommonPosts: 647

    Originally posted by Heretique

     




    Originally posted by funkmastaD

    Heads Up:

      Star Vault has sent out newsletters to pre-orders telling them about Auto-Subscription.  Here's what  I got:

     







    Mortal Online Newsletter

     

      Auto-subscription Today Mortal Online goes live! 

    You are receiving this email because of your Mortal Online pre-order purchase. The initial free month you received with your game purchase begins today, and regular billing will begin one month from today.

    If you do not wish to auto-subscribe, please log into your account [Link Removed] and cancel the option.

    We also want to formally inform you about the new TOS, the Naming Policy, the EULA and the Reimbursement Policy.

    All of which can be found on mortalonline.com.







     


     

    Well they finally saw all the ruckus, better to have had this sooner but better to have it than not at all.

     

    I agree, this went on way too long.  At least this gives people a month to act, anyway.

  • IsaneIsane Member UncommonPosts: 2,630

    Originally posted by Aercus

    Originally posted by Joker2240


    Originally posted by Toquio3



    Originally posted by Joker2240



    Originally posted by nakuma



    Originally posted by Joker2240

    Lets get one false statement put to rest here guys. Yes it is true that you have to agree with a auto-renew feature however there is a way that makes it so you do not have to do that by selecting the option. A company can auto renew you IF they tell you that you when you are putting in your information that you will be billed after your time is up. So you are agreeing by giving your CC info to the company. 

     what you fail to realize or read dude, people are saying it wasnt originally avialable, it was put in later. so how can a person opt out if they have no option to do so? come on tell me if you know. if not then move on, its illegal to hve no opt out feature then put in later and then charge a person for the payment. it is in fact illegal, or they hvae to give you an announcement that you will be charged with this new feature that has been enabled.

    What you fail to realize dude is that it does not become illegal until they actually charge you! Also yes I do realize that many people do not know about this added feature so this is not a case about if you were asked or not this is a case about making a announcement and sending out notifications about this added feature to the payments.

     

    you guys are jumping the gun WAY TOO EARLY!  However it would been nicer if you just notified people about this instead of TROLLING about it.

    Then why didnt they just dump the whole auto renew thing and then send announcements to people saying that they should set up a subscription if they wanted to play the game?

    Im sorry, but there is no excuse you can make for what they are doing.

    Yeah I do not understand that either however I am not going to go and say a company is doing something illegal when they have not done anything illegal. That is my problem with some of the post right now. You guys are calling this action illegal however it is not illegal until it has actually happened. It does not take a lawyer to know this. If you were to go to a lawyer right now and sue them you would lose because for now it is LEGAL.

     Don't get me wrong I do agree that this is unethical and the way they are doing it is really poor. However we can not cry wolf until it actually happens because then it just looks like you are trolling and trying to ripe at the company every little move they do.  

    So let me see if I get this correctly: You were so eager that you went ahead and made a preorder for a good which consists of a one time payment for a product and a subscription for its use. The company has at a later point enabled the subscription choices and lept to the conclusion that people so eager for a product that they are willing to preorder will most likely wish to subscribe to the service. As noone has yet officially been informed or charged a few question arises:

    -Was there any fine print about this topic?

    -Is the company planning on informing the preorder customers they have been put on autorenewal?

    -Would the company actually charge at due date?

    -Is the company within its right to assume people preordering will want to subscribe?

    As the answers to the middle questions are unknown we are left with the first and final ones. If there is any fine print the whole thing is a moot point. As for the last one, though one can disagree with the customer service it entails, it's a valid argument.  

    They have sent an email out , to all pre-orders stating that the auto pre-order can be deselected in the account management page.

    http://www.mortalonline.com/newsletter/customer/information.html

    ________________________________________________________
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  • AllSeeingGuyAllSeeingGuy Member Posts: 143

    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

    Originally posted by funkmastaD


    Originally posted by HerculesSAS


    Originally posted by funkmastaD


    Originally posted by HerculesSAS


    Originally posted by funkmastaD

    In all earnestness, when did you email/call SV about this issue?  I'm guessing you did more than just make threads about it... did you email the CEO, or who?    As an SV fanboy I'd like to see this issue put to rest just like you, don't think of this as trolling.

    More than a few people have emailed the support email with no response at all. It doesn't affect me, as my credit card will automatically block any transactions coming from SV so if they decide to charge me, they will simply get a penalty anyway. But for friends I know who have been deployed to the military, this is a really crap deal for them while they are out serving their country and getting robbed by a bunch of unethical people like Star Vault.

    So you don't have the time to email SV yourself, but you have the time to do this. 

    Good luck though. (edit:  I mean that seriously)

    If I email SV they can dismiss me as a troll because that's what the community has dressed me up as. I am saying that legitimate posts about this have already been deleted from people who have no other gripes about the game. The fact that I am vocal makes my emails pointless, but if you want to email them yourself -- you'll find that I am not lying to you.

    Here's my honest opinion:  You are not approaching this as a person who wants to see an issue resolved; you're approaching this as a person who wants to stir up trouble.  You were branded a troll before any of this started if I understand correctly - perhaps this was unfair, but seeing at how you act on THESE forums, I can see how someone would form that opinion.  You create a series of threads on the forum calling SV crooks and frauds instead of emailing the company directly.  You launch a campaign against the company in these forums, criticizing the game in every thread, in every post you make.

    Keep in mind I found a 'auto-subscribe' thread on my first search attempt (and that forum's search button has never served me well).  There's a few more out there too iirc, it's not like the matter is being wiped from the MO forums.  That being said, I will try to email them, since IF the situation is as you described and people DO start getting charged (which, keep in mind, has not happened yet) then it'd be bad for everyone.

    The issue doesn't exist for me -- for me to email is pointless because I've had my card blocked to anything SV tries to do. The fact I dislike the game is irrelevant -- I actually wanted to like it, until I found out what they were doing and how they were doing it. Coming from a professional background where I have some knowledge of development, standards, SDLC and how to build an 'enterprise' system yes, I suppose that the method that SV employs is what I find mediocre. But that isn't the issue, is it?

     

    I'm calling people to attention about SV's business practices. This isn't about ME. It's about 13,000 people who preordered, many of whom are going to get billed for something they never thought they would get billed for. Some of them of course, may want to get billed, and I have no issue with that. But what of the people that don't, and don't know they are going to get billed? I mention only a friend of mine who was deployed to Afghanistan as a single instance, but I'm sure there are many, many more like that.

     

    As for your auto-subscribe link, please post the link here. Every other thread has been closed and fallen off the face of the forums, and the rest have been deleted. If SV is deleting them because there are duplicates, then please point us to the ones that we can participate in so that the question may be laid to rest. If none of them are open, and they are being deleted anyway -- then it speaks more to SV's intent than my own, doesn't it? And by the way, I *am* trying to stir up concern about this -- if that leads to trouble SV it's their own fault for engaging in this type of behavior. Don't blame it on me because I'm simply calling them out on it.

    http://www.mortalonline.com/newsletter/customer/information.html

  • ErstokErstok Member Posts: 523

    Anyone who has brains enough to work in customer service knows behind closed doors companies talk shit about there own consumers. Why? Because we are all human beings. You gotta be a punching bag to some knob job on nearly a 24 hour basis. Of course your gonna make a few punches and stabs back at them. But not straight on. No your gonna change up the wording but it will still have the same meaning.

    Don't like it, don't play it. You like it then shut up and some complaining because in a few days, weeks, months. Be something else for people to whine about anyway. Stop wasting your energy on the pointless crap.

    image
    When did you start playing "old school" MMO's. World Of Warcraft?

  • HerculesSASHerculesSAS Member Posts: 1,272

    Well folks, looks like I was right -- and I'm bumping this thread to show all the evidence gathered and proved over the course of the last few months to detail exactly how SV is ripping people off, engaging in fraudulent behavior, and going to start ninja charging a WHOLE lot of people.

  • funkmastaDfunkmastaD Member UncommonPosts: 647

    Originally posted by HerculesSAS

    Well folks, looks like I was right -- and I'm bumping this thread to show all the evidence gathered and proved over the course of the last few months to detail exactly how SV is ripping people off, engaging in fraudulent behavior, and going to start ninja charging a WHOLE lot of people.

    lol, evidence.

     

    What evidence is needed?  SV openly admits to the auto-subscribe situation.  Sorry though, I don't mean to tread on your "I was right" post (though a bit premature; SV hasn't made any charges yet).

  • rlmccoy1987rlmccoy1987 Member Posts: 1,722

    Seems they are going through with it, get ready for massive charge backs.

    image
  • AethaerynAethaeryn Member RarePosts: 3,150

    Sadly I have to agree.  Not that they have charged people yet. . but they said it would be cleared up before release and it was not.  -1 for SV for sure there.

     

    I don't care about autorenew if they had sent out an e-mail to everyone.  The only sort of answer that was recent is that the TOS would be updated before release to reflect the autorenew.  that does no good to anyone that bought it a year ago.

    Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!

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